I couldn't disagree more. A new player that comes to Neverwinter online because it looks awesome, wants to play a game... a real game, not get escorted directly to the final dungeon. That will make many of the players looking for a 'deeper game' quit.
I would agree with you IF and only if this game had a great story and quest-lines, and we all know it doesn't have. Every new mod launched feels like it doesn't connect with previous one, opposed other mmos [like, i.e. Star Wars Old Republic] that with each new mod launched, we can feel and see the connections. The only exception is the basic storyline that everyone does from lvl 1 up to 60: ate least it make some sense, and I could include on that list mods 1 and 2, since we pursued and fought against Valindra [if any of you play the game since the launch, you will remember the "launch event", when we fought against Valindra's hordes trying to invade PE] and finally killed and sent her back to the philactery.
This game doesn't have a great storyline, and any new player can just start the game, and [if they want] just jump to Undermountain and reach lvl 80 without any problem or lack of understanding the story, cuz... you know.
Starting sometime around mod 4, most of the module storylines have been set to match up with the most recently 5E adventure module. There are of course a few exceptions (Aquisitions Incorporated-while obviously cross promotion-wasn't an adventure module, nor was anything from the River District. Ravenloft was, but it was released in NWO WAY out of order). But basically, story wise, the modules are relatively self-contained, though occasionally they call back to earlier plot lines.
Perhaps, the best couse of action is to give everyone double points toward campaign completion... as if they had a free Token of Patronage, so that they do not have to re-play the grinder quests over and over. This is what makes them painful. More so, now that the rewards nearly gone.
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theycallmetomuMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,861Arc User
Perhaps, the best couse of action is to give everyone double points toward campaign completion... as if they had a free Token of Patronage, so that they do not have to re-play the grinder quests over and over. This is what makes them painful. More so, now that the rewards nearly gone.
In my opinion, they should turn every level 70 campaign zone into a leveling zone. don't give x2 currency-remove the need for currency entirely. So boom, get to Sharandar. "Corellon preserve us! Arcane resoirvoire!" BOOM! "Now we need you to go to this place. Run these 6 specfic quests! Source of the blight, time to take down a redcap." And so on and so forth; make all quests non-repeatable. Then, when you're done, BLAM! Never again.
Should be able to knock out each campaign in a day. Still get all the content, but without the pointless grind.
Perhaps, the best couse of action is to give everyone double points toward campaign completion... as if they had a free Token of Patronage, so that they do not have to re-play the grinder quests over and over. This is what makes them painful. More so, now that the rewards nearly gone.
In my opinion, they should turn every level 70 campaign zone into a leveling zone. don't give x2 currency-remove the need for currency entirely. So boom, get to Sharandar. "Corellon preserve us! Arcane resoirvoire!" BOOM! "Now we need you to go to this place. Run these 6 specfic quests! Source of the blight, time to take down a redcap." And so on and so forth; make all quests non-repeatable. Then, when you're done, BLAM! Never again.
Should be able to knock out each campaign in a day. Still get all the content, but without the pointless grind.
Yes please.
Something along the lines of what was done for EE would be great.
Perhaps, the best couse of action is to give everyone double points toward campaign completion... as if they had a free Token of Patronage, so that they do not have to re-play the grinder quests over and over. This is what makes them painful. More so, now that the rewards nearly gone.
In my opinion, they should turn every level 70 campaign zone into a leveling zone. don't give x2 currency-remove the need for currency entirely. So boom, get to Sharandar. "Corellon preserve us! Arcane resoirvoire!" BOOM! "Now we need you to go to this place. Run these 6 specfic quests! Source of the blight, time to take down a redcap." And so on and so forth; make all quests non-repeatable. Then, when you're done, BLAM! Never again.
Should be able to knock out each campaign in a day. Still get all the content, but without the pointless grind.
Yes please.
Something along the lines of what was done for EE would be great.
