nope, man, it is the same class with WEAKER equipment(sets for GF are mostly team focused, and GWF weapon has by far higher damage on their weapon), LOWER survability, LOWER damage(and while having lower damage it also has 2 times lower crit chance), LOWER mobility... for now there is NOTHING GF can do, that GWF can't do better or at leastthe same way...
so! the question is: why do we need a class, that has no superiority in anything?
survability?- DC, GWF, TR, HR- all live longer
mobility?- they are the slowest
burst?- GWF has higher(or the same, but with higher crit chance,(so dmg is actually higher) if GWF is in tank build, and GF is conq)
TR has higher and can run away if needed, HR has higher+ he can do it from high range+ has annoying roots... CW also has higherburst...
initiation?- lol? a good HR or CW will not let you come close enough... yup, can be annoying, but ANY class can be, and all of them are more annoying...
prones?- wow 1 thing they have, and even here, GWF can do it better, as he is more mobile and has CC immunity almost 24/7...
so... actually they have something... but if you compare it to other classes, then everything is just worse...
and now, when SM GWF will be able to avoid prone chain of single GF by using 30%CC reduction passive what role will GFs have?
to be a meatshield, and actually they are not the best even here... as DC and GWF, even if you take away their mobility will have higher potential health...
and btw... most of PvP specced players have over 35k hp, and crit chance is the lowest of all... so... you need 6 crits a row to kill the squishiest target... ill tell you a secret, you dont even have 6 skills... and chance to get 6 crits a row is... slightly higher than 0...
and it is only if no1 is CCing you, but you will be CCd, so most likely you will not even reach your target...
dailies count, so you have e encounters+ 1 daily(man, you cant use 2 at the same time) still not 6...
bigger sword= more damage, i admit it... but shield should be more durability, more chance to deflect(it is easier to deflect with shield than with 2h sword)... but it is actually not
not 30+, even mages get 35+... and 5k is noticeable... but 1 thingy... 5k is a crit, and your chance to crit is way too low, also do not forget about deflect... and about rich enough... why to compare low geared players? it is nearly the same as comparing level 30 characters... ofc all comparitions are made on top or close to top gears/enchancements...
block cc? did not you hear, that ray of frost freezes you through block, and then CW will land all the damage and CC, or just SoEA from behind to prone and then CClock, GWF- sprint through him and prone, then chain your skills... tr- just atk from behind, HR- melee and **** GF, or range and break his block in 2 shoots, then endless roots... and DCs are not supposed to kill GFs, really...and GWF just uses unstoppable for CC immune, that breaks any CC but prone...
ranged are annoying for GFs... when i play TR- ranged is not a problem, if i play GWF- i just go in and **** people
so you need a Daily+an encounter ONLY to get same effect as GWFs get on tab, and they have it nearly 24/7, while you cant do it...
GWF is not a selfish... he provides the same support as GF, but also can go 1 vs 3 to kill 1 and escape, can just run through enemies to disorganise them, can enter 1 vs 5, get dropped to 10% HP and safely escape, while GF will be locked by 2 guys
SM GF gets the same passive, but he cant use it effectively, as hehas no unstoppable, and has no speed of GWF...
about 40%DR... GWF gets 50% mitigation just by activating unstoppable... so combine it with 40% mitigation from gears, then their terrifying high deflect chance... and we will see much higher potential health...
and im looking on GF not only dmg wise- i compared him to GWF- he has EVERYTHING worse, so GF is a class, that is not superior at anything...
Dude.... I can't even read that so I'm just gonna say that I'm too lazy to even want to come up with a rebuttal. Lol, try actually putting spaces between words and paragraphs its called hitting space and enter.
Like trying to read another language.
0
sorrowful91Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 23Arc User
Dude.... I can't even read that so I'm just gonna say that I'm too lazy to even want to come up with a rebuttal. Lol, try actually putting spaces between words and paragraphs its called hitting space and enter.
