Anyone for turning the difficulty from 11 back down to 10?

coolgeek357

Wondering who else thinks things in Well of Dragons is off the difficulty scale.

sockmunkey

Personally, id be happy to see it tuned back to a more reasonable 9. I play games to stomp mobs. I don't need to feel challenged, and I don't want to be forced to pick the strongest Min/Max builds just to have a chance to succeed.

pancakeattax

sockmunkey wrote: »

Personally, id be happy to see it tuned back to a more reasonable 9. I play games to stomp mobs. I don't need to feel challenged, and I don't want to be forced to pick the strongest Min/Max builds just to have a chance to succeed.

I guess I fall into same boat.. gaming = satisfaction, if I wanted challenge I would try to pick up on fishing in real.
**** salmon so effin cunning.

suicidalgodot

I'm all in favor of it.

Though there's a vocal (ond often/partially not-so-polite) fraction in the game that thinks differently, many users dislike it (including me).

And, heck, the two paths aren't mutually exclusive after all: E.g. add a "Legendary" dungeon type, with some wee extra loot and some epeen transmutes as an additional layer. Or give us health gating. Or time-limited, PvE-only damage reduction scrolls everyone can use (to be bought with AD, not ZEN, preferably). Or just widen the level sweet zone to three levels (and up the dungeon denizen spread by one for the legendary layer). Or just soften the underleveled cliff. Or...

So: I vote yes, I do.

generaldiomedes

For public solo areas, dial it back a bit, but not to where it was before. Maybe split the difference.

For instances/heroics, I don't think I would agree. Right now I'm really enjoying the combat, grouping, slow gear climb back up and the chance of failure. I'm even thinking they are making the game a *bit* more social.

asmose01

generaldiomedes wrote: »

For public solo areas, dial it back a bit, but not to where it was before. Maybe split the difference.

For instances/heroics, I don't think I would agree. Right now I'm really enjoying the combat, grouping, slow gear climb back up and the chance of failure. I'm even thinking they are making the game a *bit* more social.

I agree make the dailies solo-able again but keep the dungeons where there at. . . maybe the only thing I would look at really tweaking is tiamat since the vast population does not get nore takes the time to educate them selfs once again on tactics and gem use in there!

suicidalgodot

asmose01 wrote: »

[...] tweaking is tiamat [...]

That's been announced to be adddressed/in work. Looking forward to it, too...

carrytiex

Dread/sharandar areas are fine. IWD I'd rather do the main daily and buy reghed relics for currency. WoD I'm just skipping on my new character because it's only needed for the 6th and 7th boon to unlock tiamat and screw that. Probably going to skip 4th and 5th too but at least you have better choices for those ones.

kreatyve

My GWF hasn't had too many issues since Mod 6. She's pretty beast, and I would like her to stay that way.

Unknown

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zvieris

Sharandar is ok, Dread Ring is ok. IWD and WoD are sick. I assume it has got to do with the mob levels. WoD/IWD have them at lvl 73 and much higher for HEs, while Sharandar and Dread Ring have them at lvl 71-72. The solution is pretty simple here, just reduce the **** level.

burkaanc

coolgeek357 wrote: »

Wondering who else thinks things in Well of Dragons is off the difficulty scale.

yeah, it fell off the low end of the scale, solo roflstomping 5mans is boring

magenubbie wrote: »

I think for most not-BiS people IWD was a good example of how you create difficult content. All they had to do what turn that dial up a little and apply it to the rest of the game.

yup, what they did to IWD at the start of mod6 was really the right spot, they should turn the dial a bit up and apply to rest of the game, t1 seem to be ok though, t2 might need some tweaking - a bit harder but without oneshotting tanks, though that would need changing AI or dungeon mob layout

zvieris wrote: »

Sharandar is ok, Dread Ring is ok. IWD and WoD are sick. I assume it has got to do with the mob levels. WoD/IWD have them at lvl 73 and much higher for HEs, while Sharandar and Dread Ring have them at lvl 71-72. The solution is pretty simple here, just reduce the **** level.

