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Negative Feedback Regarding Random Queues

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  • jumpingmorksjumpingmorks Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 876 Arc User
    pitshade said:

    > @jumpingmorks said:

    > If you die in TONG at Avatar of Orcus, once beaten you cannot retrieve loot, there is no access. Only a one way portal for people to leave boss fight area.



    I have been able to get back in. Perhaps it is bugged now, but the option came from clicking the curses pedestals.

    Ugh, wrong tab xD
  • callumf#9018 callumf Member Posts: 1,644 Arc User

    greywynd said:

    Also, if their day is spent reading and planning (working) they are also losing time in that by posting answers to everyone's questions. Somewhere something has to take a hit and, honestly, answering on the forums isn't a major thing. That is Julia's job.

    You know there is a section of the forum for the preview shard. This is an area designed to give the Devs feedback on what is broken in upcomming patches, events, mods, etc. Paying attention to that section of the forums seams like it is an essential part of any well run game. The reality we have is that players post problem after problem found with upcomming mods, patches, etc. there and these problems are ignored/not fixed and go live.

    Another major problem we have in this game is that offical announcments we get are so so out of line with player experiences. Regular reading and participation in the game and the forums by the devs should over time reduce this problem.

    One of the things that made DnD great was that it grew out of Gary and people close to him that were gamers and had a lot of love for the game. Because they loved the game they created they were involved in it constantly and played it for fun. If a problem existed in the game they would often discover it themselves or could understand it quickly when someone else mentioned it because they were very familiar with the player side of the game. I dont get the sense that is true about this game. I suspect that a play the game Thursday or something like that where in the Devs and others that work on the game actually play it for say 4 hours a day once a week or so would benifit the game a lot over time.
    I think this is just about right. To me the game development doesn't seem to fit in with what the players either want or deserve. The random q system just isn't the right way to go. This was pointed out many times but ignored.

    But of course what we don't realise is how wonderful the Devs think that the Emperor's New Clothes look on him.
  • nitocris83nitocris83 Member, Cryptic Developer, Administrator Posts: 4,458 Community Manager
    After the module released on Tuesday, we all went into "listening" mode. There's a lot of internal conversations that happen based on what we're seeing from the community, but unless there is something concrete that is going to happen (such as certain hotfixes), I can't offer any information that's at the internal discussion stage. With something like this that involves request for changes to a feature or a system, that would take a lot more work and time than what can be done in a few days after a release. I've been trying to answer a variety of threads on the topic but also make sure I am not hyperfocusing on just this topic to the detriment of other feedback and concerns.
  • reg1981reg1981 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,425 Arc User
    It's simple, the queue is the way it is and we need to give it a fair shot.

    We can HAMSTER and moan all we want but it gets us no where when this much time and effort went into these changes. Give it time, let them gather their CONSTRUCTIVE feedback and read the statistics from the queues.

    And as for silence, have a look at the dev tracker if you wish to know where their time and effort is going. Bugfest isn't over yet, 1 more day and I'm sorry but that HAMSTER is important!
  • sorcha#9865 sorcha Member Posts: 32 Arc User

    ok.....

    Dear Dev

    The game is to big now to expect players not just new players to unlock dungeons so we can earn AD, it takes months to unlock this stuff....it is not something we can do over night and players are leaving over this or at the very least not logging in....

    Are you willing to risk your income on this because this is what you are doing...people sell wards and coal wards in AH people like me are willing to buy that or I could if I had any AD.....the seller will stop buying wards to sell if no one buys them....

    Please Dev listen to us so we can get back to playing our game that you are making.....

    While I'm at it.. SKT while the story ok, there is too much endless grinding for Voniblod and I mean endless...while some of the campaign task the amount of Voniblod is reasonable, most is not reasonable...not counting the boons, like OMG what where you thinking 120k voniblod to get all the boons.....I counted how much was needed to get all the boons and I was shocked just how much was needed.......

    while we expect grinding ^^ endless grinding is not ok.....the high numbers need for Voniblod is a lot of people including myself don't like it....

