I am sure like other locks, I was leveling up Vampiric Embrace practically never left my hot bar. Well, today someone showed off something and I never considered it, and now I have replaced Vampiric Embrace, at least with the concept of my temptation warlock as it stands now. I replaced Vampiric Embrace with Blades of the Vanquished Army, and not only has my killing speed gone up my survivability is not 100% dependent on hitting that one cursed target but instead I am getting health back from mass groups of targets making my melee survival much better.
All in all, if I were to wager it I'd say for temptation warlock's at level 60 anyways, you will want Blades more than Vampiric for most fights except maybe single target, and even then single target you would probably prefer the Blades. Experimenting more to find out, but yea, stop leaning on the crutch of Vampiric and give it a whirl.
I haven't reached level 60 yet, but just by game play mechanics, I was also leaning towards dots and aoe as a better way to gain healing back. It's more of a constant than one big restoration. One reason why I went with Deadly Curse since it adds a dot to every curse I throw out, meaning that it will bring back damage and healing while I focus on other skills.
I wasn't going to take this skill at first unless I had bonus points but now I am really wanting to try it out on my Temptation build.
I am sure like other locks, I was leveling up Vampiric Embrace practically never left my hot bar. Well, today someone showed off something and I never considered it, and now I have replaced Vampiric Embrace, at least with the concept of my temptation warlock as it stands now. I replaced Vampiric Embrace with Blades of the Vanquished Army, and not only has my killing speed gone up my survivability is not 100% dependent on hitting that one cursed target but instead I am getting health back from mass groups of targets making my melee survival much better.
All in all, if I were to wager it I'd say for temptation warlock's at level 60 anyways, you will want Blades more than Vampiric for most fights except maybe single target, and even then single target you would probably prefer the Blades. Experimenting more to find out, but yea, stop leaning on the crutch of Vampiric and give it a whirl.
I'm sure I got rid of embrace as soon as a new encounter opened up and never looked back...
A world to defend
A city to protect
innocents to save
"Why?" They ask "they hate you"
We're heroes it's what we do.
*patiently waiting on Paragon City*
If your full out temptation, youll need Vampiric for pure party + your survival.
im sure I could put something else there...but 200 / 100 % ?...Yepper..I'll be keeping VE
This is negligible and almost pointless on the whole survivability front when you actually start considering other factors. If you are using dreadtheft to begin with you've already covered that many times over. Furthermore, vampiric embrace is only 100% of the damage it causes as healing to everyone thus, unless you are a crit machine that's less than one half-assed maintained of dreadtheft.
Unless you completely ignored your life steal stat, which if you did then I suggest you stop playing warlock right now, jumping into a group of enemies will yield you many times the healing of one vampiric embrace, easily, as temptation is giving back 200% of how much your life steal rating is worth to the party. So if you are averaging say 50 health a tick that's 100 back to party members. Vampiric loses all relevance and bite by the time you reach those lofty heights of power.
There are a few boss fights that it might be good to have vampiric but even in those due to add spawns it's almost always better to have something else specifically AE specific.
If they didn't nerf the cap stone VE would have ben worth using to its full effect.
Gang Busters PvP Guild Recruiting When Mod 6 goes live Pm Me for more Info If you have any Paladin question Message Me and i will get back to you ASAP
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
None of you have mentioned the fact that the party members also get the temp hp from VE, in addition to the rather pathetic heal. This temp hp amount can vary from 6 - 20k+, which pretty much makes everyone godlike lol.
The REAL point of this ability is NOT the heal, but the temp partywide huge hp buff.
May the RNG Gods smile on you today!
Adorable Temptress - 23.4k Temptation SW
Mara Angelbane - 22k Thaum CW, Vaya Con Dios 15.2k Dragon CW.
