adinosiiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,294Arc User
edited July 2014
well, for DCs, the Empire set's 20% boost to healing is a nice addition in some circumstances - the empire set may well replace the Miracle Healer set in situations where healing is needed. What I would however really like to see would be a viable upgrade to the HP set for buffing purposes - even something that has the same bonus as HP but higher stats.
The simple fact is that for high-end groups, healing is a secondary function - buffing/debuffing is primary (and strange as it sounds - buffing may actually lead to increased healing - by making the DPSers do more damage, we increase the heals they get from Life Steal). The problem is that while DCs have a variety of sets that help with healing, there is only one set that helps with their primary function - buffing and debuffing.
I hope we get a viable upgrade for HP in Module 5, but I am afraid we will get yet another healing set and HP will get nerfed - resulting in DCs finally becoming totally unwanted in high-end groups.
Hoping for improvements...
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aaablacklady9Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 81Arc User
edited July 2014
uhm uhm why we don't nerf too TR pvp armor set? Or Avatar of war armor of GWF? Is thx to Dc whit that debuff armor if some player can close the dungeon. As allways, let's break the armor that work better for a class, because someone else is cring about it. Nerf T1 Dc armor will simply make all the Dc stop play, since all the other set ARE PURE **** on pve. Simply give us an hello kitty pink armor whit a 4/4 bonus that let us dance each time we use an at-will power and a 2/4 bonus in regeneration. Really, all the armor set above the T1 are pure ****, the only 1 worth to have it is the MH, even that purifed black ice is a pure **** on pve.
I play my cw with mix sets, and i do pretty well, set helps, but player skill works better.
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silverkeltMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,235Arc User
edited July 2014
There just isnt any reason for the # of sets they distributed to start with, There are so many useless, redundant sets for all classes that no one uses anyways.
They just keep adding on, with a slow power creep in base stats, but less effective set bonuses, power creep also hits against diminishing returns, so eventaully you have no use to slot higher stat gear.
I have to say I love my black ice for pvp purposes, but for pve, ya, I go back to HV , for dailies sometimes I just around in profound, kinda like the speed tab slot.
But thats it, thats all you need, how many sets do you want us to carry around? I have Black Ice, HV and Profound THaum on my CW, on my DC HP, MH and Profound and a few pieces of black ice to get into kessells, GWF I only really have t1 and t2 pvp sets , some black ice and a couple of AOW, because Ive run FH and Karrundux like 20 times with no Armour drops because of thier bugs. MY hr is just on t1 pvp set, working on t2 now, then whatever crappy pve set im supposed to have, then some black ice to get into kessells.. it never ends. Other games you evnetually raise level and clear all this HAMSTER out honestly, if they never raise level and give us 6 new dungeons, Ill just keep having less and less space to deal with.
I simply DO not want to keep grinding out gear that is just static to put it in ever dwindling bag space (egads why isnt the black ice pick a profession item?)
Nerfing the best sets for all the classes seem a little off to me, the other hand of this is Cryptic doesnt do slight adjustments, if they got the hands on this stuff you know it will be nerfed to near useless, thats what they do.
These 2 armor sets are and remain simply the best choice for any mid-endgame Cleric and Wizard because their bonus effectively increases party damage by 30% each.
In order to make other armor sets competitive and to stop making PvE content so trivial, I would strongly recommend reducing the bonus such that each High Prophet Stack shreds 3% defense (down from 10%) and High Vizier no longer stacks up to 3 times -> 1 stack of 250 defense only.
This would go a long way towards making PvE content less trivial, other armor sets viable and reduce reliance on "must have" class builds in a party.
No, absolutely not.
Please do not ask for more nerfs, particularly for DC's (who need some love) and CW's (who are about to lose a latge piece of their damage in the coming module).
These armor sets and their bonuses are absolutely fine as they are.
The right to command is earned through duty, the privilege of rank is service.
If you want PvE to be "less trivial" then equip yourself with a bunch of Green Gear. WTF would you want to punish *everyone else* just to satisfy your own personal preferences. You want a nerf? No one is stopping you from neutering yourself and leaving the rest of the Neverwinter population out of it.
