I'd love to be "tamed down" on my HR with neverending constricting arrow (thanks to stormstep action), easy near-instant 5k crits on split shot, and a fox shift that hits 4 times. You can have my extra 3k damage from careful attack.
FOTM for HR isn't Pathfinder, it's just HR. Almost everything comes from regular HR abilities, and those abilities ARE nerfed. God forbid a paragon path has ONE decent skill to add to the normal skillset (careful attack).
As for the OP, I agree with what you've said however I still think TRs are the best at contesting a node (and certainly the best at getting to the enemy node).
I noticed a CW doing this. It also seemed like his soulforged procced twice in about 15 seconds. Something is definitely up.
Old HR spec has 0 chance against new one. HRs can destroy similarly geared TRs if they know what they do in node contesting. I would prefer the old spec of HR any day instead of this auto-refreshing damage/debuff and incredibly tanky HRs. Many other people I talked to have the same opinion. Why you think GPF price went so high up? GWF and HR fotm.
I bet you're using pathfinder too on that Dawn HR of yours. Am I correct? Just curious.
As for the VT artifact, I saw it abused, yet never saw any correlation with soulforged, maybe missed it. This is the game we playing, bug and broken abilities abusing is king.
Old HR spec has 0 chance against new one. HRs can destroy similarly geared TRs if they know what they do in node contesting. I would prefer the old spec of HR any day instead of this auto-refreshing damage/debuff and incredibly tanky HRs. Many other people I talked to have the same opinion. Why you think GPF price went so high up? GWF and HR fotm.
I bet you're using pathfinder too on that Dawn HR of yours. Am I correct? Just curious.
Yes, I'm using pathfinder mostly because there's nothing left in Stormwarden worth using.
Zero chance? Why exactly? One old charged split shot was more damage than the full duration of careful attack, assuming careful attack proccs every single 1.5 seconds. Throw on a 3 second cooldown reduction every disruptive shot and a fox shift hitting 4 times and there's no way a Pathfinder HR could overcome the extra CC and damage.
And careful attack isn't even guaranteed to proc every time. Sometimes you may only get 3 procs out of it. So that's 1.5-3k extra damage.
Disruptive shot, forest ghost and aspect of the lone wolf are pretty much mandatory for pvp, so the only thing that could possibly add to the tankiness of a Pathfinder is one class trait, and neither of the viable ones are as good as a 3-second reduction on cooldowns every disruptive shot pre-nerf stormstep action offered.
As for plaguefire, I'm not even using it. I found it refreshed careful attack 1-2 extra times, and that 1-2k damage isn't worth the extra damage I get out of perfect vorpal.
I have completely lost my faith in this game. The combat system is great and always will be, but every patch just changes things for the worse. There are so many things wrong with balance and the devs clearly don't know what people even find enjoyable (tried to fix staying in match after it ends just as one example). This game was never very competitive because it always had issues but it was still fun and you could have some nice matches every once in a while. Was fun while it lasted. (mostly)
May 31st is the final nail in the coffin of nw for me Wildstar!
I have completely lost my faith in this game. The combat system is great and always will be, but every patch just changes things for the worse. There are so many things wrong with balance and the devs clearly don't know what people even find enjoyable (tried to fix staying in match after it ends just as one example). This game was never very competitive because it always had issues but it was still fun and you could have some nice matches every once in a while. Was fun while it lasted. (mostly)
May 31st is the final nail in the coffin of nw for me Wildstar!
I don't even feel bad.
Enjoy I guess. I couldn't get into Wildstar because the combat is a big step backward from Neverwinter, let alone the graphics.
I have completely lost my faith in this game. The combat system is great and always will be, but every patch just changes things for the worse. There are so many things wrong with balance and the devs clearly don't know what people even find enjoyable (tried to fix staying in match after it ends just as one example). This game was never very competitive because it always had issues but it was still fun and you could have some nice matches every once in a while. Was fun while it lasted. (mostly)
May 31st is the final nail in the coffin of nw for me Wildstar!
I don't even feel bad.
Kinda vague. It would be helpful to the discussion if you give us some examples on what you perceive to be problematic, IMO.
Stop making excuses. Be a man. If you know something to be broken, stop using it. Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
Kinda vague. It would be helpful to the discussion if you give us some examples on what you perceive to be problematic, IMO.
I guess being on the first page of the leaderboard with like a 10:1 k/d ratio isn't good enough for his rogue because HRs are a little better at putting up a fight?
Maybe daily powers should be disabled in PVP? Maybe this would make harder to kill others.
Hate to say it bud but that would be terrible. Not for me since I play a GWF but everyone else. I can't imagine holding a node and not having to worry about SE from a rogue I've been dueling with for 5 minutes, or what does a CW have to support that TR I've been playing with when he/she can't eventually drop ice knife on my dome. GF with no daily? Wouldn't even see those guys in pvp anymore...
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dragoness10Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 780Arc User
edited May 2014
TR killing HRs - I killed two the other day. What's the problem? I threw daggers after them.
Oh, and I'm still not using Smoke Bomb.
Try Dazing Strike instead of Impact Shot, and beef it up with some Wicked Reminder. Using the Wicked Reminder with a GWF backing you up you can tenderize the target, and they smash it easier.
Never depend upon one thing as a "surefire tactic". Mix it up a bit. You have to adapt since every pick up group you may get can have a different combo in classes, and some tactics work better thanothers with the presence/ absence of a certain class.
