thefabricantMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 5,248Arc User
The person who decided the new legendary tools should be worse then the forgehammer should seriously reconsider this. They are so bad in the new system that I will not even exchange them and instead keep my legendary tools as a memento of when they were actually useful.
Supplements do not seem to be working properly. It shows required level in red on all of them except for the level 70. It allows me to use the level 70 supplements for professions I have that are still level 1 and my level 70 professions.
Prior to this patch, you could use artisan recruitment scrolls that were given for your legacy professions slots, but not the one's purchased. Now, you can not use either.
Personally I think that the new system should have 2 tool slots, maybe being this second one only usable by Masterwork and legendary tools. Obviously the numbers should be adjusted accordingly so with these two slots you get the same probability of success that in the old system.
This way people who invested a lot on them (not me because I don't have any, not even the forgehammer) will still have a use for the old tools. This change would requiere time so it would not come with the start of the module, but if something like this is announced people could get some use for the old tools instead of just keeping them for the memories.
This is still an issue, unchanged. I’d like to know what the value of purple is going to be – both Heros from Leadership and the non-Leadership ones as noted above, so I can know whether I should put them together or not.
Thanks,
I thought he said the prices were based on what the artisans were selling for on the AH prior to information coming out regarding the M15. They took a snapshot of the AH prices and based prices on that.
One exchange currency unit = 1 AD = 1 silver
So Heroes were selling for 80k AD on the AH and will will give you 80k exchange currency units is what I recall.
The person who decided the new legendary tools should be worse then the forgehammer should seriously reconsider this. They are so bad in the new system that I will not even exchange them and instead keep my legendary tools as a memento of when they were actually useful.
Even so, them being BoC could maybe work to our advantage. In time there will fewer and fewer of them on AH now, so providing theres still mastercrafters in a year or so, they may be worth something again, dunno... For now it just looks like a big kick in the crunch to us..
The person who decided the new legendary tools should be worse then the forgehammer should seriously reconsider this. They are so bad in the new system that I will not even exchange them and instead keep my legendary tools as a memento of when they were actually useful.
Several of the new Legendary Tools are “Adventurer’s Tools” used in Gathering, where the Forgehammer can’t be used. You’ll get more successes and crits by using them, which will improve your crit chances at the workbench.
That said, I think the combination of epic artisans and tools is too weak, and a step backward; but I think the relative value of the Legendary Tools and the Forgehammer is fine.
Those of us who have legendary tools craft so much it is not practical to perform gathering tasks ourselves and would have to buy them from others. This is not in any way a substitute...
He said the ILevel of all the artifacts sets was going to be increased. Granted, I thought he just meant the waist/neck pieces, but apparently also the weapons. All have had identical ILevel increases now.
You missed my point. These are the starting levels for the artifact weapons (green level). Titansteel should be less than the Bronzewood.
The person who decided the new legendary tools should be worse then the forgehammer should seriously reconsider this. They are so bad in the new system that I will not even exchange them and instead keep my legendary tools as a memento of when they were actually useful.
Several of the new Legendary Tools are “Adventurer’s Tools” used in Gathering, where the Forgehammer can’t be used. You’ll get more successes and crits by using them, which will improve your crit chances at the workbench.
That said, I think the combination of epic artisans and tools is too weak, and a step backward; but I think the relative value of the Legendary Tools and the Forgehammer is fine.
Those of us who have legendary tools craft so much it is not practical to perform gathering tasks ourselves and would have to buy them from others. This is not in any way a substitute...
You have 3 slots per toon that can do nothing but gathering. Why would you not use them?
The point is, this is not remotely a comparison to how useful these tools are now and I cannot gather enough relative to the amount of materials used. For context, right now, when I am actively crafting I use ~1000-1200 bronzewood logs every single week. This is not even looking at other materials. These new legendary tools, are, in my eyes, useless.
The person who decided the new legendary tools should be worse then the forgehammer should seriously reconsider this. They are so bad in the new system that I will not even exchange them and instead keep my legendary tools as a memento of when they were actually useful.
Several of the new Legendary Tools are “Adventurer’s Tools” used in Gathering, where the Forgehammer can’t be used. You’ll get more successes and crits by using them, which will improve your crit chances at the workbench.
That said, I think the combination of epic artisans and tools is too weak, and a step backward; but I think the relative value of the Legendary Tools and the Forgehammer is fine.
Those of us who have legendary tools craft so much it is not practical to perform gathering tasks ourselves and would have to buy them from others. This is not in any way a substitute...
You have 3 slots per toon that can do nothing but gathering. Why would you not use them?
