Red Cross

tesyra

So every now and then, when im fighting stuff, some clown comes along and starts fighting the mob(s) ive already started on, which is perfectly fine with me, if they cant kill stuff without my help, then im glad to assist such poorly skilled players
A few times after theyve started fighting a big Red Cross comes up
Im guessing this means im not allowed" to fight their precious mob etc, y'know cos theyre so much more uberz than me and have bigger HAMSTER and all that etc

My questions are;
How come they dont see such a big red cross when im already halfway through killing it?
How do i enable such a cross? Assuming i care enough to deny other people "mah killz", which tbh i dont, but i dont like there being aspects of the game i still dont know, and since hardly anything like this is mentioned in any FAQ i have found im here asking
Also, why would i want to? Why does anyone want to lock others out, especially when it doesnt seem to have any effect on either the lock-er or the lock-ee?
Is this the "target lock" i see a key-binding for in Options, and if so do i really have to hold the button down to do this? That seems clumsy that people are holding down CTRL and at the same time dodging with shift, moving and casting powers, think id need at least 2 more fingers on my left hand for that kind of key-use

And follow-ups;
Dont they realize i still get the credit, it just means that now i can sit back, puff some bud and let them kill it for me, then i take the loot, it seems as long as i got the first shot i still get first crack at the loot and my quest updates
My only irritation is that i cant mount until theyve killed it, as it thinks im still in combat with the mob

tinukeda

The 'red cross' is the Guardian Fighter's (and sometimes other class's) "mark" (it's the Tab skill for GF's, FYI) and it applies affects to the mob and various other things. It does not prevent you from doing anything or 'take credit' or anything like that. Just ignore it and go about your business in this case.

twstdecho

Why do people get all offended and assume the worst?

That's just a Guardian Fighter's (or a GWF now as well), mark that helps build aggro and offers a small de-buff. Nothing more, nothing less. It certainly doesn't mean you can't continue to fight said enemy, in fact, if they are pulling aggro and gaining the attention of the bad guys, it leaves you free to deal damage without worrying about getting smacked.

Dohh... Ninja'd!

beckylunatic

Most mobs in the game, all players who have damaged it sufficiently will get both credit and loot.

To elaborate a little on what a marked target does for the GF, it should pull that mob's aggro away from other friendlies (like you, for example), and if feated, marking targets can mean they'll take more damage. GWFs can also mark targets, though their marks don't peel mobs nearly as well as they will for a GF as they don't have access to other ways of adding threat.

radiick507

Just trying to understand here:

Are we talking about a RED X (Like in X-Ray?) or a Red + (which to means means Cross +).

iambecks1

radiick507 wrote: »

Just trying to understand here:

Are we talking about a RED X (Like in X-Ray?) or a Red + (which to means means Cross +).

They are talking about the red colored X that appears above an enemy when a GF uses Mark on them

radiick507

iambecks1 wrote: »

They are talking about the red colored X that appears above an enemy when a GF uses Mark on them

Thanks, was pretty sure it was but was wondering there was some kind of new marker. Much appreciated.

sockmunkey

Just to add. They are most likely getting loot as well. Your drops are only visible to yourself. You can't see theirs and they can't see yours. It's rather difficult to kill steal here. You simply need to get in a few hits for full credit. Who hits first or last is completely meaningless.

chaoscourtesan

There are a gazillion different reasons why they might be attacking 'your' mobs. If I am on a mission that requires me to interact with an object, and you are fighting your mobs on top of it, I am going to do whatever it takes to eliminate those mobs as quickly as possible so that I can activate the object and move on. In those cases, if you want your mobs to yourself.. attack them, then run off a bit, so you can fight them somewhere else instead of right on top of the coffee maker.

If you are down to half hitpoints, people will often jump in, and they are trying to help you. If you don't want help, you can try saying 'Don't help.' in local, and maybe they will notice it.