" I tried to figure out the enigma that was you, and then I realized mastering Wild Magic was easier." - Old Wizard in Waterdeep
"Why is it dragons only use ketchup? I'd like a little wasabi please. Us silvers like a variety of condiments."
"Don't call them foolish mortals. One, they don't learn from it. Two, It just ticks them off." - An Ancient Red Dragon
I guess being on the first page of the leaderboard with like a 10:1 k/d ratio isn't good enough for his rogue because HRs are a little better at putting up a fight?
Everyone knows the leaderboard means very little in the end. Some of the best players at their class in this game are wayyy off the 1st page, more like on page 50 or even lower, just because they like everyone else knows that the leaderboard is a complete joke, and it's really not worth it to care about it. What comes to HRs and GWFs being OP right now, it's not really relating to the topic at all, but I've had my eye on wildstar since January 2014 basically just waiting for it to be released. Yes it's sad that TRs have become what they are now, but even if TR was the most faceroll OP class right now it wouldn't make any difference. Faceroll OP is boring, balance is fun and challenging. I would still go to wildstar no matter what happened. Just getting bored of using the same skills over and over and having competition against the same few guilds.
I have a gwf that i used to have max gear on and blah blah (no emblem though I never went that low) so if I wanted to win 1v1s I'd just play that. Your post was obviously a bit troll.
Everyone knows what TRs are capable of and what HRs and GWFs are capable of, atm. I think the balance was very close after tenacity and mod 3 between these classes (I even made a post about it check my post history if you care) but it just got screwed with mod 3.
TL;DR I would've played wildstar anyways no matter what happens with NW and the leaderboard is a complete joke. Notable HRs and GWFs know their classes are ridiculously OP anyways and there's nothing any TR can do about it right now.
essentially imbalance makes me not want to even press the button to solo queue...
certain guild take advantages of the op classes (gwf/hr) and just run in these ridiculous team comps
it's one thing to soloqueue and get matched vs a premade, that's fine
it's another to get matched against 3 gwfs over and over... takes out any skill of winning in the game and is a joke
Everyone knows the leaderboard means very little in the end. Some of the best players at their class in this game are wayyy off the 1st page, more like on page 50 or even lower, just because they like everyone else knows that the leaderboard is a complete joke, and it's really not worth it to care about it. What comes to HRs and GWFs being OP right now, it's not really relating to the topic at all, but I've had my eye on wildstar since January 2014 basically just waiting for it to be released. Yes it's sad that TRs have become what they are now, but even if TR was the most faceroll OP class right now it wouldn't make any difference. Faceroll OP is boring, balance is fun and challenging. I would still go to wildstar no matter what happened. Just getting bored of using the same skills over and over and having competition against the same few guilds.
I have a gwf that i used to have max gear on and blah blah (no emblem though I never went that low) so if I wanted to win 1v1s I'd just play that. Your post was obviously a bit troll.
Everyone knows what TRs are capable of and what HRs and GWFs are capable of, atm. I think the balance was very close after tenacity and mod 3 between these classes (I even made a post about it check my post history if you care) but it just got screwed with mod 3.
TL;DR I would've played wildstar anyways no matter what happens with NW and the leaderboard is a complete joke. Notable HRs and GWFs know their classes are ridiculously OP anyways and there's nothing any TR can do about it right now.
I just don't get how you're killing people 10x as often as they're killing you and you feel your class is UP. If the only way you're satisfied is if you never die, then well, I don't know what to tell you. Maybe rogues could do that before, and have like a 40/1 k/d ratio. I don't think that's especially balanced though.
IMO, it was basically TR and GWF being really OP in mod 2, with HRs able to compete. Now TR and HR are about the same OP'ness and GWF is a bit above.
In any case, I don't see that dynamic changing that much and if anything I think the top 3 are closer together in OP'ness than ever before.
My only beef really is that other classes can't really compete with the top 3.
I just don't get how you're killing people 10x as often as they're killing you and you feel your class is UP. If the only way you're satisfied is if you never die, then well, I don't know what to tell you. Maybe rogues could do that before, and have like a 40/1 k/d ratio. I don't think that's especially balanced though.
IMO, it was basically TR and GWF being really OP in mod 2, with HRs able to compete. Now TR and HR are about the same OP'ness and GWF is a bit above.
In any case, I don't see that dynamic changing that much and if anything I think the top 3 are closer together in OP'ness than ever before.
My only beef really is that other classes can't really compete with the top 3.
Really... Anyone can kill pugs, but when it comes to a similarly geared and correctly built gwf/hr that is decent vs a tr the gwf/hr will ALWAYS win unless there is a huge skill difference in favor of the TR. I really don't care how I do in pugs, the only thing that matters is vs an equally geared/skilled/experienced player. Any other GWF/HR who is decently geared and experienced can get just the same K/D ratios. This should be easy to figure out on your own really..
About mod 2, hr was just as strong as tr. GWF was crazy OP. After tenacity and before mod 3 gwf and tr were on the same level and hr was a bit stronger.
Really... Anyone can kill pugs, but when it comes to a similarly geared and correctly built gwf/hr that is decent vs a tr the gwf/hr will ALWAYS win unless there is a huge skill difference in favor of the TR. I really don't care how I do in pugs, the only thing that matters is vs an equally geared/skilled/experienced player. Any other GWF/HR who is decently geared and experienced can get just the same K/D ratios. This should be easy to figure out on your own really..