The 'greater-than-thou' attitudes some people have is beyond laughable, it's downright dangerous.
Neverwinter community - where a nerf is considered an offense.
Today you do boss fights 100% sure you're going to kill the boss. Using green gear means "okay I'll take it easy with you"; PvE needs challenging content, we want to think AND DO OUR BEST to kill the bosses, then we can be proud of doing so.
HP and HV together increase the damage you deal to the boss by about 50%; it's like having 2 more characters in the party doing damage, and this is a SET BONUS. How in the hell is the Magelord, Beacon of Faith or whatever set going to be a choice for high-end players with this around?
You guys see nerfs as "holy s*** I so want to see this thing useless and unused".
Please do not ask for more nerfs, particularly for DC's (who need some love) and CW's (who are about to lose a latge piece of their damage in the coming module).
It's not a nerf for a class. It's a nerf for 4 itens.
If that makes any difference you can give a buff for the class for nerfing those sets, increase the effectiveness of RoE and BtS for example, but just make these classes be more independent.
High Prophet isn't turning any DC into a killing machine, and the set bonus helps the whole party, so why would somebody want to take that away? Especially from a class that is currently (and has been for a long time) the second weakest and might already struggle to get through solo content in reasonable time.
Please, just stop. Let's reconsider tuning it down if DCs ever get a decent boost, but not before that.
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aaablacklady9Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 81Arc User
Neverwinter community - where a nerf is considered an offense.
Today you do boss fights 100% sure you're going to kill the boss. Using green gear means "okay I'll take it easy with you"; PvE needs challenging content, we want to think AND DO OUR BEST to kill the bosses, then we can be proud of doing so.
HP and HV together increase the damage you deal to the boss by about 50%; it's like having 2 more characters in the party doing damage, and this is a SET BONUS. How in the hell is the Magelord, Beacon of Faith or whatever set going to be a choice for high-end players with this around?
You guys see nerfs as "holy s*** I so want to see this thing useless and unused".
It gets even better when you have both.
It's not a nerf for a class. It's a nerf for 4 itens.
If that makes any difference you can give a buff for the class for nerfing those sets, increase the effectiveness of RoE and BtS for example, but just make these classes be more independent.
Only becuse is too easy, this not mean they have to nerf good item because you are bored. Play something else if you are bored and stop ask for nerf
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adinosiiMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,294Arc User
Please, just stop. Let's reconsider tuning it down if DCs ever get a decent boost, but not before that.
If we were for example to get a good "buffing/debuffing" set in Module 5, I don't think people would complain about HP being nerfed at that time- but currently it is just about the only thing that makes DCs really wanted.
Empire set in Module 4, with its 20% heal bonus might be a working replacement for MH, but as I have said multiple times, DCs really need a viable upgrade for HP - there is something wrong when a T1 set is the most popular when running T2.5 content.
These 2 armor sets are and remain simply the best choice for any mid-endgame Cleric and Wizard because their bonus effectively increases party damage by 30% each.
In order to make other armor sets competitive and to stop making PvE content so trivial, I would strongly recommend reducing the bonus such that each High Prophet Stack shreds 3% defense (down from 10%) and High Vizier no longer stacks up to 3 times -> 1 stack of 250 defense only.
This would go a long way towards making PvE content less trivial, other armor sets viable and reduce reliance on "must have" class builds in a party.
Sure why not?
How about making new harder dungeons instead of nerfing all around?
(T2, CN)There are almost 1,5 year old dungeons designed for 10-12k GS and you are wondering why are they so "trivial" to that much overgeared ppl(15-17k GS; mod1-3 bonuses, artifacts, pets bonuses etc)...?
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nwnghostMember, Moderators, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
These 2 armor sets are and remain simply the best choice for any mid-endgame Cleric and Wizard because their bonus effectively increases party damage by 30% each.
In order to make other armor sets competitive and to stop making PvE content so trivial, I would strongly recommend reducing the bonus such that each High Prophet Stack shreds 3% defense (down from 10%) and High Vizier no longer stacks up to 3 times -> 1 stack of 250 defense only.