And yes there are people who come and try to kill what you are fighting for the kill credit to complete the quest. And sometimes they will kill them so fast that you dont get enough dps in to get credit. That bites. The game lends itself to that sort of thing and it's going to happen.

My favorite is when you tackle the giant whatever with the deathray eyes, and it's clearly because you are after the religion node he's guarding and some slag comes in and ninjas the node, and is gone. Because you are in combat and can't interact with objects. And he never even thought of helping. I love that. Might make a person want to aggro everything in range, and truck them right down on top of him, then log out. hahaha

Seriously, all kinds of goofy stuff happens in the game, ya can't really do anything about it so ya just keep doing your thing. There are some really nasty people in there, along with some kids who just don't know any better.. all mixed in with the nice helpful ones.

Not laughing at your displeasure, but your interpretation of the red crosses made me laugh pretty hard. Think about it, it is really funny, now that you know what they really are.

tesyra

Guess the question does remain why do people jump in and "save me" when ive 90% killed something and didnt want or require their help, but i may as well be asking what my granddaughter asked me the other day "why does evil exist?" (The answer is the same to both questions btw, "because people are HAMSTER")

When i see someone fighting a mob or mobs, i let them carry on, i dont join in, i try not to pull other mobs to them, i just move on and find my own, i would feel like such a cheat putting one arrow into everything i passed by, this game is so easy, to make it easier, in any manner, for me personally is to take away the only fun it gives
Besides it is not helpful at all when people pull mobs out of my ground targetted areas

Thanks to all for the replies, no matter how spikey and snarky some of them are, they are appreciated

Silly of me to assume a big red X, which is almost the universal symbol for "stay dafuq away" "keep off/out" or "access denied" did not mean anything of the sort

Cynical of me to assume people were trying to kill-steal, thats what im used to since 1997 (Ultima Online), im sure this is all basic, standard stuff if youve been unfortunate enough to be weened on games like Wow, and many post-WoW clones, i myself have mostly avoided such games, this is my first "wow-clone" (if indeed it is)
Not all of us are used to such watered-down "fair" games, im used to kill-stealing, pee-kaying and the ubiquitous "mine mine mine" attitude you know, competition, fun, excitement, also self-policing, people dont talk or act like jerks when jerks can get killed for being jerksl
I ve been keeping myself busy with UO and SWG for the last 15 or so years, on private servers mostly, and really only here because ive been a player of Forgotten Realms since it existed, and, to fill in some time until The Repopulation comes out
So i am genuinely not familiar with what i think of as modern MMOs, and what many of you think of as "standard features" in these games, are completely new to me

Good to know about loot visibility to others, guess i will stop leaving my unwanted Arbor Keys, Feydark Crystals and whatnot laying around for others to help themselves to now i know
Though im half sure ive entered an area and seen loot laying around, when i havent been in that area/zone since the day previous

iambecks1

tesyra wrote: »

Guess the question does remain why do people jump in and "save me" when ive 90% killed something and didnt want or require their help

You answered your own question , players do it because they seem to be under the impression that such a thing a kill stealing exists in Neverwinter , the amount of times I have summoned that huge demon thing in the Dread ring daily quests and somebody has come along and started hitting on it even though I clearly need nobody's help is actually quite hilarious , I just let them get on with it and don't complain , after all they are simply making my questing so much easier and faster.

beckylunatic

Pretty much there is no actual kill-stealing, and some people who are trying to most efficiently do their "kill 3 of a specific kind of semi-tough monsters" quest would rather tag the first ones they see than go to the far reaches of the map looking for ones that are thus-far unmolested. When someone gets into your fight like that, they probably aren't trying to "save" you at all. Whether or not it's a hindrance to you, yeah, if a Guardian Fighter is pulling mobs out of your AoE (iirc you play a Wizard), then... not so helpful. My own CW has occasionally come to the rescue of players who did genuinely appear to be swarmed and either fleeing or down.

tesyra wrote: »

Though im half sure ive entered an area and seen loot laying around, when i havent been in that area/zone since the day previous

The only exception I can think of (outside of being partied with someone and depending on the party's loot mode) are the useless items dropped by the "Robe of Useless Items" which is a novelty that comes with the Hero and Guardian packs. Using this item drops something on the ground that anybody can see and pick up... but it's all junk. Some people kinda sorta use it for trolling because of that.

