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Bring back - Skirmish Hour, Dungeon Delves Hour + Trial Hour.

In the old dark past, we were unable to pick chest without the key anyways, we didn't knew what we picked yet it was quite thrilling to see whats inside, these thrilling things are not there anymore, but the key change got reversed regardless, we can't peek if inside is something we desire or trash. Dungeon Delves was something that pushed people to run the dungeons cause we didn't have to use key to pick whats inside (read: waste), and thus would make this changes all together alot less painful, especially if you would introduce Trial hour which would make all those voices around svardborg harshness in terms of dropping legendary marks ratio to key use far less complaint and easier to come by, at least you could plan your progression more wisely and it would still be possible without endlessly grinding dailies and weeklies in SoMI. These 1k AD additional rAD reward from participating in these events was also something that motivated people in guilds towards inguild activities.

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Comments

  • polaris1986polaris1986 Member Posts: 320 Arc User
    yes, but lags.
    "sometimes the world doesn't need another hero, sometimes what it needs is a monster"

  • mightyerikssonmightyeriksson Member Posts: 842 Arc User
    Delves hours would help a lot of F2P people to keep interest (and keep them playing), would also be helpful in reducing some of the financial burden MSvA is on those grinding for Relic weapons now...
  • loboguildloboguild Member Posts: 2,371 Arc User
    Have read this proposal on a fansite recently and couldn't agree more. Gotta be careful with what chests are included though. If there's a Trial hour in which you can open Svardborg for free then nobody is going to grind for keys any longer.

    I think what makes most sense is giving players a so called "Delve Keys" that are an auto-pickup once you enter any group content and expire after one hour. With those keys you can open one chest in a dungeon or trial. It would still be a substantial upgrade, but not completely invalidate farming.
  • mifiisumifiisu Member Posts: 205 Arc User
    loboguild said:

    Have read this proposal on a fansite recently and couldn't agree more. Gotta be careful with what chests are included though. If there's a Trial hour in which you can open Svardborg for free then nobody is going to grind for keys any longer.

    I think what makes most sense is giving players a so called "Delve Keys" that are an auto-pickup once you enter any group content and expire after one hour. With those keys you can open one chest in a dungeon or trial. It would still be a substantial upgrade, but not completely invalidate farming.

    You mean like the daily dungeon keys we already get but at the start of every DD/skirm/trial hour?
  • loboguildloboguild Member Posts: 2,371 Arc User
    Yes sort of. The idea is to make the Delves hour viable, but not as effective in terms of chests generated as farming keys manually. It's still very possible that such an event would completely take over dungeoneering and I don't think that's what you want. In the end the removal of the system was a community request because those that were on at the wrong time couldn't participate in runs on a given day.
  • vandignescavandignesca Member Posts: 162 Arc User
    edited January 2017
    I didn't like these because they emphasized running certain content at certain times. I very much like how in the new mod, for example, normal demo and tiamat are no longer time restricted. I would see returning to a system that reward players for playing at specific times a huge step backwards. I myself have not done any of the Storm King's Thunder group content, but I have heard about the misery people face there. I think a better solution would be to just rework that broken/grindy module instead of introducing an entirely new system. I honestly feel the new dungeon key changes were completely necessary for the economy, and quite fair for all content up to demogorgan. If mod 10 is taken as an aberration, I think the rest of the game is much healthier because of recent changes. This I feel would hurt the game more. Sorry, I vote no, quite emphatically.
    Love yourself, and focus on the rest of the madness of life later.
  • loboguildloboguild Member Posts: 2,371 Arc User
    Fixing Mod 10 doesn't make the current system farm-friendly though. And that's issue a, b and c with the key changes. The fact that you can only run as many dungeon as you have keys is just horrible.
  • warpetwarpet Member Posts: 1,969 Arc User
    we need dungeon delves and skirmish hours back in game
  • lowenduslowendus Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 322 Arc User
    DD's where great.
    But with the current power creep, not viable.
    With the proper team I remember doing 3-4 elols in a row before their removal.
    Imagine what will happen now.

