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Tyrant Hunt Drop - Bile Drenched

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  • unthoughtknownunthoughtknown Member Posts: 130 Arc User
    edited May 2018
    First @noworries#8859 I truly appreciate the response and acknowledgment of the bug I opened. The disappointment is I logged this bug 2 weeks after mod launched about 7 weeks ago. Posted in here multiple times and no response to the biggest hunt in the new mod. The lure for tyrant goes for 40-50 smops in game and I've bought at least 9-10 thinking bad RNG luck as bug was not being acknowledged. I think when I add up the all the people that I have personally talked to about 1/2 billon AD in market value spent with no chance of getting drop.
    Post edited by unthoughtknown on
  • oremonger#9999 oremonger Member Posts: 213 Arc User
    edited May 2018

    Looking into this there does seem to be an issue with the treasure table. The intention was to stop players from receiving the item if they had no use for it (had upgraded past that point already), but the table was checking against the wrong level of ring (level 4 or above) which is what is causing the problem.

    I am at a loss for words. This combined with the supposed Master Work bug "fixes" shows me that you really don't care how much AD, Zen and resources we burn testing content for you. There is still no eta on a fix and no apology or compensation for those who can prove they lost millions of AD. At least there is finally a response after weeks of nothing.

    Maybe the next mod should be nothing but bug fixes. Better yet maybe just don't touch anything, I wouldn't want to start healing the Tyrant or something.
    Post edited by oremonger#9999 on
  • noworries#8859 noworries Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 651 Cryptic Developer

    @noworries#8859 Do you have a way to check if a player have killed the tyrant already? I've killed 30+ of them (using the lure myself as expected) and many others have killed a few more or less than me. It has been a lot of effort and investment so far just to realize that we were never going to get that scale, it's frustrating. It would be nice if you could automatically grant a bile drenched scale to those who have killed the tyrant when the fix goes live.

    I don't have any answer on the feasibility of anything like that right now. I became aware of the thread and looked into the issue to make sure to get a fix in for an upcoming build and wanted to make sure to make that information known so players could know if they were in this position and not use up any more lures.

    It certainly is frustrating. And although bugs will happen due to the nature of this type of business, we dropped the ball by letting this thread go under our radar for as long as it did. Other posters are right that it is even more frustrating when put in the context of a couple of other recent bugs.

    There's always a lot going on which makes it possible for issues to go unnoticed sometimes, but when a thread has additional information added to it multiple times (including players figuring out the cause), we really need to be better at grabbing that and following up on it sooner.
  • trgluestickztrgluestickz Member Posts: 1,144 Arc User
    edited May 2018
    @noworries#8859

    I would strongly sugest your dev team double check the kutlass scale drop from the kutlass hunt while you guys are at it. There have been player reports of it potentially being bugged as well.
    --
    PVP Rogue,
    --[----- "Your friendly neighborhood spawn of Satan." -----]--
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    Main Character: Hurricane Marigolds (Rogue WK & Assassin)
    Ingame Handle: trgluestickz
    Discord Name: Hurricane🌀Marigolds#2563
    Guilds: She Looked LVL 18 & Essence of Aggression
    Alliances: Imperium & Order of the Silent Shroud
    Platform: PC
  • pteriaspterias Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 661 Arc User
    edited May 2018
    I have no dog in this fight because I will never have a Tyrant lure to use, but this absolutely calls for compensation. At the very least, the scale should be put in the Tyrant weapon store for 1 tooth. Even that isn't fair.

    This is what happens with all this black-box RNG in RNG in RNG in RNG nonsense capped with not even telling people what the intended behavior is once they get there. We still don't even know (do we?) if it's a guaranteed drop or yet another layer of RNG. This makes testing maddening and can cause egregious wastes of resources.

    Did the suckers testers that kept making those Stronghold merchants (at great expense) with the same gear for weeks on end (despite assurances it was "working this time") ever get any compensation?

    You know, for small-time things I guess it doesn't matter, but for these super expensive endeavors there should be some kind of internal tracking so that WHEN a bug like this causes hamsterloads of wasted time and resources, it would be a lot easier to make it right.
  • brewaldbrewald Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 212 Arc User
    Hi @noworries#8859

    Thanks for your feedback.

    I don't like to ask for compensation, but @pterias idea is a good option in this case:
    pterias said:

    ... At the very least, the scale should be put in the Tyrant weapon store for 1 tooth...