About mod 2, hr was just as strong as tr. GWF was crazy OP. After tenacity and before mod 3 gwf and tr were on the same level and hr was a bit stronger.
I don't think it matters much that the top 3 shuffle as nerfs come and go. What bothers me more is the bottom 3 never become major factors.
And I don't think it's true that equal gear/skill TR can NEVER beat gwf or hr.
I think a equal gear/skill DC, GF or CW might never beat a gwf or hr. But not a TR.
Not sure why you care though since you've been set on playing Wildstar for awhile now.
My Harem: Dawn HR, Erin CW, Piper TR, Zoe GWF
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mikeym80Member, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I don't think it matters much that the top 3 shuffle as nerfs come and go. What bothers me more is the bottom 3 never become major factors.
And I don't think it's true that equal gear/skill TR can NEVER beat gwf or hr.
I think a equal gear/skill DC, GF or CW might never beat a gwf or hr. But not a TR.
Not sure why you care though since you've been set on playing Wildstar for awhile now.
Kelt played since beta and playing Wildstar doesn't diminish his knowledge on the game. Coming from one of the best TR's on this server to say "a tr can not beat an equally skilled/geared GWF/HR 1v1" should mean something. I completely back his post. By no means is it far fetched.
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mikeym80Member, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
TR killing HRs - I killed two the other day. What's the problem? I threw daggers after them.
Oh, and I'm still not using Smoke Bomb.
Try Dazing Strike instead of Impact Shot, and beef it up with some Wicked Reminder. Using the Wicked Reminder with a GWF backing you up you can tenderize the target, and they smash it easier.
Never depend upon one thing as a "surefire tactic". Mix it up a bit. You have to adapt since every pick up group you may get can have a different combo in classes, and some tactics work better thanothers with the presence/ absence of a certain class.
hexanna22Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 204Bounty Hunter
edited May 2014
I agree.
And, the matching system is the worst I have ever seen it. Even tho I have always been in good pvp guilds, I have pugged since Beta because I play odd hours, and often times even if I am on in Prime time, I need to farm quickly and cant do hour long matches all the time.
The first day, people were just melting in 1 or 2 spells from me...I would say to team, something is severely wrong with the matching system and everyone said the ELO system reset...
I didn't pvp for 5 days, come back, and even solo queing I get premades, with people on my side that have 6 and 7 K GS, or I get matched up against 5 well known pvp people who all have 15-18K GS, and my pugs are all 6 - 10 K GS.
I thought Ok, how bad can it be? If I lose a few matches, my ELO should come down, and the groups be more balanced?
For S*its and Giggles and because sometimes I get obsessed with how screwed up things really are...the other night I solo qued 15 matches and lost 15 matches in a row--with no change in my team make up--still getting 6 K GWFS ( how is that even possible?), and still getting pres or super superior geared people to the last match. Not that the leaderboards matter, but I went from page 4 to page 33...I thought, well, maybe, it will adjust itself in 24 hours, like maybe it was glitched...lol no...It is just messed up, the 3 matches I got to run yesterday were all the same way!
The GWF thing, would not be so bad, if the matching system wasn't so screwed up...The way it is now, I don't even know how any of the new people to pvp, are going to keep doing pvp, and the community will die with no new blood, esp since there are no new maps.
it is a land of Deisconnecteds and AFKS more than ever.
Kelt played since beta and playing Wildstar doesn't diminish his knowledge on the game. Coming from one of the best TR's on this server to say "a tr can not beat an equally skilled/geared GWF/HR 1v1" should mean something. I completely back his post. By no means is it far fetched.
So you haven't beaten an equally geared/skilled GWF or HR since mod3? Not even once? He said it's NEVER possible (his cap emphasis, not mine).
Only thing that's changed is:
GWF punishes you way more if you get caught. As a TR you're not supposed to get caught anyway.
HR is slightly better able to get you out of stealth. Careful attack is more problematic for TRs especially, but HRs were always the anti-rogue imo.
TRs have been OP as hell in PVP since the game was released. It's possible that without SE they have finally been nerfed too much. Time will tell, but I think there's some exaggeration going on here.
In any case, TR is still by far the best at contesting a node in pugs, and can hold it against 4 puggers same as always because nothing's changed about stealth.
Maybe they've dropped off in top-end PVP, but unlike you guys I don't think what goes on between the 20 or so top pvpers "is the only thing that matters".
Once the best of the best premades stop taking TRs, let me know.
My Harem: Dawn HR, Erin CW, Piper TR, Zoe GWF
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mikeym80Member, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
So you haven't beaten an equally geared/skilled GWF or HR since mod3? Not even once? He said it's NEVER possible (his cap emphasis, not mine).
Only thing that's changed is:
GWF punishes you way more if you get caught. As a TR you're not supposed to get caught anyway.
HR is slightly better able to get you out of stealth. Careful attack is more problematic for TRs especially, but HRs were always the anti-rogue imo.
TRs have been OP as hell in PVP since the game was released. It's possible that without SE they have finally been nerfed too much. Time will tell, but I think there's some exaggeration going on here.
In any case, TR is still by far the best at contesting a node in pugs, and can hold it against 4 puggers same as always because nothing's changed about stealth.
Maybe they've dropped off in top-end PVP, but unlike you guys I don't think what goes on between the 20 or so top pvpers "is the only thing that matters".
Once the best of the best premades stop taking TRs, let me know.
