Thanks for demonstrating your ignorance on the subject at hand and invalidating anything further you have to say on this or any other matter. I know shills like you get paid to fluff and blow smoke up dev's arses but get better at it please.
used to be 30+ instances of PE @ 150 each, now there's on average 6 and none are full. combined that with Sharandar #s since a lot of 60s are there and the numbers are down to 30% from before the BOP change.
You can tell the number of people running dungeons by zone/lfg spam and in addition by queueing with a GF as the queue system is coded to always build a party with a GF first for some reason.
Far less people are playing the game and far less people are running dungeons. those that are are newbs without gear or experience and are failing at them in dramatic fashion. I ran all-alt groups to finish gearing out my CW's HV set but heaven help anyone without guild/friends trying to run dungeons nowadays.
I would say that BOP will kill this game but it's already dealt the mortal blow. Enjoy the single player game that is the 3 days it takes to level from 1 to 60 because after that it's becoming a ghost town.
Wow. Cant really even comprehend this lol.
First of all, new events happening causes declines in population in normally concentrated areas.
Second of all the game has been out for what 3 months? I would be interested to see the average population trends for MMO's around the 3 month mark to see if it is comparable with normal retention numbers.
You state i am ignorant then proceed with a highly ignorant post.
I even admitted the experience i have in game is anecdotal, but dont pretend that you have done hard research into it or that is something that is so cut and dried.
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bpskibbenheimsMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 210Bounty Hunter
Except now when you hit 60, there is nothing within AD price range worth getting, and what is there, is overpriced trash compared to preBoP
So....run dungeons, and actually EARN LOOT YOU CAN WEAR. THAT IS WHAT DUNGEONS ARE FOR.
What is wrong with people?
I may have to just sit in PE and spam "Running T1s for freshly dinged 60s in blues/greens: PM me", because everyone seems to have forgotten that's a thing you can do. I mean, once you've got inside (GS req etc) you can do epic cloak tower naked.
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fathomfulMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 207Bounty Hunter
there is nothing within AD price range worth getting
Why would you want to buy your gear with AD anyway? I mean the content is meant to be enjoyed and experienced, the loot is a by product of that experience.
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inthefade462Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited September 2013
Uh yes i've been keeping tabs on numbers, ever since they announced they hit 2 million free accounts created "milestone". and yes I accounted for sharandar, learn to read.
And it wasn't down by 30%, it's down to 30%. again learn to read.
I mean the content is meant to be enjoyed and experienced, the loot is a by product of that experience.
Feel free to ask any new player how they are "enjoying" their "experience." How about you stop posting until you get a clue?
So....run dungeons, and actually EARN LOOT YOU CAN WEAR. THAT IS WHAT DUNGEONS ARE FOR.
What is wrong with people?
I may have to just sit in PE and spam "Running T1s for freshly dinged 60s in blues/greens: PM me", because everyone seems to have forgotten that's a thing you can do. I mean, once you've got inside (GS req etc) you can do epic cloak tower naked.
So join a guild that runs groups to t2 dungeons or do without? You are not seriously suggesting to use the pug q system are you? Which is 80% fail runs.
So theres nothing "wrong with people". Are you saying you never ever got any t2 gear from ah? Dont be a hypocrite.
Maybe sitting in pe and making groups for new lvl 60s in green and blue would be a charitable thing to do, but you wont change anything.
Why would you want to buy your gear with AD anyway? I mean the content is meant to be enjoyed and experienced, the loot is a by product of that experience.
You never bought t2 gear from the AH?! But now you have all your gear you are proBoP? There is irony here somewhere, i can smell it.
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bpskibbenheimsMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 210Bounty Hunter
Uh yes i've been keeping tabs on numbers, ever since they announced they hit 2 million free accounts created "milestone". and yes I accounted for sharandar, learn to read.
And it wasn't down by 30%, it's down to 30%. again learn to read.
Feel free to ask any new player how they are "enjoying" their "experience." How about you stop posting until you get a clue?
Your misinformation tour should be rebilled as a comedy act. Really.
Quit with the "I have run the numbers this whole time" nonsense because that is all it is, nonsense.
You never bought t2 gear from the AH?! But now you have all your gear you are proBoP? There is irony here somewhere, i can smell it.
Of course i bought it. Hence i get to speak from experience. I said so in a previous post.
I regret buying it. It was broken that i could get it without having to do anything at all. Almost ruined the game for me.
Exploits and BoE combined made the AH flooded with super cheap gear of all kinds. They had to fix it somehow and stall the power curve so the game could survive.
Are you saying you never ever got any t2 gear from ah? Dont be a hypocrite.
Played till I dinged 60, got murdered in PvP till I had enough glory for the T1 PvP set (DC, so getting murdered in PvP was par for the course till I discovered the regen blue armour). Used the T1 PvP armour to run T1s to get a 2/2 set of better T1 armour without loltastic lifesteal (to be fair, I only had to run mad dragon successfully once, for which I am admittedly grateful). Currently running T2s to get a full T2 set. 50% of the way there, but secretly hoping to get 4/4 miracle healers. Rings and so on are almost entirely Drake seal stuff.
I don't really see the problem with this.
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khimera906Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 898Arc User
edited September 2013
The point of BoP is to earn your gear and not buy it from the AH. You can even chose from which set the piece of gear should be. It was fine before, and it's fine now, as far as I am concerned. Bop or not, I don't care. However, the removal of the AD refine cap is a horrible idea. Limiting the possibility to make AD is a very healthy measure. There must be a way to control how much currency is in game to prevent inflation. Having players willing to pay (because they can) as much as it takes for an item will make the prices rise and new players and players whom do not spend as much time/money on the game will not be able the afford anything.