    The bug is present in Cradle too, it seems that only one scale has been droped since we run this one.

    Brewald - GWF 18.3k
    Eleonore - CW Mof Renegade 17.5k
    Harlgard le Vieux - OP Prot 18.3k
    Valrik - DC AC 18.2k
    Furiela - SW Temp 18.1k
  • trgluestickztrgluestickz Member Posts: 1,144 Arc User
    brewald said:

    Hi @noworries#8859

    The bug is present in Cradle too, it seems that only one scale has been droped since we run this one.

    There is no Cradle scale, the item used to upgrade the chain to max is the soulmonger ampoule. Checked a guide and this is what is used in the upgrade process:

    Rank 2: Resilient Abomination Scale from the Abomination mini-boss in the Fane of the Night Serpent instance.
    Rank 3: Kutlass' Bloody Scale from the Kutlass Hunt in Omu.
    Rank 4: Tarnished Mind Whisperer's Scale from the Merchant Prince’s Folly skirmish.
    Rank 5: Decayed Scale of Ras Nsi from the Tomb of the Nine Gods final boss Ras Nsi.
    Rank 6: Bile Drenched Scale from the Tyrant Hunt.
    Rank 7: Soulmonger’s Ampoule from the Cradle of the Death God trial.
    --
    PVP Rogue,
    --[----- "Your friendly neighborhood spawn of Satan." -----]--
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    Main Character: Hurricane Marigolds (Rogue WK & Assassin)
    Ingame Handle: trgluestickz
    Discord Name: Hurricane🌀Marigolds#2563
    Guilds: She Looked LVL 18 & Essence of Aggression
    Alliances: Imperium & Order of the Silent Shroud
    Platform: PC
  • gromovnipljesak#8234 gromovnipljesak Member Posts: 1,053 Arc User
    Maybe just put the bile drenched scale in the store for some stupid amount of omuan treasures (like 10k or smth) if the person has killed the Tyrant hunt, or summoned it, or whatever.
  • adinosiiadinosii Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,294 Arc User

    @noworries#8859

    I would strongly sugest your dev team double check the kutlass scale drop from the kutlass hunt while you guys are at it. There have been player reports of it potentially being bugged as well.

    No, the Kutlass scale drops just fine....I had posted a thread about it, and someone suggested tht in order to get the Kutlass scale you had to deal the killing blow. I personally find that unlikely, but at any rate, I did the next Kutlass kill solo, and the scale dropped just fine (and yes, I hav the chain active and in my inventory.

    So, Kutlass is OK - the drop rate is just a bit low.
    Hoping for improvements...
  • muratttimurattti Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 417 Arc User
    I got a lot of bug out of the game , I was saying Why It doesn't fall, even if it turns out there is a bug.
  • trgluestickztrgluestickz Member Posts: 1,144 Arc User
    edited May 2018
    adinosii said:

    @noworries#8859

    I would strongly sugest your dev team double check the kutlass scale drop from the kutlass hunt while you guys are at it. There have been player reports of it potentially being bugged as well.

    No, the Kutlass scale drops just fine....I had posted a thread about it, and someone suggested tht in order to get the Kutlass scale you had to deal the killing blow. I personally find that unlikely, but at any rate, I did the next Kutlass kill solo, and the scale dropped just fine (and yes, I hav the chain active and in my inventory.

    So, Kutlass is OK - the drop rate is just a bit low.
    There are other players besides you that have reported or mentioned that the kutlass hunt is bugged. Most likely, the kutlass hunt isn't bugged given that reports on the cause vary widely and that everyone I've seen mention this bug either stopped saying anything about it or later said that they finally got the scale to drop.

    The devs double checking it would still be wise though.
    --
    PVP Rogue,
    --[----- "Your friendly neighborhood spawn of Satan." -----]--
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    Main Character: Hurricane Marigolds (Rogue WK & Assassin)
    Ingame Handle: trgluestickz
    Discord Name: Hurricane🌀Marigolds#2563
    Guilds: She Looked LVL 18 & Essence of Aggression
    Alliances: Imperium & Order of the Silent Shroud
    Platform: PC
  • eion311eion311 Member Posts: 338 Arc User
    In all honesty the bile should be an automatic drop every time once it is fixed.
  • trevor#8542 trevor Member Posts: 119 Arc User
    edited May 2018
    adinosii said:

    @noworries#8859

    I would strongly sugest your dev team double check the kutlass scale drop from the kutlass hunt while you guys are at it. There have been player reports of it potentially being bugged as well.