Mara Shadowskiss - 21.5k Destroyer GWF, Mara - 17.2k Sentinel GWF
Mara Duskwalker - 15.4k Healing DC
Mara Hawkeye -14.6k HR
Mara Spiritforge - 16.9k Tanky GF
Bad Religion - 14.7k Pew Pew DC
Mara Shadowstouch,Maara - TR's
Well, blades have some cast animation time while VE is instant. Sometimes it saves me when I have an angy mob on me xD Coming closer usually a swift death for me (talking about 10+ mob btw).
I don't use both VE and blades when I have a cleric or temptation warlock in my party though, killing flames for single target, fiery bolt for quick AoE and dreatheft look more cheesy for me in that case.
I am sure like other locks, I was leveling up Vampiric Embrace practically never left my hot bar. Well, today someone showed off something and I never considered it, and now I have replaced Vampiric Embrace, at least with the concept of my temptation warlock as it stands now. I replaced Vampiric Embrace with Blades of the Vanquished Army, and not only has my killing speed gone up my survivability is not 100% dependent on hitting that one cursed target but instead I am getting health back from mass groups of targets making my melee survival much better.
All in all, if I were to wager it I'd say for temptation warlock's at level 60 anyways, you will want Blades more than Vampiric for most fights except maybe single target, and even then single target you would probably prefer the Blades. Experimenting more to find out, but yea, stop leaning on the crutch of Vampiric and give it a whirl.
Even as a full Temptation build (I suppose I should go ahead and write a guide at some point) I dropped VE very early on. In epics I have been consistently outhealing the DC (which highlights the need for DC's to receive a lot more love) due to raw damage output and a decent amount of lifesteal. In very few fights (Valindra, Fulminorax) VE might make an appearance but usually it is either Fiery Bolt or Blades.
The right to command is earned through duty, the privilege of rank is service.
Even as a full Temptation build (I suppose I should go ahead and write a guide at some point) I dropped VE very early on. In epics I have been consistently outhealing the DC (which highlights the need for DC's to receive a lot more love) due to raw damage output and a decent amount of lifesteal. In very few fights (Valindra, Fulminorax) VE might make an appearance but usually it is either Fiery Bolt or Blades.
Apparently someone doesnt understand dcs also "heal" by increasing the partys DR. A DO DC properly feated can boost the partys DR by like 60% plus damage buffs like hallowed ground and divine glow.
So, while yes they dont do a lot of RAW healing in the way a SW does they make up for it in other ways. On the other hand a SW has no debuffs really worth mentioning party wise. 5% passive dmg reduction is a joke, and 5% for using hellish rebuke is incredibly clunky to apply and keep up. We also have no real usable party dmg buff.
So while yes DC's need a buff they are nowhere near as bad heal wise as people are making out.
May the RNG Gods smile on you today!
Adorable Temptress - 23.4k Temptation SW
Mara Angelbane - 22k Thaum CW, Vaya Con Dios 15.2k Dragon CW.
Mara Shadowskiss - 21.5k Destroyer GWF, Mara - 17.2k Sentinel GWF
Mara Duskwalker - 15.4k Healing DC
Mara Hawkeye -14.6k HR
Mara Spiritforge - 16.9k Tanky GF
Bad Religion - 14.7k Pew Pew DC
Mara Shadowstouch,Maara - TR's
Apparently someone doesnt understand dcs also "heal" by increasing the partys DR. A DO DC properly feated can boost the partys DR by like 60% plus damage buffs like hallowed ground and divine glow.
So, while yes they dont do a lot of RAW healing in the way a SW does they make up for it in other ways. On the other hand a SW has no debuffs really worth mentioning party wise. 5% passive dmg reduction is a joke, and 5% for using hellish rebuke is incredibly clunky to apply and keep up. We also have no real usable party dmg buff.
So while yes DC's need a buff they are nowhere near as bad heal wise as people are making out.
Apparently someone likes to read into things and make erroneous assumptions about others...
