Class artifacts should able to be used in refinement

ferency · June 2016

I understand that class artifacts could be abused in refinement as when discarded they are instantly available again, however once you've upgraded to blue, any possibility of exploitation is gone. New artifacts are coming out all the time and what was once too expensive becomes reachable. It would be nice to not have all those refinement points sat in your bank, unable to be unlocked.

plasticbat · June 2016

ferency said:
I understand that class artifacts could be abused in refinement as when discarded they are instantly available again, however once you've upgraded to blue, any possibility of exploitation is gone. New artifacts are coming out all the time and what was once too expensive becomes reachable. It would be nice to not have all those refinement points sat in your bank, unable to be unlocked.

What do you mean by "once you've upgraded to blue, any possibility of exploitation is gone"?
Do you mean after you discard a blue class Artifact, you can't claim a new green one?

ferency · June 2016

Once you've upgraded once, any refinement you get from the item is going to be less than the points/mats already invested.

szejhuludpuchacz · June 2016

We should be able to use legendary class artifacts to feed another.

scathias · June 2016

That is only true of artifact weapons. With artifacts there is a 5x bonus for putting the item in a matching (stability/power/union) artifact and so you are gaining more out of it than you put in, especially during 2x RP.

If they put some special code on artifacts like these to give you back exactly as much RP as you put into it, or 80% of the RP or something it would be reasonable though.

plasticbat · June 2016

ferency said:
Once you've upgraded once, any refinement you get from the item is going to be less than the points/mats already invested.

As @scathias pointed out, with the 5x effect + 2xRP, you can see this can be abused.

e.g. In 2xRP period, inject RP to class Artifact (say, Union). Inject this Union class Artifact to a regular Union Artifact, you will get another 10xRP. In total, the final Union Artifact will get effective 20xRP during 2xRP period (and I have not included the extra RP gained from the Artifact). Yes, the Mark can be expensive. However, to get to blue, you only need green marks and each of my characters have tons of character bound green marks.

beckylunatic · June 2016

plasticbat said:

ferency said:
I understand that class artifacts could be abused in refinement as when discarded they are instantly available again, however once you've upgraded to blue, any possibility of exploitation is gone. New artifacts are coming out all the time and what was once too expensive becomes reachable. It would be nice to not have all those refinement points sat in your bank, unable to be unlocked.
What do you mean by "once you've upgraded to blue, any possibility of exploitation is gone"?
Do you mean after you discard a blue class Artifact, you can't claim a new green one?

No, I suspect it's a severe miscalculation of how much benefit players would receive from being able to use blue class sigils for refinement. Nice as it would be from the standpoint of just getting everything mythic in a heartbeat, it would break the system. OP, perhaps you need to do a little research on the subject of "feeder" artifacts.

That said, in my opinion, a legendary or mythic class sigil should be possible to use for refinement. At that stage, you've invested so much into that single artifact, there is no exploitation involved in using it as a "free" feeder, and it simply represents a huge amount of waste in tied-up resources if you stop using a specific sigil. I feel it is unduly punishing for players switching artifacts from a high-ranked class sigil to not be able to reuse their RP.

Epic is borderline. It's not so costly (especially now) to have made an epic artifact that I feel it would be appropriate to open them up at this time.

urabask · June 2016

So just make it so you can only feed class artifacts once they're mythic. Would completely eliminate any exploitation seeing as you could buy six feeders for the cost of the marks.

ferency · June 2016

I think your using your 2x twice in your example, however I get your point. Perhaps only allowing legendary items to be used; 10 or 20 times rp doesn't matter, once something is maxed it's maxed, or just having a flat amount depending on the colour of the item like a runestone. It's workable in a lot of ways.

plasticbat · June 2016

ferency said:
I think your using your 2x twice in your example, however I get your point. Perhaps only allowing legendary items to be used; 10 or 20 times rp doesn't matter, once something is maxed it's maxed, or just having a flat amount depending on the colour of the item like a runestone. It's workable in a lot of ways.

I do and I think I am correct. In 2xRP event, when you feed normal RP to an artifact, you get the first 2xRP.
You get yet the 2nd 2xRP and 5xRP (becomes 10xRP), when you feed the artifact to another artifact (same class) during 2xRP. All together, it is 20x.

vcek · July 2016

urabask said:
So just make it so you can only feed class artifacts once they're mythic. Would completely eliminate any exploitation seeing as you could buy six feeders for the cost of the marks.

