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Astral Shield makes tanks obsolete
eisrabe1902
Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 31
Astral Shield, by far the most powerful skill. Its value is so immense that even the most squishy damage dealer standing inside becomes more durable than any full-def tank outside. Just the defense buff of it is so immense with an overkill amount of heal on top of it (plus the clerics drawback of -40% heal to himself does NOT apply).
It's a nice and maybe necessary skill to enable starters learning and grabbing their gear but on the other hand it is the big carefree-button (with enough power on the cleric) encouraging everyone to completely disregard their own defense stats and skills.
The big problem however is that in PvE it makes any kind of Tank obsolete when it enables glasscanon builds to tank the biggest evil as long as they are disciplined enough to remain in the circle.
In PvP it decides teamfights with ease rendering the team almost unkillable, again enabling glasscanon builds to become reckless, stationary and still durable like a tank while their damage is still on overdrive.
I wished that combination of extreme buff and heal would be the result of skillfully mixing cleric powers with a lot of things that can go wrong in the casting process but its just the result of pressing one button for one reliable skill that compliantly works and gives the ultimate carefree-status...
It's a nice and maybe necessary skill to enable starters learning and grabbing their gear but on the other hand it is the big carefree-button (with enough power on the cleric) encouraging everyone to completely disregard their own defense stats and skills.
The big problem however is that in PvE it makes any kind of Tank obsolete when it enables glasscanon builds to tank the biggest evil as long as they are disciplined enough to remain in the circle.
In PvP it decides teamfights with ease rendering the team almost unkillable, again enabling glasscanon builds to become reckless, stationary and still durable like a tank while their damage is still on overdrive.
I wished that combination of extreme buff and heal would be the result of skillfully mixing cleric powers with a lot of things that can go wrong in the casting process but its just the result of pressing one button for one reliable skill that compliantly works and gives the ultimate carefree-status...
Post edited by eisrabe1902 on
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Also this thread reminded me of this http://www.tentonhammer.com/node/249375 and another one that cant really remember, its far longer than that one.
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Don't try this against a PvP-specced deflect halfling cleric. They will troll you for minutes while their party blow you to smithereens.
Only focus down first PvE squishy DCs. If you meet GCTRL clones, CC/ignore and focus CW/HR.
Also the OP is a big exaggeration. AS doesn't make anyone invincible, it can barely keep a party alive in hard fights such as VT/CN last bosses and PvP, and we're talking very geared DCs here. Actually in PvP, any focused team can kill me quite fast even inside the AS, even with me dodging, because there's so much burst happening at one time.
So leave this skill alone.
You clearly haven't played long enough to realize its only situational.
And on PvP, Most clerics don't even use astral shield, as its like throwing a big beacon saying " hey DC over there, throw him outside and kill it"
It's not a matter of time to face the situation that most damage dealers survive tanking although they disregard their own defensive skills/stats. So either you like the situation that tanking as a task is obsolete or you agree there is something odd about the popularity of 4xDamageDealer + 1xDC groups.
And in my view it is no exaggeration to say that the power of Astral Shield plays a big role in that.
The reason they do 4xCW + 1xDC is because the CW control everything. CC ftw!
The reason that tanks aren't as popular is due to the design decision of moar addz! it's not due to not wanting a tank, it's due to having so many minions coming to help that it takes (to many people) that many wizards stopping them to survive.
It's completely possible and viable to clear any dungeon with a tank type. Those who decide to do stuff speedy and cheaty (although speed does not necessarily mean cheating) go with the ones that blow stuff up faster.
As for PVP, as it was said, a DC in the shield is quickly a punted DC without a way to get back into the shield. While the halfling deflect types try to live through the burst, my dwarf quite often just ignores the punt.
Moreover, to claim that Astral Shield makes a group invincible is suspect at best; it very much sounds as though the OP hasn't managed content more challenging than Cloak Tower epic. I assure you, it is more than possible to die very quickly indeed if you're careless, whether you're in the Astral Shield or outside it, with a healthy level of damage mitigation.
If the dungeons were tuned properly, there would be fewer mobs, hitting harder, and we'd need a sturdy, threat-heavy tank, AS or no. To spot a problem that underlies all PvE content and randomly blame Astral Shield is to demonstrate a lack of understanding that is almost impressive. It's a bit like blaming THE IMMIGRANTS for your <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> hair
Stacking double Astral Shields AND 100% uptime on Astral Shield, as existed long, long ago on Beta <-- now that combo makes anyone a tank.
Sounds like you read some antiquated guide written in Beta or just after, played a little (yes, reaching level 60 in this game is only playing a little) and think you understand the game. You don't.
Play into T2s and higher or play in serious PvP premades, then come back here and try to make the same statements with a straight face...
It is rather those annoying people that spam we need 2-3 Control Wizards that is wrong. They have already nerfed Astral Shield that Clerics use quite a lot. My DC with best gs has currently 13,3k gs and do I feel that Clerics are very powerful in PvP? No 1 on 1 situation I would not consider Cleric to be among the stongest classes. That said Cleric is a healer/buff/supporter class and can of course affect battle in PvP so team wins.
Anyway my 11k Rogue kills more and it is not uncommon my Rogue sometimes is even best of 10 players in 5vs5 PvP, but for a Cleric it is very tough thing to achieve.
If we really look for nerfs why not nerf Rogue INT stealth build and Control Wizard and Hunter Ranger? This attitude we need no Guardian Fighter or Great Weapon Fighter has more to do with that the above 3 DPS are so powerful. Personally I loathe this we need many wizards attitude lol you do not need a single wizard for Dwarf King Gauntlgrym. Do you think my DC 13,3k is a God? No he has not managed to win endboss in Valindras Towers after the patch though I have never tried that with a team of 15k+ average gs group.
Finally tanks take aggro from enemies. Even my DC 13,3k becomes annoyed in DK Gauntlgrym(which is easy compared to Castle Never or Valindras Tower) if there is no player taking aggro. However instead of force try to recruit a Wizard I want either at least 1 Control Wizard OR a tank Guardian Fighter in the group.
As a matter of fact it is impossible for you to know how experienced I am.
You seem to measure my "experience" by the intensity of difference between your opinion and mine, which is a long shot at most.
Regarding that, I don't feel like I need to add how valid your point seems to me.