    Power creep needs to be fixed 1st, start from bondings, I got 3 greaters and already feel the difference (although I miss my augment's flat stats) Its too much even at this level.
  • beckylunaticbeckylunatic Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 14,231 Arc User
    edited January 2017
    lowendus said:

    DD's where great.
    But with the current power creep, not viable.
    With the proper team I remember doing 3-4 elols in a row before their removal.
    Imagine what will happen now.

    Or 8-10 PK back at level 60.

    I don't think the skirmish event really needs to come back. The automatic AD is reasonably balanced, even though 3+ runs have lame AD rewards. Reason enough to do something else if your primary goal is earning rough AD.

    I disagree with implementing any type of timed event for trials. The game is well-served by the decision to eliminate the limited queuing time frames, and they don't need to add anything back in that makes it better to run trials at certain times than others. Because trials have become such a major focus of developing NW's group content though, they should implement automated daily AD for them in addition to their current reward tables. It doesn't make any sense to get AD for defeating Kessell but not Tiamat.

    I have mixed feelings on returning DD, and I don't think the idea aligns with the devs' slow push to make us dependent on keys for dungeon loot (a history I have now written at least twice). It would be ok for players who have a community to run with (which it always was anyway). It would exacerbate issues of "LF 3.5k HDPS ELOL MULTIRUN FAST" (which it always did anyway). Players who have VIP aren't in bad shape and players who have VIP and viable alts *really* don't have to be in bad shape. And DD... wouldn't necessarily do anything to close the gap between haves and have-nots. What it does is create a farming opportunity for people who are already decently off, and I don't believe this aligns with the intended direction of the game either.

    The one I want returned is the Profession event, after yet another weekend event passes in which I didn't have time to run even one chart unless I had completely given up sleeping. And I want Foundry to have a daily reward structure similar to skirmishes (AD scales by participating player's level, drops off dramatically after limited runs, and is less significant than dungeons).
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  • vandignescavandignesca Member Posts: 162 Arc User
    edited January 2017
    loboguild said:

    Fixing Mod 10 doesn't make the current system farm-friendly though. And that's issue a, b and c with the key changes. The fact that you can only run as many dungeon as you have keys is just horrible.

    I actually think that's a wonderful thing. It means you get what work you put into stuff, and keeps the economy going. When stuff was farm friendly, people weren't running content except those dungeons, nor were they putting any money into either the game or Cryptic's economy. The grind to get keys and stuff for Storm King's Thunder is rather a large and insufferable grind, but I feel like the rest of the game's content is tiered and designed rather well, and complements the system. So, from me at least, good job dev team. I run dungeons because they are fun, and, because as a VIP for lower-level stuff, I get some loot. I think the farming dungeon for loots only practice was deeply unhealthy for the game. Now, players are forced to take a step back and think about where they want to go, and what they want to do. It also ups the pressure on the dev team to provide more meaningful content, which I think mod 11 is shaping up to be. When both players and developers are forced to get more invovled, I think the game is healthier.



    And I want Foundry to have a daily reward structure similar to skirmishes (AD scales by participating player's level, drops off dramatically after limited runs, and is less significant than dungeons).

    I will never stop wanting the Foundry to be more incorporated into the game and its economy. Finding a way to bring back a reward system for it that doesn't cost too much dev time would be wonderful. I hope it gets looked at after mod 11.

    Love yourself, and focus on the rest of the madness of life later.
  • loboguildloboguild Member Posts: 2,371 Arc User

    When stuff was farm friendly

    The system was never farm friendly and it always worked for those that grinded keys and only run daily dungeons. What the devs did was extend the discrepancy when the game really needed more farming capabilities. If people don't get that a hard limit on dungeons is a bad thing then only because they are not affected.
    etelgrin said:

    To be honest I think the fact that you can que to Tiamat at any time will mean... nobody will do tiamat anymore but I hope I'm wrong :smile: when people knew you have to queue up till 5 past full hour it was obvious when to start gathering and calling for people, getting at any given time 25 people other than zoners may not be superbly well executed.

