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Is it really hard to gear up now?

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  • colonelwingcolonelwing Member Posts: 1,448 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    s1ssy wrote: »
    What are you even talking about? I was referring to the fact that most people in the LFG-Channel are looking for T2-Dungeons or higher, meaning that if you want to find anyone running T1-Dungeons in that channel you're out of luck.
    The most I ever found spamming that channel for like 30 minutes were 3 people and guess what: We ended up queueing. Found Idris, someone not in our Party declined the queue, we weren't able to find anything else during the last 5 minutes, so we essentially did nothing the whole DD.


    You stated, that it is hard to do t2 dungeons with your setup. I explained to you, why.

  • khimera906khimera906 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 898 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    The way it was before, you could get all the T2 gear with less then 200K AD in the AH. No skill and no experience was needed, just some AD. You got into a dungeon with players that didn't even know how to play but they were all geared up. There was no point to blue gear or even to T1 purple gear. Now there is actual progression in getting your gear. Blue gear is not as rare anymore so gear-up in blue and start earning you purple gear PROGRESSIVELY, just as games are meant to be played.
    I think it's harder, in the sense that you have to actually do dungeons to earn gear and you don't have the commodity of buying it for next to nothing from the AH, but I think that's fine, it's harder in the right way.
    I hate dancing with Lady Luck. She always steps on my toes.
  • fallenhawkfallenhawk Member Posts: 6 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    Two people who think harder is the right away to play this game. I think it just how they been playing in other games and I ask why it should be an one give me an answer that came own to "it just should be" . I being to think that some of just don't want it to change from the other MMORPG because you just use to the slow and hard way . I ask you maybe it time for a change in game play . Not saying to have it sever in on a silver plate just not the same grind and slow way .
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  • colonelwingcolonelwing Member Posts: 1,448 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    fallenhawk wrote: »
    Two people who think harder is the right away to play this game. I think it just how they been playing in other games and I ask why it should be an one give me an answer that came own to "it just should be" . I being to think that some of just don't want it to change from the other MMORPG because you just use to the slow and hard way . I ask you maybe it time for a change in game play . Not saying to have it sever in on a silver plate just not the same grind and slow way .


    Are you able to comprehend my former post? I took the time to explain to you, why the BoP changes are good... [page 6, post #55]


    enjoy.

  • fallenhawkfallenhawk Member Posts: 6 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    Are you able to comprehend my former post? I took the time to explain to you, why the BoP changes are good... [page 6, post #55]


    enjoy.
    Only thing good and it a bad thing about BOP is greed .
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  • stormdrag0nstormdrag0n Member Posts: 3,222 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    I see the ghost of Vanilla wow all over this thread.
    Always Looking for mature laidback players/rpers for Dungeon Delves!
  • fallenhawkfallenhawk Member Posts: 6 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    I see the ghost of Vanilla wow all over this thread.
    In what way if I might ask?
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  • gek1956gek1956 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    The vast majority of pro BOP posts in here come from established players either with early beta join dates or guild/cartel players who regularly farm these epic DDs. BOP Makes it far easier for them to equip their alts and mains. It has turned the loot chest into a buffet. It relatively easy for a few maxed out toons to chauffeur their less equipped teammates to success. In just a few runs, far easier than before, poorer alts are able to pull their own weight, making their clique that much stronger. On the flip side the reduced supply of unbound gear turns the AH into scalper's paradise.

    I have a good idea why these people post. All the 'gear progression' and 'supply and demand' and ''poor player not worthy' pseudo-babble is , at its best, overbearing and hypocritical self justification of their own greed. At its worst its simply the 'haves' slow trolling the 'have nots'. Notice all of the join dates, profiteering boasts, and descriptions of cadillac uber alts, and judge accordingly.

    What I'm hearing is an entrenched minority that has just been handed a windfall trying to shout down the arguments of the newer , as yet un-aligned, or guildless players who are left out in the cold by this radical gameshift.

    What I am not hearing from these veterans, these DD gladiators, these long term community members and potential community leaders is anything constructive. Instead of talking down to you inferiors, why don't you help?

    So this is a challenge, dungeon heroes : HELP THESE PEOPLE!!

    I don't hear any offers to mentor. I don't hear any friendly party/guild invites. /LFG is a joke if you are not already 'in the know'. I'm glad they got it out of zone chat, so now I can turn it off.