    I guess the next point is why SKT never got a Skirmish but in stead 2 dungeon's which require 11k to get into...I've unlocked FBI but not the other dungeon and even if I had unlocked this dungeon my main is not ready I'm a DPS class and my DPS is too low....

    Fun fact how many player and in the same boat as me...close to 11K not ready for the 11k content

    next point the new refining system is the only good this to come out of this....one can say it was the only this you did right, lets face it its working.....

    But the reason why you did it right was all about money and would be working very well if only the players had any AD to buy wards.....

    I have 5 toons all I can do now is run leveling dungeon's I have skirmish's on my main only or will until they level 70 at which point its back to leveling dungeon's being the only way to earn AD....

    or maybe if you increased the maximum AD per day per character people will for the most part use one character instead of earning AD on more than one characters.... I'm only doing it because its the only way to make enough AD to get the stuff I need to play the game...

    You have add new AD sinks into the game but lowered the amount of AD new players can earn making the grind even harder....

    I have 5 toons in total 3 at level 70 but the others will level very quick, I consider myself to be a new player...why....because after a year of playing mostly on but sometimes off I still can't get into the higher item level content....

    you have stated that one of your goals was to lower the amount of AD in the game hence the new AD sinks....

    but the problem once you unlock the dungeon's all these problems disappear.... so this makes another problem....

    people who have unlocked the dungeon's will still be able to earn AD and they will be the only people who have AD enough to buy things so if you did want the AH prices to go down they won't because people will still be buy some of it and that is not counting the people with millions of AD.....

    From what I've seen there is no fix for players hording game currency and effecting AH prices.....at least not the way things are...

    But then other have most likely said this stuff before...so I'm wasting my time typing all this stuff....

  • chemjeffchemjeff Member Posts: 544 Arc User
    edited October 2017

    After the module released on Tuesday, we all went into "listening" mode. There's a lot of internal conversations that happen based on what we're seeing from the community, but unless there is something concrete that is going to happen (such as certain hotfixes), I can't offer any information that's at the internal discussion stage. With something like this that involves request for changes to a feature or a system, that would take a lot more work and time than what can be done in a few days after a release. I've been trying to answer a variety of threads on the topic but also make sure I am not hyperfocusing on just this topic to the detriment of other feedback and concerns.

    @nitrocris83 I think we all appreciate that you and your colleagues are listening to the legitimate concerns expressed on the forums, thank you. Could we at least get an ETA on when some tweaks or adjustments to the random queue system, friendlier to newer players, leveling players, players in smaller guilds reliant on Dungeoneering Shards, players who don't yet meet the IL requirements for all the dungeons, etc., might be forthcoming?
  • dlorkluwedlorkluwe Member Posts: 3 Arc User
    With your new random queues, at first it was good, getting astral diamonds that way and experience. But once you hit level 70 the gear needed to queue up for a random skirmish jumps to 10,000 because of merchant prince. This punishes new players who just hit level 70 that are trying to gear up since there is now only 1 way instead of 2 to get astral diamonds from doing random queues.
  • greywyndgreywynd Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 6,695 Arc User
    eh, no. Got locked out of the random skirmishes when I hit 64 and didn't have the 7,5k for Master of the Hunt.
    I'm not looking for forgiveness, and I'm way past asking permission. Earth just lost her best defender, so we're here to fight. And if you want to stand in our way, we'll fight you too.
  • dlorkluwedlorkluwe Member Posts: 3 Arc User
    I leveled from 62 to 70 doing random skirmishes, without having 7.5k for master of the hunt, checked and it doesn't require any gear score, the only one that does is the new merchant prince, which is 10k. So once again, leveling a character to 70 takes away the option to do random skirmish and make astral diamonds that way for any new players unlike what they were doing up to that point.
  • jumpingmorksjumpingmorks Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 876 Arc User
    edited November 2017
    I'm actually enjoying Random Skirmish and Random (normal) Dungeons. It's an easy 20k AD for 10k+ ALTS.

    I have 2 15k Tanks, OP/GF and there's no way I'm random queuing for an epic dungeon, I rarely get time to do what I do with my existing ALTS. (My mains get a lot of requests).

