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TR's Main At-Will animation...
brun2000
Member Posts: 244 Arc User
Hello,
I have noticed that tr's have a special problem hitting with Sly Flourish on moving targets and after comparing them to the other classes, I found out that it is.
The animation throws you quite far and fast (simulating the stab animation) but the problem is that when the animation finishes, you stay in place without moving quite long compared to every other close range class.
GWF's can attack quite easily moving targets because they can cancel the animation quickly and the pause is really short.
This is how every other class should behave.
GF's have a similar attack and HR's have an easy time with it.
What I ask is a rework of the animation because it just does not seem fair on how hard it is to hit moving targets when you are a close range class.
Considering ranged classes have auto-following projectiles, I think its not asking for much on this.
Thank you.
I have noticed that tr's have a special problem hitting with Sly Flourish on moving targets and after comparing them to the other classes, I found out that it is.
The animation throws you quite far and fast (simulating the stab animation) but the problem is that when the animation finishes, you stay in place without moving quite long compared to every other close range class.
GWF's can attack quite easily moving targets because they can cancel the animation quickly and the pause is really short.
This is how every other class should behave.
GF's have a similar attack and HR's have an easy time with it.
What I ask is a rework of the animation because it just does not seem fair on how hard it is to hit moving targets when you are a close range class.
Considering ranged classes have auto-following projectiles, I think its not asking for much on this.
Thank you.
Post edited by brun2000 on
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Comments
sly is not TRs main at will you should never use it
Why not its hits easier then Df,which anyone can doge easy.If you take Mocking Knave it dose more dmg then Df.I can out dmg other TR with my SF then them using DF and if they doge I'm not stuck hitting air for a few seconds.GC way to slow and only dose good dmg if there low on HP,which by then there easily killed most of the time.
But back to the OP,yes your right on that.When i use Deft Strike I see most classes turn and hit me in seconds.But on TR using SF they keep atking straight ahead for 1 or 2 atks then turn.
Any good TR using DF will always beat the living **** out of a Sly TR.
Any good TR using DF will always do better against CWs than a Sly TR.
Any good TR using DF will always do better against GWFs than a Sly TR.
Any good TR using DF will always do better against GFs than a Sly TR.
Any good TR using DF will always do better against HRs than a Sly TR.
Any good TR using DF will always do better against DCs than a Sly TR.
Any good TR using DF will always do better against *whatever class will come up in the next 20 years* than a Sly TR.
We are always looking for new models --- Borderline Fashiondolls ---
That said, when you're fighting PvE stuff that dies before you finish the third strike of DF, all you're doing is wasting time (unless they're clumpy enough that you can switch targets quickly), and it can be worth slotting something else on one button, including SF, reserving DF for things that are worth getting into the full rotation on.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
Yes it is superior....at missing lmao.You say only newbie use Sly Flourish,your dead wrong there it's the other way around.Newbies see how many times it hits and go crazy thinking it's great.Then cry in pvp because they cant hit with it.
On average i only get hit 1 maybe 2 times by it. (and that's because I'm fight 2-3 people)the other times I'm lmao at them hitting air.
Try this go to the dummies in trade and blade,put Lashing Blade,Sly Flourish, and Duelist's Flurry.Use lashing blade (that starts a countdown) at 15 start Duelist's Flurry ( see the # it stops at ) look at damage.Then do it again but use Sly Flourish (remember the # df stopped at and stop Sky there)you'd see that the damage is close.Now that's with out someone dodging the 3rd hit to,which would make the damage from DF a lot less.
Right now people think Duelist's Flurry is good because GWF don't dodge it.Come mod 4 and there weaker they will.Only two classes don't have dodges GWF and GF.All the other will dodge DF and GWF will just use start running and come in be hide the stuck TR hitting air, then stun.
OP-It's not the animation,It's the moving part.They need to make it where you move foreword like the animation and not stay still.Which stops some times.Normal you do move foreword but some times you just stop and will not move foreword, no matter how long you hold the button down.
Any good TR using DF will always do better against CWs than a Sly TR.Wrong, they can teleport and if done right have unlimited.Most TR win because of ITC.
Any good TR using DF will always do better against GWFs than a Sly TR.Wrong,they don't need to doge just kill df or sky tr in 2-3 hits.
Any good TR using DF will always do better against GFs than a Sly TR.Wrong,just block then stun lock TR,then repeat.
