Why doesnt really matter. The facts are that a new player cannot get what the rest of us have already. New players are not going to enjoy PVP because it is inevitable that they will meet up with a group of BiS PVPers that have zero chance of challenging. Sure, you can completely avoid PVP but is that really a reasonable response?
Well, the Devs are ignoring player feedback, only option left, not to participate in PvP. The same goes for the whole upgrading system, until the Devs come up with reasonable changes, hold on to your AD. At some point, the players have to draw a line...
I'd like to point out that all of these ridiculous AD sinks were put in because there was trillions of AD floating around and billions being generated every day.
What was the price of a GMOP on the first day of public access to NW? 100,000 AD. Cryptic has been charging out the wazoo from day 1; these sinks are not in response to AD farms. Please get your facts straight!
100% agree! The AD leadership farms are a result of ridiculous prices and not the other way around!
Again. THERE WERE NO GMOPS WHEN THE GAME LAUNCHED.
The GMOPs were added IN MODULE 2, AFTER some of the huge exploits (which had been running for MONTHS by that point), and, yes, people botting Leadership through the gateway, had introduced tons of AD that needed to be sunk.
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santralafaxMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 2,896Arc User
Personally, I'm reserving judgement until after the changes. Maybe things won't be as bad as everyone thinks. Maybe the devs will decide that the changes are too extreme and add in other ways of earning AD. I don't know, but I don't want to quit a game that I still totally love just because of something like this. It's not like they are targeting just a few people with this. Everyone will be in the same boat. It should even the playing field between the people who have 50 characters and the people who only have 1 or 2.
I only HAVE 1 or 2. I supplement my income with Leadership and cash. I am not increasing the cash to offset the loss to Leadership. In fact, it makes pull back the wallet. Lack of progress will be the end of me playing.
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santralafaxMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 2,896Arc User
I'd like to point out that all of these ridiculous AD sinks were put in because there was trillions of AD floating around and billions being generated every day. Now that they've removed the biggest cause of this, there's reason to believe they will also lower/remove the sinks, give it some time.
I see you agree this isn't about bots at all. I've been giving them time since they rendered my gear obsolete in Mod 6 and made the mobs meaner. This isn't a new thing. One step forward, two steps....
I'd like to point out that all of these ridiculous AD sinks were put in because there was trillions of AD floating around and billions being generated every day. Now that they've removed the biggest cause of this, there's reason to believe they will also lower/remove the sinks, give it some time.
I see you agree this isn't about bots at all. I've been giving them time since they rendered my gear obsolete in Mod 6 and made the mobs meaner. This isn't a new thing. One step forward, two steps....
Well... no, it's not entirely about bots, or goldfarmers. This is because PLAYERS were exploiting. Tons of them.
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santralafaxMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 2,896Arc User
I'd like to point out that all of these ridiculous AD sinks were put in because there was trillions of AD floating around and billions being generated every day. Now that they've removed the biggest cause of this, there's reason to believe they will also lower/remove the sinks, give it some time.
I see you agree this isn't about bots at all. I've been giving them time since they rendered my gear obsolete in Mod 6 and made the mobs meaner. This isn't a new thing. One step forward, two steps....
Well... no, it's not entirely about bots, or goldfarmers. This is because PLAYERS were exploiting. Tons of them.
So Scott is dissembling (I'm using the kind word.) Not that I didn't recognize it, just want to drive it home. Things come out of this typing that are not true. This is the way of Cryptic. And they want our business....
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obsiddiaMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,025Arc User
... People hoping for a decrease of fixed prizes in near future will probably be disappointed. Cryptic will be monitoring the amount of AD in game and will decrease the fixed prizes, when they see a steady decrease in the global amount of AD - BUT all people with millions of AD will immediately stop spending ADs resulting in a deadlock - Cryptic waiting for people spending AD and players waiting for Cryptic to announce a decrease in fixed prices.
THIS. This is exactly what I plan to do. And I only have 1 toon farming Leadership. With no immediate changes and no decisions announced... this is what will happen.
Did you really think anyone could steal the power of the god of thieves?
I'd like to point out that all of these ridiculous AD sinks were put in because there was trillions of AD floating around and billions being generated every day. Now that they've removed the biggest cause of this, there's reason to believe they will also lower/remove the sinks, give it some time.
