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Strongholds: A list of Please Do's and Please Don'ts
adent086
Member Posts: 108 Arc User
Greetings all! Since there is SO much anticipation for/about the upcoming Strongholds Module Expansion; and since there has been so much buzz about it from my remaining (the ones that survived the Mod 6 purge) guild members, I thought I would take a moment to put hands to keyboard and write out some thoughts about that very same subject aimed directly at the devs.
Spoiler/Troll Alert: This thread is aimed directly at the devs. While community comments and thoughts are always welcome, what is listed here are the thoughts and impressions from OUR guild. We realize that what WE think and feel might not be the same as everyone else. This is just intended to represent our small voice in the otherwise larger (but not as large as before mod 6) Neverwinter Community.
First, I would like to cover the 5 main things that the guild is excited about and would like to see come with the new Module:
1. First, and most importantly, the Guild would like to see a fun and REWARDING module to play, chocked full of massive amounts (and different kinds) of PvE content. Module 6 was largely unrewarding, and largely did more to take away from the players that give to them; at the very least this was the perception it gave all of the players in our guild. This needs to change with Mod 7. A large area, with tons of content, with ALL different kinds of Refinement rewards for completion of various missions, would go a LONG way towards this goal. To go along with this, the guild would like to see a zone that you can truly "live" in and make your own. To truly make this possible, ALL of the conveniences of Protector's Enclave would have to be present, or achievable through upgrades, to our Stronghold. (I.E. Mailbox, Bank (both personal and guild (of course), Salvage, Merchant, etc.)
2. There should be PvE content for ALL group sizes to complete. This content should be able to be completed by groups with mixed levels (both actual and item). The Skirmish for the Protector's Jubilee: "The Protector's Speech" is a PERFECT example of what we are talking about here. Many people of many different levels (both actual and item) could come together, seamlessly, and have fun. The point of: People of many different levels (both item and actual) coming together seamlessly to have fun should be a PRIMARY focus of this module. Because, as it stands, Level (both actual and item) is currently a MAJOR exclusionary barrier to people coming together to have fun; and people easily coming together to have fun, seamlessly, is how you are going to get people to stay in (and most importantly to you: spend money on) your game. There should also be a way for players that can't always be on at the times the rest of the guild are, even if they are alone at the time they are on, to have fun and participate in a meaningful way to guild goals in this zone. This is the kind of content that you need to focus on at all levels in Strongholds.
3. The guild would like to see many of the lingering issues that are left from Mod 6 be fixed BEFORE mod 7 rolls out. Specifically, there are still many class skills, feat capstones, and basic functionality that just don't work and/or remain broken from mod 6 (and before). A very specific example of this is, but is not limited to: the TR's Tenacious Concealment; this class feature has been broken since mod 4 (or before according to some guild members), please fix it (and the many others that were broken when 4th ranks were added) before mod 7 arrives. Leaving this undone, or taking as long (or longer) as it has to get to some of these issues, leaves the community as a whole with a "the devs don't care about old classes and content" impression. The Guild would very much like to see this impression change through enhanced action on the part of the devs; specifically in this area.
4. New Boons and Gear. There is a massive potential for the use and implementation of MANY new Boons (and different types of boons) with this content. Since Module 6 was the first significant module to ever come WITHOUT Boon content of any kind, the guild would very much like to see that trend be different (end) with Mod 7. Also, there is currently a gear gap in game; and it is a sizeable one. This gap exists between Item levels 122 and 130. In mods previous to 6, this (same type of range) gap was filled (and handled wonderfully) with Unicorn and Dragon item sets. The guild would like very much for this gap to be filled by the new content with items leveled somewhere in the 128 range. This would be an excellent way for guild members to gear up (even if alone) and get ready for guild events in Tier 1 and even some Tier 2 dungeons. The more ways (that appeal to a maximum number of gaming styles) that a community has to gear up at end game, the happier that community as a whole will be.