    Come on geniuses, Put up or shut up.

    Don't bother offering help to me. I don't like this dungeon model. I saw enough 50k to 100k HP minions in the 'Lairs' of Champions online. I've seen enough of them to last me the rest of my MMO career. There's plenty of other good level 60 content here. I love the Foundry. NWO's 'Dungeons' are a just modified from an older Cryptic game. I posted a thread on that here:

    http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?484981-From-Lairs-to-Dungeons-to-Flowers

    But they are the'"Dungeons' of this dungeons and dragons game, and a lot of the new players want to do them, and can't, and its hurting the game. Running people off.

    So come on boys, pony up. Help these rookies. If you want to keep BOP because its good gaming system, prove it. TEACH IT.

    Because if you don't there's a lot of the rest of us who are pretty sure we know why.
  • junichiroujunichirou Member Posts: 51 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    I'd like to not find T1 items in T2 dungeon chests. At least.

    Even if I'm mainly receiving accessories from the chest, once in a while I find a piece of set, but when that piece is a T1 and my party-mates are congratulating themselves for the T2 pieces they found I get really sad with the chest system.

    I also think that glory/seal/coin items could be account-bound instead of character-bound, but if that's not possible, at least the rough AD refinement cap should be increased (as we are now "bound" to salvage for rough AD), because some days I'm making more rough AD than I can refine and I will eventually need to "stop" collecting rough AD because it isn't useful in that "blocked" state...
  • diogene0diogene0 Member Posts: 2,894 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    It's actually easier since we can chose the set part we want. But it looks like it's harder for most people, so i guess that 50% of the players here were used to just buy their sets on the AH and try to play the game. Now i know why some people keep complaining that the game has "too many adds", if you skip T1 and T2 farming to gear up, there's something wrong and you'll never l2p. :/
  • grimahgrimah Member Posts: 1,658 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    its quicker because of the new changes, i got my gf full T2 after 2-3 runs of each.

    however, its difficult because the "pros" dont do these dungeons anymore, so you are left with alot of un-exped people. this is fine with most of them, but spider is a pain without a set of decent players.
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  • ryonasryonas Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 158 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    i think it is hard gearing up for several reasons

    the T1 to T2 Switch is bad not fluid enough for players undergeared
    Experienced players with gears don't need to do T2 Dungeons anymore so who does the T2 dungeons it is the under-geared players yet the PVE combat style is terrible for under-geared players

    it is totally bad and if someone says go to your guild to do it - sorry but Guild players wanna do DD in MC or CN and wont bother doing it for under-geared players cryptic needs to change it for pub parties are horrible which scales toward failing doing the dungeon
  • trollgretrollgre Member Posts: 297
    edited September 2013
    lots of players were blinded bec you can pick what part you want now

    before if you got set part that you dont want you can sell it to AH then buy the set that you want
    also before you can farm the helm sell it to AH then buy other parts

    but now you need to do dungeons even if you dont like doing it
    there are many reasons why

    they killed the AH with BoP
    they did not remove trash(blue items) from DD chest
    you can stil lget T1 items from T2 dungeons

    items at AH are limited now, limited that you wont even see some set items on AH
    most items from AH now were farmed before they implement BoP
  • l3l3l3l3l3l3l3l3 Member Posts: 73
    edited September 2013
    Poll says it all really.
  • arcademasterarcademaster Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    trollgre wrote: »
    before if you got set part that you dont want you can sell it to AH then buy the set that you want
    also before you can farm the helm sell it to AH then buy other parts

    Hardly, there was one OP set that everybody wanted that was ridiculously expensive, and the other sets were worth only a fraction of that. So you still had to get 5 or 6 drops and sell them to get the one you actually want. I dunno about other classes, but for GF it was absolutely the worst. A piece of Stalwart Bulwark? 1-2 Million. Any other set? <50k. Good luck buying that up just with selling drops.
  • s3ven0fmines3ven0fmine Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    gek1956 wrote: »
    The vast majority of pro BOP posts in here come from established players either with early beta join dates or guild/cartel players who regularly farm these epic DDs. BOP Makes it far easier for them to equip their alts and mains. It has turned the loot chest into a buffet. It relatively easy for a few maxed out toons to chauffeur their less equipped teammates to success. In just a few runs, far easier than before, poorer alts are able to pull their own weight, making their clique that much stronger. On the flip side the reduced supply of unbound gear turns the AH into scalper's paradise.