In a party, the default loot mode has green and above items visible to all for looting and these will trigger a roll. Common items will drop just for you.
You can set other loot modes as leader. Round robin means that all loot drops you see are just for you, regardless of quality. There's another one where all loot drops are visible to all, but anyone can pick things up with no roll triggered. I've only used this while partied with a friend when his bag filled up, so that I'd be able to collect absolutely everything that dropped, and we could divide the spoils in town.

tldr... Unclaimed loot laying around is -probably- useless items.

beckylunatic

iambecks1 wrote: »

You answered your own question , players do it because they seem to be under the impression that such a thing a kill stealing exists in Neverwinter , the amount of times I have summoned that huge demon thing in the Dread ring daily quests and somebody has come along and started hitting on it even though I clearly need nobody's help is actually quite hilarious , I just let them get on with it and don't complain , after all they are simply making my questing so much easier and faster.

Actually, I'd say that players do it because there is *no* kill-stealing in Neverwinter. Therefore, if you tag the big demon with a couple of magic missiles when you're riding by and see someone has already triggered the fight, your quest is done with minimal annoyance.

Likewise, with the Fomorian witches in Sharandar, if multiple players end up at one cauldron, there is no need to find a second cauldron because everyone there can interact with it once and get credit for the witch. It simply makes racking up the needed kills moderately less of a pain in the HAMSTER.

There is no kill-*steal*ing. There is kill-*share*ing. Big difference.

melodywhr

( moving to the moonstone mask )

iambecks1

beckylunatic wrote: »

Actually, I'd say that players do it because there is *no* kill-stealing in Neverwinter. Therefore, if you tag the big demon with a couple of magic missiles when you're riding by and see someone has already triggered the fight, your quest is done with minimal annoyance.

Likewise, with the Fomorian witches in Sharandar, if multiple players end up at one cauldron, there is no need to find a second cauldron because everyone there can interact with it once and get credit for the witch. It simply makes racking up the needed kills moderately less of a pain in the HAMSTER.

There is no kill-*steal*ing. There is kill-*share*ing. Big difference.

I didn't actually know the big fights where you summon the Witches or the big demon worked like that , I just thought anybody who hit them was wasting their time because I assumed that only the person who summoned it got the kill to count so that info is good to know , the ones that really do annoy me though are the players who try to sneak in and interact with the elves you release from the giant plants or the dogs you lure out of the caves in the Sharandar daily quests does anybody near by get credit for them or just the player who actually interacts with the NPC?

beckylunatic

The pods, if you are close enough when the guardian is armed, you get credit. I'm not entirely sure what qualifies as "close enough" though, as it does seem to be a small radius.

Not sure about the portal hound dens, since I usually try to find a low pop instance for that quest because of the bug where previously placed bait prevents a den from working at all. I'll try to remember to test it with a partner.

pitshade

I don't think the hounds count just by being close to them but multiple people can interact with them if they're fast enough hitting 'F.' The Dryads only count if you're in a party with someone and range doesn't matter then. I think all the other quest objects - communication orbs, mushrooms etc... - all have to be interacted with by each player, though some of them 'count' for each member of the party, allowing for faster quest completion. I know the wanted posters quest in Helm's Hold is like that. Each party member can activate a poster and each poster activated adds to the total of each person - so three people clicking two posters will count as six posters for each player, finishing that part of the quest.