5. Use of ALL levels of Profession Resources as a way to build "Guild Points" and pay for the upkeep of the Stronghold. Basically, there is very little use for Profession Resources in the game. The lower down you go in "resource level" the worse the problem gets. Honestly, the lowest level profession resources are currently little more than "vendor trash" in the game right now. The guild would very much like to see that change with Strongholds. Also, the donation of said Profession Resources to build additions to the Stronghold itself flows logically and makes sense. This is also an excellent alternative way to build up whatever currency is going to come with the zone and a direct alternative (or addition) to grinding the rewards for missions in the zone. Basically, whatever this "currency" for "buying stuff" from the zone store ends up being, it should be attainable either by donating Profession Resources to the Guild for upgrading and upkeep to the Stronghold and/or as a reward for doing mission in the zone. If you can get all of the "currency" you need by either running missions and/or donating profession resources then that will appeal to a wide variety of play styles; and that is ALWAYS a good thing in game design. Additionally, being able to donate "campaign currency" from any of the other zones that you have no other use for (because the devs have given us no way to spend most of it once we are done with the campaign tree) would also be an excellent way to build up currency in this zone and for stronghold upgrades. In this way, all players of all levels could have a meaningful impact to "donation drives", and the devs would finally achieve something that has long been missing from the game: Namely, tying all of the different zones together somehow.
Next, I would like to cover the 5 main things that the guild is "worried" about and does very much NOT want to see come in with the new Module:
1. Another Broken Mod. Module 6 was, in our guild's opinion, one of the most damaging to the game that has ever been released. Note I didn't use the word "worst", I used the term "most damaging". The difference is fairly obvious. The best way to avoid this would be to simply take your time in releasing it. We realize that you have corporate masters at your backs making unreasonable demands of you; but please: TAKE YOUR TIME. We would much rather wait for a mod that works, than get a mod early that doesn't.
2. PvP required or heavily focused on. The worry about this pretty much hit a "fevered pitch" in the guild with the preview snap shot that came with "Our Biggest Map Ever". The mirrored map gave the VERY definite impression to our guild that not only was PvP the center focus of the expansion, that it could also very possibly be a required component to get all of the truly good boons that should be coming with the module. Our guild has nothing against people/guilds that love PvP and want to do it all day long. That is great..... for them. Our guild doesn't PvP, nor do we want to (as a group). Please do no make PvP a focus as it was in the IWD module.
3. Another 72-73 level mob zone. We already have enough of these. In our guild's opinion, there shouldn't be ANY of these. But, since they do exist, we certainly don't need another one. You have a mechanic that allows mobs to automatically scale themselves to the level of the people that are fighting them. Use it please. Much like in the Module 4 Tyranny of Dragon zones, if you do this, then a level 20 character and a level 60 character can be fighting the same mob, and both doing balanced damage and effects. Our guild would very much like to see this implemented throughout the entire Stronghold zone.
4. New Crafting Profession that are solely for the purpose of upgrading or the upkeep of Strongholds. Please. Pretty please with sugar on top our guild asks and begs: Just say no to this idea. The crafting system in Neverwinter is of questionable and debatable use in Neverwinter as it is. Using EXISTING resources from EXISTSING crafting professions as a way to fuel currency build up and the upgrading our Strongholds is an AWESOME idea! Introducing entirely new resources and crafting professions to go along with Strongholds is an very BAD idea. Please do NOT do it. Thank you in advance.
5. The use of Astral Diamonds as a way to build, upgrade, or upkeep Strongholds. Please don't do it. Gold? Yes. Astral Diamonds? No. There is already way too much demand for the use of Astral Diamonds in the game. After all, you can't do ANY meaningful upgrades to you character at end game (beyond boons) that don't require one (usually many more) GMoP. If you make this move, the demand, and the pressure to make Astral Diamonds without paying you guys money, is only going to get worse. Also, functionally, the MAIN reason why you shouldn't and CAN'T do this is that there is no easy way for all the guild members, as a whole, to contribute to this upkeep. It would fall, by the necessity of Astral Diamonds not being able to be shared, to one member to supply this need.
Anyway, these 10 issues of "please do's" and "please don'ts" are what has been buzzing around the guild of late. This includes, I might add, to many of the guild members that are not, currently, in game. Paying attention to these remarks just might give me the ability to get some of our guild member back in game, and spending money.
Just a little perspective from our guild's view on the game. It was put here in the constructive attempt to help. I hope the devs give it a kind ear and listen. I truly do.
Best regards from an overworked and under appreciated guild leader!
Peace.
Spoiler/Troll Alert: This thread is aimed directly at the devs. While community comments and thoughts are always welcome, what is listed here are the thoughts and impressions from OUR guild. We realize that what WE think and feel might not be the same as everyone else. This is just intended to represent our small voice in the otherwise larger (but not as large as before mod 6) Neverwinter Community.