    I have a good idea why these people post. All the 'gear progression' and 'supply and demand' and ''poor player not worthy' pseudo-babble is , at its best, overbearing and hypocritical self justification of their own greed. At its worst its simply the 'haves' slow trolling the 'have nots'. Notice all of the join dates, profiteering boasts, and descriptions of cadillac uber alts, and judge accordingly.

    What I'm hearing is an entrenched minority that has just been handed a windfall trying to shout down the arguments of the newer , as yet un-aligned, or guildless players who are left out in the cold by this radical gameshift.

    What I am not hearing from these veterans, these DD gladiators, these long term community members and potential community leaders is anything constructive. Instead of talking down to you inferiors, why don't you help?

    So this is a challenge, dungeon heroes : HELP THESE PEOPLE!!

    I don't hear any offers to mentor. I don't hear any friendly party/guild invites. /LFG is a joke if you are not already 'in the know'. I'm glad they got it out of zone chat, so now I can turn it off.

    Come on geniuses, Put up or shut up.

    Don't bother offering help to me. I don't like this dungeon model. I saw enough 50k to 100k HP minions in the 'Lairs' of Champions online. I've seen enough of them to last me the rest of my MMO career. There's plenty of other good level 60 content here. I love the Foundry. NWO's 'Dungeons' are a just modified from an older Cryptic game. I posted a thread on that here:

    http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?484981-From-Lairs-to-Dungeons-to-Flowers

    But they are the'"Dungeons' of this dungeons and dragons game, and a lot of the new players want to do them, and can't, and its hurting the game. Running people off.

    So come on boys, pony up. Help these rookies. If you want to keep BOP because its good gaming system, prove it. TEACH IT.

    Because if you don't there's a lot of the rest of us who are pretty sure we know why.

    Not agreeing with BoP does not mean i need to "put up or shut up" as you say. The dungeons are NO LONGER WORTH RUNNING if you have your gear. Why would I run those dungeons now? Its not my responsibility to gear they new level 60s. SO LISTEN UP SO YOU CAN UNDERSTAND ITS NOT HARD!! We are complaining FOR the new level 60s. All my alts are geared and I'm sitting on millions of AD. I find it ****ty that they will NEVER get to the enchant level that beta players are at WITHOUT purchasing zen. That was the whole point of BoP and its made this game more stale. The new 60 who wants to PvP really cant because he will be smashed by people with perfect enchants/rank 8-10s and he can do nothing to fix it short of P2W. Hope this clears it up for you because your whole post was an attack on us when we are trying to help the 60s by having BoP removed.
  • trollgretrollgre Member Posts: 297
    edited September 2013
    Hardly, there was one OP set that everybody wanted that was ridiculously expensive, and the other sets were worth only a fraction of that. So you still had to get 5 or 6 drops and sell them to get the one you actually want. I dunno about other classes, but for GF it was absolutely the worst. A piece of Stalwart Bulwark? 1-2 Million. Any other set? <50k. Good luck buying that up just with selling drops.

    you can farm the best gear then sell it to buy cheaper items
    stalwart on dragon is lower than 1M
    3 parts is easy to get they hardest is helm (helm 500-700k / armor 100k / gloves and boots are cheap)

    before , if you got all the items you can sell it to buy gears for your alts
    now , got all the item? DD items = Salvage

    they killed seals glory and grym coins too (if you can transfer items through bank it will still be useful)
  • koalazebra1koalazebra1 Member Posts: 1,173 Bounty Hunter
    edited September 2013
    for new players it would be hard as hell, even for PvP gear cause they'll end up getting stomped by geared players (who are also bored of doing dungeons so they PvP instead). me and my friends only play pvp nowadays and we make sure when we get matched with fresh 60s we dont let their team get enough points to receive glory :) - don't hate the player, hate the game!
  • dgfdsdgsgh3dgfdsdgsgh3 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 127 Bounty Hunter
    edited September 2013
    In my opinion the hardest part with T2 and beyond at the moment is changes made to CW with sharandar patch. Too many players still think chaining singularity is a valid(and doable) tactic to get rid of adds. Many CWs themselves need to shake some cobwebs from their brains and rethink their tactics.