I see you agree this isn't about bots at all. I've been giving them time since they rendered my gear obsolete in Mod 6 and made the mobs meaner. This isn't a new thing. One step forward, two steps....
Well... no, it's not entirely about bots, or goldfarmers. This is because PLAYERS were exploiting. Tons of them.
A leadership armies aren't exploiting as long as they are on the same account and you bought the extra slots. Astral resonator and Caturday were exploits. This isn't about the latter.
I'd like to point out that all of these ridiculous AD sinks were put in because there was trillions of AD floating around and billions being generated every day. Now that they've removed the biggest cause of this, there's reason to believe they will also lower/remove the sinks, give it some time.
I see you agree this isn't about bots at all. I've been giving them time since they rendered my gear obsolete in Mod 6 and made the mobs meaner. This isn't a new thing. One step forward, two steps....
Well... no, it's not entirely about bots, or goldfarmers. This is because PLAYERS were exploiting. Tons of them.
A leadership armies aren't exploiting as long as they are on the same account and you bought the extra slots. Astral resonator and Caturday were exploits. This isn't about the latter.
No, but using a bot to do professions is exploiting. Which a ton of players were doing. Seriously, do you have any idea how easy it was to bot professions? It was easier through the gateway, but even removing Leadership from there didn't stop it. Removing the AD from leadership was the right thing to do.
It's going to be chaotic for a while, but the dust will eventually settle. Just try to hang in there.
I'd like to point out that all of these ridiculous AD sinks were put in because there was trillions of AD floating around and billions being generated every day. Now that they've removed the biggest cause of this, there's reason to believe they will also lower/remove the sinks, give it some time.
I see you agree this isn't about bots at all. I've been giving them time since they rendered my gear obsolete in Mod 6 and made the mobs meaner. This isn't a new thing. One step forward, two steps....
Well... no, it's not entirely about bots, or goldfarmers. This is because PLAYERS were exploiting. Tons of them.
A leadership armies aren't exploiting as long as they are on the same account and you bought the extra slots. Astral resonator and Caturday were exploits. This isn't about the latter.
No, but using a bot to do professions is exploiting. Which a ton of players were doing. Seriously, do you have any idea how easy it was to bot professions? It was easier through the gateway, but even removing Leadership from there didn't stop it. Removing the AD from leadership was the right thing to do.
It's going to be chaotic for a while, but the dust will eventually settle. Just try to hang in there.
You are putting way, way too much faith into a company that is not deserving based off of their past discretions...
I was hopeful that based off of the recent communication that things were headed in the right direction...but this all feels like one big set up.
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santralafaxMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 2,896Arc User
It's going to be chaotic for a while, but the dust will eventually settle. Just try to hang in there.
If you recall, we are still on the heels of the chaotic Mod 6 implosion. What will be the next catastrophe?? Neverwinter is a very unstable place. Has been at least since April. I believe the Leadership Armies really got underway in reaction to Mod 6's removal of many AD trajectories, btw. They are just snowballing things even further, and the reckoning is going to be harsh.
If they think that there are some people out there with ill-gotten gains, why don't they just take a large chunk off the top of it. Instead of a 100 million ad cap (unbelievable) they could create a new cap at 30 million and wipe away a large amount of AD. Then they would only be punishing an elite subset instead of the whole player base. They could drop the character limit to 10 while they are at it. They seem to have no problems with unfairly changing rules mid-stream anyway.
I spend what I have. How much do you have socked away??
I'd like to point out that all of these ridiculous AD sinks were put in because there was trillions of AD floating around and billions being generated every day. Now that they've removed the biggest cause of this, there's reason to believe they will also lower/remove the sinks, give it some time.
I see you agree this isn't about bots at all. I've been giving them time since they rendered my gear obsolete in Mod 6 and made the mobs meaner. This isn't a new thing. One step forward, two steps....
Well... no, it's not entirely about bots, or goldfarmers. This is because PLAYERS were exploiting. Tons of them.
A leadership armies aren't exploiting as long as they are on the same account and you bought the extra slots. Astral resonator and Caturday were exploits. This isn't about the latter.
No, but using a bot to do professions is exploiting. Which a ton of players were doing. Seriously, do you have any idea how easy it was to bot professions? It was easier through the gateway, but even removing Leadership from there didn't stop it. Removing the AD from leadership was the right thing to do.