Unfortunately, the quests have different ways of counting when you're in a group. The only one I know of where it's not easier teamed up is the plague crystals quest in the Chasm. You only get credit for the crystals you activate, and you have to compete with everyone else in the instance running the quest.

lukeminherexx

I actually wondered about this myself, but not so much as worrying about others stealing but sometimes, let's face it, accidents occur and you steal a mob before you noticed the other person attacking. I did assume loot was player specific from the way it didn't blink away when others ran over it! This has confirmed that suspicion. I think it is an excellent addition to an already very good game (i actually started playing when it first started, didn't like it, and came back to love it!)

As far as anger issues with others attacking/helping with mobs, I say in the nicest way, get over it. SOME people are trolls and intentionally do things to anger others, but MOST people aren't that way. Just move on to a more secluded area if you do not wish "help", and I must admit, some have actually "helped" me, and some have followed me around to every mob and annoyed me (though not sure why it annoys me...lol). Part of playing online, always has been, always will be. However, it has come a looooooooong way since UO.

With all of my own personal views aside, I DO understand the OP's side of it, it can be annoying.

sockmunkey

With the way the game handles instances. Its not all that hard to always have a secluded area to play in, if that is your thing.

The game by, default, tries to fill up busy instances instead of placing players in new or empty instances. This tends to concentrate players in a few full or near full areas. However, there is generally always a few near empty instances available. So, seeing as how, in most cases, you need to enter these instances manually. They tend to stay empty, and the few people in them are also most likely looking for some alone time as well. Confrontations can be reduced to a minimum.

Put simply, the choices for how you want to play are open for nearly any play style. Provided you make use of the tools available.

micky1p00

Just want to say that usually if i see someone (specially DC, or GF) fighting something big i'll usually do invis-lashing blade on the biggest thing, because imo two key presses will save them time fighting. So i'm only trying to help, as it doesn't affect loot, missions, xp and usually i will leave the killing blow to them. Had no idea people have problem with it

ladymythos

chaoscourtesan wrote: »

Seriously, all kinds of goofy stuff happens in the game, ya can't really do anything about it so ya just keep doing your thing. There are some really nasty people in there, along with some kids who just don't know any better.. all mixed in with the nice helpful ones.

The sad fact is that we can't do anything to stop people being complete morons or jerks. It's human nature, in most cases. Telling you guys what I've experienced in online-games would take all day, so I could mention a few highlights:

- Guy wanted me to adopt him in the game. Then he wanted to have sex with me while calling me mom.

- Guy insisted on kill-stealing in City of Villains, and excused himself by saying we are playing villains. Newflash: Even villains need friends, and usually don't fight each other unless they have a good reason to. Acting like a jerk "because you play a villain" still means you're a jerk.

- Guy (it's always male characters, for some reason) insisted on attacking me, despite being on a PvE server. When he finally realized it wouldn't work, he kept following me. And by following, I mean always staying less than 20 meters away, and usually closer. Even right behind me when I was standing still, or in combat.

- My first experience with Diablo multiplayer was one max level guy showing up and insisting he'd give me high-level gear for free. I refused. Shortly after, another guy at max level showed up and wanted to give me high-level gear (I was lvl 4, btw...). When they noticed each other, they started a big fight with each other.

- Diablo 2: Guy dropped a ton of high-level gear right next to me, then started calling me things that could have melted the server simply because I refused. When I said I wanted to play legit and get my own stuff, he didn't understand what I meant.

- To top off the Diablo trilogy, guy the same class as me kept switching his own skills to me all the time. I change, he changed. I first asked him why, but he didn't bother respond. I then told him to please stop, but he kept doing it.

- Finally, there's Lord of the Rings Online. An early quest in the shire has you looking for a dead cow in the swamp. The swamp is really small, and the cow really easy to find. Even so, people kept asking where it was at least once an hour every single day for at least three whole months, until I left the Shire. Chances are they still ask the same thing. It could be simple ignorance, but if so, why don't anyone ask for help with any other quest? At all?

And that's just a few highlights. So in other words, stupid people do stupid things. We can either just ignore or get annoyed, and I've learned to ignore it.