This is the best solution imo.
Another alternative would be ability to exchange class artifacts with same quality of different class.
Example : i have 2 mythic and 1 legendary, the shop will work the same way like lostmouth replacement. so i get 2 mythic and 1 legendary class artifact choice pack.

scathias · July 2016

vcek said:

urabask said:
So just make it so you can only feed class artifacts once they're mythic. Would completely eliminate any exploitation seeing as you could buy six feeders for the cost of the marks.
This is the best solution imo.
Another alternative would be ability to exchange class artifacts with same quality of different class.
Example : i have 2 mythic and 1 legendary, the shop will work the same way like lostmouth replacement. so i get 2 mythic and 1 legendary class artifact choice pack.

Isn't that needlessly complicated? just allowing the class artifacts to be worth exactly as much RP as is in them (and not being modified by 2x RP) allows the class artifacts to be used to refine any current artifacts as well as any of the other artifacts released in the future. By making a box cryptic would have to update the box every time a new artifact came out. And if I misunderstood you and you actually want to limit things to trading a class artifact for another class artifact then that is silly. We are looking to use our RP where ever we want, not being limited to trading around between class sigils (which would allow me to basically refine 1 or 2 class sigils and then trade out whenever i want at no cost which is not good.

luigipr31 · July 2016

"Just allowing the class artifacts to be worth exactly as much RP as is in them (and not being modified by 2x RP) allows the class artifacts to be used to refine any current artifacts as well as any of the other artifacts released in the future. "
^^This would be great.
And what do you think of the first class artifact (for each of your toons) free and others you have to buy BTC?
That way they dont use it over and over for free RP?

sorce · July 2016

plasticbat said:

ferency said:
I think your using your 2x twice in your example, however I get your point. Perhaps only allowing legendary items to be used; 10 or 20 times rp doesn't matter, once something is maxed it's maxed, or just having a flat amount depending on the colour of the item like a runestone. It's workable in a lot of ways.
I do and I think I am correct. In 2xRP event, when you feed normal RP to an artifact, you get the first 2xRP.
You get yet the 2nd 2xRP and 5xRP (becomes 10xRP), when you feed the artifact to another artifact (same class) during 2xRP. All together, it is 20x.

No - it's only x10 on a 2xRP weekend, and only if the artifact type is the same (Union into Union, etc.).

urabask · July 2016

confusedpoof said:

plasticbat said:

ferency said:
I think your using your 2x twice in your example, however I get your point. Perhaps only allowing legendary items to be used; 10 or 20 times rp doesn't matter, once something is maxed it's maxed, or just having a flat amount depending on the colour of the item like a runestone. It's workable in a lot of ways.
I do and I think I am correct. In 2xRP event, when you feed normal RP to an artifact, you get the first 2xRP.
You get yet the 2nd 2xRP and 5xRP (becomes 10xRP), when you feed the artifact to another artifact (same class) during 2xRP. All together, it is 20x.
No - it's only x10 on a 2xRP weekend, and only if the artifact type is the same (Union into Union, etc.).

He's using multiple feeders to get his numbers. 2x 59 feeders into one feeder to get it to 90ish then you feed two 90ish feeders into the artifact you're refining. That turns 600k RP into 10.5 million so it's more like 17.5x.

silverkelt · July 2016

I asked before if they could remove the ACTUAL RP value out of them somehow, so you could apply that, but no other bonuses and if you applied a new green its worth = zero rp.

I dont know if thats possible, and its probably complicated coding on their side. It would be nice though, I think we all have various ones we maybe do not use anymore.

demonmonger · July 2016

Sorry buddy.. ain't happeing..

forumnamesuxs · July 2016

scathias said:
That is only true of artifact weapons. With artifacts there is a 5x bonus for putting the item in a matching (stability/power/union) artifact and so you are gaining more out of it than you put in, especially during 2x RP.

If they put some special code on artifacts like these to give you back exactly as much RP as you put into it, or 80% of the RP or something it would be reasonable though.

Yes. This.. I would LOVE this!

I have some epic and legendary artifacts that most likely will never see the outside of my personal banks again, but I can't get myself to discard them either. Some sort of RP refund, if you will, would be very much appreciated.

forumnamesuxs · July 2016

Another way to do it, could be to add a vendor where one could trade in class sigils for character bound refinement stones, worth an equal to the first rank of the quality of the artifact.

Example: Epic devoted sigil could be traded for a refinement stone, let's call it for example "epic stone of union", worth 128,190 refinement points, with the standard multiplication of five in union artifacts.

Class artifacts should able to be used in refinement

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