This does, however, involve reworking how guild upgrades work, since obviously you wouldn't have fey et al currency for guilds.
o Please add a Tab to the Seal Trader that sells Signets of Patronage for each campaign for 1000 Crowns each, bound to character.
o Replace the campaign "Create" tab with a link to the Zen Store selling campaign buy-out and Genies Gifts (used to buy campaign currencies)
+ This will make campaigns fun (not a repeating grind). The only rewards left in the old campaigns are the experience and the boons. These were made to be a grind. They don't need to be, and this is something M16 can do to improve player experience.
Old dungeons reward Seals of the Crown, which cannot buy Mod16 relevant gear.
They should award Seals of the Mountain, as at least that is relevant gear because no one is getting stuck at level 70.
At this point we have a huge surplus of gear that is entirely irrelevant to game play that we earn seals to buy by doing dungeons that are now closer to the end game experience.
I realise that some of the gear issues may be fixed later, but that in no way means we should be earning a reward to get gear that is worse than random drops from HEs or Expeditions.
Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin Obsidian Oath - Warlock A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
Perhaps, the best couse of action is to give everyone double points toward campaign completion... as if they had a free Token of Patronage, so that they do not have to re-play the grinder quests over and over. This is what makes them painful. More so, now that the rewards nearly gone.
In my opinion, they should turn every level 70 campaign zone into a leveling zone. don't give x2 currency-remove the need for currency entirely. So boom, get to Sharandar. "Corellon preserve us! Arcane resoirvoire!" BOOM! "Now we need you to go to this place. Run these 6 specfic quests! Source of the blight, time to take down a redcap." And so on and so forth; make all quests non-repeatable. Then, when you're done, BLAM! Never again.
Should be able to knock out each campaign in a day. Still get all the content, but without the pointless grind.
Yes please.
Something along the lines of what was done for EE would be great.
This does, however, involve reworking how guild upgrades work, since obviously you wouldn't have fey et al currency for guilds.
this needs to happen anyway. long over due. strongholds needs some love
Here is a way to spice up character creation, add some diversity, and reward frequent online play. Each of the patron god/dieties confers a unique blessing bonus, earned through invocation:
Amaunator - 10% Glory-Exp Gain , 1% AP gain Chauntea - 4000 Health , 4% Heal potion boost Correllion - 1% Accuracy , 3% companion power Kelemvor - 1% armor penetration , 1% Health Steal * Moradin - 1% Defense , 3% companion HP Oghma - 1% Awareness , 1% recovery Selune - 2% movement , 2% Stamina Silvanus - 1% combat advantage , 2% control resist Sune - 1% critical resist , 2% incoming healing Tempus - 1% critical strike , 1% critical severity Torm - 1% Power , 2% Control Tymora - 1% deflection , 10% Gold Gain
HOW THE INVOCATION SYSTEM WORKS:
Patron deity is chosen at character creation, and each character begins play with 10 invocation points. Whenever a character invokes, they gain 1 invocation point. A character loses one invocation point at the start of each day. If they did not invoke the day before, they lose an additional invocation point. The maximum number of points is capped at 15. Invocation points measure favor with the patron deity and determine the blessings they bestow upon your character:
At 5 points, the character begins receiving Ardent coins each time they invoke. At 10 points the character gains the 1st blessing in the list above. At 15 points the character also receives the 2nd blessing in the list above.
Patron deity can be changed at any time by donating 5 gold to Aralynn at the campfire in Protector's Enclave. After switching, invocation points are set to zero. NOTE: The current items in the Ardent coin store should have their costs cut in half. A new range of top end items should be added to it.
* HEALTH STEAL:Whenever an At-Will power does damage, the percent chance of dealing an extra 50% damage. An amount equal to the extra damage transfers to the damage-dealer as health gain.
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adinosiiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,294Arc User
They should award Seals of the Mountain, as at least that is relevant gear because no one is getting stuck at level 70.
Hmm... but what if people were? For example, what if you could not start the Undermountain campaign or gain XP to progress beyond L70 until you had reached a certain minimum IL? This would ensure that people would indeed be stuck at L70 for a while, and that would make the L70 rewards relevant.