First, I would like to cover the 5 main things that the guild is excited about and would like to see come with the new Module:
1. First, and most importantly, the Guild would like to see a fun and REWARDING module to play, chocked full of massive amounts (and different kinds) of PvE content. Module 6 was largely unrewarding, and largely did more to take away from the players that give to them; at the very least this was the perception it gave all of the players in our guild. This needs to change with Mod 7. A large area, with tons of content, with ALL different kinds of Refinement rewards for completion of various missions, would go a LONG way towards this goal. To go along with this, the guild would like to see a zone that you can truly "live" in and make your own. To truly make this possible, ALL of the conveniences of Protector's Enclave would have to be present, or achievable through upgrades, to our Stronghold. (I.E. Mailbox, Bank (both personal and guild (of course), Salvage, Merchant, etc.)
2. There should be PvE content for ALL group sizes to complete. This content should be able to be completed by groups with mixed levels (both actual and item). The Skirmish for the Protector's Jubilee: "The Protector's Speech" is a PERFECT example of what we are talking about here. Many people of many different levels (both actual and item) could come together, seamlessly, and have fun. The point of: People of many different levels (both item and actual) coming together seamlessly to have fun should be a PRIMARY focus of this module. Because, as it stands, Level (both actual and item) is currently a MAJOR exclusionary barrier to people coming together to have fun; and people easily coming together to have fun, seamlessly, is how you are going to get people to stay in (and most importantly to you: spend money on) your game. There should also be a way for players that can't always be on at the times the rest of the guild are, even if they are alone at the time they are on, to have fun and participate in a meaningful way to guild goals in this zone. This is the kind of content that you need to focus on at all levels in Strongholds.
3. The guild would like to see many of the lingering issues that are left from Mod 6 be fixed BEFORE mod 7 rolls out. Specifically, there are still many class skills, feat capstones, and basic functionality that just don't work and/or remain broken from mod 6 (and before). A very specific example of this is, but is not limited to: the TR's Tenacious Concealment; this class feature has been broken since mod 4 (or before according to some guild members), please fix it (and the many others that were broken when 4th ranks were added) before mod 7 arrives. Leaving this undone, or taking as long (or longer) as it has to get to some of these issues, leaves the community as a whole with a "the devs don't care about old classes and content" impression. The Guild would very much like to see this impression change through enhanced action on the part of the devs; specifically in this area.
4. New Boons and Gear. There is a massive potential for the use and implementation of MANY new Boons (and different types of boons) with this content. Since Module 6 was the first significant module to ever come WITHOUT Boon content of any kind, the guild would very much like to see that trend be different (end) with Mod 7. Also, there is currently a gear gap in game; and it is a sizeable one. This gap exists between Item levels 122 and 130. In mods previous to 6, this (same type of range) gap was filled (and handled wonderfully) with Unicorn and Dragon item sets. The guild would like very much for this gap to be filled by the new content with items leveled somewhere in the 128 range. This would be an excellent way for guild members to gear up (even if alone) and get ready for guild events in Tier 1 and even some Tier 2 dungeons. The more ways (that appeal to a maximum number of gaming styles) that a community has to gear up at end game, the happier that community as a whole will be.
5. Use of ALL levels of Profession Resources as a way to build "Guild Points" and pay for the upkeep of the Stronghold. Basically, there is very little use for Profession Resources in the game. The lower down you go in "resource level" the worse the problem gets. Honestly, the lowest level profession resources are currently little more than "vendor trash" in the game right now. The guild would very much like to see that change with Strongholds. Also, the donation of said Profession Resources to build additions to the Stronghold itself flows logically and makes sense. This is also an excellent alternative way to build up whatever currency is going to come with the zone and a direct alternative (or addition) to grinding the rewards for missions in the zone. Basically, whatever this "currency" for "buying stuff" from the zone store ends up being, it should be attainable either by donating Profession Resources to the Guild for upgrading and upkeep to the Stronghold and/or as a reward for doing mission in the zone. If you can get all of the "currency" you need by either running missions and/or donating profession resources then that will appeal to a wide variety of play styles; and that is ALWAYS a good thing in game design. Additionally, being able to donate "campaign currency" from any of the other zones that you have no other use for (because the devs have given us no way to spend most of it once we are done with the campaign tree) would also be an excellent way to build up currency in this zone and for stronghold upgrades. In this way, all players of all levels could have a meaningful impact to "donation drives", and the devs would finally achieve something that has long been missing from the game: Namely, tying all of the different zones together somehow.