Seeiing how I am in a top tier PvP guild and rank 6 there, I will tell you first hand we no longer duo TR comps. We take 1 yes for node holding. That's it. I played in a premade against another top tier PvP guild, the HR takes me down 50% in one rotation. Now factor in his roots and silence nonsense.. Dead. Oh yea, Oak Skin... lulz
GWF catches me one time! I am 30% sometimes less depending on his crits. Want to know how to stalemate them? We sit in stealth with BaS, ITC, and SS. Pointless to even try to kill sometimes. How does a class have the tankiness of a tank and the dmg of a top DPS?
I would gladly take more dps over sitting in stealth. I would also gladly take impact shot (the way it used to be) over having SE in the game at all. To anyone saying TR is op at all, you obviously don't main one.
I am thinking the players put much much more thought into pvp than the Devs do or ever did. This has me seriously questioning if this is a game I want to invest any more time or money in. Everything about pvp is broken. There is no indication that this will ever be fixed. Had high hopes for mod3. But things are so much worse now. Sad because the game-play is fun enough for there to be huge potential. But that potential will never be realized. PVP is treated as and will apparently remain a side show not to be token very seriously.
Seeiing how I am in a top tier PvP guild and rank 6 there, I will tell you first hand we no longer duo TR comps. We take 1 yes for node holding. That's it. I played in a premade against another top tier PvP guild, the HR takes me down 50% in one rotation. Now factor in his roots and silence nonsense.. Dead. Oh yea, Oak Skin... lulz
GWF catches me one time! I am 30% sometimes less depending on his crits. Want to know how to stalemate them? We sit in stealth with BaS, ITC, and SS. Pointless to even try to kill sometimes. How does a class have the tankiness of a tank and the dmg of a top DPS?
I would gladly take more dps over sitting in stealth. I would also gladly take impact shot (the way it used to be) over having SE in the game at all. To anyone saying TR is op at all, you obviously don't main one.
Why run 1 at all if the enemy has 1 HR, according to you guys it's a dead TR instantly and easily every single time? Something doesn't jive.
As for OP, I'm talking compared to DCs, GFs and CWs.
What's funny about this to me is when I mained a CW, and inquired about how to deal with rogues, I was told that CWs are the "natural prey" of TRs and I shouldn't ever expect to beat one, and everyone seemed to be ok with that.
So now TRs have a "natural predator" in the HR and suddenly it's the end of the world. I can't help but be a little unsympathetic, and also think it's a decent move towards balancing PVP. Personally, I'd like to see all the classes rock-paper-scissors eachother and EVERYONE have a chance to play in top compositions.
If premades are only taking 1 TR instead of 2, that to me is A-OK. Ideally, I'd like to see a rainbow comp as the most powerful comp, meaning 1 of each class.
As for GWFs- well, I'm on board with you on them, mainly because they have no "natural predators" and haven't since I've been playing this game.
Rather than nerf them though (especially since GWF nerfs seem to actually mean buffs lol), I'd love to see them buff CWs and GFs in PVP so they both were somehow able to kill GWFs fairly easily.
I think that would be amazing for balance and eliminate the biggest problem of OP in the game right now, which is- the more GWFs you have the better your odds of winning the game.
I just wanna ad something to my little expose, i did forget about the mount, a normal player or a beginner doesn't always have a 110% mount, this is crucial too in PVP, for chasing or for escaping. Bamm another nail in the coffin of the ranking list!
Don't get me wrong my fellow players, i like the TRs, but i can not find any sympathy for perma TRs and the guys who play a char like it. In my eyes these players aren't skilled, they are just OP. I for myself would never play a perma TR, what is the challenge, where is the little creeping fun, when you are like a god...pfff...
Just look at the current ranking perma TRs all over it and semi-perma HRs and OP Sentinels! This could actually give a hint for the Devs, where to cut into things.
The real honest man is honest from conviction of what is right, not from policy.
Robert E. Lee
I only believe in statistics that I doctored myself.
Winston Churchill
The human race is a herd. Here we are, unique, eternal aspects of consciousness with an infinity of potential, and we have allowed ourselves to become an unthinking, unquestioning blob of conformity and uniformity. A herd. Once we concede to the herd mentality, we can be controlled and directed by a tiny few. And we are.
David Icke
completely agree with most of the stuff said here.
if you think TRs are weak now... wait until everyone else gets full black ice gear and we stay with profound for the perma, that'll be fun to watch.
you want to kill perma? fine, just kill it already. don't torture it a little bit each day... that's just cruel. I can understand facing a perma TR in 1v1 PVP could be annoying, but seriously, it can't be more annoying that getting ROFLSTOMPed by GWF time after time...
please nerf GWF, i saw a lot of very good suggestions about facing this problem in the forums, i'm sure you won't have a problem finding a solution...
about HR, i don't completely agree... i haven't seen that many OP HR's lately... just ones who killed me fair and square... their kiting is annoying yes, but i imagin my stealth can also be...
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mikeym80Member, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Why run 1 at all if the enemy has 1 HR, according to you guys it's a dead TR instantly and easily every single time? Something doesn't jive.
As for OP, I'm talking compared to DCs, GFs and CWs.
What's funny about this to me is when I mained a CW, and inquired about how to deal with rogues, I was told that CWs are the "natural prey" of TRs and I shouldn't ever expect to beat one, and everyone seemed to be ok with that.
