Think about how D&D 5e is now - you only have a small handful of choices, but (for the most part) you can't really make a wrong choice because with fewer options, play is well balanced- just different choices that make you play a character differently. Compare that to Pathfinder 1e where you have thousands of choices, and the vast majority of options lead to non-viable characters, so hours of research is required before you even start. Some people love that and some hate it - I personally hate it (so much so that I gave up tabletop games when 3e came out and didn't start again until 5e - skipped pathfinder altogether). If you love that kind of game then D&D, and therefore Neverwinter, simply aren't your games.
All this complexity was pre-m16 Neverwinter, which was based on 4e - a deeply flawed version that was still trying to figure out how to appeal to a mass audience after 3e and PF devastated the game overall. Those flaws carried into NW and were persistent from the start of the game. M16 has gone a long way to finally rectifying those complexity flaws.
That is, honestly, such a superb reference/analysis and entirely spot on. Neverwinter's Feat/Paragon system, while technically offering more choices/ways to play the game than Mod 16 does, was needlessly complex and had many 'dead end' builds that prevented endgame/successful dungeon play.
Mind you I'm not saying that people shouldn't be able to choose whichever way they want to play the game... However, for successful runs that were actually team work oriented and not hard carries by 1-2x of a given party, you were limited to very specific builds for Dungeon runs pre-Mod 16. It's been a LONG time issue with the game.
Mod 16 is not perfect, and had.has issues that need(ed) to be fixed ASAP including Scaling. The cast did show that the Devs are aware of that, offered a mea culpa, and are making a pretty major adjustment this Thursday. So that's definitely some positive news there and in my opinion bodes well going forward.
As for people requesting a rollback to Mod 15, and honestly expecting it would actually happen, all I can offer is this...
6
kreatyveMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 10,545Community Moderator
My opinions are my own. I do not work for PWE or Cryptic. - Forum Rules - Protector's Enclave Discord - I play on Xbox Any of my comments not posted in orange are based on my own personal opinion and not official. Any messages written in orange are official moderation messages. Signature images are now fixed!
> @demonmonger said: > I'll keep this in line with the topic. Stream response. I was disappointed with the quality of the stream, the repetitive verbiage that no one wanted to hear.. the lack of connect or care with what we the players want... > > What I would like to see... > > Rogue improvements > Stealth becomes a toggle > Party stealth becomes an option > Stealth makes all attacks critical 100% no matter someone's anti crit measures. > Ability to see the rune traps at a distance in master expeditions > Ability to set traps. > > They say the give us what we ask for... mmm ok I'm waiting.
really, party stealth? we rogues don't do magic for anyone but ourselves! i agree with everything else 100%.
99 lines of code on the wall, 99 lines of code, add one line, compile it again....... 113 lines on code on the wall 113 lines of code on the wall, 113 lines of code, rewrite one line, compile it again....... Wait For It
I might be wrong, and some will surely say I am, but I truly believe that with this surge in the right kinds of communication efforts that are underway, that you have opened small window to fix the mistakes the "Cryptic forefathers" made during and after Alpha.
Please enjoy this throwback Julia and Thomas. Here within THIS tome, lies the playerbase's enthusiasm when it was at a fever's pitch back in early 2013.
This was my favorite episode of the "Neverwinter Online Crossroads Show", Episode 2, my short-lived four episode Neverwinter podcast. It aired live February 11, 2013 and was featured on iTunes.
I was joined by special guest host Deathsickle of the Hardcore Christian Gamers guild, for what was quite possibly the most extensive interview EVER done about Neverwinter, and some very important staff members of the day.
Our very special interview stars Lead Producer Andy Velasquez and Senior Environment Artist Crypticmapolis, with a surprise cameo by Cryptic COO (Chief Operating Officer) Craig Zinkievich!
We had a blast interviewing not one, not two, but three very important members of the Cryptic team. As Deathsickle stated after the interview "that was sooooo epic!", so don't miss it if you didn't see it years ago!!
I must say that the Neverwinter community was near NUCLEAR, abuzz and chompin' at the bit for any and all information about the game!! It was a really enthusiastic time.
Information was scarce of course, until this interview!
