naw with act testing I think they showed that it took 55 or 65 (can't remember which) for a lone acdc to be as effective or more than a do with TI.
How does a DC get 55 -65k base power, please explain to me how that is possible. Adding up all of the possible stats that contribute to Base Power a DC can get close to 50K with BiS and R14 enchantments and not 55-65K like you stated.
Like I explained, a year ago it was around 30K base needed for a AC build to keep up with the DO. With the changes to bonding it is higher. I don't know the currently value but it is higher and like I said, the immunity from AA does provide a benefit that a DO cannot offer. It is figuring out what is really needed in a 1 DC group - the slight bonus in buffs or a bit more protection.
Most groups I run with when I am the lone DC always want the AC build for the extra power over the 20% damage buff because I tend to run with players all running R13 or higher enchantments. If I do a random Q and see lower geared players I do run DO or run DO when grouped up with a AC DC.
As for my claim about HG and AA, it is possible with a GF Tac build as a tank, using a recovery potion, using AP Vault of Piety potion, and food. I have done plenty of T9 without a 2nd DC and I only will do that with a GF Tac Tank for the extra AP that the GF provides. Without potions my recovery with my bonding is at 23K on my AC DC build.
Losing my companion hurts my AC setup as my AP gains drop very fast and it becomes an issue keeping AA and HG up. With my companion up it is not a problem with a GF Tac Tank.
Um if you are going to quote me please use my quote not someone else. I believe i said 60K power somewhere but that quote belongs to @tiberiusrex#6660 that said "55 or 65 (can't remember which)" and thanks to @rjc9000 case proven. You keep talking about how you run DO build for starters but then you can switch to AC and be some AP gain king :* Even with a GF i still have a very hard time believing you can lay down HG backed up with 2 AA and back to HG before HG goes down. I am not saying it can not be done at all but i know 23K recovery is not going to do that for you. Next you will tell me you are one of them miracle DCs that can cast fully empowered BTS and fully empowered FF and keep them up 100%.
I am far from a theory crafter but i have run DC long enough and have pretty good understandings on builds. I also know many other DCs in game and sure a few might be able to pull off what you claim but it would also take to much away from a power AC build to be much use. But one thing i am good at is spotting BS when i see it
I know what I can do and I can do exactly what I said, HG and 2 AA and another HG when it goes down. This does require a GF and without a GF it is one HG and one AA and than another HG. The GF gives me enough AP regen to throw out another AA. The 23K recovery is prior to any of the boons that provide bonus recovery kicks in and before I drink any potions. I'm also potion up as well and that pushes my recovery to 24K+ and a chance to gain additional AP. There are times where I can only get one HG and AA but most of the time when full buffed through potions I can do two AA. I also have to be on my best to do this.
As for AC vs DO. If a AC does require 60K+ power to be as good as a DO, than the devs will modify and adjust the DO buffs if that is the case given the cost to create a AC DC that can get 60K base power. Any time devs, not just NW but any type of MMO game, get a whiff of stuff that causes imbalance, the game will be adjusted. I have been playing MMOs now for years and I see it all the time. The BiS stuff is tweaked and than it becomes average or below average with a new item taking its place as BiS.
At one point two AC were preferred than one of each DC. For a while prior to the bonding nerf many wanted a AC for buffing and now it is a DO. It is only a matter of time before DO get fixed.
This game screams REVAMP given all of the issues and tweaks that keep happening. I personally would rather the devs take a step back and do it right than what they are doing now, which is patchwork tweaking. This is not the first time I mention revamp and I know it probably won't be my last time either.
oh I don't think there is any danger of that particular fix at the moment. the only time they address that sort of thing is when the majority of the community is doing it. right now people are still clamoring for solo ac in content even though they are shooting themselves in the foot by not bringing a do. it is possible to have that kind of base power but most don't. so.. yeah. atm not really a breaking issue. especially since they just did a balance on the two classes and that wasn't part of it.
I don't think mod 14 there will be a DC fix. Maybe mod 15 or 16 we will see another DC fix.
How does a DC get 55 -65k base power, please explain to me how that is possible. Adding up all of the possible stats that contribute to Base Power a DC can get close to 50K with BiS and R14 enchantments and not 55-65K like you stated.
(There, should be fixed to not include Bruenor's Helm).
Power boons taken are a max rank Barracks (8000), Sharandar (400), Dread Ring (250), Tyranny of the Dragons (400), Elemental Evil (300), Underdark (400), and 3x Power from Chult (1000). If you really wanted to tryhard mode, you could throw in 2000 from the Icewind Dale Cool boon, though I am too lazy to include it because I can't be bothered to drain my stamina before each fight.
Defense boons taken are a max rank Stables (8000), Tyranny of the Dragons (400), 1x from Omu (500)
Deflect boons taken are Sharandar (400), Tyranny of the Dragons (400), and 2x from Omu (750).