It's going to be chaotic for a while, but the dust will eventually settle. Just try to hang in there.
Please show me some evidence that those who were using easily downloaded scripts to do Leadership on the gateway suddenly decided to pay for, download, and set up in game bots to do their Leadership tasks. I doubt that you can as it is a conclusion based upon speculation versus reality. Running an in game bot versus an app script is like comparing apples to oranges -- while they may be similar they are not exactly the same.
I'd like to point out that all of these ridiculous AD sinks were put in because there was trillions of AD floating around and billions being generated every day. Now that they've removed the biggest cause of this, there's reason to believe they will also lower/remove the sinks, give it some time.
I see you agree this isn't about bots at all. I've been giving them time since they rendered my gear obsolete in Mod 6 and made the mobs meaner. This isn't a new thing. One step forward, two steps....
Well... no, it's not entirely about bots, or goldfarmers. This is because PLAYERS were exploiting. Tons of them.
A leadership armies aren't exploiting as long as they are on the same account and you bought the extra slots. Astral resonator and Caturday were exploits. This isn't about the latter.
No, but using a bot to do professions is exploiting. Which a ton of players were doing. Seriously, do you have any idea how easy it was to bot professions? It was easier through the gateway, but even removing Leadership from there didn't stop it. Removing the AD from leadership was the right thing to do.
It's going to be chaotic for a while, but the dust will eventually settle. Just try to hang in there.
Please show me some evidence that those who were using easily downloaded scripts to do Leadership on the gateway suddenly decided to pay for, download, and set up in game bots to do their Leadership tasks. I doubt that you can as it is a conclusion based upon speculation versus reality. Running an in game bot versus an app script is like comparing apples to oranges -- while they may be similar they are not exactly the same.
The main person who was writing the script for the gateway was giving away access to an in-game bot when leadership was removed from the gateway. No one had to pay for anything.
I dont want to be a BiS player in a sea of casuals. Its boring.
thank you for your words. maybe you can spend some time discuss this at your guild plagueing pvp with premades
They enjoy PVP. It is not their fault that the devs of the game have made it impossible for the casual player to compete effectively. Instead of blaming the people that love to play, blame the jerks who made it so that you can NEVER get gear as good as theirs. Now, instead of new guilds catching up and getting geared players, they will never catch up. Your solution to this issue is for the people in my guild to quit? Most of us have played since launch. Everyone needs to contact Cryptic and complain at them directly. http://mmos.com/developers/cryptic-studios
i am talking about attitude. not pvp system
"I dont want to be a BiS player in a sea of casuals"
many from your guild constantly play like to be BIS player in sea of casuals. thats what i talk about... no offense
I feel like briseda has a good attitude about this. Having good gear shouldn't make one a detriment to the game if the overall point of the PVP game is to have good gear and compete against other players. This one's on Cryptic for making gear so damned hard to acquire then not properly segregating the haves vs have nots.
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tripsofthrymrMember, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,624Community Moderator
It should even the playing field between the people who have 50 characters and the people who only have 1 or 2.
Why do you think it is appropriate or fair to even that playing field? People that have 50 characters spent money buying character slots. They spent many, many hours leveling 40+ toons high enough for professions. They invested many months leveling Leadership to 20 then again to 25.
Why should we redistribute the economy to "even the playing field" between the people that invest that time and the people that did not.
Unlike the real economy, every player in the game had the exact same opportunity and played by exactly the same rules. The playing field was already even.
Evening the playing field is not a justification for this action.
PS - For the record I have 14 toons, 2-3 of which I actively play.
Why doesnt really matter. The facts are that a new player cannot get what the rest of us have already. New players are not going to enjoy PVP because it is inevitable that they will meet up with a group of BiS PVPers that have zero chance of challenging. Sure, you can completely avoid PVP but is that really a reasonable response?
They are not going to enjoy ECC either. You need serious gear including enchants to have a shot at doing it legit!
eGWD isn't much easier, either. The T1 dungeons are more reasonable now for lower geared people, but now 2 of the 3 T2's require a level of gear to complete legit that's going to be tough for anyone new to get. They'd need to get carried and unless they've got a helpful guild then their chances are nil.