    As it currently is, the time it takes to build up your singularity and push those poor <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> to their demise you might aswell have nuked them down in the same time with a lot less hassle. Bring out the AoE cannons because there is damage to be dealt.
  • kolbe11kolbe11 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    In my opinion the hardest part with T2 and beyond at the moment is changes made to CW with sharandar patch. Too many players still think chaining singularity is a valid(and doable) tactic to get rid of adds. Many CWs themselves need to shake some cobwebs from their brains and rethink their tactics.

    As it currently is, the time it takes to build up your singularity and push those poor <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> to their demise you might aswell have nuked them down in the same time with a lot less hassle. Bring out the AoE cannons because there is damage to be dealt.

    Good luck with that method in CN!
    "It is said that idle hands are the Devil's tools: Idle geek hands, however, came up with gunpowder, nuclear weapons, and toilet plungers." -Illiad
  • jn2002dk1jn2002dk1 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    for new players it would be hard as hell, even for PvP gear cause they'll end up getting stomped by geared players (who are also bored of doing dungeons so they PvP instead). me and my friends only play pvp nowadays and we make sure when we get matched with fresh 60s we dont let their team get enough points to receive glory :) - don't hate the player, hate the game!
    That's called being a ****** and it's got little to do with the actual game. It's a personality flaw which will hopefully diminish as you grow up
  • rki2rki2 Member Posts: 57
    edited September 2013
    jn2002dk1 wrote: »
    That's called being a ****** and it's got little to do with the actual game. It's a personality flaw which will hopefully diminish as you grow up

    since when are players obliged to help fresh 60s get their pvp gear, there's nothing wrong with what he's doing. Its the reality, fresh 60s will have to endure hell to get epics
  • colonelwingcolonelwing Member Posts: 1,448 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    ryonas wrote: »
    i think it is hard gearing up for several reasons

    the T1 to T2 Switch is bad not fluid enough for players undergeared
    Experienced players with gears don't need to do T2 Dungeons anymore so who does the T2 dungeons it is the under-geared players yet the PVE combat style is terrible for under-geared players

    it is totally bad and if someone says go to your guild to do it - sorry but Guild players wanna do DD in MC or CN and wont bother doing it for under-geared players cryptic needs to change it for pub parties are horrible which scales toward failing doing the dungeon



    Nice "guild" you got there. :rolleyes:

  • nakzernakzer Member Posts: 18 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    Sry but..
    1st of all I dont believe anything you say..
    Second of all you are a forum fanboi that will say anything and invent anything to make your bogus posts seem valid...Also you just seem to agree with other fanbois : ladysylvia, diogene0
    etc the same 3 people defending this injustice over and over again ...so anything you say is invalid because your reputation of that of a fanboi , dismisser and the fact that on every post you just want to make yourself look like the bigger person...
    Its sad and it hurts the game..
    The #1 fact is that gearing now is WAY HARDER than it was before and no belittleling from fanbois is gonna change that...
  • sangrinesangrine Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 575 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    Yesterday, I sold T1 GWF bracers for 165k AD in the AH.
    The bracers were a boss drop in the easy Fardelver crypt.
    Any lvl 60 player can do Fardelver crypt, including players who do not pvp.
    Yes, T1/T2 gear is very expensive to buy. On the other hand, it's now more profitable to sell T1/T2 gear.
    I earn more AD now, than before.
    Previously, I almost never hit daily refine limit. Now, I hit refine limit every day on my main character and occasionally send items to my alt to be salvaged.
  • pers3phonepers3phone Banned Users, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    grimah wrote: »
    its quicker because of the new changes, i got my gf full T2 after 2-3 runs of each.

    however, its difficult because the "pros" dont do these dungeons anymore, so you are left with alot of un-exped people. this is fine with most of them, but spider is a pain without a set of decent players.

    You were just lucky :) I got 2 T2 items in a single day, then had to run SP for more than a week to get my last HV piece, 30+ runs. Also, the tank I ran with, he still does SP even today, it's been a month or so and no T2 for him. The chest drops being BoP is aggravating this RnG issue, because you cannot just AH what you got so you can buy what you need, you have to salvage for rough AD, which we all know are useless for an active player. Besides a few drops, many loot from T2s is extremely cheap so even if you win, if it's not something like HV cap/chest, you won't make a significant profit out of it.