So now TRs have a "natural predator" in the HR and suddenly it's the end of the world. I can't help but be a little unsympathetic, and also think it's a decent move towards balancing PVP. Personally, I'd like to see all the classes rock-paper-scissors eachother and EVERYONE have a chance to play in top compositions.
If premades are only taking 1 TR instead of 2, that to me is A-OK. Ideally, I'd like to see a rainbow comp as the most powerful comp, meaning 1 of each class.
As for GWFs- well, I'm on board with you on them, mainly because they have no "natural predators" and haven't since I've been playing this game.
Rather than nerf them though (especially since GWF nerfs seem to actually mean buffs lol), I'd love to see them buff CWs and GFs in PVP so they both were somehow able to kill GWFs fairly easily.
I think that would be amazing for balance and eliminate the biggest problem of OP in the game right now, which is- the more GWFs you have the better your odds of winning the game.
Rainbow comp is just fine with me and what we try to run most of the time. A rainbow isn't always available though. What I'm saying is the win ratio vs GWF/HR is like 80-20 in their favor. The regen on an HR right now is just omg stupid, and plague fire is helping with its ticks. I'm slightly ignorant to Hr play as I don't play one myself though. I'm not trying to argue or cry about a certain class, but I think a slight nerf to HR regen/defense (maybe?) and a huge dmg, or defense nerf to GWF. GWF should not ge the best of both worlds (tank/dps).
CW is everyone's prey. Not just TR. Team fights in premade = "FOCUS CW!!!" You are absolutely right on "more gwf = win" though.
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mikeym80Member, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I just wanna ad something to my little expose, i did forget about the mount, a normal player or a beginner doesn't always have a 110% mount, this is crucial too in PVP, for chasing or for escaping. Bamm another nail in the coffin of the ranking list!
Don't get me wrong my fellow players, i like the TRs, but i can not find any sympathy for perma TRs and the guys who play a char like it. In my eyes these players aren't skilled, they are just OP. I for myself would never play a perma TR, what is the challenge, where is the little creeping fun, when you are like a god...pfff...
Just look at the current ranking perma TRs all over it and semi-perma HRs and OP Sentinels! This could actually give a hint for the Devs, where to cut into things.
The leader board is useless and far from accurate. It means nothing. As for playing perma, I completely agree. I hate that I have to conform to a perma build, I would much rather have dps and attack, than run and hide just to contest a node.
I have completely lost my faith in this game. The combat system is great and always will be, but every patch just changes things for the worse. There are so many things wrong with balance and the devs clearly don't know what people even find enjoyable (tried to fix staying in match after it ends just as one example). This game was never very competitive because it always had issues but it was still fun and you could have some nice matches every once in a while. Was fun while it lasted. (mostly)
May 31st is the final nail in the coffin of nw for me Wildstar!
I don't even feel bad.
The white damage, and massive telegraphs make wildstar gear/build based combat. outside of pvp it's like you go into every fight with a dot on you from every mob that you have to mitigate, and can't dodge or avoid. The only skill it takes to play wildstar is watching the ground, and building and gearing your character.
There are much better games out there if you want to play trinity.
The white damage, and massive telegraphs make wildstar gear/build based combat. outside of pvp it's like you go into every fight with a dot on you from every mob that you have to mitigate, and can't dodge or avoid. The only skill it takes to play wildstar is watching the ground, and building and gearing your character.
There are much better games out there if you want to play trinity.
You know, that might get changed any time, and I play 90% PvP in the games I play anyways and the PvP there is great. I was in the beta since January you wouldn't believe how many things changed since then .
The white damage wasn't an issue for me, it's basically a way to make you dps faster, if you're not fast enough at killing the mob while avoiding his attacks and if it's a ranged mob yes you will probably die to white damage eventually. This was never a problem for me though and I also ran through all the dungeons (not raids yet) in the game at least once and 90+% of the white damage was going to the tank anyways so it wasn't an issue.
Wildstar is actually hard, I get it that some people just want a game where they can get through the content with little effort, and get frustrated if they realise they aren't good enough to do something. If you like hard content (pve and of course, pvp) Wildstar is the game for you, if you don't, then don't play it.
I've played the game a lot during the course of 5 months and I enjoy it more every day. It's just not for everyone.
No longer playing NW
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silverquickMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 1Arc User
Rather than nerf them though (especially since GWF nerfs seem to actually mean buffs lol), I'd love to see them buff CWs and GFs in PVP so they both were somehow able to kill GWFs fairly easily.
I think that would be amazing for balance and eliminate the biggest problem of OP in the game right now, which is- the more GWFs you have the better your odds of winning the game.
Well Ironically they USED to be able to... Until everyone got on this nerfaholic kick.
They're never going to balance things or make anything better... until they realize this Nerfaholic addiction has GOT to end...
Because ALL the problems you're seeing right now... are due to previous nerfs.
Pretty much... PvPers are standing in shoes of their own making.
BUT they'll keep picking other supposed "OP" things to nerf.... when if they'd have just left well enough alone in the first place...
NONE OF THIS EVER WOULD HAVE HAPPENED...
They stand in shoes of their own making because of their own Nerfaholic syndrome... worse, they won't realize that if theyd only go back and un-nerf the things that were previously NERFED that caused this... the blinders would come off and they' suddenly realize... OH HAMSTER.. we did this to ourselves...
You know, that might get changed any time, and I play 90% PvP in the games I play anyways and the PvP there is great. I was in the beta since January you wouldn't believe how many things changed since then .
