I would like to weigh in on this trade bar issue. First I play this game for countless hours and spend my hard earned money to buy my Zen directly from you guys. I do not buy HAMSTER from third party, like a lot of other people that you "BANNED". Yet they are back playing the game a few days later? You failed to take action with the gold/AD sellers for months. Then you finally ban the jerks for doing it and as soon as they write a whining letter asking to let them back in, you do? How about some real punishment for cheating I mean I see guild halls rank 15+for some of these AD buyers. For these AD buyers how about dropping the guilds of these folks and making them rebuild the SH for cheating or removing gear. There are plenty of other things that can be done. You know who the buyers are. They ruined the economy by cheating. Now after all that you punish the rest of the community by not put wards on the trade bar vendor. Wait it gets better! Hey since we removed wards from the trade bar vendor altogether and then kept it a secret, now lets removed double ASTRALS and replace it with RP in a effort to cash grab and FORCE you to buy Zen to buy wards from the market place because it's the only place to get them. Honestly, I do not know who you have making decisions but they need to be fired or replaced. You want to fix the economy get rid of the freaking gold/ AD buyers then all that AD will be removed from the game BOOM problem solved. At the very least put the freaking wards back on the Trade bar vendor at the old price for the time being.
I love this game and have been loyal all the way back to the beta. This bothers me to know end. Here is why, I spent 2 months prepping for this release day, countless gear runs to make 2500 IL and storing gear for double astral's. Then buying ZEN with CASH to open lock boxes to build up my trade bars in preparation upgrading the gear FIVE other characters. YES FIVE LEVEL 70's! I am one of many of the loyal customers you have thumbed your nose at. Well I for one am not going to stand for it. I want my my $200+ dollars back that I spent for the last 2 months prepping for this. I am one customer, Now multiply this anger what 200000 times for the rest of the players and what you get is a mass of people leaving this game. To mislead your players in this way and come back and say "We Never said wards would be on the trade bar vendor" is a cop out and totally disrespectful to the player base. You never said they wouldn't be either so I want my money back. You showed pictures of the the wards on the vendor, you hipped it up and got us excited to play and then BAM and big slap in the face. Nope. I know the folks in California have a way to get their money back and you will have to pay them. If this isn't fixed soon you will have lost a Loyal customer and I know I am not the only one.
-Ralos Dalziel soon to be former player of Neverwinter.
I second this entire post. Gonna retire neverwinter because of this. Fix it or I'm out. Peace.
I will not be quitting neverwinter, just cutting off access to my pockets. Those of you who are quitting entirely, please remember how much more difficult or is for us all to get high level gems now without wards, and hook a brother up on your way out
Levity aside, in California where they are located, it's nearing lunch time. Still no response? Enjoy your break PWE employees, you might still have jobs when you come back.
Well, there is not much I can say that has not been said already. I guess I'm posting just to add my name to the list of upset players. I have defended some of the shadier tactics in the past... I mean these kind of things seem to be common in f2p games. However, I can't support any aspect of this move.
You know, I got home from work last night, ready to get my nightly Neverwinter fix in... I already knew about the bait and switch so I was not even very excited. To make it even worse, I signed in and almost all of my guild mates were not on. Most of them are either pissed, or even depressed about this whole situation.
We have new content and we can't even enjoy it! I slogged through the unlocking missions and it just felt like work. I don't know if it was because the missions just suck or if the sour mood of the entire community was effecting my experience.
I will also say I am not the biggest spender, but I do spend some... I have been willing to spend more. Unfortunately it's actions like this that make me change my mind, every time. I wanted to buy some zen around Christmas time and then you pullled that <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> with the courtesan fashion! It wasn't some kind of game breaker for me but I have a problem with dishonesty. I don't believe in supporting that kind of behavior. The whales in the game are always going to spend, but the casual spenders can really add up too if you actually treat them with respect.
I can't even begin to imagine what type of person(s) thought this would be a good idea, either for the game or for the business. Someone must think they are smarter than what they really are. Whoever made the decision... everyone in the game thinks you are a moron. If you are reading any of this feedback, the beating to your ego must be brutal. You are probably just bubbling over with denial right now.
null The issue they have is the whales are voting with their feet as well This behaviour has insulted the whole community from the lowest entrant player to the mega level guys That's one hell of a trick to pull off!