Yes, I do realizethis would not be popular with the "I want it NOW!" crowd, but this would solve the problem you described.
Thats ridiculous. They already have 70 levels to get through first. Marketing by making it 'available' as quickly as possible is good. But to make it easy to master is wildly counter-productive. We should avoid a mentality of spoiling new players by allowing them to rush to the end of the game because we are afraid they might get bored and quit first.
Why?
What do you think the goals of the dev team are, exactly? Undermountain is the latest D&D Adventure module (released Nov 2018), and Mod 16 is cross promotion. People are going to be coming to NWO because they want to try out Undermountain, and people are going to be trying out the D&D adventure module because of the game.
New players playing Undermountain aren't any more "spoiled" than people who played Sharandar for the first time. People need to stop getting it in their head that the only proper way to play the game is to do 100% of the content released for the game.
True, but I guess problem is that all that content would become so meaningless and unrewarding that a new player would find no reason to go there. Boons at current prewiev are...how to say that ? "not worthy" So there is literally no reason at all to even go there. And with such approach new player gona be bored really soon. And I may be wrong here but Cryptic more likely prefere a customer to stay around for a while and spent some cash right? If there would be no reason there would be no cash. And no, acces to irrelevant level 70 dungeons wont be necessery as those wont give any good loot so.... tons of waisted content.
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theycallmetomuMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,861Arc User
Thats ridiculous. They already have 70 levels to get through first. Marketing by making it 'available' as quickly as possible is good. But to make it easy to master is wildly counter-productive. We should avoid a mentality of spoiling new players by allowing them to rush to the end of the game because we are afraid they might get bored and quit first.
Why?
What do you think the goals of the dev team are, exactly? Undermountain is the latest D&D Adventure module (released Nov 2018), and Mod 16 is cross promotion. People are going to be coming to NWO because they want to try out Undermountain, and people are going to be trying out the D&D adventure module because of the game.
New players playing Undermountain aren't any more "spoiled" than people who played Sharandar for the first time. People need to stop getting it in their head that the only proper way to play the game is to do 100% of the content released for the game.
True, but I guess problem is that all that content would become so meaningless and unrewarding that a new player would find no reason to go there. Boons at current prewiev are...how to say that ? "not worthy" So there is literally no reason at all to even go there. And with such approach new player gona be bored really soon. And I may be wrong here but Cryptic more likely prefere a customer to stay around for a while and spent some cash right? If there would be no reason there would be no cash. And no, acces to irrelevant level 70 dungeons wont be necessery as those wont give any good loot so.... tons of waisted content.
If players are going to be bored because they don't have access to mods 1-15, I can't help but wonder about why the original base game wasn't boring.
> @adinosii said: > They should award Seals of the Mountain, as at least that is relevant gear because no one is getting stuck at level 70. > > Hmm... but what if people were? For example, what if you could not start the Undermountain campaign or gain XP to progress beyond L70 until you had reached a certain minimum IL? This would ensure that people would indeed be stuck at L70 for a while, and that would make the L70 rewards relevant. > > Yes, I do realizethis would not be popular with the "I want it NOW!" crowd, but this would solve the problem you described.
Actually I had considered that as well, but currently there seems to be no sign of that as an intention.
Which brings us back to; Old level 70 dungeons still drop Elven gear which needs to be replaced with Blackjaw gear.
Primal gear needs to be replaced with Spy gear or at least the most expensive stuff sold for AD in YP at the moment bumped to level 80. (Which would be worse than Spy, but at least relevant.)
Right now I’ll log into Mod16 when it drops, convert seals, go to Barovia get gear, then level to 80 and farm gear in Expeditions. Will take about a week per toon to be LotMM ready...
But everything that drops Crown seals is pointless once you are at 80.
Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin Obsidian Oath - Warlock A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
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adinosiiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,294Arc User
OK, one issue that I just noticed. For the new armor gear (Armor of the Successor, Runed Apprentice armor etc), we typically have a choice between two pieces for each slot. Now typically the pieces have somewhat different stats, which is good, as it allows you to tune your character's stats.