Next, I would like to cover the 5 main things that the guild is "worried" about and does very much NOT want to see come in with the new Module:
1. Another Broken Mod. Module 6 was, in our guild's opinion, one of the most damaging to the game that has ever been released. Note I didn't use the word "worst", I used the term "most damaging". The difference is fairly obvious. The best way to avoid this would be to simply take your time in releasing it. We realize that you have corporate masters at your backs making unreasonable demands of you; but please: TAKE YOUR TIME. We would much rather wait for a mod that works, than get a mod early that doesn't.
2. PvP required or heavily focused on. The worry about this pretty much hit a "fevered pitch" in the guild with the preview snap shot that came with "Our Biggest Map Ever". The mirrored map gave the VERY definite impression to our guild that not only was PvP the center focus of the expansion, that it could also very possibly be a required component to get all of the truly good boons that should be coming with the module. Our guild has nothing against people/guilds that love PvP and want to do it all day long. That is great..... for them. Our guild doesn't PvP, nor do we want to (as a group). Please do no make PvP a focus as it was in the IWD module.
3. Another 72-73 level mob zone. We already have enough of these. In our guild's opinion, there shouldn't be ANY of these. But, since they do exist, we certainly don't need another one. You have a mechanic that allows mobs to automatically scale themselves to the level of the people that are fighting them. Use it please. Much like in the Module 4 Tyranny of Dragon zones, if you do this, then a level 20 character and a level 60 character can be fighting the same mob, and both doing balanced damage and effects. Our guild would very much like to see this implemented throughout the entire Stronghold zone.
4. New Crafting Profession that are solely for the purpose of upgrading or the upkeep of Strongholds. Please. Pretty please with sugar on top our guild asks and begs: Just say no to this idea. The crafting system in Neverwinter is of questionable and debatable use in Neverwinter as it is. Using EXISTING resources from EXISTSING crafting professions as a way to fuel currency build up and the upgrading our Strongholds is an AWESOME idea! Introducing entirely new resources and crafting professions to go along with Strongholds is an very BAD idea. Please do NOT do it. Thank you in advance.
5. The use of Astral Diamonds as a way to build, upgrade, or upkeep Strongholds. Please don't do it. Gold? Yes. Astral Diamonds? No. There is already way too much demand for the use of Astral Diamonds in the game. After all, you can't do ANY meaningful upgrades to you character at end game (beyond boons) that don't require one (usually many more) GMoP. If you make this move, the demand, and the pressure to make Astral Diamonds without paying you guys money, is only going to get worse. Also, functionally, the MAIN reason why you shouldn't and CAN'T do this is that there is no easy way for all the guild members, as a whole, to contribute to this upkeep. It would fall, by the necessity of Astral Diamonds not being able to be shared, to one member to supply this need.
Anyway, these 10 issues of "please do's" and "please don'ts" are what has been buzzing around the guild of late. This includes, I might add, to many of the guild members that are not, currently, in game. Paying attention to these remarks just might give me the ability to get some of our guild member back in game, and spending money.
Just a little perspective from our guild's view on the game. It was put here in the constructive attempt to help. I hope the devs give it a kind ear and listen. I truly do.
Best regards from an overworked and under appreciated guild leader!
Peace.
Telling us about upcoming content updates, and getting those updates out the door BUG-FREE, is *AWESOME*!! Know what's even *MORE* awesome? Fixing game breaking bugs (and/or undocumented "features") that have been in EXISTING content for months/years!!! Guess which one makes me want to spend money on a game much more than the other? Hint: It's the "more awesome" one.
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Many of us have seen the truth and so far none of the flaming fantasies are even close to the reality.
This "Chicken Little Syndrome" gets a little annoying. Instead of seeing the cup half full... see that the cup is full with life sustaining water and air.
What are YOU even talking about? This is a "would like there to be and not to be" not a "is going to be or already is" thread. Talk about "knowing what you are talking about" being an issue. Sheese......
Still, your good points are things they already know, already did or are already working on. For instance, they know exactly what went good and bad with latest iterations and they know when or how to release updates better than you, so your #1 sound, as you said yourself, obvious and at best a juvenile call for attention. At worst, the whole thread sounds like flaming bait like our friend there pointed out.