    No, the Kutlass scale drops just fine....I had posted a thread about it, and someone suggested tht in order to get the Kutlass scale you had to deal the killing blow. I personally find that unlikely, but at any rate, I did the next Kutlass kill solo, and the scale dropped just fine (and yes, I hav the chain active and in my inventory.

    So, Kutlass is OK - the drop rate is just a bit low.
    whoever puts the hunt down gets the scale
  • adinosiiadinosii Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,294 Arc User

    whoever puts the hunt down gets the scale

    That is - only the person placing the lure has a chance of getting the scale - but the chance is absolutely not 100% - I got it on my 8th attempt.
    Hoping for improvements...
  • adinosiiadinosii Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,294 Arc User
    edited May 2018
    dupeks said:

    Mine should be interpreted in the context of the LOL for the previous comment, and how seldom we get any kind of acknowledgement for these kinds of problems.

    Same here. Good developer feedback is a rare sight. Every software developer knows that a bug can appear just about anywhere - but the important part is how quickly the bug is verified, acknowledged and fixed.

    NWO has a real problem with QC - there are far too many things that are just broken on release - do not work at all. There are also (unfortunately) too many cases of "fixes" that do not work at all - or (typically), break something else.

    The most recent major example of that was the "fix" to the Masterwork IV alchemy quest, which broke every other Masterwork IV quest - and it took 4 weeks to get a fix in. (and it's still not complete).

    I do realize the QC department is probably understaffed, and I suppose much of the "testing" is just the developers testing their own code.....but that's just not sufficient (and I'm saying that as someone who was in charge of a QC department of a software company for 25 years).

    The Preview server helps a bit - but it is not a solution. One issue there is that even if players are in effect given early access to some content, they might not even be able to test everything in time for release - might not be able to complete the campaign for example. One workaround has been to provide Preview-only vendors which hand out tokens, currencies and other items - that helps, but is not quite sufficient.

    There was one experiment earlier, in mod 9, when a selected group of players was given access to test things at an even earlier stage - That did help, except that certain things could not be tested so the bugs went live. I do think it would be a good idea to continue this - even with just a small group of handpicked playtesters that have to sign an NDA, because, as I said before, we know the QC depeartment's resources are limited, and player testers take some of the load off their shoulders.
    Hoping for improvements...
  • brewaldbrewald Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 212 Arc User
    adinosii said:

    There was one experiment earlier, in mod 9, when a selected group of players was given access to test things at an even earlier stage - That did help, except that certain things could not be tested so the bugs went live. I do think it would be a good idea to continue this - even with just a small group of handpicked playtesters that have to sign an NDA, because, as I said before, we know the QC depeartment's resources are limited, and player testers take some of the load off their shoulders.

    Agree with this point, and the NDA need to be really controled.
    During the M9 test we had lot of issues to connect to Owlbear, this point need to be solved before launching a M14/M15 alpha test.
    Brewald - GWF 18.3k
    Eleonore - CW Mof Renegade 17.5k
    Harlgard le Vieux - OP Prot 18.3k
    Valrik - DC AC 18.2k
    Furiela - SW Temp 18.1k
  • onin002onin002 Member Posts: 35 Arc User
    edited May 2018

    Looking into this there does seem to be an issue with the treasure table. The intention was to stop players from receiving the item if they had no use for it (had upgraded past that point already), but the table was checking against the wrong level of ring (level 4 or above) which is what is causing the problem.

    @noworries#8859

    Hi,

    I think this issue with looking on wrong level in a table or queue is not an isolated bug to this issue with the scale, but an general issue with the code and queue handling/task handling. I would recomend coder to look in to this. An example is the crafting revard. Always when I press the second (and all after that) craftings Collect Result, the result that is showed is not the correct one but the one Before, then after a short period the correct Collect Result is showed. For me this showes two things:
    1. There is a bug in the queue system (kind of n-1 instead of n)
    2. Somewhere in time someone has done a bandaid to fix this issue in crafting instead of fix the root cause in the queue handling/task handling

    Another example I seen is when I done a a Race Reroll to change my Ability Score, then at a later point made a Retraining, now the Ability Score is the one I had BEFORE the Race Reroll. Once again a queue pointer error


    /Onin
  • scumbag#5244 scumbag Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    Despite all the ruckus, I'm one of those who've put time and effort into tyrant hunt for the scale. It'd be really nice for compensation to increase the drop rate (50/50, maybe?) and make it possible to exchange 5 Teeth of the Tyrant item (you get this if you've lured the tyrant and killed it) for Bile-Drenched Scale at Agnar of the Many Teeth NPC in Port Nyanzaru.