    But I can't see it as sustainable, I've changed how I run normal dungeons. I now wait at every block that requires a player to interact for us to pass and I let them kill the Bosses. But, and I don't blame them, many high geared characters rushing through as fast as they can, that cannot be enjoyable for new players.

    One thing I have noticed, is the running random normal dungeon now gives 90 seals, that's a big break for new players trying to gear up for T1's, T2's and beyond and does answer major feedback since mod 6 release on how a new player is supposed to run content for the gear they need to actually complete that content.

    EDIT:
    Oh, and the New Player bonus AD is a nice touch too.
    Post edited by jumpingmorks on
  • jumpingmorksjumpingmorks Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 876 Arc User
    edited November 2017
    Wrong thread gah.
  • reg1981reg1981 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,425 Arc User


    The same could be said for the Edsil and New Coke. Its irrelevant. They work for a business. The purpose of a business is to make a profit. Profits are made by making people called customers happy. Happy customers give the business a thing called money. The happier the customers are the more of this thing called money they are willing to give to the business.

    Now do you get even a remote sense that much of the customer base is happy right now? The forums, independed sites, and zone chat are full of customers voicing their displeasure with this piece of HAMSTER call the random queve.

    Ignoring widespread customer displeasure as they have been for weeks now is not a business stratagy that any entrepreneur I know would utilize. I know that I have never used it in any of my businesses.

    I'm happy!

    Sure, I had a failure in MSP last night, we quit as a group. I queue'd up again right away and got pulled into an FBI with the same results. Quit there, queue'd again and completed ESOT. (No leaver penality though)

    My hope here is that the statistics will tell the tale when they are ready for proper analysis. We've already been told that adjustments may be needed in upcoming weeks, so add to the statistics. Don't feel your group can complete the run your in? Talk to the grp and walk away from the run.

    Time and effort went into these changes and they are not all bad. We need a single constructive thread to lay out the concerns, keep adding to the stats, and be a little patient. My fails last night we're given a fair chance, 15 mins spent in each run. That is all I suggest we do with the queues. Give them a fair chance and let the stats speak! If 90% of random FBI and MSP's fail we may see adjustments. Those adjustments may come as a queue adjustment, difficulty adjustments, who knows.

    Anyways, it's just my opinion and we are all entitled to one.
  • ontheleftcoast#2086 ontheleftcoast Member Posts: 120 Arc User
    The system for failed runs is appallingly bad. This happened today trying to run a random skirmish

    Myself and 3 other guildies started a queue and couldn't get a 5th so we just went with a PUG. 2 seconds into Merchant Prince's Folly the PUG disconnects. We wait, and wait, and wait and still can't boot him so we finally abandon the instance. Now we're penalized because of another user who disconnected. So we have to wait some more.. and more.. and eventually we get a queue and it's Master of the Hunt which we finish in less then 2 minutes. 30+ minutes of waiting because of the poorly thought out penalty systems. 2 minutes of play time. I'm sure that's "faster" and "easier" compared to something but not the old system of running skirmishes or dungeons. What a freaking joke and a half.
  • jumpingmorksjumpingmorks Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 876 Arc User
    I hate pugs, don't get me wrong, I've met some amazing pugs who are now amazing friends and I wouldn't be in the guild/alliance/channels I am in nowwithout pugging. But it only takes 1 pug in 30 to make you hate them. The other day I got kicked from Phantasmal Fortress because I rushed off ahead to clear the way (it was a GWF ALT), next thing I know the party leader kicked me because "group stays together, that's it" and then promptly put me on ignore.

    It takes me 3 minutes to solo PF, longer with pugs because I kill everything so they aren't stuck with aggro they might struggle with. Now anyone pugging PF can just muddle through by themselves if they have to, one less person to carry them.
  • jumpingmorksjumpingmorks Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 876 Arc User
    Folly just now, on my main, a GF. I lured the T-Rex away team HAMSTER off except one once they have their rewards.

    If I wasn't as well geared and just a decent tank tank looking to be the good tank, no way I could have soloed T-Rex in under an hour.
  • mithrosnomoremithrosnomore Member Posts: 693 Arc User
    What I posted in a similar thread...

    I just returned after a long absence... Personal stuff and all that.