The white damage wasn't an issue for me, it's basically a way to make you dps faster, if you're not fast enough at killing the mob while avoiding his attacks and if it's a ranged mob yes you will probably die to white damage eventually. This was never a problem for me though and I also ran through all the dungeons (not raids yet) in the game at least once and 90+% of the white damage was going to the tank anyways so it wasn't an issue.
Wildstar is actually hard, I get it that some people just want a game where they can get through the content with little effort, and get frustrated if they realise they aren't good enough to do something. If you like hard content (pve and of course, pvp) Wildstar is the game for you, if you don't, then don't play it.
I've played the game a lot during the course of 5 months and I enjoy it more every day. It's just not for everyone.
If you like it great!, but it's just more of the same.
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mikeym80Member, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2014
Since I've posted this, things have only become worse. Now everyone has a GWF. The past week has been hell in PvP with all the troll comps. PLEASE, I am begging you! Take a look at the **** class balance before adding more zen items to the zen store. People aren't even playing now due to this imbalance.
Comments
Old HR spec has 0 chance against new one. HRs can destroy similarly geared TRs if they know what they do in node contesting. I would prefer the old spec of HR any day instead of this auto-refreshing damage/debuff and incredibly tanky HRs. Many other people I talked to have the same opinion. Why you think GPF price went so high up? GWF and HR fotm.
I bet you're using pathfinder too on that Dawn HR of yours. Am I correct? Just curious.
As for the VT artifact, I saw it abused, yet never saw any correlation with soulforged, maybe missed it. This is the game we playing, bug and broken abilities abusing is king.
Yes, I'm using pathfinder mostly because there's nothing left in Stormwarden worth using.
Zero chance? Why exactly? One old charged split shot was more damage than the full duration of careful attack, assuming careful attack proccs every single 1.5 seconds. Throw on a 3 second cooldown reduction every disruptive shot and a fox shift hitting 4 times and there's no way a Pathfinder HR could overcome the extra CC and damage.
And careful attack isn't even guaranteed to proc every time. Sometimes you may only get 3 procs out of it. So that's 1.5-3k extra damage.
Disruptive shot, forest ghost and aspect of the lone wolf are pretty much mandatory for pvp, so the only thing that could possibly add to the tankiness of a Pathfinder is one class trait, and neither of the viable ones are as good as a 3-second reduction on cooldowns every disruptive shot pre-nerf stormstep action offered.
As for plaguefire, I'm not even using it. I found it refreshed careful attack 1-2 extra times, and that 1-2k damage isn't worth the extra damage I get out of perfect vorpal.
May 31st is the final nail in the coffin of nw for me
I don't even feel bad.
Enjoy I guess. I couldn't get into Wildstar because the combat is a big step backward from Neverwinter, let alone the graphics.
Kinda vague. It would be helpful to the discussion if you give us some examples on what you perceive to be problematic, IMO.
If you know something to be broken, stop using it.
Otherwise, you've got no right to be speaking of 'balance.'
I guess being on the first page of the leaderboard with like a 10:1 k/d ratio isn't good enough for his rogue because HRs are a little better at putting up a fight?
Hate to say it bud but that would be terrible. Not for me since I play a GWF but everyone else. I can't imagine holding a node and not having to worry about SE from a rogue I've been dueling with for 5 minutes, or what does a CW have to support that TR I've been playing with when he/she can't eventually drop ice knife on my dome. GF with no daily? Wouldn't even see those guys in pvp anymore...
Oh, and I'm still not using Smoke Bomb.
Try Dazing Strike instead of Impact Shot, and beef it up with some Wicked Reminder. Using the Wicked Reminder with a GWF backing you up you can tenderize the target, and they smash it easier.
Never depend upon one thing as a "surefire tactic". Mix it up a bit. You have to adapt since every pick up group you may get can have a different combo in classes, and some tactics work better thanothers with the presence/ absence of a certain class.
"Why is it dragons only use ketchup? I'd like a little wasabi please. Us silvers like a variety of condiments."
"Don't call them foolish mortals. One, they don't learn from it. Two, It just ticks them off." - An Ancient Red Dragon
Everyone knows the leaderboard means very little in the end. Some of the best players at their class in this game are wayyy off the 1st page, more like on page 50 or even lower, just because they like everyone else knows that the leaderboard is a complete joke, and it's really not worth it to care about it. What comes to HRs and GWFs being OP right now, it's not really relating to the topic at all, but I've had my eye on wildstar since January 2014 basically just waiting for it to be released. Yes it's sad that TRs have become what they are now, but even if TR was the most faceroll OP class right now it wouldn't make any difference. Faceroll OP is boring, balance is fun and challenging. I would still go to wildstar no matter what happened. Just getting bored of using the same skills over and over and having competition against the same few guilds.
I have a gwf that i used to have max gear on and blah blah (no emblem though I never went that low) so if I wanted to win 1v1s I'd just play that. Your post was obviously a bit troll.
Everyone knows what TRs are capable of and what HRs and GWFs are capable of, atm. I think the balance was very close after tenacity and mod 3 between these classes (I even made a post about it check my post history if you care) but it just got screwed with mod 3.