    It's great for farming ndemo though.
  • jonkocajonkoca Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,586 Arc User
    edited February 2017
    Always amazes me, I have these weapons that can pretty much kill anything that moves, and yet I can't bash in a simple chest with my axes.

    Imagine if orcus got his demon minions to construct him some armor made out of chest-lids... game over lol.
    No idea what my toon is now.
  • vandignescavandignesca Member Posts: 162 Arc User
    edited February 2017
    loboguild said:


    The system was never farm friendly and it always worked for those that grinded keys and only run daily dungeons. What the devs did was extend the discrepancy when the game really needed more farming capabilities. If people don't get that a hard limit on dungeons is a bad thing then only because they are not affected.
    It's great for farming ndemo though.

    I think we'll probably just end up disagreeing in the end, but I am affected, and I still support the changes. I was out of greater demonic keys on one of my characters earlier, and I wanted to get keys for the demo rings. What I did was run heroics/skirmishes, etc. and I worked until I got enough stuff for the new key. I am someone who will not get Storm King's Thunder relic weapons because I am not willing to put in the work to acquire them. I am someone who is not opposed (in principle, not in magnitude for Storm King's Thunder content as it is just a bit much) to having to work for a reward, and missing out on that reward if the work is too much for me. I see the problem, honestly, as the old system really HAMSTER (please note the Hamster is not a seriously explicit word. I guess it got censored anyway; so please, don't take my tone more seriously than it needs to be :) ) up the mentality of dungeon runners. It got to the point that people expected that key to mean something, and they expected to get rewarded if they spent it. Now that they don't get rewarded every time they spend their key, it upsets them. It feels like they lost something. People just have to get over the fact that when they run something right now it might cost them something. If that upsets a person, I think they really ought to re-examine why they run dungeons in the first place, and if they're not fun, and it's simply a loot chasing game for that person, maybe they just need to revaluate how they look at the world, or stop running dungeons that give them no joy if the work to get the loot is unpleasant for them.

    Love yourself, and focus on the rest of the madness of life later.
  • beckylunaticbeckylunatic Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 14,231 Arc User
    etelgrin said:

    To be honest I think the fact that you can que to Tiamat at any time will mean... nobody will do tiamat anymore but I hope I'm wrong :smile: when people knew you have to queue up till 5 past full hour it was obvious when to start gathering and calling for people, getting at any given time 25 people other than zoners may not be superbly well executed.

    I think it might get harder to pug Tiamat, but easier to organize an Alliance run. For most people, that's a win.
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    Neverwinter Census 2017

    All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
  • fogcrowfogcrow Member Posts: 82 Arc User
    hell no, please do not bring back the dungeon delve hour event or similar. first: it puts thouse who have limited free time, and don´t get to decide when that free time will be, at a ridiculous disadvantage, and second: by pitting the players against the clock the way it did, it forced players into the worst kind of elitism... can´t take anyone who isn´t already at the very top in both skill and gear along, if you need to squeeze the maximal number of runs of the ultimate content into one hour(or an other limited amount of time).
  • kgatorgkgatorg Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 19 Arc User
    The above is a valid point, bring the delve hour back, but make it a quest, that the player activate, go talk to Rhix and say I want to do dungeons, that gives you the quest, which effectively puts you into the 1 hour delve state.
  • darthpotaterdarthpotater Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,130 Arc User
    edited February 2017
    I think we should keep the freedom to run the content we want when we want. They changed DD because lot of people couldnt play the hours of DD. And that is ok.

    That said, legendary keys should be more accessible. For example:
    1-2 each day with VIP.
    Rewards in dungeon chests (I think this is implemented buet seems so rare)
    Events (siege, tymora, etc.)
    Lockboxes
    Experience rewards
    Etc.

    And I think replacing all the keys of every campaign for legendary keys can be a good idea to keep things simple
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