We scored over 10,000 views the night of the cast on iTunes. I believe it still holds the one day ratings record for anything Neverwinter related. Please enjoy !!
My favorite part of the interview may have been snagging then COO CRAIG ZINKIEVICH! He walked over trying to get his boys back to work... he wound up joining in the hi-jinx and so did the rest of the office!
I had planned for a 45-60 minute interview. It turned into 1 hour and 40 minutes and it was fun as all hell.
This was a great, and fun time. Our guild and alliance are STILL HERE of course, but I wish everyone from these days were as well. Oh well, here are to many more great days ahead for Neverwinter and for the greater Neverwinter community AS A WHOLE!
Scaling = Scale down stats to some percentage Example : If u have 10,000 crit ... make it 40% less for other map so u can have 6000 crit . So if u improve and able to increase your crit to 20,000 then u will get 12000 crit in old content.
Scaling with hard cap = Scale down to definite value Example : If u have 10,000 crit ... and cap is set to 6000 for other map so u can have 6000 crit . But even if u improve and able to increase your crit to 20,000 then u will get again same 6000 crit in old content.
Pleas make me understand if I am incorrect. But if I am correct and NW implemented Scaling with hard cap then where is the progress ?
You are 100% right and that is the way it is staying from the sound of it. Hard capped down scaling regardless of your stats.
There is little to no incentive to improve. When players start to ask about a way to stop gaining experience you know there is a system in the game that is broken. Why would a player ask to stop gaining experience?
The only place that currently your effort for progress pays off is in the new content. You will be fine in the new dungeon, but outside the new content expect all your effort to be ignored.
I don't like them suggesting nerfs to classes like the barby. What they need to start doing is buff the other classes. Fighter is my main and is sorely lacking. Barby is where the other classes should be not the other way around.
All companions need a buff, tanks need to be able to tank again. I hate how companions are just a stat buff now. Healers don't heal and most dps do so little damage.
Tiamat is still a mess. Havent been able to get pass the cleric phase since the mod drop.
Why would anyone seriously think they would roll back to an earlier version? That's just silly. Of course that's off the table and anyone that would ask that in a serious way is off their rocker.
My personal nitpick, since that's clearly what this thread is about:
Immolation Spirits. OMG, Warlocks just HAMSTER those out and leave them all over the place. I can't imagine it doesn't contribute to lag at some point. If nothing else @mimicking#6533 - give us some immolation spirit pooper scoopers. I pointed these out in closed beta, and in open beta, and someone (@asterdahl maybe or @noworries#8859) even said they were looking into it...
Dont forget the Undead from Thayan book, find thos standing all the places... lost count woul many times i tried to target those zombies...
Scaling = Scale down stats to some percentage Example : If u have 10,000 crit ... make it 40% less for other map so u can have 6000 crit . So if u improve and able to increase your crit to 20,000 then u will get 12000 crit in old content.
Scaling with hard cap = Scale down to definite value Example : If u have 10,000 crit ... and cap is set to 6000 for other map so u can have 6000 crit . But even if u improve and able to increase your crit to 20,000 then u will get again same 6000 crit in old content.
Pleas make me understand if I am incorrect. But if I am correct and NW implemented Scaling with hard cap then where is the progress ?
You are 100% right and that is the way it is staying from the sound of it. Hard capped down scaling regardless of your stats.
There is little to no incentive to improve. When players start to ask about a way to stop gaining experience you know there is a system in the game that is broken. Why would a player ask to stop gaining experience?
The only place that currently your effort for progress pays off is in the new content. You will be fine in the new dungeon, but outside the new content expect all your effort to be ignored.
yep is a hard cap but, HP and power a siede all the other stats are already "hard capped" since we have a hard cap in the percentual we can hit like the 50% crit chance....
I can be wrong but this makes the idea of scalling all stats even more useless...
My point is since we already have hard caps on %, only power and HP have to be scaled and that should be done with no hard caps, to allow progression... Doesn't matter if i have 100k crit on LV 80 my crit chance is still 50% so it would be in lv 10 even with no scaling is the % hard caps where working as planned...