This would go a long way towards making PvE content less trivial, other armor sets viable and reduce reliance on "must have" class builds in a party.
No, please no nerfs to existing sets. Buffs to lackluster sets, certainly. But please don't ask for things to be taken away from players.
The right to command is earned through duty, the privilege of rank is service.
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nwnghostMember, Moderators, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited October 2014
Glyphs are getting fixed (nerfed as some may say) with Mod5 so you won't be nearly as amazing in damage output with them. Do remember that Gylph damage is also boosted by having someone in your party with High Prophet or High Vizier.
As for making numbers up, I'd appreciate if you didn't make nonsense arguments up. Read kaelac's guide if you don't believe that they grant a 30% damage boost to the entire party. More if other debuffs are also on the target due to the way debuffs stack.
As for buffing existing sets, its fairly clear that no buff to existing or new sets will make them better than either of these 2 sets, short of making them do the same but even better. These 2 sets are the odd ones out in terms of game item balance, and once you have them, they make other content trivial.
Glyphs are getting fixed (nerfed as some may say) with Mod5 so you won't be nearly as amazing in damage output with them.
Glyphs are barely 4-11% damage depending on build and situation Glyph damage is NOT boosted by having someone with debuffs lol, they do 600 damage and that is it.
They will be fixed to respect DR and dodging etc.
But I already stack 24% ArP overcoming mob defenses and mobs do NOT dodge, block etc.
Glyph PvE damage will remain largely UNCHANGED.
The huge amount of damage people can push is from Power stacking and chaining dailies on 20-30 mobs, i.e. door to door pulls.
Nerfing 2 sets accomplishes nothing. People in this game are already so powerful in PvE it won't matter a bit.
I know your intentions are good, but this one suggestion won't be working.
You wanna know the solution to the issue of stupid easy content?
RAIDS. Hard content for the very geared hardcore people.
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kieranmtornMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 382Arc User
edited October 2014
One problem I see with any Nerf to existing gear. Cryptic's track record on fixes/nerf/adjustments to over-performing things, generally wrecks them. So for HV & HP, it would mean the ruin of both sets. I'm just looking at Cryptic's batting average on nerfs (or anybody using a Greater Blue Dragon Glyph now?). I could see a reduction (1/2 effectiveness, which would reduce most CW's/Parties dps by 15% for HV), but I fear it would be far worse.
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heck62Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 11Arc User
edited October 2014
Instead of nerfing the gear,just don't use it if you think it trivializes pve content.
you dont take into consideration they are low level armor and to keep using them you have to decide not to use other powerfull items like glyphs and stats. hv is a horrible set stat-wise. both sets are good but they have their drawbacks.
Comments
The simple fact is that for high-end groups, healing is a secondary function - buffing/debuffing is primary (and strange as it sounds - buffing may actually lead to increased healing - by making the DPSers do more damage, we increase the heals they get from Life Steal). The problem is that while DCs have a variety of sets that help with healing, there is only one set that helps with their primary function - buffing and debuffing.
I hope we get a viable upgrade for HP in Module 5, but I am afraid we will get yet another healing set and HP will get nerfed - resulting in DCs finally becoming totally unwanted in high-end groups.
They just keep adding on, with a slow power creep in base stats, but less effective set bonuses, power creep also hits against diminishing returns, so eventaully you have no use to slot higher stat gear.
I have to say I love my black ice for pvp purposes, but for pve, ya, I go back to HV , for dailies sometimes I just around in profound, kinda like the speed tab slot.
But thats it, thats all you need, how many sets do you want us to carry around? I have Black Ice, HV and Profound THaum on my CW, on my DC HP, MH and Profound and a few pieces of black ice to get into kessells, GWF I only really have t1 and t2 pvp sets , some black ice and a couple of AOW, because Ive run FH and Karrundux like 20 times with no Armour drops because of thier bugs. MY hr is just on t1 pvp set, working on t2 now, then whatever crappy pve set im supposed to have, then some black ice to get into kessells.. it never ends. Other games you evnetually raise level and clear all this HAMSTER out honestly, if they never raise level and give us 6 new dungeons, Ill just keep having less and less space to deal with.