My main is a DC, so I have at least a fairly reasonable idea of how they work. Which includes the fact that they need a serious buff. What makes the SW able to surpass most average DC's in healing ability is how much more rapidly SW's kill things. In every epic I have run with my SW I have consistently outhealed the DC's. My DC significantly increases a party's DR, my SW obviates some of that by making sure everything dies much more rapidly so every takes less damage. A good DC with a good SW is a fantastic combination.
But yes, DC's need a lot more love.
The right to command is earned through duty, the privilege of rank is service.
Apparently someone likes to read into things and make erroneous assumptions about others...
My main is a DC, so I have at least a fairly reasonable idea of how they work. Which includes the fact that they need a serious buff. What makes the SW able to surpass most average DC's in healing ability is how much more rapidly SW's kill things. In every epic I have run with my SW I have consistently outhealed the DC's. My DC significantly increases a party's DR, my SW obviates some of that by making sure everything dies much more rapidly so every takes less damage. A good DC with a good SW is a fantastic combination.
But yes, DC's need a lot more love.
As you can see from my signature I have not one but two DC's xD
And again yes we do a lot more RAW healing but we dont reduce incoming damage by anything worth mentioning. If the healing charts displayed dmg reduced w astral shield/hg/foresight/bots I would imagine they would be a lot closer.
May the RNG Gods smile on you today!
Adorable Temptress - 23.4k Temptation SW
Mara Angelbane - 22k Thaum CW, Vaya Con Dios 15.2k Dragon CW.
Mara Shadowskiss - 21.5k Destroyer GWF, Mara - 17.2k Sentinel GWF
Mara Duskwalker - 15.4k Healing DC
Mara Hawkeye -14.6k HR
Mara Spiritforge - 16.9k Tanky GF
Bad Religion - 14.7k Pew Pew DC
Mara Shadowstouch,Maara - TR's
As you can see from my signature I have not one but two DC's xD
And again yes we do a lot more RAW healing but we dont reduce incoming damage by anything worth mentioning. If the healing charts displayed dmg reduced w astral shield/hg/foresight/bots I would imagine they would be a lot closer.
It would be interesting to be able to pull more detailed data from those charts. Again, the was an SW mitigates damage is by eliminating the source of the damage rather than making people better able to take a hit.
Anecdotally, the difference between using a SW rather than a DC for healing is one of speed. A true zerging speed run with a heavily geared and DPS heavy party will be better served by the SW than the DC. The DC can certainly do it, and I had a heck of a lot of fun doing that this morning in VT right before maintenance, but the SW has a bit of an edge.
The right to command is earned through duty, the privilege of rank is service.
As you can see from my signature I have not one but two DC's xD
And again yes we do a lot more RAW healing but we dont reduce incoming damage by anything worth mentioning. If the healing charts displayed dmg reduced w astral shield/hg/foresight/bots I would imagine they would be a lot closer.
Honestly, I doubt it. Unless the SW is just not speccing right even the damage reduction from a DC isn't a huge amount and if you are playing the DC right, aka, using empowered astral shields anyways, you should be healing while preventing damage. The bonus of killing stuff faster is one thing, but the fact we put out so much healing is another.
I have to say after playing 60 temptation warlock for about half a week doing epic dungeons, I have yet to see Vampiric Embrace come back onto my bar. There has been no need for it when I can use something like Fiery Bolt in a group of adds. VE is a very weak power and even worse that it's tied to our capstone, so we really only benefit from half of it. I would love to see some kind of buff to VE, at least to the temptation line, otherwise I'm really not missing it at all. It has been one of those leveling powers and even then, I stopped using it when I got DT and FB.
But VE is one of the 2 strong encounters for PvP... Swap out with Wraiths Shadow depending on what your facing.
Really? I'd say VE is even weaker in PvP than it is in PvE... Healing debuff, low damage not much use compared to other options. I have 36k HP and that hits around 3k base meaning about 6.5k is the max it can hit. Most likely people will reduce that to around 3k. So if the max it'll heal me for is less than 1.5k then I'm pretty sure it's rather pointless on me. <_<
Too be honest it's probably the second or third worst encounter us Warlocks have, of course the worst and most fiddly to use is Cursed Bite. It's 150ft range would be nice if you didn't have to put the curse on them from 80ft anyway.