What happens is that this sistem hard cap itens and enchants individually, every single piece scalled/capped in separated, then put it all together to creating the final stats rattings... thats the reason you cant hit the max cap when scaling hit you...
because people usually dont have all enchants on the same level, but when scalled they will have so the stats dont go down as a % value...
Again, uncapped stats aside, i can't understand the need of scalling if we already have a limit to how much our stats can help (like the 50%cap)...
0
silverkeltMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,235Arc User
11 days left of vip for me.. I cant imagine some of you poor sods with 500 days or something.. I never purchased more then 6 months at a time.. even when I didnt remotely think I would leave.. I dont trust game companies.
I had such hope, I am at a loss for words. I mean how do you not fix what you say you fixed AND freaking break more things with your patch. I mean at this point I am starting to think you are actually trying to break things instead of fix them. Might want to extend this 2x AD event.
Now that my undermountain content is finished, it's just collecting keys till VIP expires. I could care less about running the 2XAD event as the dungeons aren't worth the frustration.
Varric the Cursed Dwarven cursed to be Tiefling CW Original Serenity Mostly Retired DC Tokarek Bearded Dwarven OP Tankadin JuiceHead Goofy Human GWF Member of H3llzWarriors and Limitless.
I had such hope, I am at a loss for words. I mean how do you not fix what you say you fixed AND freaking break more things with your patch. I mean at this point I am starting to think you are actually trying to break things instead of fix them. Might want to extend this 2x AD event.
As the old saying goes: "99 little bugs in the code, 99 little bugs, you take one down, patch it around 127 little bugs in the code!"
And that can happen to a competent, motivated team with adequate resources and a lead Dev not high on the smell of his own hamster fluff. Now imagine it with Cryptic Devs...
> @silverkelt said: > 11 days left of vip for me.. I cant imagine some of you poor sods with 500 days or something.. I never purchased more then 6 months at a time.. even when I didnt remotely think I would leave.. I dont trust game companies.
Got just over 3000 😣, guess ill have to write them off and chalk it up to experiance
> 11 days left of vip for me.. I cant imagine some of you poor sods with 500 days or something.. I never purchased more then 6 months at a time.. even when I didnt remotely think I would leave.. I dont trust game companies.
Got just over 3000 😣, guess ill have to write them off and chalk it up to experiance
> 11 days left of vip for me.. I cant imagine some of you poor sods with 500 days or something.. I never purchased more then 6 months at a time.. even when I didnt remotely think I would leave.. I dont trust game companies.
Got just over 3000 😣, guess ill have to write them off and chalk it up to experiance
Wait...you seriously have about 9 years of VIP?
I have way over 1000. You have to remember that keys and VIP were combined purchases back in the day so people every time they purchased keys also got VIP. It was a great deal and one that most purchased to the point that they didn't have to purchase VIP for a long time.
Guild Leader: Under the Influence Yule (Barb): 72k : Siren (TR): 78k : Torun (DC): 73k : Siren OP (OP): 76k : Siren SW (SW): 78k : Modern (F): 80k : Cherry1 (CW) : 68k Siren HR (HR): 78k
So since they closed the mimic stream thread pretty quickly, what did you think of the responses from Mr. Foss? Happy with his answers, felt he evaded questions?
And where do you see direction game going from just this scaling response ?
Feedback welcomed.
The stream was good the Actual result or fix is a disaster the nerfing is now worst than before the patch/fix
There are more than BIS players in this game RIP Real Tiamat, RIP Real Demogorgon RIP real Temple of the spider. Why remove non bis content to give to bis players ???? FORCING the majority of your player base to play 4 mod old dungeons and trial will have a bad result on player base Changes are getting so bad i would rather prefer no new changes (RIP ICE FISHING in winter fest)
> 11 days left of vip for me.. I cant imagine some of you poor sods with 500 days or something.. I never purchased more then 6 months at a time.. even when I didnt remotely think I would leave.. I dont trust game companies.
Got just over 3000 😣, guess ill have to write them off and chalk it up to experiance
Wait...you seriously have about 9 years of VIP?
I have way over 1000. You have to remember that keys and VIP were combined purchases back in the day so people every time they purchased keys also got VIP. It was a great deal and one that most purchased to the point that they didn't have to purchase VIP for a long time.