higher lvl mobs do deal much more dmg(i think it started at +2), but if they reduced mob lvl to 72 it would be so boring, i would need to find a way to pull all the darn map at the same time to give mobs at least some chance to kill me

diogene0

As long as we're talking about solo content I don't care. They could just remove all damage and make npcs dummies for all I care. But dungeons should remain unchanged. There's finally something to do in this game for people with some gear and skill, that's about time!

linoge63

sockmunkey wrote: »

Personally, id be happy to see it tuned back to a more reasonable 9. I play games to stomp mobs. I don't need to feel challenged, and I don't want to be forced to pick the strongest Min/Max builds just to have a chance to succeed.

I second this reply...

k3ll0

I'm all for the mobs requiring some effort to kill, except when they're the kind you have to kill a metric crapton of every day for grinding in which case the less trouble they give the better. But banging your head against a wall isn't much fun, doubly so when a lot of the relevant mechanics aren't working properly/reliably/at all.

nehemiah217

If you ask me, there are really two issues here: one is the difficulty / one-shotting / level disparity, and the other issue is the stat reduction curve.

The first issue: yes, I do agree with easing up on the difficulty a bit, especially for public campaign areas or "solo" content. I do enjoy a challenge (heck, I've been going back and playing some oldies with my kids, such as Mega Man, Super Mario, and so on, and those are hard now, in my old age. I can't believe that I used to play them, much less finished them), but, a challenge implies that there is an element of skill and learning involved. Being one-shot is NOT does not constitute a challenge. I would like to personally see a widening of the level disparity so that higher level mobs present "more" of a challenge, not the "zero challenge + insta-dead" equation that we currently have. In FPS games, the challenging players are the skilled players, who use tactics and strategy as opposed to blindly running into combat areas. The same applies for classic games like chess and checkers. Skilled players use skill to overcome obstacles. Here, the mobs in IWD are just as unskilled as those in the Black lake District.... They just have a perma quad-damage.

The second issue: the stat (penalty) curve. I just don't get it. It goes against all instinctive common sense about increasing level, and is just straight up confusing. You gain power, gain power, gain power all the way to level 60, but from 60-70 you lose power? I'm still not clear on how it works, so please don't berate me if I have it wrong.

And for the love of all that's sacred, please stop messing with existing mechanics. Create content that fits in with current mechanics rather then completely reworking mechanics to fit in with the content.

nehemiah217

And for the record.... I played through most of Rothe Valley with my DC up to the night before mod6 went live. I was trying to get to 60, but made it to 56 I think. The next morning I logged on and finished Rothe Valley and finished the last few dungeons. I immediately noticed the increase in difficulty, and finishing the final dungeon was a bit of a challenge with a few deaths incurred.

I love that change. A bit more of a challenge but not impossible; I'm all for it, as long as it's not completely over the top.

sockmunkey

magenubbie wrote: »

Kinda hard to feel satisfied at doing something if you can do it blindfolded. I don't want it to be the way it is either, but to return it to the facetanking gameit used to be would be just as bad. A challenge is fine, as long as it's not being made impossible like it is now.

Well I did suggest a 9 out of 10. I wouldn't consider that blindfold level easy. And while its true, I'm not really looking at this game as a means of challenging me or a means to skill building. It still needs to be entertaining. And for me, that generally means leaving a little room for forgiveness.

I don't want a single mistake to equal dead. I don't want a single build or play style to be the only viable choice. I enjoy games that are forgiving enough that I don't feel punished for being different, for playing different, or for experimenting. Id like to make a mistake, and actually have a chance to still win rather then being stomped completely because of it.