The heal + Temporary hitpoints make it a great encounter for surviving in hairy situations and some 1v1's
There have been times using the Stamina regen and low HP, i stop to hit a quick VE to have just enough to fly off to a pot.
The encounters I deal with those temp hit points don't survive a single hit let alone get me out of a hairy situation anymore. It's become a power that is just frankly, worthless end game.
The encounters I deal with those temp hit points don't survive a single hit let alone get me out of a hairy situation anymore. It's become a power that is just frankly, worthless end game.
Yeah he was talking about PvP.
Which I say again is even worse because healing and temporary hit points are reduced by 50%. I don't know what other two encounters you have on your bar however I can think of many better options for PvP. Some of which probably heal for almost as much as it anyway if you have the 20% lifesteal you can get from the 5% more spec in temptation. Also in a 1v1 being able to hit a 7-12k+ burst every 10 seconds or so is certainly better than a 4k hit and 2k heal every 10 seconds.
On the point of disagreeing the maths in DPS / HPS numbers for a 1v1 situation just doesn't add up in VE's favour with the 50% healing reduction while in combat.
Your KD looks pretty similar to my one probably would if it wasn't for the warlock bug, I play much more of a high damage but a lot riskier build using Bargain with Dread and Harrowind as my CC. I'm currently in 2 set t1 and 2 set t2 however in comparison to your Nether Mages, although I am thinking of it as an option to get it. I'm wondering what it actually procs off, is it literally only on the click of the ability? Or if you use something such as Dreadtheft / Infernal Spheres / Shadow will it act different and proc more than once. in any case it'll be at around 100-400 heal each encounter use halfed due to PvP making it 50-200 3 x every 9-13 seconds. Is it really worth the loss of tenacity on PvP sets?
I played a lot of matches with 8-10k GS while gearing up in PvP stuff and was playing with the bugged spec for a bit where in a couple of matches I was killed like 10 times in a row somehow giving me more deaths than I probably would if it started from now.
But yeah we've played the same number of matches still. (61)
Only 10 less than I have so I suppose the numbers kind of suggest the big differences between how our characters are built.
In epics I have been consistently outhealing the DC (which highlights the need for DC's to receive a lot more love)
Congratulations, you just discovered that 2+2=7. The fact that you're "outhealing the DC" doesn't prove that DCs need to heal more. At the higher end of PvE, DCs, if they're taken at all, are there to buff and debuff primarily, and healing is just there to take the pressure off. It's quite common not to take one at all.
You don't fix DCs by making them heal more. Even in just Miracle Healer and rank 7 gems, you can kick out more healing than any reasonable group needs. If they still die, it's because they're standing in too much red- and if years of MMO healing has taught us anything, it's that "you can't outheal stupid".
No, with the current state of the PvE meta, you don't fix a thing by making DCs heal more, that is simplistic, and frankly- misguided. Heck, my DC is in High Prophet, carrying a Greater Terror, and spamming Divine Glow in order to be slightly useful. Making DCs heal more will only help if you make the game require more healing.
Now, in regard to the OP:
No-one's forcing you to have it slotted. Certainly, as a Fury lock, I'd be gimping my DPS if I left it slotted all the time. I find its use massively situational (see above re: lack of need for a lot of Cleric healing). If I am sleepy or feeling lazy, I might leave it slotted, however, and just let the fight last a little longer. Everyone needs to slack off and play badly occasionally- but you shouldn't do it all the time, really.
I can see it having a place on fights where you're taking relatively large amounts of damage, and maybe where the group doesn't massively outgear the content though. There are probably legitimate reasons to slot it in PvE, as well as my own occasionally slightly less honourable one.