The point is, this is not remotely a comparison to how useful these tools are now and I cannot gather enough relative to the amount of materials used. For context, right now, when I am actively crafting I use ~1000-1200 bronzewood logs every single week. This is not even looking at other materials. These new legendary tools, are, in my eyes, useless.
That also concentrates the AD-wealth to a very small number of players. It’s pretty clear that Crypic is trying to change/prevent that. They’re explicitly trying to reduce the ZAX backlog, but their recent actions also imply they’re trying to distribute the wealth more evenly among the players.
So 95% to ~65% is a big hit, but it’s not nearly as big a hit as the chances of making the “+1” items, which is where most of the value will be. The 50-100 point differences between the tools will make very little difference for that.
I am not arguing they should be as good as they were in the old system, only that they should be better then they are in the new system and that they should absolutely be better then the forgehammer.
My prediction is crafting will not even be worth it in the new system. Everybody and his mother who has a forgehammer will craft, the value will drop to below the value of the materials since at least half of the people who craft don't even bother to calculate the craft cost and the only way to make AD will be to sell materials.
The person who decided the new legendary tools should be worse then the forgehammer should seriously reconsider this. They are so bad in the new system that I will not even exchange them and instead keep my legendary tools as a memento of when they were actually useful.
Several of the new Legendary Tools are “Adventurer’s Tools” used in Gathering, where the Forgehammer can’t be used. You’ll get more successes and crits by using them, which will improve your crit chances at the workbench.
That said, I think the combination of epic artisans and tools is too weak, and a step backward; but I think the relative value of the Legendary Tools and the Forgehammer is fine.
Those of us who have legendary tools craft so much it is not practical to perform gathering tasks ourselves and would have to buy them from others. This is not in any way a substitute...
You have 3 slots per toon that can do nothing but gathering. Why would you not use them?
The point is, this is not remotely a comparison to how useful these tools are now and I cannot gather enough relative to the amount of materials used. For context, right now, when I am actively crafting I use ~1000-1200 bronzewood logs every single week. This is not even looking at other materials. These new legendary tools, are, in my eyes, useless.
That also concentrates the AD-wealth to a very small number of players. It’s pretty clear that Crypic is trying to change/prevent that. They’re explicitly trying to reduce the ZAX backlog, but their recent actions also imply they’re trying to distribute the wealth more evenly among the players.
So 95% to ~65% is a big hit, but it’s not nearly as big a hit as the chances of making the “+1” items, which is where most of the value will be. The 50-100 point differences between the tools will make very little difference for that.
I am not arguing they should be as good as they were in the old system, only that they should be better then they are in the new system and that they should absolutely be better then the forgehammer.
My prediction is crafting will not even be worth it in the new system. Everybody and his mother who has a forgehammer will craft, the value will drop to below the value of the materials since at least half of the people who craft don't even bother to calculate the craft cost and the only way to make AD will be to sell materials.
The Forgehammer only drops rarely during various events. The legendary tools can be had just by opening enough lockboxes, anytime, even if they’re more rare than legendary mounts. I suppose if Cryptic wants to get (a few) people to open more lockboxes, they’d do what you suggest. But in terms of rarity and AD-sink cost (i.e., refining the artifact), the Forgehammer wins.
Also, I think all of these things should be as good as they were in the old system, otherwise it’s a nerf, not an improvement. I’ve written a long post about that, but it doesn’t seem to want to post… no idea why….
But anyway, I suspect the price of the +0 items will crash, as people like you, who make a hundred things a week, try to make the +1 items at a 5-25% chance. Even if you try to price-fix, someone will crash it (maybe me, lol). Maybe those +1 items will make up the cost… maybe not….
Personally, I try to avoid buying ingredients with AD, and instead grind them from GM. I have active guilds, so that’s just part of the game. Then, whatever the sale price, I’m turning my play time into AD. Of course, I’ll never be able to buy a 90 million AD legendary tool that way….
No, the forgehammer does not even remotely win and it could drop in professions packs as well. The most obscene part of legendary tools is that, in terms of their rarity, they are actually not overvalued, they are, by far undervalued.