Right now, the game has little forgiveness. One mistake, one mistimed dodge, the wrong build, the wrong powers, or simply not being powerful enough, and you are dead. That is not entertainment, that is stress. Entertainment, for me, making that mistake then fighting twice as hard to recover from it. Its doing something different and unexpected and actually turning it into success. Its playing your own way and still stomping the boss. The game used to be all of that, and its not anymore.

suicidalgodot

nehemiah217 wrote: »

And for the record.... I played through most of Rothe Valley with my DC up to the night before mod6 went live. I was trying to get to 60, but made it to 56 I think. The next morning I logged on and finished Rothe Valley and finished the last few dungeons. I immediately noticed the increase in difficulty, and finishing the final dungeon was a bit of a challenge with a few deaths incurred.

I love that change. A bit more of a challenge but not impossible; I'm all for it, as long as it's not completely over the top.

...did they change stuff pre-Lvl-60??? I think not...

My opinion: Basically, I even found SpinRise OK-ish difficulty-wise. Less so entertainment-value wise. Also Shar/DR are OK-ish. IwD and WoD are tough, and cheesily so, especially the WoD lairs with the current balancing. It's doable with the prooper class and/or build and/or good gear, but it's a violation of the official "solo content doable with a companion" party line (excluding HEs, that's a diffferent thing).

And due to the red damage / blue defense balance this is not even true for all classes and trees, I find archer soloing is more a lesson in frustration tolerance for example... ...and avoiding populated instances due to lag and friendly, helpful killsteals.

Also heavily fun-reducing: The reward changes. Difficulty up three to five notches, loot down three to five notches - it's not really fun. But this is just a mention for completeness' sake, a sideline to this topic, so please don't pick that up to make this a discussion topic here.

hustin1

I tried warning them...

http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?831701-Official-Feedback-Thread-Stat-Changes&p=9954281&viewfull=1#post9954281

again...

http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?837751-New-regeneration-mechanics&p=10022811&viewfull=1#post10022811

and again...

http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?858481-Not-liking-level-73-areas-in-IWD-and-Well-of-Dragons&p=10258131&viewfull=1#post10258131

and again.

http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?858481-Not-liking-level-73-areas-in-IWD-and-Well-of-Dragons&p=10263861&viewfull=1#post10263861

It was apparently all ignored, and I wasn't the only one.

urlord283

I would like some intermediate epic DD

I think most things have stabilized except epic DDs and the dragon queen

urlord283

One more thing...

I you leave the monsters 73+ please up the rewards

They seem the same or less than what they were at lvl 60

matthiasthehun76

urlord283 wrote: »

I would like some intermediate epic DD

Definitely yes!

I think Devs should bring back the good old order, which means we start out with a learning curve, while we level up a toon, then something intermediate like skirmishes and then for the final act, the dungeons and pvp.

Currently most folks have troubles to do even a simple skirmish. That needs to change.

Game should have min games, where you can relax and do fun content and there should be the harder content, which requires more attention.

BUT altogether the 1 shot phenomenon should disappear forever, like it was a bad dream.

juleadream

I would say that Sharandar and Dread Ring are good as they are... soloable by a level 70 in decent gear but not "nap through it" easy. IWD and WoD I think should be dialed back to a 9; my GF was able to solo the dailies in Icewind Pass, my CW (who deals a LOT more damage) could not even survive an encounter with 2 polar bears. All these areas should be soloable but I agree they should not be a complete cakewalk.

T1 Dungeons I think should have the mobs dialed back to level 71, T2 should be dialed down too but still hard enough to not breeze through, and I definitely would support adding a 3rd tier (call it Legendary) with mobs at level 75.