0
mittensofdoomMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 247Arc User
edited August 2014
As temptation, I only use VE if the party is losing too much HP too quickly. Otherwise I use Blades, Fiery Bolt, Harrowstorm
Which I say again is even worse because healing and temporary hit points are reduced by 50%. I don't know what other two encounters you have on your bar however I can think of many better options for PvP. Some of which probably heal for almost as much as it anyway if you have the 20% lifesteal you can get from the 5% more spec in temptation. Also in a 1v1 being able to hit a 7-12k+ burst every 10 seconds or so is certainly better than a 4k hit and 2k heal every 10 seconds.
On the point of disagreeing the maths in DPS / HPS numbers for a 1v1 situation just doesn't add up in VE's favour with the 50% healing reduction while in combat.
WOW 20% LIFE STEAL??? REALY??? I would love to see that much life steal, need 1400 for 10% even with 3.5k life steal u won't get that much. i realy wonder how i did got 20%.
WOW 20% LIFE STEAL??? REALY??? I would love to see that much life steal, need 1400 for 10% even with 3.5k life steal u won't get that much. i realy wonder how i did got 20%.
A 'Templock' can do 20% friarly easily. A score of 3100 is about 15% and you can get +5% from investing points into the Aura of Cruelty feat in the temptation tree.
If you really want to go overboard, One of the last boon of the ToD campaign can also give +3% life steal and the Draconic set also give a 3%? to the party I believe. slap on endless consumption and your good for business.
A 'Templock' can do 20% friarly easily. A score of 3100 is about 15% and you can get +5% from investing points into the Aura of Cruelty feat in the temptation tree.
If you really want to go overboard, One of the last boon of the ToD campaign can also give +3% life steal and the Draconic set also give a 3%? to the party I believe. slap on endless consumption and your good for business.
Wondering if some people just blatantly ignore our powers and sets in search of that silly thing called damage. So many locks I see chasing Constitution when if you really want damage you should be staring at Charisma more for crit chance and taking advantage of No Pity, No Mercy with combat Advantage bonus damage. 1.5% DPS increase is better than just 1%, after all (and that's assuming they didn't boost their severity).
Congratulations, you just discovered that 2+2=7. The fact that you're "outhealing the DC" doesn't prove that DCs need to heal more. At the higher end of PvE, DCs, if they're taken at all, are there to buff and debuff primarily, and healing is just there to take the pressure off. It's quite common not to take one at all.
You don't fix DCs by making them heal more. Even in just Miracle Healer and rank 7 gems, you can kick out more healing than any reasonable group needs. If they still die, it's because they're standing in too much red- and if years of MMO healing has taught us anything, it's that "you can't outheal stupid".
No, with the current state of the PvE meta, you don't fix a thing by making DCs heal more, that is simplistic, and frankly- misguided. Heck, my DC is in High Prophet, carrying a Greater Terror, and spamming Divine Glow in order to be slightly useful. Making DCs heal more will only help if you make the game require more healing.
So speaking of bad math, you just went to 2+2 = orange. Remember kids, when you make assumptions you make an *** out of you and umptions!
DC's need more going for them than what people perceive as their healing, as you seem to have some sense of by saying "it's quite common not to take one at all." You "fix" DC's by giving them more options as well as more power. Educating the player base about what DC's can do is a different issue altogether. Had you followed the discussion, you would have realized that your post was entirely superfluous.
The right to command is earned through duty, the privilege of rank is service.
Wondering if some people just blatantly ignore our powers and sets in search of that silly thing called damage. So many locks I see chasing Constitution when if you really want damage you should be staring at Charisma more for crit chance and taking advantage of No Pity, No Mercy with combat Advantage bonus damage. 1.5% DPS increase is better than just 1%, after all (and that's assuming they didn't boost their severity).
How are you figuring 1.5%?
Just curious, at base crit severity of 75 it would be 0.75% from crit chance and I honestly have no idea how to calculate the combat advantage bonus + No Pitty, No Mercy...