I seem to remember 14 day VIP packs/extensions being an added drop from some events over the last couple of years (Protector's Jubilee, WinterFest...something). I added a lot of extra days because of that.
Sadly yes, not really bothered tbh, like cherryman1 says i used to get vip with key bundles, and ive never made any secret of the fact i was happy to spend real money on the game while i enjoyed it, as means to support my hobby. To give you an idea of how much ive spent i have 16 different legendary mounts from lockboxes i opened with those keys plus metalic dragonborn, and also sold a good few duplicate legendary mounts.
Im not sour, it was worth spending for my enjoymemt at the time, but its a reliable imcome stream the game no longer has.
I know someone whose estimate is close to 50 years of VIP racked up.
I'm not looking for forgiveness, and I'm way past asking permission. Earth just lost her best defender, so we're here to fight. And if you want to stand in our way, we'll fight you too.
Comments
That is, honestly, such a superb reference/analysis and entirely spot on. Neverwinter's Feat/Paragon system, while technically offering more choices/ways to play the game than Mod 16 does, was needlessly complex and had many 'dead end' builds that prevented endgame/successful dungeon play.
Mind you I'm not saying that people shouldn't be able to choose whichever way they want to play the game... However, for successful runs that were actually team work oriented and not hard carries by 1-2x of a given party, you were limited to very specific builds for Dungeon runs pre-Mod 16. It's been a LONG time issue with the game.
Mod 16 is not perfect, and had.has issues that need(ed) to be fixed ASAP including Scaling. The cast did show that the Devs are aware of that, offered a mea culpa, and are making a pretty major adjustment this Thursday. So that's definitely some positive news there and in my opinion bodes well going forward.
As for people requesting a rollback to Mod 15, and honestly expecting it would actually happen, all I can offer is this...
Any of my comments not posted in orange are based on my own personal opinion and not official.
Any messages written in orange are official moderation messages. Signature images are now fixed!
> I'll keep this in line with the topic. Stream response. I was disappointed with the quality of the stream, the repetitive verbiage that no one wanted to hear.. the lack of connect or care with what we the players want...
>
> What I would like to see...
>
> Rogue improvements
> Stealth becomes a toggle
> Party stealth becomes an option
> Stealth makes all attacks critical 100% no matter someone's anti crit measures.
> Ability to see the rune traps at a distance in master expeditions
> Ability to set traps.
>
> They say the give us what we ask for... mmm ok I'm waiting.
really, party stealth? we rogues don't do magic for anyone but ourselves! i agree with everything else 100%.
113 lines of code on the wall, 113 lines of code, rewrite one line, compile it again.......
Wait For It
I might be wrong, and some will surely say I am, but I truly believe that with this surge in the right kinds of communication efforts that are underway, that you have opened small window to fix the mistakes the "Cryptic forefathers" made during and after Alpha.
Please enjoy this throwback Julia and Thomas. Here within THIS tome, lies the playerbase's enthusiasm when it was at a fever's pitch back in early 2013.
This was my favorite episode of the "Neverwinter Online Crossroads Show", Episode 2, my short-lived four episode Neverwinter podcast. It aired live February 11, 2013 and was featured on iTunes.
I was joined by special guest host Deathsickle of the Hardcore Christian Gamers guild, for what was quite possibly the most extensive interview EVER done about Neverwinter, and some very important staff members of the day.
Our very special interview stars Lead Producer Andy Velasquez and Senior Environment Artist Crypticmapolis, with a surprise cameo by Cryptic COO (Chief Operating Officer) Craig Zinkievich!
We had a blast interviewing not one, not two, but three very important members of the Cryptic team. As Deathsickle stated after the interview "that was sooooo epic!", so don't miss it if you didn't see it years ago!!
I must say that the Neverwinter community was near NUCLEAR, abuzz and chompin' at the bit for any and all information about the game!! It was a really enthusiastic time.
Information was scarce of course, until this interview!
We scored over 10,000 views the night of the cast on iTunes. I believe it still holds the one day ratings record for anything Neverwinter related. Please enjoy !!
My favorite part of the interview may have been snagging then COO CRAIG ZINKIEVICH! He walked over trying to get his boys back to work... he wound up joining in the hi-jinx and so did the rest of the office!