Like trying to read another language.
okay, the same text, but ill try to make it more acceptable
1- each of my numbers will be as answer to 1 of things you wrote before i wrote this big thingy... and it was almost in the same order, and now i have no time to match your sentences with my answers...
dailies count, so you have 3 encounters+ 1 daily(man, you cant use 2 at the same time) still not 6...(6 is the number of skills you need to be crits a row to kill 1 PvP specced mage(the squishiest of all), so even ifyou are insanely lucky all and all your skills will crit+ none of your attacks will be deflected there is no chance you will kill some1 1v1 in 1 burst)
bigger sword= more damage, i admit it... but shield should be equal to more durability, more chance to deflect(it is easier to deflect with shield than with 2h sword)... but it is actually not, and somehow that big red guy with big sword can deflect attacks better, than guardian using a shield (if we think logically, even if you are not using shield to block frontal attacks some hits will not reach you, even if you just carry a shield(it is justlogic, nothing of this is part of this game)
not 30+, even mages get 35+... and 5k is noticeable...(all about HPs, when you wrote, that 5k is good vs 30k) but 1 thingy... 5k is a crit, and your chance to crit is way too low, also do not forget about deflect...
and about rich enough... why to compare low geared players? it is nearly the same as comparing level 30 characters... ofc all comparitions are made on top or close to top gears/enchancements...(i think you can understand everything here)
about your statement that i forgot about blocking cc: did not you hear, that ray of frost freezes you through block, and then CW will land all the damage and CC, or just SoEA from behind to prone and then CClock, GWF- sprint through him and prone, then chain your skills... tr- just atk from behind, HR- melee and **** GF, or range and break his block in 2 shoots, then endless roots... and DCs are not supposed to kill GFs, really...
and GWF just uses unstoppable for CC immune, that breaks any CC but prone...(comparition of GF's way to avoid CC and GWF's- GF's block is pretty easy to bypass+ it block effectiveness if you are fighting against more than 1 enemy, while GWF just ignores CC, and can have tanky build without losing too much of his damage, so after he started to use his unstoppables he will lose almost no health, unless team is nicely cooperated and somehow you burst him in between of his "BIG UGLY RED GUY MODEs"... and his unstoppable gets more effective the more ppl he is fighting, unlike GF, who can fight only 1 v 1 without being locked...
ranged are annoying for GFs(and other ranged classes)... when i play TR- ranged is not a problem, if i play GWF- i just go in and **** people
(TR with his invis will most likely land a 1st hit+ he will be already in range, so he will have an advantage,
GWF with unstoppable and his speed will be able to go through any wall of enemies to reach the one he wants
the question is: what can GF offer to compare?)
so you need a Daily+an encounter ONLY to get same effect as GWFs get on tab, and they have it nearly 24/7, while you can have it less than 10% of time you are fighting...+ do not forget about 50% mitigation buff on unstoppable...
+ you lose 2 skill slots, and only to get weaker effect, than tab+ in PvP you have no tab(and tbh his shift is also the weakest of all)
and... even with this 2 skills... unstoppable is activated even while in CC(but prone), and it is done instantly, while GF has long cast animation on both buffs, and none of them is CC breaker+ can be interrupted by any CC...
GWF is not a selfish, he is self-sufficient... he provides the same support as GF, but also can go 1 vs 3 to kill 1 and escape, can just run through enemies to disorganise them, can enter 1 vs 5, get dropped to 10% HP and safely escape, while GF will be locked even by 2 guys
SM GF gets the same passive, but he cant use it effectively, as he has no unstoppable, and has no speed of GWF, so even if he uses VM for CCimmune, what can he do?(actually he will not be able to use theese skills: he is proned, gets up b4 the 2nd prone arrives, tries to use VM- interrupt by 2nd prone and so on(the fact you got proned for the 1st time means that somehow enemy can bypass your block and will do it more))... GWF needs this to avoid chain prones to instantly proc unstoppable and continue <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> ppl...
about 40%DR... GWF gets 50% mitigation just by activating unstoppable... so combine it with 40% mitigation from gears, then their terrifying high deflect chance... and we will see much higher potential health...(and it is all, when GWF still has much more damage)
and im looking on GF not only dmg wise- i compared him to GWF- he has EVERYTHING worse, so GF is a class, that is not superior at anything... (all GF can do GWF can do better, or at least the same way... and actually not only GWF, for surviving under pressure, kiting, supportiong, bursting, dealing constant dmg... for every role there is a class, other than GWF, that can do it better, than GF... so i dont see any role for GF in both PvE and PvP for now...
oh, wait... i lied, he can be really awesome in PvE in early game: pre 60 and early 60s, and in PvP he can obliterate everything in 50-59 room, as ppl there are mostly not experienced enough to counter you...
about spaces... was hurrying, so did not press enter many times it was neccessary, and about space... just a broken button, that works 50/50... im trying to look, if it worked, but sometimes i forget about it, or just do not notice...