Which is why so many people are still exploiting the last boss in eCC (why bother with eTOS, the easiest of the 3, when eCC can be farmed?) and who knows if that'll get fixed tomorrow or any time soon since I doubt it'd even be listed as a fix. But as long as it isn't, it's going to be maybe the only way for new players and characters to get the best PvE gear available to them.
Off topic, but could we get some account bound Elven gear for other classes from the element/protector seal vendor at some point?
Just call me Rod. Member of Grievance! CW: Rodrant Turnbul TR: Rodran DC: Rodrat GWF: ROARdrant TurnBRAWL Other GWF: Shieldrant HR: Bowdrant SW: Wardrant Turnlock (my main!) OP: Paladrant (on Preview!)
I'd like to point out that all of these ridiculous AD sinks were put in because there was trillions of AD floating around and billions being generated every day.
What was the price of a GMOP on the first day of public access to NW? 100,000 AD. Cryptic has been charging out the wazoo from day 1; these sinks are not in response to AD farms. Please get your facts straight!
100% agree! The AD leadership farms are a result of ridiculous prices and not the other way around!
Again. THERE WERE NO GMOPS WHEN THE GAME LAUNCHED.
The GMOPs were added IN MODULE 2, AFTER some of the huge exploits (which had been running for MONTHS by that point), and, yes, people botting Leadership through the gateway, had introduced tons of AD that needed to be sunk.
you are right. However that is when they introduced refining. Something many many players warned them not to do. They also made a point to say that this would free up space in our inventory (LOL) and that their intention is that the regents (aka GMOP) would drop IN GAME.
this has been long downward spiral unfortunately. I don't envy their position but at the same time its hard to feel sorry as the hole has been dug deeper and deeper for years now. Honestly at this point, you just get the feeling they don't have the bandwidth to make the necessary coding changes needed
"we all love this game and want it to thrive"
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theycallmetomuMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,861Arc User
You had never the chance to be BIS equipped as freeplayer. You must spend money. It is simple as that. And even if you could reach it there is a gurante for it that comes another elemental evil update and destroy 50% of your progress that you did in a year or two.
It is only an Illusion that you can earn everything in the game with time investment. On top of that, the game is buggy and laggy. The last 3-6 month it lacks of content. I heard that Cryptic will only develope 10-12 modules and then the game is done.
I'm near BIS, and would be BIS if I actually did dungeons, without spending money. No, the main thing is you need 4 purple tools, which is only likely if you started early on.
By the way: this is going to make RP even cheaper AD wise, not more expensive. Because now, market manipulators and bots will just spam leadership tasks that drop enchants/peridots, as opposed to tasks that give AD. Of course, your income is going to drop by a greater value.
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theycallmetomuMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,861Arc User
I understand PVP players not using leadership that applaud the removal of leadership AD.
I don't understand PVE players not using leadership applauding. At the moment you progress your toon because of leadership farmers. You can farm elol - win the artifact - sell it for 1.6mio AD - buy 16 gmops and progress your toon. In the future - you farm elol - win the artifact - but the prize will drop to about 160k-300k AD - you can only buy 1-3 gmops.
The only reason some people sell profession stuff for high prizes in AH is because of leadership farmers, who don't care because they earn large amounts of AD per day.
People hoping for a decrease of fixed prizes in near future will probably be disappointed. Cryptic will be monitoring the amount of AD in game and will decrease the fixed prizes, when they see a steady decrease in the global amount of AD - BUT all people with millions of AD will immediately stop spending ADs resulting in a deadlock - Cryptic waiting for people spending AD and players waiting for Cryptic to announce a decrease in fixed prices.
If people stop spending AD because they're expecting prices to drop ... prices drop, because no one is willing to spend AD. It's called a deflationary spiral.
Why doesnt really matter. The facts are that a new player cannot get what the rest of us have already. New players are not going to enjoy PVP because it is inevitable that they will meet up with a group of BiS PVPers that have zero chance of challenging. Sure, you can completely avoid PVP but is that really a reasonable response?
They are not going to enjoy ECC either. You need serious gear including enchants to have a shot at doing it legit!
eGWD isn't much easier, either. The T1 dungeons are more reasonable now for lower geared people, but now 2 of the 3 T2's require a level of gear to complete legit that's going to be tough for anyone new to get. They'd need to get carried and unless they've got a helpful guild then their chances are nil.