Lifesteal boons taken are a Dread Ring (400), Tyranny of the Dragons (400), Underdark (400), and Cloaked Ascendancy (500)
Question : the bonuses that take % of your base power to increase your power can you share them ?
Dragonborn 3% to your base , can you share it ? vivified restoration : the 5% (maximum stacks ) of your base power as additional power,can you share it ?
Dragonborn 3% to your base , can you share it ? vivified restoration : the 5% (maximum stacks ) of your base power as additional power,can you share it ?
Both the uglyborn racial and the Primal arms bonus are shared.
my dc is hooman. is it worth it to reroll as dragonborn? I made him before I had dragonborn available. or is it one of those things that doesn't matter so much. it sounds like the bonus you get from being human is not really that important in the overall scheme of things so I'm thinking I should re roll.
Run lizard if you want to maximize your stats, but you will cry every time you see your fat lizard hitbox gets you killed. Or whenever you see your character really, because lizard is the only race with the "Ugly as Sin" penalty.
Drow would have the second best DC racial bonus, for its Darkfire debuff. DC isn't a proc monster like CW is, so unless you pull off some voodoo magic, you can't really call the Darkfire debuff a consistent part of your DPS.
party two dc, just pm the other dc and coordinate, no reason to make a show of it. Should be doing that anyhow to coordinate who is using what powers.
end game dc should probably have at least 4 loadouts anyhow
solo party only dc party two dc - ac party two dc - do
I run with plenty of high recovery AC DC that have lower power than I do. Based on your recommendations I as a DO with a base of 43K power should go without WoL when running with a DC that has a base of 35K power. That is 8K or 800 more power they get form me having that feat. Looking over the DC feats, honestly there are not any worth taking that jump out at me that say take me, take me....due to how bad DC feats are.
That aside, this allows my lazy butt to have only 2 loadouts, one for AC and one for DO.
Now my CW, that character has 3 or is it 4 loadout due to having 2 Paragon Paths and 3 paragon feat paths to create various builds. DC have two paragon paths with only one good paragon feat path.
I can understand having 3 loadouts with two AC builds. One with ByS and the other without it. You could do the same again with the DO build, but again, there are no feats that scream take me take me....for a DO.
Like I said, I'm lazy, I will stick with my current setup for now.
party two dc, just pm the other dc and coordinate, no reason to make a show of it. Should be doing that anyhow to coordinate who is using what powers.
end game dc should probably have at least 4 loadouts anyhow
solo party only dc party two dc - ac party two dc - do
I run with plenty of high recovery AC DC that have lower power than I do. Based on your recommendations I as a DO with a base of 43K power should go without WoL when running with a DC that has a base of 35K power. That is 8K or 800 more power they get form me having that feat. Looking over the DC feats, honestly there are not any worth taking that jump out at me that say take me, take me....due to how bad DC feats are.
That aside, this allows my lazy butt to have only 2 loadouts, one for AC and one for DO.
Now my CW, that character has 3 or is it 4 loadout due to having 2 Paragon Paths and 3 paragon feat paths to create various builds. DC have two paragon paths with only one good paragon feat path.
I can understand having 3 loadouts with two AC builds. One with ByS and the other without it. You could do the same again with the DO build, but again, there are no feats that scream take me take me....for a DO.
Like I said, I'm lazy, I will stick with my current setup for now.
As for the OP, stick with AC DC when you are the lone DC. Your base power is high enough as well as your recovery to be an AC DC. It will get a bit high as you get flush out your enchantments, gear, mount equipped power, etc...
I was in your boat and my base at one point was around 29K. I am now at 43K. So it can go up.
I typically am the DO and not the AC DC. I can play both roles just fine because whatever stats I need I get through my companion. When I play DO I swap out one piece of my companion gear for companion gear on my CW. I get more crit when I do this. When I play AC I use the gear and enchantments that provide more recovery.
It is a balancing act but if you have gear to swap out it makes it easier playing both DC builds.
1. How you decided that 30k is the threshold? Usually that threshold is measured as the point where the AC reaches DO effectiveness in terms of buff, I'm not sure why you decided that 30k is it.
2. In a case where you have more base power than the other DC, why are you running DO and they AC and not the other way? It's like giving the bloody death course to a support OP (or something non DPS) while having a BiS GWF (that does their job) in a party. Sure, can be done, but why to do it?
As a AC DC I can do HG and 2 AA before HG wears off. Than I do another HG and 2 more AA.
Seriously are you for real? Please make a video of what you claim. That just can not be done ( if it can) and still have any useful purpose in a group. Really i am sad to say this is all getting very old by you having the need to give incorrect input advice or just false claims.