0
sorrowful91Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 23Arc User
1. The changes on the preview shard.
2. Marked enemies receive 8 % more dmg (instead of lower damage resistance. Its useless in the pve endgame, because most characters already have 24% ap).
3. If a GF marks a foe, its perma till his death.
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twstdechoMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 630Bounty Hunter
edited February 2014
Inluding what's on the preview shard, I'd start with setting a minimum damage amount that block simply ignores when at full capacity, with the intent that you can block most normal attacks from all trash mobs without it taking away from your block meter.
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zhaofuoMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 129Bounty Hunter
edited February 2014
GF deflect severity should atleast give us more than 50% damage mitigation. common that's a freaking shield that deflected an attack vs a rouge who has 75% deflect damage mitigation using a what? dagger.
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kolbe11Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited February 2014
As of today, I'm hanging up my GF in protest to the latest animation "fix". Damned thing feels even slower now.
"It is said that idle hands are the Devil's tools: Idle geek hands, however, came up with gunpowder, nuclear weapons, and toilet plungers." -Illiad
2. Marked enemies receive 8 % more dmg (instead of lower damage resistance. Its useless in the pve endgame, because most characters already have 24% ap).
It already works this way. Defense/Mitigation debuffs are separate from Resistance Ignored (armor pen/stat) and work entirely as damage buffs. Someone with enough resistance ignored to negate a foe's armor who hits a debuffed target is getting a straight up damage increase. It doesn't matter the source of the debuff, HV set, HP set, Plaguefire, or mark, it just increases damage.
"We have always been at war with Dread Vault" ~ Little Brother
It's stupid to not have passive team bonuses for gfs. Make the gfs buff the team (or debuff others) and everything will be ok. GWF works good, but tanking should not be the only choice for gfs. They should have some "leader" role, a "party guy" thing.
And still we would need some love for the at-wills.
they have tons of party buffs knights valor and challenge into the fray all of which effect party members or enemies in some fashion look it up. Feats associated with them also affect party members as they do you.
GWF only has battle fury.
and no one else has passive team buffs why should gf.
Sorrowful i believe you are right about wizards and gf but only with ray of frost. Other than that they don't have much to get past the shield and honestly if its a 1v1 that wizard better pray i don't crit on a knock down cause that will lead to another and he will be getting hit back for most of the damage he is hitting me with if I have sos and I'm immune to damage for most of the time while thats up and again after i activate again.
Plus I still have lunging bull rush and crescendo for easy knocks if thats what I'm running. Using into the fray is amazing for getting out the gate and capping points before the other team even gets past the gate add in mastery steal time from a cw the 2 points are already capped add in a nature buff with the 10% for 10 sec speed boost we've already made it to the third.
I am usually with my group because I can support them and they can support me. I use knights valor which would reduce the damage taken by my team and i can block the damage to me from far away just by looking at them. My base damage resist is already 52% with a 40% deflect so ray of frost won't hurt and if i break out early from the freeze most of the damage from those spells won't really matter too much and i have 32k hp without even stacking any.
I can get temp hp if I'm using my encounter for it and i can heal better than a gwf with fighters recovery my regen and ls is nice enough so i wouldn't even have to truly worry about it.
Then again I don't care for pvp much not to say I'm not good at it but its all pretty pointless unless you are 15k+ because you have a higher chance of the enemy team being pre made and your team being either the same as you or way way lower with the added possibility of having 1 person that has a good gs and enchants.
And at 12.8k GS i have almost no trouble in almost any dungeon even with a good or bad team because i make them all better and make it so they don't have to dodge anything save the highest damage. See one of the problems is that gf is a tank but not many really plays it like it is one and really if I'm alone in pvp and not taking or contesting a point I'm doing something wrong; a lot of people look at gf and only see low damage, I only see great party synergy through mechanics.
I leave the 1v1s to the gwf and the tr thats their deal thats why they were made gf is meant to tank and support the party and maybe knock a few fools down after all whats the use in tanking if theres no one to tank for.
GWF is self sufficient in pvp only because they can unstoppable, run, get on a horse to pot and really unstoppable is the only trait that makes gwf even possible otherwise they'd get crushed just like the rest just ask anyone who played pvp with one when it bugged out..... long story short, they died.