TL;DR I would've played wildstar anyways no matter what happens with NW and the leaderboard is a complete joke. Notable HRs and GWFs know their classes are ridiculously OP anyways and there's nothing any TR can do about it right now.
certain guild take advantages of the op classes (gwf/hr) and just run in these ridiculous team comps
it's one thing to soloqueue and get matched vs a premade, that's fine
it's another to get matched against 3 gwfs over and over... takes out any skill of winning in the game and is a joke
I just don't get how you're killing people 10x as often as they're killing you and you feel your class is UP. If the only way you're satisfied is if you never die, then well, I don't know what to tell you. Maybe rogues could do that before, and have like a 40/1 k/d ratio. I don't think that's especially balanced though.
IMO, it was basically TR and GWF being really OP in mod 2, with HRs able to compete. Now TR and HR are about the same OP'ness and GWF is a bit above.
In any case, I don't see that dynamic changing that much and if anything I think the top 3 are closer together in OP'ness than ever before.
My only beef really is that other classes can't really compete with the top 3.
Really... Anyone can kill pugs, but when it comes to a similarly geared and correctly built gwf/hr that is decent vs a tr the gwf/hr will ALWAYS win unless there is a huge skill difference in favor of the TR. I really don't care how I do in pugs, the only thing that matters is vs an equally geared/skilled/experienced player. Any other GWF/HR who is decently geared and experienced can get just the same K/D ratios. This should be easy to figure out on your own really..
About mod 2, hr was just as strong as tr. GWF was crazy OP. After tenacity and before mod 3 gwf and tr were on the same level and hr was a bit stronger.
I don't think it matters much that the top 3 shuffle as nerfs come and go. What bothers me more is the bottom 3 never become major factors.
And I don't think it's true that equal gear/skill TR can NEVER beat gwf or hr.
I think a equal gear/skill DC, GF or CW might never beat a gwf or hr. But not a TR.
Not sure why you care though since you've been set on playing Wildstar for awhile now.
Kelt played since beta and playing Wildstar doesn't diminish his knowledge on the game. Coming from one of the best TR's on this server to say "a tr can not beat an equally skilled/geared GWF/HR 1v1" should mean something. I completely back his post. By no means is it far fetched.
Did you happen to read my disclaimer?
And, the matching system is the worst I have ever seen it. Even tho I have always been in good pvp guilds, I have pugged since Beta because I play odd hours, and often times even if I am on in Prime time, I need to farm quickly and cant do hour long matches all the time.
The first day, people were just melting in 1 or 2 spells from me...I would say to team, something is severely wrong with the matching system and everyone said the ELO system reset...
I didn't pvp for 5 days, come back, and even solo queing I get premades, with people on my side that have 6 and 7 K GS, or I get matched up against 5 well known pvp people who all have 15-18K GS, and my pugs are all 6 - 10 K GS.
I thought Ok, how bad can it be? If I lose a few matches, my ELO should come down, and the groups be more balanced?
For S*its and Giggles and because sometimes I get obsessed with how screwed up things really are...the other night I solo qued 15 matches and lost 15 matches in a row--with no change in my team make up--still getting 6 K GWFS ( how is that even possible?), and still getting pres or super superior geared people to the last match. Not that the leaderboards matter, but I went from page 4 to page 33...I thought, well, maybe, it will adjust itself in 24 hours, like maybe it was glitched...lol no...It is just messed up, the 3 matches I got to run yesterday were all the same way!
The GWF thing, would not be so bad, if the matching system wasn't so screwed up...The way it is now, I don't even know how any of the new people to pvp, are going to keep doing pvp, and the community will die with no new blood, esp since there are no new maps.
it is a land of Deisconnecteds and AFKS more than ever.
So you haven't beaten an equally geared/skilled GWF or HR since mod3? Not even once? He said it's NEVER possible (his cap emphasis, not mine).
Only thing that's changed is:
GWF punishes you way more if you get caught. As a TR you're not supposed to get caught anyway.
HR is slightly better able to get you out of stealth. Careful attack is more problematic for TRs especially, but HRs were always the anti-rogue imo.
TRs have been OP as hell in PVP since the game was released. It's possible that without SE they have finally been nerfed too much. Time will tell, but I think there's some exaggeration going on here.
In any case, TR is still by far the best at contesting a node in pugs, and can hold it against 4 puggers same as always because nothing's changed about stealth.
Maybe they've dropped off in top-end PVP, but unlike you guys I don't think what goes on between the 20 or so top pvpers "is the only thing that matters".
Once the best of the best premades stop taking TRs, let me know.
Seeiing how I am in a top tier PvP guild and rank 6 there, I will tell you first hand we no longer duo TR comps. We take 1 yes for node holding. That's it. I played in a premade against another top tier PvP guild, the HR takes me down 50% in one rotation. Now factor in his roots and silence nonsense.. Dead. Oh yea, Oak Skin... lulz
GWF catches me one time! I am 30% sometimes less depending on his crits. Want to know how to stalemate them? We sit in stealth with BaS, ITC, and SS. Pointless to even try to kill sometimes. How does a class have the tankiness of a tank and the dmg of a top DPS?
I would gladly take more dps over sitting in stealth. I would also gladly take impact shot (the way it used to be) over having SE in the game at all. To anyone saying TR is op at all, you obviously don't main one.
Jugger Conq GF
....
Why run 1 at all if the enemy has 1 HR, according to you guys it's a dead TR instantly and easily every single time? Something doesn't jive.
As for OP, I'm talking compared to DCs, GFs and CWs.