Does Aura of Cruelty still increase your life steal? I tried it recently, but it didn't show up on my paperdoll stats..
It's a flat 5% onto the end %. You'll see the increase on the actual % number. If it was 5% increase to the lifesteal stat I wouldn't bother with it as it'd probably only increase the % by 0.3% or so for me. Basically because it isn't on the diminishing returns there isn't really any reason for a temptation warlock not to get it.
Just curious, at base crit severity of 75 it would be 0.75% from crit chance and I honestly have no idea how to calculate the combat advantage bonus + No Pitty, No Mercy...
idk about how he figures no pity, no mercy into that but i get different results from calcing crit vs dam. going by the results, damage seems to be worth more at the same severity. things change when u consider perfect vorpal though.
1000 dam x 30 hits x 1.75 crit sev + 1000 dam x 70 hits = 122,500 total damage
+4% crit
1000 dam x 34 hits x 1.75 crit sev + 1000 dam x 66 hits = 125,500
net gain = 3,000
+4% dam
(1000 dam x 30 hits x 1.75 crit sev + 1000 dam x 70 hits) x 1.04 = 127,400
net gain = 4,900
Comments
I wasn't going to take this skill at first unless I had bonus points but now I am really wanting to try it out on my Temptation build.
I'm sure I got rid of embrace as soon as a new encounter opened up and never looked back...
A city to protect
innocents to save
"Why?" They ask "they hate you"
We're heroes it's what we do.
*patiently waiting on Paragon City*
This is negligible and almost pointless on the whole survivability front when you actually start considering other factors. If you are using dreadtheft to begin with you've already covered that many times over. Furthermore, vampiric embrace is only 100% of the damage it causes as healing to everyone thus, unless you are a crit machine that's less than one half-assed maintained of dreadtheft.
Unless you completely ignored your life steal stat, which if you did then I suggest you stop playing warlock right now, jumping into a group of enemies will yield you many times the healing of one vampiric embrace, easily, as temptation is giving back 200% of how much your life steal rating is worth to the party. So if you are averaging say 50 health a tick that's 100 back to party members. Vampiric loses all relevance and bite by the time you reach those lofty heights of power.
There are a few boss fights that it might be good to have vampiric but even in those due to add spawns it's almost always better to have something else specifically AE specific.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Unless you're full Temptation it's a pretty worthless encounter.
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder
I am full temptation and I prefer to use other things.
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder
The REAL point of this ability is NOT the heal, but the temp partywide huge hp buff.
Mara Angelbane - 22k Thaum CW, Vaya Con Dios 15.2k Dragon CW.
Mara Shadowskiss - 21.5k Destroyer GWF, Mara - 17.2k Sentinel GWF
Mara Duskwalker - 15.4k Healing DC
Mara Hawkeye -14.6k HR
Mara Spiritforge - 16.9k Tanky GF
Bad Religion - 14.7k Pew Pew DC
Mara Shadowstouch,Maara - TR's
I don't use both VE and blades when I have a cleric or temptation warlock in my party though, killing flames for single target, fiery bolt for quick AoE and dreatheft look more cheesy for me in that case.
WTB Class Reroll please
Even as a full Temptation build (I suppose I should go ahead and write a guide at some point) I dropped VE very early on. In epics I have been consistently outhealing the DC (which highlights the need for DC's to receive a lot more love) due to raw damage output and a decent amount of lifesteal. In very few fights (Valindra, Fulminorax) VE might make an appearance but usually it is either Fiery Bolt or Blades.
Apparently someone doesnt understand dcs also "heal" by increasing the partys DR. A DO DC properly feated can boost the partys DR by like 60% plus damage buffs like hallowed ground and divine glow.
So, while yes they dont do a lot of RAW healing in the way a SW does they make up for it in other ways. On the other hand a SW has no debuffs really worth mentioning party wise. 5% passive dmg reduction is a joke, and 5% for using hellish rebuke is incredibly clunky to apply and keep up. We also have no real usable party dmg buff.