For fun and to see the proof in that run a spellplague without hitting tab you'll probably die once every few encounters unless its with a 3 cw group and your team will say you suck and ask in caps why aren't you using unstoppable? Then they will leave i promise.
Without it we are basically the same survival-wise only i still protect party and you have very few ways of doing it aside from killing them regardless of paragon.
and a good gf gwf combo is a beauteous thing to behold..... ALL the knockdowns.
Add in a tr 2 spike damagers 2 knockers 1 protector add a cw.... you get the idea.
Comments
Your writing format is weird lol...
Dude.... I can't even read that so I'm just gonna say that I'm too lazy to even want to come up with a rebuttal. Lol, try actually putting spaces between words and paragraphs its called hitting space and enter.
Like trying to read another language.
okay, the same text, but ill try to make it more acceptable
1- each of my numbers will be as answer to 1 of things you wrote before i wrote this big thingy... and it was almost in the same order, and now i have no time to match your sentences with my answers...
dailies count, so you have 3 encounters+ 1 daily(man, you cant use 2 at the same time) still not 6...(6 is the number of skills you need to be crits a row to kill 1 PvP specced mage(the squishiest of all), so even ifyou are insanely lucky all and all your skills will crit+ none of your attacks will be deflected there is no chance you will kill some1 1v1 in 1 burst)
bigger sword= more damage, i admit it... but shield should be equal to more durability, more chance to deflect(it is easier to deflect with shield than with 2h sword)... but it is actually not, and somehow that big red guy with big sword can deflect attacks better, than guardian using a shield (if we think logically, even if you are not using shield to block frontal attacks some hits will not reach you, even if you just carry a shield(it is justlogic, nothing of this is part of this game)
not 30+, even mages get 35+... and 5k is noticeable...(all about HPs, when you wrote, that 5k is good vs 30k) but 1 thingy... 5k is a crit, and your chance to crit is way too low, also do not forget about deflect...
and about rich enough... why to compare low geared players? it is nearly the same as comparing level 30 characters... ofc all comparitions are made on top or close to top gears/enchancements...(i think you can understand everything here)
about your statement that i forgot about blocking cc: did not you hear, that ray of frost freezes you through block, and then CW will land all the damage and CC, or just SoEA from behind to prone and then CClock, GWF- sprint through him and prone, then chain your skills... tr- just atk from behind, HR- melee and **** GF, or range and break his block in 2 shoots, then endless roots... and DCs are not supposed to kill GFs, really...
and GWF just uses unstoppable for CC immune, that breaks any CC but prone...(comparition of GF's way to avoid CC and GWF's- GF's block is pretty easy to bypass+ it block effectiveness if you are fighting against more than 1 enemy, while GWF just ignores CC, and can have tanky build without losing too much of his damage, so after he started to use his unstoppables he will lose almost no health, unless team is nicely cooperated and somehow you burst him in between of his "BIG UGLY RED GUY MODEs"... and his unstoppable gets more effective the more ppl he is fighting, unlike GF, who can fight only 1 v 1 without being locked...
ranged are annoying for GFs(and other ranged classes)... when i play TR- ranged is not a problem, if i play GWF- i just go in and **** people
(TR with his invis will most likely land a 1st hit+ he will be already in range, so he will have an advantage,
GWF with unstoppable and his speed will be able to go through any wall of enemies to reach the one he wants
the question is: what can GF offer to compare?)
so you need a Daily+an encounter ONLY to get same effect as GWFs get on tab, and they have it nearly 24/7, while you can have it less than 10% of time you are fighting...+ do not forget about 50% mitigation buff on unstoppable...
+ you lose 2 skill slots, and only to get weaker effect, than tab+ in PvP you have no tab(and tbh his shift is also the weakest of all)
and... even with this 2 skills... unstoppable is activated even while in CC(but prone), and it is done instantly, while GF has long cast animation on both buffs, and none of them is CC breaker+ can be interrupted by any CC...