Which is why so many people are still exploiting the last boss in eCC (why bother with eTOS, the easiest of the 3, when eCC can be farmed?) and who knows if that'll get fixed tomorrow or any time soon since I doubt it'd even be listed as a fix. But as long as it isn't, it's going to be maybe the only way for new players and characters to get the best PvE gear available to them.
Off topic, but could we get some account bound Elven gear for other classes from the element/protector seal vendor at some point?
nope just a pali being fed AP from a dc and some dps, same with the other t2s. takes a while but doable ( just ignore everything (except the eGWD wolf) and bang on the boss) . cleared everything with a 2.3 pali, 2.1 dc, and some mixed 2.2-2.5dps . whats really sad is everything is 3 total dungeons.
BIS should be an ideal, not really possible to reach, most of the actual bis should have been banned long ago, but cryptic let then get away with it.
a small video about it:
Pay attention in reason 8 and the game show in the image meanwhile.
Except....there are alot of people who are already BIS. Matter of fact, they have so much stored up AD and zen that when the next wave of stuff comes out, they'll be BIS then too. And the time after that, and the time after that, and etc. etc. etc.
All this does is hurt the people who are attempting to catch up to those people. Leadership farmers still spend money on the game, at least some of em do.
If they really wanted to make AD something people get through playing and enjoying the game. They would attach AD on to general missions, stuff that people can solo. But you will not be seeing that. Because it's not about making things right or stopping the people "Abusing the system" Because this does nothing to the people that are still using the system with exploits. It just is a attempt to try and get those who aren't paying close attention to spend real money to buy zen for AD.
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theycallmetomuMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,861Arc User
Well, as zen prices go down, you'll actually have LESS incentive to spend money on zen, not more, because the ZAX rate declines. Before, 1 dollar bought 1/2 a GMOP. If it falls to a rate of 250 instead of 500 for instance, 1 dollay buys 1/4 a GMOP.
A party that is formed with the intention of PVPing. Get 5 ppl together with really good gear and queue for Domination. Its hard to beat them.
Why would you poopoo on premades? Teamwork should be something everyone playing should aspire to.
To some "Teamwork" means being able to find one you can stand to play with let alone work together. So yes premades are unfair. I should be a BOT class gen and you work with what you are given all the same grear all the came stats everything. Lets see if you still have that cocky attitude when someone out games you with the same toon.
Personally, I'm reserving judgement until after the changes. Maybe things won't be as bad as everyone thinks. Maybe the devs will decide that the changes are too extreme and add in other ways of earning AD. I don't know, but I don't want to quit a game that I still totally love just because of something like this. It's not like they are targeting just a few people with this. Everyone will be in the same boat. It should even the playing field between the people who have 50 characters and the people who only have 1 or 2.
Why? Why do you need to even the playing field between people who have 50 characters, and people who have 1 or 2?
I dont understand this logic? Why are you punishing people that have invested more into the game then you have? What about the cost of character slots, the cost of resources to speed up leadership? Are you telling me the amount of money put in on 50 toons is the same as 1 or 2? Because, guess what? It's not.
I have 1 level 60 to 70 toon for every class that is in game. It's the way I play. If my leadership is max'd out on those characters I should not be equal to somebody who plays with 1 or 2 characters. Nor should I be equal to somebody who has 50 characters. That is just foolish thinking.
Why does the playing field need to be even. If you want the income that people with 50 leadership toons have, get your HAMSTER busy in game and get it.
Next thing we'll be punishing people with legendary and mythic gear for having legendary and mythic gear. That gear should be taken away or nerfed so that it's on par with people who only have common to epic gear!
The more I think about these changes, the more stupid I find them.
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theycallmetomuMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,861Arc User
it was never the intention to make people have the incentive to have 50 characters. In any other game, if you tried to manage 50 characters, it would make each of them weaker, not stronger. But in NWO, having 50 characters means your one character can be way stronger than if you only had the one character.
Conceptually removing Leadership is a good idea-they just need to add better ways for solo players to get AD, and/or cut costs dramatically.
it was never the intention to make people have the incentive to have 50 characters. In any other game, if you tried to manage 50 characters, it would make each of them weaker, not stronger. But in NWO, having 50 characters means your one character can be way stronger than if you only had the one character.