And please for the love of whatever you hold holy, give us back in-combat regeneration and reverse the cooldown on potions.

adisonmak

matthiasthehun76 wrote: »

1 shot phenomenon should disappear forever,...

for most area yes, but not in instance i hope. any 1shot mechanic should ONLY stay in:

- certain boss skill or
- environment mechanic (not even one is qualified for 1shot as far as i concerned, consider the amount of time the warning sign given factor in min of 400ms)

that is forseeable and dodge-able and not casting too frequent. what is DoT stay as DoT.. what is 1shot intended stay as 1shot intended... the rest, nerf them to an acceptable level. Mobs should not have them except Elite or the big one like Golem.

hustin1

adisonmak wrote: »

for most area yes, but not in instance i hope. any 1shot mechanic should ONLY stay in:

- certain boss skill or
- environment mechanic (not even one is qualified for 1shot as far as i concerned, consider the amount of time the warning sign given factor in min of 400ms)

that is forseeable and dodge-able and not casting too frequent. what is DoT stay as DoT.. what is 1shot intended stay as 1shot intended... the rest, nerf them to an acceptable level. Mobs should not have them except Elite or the big one like Golem.

I disagree, mainly because of network lag. I can't count the number of times I died in eLoL because of lag, when suddenly the red area appeared at the same time as "You have been defeated!" There will always be cases when you can't dodge a red area through no fault of your own. One-shotting should never happen.

blackxxwolf3

hustin1 wrote: »

I disagree, mainly because of network lag. I can't count the number of times I died in eLoL because of lag, when suddenly the red area appeared at the same time as "You have been defeated!" There will always be cases when you can't dodge a red area through no fault of your own. One-shotting should never happen.

yeah we really cant have 1 shotting going on like this when there is such lag problems. i mean i never lagged before mod 6 i had max setting everywhere exept tiamat. now i play on min settings everywhere just to get 30 fps. where before i got 60fps. its complete bs.

suicidalgodot

adisonmak wrote: »

for most area yes, but not in instance i hope. any 1shot mechanic should ONLY stay in:

- certain boss skill or
- environment mechanic (not even one is qualified for 1shot as far as i concerned, consider the amount of time the warning sign given factor in min of 400ms)

that is forseeable and dodge-able and not casting too frequent. what is DoT stay as DoT.. what is 1shot intended stay as 1shot intended... the rest, nerf them to an acceptable level. Mobs should not have them except Elite or the big one like Golem.

400ms client side - yes.

400ms server side? My ping is 180 at good times, 400-ish at bad and on average somewhere around 250ms - not counting lag-spikes. No cookies. Even with the 180 it'd be a close call for ca. 50% of young people, and that's not counting delays due to whatever magic or bug causes some chars like the SW or in sometimes the Pally to have horrendously delayed reactions. I'm sure I'm not the only one having this kind of ISP, and no, it's beyound my influence - unless someone cares to give me a 6-digit sun to get our village connected to modern telecommunictions standards...

Different story if things like foreseeable, triggered events specific to certain combats are considered, though a wee more would be nice. I do have _real_ problems with e.g. the LoL bossfight meteor phase due to that.

I do agree with the general gist, though, regarding OSK as a not-challenge but annoyance - outside bossfights.


Oh, premark to the "Can't care for everybody" people: I know that, actually knew that decades before before you graciously told me. Extend your keyboard life and save yourselves and me that remark...

methecsgod

Absolutely not. When difficulty is concerned, overreacting is better than underachieving.

phoenix1021

Try dodging a 1-hit-kill with a guardian or paladin. And don't tell me to block, my devotion paladin only blocks 30% damage, that does nothing in dungeons. Soulforged are mandatory right now, and that can't be right.

burkaanc

suicidalgodot wrote: »

400ms client side - yes.

400ms server side? My ping is 180 at good times, 400-ish at bad and on average somewhere around 250ms - not counting lag-spikes. No cookies. Even with the 180 it'd be a close call for ca.

then some some decent connection i have 170~200 and i live on the other side of the world from servers

phoenix1021 wrote: »

Try dodging a 1-hit-kill with a guardian or paladin. And don't tell me to block, my devotion paladin only blocks 30% damage, that does nothing in dungeons. Soulforged are mandatory right now, and that can't be right.

there are 2 sticks growing out of your characters *** those are called legs, use them to move