However, all the Head and Feet items always have Crit Chance. This makes it needlessly tough to keep that stat down to a reasonable number. Can we get some variability there - maybe have every other piece have Combat Advantage instead of Crit Chance ?
Admittedly the 1k iL feet from Master Expeditions have a movement boost on them as well, so perhaps they are an alternative?
But I do agree the new Seal purchased sets are very limited in their choices for stats and this makes up a significant portion of character customisation right now.
Obsidian Moonlight - Paladin Obsidian Oath - Warlock A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
A lot of 70+ plus players will have weapon enchants, why don't the weapons rewarded by quests have weapon enchantment slots? The weapons get increasingly better than the artifact Undermountain weapon set due to stats and damage, the level 80 rewarded weapons have +644 more damage but feel useless to me without a slot for my vorpal. Green level armor has armor enchantments slots, why don't the weapons have enchantment slots?
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adinosiiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,294Arc User
A lot of 70+ plus players will have weapon enchants, why don't the weapons rewarded by quests have weapon enchantment slots? The weapons get increasingly better than the artifact Undermountain weapon set due to stats and damage, the level 80 rewarded weapons have +644 more damage but feel useless to me without a slot for my vorpal. Green level armor has armor enchantments slots, why don't the weapons have enchantment slots?
Those green items are just refinement fodder. The only logical upgrade from the lvl 70 gear you have at the start of Undermountain (Vistani, Undermountain, Primal or whatever) would be one of the new Lvl 80 weapon sets, with a set bonus and a weapon enchantment slot.
Well duh that's what they are now. The new artifact weapons won't be as easy to get as they are by going to a preview vendor on live.. especially with them putting the trade bar weapons behind a $200 price tag at release. I'm trying to see what the legit means of getting those artifact is because it isn't like they're dropped into your hands when you hit 80...
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adinosiiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,294Arc User
edited April 2019
I upgraded the Woven Wine and Blooming Cord to Legendary on Preview, but it does not register in the collection - it just shows the green rank. Regarding the artifact sets, there are way too many pieces with Critical Strike stat....it is somewhat hard to make a BiS character without wasting a lot of points in that stat. It would be nice to have some items with points for example in Combat Advantage instead.
For reference, here are my current stats on Preview: 102.000 points in Crit Strike is absurdly excessive, as anything above 55.000 is just wasted. I can get it down to 80K or so...but pushing it down further is quite hard because there are just too many items (like the ones mentioned above, as well as head/feet pieces from the new armor sets
It is a bit demotivating to work towards new and supposedly "better" gear, if it only gives stats I have already maxed out.
Well duh that's what they are now. The new artifact weapons won't be as easy to get as they are by going to a preview vendor on live.. especially with them putting the trade bar weapons behind a $200 price tag at release. I'm trying to see what the legit means of getting those artifact is because it isn't like they're dropped into your hands when you hit 80...
After a few Master expeditions i could get those Ebonized weapons, main hand only so far but the have more dmg than a fully upgraded primal and 1 offence + enchant slots, so you only miss one offence slot.
to be honest my weapon enchantments are cool but not that game changing on next mod for new players, set your dmg log up to see
*Anyway if you have a free day you can buy a enchant in a one day farm, used to takes much more time (at least when i started to play)...
Edit. the point on the last part was to agree that any Lv 70 wepon and armor should have the enchantent slot like artifacts weapon and purple armor, because now is much easy to get those enchants... Sorry if i missed the ponit abouve, english is not my native language, and mistakes like that happen some times...
Post edited by rafaelda on
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adinosiiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,294Arc User
Well duh that's what they are now. The new artifact weapons won't be as easy to get as they are by going to a preview vendor on live..
Well, you just buy the Burnished set with seals you get from running LoMM, so that's not too hard. You get the Alabaster set from the Master expeditions, but I must admit I am not 100% sure how you get the watcher set, which has the same stats as the other two, but a better set bonus.