Anyway some of the points are valid. For instance, professions could be better explored. However whatever is done with the current systems are things that take time and, honestly, I dont expect many matters to be even considered for strongholds. But it would be cool if they did make it in.
So, its good to make assumptions about what the devs do and don't know? And, therefore not provide feedback in the "feedback" section of the forums to that fact?
Also, it is " at best juvenile" to express the wants, desires, opinions, hopes, and fears of an entire group of people and bring them to the attention of the devs all nicely summed up in a SINGLE thread? Or, its "flame bait" to once again express those same wants, desires, opinions, hopes and fears to the devs in the section of the forums designed specifically for that purpose?
Interesting thoughts and opinions. I honestly hadn't ever seen things from the point of view you express.
Also, as a last mention I would like to make a comment specifically on your "they know when or how to release updates better than you"...... I think this is kind of funny considering the current state of the servers: Down going on double the time they slotted, and having had to be taken down (once up) again because they upped it with stuff being broken. Just saying that your comment here made me smile is all. After all, the ISP I run has never has such a run of "bad luck".
But, thank you for your comments and the limited support you showed. After all, expressing ourselves in a constructive manner about the game is what the forums is all about.
Peace.
Your post is mostly about saying what you think about strongholds when you dont know what it really is or the relevance it will have in the future. Nobody does. For instance, you did say that strongholds was "very definitely" pvp centric. You dont know that. Of course, I would not take away your rights to think that since there is GvG planned for strongholds and anyone would feel tempted to agree with you. So you are certainly free to voice what you will. But you should ponder a little bit more with your guild and I would advice you to be more positive about it with your guild members, if you want them to stay with you.
You should have taken into consideration for instance that anecdotal evidence shows that this is probably not the case of a pvp centric expansion because, for one, pvp is mostly optin instanced and two, the GvG map showed to us is different from the guild stronghold map.
In NWO logs they mentioned for instance a 1993 game of strongholds that focuses mainly on building a thriving community. In this particular 1993 game you build castles, markets, stuff like that and there are peasants you must care for. If they really take this into account as an inspiration I have more reasons to believe it will be more pve centric than PVP. But I wouldnt jump to conclusions just now. Also dont forget there is the Underdark expansion coming so there is more room to improve than we are actually anticipating. I am an optimist for now when it comes to PVE as imho it can only improve from now on.
Why bother saying anything unless you want to be seen and heard? Unless you are involved in the Alpha testing I doubt they will take anything you have to say... with any value.
So considering this... why bother posting this?
As I said... you have no concept of what is actually being proposed, yet you feel the need to make requests. If you actually knew what was being proposed by the release of Strongholds... you would not say anything.
On this SPECIFIC point you and I actually completely agree. But, there is always vain hope, yeah? And, if these types of threads bother you so much, why do you read them?
This is actually the POINT of the entire thread. Thank you for making it for me. Yes, a vain attempt to STEER the direction that "conversation" is taking, and to help the devs with FEEDBACK (not so ironically the name of the forum) as to the direction our guild would like the game to take.
The last sentence of your statement also implies that you DO know what is being planned. So please inform us. What IS actually being proposed for the release of Strongholds? Since you claim to know, please inform us so we can all discuss it. Don't know? Then, once again, you DON'T know what you are talking about. Also, curiously, then what is YOUR true purpose is shooting down "request" threads other than to simply troll?
I see and accept your point here. However, the blog about the Senior Producer you are referring to is very vague, imho, about specifically WHAT they were apologizing having "gone wrong." In the post here, myself, and my guild try to be more specific about (in our opinion) what has gone wrong.
Incorrect, kind sir. I said that the map gave us the IMPRESSION that the expansion was taking a very PvP centered turn. With respect, this is not the same thing at all.
In all of this, I and my guild can only say: We hope you are right and that your optimism proves right and well founded.
Again, thank you very much for your input and lively chat.
I am involved in the Alpha testing... and we were asked not to share anything that we experience. Needless to say, what is going to be released is NOT what everyone thinks it is.
So it would be best to refrain from creating needless drama over personal ideas.
Ah, so now we come to where you actually have a point and what you have been on about all along. Nice. For future reference, you might want to start out with "I am in Alpha testing so your thread is pointless" rather than just saying it is "pointless" and coming off sounding like a run-of-the-mill troll.