Let's say that it's possible. I can do it when I've all my stuff on for a limited amount of time. I wouldn't say that it's normal or something to aim for. The time you spend to cast dailies is often time lost to build divinity for empowerment. In some specific and limited cases, my AC DC can cast AA more than once while HG is on. At the end of the second AA, usually HG turns off, but I'm not ready to cast HG again (I need to cast one more encounter to have it). I don't see any particular beneifit to increase my recovery stat to have HG ready at the end of the second AA. Does it worth it? yes..occasionally. I'm still in love with my AC DC.
Oltreverso guild leader Maga Othelma - DC | Svalvolo - SW | Dente Avvelenato- GWF
my dc is hooman. is it worth it to reroll as dragonborn? I made him before I had dragonborn available. or is it one of those things that doesn't matter so much. it sounds like the bonus you get from being human is not really that important in the overall scheme of things so I'm thinking I should re roll.
Run lizard if you want to maximize your stats, but you will cry every time you see your fat lizard hitbox gets you killed. Or whenever you see your character really, because lizard is the only race with the "Ugly as Sin" penalty.
Drow would have the second best DC racial bonus, for its Darkfire debuff. DC isn't a proc monster like CW is, so unless you pull off some voodoo magic, you can't really call the Darkfire debuff a consistent part of your DPS.
Run anything else if you like not looking ugly.
I'm running a human and will be going back to Drow for its debuff. IMO it is better than a small 3% gain in power that Dragonborn offers, though others will want the power from the Ulgyborn race.
You did prove me wrong on the amount of power that a DC can get. Though getting to that amount is not cost effective in the game given it requires full R14 enchantments; I know a few players that dropped about a grand just to get their R13 to R14 and afterward they stated "Waste of money!". The only thing they recommended leveling up to max rank for enchantments are bonding and weapon with all others being not as critical.
My DC is all R12, other than my armor enchantment which is a R10. Though all of my enchantments are ready to rank up. I been saving up AD so I can do one big sweep and upgrade everything at once. I have the AD to get the marks but I need quite a bit more AD for the wards. So for now, I'm going to continue to grind it out. Though I may use the AD I have to get the Chult Tiger or make upgrades to other characters.
Comments
As for AC vs DO. If a AC does require 60K+ power to be as good as a DO, than the devs will modify and adjust the DO buffs if that is the case given the cost to create a AC DC that can get 60K base power. Any time devs, not just NW but any type of MMO game, get a whiff of stuff that causes imbalance, the game will be adjusted. I have been playing MMOs now for years and I see it all the time. The BiS stuff is tweaked and than it becomes average or below average with a new item taking its place as BiS.
At one point two AC were preferred than one of each DC. For a while prior to the bonding nerf many wanted a AC for buffing and now it is a DO. It is only a matter of time before DO get fixed.
This game screams REVAMP given all of the issues and tweaks that keep happening. I personally would rather the devs take a step back and do it right than what they are doing now, which is patchwork tweaking. This is not the first time I mention revamp and I know it probably won't be my last time either.
Dragonborn 3% to your base , can you share it ?
vivified restoration : the 5% (maximum stacks ) of your base power as additional power,can you share it ?
It's not like a certain pickle lover made a post or anything on whether or not these are shared...
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter#/discussion/1227832/reference-power-sharing/p1
Drow would have the second best DC racial bonus, for its Darkfire debuff. DC isn't a proc monster like CW is, so unless you pull off some voodoo magic, you can't really call the Darkfire debuff a consistent part of your DPS.
Run anything else if you like not looking ugly.
From a "can I stand to look at this for hours each week" standpoint, I remain Half-Elven.
Contagion - Cleric
Testament - Wizard
Pestilence - Ranger
Dominion - Paladin
NIGHTSWATCH
In some specific and limited cases, my AC DC can cast AA more than once while HG is on. At the end of the second AA, usually HG turns off, but I'm not ready to cast HG again (I need to cast one more encounter to have it). I don't see any particular beneifit to increase my recovery stat to have HG ready at the end of the second AA. Does it worth it? yes..occasionally.
I'm still in love with my AC DC.
Oltreverso guild leader
Maga Othelma - DC | Svalvolo - SW | Dente Avvelenato- GWF
I'm running a human and will be going back to Drow for its debuff. IMO it is better than a small 3% gain in power that Dragonborn offers, though others will want the power from the Ulgyborn race.
You did prove me wrong on the amount of power that a DC can get. Though getting to that amount is not cost effective in the game given it requires full R14 enchantments; I know a few players that dropped about a grand just to get their R13 to R14 and afterward they stated "Waste of money!". The only thing they recommended leveling up to max rank for enchantments are bonding and weapon with all others being not as critical.
My DC is all R12, other than my armor enchantment which is a R10. Though all of my enchantments are ready to rank up. I been saving up AD so I can do one big sweep and upgrade everything at once. I have the AD to get the marks but I need quite a bit more AD for the wards. So for now, I'm going to continue to grind it out. Though I may use the AD I have to get the Chult Tiger or make upgrades to other characters.