So while yes DC's need a buff they are nowhere near as bad heal wise as people are making out.
Mara Angelbane - 22k Thaum CW, Vaya Con Dios 15.2k Dragon CW.
Mara Shadowskiss - 21.5k Destroyer GWF, Mara - 17.2k Sentinel GWF
Mara Duskwalker - 15.4k Healing DC
Mara Hawkeye -14.6k HR
Mara Spiritforge - 16.9k Tanky GF
Bad Religion - 14.7k Pew Pew DC
Mara Shadowstouch,Maara - TR's
Apparently someone likes to read into things and make erroneous assumptions about others...
My main is a DC, so I have at least a fairly reasonable idea of how they work. Which includes the fact that they need a serious buff. What makes the SW able to surpass most average DC's in healing ability is how much more rapidly SW's kill things. In every epic I have run with my SW I have consistently outhealed the DC's. My DC significantly increases a party's DR, my SW obviates some of that by making sure everything dies much more rapidly so every takes less damage. A good DC with a good SW is a fantastic combination.
But yes, DC's need a lot more love.
As you can see from my signature I have not one but two DC's xD
And again yes we do a lot more RAW healing but we dont reduce incoming damage by anything worth mentioning. If the healing charts displayed dmg reduced w astral shield/hg/foresight/bots I would imagine they would be a lot closer.
Mara Angelbane - 22k Thaum CW, Vaya Con Dios 15.2k Dragon CW.
Mara Shadowskiss - 21.5k Destroyer GWF, Mara - 17.2k Sentinel GWF
Mara Duskwalker - 15.4k Healing DC
Mara Hawkeye -14.6k HR
Mara Spiritforge - 16.9k Tanky GF
Bad Religion - 14.7k Pew Pew DC
Mara Shadowstouch,Maara - TR's
It would be interesting to be able to pull more detailed data from those charts. Again, the was an SW mitigates damage is by eliminating the source of the damage rather than making people better able to take a hit.
Anecdotally, the difference between using a SW rather than a DC for healing is one of speed. A true zerging speed run with a heavily geared and DPS heavy party will be better served by the SW than the DC. The DC can certainly do it, and I had a heck of a lot of fun doing that this morning in VT right before maintenance, but the SW has a bit of an edge.
Honestly, I doubt it. Unless the SW is just not speccing right even the damage reduction from a DC isn't a huge amount and if you are playing the DC right, aka, using empowered astral shields anyways, you should be healing while preventing damage. The bonus of killing stuff faster is one thing, but the fact we put out so much healing is another.
Really? I'd say VE is even weaker in PvP than it is in PvE... Healing debuff, low damage not much use compared to other options. I have 36k HP and that hits around 3k base meaning about 6.5k is the max it can hit. Most likely people will reduce that to around 3k. So if the max it'll heal me for is less than 1.5k then I'm pretty sure it's rather pointless on me. <_<
Too be honest it's probably the second or third worst encounter us Warlocks have, of course the worst and most fiddly to use is Cursed Bite. It's 150ft range would be nice if you didn't have to put the curse on them from 80ft anyway.
A Playlist of my CO PvP video's
The encounters I deal with those temp hit points don't survive a single hit let alone get me out of a hairy situation anymore. It's become a power that is just frankly, worthless end game.
Yeah he was talking about PvP.
Which I say again is even worse because healing and temporary hit points are reduced by 50%. I don't know what other two encounters you have on your bar however I can think of many better options for PvP. Some of which probably heal for almost as much as it anyway if you have the 20% lifesteal you can get from the 5% more spec in temptation. Also in a 1v1 being able to hit a 7-12k+ burst every 10 seconds or so is certainly better than a 4k hit and 2k heal every 10 seconds.
On the point of disagreeing the maths in DPS / HPS numbers for a 1v1 situation just doesn't add up in VE's favour with the 50% healing reduction while in combat.