I had planned for a 45-60 minute interview. It turned into 1 hour and 40 minutes and it was fun as all hell.
This was a great, and fun time. Our guild and alliance are STILL HERE of course, but I wish everyone from these days were as well. Oh well, here are to many more great days ahead for Neverwinter and for the greater Neverwinter community AS A WHOLE!
TYRS PALADIUM - A Premier Neverwinter Online Guild
No Drama. Camaraderie. TEAM Focus. That's the TYRS way. If that's your style, come join us!
Research our Guild here: Read our official Recruitment thread | Sign up here: Tyrs Guild Website! | NEVERWINTER GUILD LEADERS: Join the Fellowship!
Someone told me the link above in my last post didn't work for them, so here's another way to access the podcast.
And last but not least, Foundry > PvP in my heart of hearts... I'm sorry to see it go.
TYRS PALADIUM - A Premier Neverwinter Online Guild
No Drama. Camaraderie. TEAM Focus. That's the TYRS way. If that's your style, come join us!
Research our Guild here: Read our official Recruitment thread | Sign up here: Tyrs Guild Website! | NEVERWINTER GUILD LEADERS: Join the Fellowship!
There is little to no incentive to improve. When players start to ask about a way to stop gaining experience you know there is a system in the game that is broken. Why would a player ask to stop gaining experience?
The only place that currently your effort for progress pays off is in the new content. You will be fine in the new dungeon, but outside the new content expect all your effort to be ignored.
All companions need a buff, tanks need to be able to tank again. I hate how companions are just a stat buff now. Healers don't heal and most dps do so little damage.
Tiamat is still a mess. Havent been able to get pass the cleric phase since the mod drop.
Bots are running rampant in the random queus.
I can be wrong but this makes the idea of scalling all stats even more useless...
My point is since we already have hard caps on %, only power and HP have to be scaled and that should be done with no hard caps, to allow progression...
Doesn't matter if i have 100k crit on LV 80 my crit chance is still 50% so it would be in lv 10 even with no scaling is the % hard caps where working as planned...
What happens is that this sistem hard cap itens and enchants individually, every single piece scalled/capped in separated, then put it all together to creating the final stats rattings... thats the reason you cant hit the max cap when scaling hit you...
because people usually dont have all enchants on the same level, but when scalled they will have so the stats dont go down as a % value...
Again, uncapped stats aside, i can't understand the need of scalling if we already have a limit to how much our stats can help (like the 50%cap)...
Original Serenity Mostly Retired DC
Tokarek Bearded Dwarven OP Tankadin
JuiceHead Goofy Human GWF
Member of H3llzWarriors and Limitless.
And that can happen to a competent, motivated team with adequate resources and a lead Dev not high on the smell of his own hamster fluff. Now imagine it with Cryptic Devs...
> 11 days left of vip for me.. I cant imagine some of you poor sods with 500 days or something.. I never purchased more then 6 months at a time.. even when I didnt remotely think I would leave.. I dont trust game companies.
Got just over 3000 😣, guess ill have to write them off and chalk it up to experiance
Yule (Barb): 72k : Siren (TR): 78k : Torun (DC): 73k : Siren OP (OP): 76k : Siren SW (SW): 78k : Modern (F): 80k : Cherry1 (CW) : 68k Siren HR (HR): 78k
RIP Real Tiamat, RIP Real Demogorgon RIP real Temple of the spider. Why remove non bis content to give to bis players ????
FORCING the majority of your player base to play 4 mod old dungeons and trial will have a bad result on player base
Changes are getting so bad i would rather prefer no new changes (RIP ICE FISHING in winter fest)
Sadly yes, not really bothered tbh, like cherryman1 says i used to get vip with key bundles, and ive never made any secret of the fact i was happy to spend real money on the game while i enjoyed it, as means to support my hobby. To give you an idea of how much ive spent i have 16 different legendary mounts from lockboxes i opened with those keys plus metalic dragonborn, and also sold a good few duplicate legendary mounts.
Im not sour, it was worth spending for my enjoymemt at the time, but its a reliable imcome stream the game no longer has.