Conceptually removing Leadership is a good idea-they just need to add better ways for solo players to get AD, and/or cut costs dramatically.
Not true. In City of Heroes I had 54 characters, 22 of them were pretty much BIS (though gear was handed alot differently there) I had a character for basicly any need that anyone ever had in game.
If you needed a ice/ice blaster to help in a fight, I had it, A scrapper or controller to help you get through any of the incarnate content. I had it. And it was fun. I loved all the characters I had in that game, and having them was a show of how much I enjoyed that game.
Here, it's a crime and you should should be punished for it. I am still shaking my head over that line of thinking.
And I still dont understand how you can say removing a way to play the game is a good idea, even conceptually...
That's like saying them removing dungeons from the game is a good idea bec...oh wait, they've done that too.
Let me ask you a question. Can you name any other company with any other MMO that has removed content from a game and had it end well? I cant.
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theycallmetomuMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,861Arc User
Please listen to what I said.
I didn't say "having alts so you can do different things when called for is a bad thing." No, I said "having alts that exist only to make your main stronger is a bad thing." Because then it means that the people who don't have alts are disadvantaged.
Characters should not, in and of themselves, provide a benefit outside of the character itself. You have an ice guy and a fire guy, great! But your fire guy shouldn't be stronger just because you have an ice guy; rather, you just have the ability to choose between the two.
Now, I can understand "well you should make alts easy to maintain" and sure, I'm fine with that. But the guy who focuses entirely on one character shouldn't be weaker with that one character than the guy who has 10 characters.
Personally, I'm reserving judgement until after the changes. Maybe things won't be as bad as everyone thinks. Maybe the devs will decide that the changes are too extreme and add in other ways of earning AD. I don't know, but I don't want to quit a game that I still totally love just because of something like this. It's not like they are targeting just a few people with this. Everyone will be in the same boat. It should even the playing field between the people who have 50 characters and the people who only have 1 or 2.
While I can respect your statement I also have to note that anyone whos been playing since release has already seen just how bad cryptic is at making these decisions. Lets take a trip down memory lane.
Enchanted keys. Ah what a wonderful time it was when the enchanted keys were flowing like water, easy and cheap to get, often selling for around 10K AD on the AH. Not only were people selling keys left and right but hey were also selling zen like there was no tomorrow, I remember buying zen on the exchange for under 300AD each. Then for whatever reason Cryptic decided to make the keys BoP. And that's was the beginning of the great AD craze.
Players just about stopped selling zen in favor of opening boxes and selling the box items for far more since they are now harder to get. And who can blame them? Earning more AD while having to spend less zen. This change has never been fixed in anyway shape or form.
Coalescent Wards. Yet another decision cryptic made "for the players benefit" that has benefitted us in no way. Now, admittedly back then all we had to level was the 14 enchantment slots and honestly, no one really needed all R12s unless they just wanted to solo everything in like 2 seconds.
So to fight the "bot" army of invokers first thing they did was make all coalescent wards from coffers BoP. That single change was more then enough to stop the bots by making it so they cant sell or trade them. No more cheap and bountiful coalescent wards for the players. But why stop there they said, so they also reduced the drop rate of the wards from coffer and then on top of that they also added more items to the coffer which basically makes a drop even more less likely.
Now we can have up to 16 enchantment slots plus we now have 4 gear items plus 4 artifacts to level up and all while never increasing the availability of coalescent wards. And while the new refining system did decrease the need for coalescent ward it increased the need for reagents that they have also had theirs drops reduced for some odd reason making them harder to find and thus driving up the cost of those too.
Mod 6. OK, im not even going to try and cover all the things they did wrong there but lets focus on the mob damage. During testing they were told the damage was too high. After it went live they were told the damage was too high. After they made the "reduced damage/more HP" fix they were told the damage was too high.
It took them until like 2 weeks into mod 7 to finally agree with the player base and admit that the damage was still too high. And while the fix was more then welcomed that real damage had already been done. How many players both free and paying did they lose while they "reviewed the data"? I mean over 3 months over the player base telling them that the damage was too high and they just didn't want to listen.