A Playlist of my CO PvP video's
I played a lot of matches with 8-10k GS while gearing up in PvP stuff and was playing with the bugged spec for a bit where in a couple of matches I was killed like 10 times in a row somehow giving me more deaths than I probably would if it started from now.
But yeah we've played the same number of matches still. (61)
Only 10 less than I have so I suppose the numbers kind of suggest the big differences between how our characters are built.
A Playlist of my CO PvP video's
Congratulations, you just discovered that 2+2=7. The fact that you're "outhealing the DC" doesn't prove that DCs need to heal more. At the higher end of PvE, DCs, if they're taken at all, are there to buff and debuff primarily, and healing is just there to take the pressure off. It's quite common not to take one at all.
You don't fix DCs by making them heal more. Even in just Miracle Healer and rank 7 gems, you can kick out more healing than any reasonable group needs. If they still die, it's because they're standing in too much red- and if years of MMO healing has taught us anything, it's that "you can't outheal stupid".
No, with the current state of the PvE meta, you don't fix a thing by making DCs heal more, that is simplistic, and frankly- misguided. Heck, my DC is in High Prophet, carrying a Greater Terror, and spamming Divine Glow in order to be slightly useful. Making DCs heal more will only help if you make the game require more healing.
Now, in regard to the OP:
No-one's forcing you to have it slotted. Certainly, as a Fury lock, I'd be gimping my DPS if I left it slotted all the time. I find its use massively situational (see above re: lack of need for a lot of Cleric healing). If I am sleepy or feeling lazy, I might leave it slotted, however, and just let the fight last a little longer. Everyone needs to slack off and play badly occasionally- but you shouldn't do it all the time, really.
I can see it having a place on fights where you're taking relatively large amounts of damage, and maybe where the group doesn't massively outgear the content though. There are probably legitimate reasons to slot it in PvE, as well as my own occasionally slightly less honourable one.
WOW 20% LIFE STEAL??? REALY??? I would love to see that much life steal, need 1400 for 10% even with 3.5k life steal u won't get that much. i realy wonder how i did got 20%.
A 'Templock' can do 20% friarly easily. A score of 3100 is about 15% and you can get +5% from investing points into the Aura of Cruelty feat in the temptation tree.
If you really want to go overboard, One of the last boon of the ToD campaign can also give +3% life steal and the Draconic set also give a 3%? to the party I believe. slap on endless consumption and your good for business.
Axios Guild Officer,
Wondering if some people just blatantly ignore our powers and sets in search of that silly thing called damage. So many locks I see chasing Constitution when if you really want damage you should be staring at Charisma more for crit chance and taking advantage of No Pity, No Mercy with combat Advantage bonus damage. 1.5% DPS increase is better than just 1%, after all (and that's assuming they didn't boost their severity).
So speaking of bad math, you just went to 2+2 = orange. Remember kids, when you make assumptions you make an *** out of you and umptions!
DC's need more going for them than what people perceive as their healing, as you seem to have some sense of by saying "it's quite common not to take one at all." You "fix" DC's by giving them more options as well as more power. Educating the player base about what DC's can do is a different issue altogether. Had you followed the discussion, you would have realized that your post was entirely superfluous.
How are you figuring 1.5%?
Just curious, at base crit severity of 75 it would be 0.75% from crit chance and I honestly have no idea how to calculate the combat advantage bonus + No Pitty, No Mercy...
Axios Guild Officer,
It's a flat 5% onto the end %. You'll see the increase on the actual % number. If it was 5% increase to the lifesteal stat I wouldn't bother with it as it'd probably only increase the % by 0.3% or so for me. Basically because it isn't on the diminishing returns there isn't really any reason for a temptation warlock not to get it.
A Playlist of my CO PvP video's
idk about how he figures no pity, no mercy into that but i get different results from calcing crit vs dam. going by the results, damage seems to be worth more at the same severity. things change when u consider perfect vorpal though.