    This way it's fair for the people who've consumed resources and time on the hunt - they can purchase the scale and watch other players try to farm for the tyrant lure for a chance at the scale -

    It'd definitely hurt to see people, who didn't suffer from the bug, easily obtain the scale at their first attempt, please avoid making it a guaranteed drop. Selfish? no, fair.
  • archangelzorak01archangelzorak01 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 324 Arc User
    edited May 2018
    This is a great opportunity for Cryptic to get some positive PR. Give us all Bile-Drenched Scales. A lot of people deserve them after having put down multiple Tyrant lures, which aren't cheap. To farm or to buy. Or if that seems too nice put the bile-drenched scale on the Teeth vendor for 1 Tooth each, bound to account.

    You almost certainly don't have the resources to go through the logs and determine everyone who put down a Tyrant lure and compensate them for it.

    I'm suggesting you take one on the chin and get some positive PR for once.
    Neverwinter Module 6: The only MMO expansion in the history of MMO's to remove more content than it added.


  • issssshoisssssho Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 105 Arc User
    edited May 2018
    all i gotta say is that this is a very irresponsible oversight by the dev team - its been 2 months + since mod release andsome people have spent multiple milions worth of ads on resources just chasing the scale.
    With great power comes great electricity bill.

    THC
    http://www.theholycrusaders.com/
  • trgluestickztrgluestickz Member Posts: 1,144 Arc User
    edited May 2018

    Despite all the ruckus, I'm one of those who've put time and effort into tyrant hunt for the scale. It'd be really nice for compensation to increase the drop rate (50/50, maybe?) and make it possible to exchange 5 Teeth of the Tyrant item (you get this if you've lured the tyrant and killed it) for Bile-Drenched Scale at Agnar of the Many Teeth NPC in Port Nyanzaru.

    This way it's fair for the people who've consumed resources and time on the hunt - they can purchase the scale and watch other players try to farm for the tyrant lure for a chance at the scale -

    It'd definitely hurt to see people, who didn't suffer from the bug, easily obtain the scale at their first attempt, please avoid making it a guaranteed drop. Selfish? no, fair.

    So what if someone spent 4 or fewer lures going after the bile drenched scale? Under your proposal, those people wouldn't be compensated for Cryptic's mistake even though they also lost a ton of time/money due to the bug. 4 Tyrant lures is 12mil's AD worth or a hell of a lot of time spent + going though lairs upon lairs of very punishing RNG.

    And frankly, I couldn't care less if a few people get their panties all in a bunch over future hunters getting the scale as a guaranteed drop. The lure needed to get said scale is already very expensive/time consuming even if you only need 1. That, and even under your proposal, many lucky players would still get the scale on only 1 try, meaning the system would still "unfairly" reward many people with the scale for a lower cost than what the bugged players had to pay.
    --
    PVP Rogue,
    --[----- "Your friendly neighborhood spawn of Satan." -----]--
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    Main Character: Hurricane Marigolds (Rogue WK & Assassin)
    Ingame Handle: trgluestickz
    Discord Name: Hurricane🌀Marigolds#2563
    Guilds: She Looked LVL 18 & Essence of Aggression
    Alliances: Imperium & Order of the Silent Shroud
    Platform: PC
  • trgluestickztrgluestickz Member Posts: 1,144 Arc User
    edited May 2018

    This is a great opportunity for Cryptic to get some positive PR. Give us all Bile-Drenched Scales. A lot of people deserve them after having put down multiple Tyrant lures, which aren't cheap. To farm or to buy. Or if that seems too nice put the bile-drenched scale on the Teeth vendor for 1 Tooth each, bound to account.

    You almost certainly don't have the resources to go through the logs and determine everyone who put down a Tyrant lure and compensate them for it.

    I'm suggesting you take one on the chin and get some positive PR for once.