What's funny about this to me is when I mained a CW, and inquired about how to deal with rogues, I was told that CWs are the "natural prey" of TRs and I shouldn't ever expect to beat one, and everyone seemed to be ok with that.
So now TRs have a "natural predator" in the HR and suddenly it's the end of the world. I can't help but be a little unsympathetic, and also think it's a decent move towards balancing PVP. Personally, I'd like to see all the classes rock-paper-scissors eachother and EVERYONE have a chance to play in top compositions.
If premades are only taking 1 TR instead of 2, that to me is A-OK. Ideally, I'd like to see a rainbow comp as the most powerful comp, meaning 1 of each class.
As for GWFs- well, I'm on board with you on them, mainly because they have no "natural predators" and haven't since I've been playing this game.
Rather than nerf them though (especially since GWF nerfs seem to actually mean buffs lol), I'd love to see them buff CWs and GFs in PVP so they both were somehow able to kill GWFs fairly easily.
I think that would be amazing for balance and eliminate the biggest problem of OP in the game right now, which is- the more GWFs you have the better your odds of winning the game.
I just wanna ad something to my little expose, i did forget about the mount, a normal player or a beginner doesn't always have a 110% mount, this is crucial too in PVP, for chasing or for escaping. Bamm another nail in the coffin of the ranking list!
Don't get me wrong my fellow players, i like the TRs, but i can not find any sympathy for perma TRs and the guys who play a char like it. In my eyes these players aren't skilled, they are just OP. I for myself would never play a perma TR, what is the challenge, where is the little creeping fun, when you are like a god...pfff...
Just look at the current ranking perma TRs all over it and semi-perma HRs and OP Sentinels! This could actually give a hint for the Devs, where to cut into things.
Robert E. Lee
I only believe in statistics that I doctored myself.
Winston Churchill
The human race is a herd. Here we are, unique, eternal aspects of consciousness with an infinity of potential, and we have allowed ourselves to become an unthinking, unquestioning blob of conformity and uniformity. A herd. Once we concede to the herd mentality, we can be controlled and directed by a tiny few. And we are.
David Icke
if you think TRs are weak now... wait until everyone else gets full black ice gear and we stay with profound for the perma, that'll be fun to watch.
you want to kill perma? fine, just kill it already. don't torture it a little bit each day... that's just cruel. I can understand facing a perma TR in 1v1 PVP could be annoying, but seriously, it can't be more annoying that getting ROFLSTOMPed by GWF time after time...
please nerf GWF, i saw a lot of very good suggestions about facing this problem in the forums, i'm sure you won't have a problem finding a solution...
about HR, i don't completely agree... i haven't seen that many OP HR's lately... just ones who killed me fair and square... their kiting is annoying yes, but i imagin my stealth can also be...
Rainbow comp is just fine with me and what we try to run most of the time. A rainbow isn't always available though. What I'm saying is the win ratio vs GWF/HR is like 80-20 in their favor. The regen on an HR right now is just omg stupid, and plague fire is helping with its ticks. I'm slightly ignorant to Hr play as I don't play one myself though. I'm not trying to argue or cry about a certain class, but I think a slight nerf to HR regen/defense (maybe?) and a huge dmg, or defense nerf to GWF. GWF should not ge the best of both worlds (tank/dps).
CW is everyone's prey. Not just TR. Team fights in premade = "FOCUS CW!!!" You are absolutely right on "more gwf = win" though.
The leader board is useless and far from accurate. It means nothing. As for playing perma, I completely agree. I hate that I have to conform to a perma build, I would much rather have dps and attack, than run and hide just to contest a node.
The white damage, and massive telegraphs make wildstar gear/build based combat. outside of pvp it's like you go into every fight with a dot on you from every mob that you have to mitigate, and can't dodge or avoid. The only skill it takes to play wildstar is watching the ground, and building and gearing your character.
There are much better games out there if you want to play trinity.
You know, that might get changed any time, and I play 90% PvP in the games I play anyways and the PvP there is great. I was in the beta since January you wouldn't believe how many things changed since then
The white damage wasn't an issue for me, it's basically a way to make you dps faster, if you're not fast enough at killing the mob while avoiding his attacks and if it's a ranged mob yes you will probably die to white damage eventually. This was never a problem for me though and I also ran through all the dungeons (not raids yet) in the game at least once and 90+% of the white damage was going to the tank anyways so it wasn't an issue.
Wildstar is actually hard, I get it that some people just want a game where they can get through the content with little effort, and get frustrated if they realise they aren't good enough to do something. If you like hard content (pve and of course, pvp) Wildstar is the game for you, if you don't, then don't play it.
I've played the game a lot during the course of 5 months and I enjoy it more every day. It's just not for everyone.
Well Ironically they USED to be able to... Until everyone got on this nerfaholic kick.
They're never going to balance things or make anything better... until they realize this Nerfaholic addiction has GOT to end...
Because ALL the problems you're seeing right now... are due to previous nerfs.
Pretty much... PvPers are standing in shoes of their own making.
BUT they'll keep picking other supposed "OP" things to nerf.... when if they'd have just left well enough alone in the first place...
NONE OF THIS EVER WOULD HAVE HAPPENED...
They stand in shoes of their own making because of their own Nerfaholic syndrome... worse, they won't realize that if theyd only go back and un-nerf the things that were previously NERFED that caused this... the blinders would come off and they' suddenly realize... OH HAMSTER.. we did this to ourselves...
If you like it great!, but it's just more of the same.