Changes to ADs Now they're making changes to how we can get AD that everyone is already telling them is a bad idea. And as the past has shown, if and that's a big IF, they decide they made a mistake, the damage will already be done. We don't need another mass exodus from the game.
So far the only thing I've seen in terms of making ADs with the new changes is trying to force us to run quests that scott himself called inconvenient. How does that make any sense when the players have already been yelling for less repetitive content?
Comments
The same goes for the whole upgrading system, until the Devs come up with reasonable changes, hold on to your AD.
At some point, the players have to draw a line...
Again. THERE WERE NO GMOPS WHEN THE GAME LAUNCHED.
The GMOPs were added IN MODULE 2, AFTER some of the huge exploits (which had been running for MONTHS by that point), and, yes, people botting Leadership through the gateway, had introduced tons of AD that needed to be sunk.
With no immediate changes and no decisions announced... this is what will happen.
It's going to be chaotic for a while, but the dust will eventually settle. Just try to hang in there.
I was hopeful that based off of the recent communication that things were headed in the right direction...but this all feels like one big set up.
If they think that there are some people out there with ill-gotten gains, why don't they just take a large chunk off the top of it. Instead of a 100 million ad cap (unbelievable) they could create a new cap at 30 million and wipe away a large amount of AD. Then they would only be punishing an elite subset instead of the whole player base. They could drop the character limit to 10 while they are at it. They seem to have no problems with unfairly changing rules mid-stream anyway.
I spend what I have. How much do you have socked away??
Why should we redistribute the economy to "even the playing field" between the people that invest that time and the people that did not.
Unlike the real economy, every player in the game had the exact same opportunity and played by exactly the same rules. The playing field was already even.
Evening the playing field is not a justification for this action.
PS - For the record I have 14 toons, 2-3 of which I actively play.
Sci-fi author: The Gods We Make, The Gods We Seek, and Ji-min
Which is why so many people are still exploiting the last boss in eCC (why bother with eTOS, the easiest of the 3, when eCC can be farmed?) and who knows if that'll get fixed tomorrow or any time soon since I doubt it'd even be listed as a fix. But as long as it isn't, it's going to be maybe the only way for new players and characters to get the best PvE gear available to them.
Off topic, but could we get some account bound Elven gear for other classes from the element/protector seal vendor at some point?
CW: Rodrant Turnbul
TR: Rodran
DC: Rodrat
GWF: ROARdrant TurnBRAWL
Other GWF: Shieldrant
HR: Bowdrant
SW: Wardrant Turnlock (my main!)
OP: Paladrant (on Preview!)
The GMOPs were added IN MODULE 2, AFTER some of the huge exploits (which had been running for MONTHS by that point), and, yes, people botting Leadership through the gateway, had introduced tons of AD that needed to be sunk.
you are right. However that is when they introduced refining. Something many many players warned them not to do. They also made a point to say that this would free up space in our inventory (LOL) and that their intention is that the regents (aka GMOP) would drop IN GAME.
this has been long downward spiral unfortunately. I don't envy their position but at the same time its hard to feel sorry as the hole has been dug deeper and deeper for years now. Honestly at this point, you just get the feeling they don't have the bandwidth to make the necessary coding changes needed
By the way: this is going to make RP even cheaper AD wise, not more expensive. Because now, market manipulators and bots will just spam leadership tasks that drop enchants/peridots, as opposed to tasks that give AD. Of course, your income is going to drop by a greater value.
whats really sad is everything is 3 total dungeons.
All this does is hurt the people who are attempting to catch up to those people. Leadership farmers still spend money on the game, at least some of em do.
If they really wanted to make AD something people get through playing and enjoying the game. They would attach AD on to general missions, stuff that people can solo. But you will not be seeing that. Because it's not about making things right or stopping the people "Abusing the system" Because this does nothing to the people that are still using the system with exploits. It just is a attempt to try and get those who aren't paying close attention to spend real money to buy zen for AD.
Why? Why do you need to even the playing field between people who have 50 characters, and people who have 1 or 2?
I dont understand this logic? Why are you punishing people that have invested more into the game then you have? What about the cost of character slots, the cost of resources to speed up leadership? Are you telling me the amount of money put in on 50 toons is the same as 1 or 2? Because, guess what? It's not.