Now, having said that, I have been in software development myself for my entire professional career (going on 30 years now); so I can understand about the NDAs and what they entail. It is also usual for NDAs to include the fact that if you are not supposed to talk about what you see and/or experience while in a testing phase; you are also not supposed to talk about the fact that you actually ARE one of the testing phase participants. Strange that Crypic and PWE don't follow industry standards on that particular point.
At any rate, lets be kind, and assume that you are an actual alpha tester (and not just saying that to sound more important and knowledgeable than you actually are) and have taken the time out of your busy schedule to stop by my humble thread. If this is so, then: thank you.
If all of what you say is true, then you have a very valid point all the way from the beginning. If the devs have already put the actual functionality of the new zone into production then nothing we as the players say will matter so much as a hill of beans; and indeed, this entire thread is utterly pointless and very ill-timed, and even ill-advised. IF, all of what you say is true.
Again, assuming that it is true, thank you for stopping by and providing a little bit of a peak behind the curtain so to speak. At the very least it has alerted me, and my entire guild, to the possibility that all we can do at this point is "wait and see"; because all of the decisions that matter on the topics of our concerns have already been made, and can not be affected by our opinions or input.
Cheers.
I would recommend using completly new currency which is gated behind daily or weekly quest and cannot be botted as easily, or / and AD to remove more of it from the market.
I'd also recommend taking in to consideration that most players have a lot of alts which could potentially allow to upgrade things faster and leave small / medium guilds far behind.
Like I said, IF the explanations of your comments are true, thank you for stopping by and giving us some insight; and I am sorry if my "making" you break NDA with my comments has any negative impact on you and your status as a "alpha tester" for cryptic in the future.
In the much more likely scenario where your comments are completely untrue, then I am still very glad that I posted the thread so that there is a chance (however small) that the devs see it and take notice.
Peace, and kind regards to you either way.
Interesting points, even though some of them directly disagree with what the guild and I were thinking. Your comments actual sparked some new debate in guild chat. Thank you for your input. Cheers!
1. NO ASTRAL DIAMOND COSTS. As the OP mentioned, there are far more than enough AD expenses already in-game. I believe every member of my/our guild has put money into the game, and does so periodically, but every time we feel forced to do so (to remain competitive, or even to not take the next year to get something up to snuff) there are grumbles. We prefer to put money into the game when we've been enjoying playing, and when we see something that would nifty to have, but not required.
2. Use of existing crafting professions would be great and helpful, but I don't think we are quite as averse to a new profession, especially if it is along the lines of the winter or siege event levels, rather than another (ugh) full scale profession.
3. PvP either not a factor, or an entirely optional one.
4. We are very much hoping for the (potential) full service stronghold, and expect that it will take some work to get there.
5. Non-broken releases and fixes for existing problems: I think everyone, player and dev, would like to see this. I personally have one major suggestion in that area, particularly when it comes to fixes, there is just no reason to wait around for a major release to put it all in one big package. That is dangerous. If you've got decent version control software (which I doubt, given the track record), then putting a series of smaller changes in is safer, allows better impact assessment, and is more easily rolled back if need be. Even without decent VC, it still makes sense to do more, smaller releases, it just isn't as easy.
The final comment I'll make is that personally, I think it would have been extremely cool if we could have had some choice as to where our stronghold would be. Do we reclaim a part of former Neverwinter City? Build a cave/mine complex in the Underdark? Fortify the wilds near some encroaching enemy (Tyranny/Well themed, Dread Ring, Sharandar, EE, etc.)? Having some choice in that would have allowed for more personalized (guildized?) expression, which would have been awesome. Heck, that might have been an optional thing that I would have been willing to toss some actual money at.
Alas, it now sounds like the single map for the strongholds is a done deal, and there is to be no flexibility or choice in the matter.
I have mixed feelings about astral diamonds as currency. The more ways you can spend AD is better imho for economy. But a real world problem is that something is either worth lots of AD or it is worthless. Anyway, from the info we got, stronghold economy will probably be more about real items than AD, if any. Not worried about it.
PvP, like in the rest of the game, is believed to be optional. I dont really understand where you guys got the idea that its a mandatory pvp experience. You dont need to suffer from anticipation about forced pvp. Certainly not happening. However even if not forced, certainly we were hinted that guild pvp is one thing that they may spend a lot of their love into and people will miss one of many experiences if they pass on it.
Their problem is always the implementation. They had loads of fresh cool ideas that they just messed up.