"We're still in the midst of finalizing the decision. Sorry for the long wait." Is the current statement from Twitter. More the 24 hours of deliberation! Maybe they are having serious vonsidetarion on how to appologize on top of giving us what was offered. Then again who knows, since sincere apology hasn't been the tone set for other statements.
Funny below is a link to the article that you all put out to us at Xbox. In it was the price list and what was to be included in the trade bar market. I guess you can't stand by what you put out. Many of us have been saving just for this list. You keep HAMSTER us for PC's economy. Stop. Plus all the horrible bans where you are not following your own EULA by sending any notification to the people who get banned. Most of whom are innocent. We are paying for PC's bots stop punishing us for them.
Funny below is a link to the article that you all put out to us at Xbox. In it was the price list and what was to be included in the trade bar market. I guess you can't stand by what you put out. Many of us have been saving just for this list. You keep HAMSTER us for PC's economy. Stop. Plus all the horrible bans where you are not following your own EULA by sending any notification to the people who get banned. Most of whom are innocent. We are paying for PC's bots stop punishing us for them.
Update: We're reviewing all the feedback and are currently in discussions on next steps. The Neverwinter team aims to provide a great experience adventuring throughout the lands. More updates to follow.
As some of you have noticed, there are a few differences between the Tarmalune Trade Bar Store on PC and Xbox. In particular, the Wards and Gems tab does not include Blood Rubies, Preservation Wards, or Coalescent Wards. We just wanted to let you know that this is intentional. Though they may show up at some point in the future, they are not supposed to be there with the launch of Neverwinter: Underdark on Xbox One.
As a reminder, these are different platforms and environments, each with a different history and economy. Though we are constantly trying to get all versions of NW on all platforms to line up, there shouldn’t be an expectation of exact parity between multiple platforms.
"Parity" is that what you guys are going with? You are stealing from your consumers yes in todays day and age micro-transactions are a huge part of how companies who produce free to play games make much of their money but by no means do you promise one thing and take away another you can edit your patch notes to make it look like it wasnt supposed to release and try to cover up your biggest mistake instead of stealing from us you could have slowly covered your tracks by having some employees create accounts and play with AD exchange rate at least then you would have less people pissed off the truth of it is you guys screwed up made obvious mistakes and tried to balance what should not have been xbox gamers will just switch to different games and forget about this one that will account for roughly a 1/4 of expendable gamers you might keep around 1/3 of those people but they will never spend money on the game again then you have roughly another 1/2 of the xbox community who will only start playing part time who used to play none stop then part of them somewhere around 1/2 of that half who will spend $10 here and there then you have the last quarter who will spend but not as much as they did before hell some of them might keep spending the way they did because they hardly noticed the change but lets be real if you address this fast and return what is supposed to be our you still risk losing about 1/16 of the players you currently have.
Interesting you Strum mention parity you guys said that about taking diamonds always from leadership profession. When you did stating you at Neverwinter were trying to bring us closer to be equal to PC even though we don't have bots and our economy was fine at the time. So either we are different or we are to be equal not both when it's convenient to make a new excuse for a major screw up. The bug testing we get for Xbox release is a joke at best did anyone try out this update before release. What's my money paying for yes I actually by Zen but I won't until you all stop taking advantage of all of us. I've helped with one gaming boycott Maybe we need to start one here.
Thought if i took a break, had some coffee, and chilled for a bit I'd feel better about this but nope. I am Still disappointed. I am Still waiting for their response. I am still waiting for them to at least acknowledge that this was not some far off, misplaced expectation of parity between consoles.
We were told:
(1) that parity was an eventual goal,
(2) to expect changes to the tarmulune trade house,
(3) that these changes would take the form of cheaper prices and new products, and
(4) The exact and specific nature of the changes to expect.
We were also told that coalescent wards would not be leaving the tradehouse..