I have 1 level 60 to 70 toon for every class that is in game. It's the way I play. If my leadership is max'd out on those characters I should not be equal to somebody who plays with 1 or 2 characters. Nor should I be equal to somebody who has 50 characters. That is just foolish thinking.
Why does the playing field need to be even. If you want the income that people with 50 leadership toons have, get your HAMSTER busy in game and get it.
Next thing we'll be punishing people with legendary and mythic gear for having legendary and mythic gear. That gear should be taken away or nerfed so that it's on par with people who only have common to epic gear!
The more I think about these changes, the more stupid I find them.
Conceptually removing Leadership is a good idea-they just need to add better ways for solo players to get AD, and/or cut costs dramatically.
If you needed a ice/ice blaster to help in a fight, I had it, A scrapper or controller to help you get through any of the incarnate content. I had it. And it was fun. I loved all the characters I had in that game, and having them was a show of how much I enjoyed that game.
Here, it's a crime and you should should be punished for it. I am still shaking my head over that line of thinking.
And I still dont understand how you can say removing a way to play the game is a good idea, even conceptually...
That's like saying them removing dungeons from the game is a good idea bec...oh wait, they've done that too.
Let me ask you a question. Can you name any other company with any other MMO that has removed content from a game and had it end well? I cant.
I didn't say "having alts so you can do different things when called for is a bad thing." No, I said "having alts that exist only to make your main stronger is a bad thing." Because then it means that the people who don't have alts are disadvantaged.
Characters should not, in and of themselves, provide a benefit outside of the character itself. You have an ice guy and a fire guy, great! But your fire guy shouldn't be stronger just because you have an ice guy; rather, you just have the ability to choose between the two.
Now, I can understand "well you should make alts easy to maintain" and sure, I'm fine with that. But the guy who focuses entirely on one character shouldn't be weaker with that one character than the guy who has 10 characters.
Enchanted keys.
Ah what a wonderful time it was when the enchanted keys were flowing like water, easy and cheap to get, often selling for around 10K AD on the AH. Not only were people selling keys left and right but hey were also selling zen like there was no tomorrow, I remember buying zen on the exchange for under 300AD each. Then for whatever reason Cryptic decided to make the keys BoP. And that's was the beginning of the great AD craze.
Players just about stopped selling zen in favor of opening boxes and selling the box items for far more since they are now harder to get. And who can blame them? Earning more AD while having to spend less zen. This change has never been fixed in anyway shape or form.
Coalescent Wards.
Yet another decision cryptic made "for the players benefit" that has benefitted us in no way. Now, admittedly back then all we had to level was the 14 enchantment slots and honestly, no one really needed all R12s unless they just wanted to solo everything in like 2 seconds.
So to fight the "bot" army of invokers first thing they did was make all coalescent wards from coffers BoP. That single change was more then enough to stop the bots by making it so they cant sell or trade them. No more cheap and bountiful coalescent wards for the players. But why stop there they said, so they also reduced the drop rate of the wards from coffer and then on top of that they also added more items to the coffer which basically makes a drop even more less likely.
Now we can have up to 16 enchantment slots plus we now have 4 gear items plus 4 artifacts to level up and all while never increasing the availability of coalescent wards. And while the new refining system did decrease the need for coalescent ward it increased the need for reagents that they have also had theirs drops reduced for some odd reason making them harder to find and thus driving up the cost of those too.
Mod 6.
OK, im not even going to try and cover all the things they did wrong there but lets focus on the mob damage. During testing they were told the damage was too high. After it went live they were told the damage was too high. After they made the "reduced damage/more HP" fix they were told the damage was too high.
It took them until like 2 weeks into mod 7 to finally agree with the player base and admit that the damage was still too high. And while the fix was more then welcomed that real damage had already been done. How many players both free and paying did they lose while they "reviewed the data"? I mean over 3 months over the player base telling them that the damage was too high and they just didn't want to listen.
Changes to ADs
Now they're making changes to how we can get AD that everyone is already telling them is a bad idea. And as the past has shown, if and that's a big IF, they decide they made a mistake, the damage will already be done. We don't need another mass exodus from the game.
So far the only thing I've seen in terms of making ADs with the new changes is trying to force us to run quests that scott himself called inconvenient. How does that make any sense when the players have already been yelling for less repetitive content?