I simply DO not want to keep grinding out gear that is just static to put it in ever dwindling bag space (egads why isnt the black ice pick a profession item?)
Nerfing the best sets for all the classes seem a little off to me, the other hand of this is Cryptic doesnt do slight adjustments, if they got the hands on this stuff you know it will be nerfed to near useless, thats what they do.
No, absolutely not.
Please do not ask for more nerfs, particularly for DC's (who need some love) and CW's (who are about to lose a latge piece of their damage in the coming module).
These armor sets and their bonuses are absolutely fine as they are.
The 'greater-than-thou' attitudes some people have is beyond laughable, it's downright dangerous.
Today you do boss fights 100% sure you're going to kill the boss. Using green gear means "okay I'll take it easy with you"; PvE needs challenging content, we want to think AND DO OUR BEST to kill the bosses, then we can be proud of doing so.
HP and HV together increase the damage you deal to the boss by about 50%; it's like having 2 more characters in the party doing damage, and this is a SET BONUS. How in the hell is the Magelord, Beacon of Faith or whatever set going to be a choice for high-end players with this around?
You guys see nerfs as "holy s*** I so want to see this thing useless and unused".
It gets even better when you have both.
It's not a nerf for a class. It's a nerf for 4 itens.
If that makes any difference you can give a buff for the class for nerfing those sets, increase the effectiveness of RoE and BtS for example, but just make these classes be more independent.
Please, just stop. Let's reconsider tuning it down if DCs ever get a decent boost, but not before that.
Only becuse is too easy, this not mean they have to nerf good item because you are bored. Play something else if you are bored and stop ask for nerf
If we were for example to get a good "buffing/debuffing" set in Module 5, I don't think people would complain about HP being nerfed at that time- but currently it is just about the only thing that makes DCs really wanted.
Empire set in Module 4, with its 20% heal bonus might be a working replacement for MH, but as I have said multiple times, DCs really need a viable upgrade for HP - there is something wrong when a T1 set is the most popular when running T2.5 content.
Sure why not?
How about making new harder dungeons instead of nerfing all around?
(T2, CN)There are almost 1,5 year old dungeons designed for 10-12k GS and you are wondering why are they so "trivial" to that much overgeared ppl(15-17k GS; mod1-3 bonuses, artifacts, pets bonuses etc)...?
Mod 12.5 PvP Power/Crit/Arp Optimization
Youtube channel (PvE/PvP)
PVE content is too easy w or w/o these sets.
You realize I can slap on my Corrupted set with Red glyphs and annihilate any PvE that is currently available and do monster DPS with my 10-11K Power?
Or slap on Purified, get 2000 LS with 9K Power and solo everything with a bit less DPS?
Please, leave the T2 sets alone...
Neither of those sets increase damage by 30% by itself, by the way, stop pulling "statistics" out of your ***.
No, please no nerfs to existing sets. Buffs to lackluster sets, certainly. But please don't ask for things to be taken away from players.
As for making numbers up, I'd appreciate if you didn't make nonsense arguments up. Read kaelac's guide if you don't believe that they grant a 30% damage boost to the entire party. More if other debuffs are also on the target due to the way debuffs stack.
As for buffing existing sets, its fairly clear that no buff to existing or new sets will make them better than either of these 2 sets, short of making them do the same but even better. These 2 sets are the odd ones out in terms of game item balance, and once you have them, they make other content trivial.
Glyphs are barely 4-11% damage depending on build and situation
They will be fixed to respect DR and dodging etc.
But I already stack 24% ArP overcoming mob defenses and mobs do NOT dodge, block etc.
Glyph PvE damage will remain largely UNCHANGED.
The huge amount of damage people can push is from Power stacking and chaining dailies on 20-30 mobs, i.e. door to door pulls.
Nerfing 2 sets accomplishes nothing. People in this game are already so powerful in PvE it won't matter a bit.
I know your intentions are good, but this one suggestion won't be working.
You wanna know the solution to the issue of stupid easy content?
RAIDS. Hard content for the very geared hardcore people.