(...Agree with above) The over-abundance of crit on the new equipments causes crit to cap first. You dont even need to equip a companion crit boost, or runestones and its just maxed no matter what. The stats that are 'lagging' are Combat Advantage, Critical Avoidance, and Awareness. This is because of the way the old "Lifesteal" got split in multiple directions. The new equipment doens't compensate to bring these up. (In PvE, Awareness is a "trap" stat right now, worth some but not much. Critical Avoidance might be a huge stat.. it all depends on where critical severity is set at. If its 100% critical severity... then Critical Avoidance is as important as defense.
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rickcase276Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,404Arc User
But it did say the mountaineer set would be put into the tradebar store at a later date, so just have to be patient until then.
Maybe they will do the same thing, they did when Omu came out. Bundle the offhand of one set with a key pack and the main hand with a companion (Maybe it was the other way round or they were bundled with different stuff, not 100% certain, but there was a way to get the set without investing 15k zen.
Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master
Well duh that's what they are now. The new artifact weapons won't be as easy to get as they are by going to a preview vendor on live..
Well, you just buy the Burnished set with seals you get from running LoMM, so that's not too hard. You get the Alabaster set from the Master expeditions, but I must admit I am not 100% sure how you get the watcher set, which has the same stats as the other two, but a better set bonus.
Hmm, I haven't gotten the alabaster set yet. Collection says it comes from a Master Expedition quest? Watcher set seems to have to do with Expeditions too according to the collection.
rafaelda, I haven't seen any ebonized weapons yet but that sounds like what I need to be looking for until I figure out the sets. Thanks.
I can't buy shirt and trousers from the Mountain seal Vendor ! I can see the rest of the gear pieces but no shirt or trousers there ! Is this a bug or they are going to be Zen only purchase?
Best
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lordseth1985Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 319Arc User
What's the point in doing those expeditions if the rewards aren't rewarding enough? Fighting those hi-lvl monsters it's like hit a stone wall with wet noodles... and after they are finally dead, the rewards are insulting...
Avestruz.Q.T.Seduz - Rogue, natural born assassin.
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adinosiiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,294Arc User
insulting? The final chest has given me pretty decent gear.
Comments
Should be able to knock out each campaign in a day. Still get all the content, but without the pointless grind.
Something along the lines of what was done for EE would be great.
o Please add a Tab to the Seal Trader that sells Signets of Patronage for each campaign for 1000 Crowns each, bound to character.
o Replace the campaign "Create" tab with a link to the Zen Store selling campaign buy-out and Genies Gifts (used to buy campaign currencies)
+ This will make campaigns fun (not a repeating grind). The only rewards left in the old campaigns are the experience and the boons. These were made to be a grind. They don't need to be, and this is something M16 can do to improve player experience.
They should award Seals of the Mountain, as at least that is relevant gear because no one is getting stuck at level 70.
At this point we have a huge surplus of gear that is entirely irrelevant to game play that we earn seals to buy by doing dungeons that are now closer to the end game experience.
I realise that some of the gear issues may be fixed later, but that in no way means we should be earning a reward to get gear that is worse than random drops from HEs or Expeditions.
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
Here is a way to spice up character creation, add some diversity, and reward frequent online play. Each of the patron god/dieties confers a unique blessing bonus, earned through invocation:
Amaunator - 10% Glory-Exp Gain , 1% AP gain
Chauntea - 4000 Health , 4% Heal potion boost
Correllion - 1% Accuracy , 3% companion power
Kelemvor - 1% armor penetration , 1% Health Steal *
Moradin - 1% Defense , 3% companion HP
Oghma - 1% Awareness , 1% recovery
Selune - 2% movement , 2% Stamina
Silvanus - 1% combat advantage , 2% control resist
Sune - 1% critical resist , 2% incoming healing
Tempus - 1% critical strike , 1% critical severity
Torm - 1% Power , 2% Control
Tymora - 1% deflection , 10% Gold Gain
HOW THE INVOCATION SYSTEM WORKS:
Patron deity is chosen at character creation, and each character begins play with 10 invocation points. Whenever a character invokes, they gain 1 invocation point. A character loses one invocation point at the start of each day. If they did not invoke the day before, they lose an additional invocation point. The maximum number of points is capped at 15. Invocation points measure favor with the patron deity and determine the blessings they bestow upon your character:
At 5 points, the character begins receiving Ardent coins each time they invoke.