The larger problem here is Strumslinger's framing of the problem. He blames us for our expectations of parity when really quite a lot was done to sell us on that idea.. Look at the extremely positive reaction they received from that January blog post. As far as I'm concerned, people would have to be willfully ignorant to not notice that the 3 things that people praised the most about the tarumulune update would actually not be IN the update.
just my 2 cents.. Have a nice day.
I have screen shots saved from the article they posted about changes to the trade bar store that include the old and new prices for pres wards, c wards and blood rubies.
Two things: one, no one believes your cover up. It takes the same amount of time to add a disclaimer about your lie as it would to just delete the line where you specifically refer to trade bar price of c wards. Less work even, given the amount of work that went into assuring people that this time the c wards really would be price reduced.
Two: this one is for players who keep posting how the very minimum they will "except" is Xyz. Except means everything but this, like in the sentence "everything except what you wanted is now in the trade bar upgrade". Accept means to come to terms with, or allow, such as in the sentence "I simply cannot accept that this was an oversight of some sort, and had any good intention attached to it. "
I called cryptic repeatedly today. No answer. Odd that their billing and customer support functions in a manner akin to their online response time. But lo, should someone post about an improper ban, it's removed in moments. Why not have those guys fix this issue? They obviously do their job in a timely manner. Anywho, I'll let you get back to your "investigations"
Wouldn't The changes to wards and rubies make more sense for the PC version because of the AD glut?
Exactly. This isn't about in game economics. They know that xbox players spend money. They saw an opportunity(fortunately they were very wrong)to make money by pulling refinement. I mean, people don't want to miss out on double refinement, right?
I still can't believe they have not just come out, apologized, and fixed the trade bar store. It appears as though they'll hope it blows over, at least until double refinement, and then they'll thank us for our patience, and possibly give us back what they promised originally. If they don't come out with an apology today, and say they're going to right this, I will likely never be back, and I certainly won't be making any more zen purchases. Which, if they were to look at my account, I'm sure I'm one of the biggest in game spenders on xbox.
Time to man up and admit you've been caught with your hand in the cookie jar and fix this problem your greed has caused. If you were clever instead of quick cash grabs you would put in effort to create good content and better consumer care and invest in longevity and loyal gamers who love the game and plan to play for years. That's how real money is made. Sort it out and we can get back to enjoying a fun game.
Why are we still waiting for an official response?
It's been more than 24hrs and since we all know you knew about this issue for about a week minimum (going by the time line when you edited the Tbar changes blog to cover your A$$) We need answers Andy/Scott!!!!!!
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I also want you to tell us why you changed the event calendar!!!!! Not the same BS PR "sorry for any inconvenience" I want the truth for once. Can you do that?
What is the point of having a calendar if at any time you can just change it to suit your bait and switch tactics. People make real life decisions by this calendar and even financial commitments, only to have you pull the rug out from under us and ruin everything we had planned. This alone has made me so sour to you (the admin) and the game.
Pretty much everything you say from this point on is a lie until proven otherwise (sounds a lot like your response to people who got banned lately hey)
Was thinking of actually buying some zen for a pack or two but no way now - have a lowly 2k trade bars but was going to make a big difference for my alts. Will keep playing given my VIP 12 but can't seem me spending any real money on this game ever again following the GMoP fiasco and now this
sorry guys but i think this game is a lost cause. its sad i feel your pain but we have to move on and let them regret stealing from its player base #RIPNEVERWINTER
We're still in discussions and finalizing plans based on the community's feedback on the Trade Bar Store changes. There are a lot of moving pieces that need to be addressed in decisions like these that affect the economy as a whole.
You have got to be kidding me. Is this the BS line you are still going to cling to?
It is a virtual economy, are you scared that the economy will collapse and Valindra will take over Neverwinter? Ohhs scarrry!!!
Or are you afraid your CEO will have to settle for a vacation home in Napa instead of Marthas Vineyard.
Just be honest, you have zero intention to give us what you promised, you have zero intention to treat us like anything but money buckets for you to gut.
Cram it.
Pastor Martin Niemöller had it right, but remember, before they come for anyone, they silence all, because to have discourse, is to breed discontent.