    Anyway, I started a new toon to get my bearings back rather than trying to run a 60 (who used to be capped but no longer) and being sort of lost in what I am doing.

    So I see that a random queue will get me some AD, and Cloak Tower, which is the mission I got, is the only dungeon I can possibly get on the random queue, so I go that route.

    Quick pop and in the dungeon. Good.

    Then one of the people proceeds to speed run through and I got to participate in three fights; The very first one, a wandering group that got into the path after the speed runners had passed, and the last fight since they had to wait for me at the gate.

    And by participate I mean I got some swings in, but other than the second fight where I was on my own, my swings didn't amount to much in terms of the fight... Just some token damage.

    That wasn't fun.

    As a Paladin I don't even have a "move fast" ability that I could use to help me keep up. I was worried that they would try to kick me out for slowing them down (if that's even possible in a random queue). That made things less fun.

    If they are going to do this then I would like to see the higher levels nerfed more effectively. I figure that is going to be an unpopular opinion with the high-levels that want to speed-run everything for quick and easy ADs, but isn't the point to "work" for the ADs? To do something to "earn" them?

    If Cryptic thinks that having that high level toon along to run the dungeon for me is doing me a favor; That that is how that person is earning their ADs, then I would like them to re-think that position.

    I want to participate, not have someone carry me.

    So that's really the only complaint/suggestion I have: Do more to bring over-leveled characters (and their companions) more in line with the content that they are running.

  • athena#9205 athena Member Posts: 575 Arc User
    I finally understand why the random: When you do the 3 early ones: epic, normal and skirmish you are at 33860 AD for the day and that includes the bonus 3600 AD from invoking. With 4 that would put you at the refining Cap for AD.

    My request is that you take FBI SVA MSVA and put them in the hero random section with TONG as those are really too much for a normal 11k IL class to do (have to finish long and arduous campaigns to unlock them, so that just like TONG). That will open random trial at 11K and allow more people to reach their AD cap. This in turn should quiet allot of complaints i believe.

    11k can be reached with good purple gear and artifacts, lvl 8 enchants and all campaigns but RD, SKT and Chult complete. Making it just right to compete in the trials.
  • minotaur2857minotaur2857 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,140 Arc User

    I finally understand why the random: When you do the 3 early ones: epic, normal and skirmish you are at 33860 AD for the day and that includes the bonus 3600 AD from invoking. With 4 that would put you at the refining Cap for AD.

    My request is that you take FBI SVA MSVA and put them in the hero random section with TONG as those are really too much for a normal 11k IL class to do (have to finish long and arduous campaigns to unlock them, so that just like TONG). That will open random trial at 11K and allow more people to reach their AD cap. This in turn should quiet allot of complaints i believe.

    11k can be reached with good purple gear and artifacts, lvl 8 enchants and all campaigns but RD, SKT and Chult complete. Making it just right to compete in the trials.

    Any IL limit like that gets rendered silly by the 0-2K extra depending on your guild. You can either grind for months or just join a guild that gives you 2K for free.


  • dionchidionchi Member Posts: 907 Arc User
    edited November 2017
    I'm really liking the random queues too...

    Most of the people I see complaining are they ones who are saying they can't solo power through dungeons just to get to the astral diamonds like they used to.

    Helloooo, dungeons and skirmishes are designed to be done as a party, not a solo quest for a quick and easy pay off at the end and for anyone who has a problem actually working together with others as a party, well perhaps they shouldn't be in dungeons or skirmishes to begin with.
    DD~
  • minotaur2857minotaur2857 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,140 Arc User
    dionchi said:

    I'm really liking the random queues too...

    Most of the people I see complaining are they ones who are saying they can't solo power through dungeons just to get to the astral diamonds like they used to.

    Helloooo, dungeons and skirmishes are designed to be done as a party, not a solo quest for a quick and easy pay off at the end and for anyone who has a problem actually working together with others as a party, well perhaps they shouldn't be in dungeons or skirmishes to begin with.

    No the people complaining are those who can't join them or are getting their small guilds annihilated by them. Or those who if they want the ADs have to do leveling dungeons.

    Yes they're great for highly geared monsters who can go in as a premade 5 and get more rADs.

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