At 10 points the character gains the 1st blessing in the list above.
At 15 points the character also receives the 2nd blessing in the list above.
Patron deity can be changed at any time by donating 5 gold to Aralynn at the campfire in Protector's Enclave. After switching, invocation points are set to zero. NOTE: The current items in the Ardent coin store should have their costs cut in half. A new range of top end items should be added to it.
* HEALTH STEAL: Whenever an At-Will power does damage, the percent chance of dealing an extra 50% damage. An amount equal to the extra damage transfers to the damage-dealer as health gain.
Yes, I do realizethis would not be popular with the "I want it NOW!" crowd, but this would solve the problem you described.
So there is literally no reason at all to even go there. And with such approach new player gona be bored really soon. And I may be wrong here but Cryptic more likely prefere a customer to stay around for a while and spent some cash right? If there would be no reason there would be no cash. And no, acces to irrelevant level 70 dungeons wont be necessery as those wont give any good loot so.... tons of waisted content.
> They should award Seals of the Mountain, as at least that is relevant gear because no one is getting stuck at level 70.
>
> Hmm... but what if people were? For example, what if you could not start the Undermountain campaign or gain XP to progress beyond L70 until you had reached a certain minimum IL? This would ensure that people would indeed be stuck at L70 for a while, and that would make the L70 rewards relevant.
>
> Yes, I do realizethis would not be popular with the "I want it NOW!" crowd, but this would solve the problem you described.
Actually I had considered that as well, but currently there seems to be no sign of that as an intention.
Which brings us back to;
Old level 70 dungeons still drop Elven gear which needs to be replaced with Blackjaw gear.
Primal gear needs to be replaced with Spy gear or at least the most expensive stuff sold for AD in YP at the moment bumped to level 80. (Which would be worse than Spy, but at least relevant.)
Right now I’ll log into Mod16 when it drops, convert seals, go to Barovia get gear, then level to 80 and farm gear in Expeditions. Will take about a week per toon to be LotMM ready...
But everything that drops Crown seals is pointless once you are at 80.
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
However, all the Head and Feet items always have Crit Chance. This makes it needlessly tough to keep that stat down to a reasonable number. Can we get some variability there - maybe have every other piece have Combat Advantage instead of Crit Chance ?
But I do agree the new Seal purchased sets are very limited in their choices for stats and this makes up a significant portion of character customisation right now.
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
I upgraded the Woven Wine and Blooming Cord to Legendary on Preview, but it does not register in the collection - it just shows the green rank.
Regarding the artifact sets, there are way too many pieces with Critical Strike stat....it is somewhat hard to make a BiS character without wasting a lot of points in that stat. It would be nice to have some items with points for example in Combat Advantage instead.
For reference, here are my current stats on Preview:
102.000 points in Crit Strike is absurdly excessive, as anything above 55.000 is just wasted. I can get it down to 80K or so...but pushing it down further is quite hard because there are just too many items (like the ones mentioned above, as well as head/feet pieces from the new armor sets
It is a bit demotivating to work towards new and supposedly "better" gear, if it only gives stats I have already maxed out.
to be honest my weapon enchantments are cool but not that game changing on next mod for new players, set your dmg log up to see
*Anyway if you have a free day you can buy a enchant in a one day farm, used to takes much more time (at least when i started to play)...
Edit. the point on the last part was to agree that any Lv 70 wepon and armor should have the enchantent slot like artifacts weapon and purple armor, because now is much easy to get those enchants...
Sorry if i missed the ponit abouve, english is not my native language, and mistakes like that happen some times...
rafaelda, I haven't seen any ebonized weapons yet but that sounds like what I need to be looking for until I figure out the sets. Thanks.
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.
Best