Any good TR using DF will always do better against HRs than a Sly TR.Very wrong,ummm did you know they have six dodges and can hit as hard as a GWF?
Any good TR using DF will always do better against DCs than a Sly TR.Wrong, just slide and most good DC are tanks so DF or sky will have a hard time.But the shy one will not be wasting time missing.
It's not Df or sky the wins,It's who's better/gear that wins the fight.
Any good TR using DF will always beat the living **** out of a Sly TR. I'd like to see that.No stealth,no other atk's,even gear.Just DF vs sky TR with dodges.I'd put good money on the sky TR for the next 50 year.
Because I really don't think you do, if you think SF can compete at all in damage. SF isn't that much faster than DF to get off when I tried it again recently on preview to see if I could get a semi-decent PvE Scoundrel build(no).
I used to use Sly Flourish. Unsurprisingly my damage was pants compared to the 20 million other TRs were pulling back then with careful management of DF bleed stacks(This was back in the glory days before they nerfed DF and nearly everything else along with it). I was one of those people who tried out DF for a couple of minutes on weak-*** enemies and thought it was too slow and went back to SF. Then later I gave it another shot except actually used it this time and yeah, it's about a billion times better. And I started using it regularly AFTER they nerfed it. It's still better. It's really not that hard to hit with if you aren't a moron. No, not even in PvP.
For PVE there is no contest tho, DF all the way!
Many good CW are complacent and so full of themselves and will FACETANK Sly Flourish, just because it's not DF, laughing at the TR, but then not realizing they are taking damage. Then they die.
Please send me an ingame message to @nuudlz. Thank you!
We are always looking for new models --- Borderline Fashiondolls ---
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
As it is, frankly speaking this 'problem' is not unique to SF. In actuality its a problem that infests ALL melees classes with ALL their melee powers in one way or another in the fact that essentially, any action in game self-roots you in place, and only allows whatever forward motion that is inherent in the attack animation. This is common occurrence for ranged as well, but taking into the "gun > knife" ranged advantage logic into equation, it most deeply impacts melees rather than ranged.
Fortunately for the two fighter classes GF and GWF, many of their traits simply offset this problem so none of them ever really recognize it. I won't list down just what makes it so easy for GFs and GWFs, but I will mention that NW is very unfriendly to melees in general, and this difficulty in hitting melee attacks against enemies with shift, dodge, teleport and etc etc.. has actually driven the TRs into basically building upto either a full ranged class or a melee-ranged hybrid class.
To sum it up all melee powers TRs use are...
The moment stealth finishes, and a TR has no re-stealth tool, it is CCd, hurt, can't close distance to its target, all its melee attacks fail to land, and then get CCd again and rinse and repeat until it drops dead after having accomplished nothing. Literally nothing's possible. Any one shift/dodge/teleport and there's nothing the TR can hit the target with. It's less than 20' away the enemy has moved, and the moment you take one step toward it you're CCd. Even if you close distance and start swinging, your at-will attack combos land like.. what.. once? dealing maybe 1.5~2k damage? The target isn't even using any special escpae power, it's simply back peddaling, and still you can't hurt it with any of your melee at-wills. You actually have a better chance doing damage by jump-attack1-jump-attack1-jump-....
Like said, this happens to all melees, except the TRs are hit by it worst, whereas GF/GWFs have been given goodies that overcompensate this inherent disadvantage in the "gun > knife" logic. So in the end, the "Trickster Rogue", a light-melee class that is supposed to have an arsenal of CCs and utilities to fight technically and keep enemies at bay, are reduced to walking sand-bags that can't hit the broad side of the barn unless they use stealth to hop around with DF while people are confined to that small node circle, or simply throw knives.
Hence, people just give up the melee aspect and go stealth+ranged. I don't even really count jump/hop DFs as real melee methods, since most of its use is simply limited as an ambush tool while in stealth
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Not so in PVP.
In PVP the correct equation for optimal damage will be as follows, assuming equal duration of use:
(At will Damage) X (Frequency of when you are in position to actually use it) X (Frequency of landing it)
This is almost totally dependent on two things ... the user's ability with DF and the opponent's savvy and dodging ability. Therefore, if you are not proficient with DF and/or are facing opponents that you have great difficulty landing it, there are darn good reasons to use SF and many cases in which it will be optimal.
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