    Agreed on everything except maybe the feasibility of going through the logs. Cryptic staff have actually gone through massive numbers of accounts to dole out bans or compensate people for past mistakes before. Some of these mass account checks likely weren't done manually but there are also examples of them preforming manual case by case account examinations as well.

    There is a downside to making people buy the scale for 1 tooth but its a good option to consider. If you make people buy the scale for 1 tooth, some bugged players who spent their lures in an attempt to get the scale might not get compensated if they spent their teeth already.

    Since people lost differing amounts of AD on this bug, the consept itself of granting a scale as the only compensation isn't without its flaws. For example, if a player spent 30 X lures trying to get the scale, then they have still lost a lot even if you give them a scale. The most fair option would be to refund people's AD or lures. However, I can understand if Cryptic doesn't take this approach and instead dicides to go with the easier option of awarding every tyrant lure user a scale. An imperfect compensation is of course better than no compensation.
    Post edited by trgluestickz on
    --
    PVP Rogue,
    --[----- "Your friendly neighborhood spawn of Satan." -----]--
    ----------------------------------------------------------------
    Main Character: Hurricane Marigolds (Rogue WK & Assassin)
    Ingame Handle: trgluestickz
    Discord Name: Hurricane🌀Marigolds#2563
    Guilds: She Looked LVL 18 & Essence of Aggression
    Alliances: Imperium & Order of the Silent Shroud
    Platform: PC
  • zencricketzencricket Member Posts: 14 Arc User
    If I discard my chain will I be able to restart the process? Do I have the chance to get the chain again from Fane? The scales will drop again? And if I don't upgrade my chain will i get the bile drenched scale from the Tyrant?
  • gromovnipljesak#8234 gromovnipljesak Member Posts: 1,053 Arc User

    After looking into it further, we are planning on giving a Bile Drenched Scale to anyone who: killed the Tyrant, doesn't already have a Bile Drenched Scale, and doesn't have the chain of scales at rank 6 or 7.

    This should just show up in the character's inventory after they log in when the fix to the bug goes live.

    Killed or summoned? In any case - great change.
  • heraldfayez#8520 heraldfayez Member Posts: 227 Arc User

    After looking into it further, we are planning on giving a Bile Drenched Scale to anyone who: killed the Tyrant, doesn't already have a Bile Drenched Scale, and doesn't have the chain of scales at rank 6 or 7.

    This should just show up in the character's inventory after they log in when the fix to the bug goes live.

    thank you for the change and just for record will the bile drenched be a guaranteed drop after change ? because as it is right now it's expensive for some people to buy the lure so it wouldn't be fair to gate it behind RNG just let everyone have from first try that way more people will aim for the tyrant :)

  • archangelzorak01archangelzorak01 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 324 Arc User

    After looking into it further, we are planning on giving a Bile Drenched Scale to anyone who: killed the Tyrant, doesn't already have a Bile Drenched Scale, and doesn't have the chain of scales at rank 6 or 7.

    This should just show up in the character's inventory after they log in when the fix to the bug goes live.

    This is good news. Greatly appreciated. I second the suggestion to make it a guaranteed drop for the summoner from now on. The amount of effort required to get a Tyrant lure would justify it.
    Neverwinter Module 6: The only MMO expansion in the history of MMO's to remove more content than it added.


  • adinosiiadinosii Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,294 Arc User
    > @noworries#8859 said:
    > After looking into it further, we are planning on giving a Bile Drenched Scale to anyone who: killed the Tyrant, doesn't already have a Bile Drenched Scale, and doesn't have the chain of scales at rank 6 or 7.

    Good solution....however...this is a bit unfair to those who have not yer done the hunt. if you have done the hunr in the past you will get the scale...if not, you will just have a chance of getting it.

    I would really suggest making the scale a guaranteed drop. the effort required to get the tyrant lure (unless you buy it from farmers) would justify that.
    Hoping for improvements...
  • dairyzeusdairyzeus Member Posts: 304 Arc User
    Just wanting to clarify the fix is for all platforms?
  • miasmatmiasmat Member, Cryptic Developer Posts: 318 Cryptic Developer
    edited May 2018
    "killed the Tyrant" should be read as "has the Chult Lore entry about The Tyrant" ("The Lost City of Omu: The Tyrant"). So between now and when the fix goes live (probably next week), get in on a Tyrant kill and you'll get a Bile Drenched Scale.
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