What a load of BS...still in discussions. What is there to discuss you lied to your customers in order to make some extra cash. Own up to it give us what you said we were going to get.
THERE IS NOTHING TO DISCUSS. Put the C. Wards in the market for 75 trade bars like you said. Put in the refining stores for trade bars LIKE YOU SAID! End of discussion!
Discussions? So we can expect a fix by close of business right? Surely neverwinter executives wouldn't walk out in the middle of a discussion, yes?
Discussion means someone is against it, otherwise it wouldn't be a discussion, it would be a consensus. Who is against it? Fire them. Problem solved. You want to know how putting the wards back in will effect game economy? Simple. People will spend all their bars on wards, worried that it is temporary. They will then proceed to use or horde them. The least irate of players will begin purchasing zen again, the most irate are already gone and won't come back regardless. The in between will either continue to never buy zen if that was their previous methodology, or will slowly go back to buying zen after cooling off. A negligible percentage of the playerbase that used to purchase zen will stick around, playing the game, and not purchasing zen.
As far as astral goes, the price of everything available for sale in the trade bar market except the wards and rubies will increase, the wards and rubies will decrease. Nothing else wool be affected by this correction.
That's college learnin' cryptic. You hire a few people all smart-like and stuff and you can avoid situations like this all together. Hell, I'll do it fort minimum wage. Send me a text saying "hey weevil, we are gonna screw the players like this, on a scale of 1 to c wards, how mad will they be?". I'll text you a response, you'll send me a check, disregard the only intellectual input received from an employee, and screw us anyway. Everybody wins.
Impact on the economy? GTF out, this has 0 to do with fake economic ramifications.
This has 100% to do with Cryptic/PWE wanting an entire player base to shell out $10 a pop to upgrade enchantments.
By implying that Wards and Rubies would be included in the tradebar update, going as far as to list what they would cost & giving absolutely no reason for anyone to reasonably doubt they would be included in the new tradebar store, you effectively told the entire XBox One population to go F themselves.
I'm not entirely sure how this affects the economy at all. If it is such a worry that it will effect the economy, then they need to be removed from the PC version as well. If your goal is to line up the games as close as possible, then either give them to Xbox, or take them from the PC. Given they have had them awhile now and their economy seems just fine, I'm thinking your reasoning is a bit flawed. Try harder.
Effect on the economy - the PW economy only. Ultimately they need to make money on the game or NW doesn't exist but the approach seems so short termist that the players have to milked at every possible opportunity
Comments
Levity aside, in California where they are located, it's nearing lunch time. Still no response? Enjoy your break PWE employees, you might still have jobs when you come back.
You know, I got home from work last night, ready to get my nightly Neverwinter fix in... I already knew about the bait and switch so I was not even very excited. To make it even worse, I signed in and almost all of my guild mates were not on. Most of them are either pissed, or even depressed about this whole situation.
We have new content and we can't even enjoy it! I slogged through the unlocking missions and it just felt like work. I don't know if it was because the missions just suck or if the sour mood of the entire community was effecting my experience.
I will also say I am not the biggest spender, but I do spend some... I have been willing to spend more. Unfortunately it's actions like this that make me change my mind, every time. I wanted to buy some zen around Christmas time and then you pullled that <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> with the courtesan fashion! It wasn't some kind of game breaker for me but I have a problem with dishonesty. I don't believe in supporting that kind of behavior. The whales in the game are always going to spend, but the casual spenders can really add up too if you actually treat them with respect.
I can't even begin to imagine what type of person(s) thought this would be a good idea, either for the game or for the business. Someone must think they are smarter than what they really are. Whoever made the decision... everyone in the game thinks you are a moron. If you are reading any of this feedback, the beating to your ego must be brutal. You are probably just bubbling over with denial right now.
SoonerGM - HR Trapper
Haven - Righteous Cleric
Ethereal Justice - OP Paladin
The issue they have is the whales are voting with their feet as well
This behaviour has insulted the whole community from the lowest entrant player to the mega level guys
That's one hell of a trick to pull off!