There is no practical way to obtain the tools you want. I estimated in the current system, if I wanted to try and "force" a hammer for example, it would take me over a billion AD.
so i have been watching this thread for a while, and...whats the point of it all? i did professions to get my leadership up to the point i could get refinement out of it. never did any 3rd lvl skill, never did master-crafting. none of that interests me. i want to play to quest and kill stuff. but what i dont see from any of these posts is an end result? what is the point of spending all the time, AD,gold? what can you make which is a) useful and b) worth the bother
so i have been watching this thread for a while, and...whats the point of it all? i did professions to get my leadership up to the point i could get refinement out of it. never did any 3rd lvl skill, never did master-crafting. none of that interests me. i want to play to quest and kill stuff. but what i dont see from any of these posts is an end result? what is the point of spending all the time, AD,gold? what can you make which is a) useful and b) worth the bother
The new gear will be 2nd Bis (IL 560, vs. 600 for the AI stuff), and the artifact sets / weapons will be BiS... at least until Mod 16....
so..., aimed at endgame players and not new players then
Having a legendary tool have additional bonus effects might help keep their value vs gond. Gond would have a higher chance at succession chance but legendary tools could take a risk vs reward type of style. Maybe increased material cost for a higher chance at high quality products or even make +2 gear possible through an effect of legendary tools. Something to make them retain their current value as I can understand that mc should have their risks as well
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adinosiiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,294Arc User
edited October 2018
There is an issue with the material satchel. Now, I know that I can free up a lot of space there by getting rid of obsolete materials, but someone who has not followed the discussion on the Preview forum may not be aware of a significant increase in the number of slots needed, and that can cause problems.
Here is an example.
I copied over a character that had 4 free slots for materials. When I opened the profession box I got initially, some of the items ended up in the 4 empty slots, but the rest was just, well...lost...didn't go into the overflow bag or anything.
Now, I know that I could have avoided this as I said, by getting rid of obsolete materials first, but my point is that there is no indication whatsoever that it is needed.
Having a legendary tool have additional bonus effects might help keep their value vs gond. Gond would have a higher chance at succession chance but legendary tools could take a risk vs reward type of style. Maybe increased material cost for a higher chance at high quality products or even make +2 gear possible through an effect of legendary tools. Something to make them retain their current value as I can understand that mc should have their risks as well
I’m sure +2 gear will come at some point.
The advantage of legendary tools was that you could use several of them. Individually, they were less powerful than the forgehammer. I think being able to use them in Gathering, where the forgehammer can’t be used, is enough of a special ability for them.
All the professions from level 1 on have risks now, btw.
I believe >+1 has been implemented but impossible to reach. Above mythic artis ahoy, Forgehammer of dong at "ungodly" rank omegaLUL
+1 Masterwork crafted items still don't count towards quests:
On a more plusser side, I used the artisan that has a chance to double the crafted items. So there should be something that can be done with an extra Masterwork Final quest items: These items should be worth more than the printed coin value or exchanged for the resources used.
For some reason, the artisans and tools unslot themselves after crafting. This happens about every 1-5 items crafted. It gets quite annoying when crafting 500 Thingamabobs.
@manjusriyamantak more of a risk I mean, price wise legendary tools overshadow the price of a forgehammer. While they aren't as good in the new system, making them obsolete isn't ideal for how much of an investment they were previously. While they can be used in gathering, I rather not think about something worth several legendary mounts being used to gather material I could have bought off the ah for far cheaper and faster than how much the tools were worth
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Prior to this patch, you could use artisan recruitment scrolls that were given for your legacy professions slots, but not the one's purchased. Now, you can not use either.
This way people who invested a lot on them (not me because I don't have any, not even the forgehammer) will still have a use for the old tools.
This change would requiere time so it would not come with the start of the module, but if something like this is announced people could get some use for the old tools instead of just keeping them for the memories.
One exchange currency unit = 1 AD = 1 silver
So Heroes were selling for 80k AD on the AH and will will give you 80k exchange currency units is what I recall.
The green Titansteel show iLevel 540. Green Bronzewood show iLevel 515. These are for the OP set.
For now it just looks like a big kick in the crunch to us..
My prediction is crafting will not even be worth it in the new system. Everybody and his mother who has a forgehammer will craft, the value will drop to below the value of the materials since at least half of the people who craft don't even bother to calculate the craft cost and the only way to make AD will be to sell materials.
There is no practical way to obtain the tools you want. I estimated in the current system, if I wanted to try and "force" a hammer for example, it would take me over a billion AD.
Here is an example.
I copied over a character that had 4 free slots for materials. When I opened the profession box I got initially, some of the items ended up in the 4 empty slots, but the rest was just, well...lost...didn't go into the overflow bag or anything.
Now, I know that I could have avoided this as I said, by getting rid of obsolete materials first, but my point is that there is no indication whatsoever that it is needed.
On a more plusser side, I used the artisan that has a chance to double the crafted items. So there should be something that can be done with an extra Masterwork Final quest items:
These items should be worth more than the printed coin value or exchanged for the resources used.
For some reason, the artisans and tools unslot themselves after crafting. This happens about every 1-5 items crafted. It gets quite annoying when crafting 500 Thingamabobs.
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