    So as always, sometimes the ability to buy things is offsetting the RnG drops, so it's a good thing IMO. I think (all) people should work for their gear not buy it, but sometimes mechanisms must be put in place to alleviate bad luck. When you forge through the same dungeon 2 weeks and you still don't get your needed piece of gear, something like an ever increasing chance of tier drop should kick in to help.
    sangrine wrote: »
    Yesterday, I sold T1 GWF bracers for 165k AD in the AH.
    The bracers were a boss drop in the easy Fardelver crypt.

    More luck. I did that dungeon 5-6 times each day for more than 6 weeks, and guess what, all that I got was salvageable <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>...

    The conclusion is that if RnG works for you, it doesn't mean it works for everybody, so the unlucky should be protected through some ingame mechanism, after they worked enough for their gear. What is enough? Up for discussion.
  • diogene0diogene0 Member Posts: 2,894 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    nakzer wrote: »
    defending this injustice

    LOL, it's just a game, take a breath, relax... I keep saying it's not an issue because:
    - I have a guild with ok players. They can help a lot.
    - I'm a good player. Really.
    - I read builds on the forums.
    - I know how to make my way to /lfg
    - I have a good friendlist, full of people who don't enjoy cheating (ie: great players).

    Anyone can get several or all of these items. Being a good player yourself will make a difference in a party with average or under average players. You can save the run. That's up to you to become better, get more control/dps/heals/whatever to achieve that. Your build and your playstyle will make a difference. Your gear, not so much, provided it's at least purple (no need to get a set) with some r5 enchantments on it, you can win all the content in game easily.

    And i don't complain because i'm human, i know how to anticipate change, i can adapt, find new ways, etc. :o
  • khimera906khimera906 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 898 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    rki2 wrote: »
    since when are players obliged to help fresh 60s get their pvp gear, there's nothing wrong with what he's doing. Its the reality, fresh 60s will have to endure hell to get epics
    So there is nothing wrong with deliberately making life harder for somebody else just for fun? You have no obligation to help anyone, though that would be very nice of you. So he admits he know that is hard for new player and he just makes it even harder. Why? Well for no reason, actually. "That's called being a ****** and it's got little to do with the actual game. It's a personality flaw which will hopefully diminish as you grow up" is pretty accurate.
    I hate dancing with Lady Luck. She always steps on my toes.
  • cribstaxxxcribstaxxx Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 1,300 Bounty Hunter
    edited September 2013
    sangrine wrote: »
    Yesterday, I sold T1 GWF bracers for 165k AD in the AH.
    The bracers were a boss drop in the easy Fardelver crypt.
    Any lvl 60 player can do Fardelver crypt, including players who do not pvp.
    Yes, T1/T2 gear is very expensive to buy. On the other hand, it's now more profitable to sell T1/T2 gear.
    I earn more AD now, than before.
    Previously, I almost never hit daily refine limit. Now, I hit refine limit every day on my main character and occasionally send items to my alt to be salvaged.

    Exactly! every drop is worth more than it was pre-patch and the gear is 3x easier to farm. So say you're looking for your T2 chest piece. You run spider and your exact chest that you wanted drops, you get it (as BoE) but you don't get your chest piece from the DD chest. What do you do? Sell the **** thing for 600k and keep farming DD for your BoP chestpiece... you will gear up faster AND get better enchants quicker with this system, guaranteed.

    I have made far more money and dungeons feel much more rewarding after patch. Anyone who cries "luck", did you not have the same random chance at loot pre-patch? Except even when you got "lucky" pre patch the gear you won sold for 1/4 of what it does now. If you simply aren't willing to ever step foot in a dungeon then you have basis to complain that you are gearing up slower.

    If you can't find groups then join a guild, there are many PvE guilds that will take lower GS guildees. If you refuse to join a guild and will ONLY use Q system then again, you have no basis to complain as you are handicapping (not derogatory in any way) yourself.
    Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
    We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
  • fallenhawkfallenhawk Member Posts: 6 Arc User
    edited September 2013
    diogene0 wrote: »

    And i don't complain because i'm human, i know how to anticipate change, i can adapt, find new ways, etc. :o
    No you can't or you won't be holding on to the old ways so mush.

    I'll ask again ,Why should gearing up be hard or/and long? Better not be "it should be that away".
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    I can still fight.
    I will never give up!
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