Is the current statement from Twitter. More the 24 hours of deliberation! Maybe they are having serious vonsidetarion on how to appologize on top of giving us what was offered. Then again who knows, since sincere apology hasn't been the tone set for other statements.
Two: this one is for players who keep posting how the very minimum they will "except" is Xyz. Except means everything but this, like in the sentence "everything except what you wanted is now in the trade bar upgrade". Accept means to come to terms with, or allow, such as in the sentence "I simply cannot accept that this was an oversight of some sort, and had any good intention attached to it. "
I called cryptic repeatedly today. No answer. Odd that their billing and customer support functions in a manner akin to their online response time. But lo, should someone post about an improper ban, it's removed in moments. Why not have those guys fix this issue? They obviously do their job in a timely manner. Anywho, I'll let you get back to your "investigations"
Exactly. This isn't about in game economics. They know that xbox players spend money. They saw an opportunity(fortunately they were very wrong)to make money by pulling refinement. I mean, people don't want to miss out on double refinement, right?
I still can't believe they have not just come out, apologized, and fixed the trade bar store. It appears as though they'll hope it blows over, at least until double refinement, and then they'll thank us for our patience, and possibly give us back what they promised originally. If they don't come out with an apology today, and say they're going to right this, I will likely never be back, and I certainly won't be making any more zen purchases. Which, if they were to look at my account, I'm sure I'm one of the biggest in game spenders on xbox.
Xerxes - GWF
Eazy - DC
Tyrian - TR
It's been more than 24hrs and since we all know you knew about this issue for about a week minimum (going by the time line when you edited the Tbar changes blog to cover your A$$) We need answers Andy/Scott!!!!!!
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I also want you to tell us why you changed the event calendar!!!!!
Not the same BS PR "sorry for any inconvenience" I want the truth for once. Can you do that?
What is the point of having a calendar if at any time you can just change it to suit your bait and switch tactics.
People make real life decisions by this calendar and even financial commitments, only to have you pull the rug out from under us and ruin everything we had planned. This alone has made me so sour to you (the admin) and the game.
Pretty much everything you say from this point on is a lie until proven otherwise
(sounds a lot like your response to people who got banned lately hey)
Time to make thing right
It is a virtual economy, are you scared that the economy will collapse and Valindra will take over Neverwinter? Ohhs scarrry!!!
Or are you afraid your CEO will have to settle for a vacation home in Napa instead of Marthas Vineyard.
Just be honest, you have zero intention to give us what you promised, you have zero intention to treat us like anything but money buckets for you to gut.
Cram it.
Discussions? So we can expect a fix by close of business right? Surely neverwinter executives wouldn't walk out in the middle of a discussion, yes?
Discussion means someone is against it, otherwise it wouldn't be a discussion, it would be a consensus. Who is against it? Fire them. Problem solved. You want to know how putting the wards back in will effect game economy? Simple. People will spend all their bars on wards, worried that it is temporary. They will then proceed to use or horde them. The least irate of players will begin purchasing zen again, the most irate are already gone and won't come back regardless. The in between will either continue to never buy zen if that was their previous methodology, or will slowly go back to buying zen after cooling off. A negligible percentage of the playerbase that used to purchase zen will stick around, playing the game, and not purchasing zen.
As far as astral goes, the price of everything available for sale in the trade bar market except the wards and rubies will increase, the wards and rubies will decrease. Nothing else wool be affected by this correction.
That's college learnin' cryptic. You hire a few people all smart-like and stuff and you can avoid situations like this all together. Hell, I'll do it fort minimum wage. Send me a text saying "hey weevil, we are gonna screw the players like this, on a scale of 1 to c wards, how mad will they be?". I'll text you a response, you'll send me a check, disregard the only intellectual input received from an employee, and screw us anyway. Everybody wins.
This has 100% to do with Cryptic/PWE wanting an entire player base to shell out $10 a pop to upgrade enchantments.
By implying that Wards and Rubies would be included in the tradebar update, going as far as to list what they would cost & giving absolutely no reason for anyone to reasonably doubt they would be included in the new tradebar store, you effectively told the entire XBox One population to go F themselves.
Again, bravo NWXbox/Cryptic/PE.