I won't minds a few bugs either - I'm a patient man - they'll fix the bugs this century, or the next. What scares me is their habits of turning everything into a sickening grind or slowing progress through time-gating. It seems that's their only idea on how to make money is to make the game insufferable, so you'd eventually end up in the Zen Store. I had no hopes for Modules 4,5 and 6. I actually have some hope for this Module ... against my better judgement.
Please make it good!
https://www.arcgames.com/en/games/neverwinter/news/detail/9435423
Reading through the final few paragraphs is a little depressing:
"One of the first plots the guild has access to early on is the marketplace. By building the marketplace, the guild unlocks special stores containing a huge array of new equipment. This new gear is purchased with Guild Marks, a currency earned when players contribute to the guild’s advancement. The more the guild members contribute, the more Guild Marks they earn.
In order to access the best gear, the guild will need to upgrade the marketplace. Each structure the guild builds has 10 ranks, each unlocking new abilities or boons. The guild hall must also be upgraded to allow structures to advance. Upgrading the guild hall also increases the coffer capacity and clears the overgrown plots around the map.
This cycle of collecting, donating, building, and upgrading is the heart of stronghold gameplay. The whole process takes time and collaboration, but the rewards for guilds that work together to meet their goals make the investment worthwhile."
Basically, a stronghold is a mega piece of Artifact Equipment which will take an eternity to 'refine' up to the highest levels unless you are a large and deep-pocketd guild. By the sound of it, with 10 ranks for each structure small guilds will have no chance to get anything worthwhile together in a reasonable timespan. The endless grind may have found its next iteration
That said, if it is really an "unreasonable timespan" well, that would not be cool, but I guess if we are to be preemptively defeated at any point I guess no ammount of updates would ever fix anything.
Example:
Guild "A" with most active memebers will focus on upgradting
Alt guild 1 casual players
Alt guild 2 casual players
Alt guild 3 casual players
Alt guild 4 casual players
Once guild "A" finish upgrading, they will swap for few days memebers from alt guilds so they can easily buy top gear. Unless they will make new gear guild bound (aka when you leave the guild or get kicked you wont be able to equip the gear anymore.
This isn't criticism or being snarky or whatever, just my observation.
"...I grab my wiener and charge!" - ironzerg79
Ironically Jimmy, you are not far off the mark. Mod 6 nearly broke the back of our guild in this game. Before mod 6 we had a regular attendance of 20 or more, especially on the weekends. Now, we are lucky to get 5 on at the same time. What reason does everyone give on our own personal forums and website we use for our multi-game guild? Simple: The changes in mod 6.
So, "axe-grindy"...... not the term I would have chosen; but, yes. A great deal of the purpose of this thread was to try and alert the devs as to changes that they made that were unpopular with our guild and try to steer them away from repeating those same types of mistakes in future content. I.E. "Constructive Criticism"; what the devs CLAIM to want out of these forums; though their actions and especially the actions of their moderators tell a very different story.
Anyway, thanks for stopping by and commenting, even if you didn't find it of much worth.
Peace.
That said, am inclined to agree with some of the "don'ts", like boons or any other huge general advantages (new players consideration also), dependent on mass PvP/PvE (that module specific) progress, unrelated to the Strongholds themselves. Not literally, but in an overall perspective tho.
Ofc a well running guild should have an advantage of a developed "guild base", like hours lasting buffs, being it exp boosts or a "70lvl-like pots", some injury immunity, some "support classes-like buffs" even, costumes/whatever et cetera - so the (for some) "annoying" WoD lairs or any "playthru" locations are more bearable, fun or easier (faster).
I dont think anyone want any more "have to-s".
Unfortunatelly, I have to bite my tongue.
Well written and brilliantly on point. Yes our guild has many of the same opinions. Lets see how everything rolls out.
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An excellent point, and one we are trying to figure out a solution for. If small guilds are behind the 8 ball because it would take too long to refine, and medium to large sized guilds get splintered into alt guilds who cant help each other out.. who exactly will be happy?
I guess we'll just have to wait for more information. I actually like what they have to say about the PvE stuff in general. As long as its FUN, I think many of these early tidbits of information they are releasing will start to make more sense.
TYRS PALADIUM - A Premier Neverwinter Online Guild
No Drama. Camaraderie. TEAM Focus. That's the TYRS way. If that's your style, come join us!
Research our Guild here: Read our official Recruitment thread | Sign up here: Tyrs Guild Website! | NEVERWINTER GUILD LEADERS: Join the Fellowship!