GWF is not a selfish, he is self-sufficient... he provides the same support as GF, but also can go 1 vs 3 to kill 1 and escape, can just run through enemies to disorganise them, can enter 1 vs 5, get dropped to 10% HP and safely escape, while GF will be locked even by 2 guys
SM GF gets the same passive, but he cant use it effectively, as he has no unstoppable, and has no speed of GWF, so even if he uses VM for CCimmune, what can he do?(actually he will not be able to use theese skills: he is proned, gets up b4 the 2nd prone arrives, tries to use VM- interrupt by 2nd prone and so on(the fact you got proned for the 1st time means that somehow enemy can bypass your block and will do it more))... GWF needs this to avoid chain prones to instantly proc unstoppable and continue <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> ppl...
about 40%DR... GWF gets 50% mitigation just by activating unstoppable... so combine it with 40% mitigation from gears, then their terrifying high deflect chance... and we will see much higher potential health...(and it is all, when GWF still has much more damage)
and im looking on GF not only dmg wise- i compared him to GWF- he has EVERYTHING worse, so GF is a class, that is not superior at anything... (all GF can do GWF can do better, or at least the same way... and actually not only GWF, for surviving under pressure, kiting, supportiong, bursting, dealing constant dmg... for every role there is a class, other than GWF, that can do it better, than GF... so i dont see any role for GF in both PvE and PvP for now...
oh, wait... i lied, he can be really awesome in PvE in early game: pre 60 and early 60s, and in PvP he can obliterate everything in 50-59 room, as ppl there are mostly not experienced enough to counter you...
about spaces... was hurrying, so did not press enter many times it was neccessary, and about space... just a broken button, that works 50/50... im trying to look, if it worked, but sometimes i forget about it, or just do not notice...
and to fix broken GWF^_^ just to remove a guy, that is just better at everything...
1. The changes on the preview shard.
2. Marked enemies receive 8 % more dmg (instead of lower damage resistance. Its useless in the pve endgame, because most characters already have 24% ap).
3. If a GF marks a foe, its perma till his death.
And still we would need some love for the at-wills.
GWF only has battle fury.
and no one else has passive team buffs why should gf.
Sorrowful i believe you are right about wizards and gf but only with ray of frost. Other than that they don't have much to get past the shield and honestly if its a 1v1 that wizard better pray i don't crit on a knock down cause that will lead to another and he will be getting hit back for most of the damage he is hitting me with if I have sos and I'm immune to damage for most of the time while thats up and again after i activate again.
Plus I still have lunging bull rush and crescendo for easy knocks if thats what I'm running. Using into the fray is amazing for getting out the gate and capping points before the other team even gets past the gate add in mastery steal time from a cw the 2 points are already capped add in a nature buff with the 10% for 10 sec speed boost we've already made it to the third.
I am usually with my group because I can support them and they can support me. I use knights valor which would reduce the damage taken by my team and i can block the damage to me from far away just by looking at them. My base damage resist is already 52% with a 40% deflect so ray of frost won't hurt and if i break out early from the freeze most of the damage from those spells won't really matter too much and i have 32k hp without even stacking any.
I can get temp hp if I'm using my encounter for it and i can heal better than a gwf with fighters recovery my regen and ls is nice enough so i wouldn't even have to truly worry about it.
Then again I don't care for pvp much not to say I'm not good at it but its all pretty pointless unless you are 15k+ because you have a higher chance of the enemy team being pre made and your team being either the same as you or way way lower with the added possibility of having 1 person that has a good gs and enchants.
And at 12.8k GS i have almost no trouble in almost any dungeon even with a good or bad team because i make them all better and make it so they don't have to dodge anything save the highest damage. See one of the problems is that gf is a tank but not many really plays it like it is one and really if I'm alone in pvp and not taking or contesting a point I'm doing something wrong; a lot of people look at gf and only see low damage, I only see great party synergy through mechanics.
I leave the 1v1s to the gwf and the tr thats their deal thats why they were made gf is meant to tank and support the party and maybe knock a few fools down after all whats the use in tanking if theres no one to tank for.
GWF is self sufficient in pvp only because they can unstoppable, run, get on a horse to pot and really unstoppable is the only trait that makes gwf even possible otherwise they'd get crushed just like the rest just ask anyone who played pvp with one when it bugged out..... long story short, they died.
For fun and to see the proof in that run a spellplague without hitting tab you'll probably die once every few encounters unless its with a 3 cw group and your team will say you suck and ask in caps why aren't you using unstoppable? Then they will leave i promise.
Without it we are basically the same survival-wise only i still protect party and you have very few ways of doing it aside from killing them regardless of paragon.
and a good gf gwf combo is a beauteous thing to behold..... ALL the knockdowns.
Add in a tr 2 spike damagers 2 knockers 1 protector add a cw.... you get the idea.