I hate dancing with Lady Luck. She always steps on my toes.
The point of BoP is to restrict AD sources forcing people to buy Zen to convert to AD to get their items..NOTHING MORE NOTHING LESS
Well, my friend, I am still making AD by in-game means, and I don't feel any pressure to spend any real money on the game, now that DD rewards are BoP, do you? The secret for success is adaptability. Anyway, restricting the possibility to make to much AD is not a bad thing. I suggest you try to take your time and play and enjoy the game as it was meant to and stop racing to make a million AD per second.
I hate dancing with Lady Luck. She always steps on my toes.
The point of BoP is to restrict AD sources forcing people to buy Zen to convert to AD to get their items..NOTHING MORE NOTHING LESS
100% true. In fact, every change they do revolves around this. To the people saying "earn your own gear" good
luck to new players trying to farm T2 dungeons with the current player base.
Another prime example was the nerf to the 7 day celestial chests which can give Coalescent Wards. They reduced the chances on that horribly. Look at how much zen its takes to buy one, and than check price on AH.
The AH price is 1/3 the price of buying one with zen. Things like this they company responds to VERY QUICKLY.
Everything else gets ignored.
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krisst0fMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I honestly don't mind BoP and I think it's a good idea. But I wish I had shared bank space so that I could trade items in between my own toons, and I wish that the vendor paid refined diamonds instead of unrefined.
BoE was good to be able to use one of your character and hope to be able to dress them up with gear there is NO WAY anymore you can afford in the AH.
In particular with the Greed/Need option, if you got a TR in your group for example, you will never get the gear for your TR char.
Good luck finding a group where anyone if pushing Greed, aside from guild runs...
Aren't we taking this a little too far? We aren't raising our arms against some great evil, it's just unbridled capitalism.
Of course this poster is taking things too far, It's an opinion, an opinion they feel is right vs other players opinions on the Bop/Boe subject. Fact is Cryptic did a horrible job when developing the loot system in this game, there was no reason to allow the majority of the gear to be Boe with a small amount Bop. It diminishes the value of gear as well as players accomplishments in the game,spending time farming the gear.
I have yet to play a game (Besides Diablo III) where you can rush to the Ah once you reach max level and spend in game currency to buy the best gear without ever having to set foot in a dungeon like I was able to do in Neverwinter. Now Cryptic realizes the mistake they made and they are trying to correct that mistake. Problem now, way too many players got use to the way the old loot system was and now (instead of adapting) they would rather rush the forums in an all for nothing ploy to try and get Cryptic to somehow see the error of their ways and revert the Bop changes. Which of course they are not going to do.
I like the recent changes to the loot system, as well as Cryptics work trying to correct the dungeon exploits to make the game as a whole a lot better. The players who enjoy the game will tough it out why Cryptic makes the Necessary changes to make this game last instead of falling to the wayside like so many other games.
Life is a dream for the wise, a game for the fool, a comedy for the rich, a tragedy for the poor.
~Sholom Aleichem
You know the funny thing about major economic changes in MMOs, the market will go sour for 2-3 months then pick up again as though nothing happened.
Think I'm joking, I predict that by 2014 not only will all the current issues "killing the game" be forgotten, but a new crop of issues will now be "killing the game" and most of those will be centred around the new class and paragon paths.
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gek1956Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
You know the funny thing about major economic changes in MMOs, the market will go sour for 2-3 months then pick up again as though nothing happened.
Think I'm joking, I predict that by 2014 not only will all the current issues "killing the game" be forgotten, but a new crop of issues will now be "killing the game" and most of those will be centred around the new class and paragon paths.
In 2014 it is quite likely, as has happened with many other PWE titles, that the ACTIVE population of this game will have dwindled to a few thousand well heeled players who spend 500$ Us plus per year to pick up 12k plus gear from the game vendors , make lvl7 enh from lockbox drops, and can be maintained on a much smaller server with a smaller staff. Its not the ONLY PWE business model, but it seems to be the prevelant one. Look at Champions Online to see the future.
There is a clear pattern here.. big launch .. cull out the freebies.... cull out the casuals by grinding them to death.. leaving a much more streamlined, profitable product for the true parent company here. Meanwhile the core Cryptic staff, who are EMPLOYEES, will move on to their next assigned project. Often the group left behind to service a well launched game is much less experienced, more prone to mistakes, and will take a few months to get up to speed on quality, but soon you wont even notice. You shouldn't burn Cryptic for things beyond their control.
Don't believe? Watch it play out. I will still be here in 2014. Someone has to be here to get stuff for the upper crust, and it pays well enough to keep me in gear for my self.. CYAS...
Too many bugs are introduced with the patches and too many get 'fixed' by changing the tooltip.
Forcing people to install additional software they don't need (which in my definition IS bloatware) in order to install the game.
I loved Neverwinter, but the devs are taking it to a cash-driven, bug-ridden solo-game.
- BoP needs to change, Bound on 'need, not-bound on 'greed'
- We need a definitive and actual list of all known bugs
- The Devs need to communicate more on the what, why and how of what they're planning. Include the community more on the preview server.
Because as it stands right now, they're killing the game and I'm not playing.
Bolded the big thing I pushed for with BOP before they added it in.
Only/big thing I think would be a good change on this issue. I like BOP because it keeps people from needing every item in the game to sell as they did back when it was all BoE.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
/Channel_Join NW_Legit_Community to run Dungeons without the exploits
You know the funny thing about major economic changes in MMOs, the market will go sour for 2-3 months then pick up again as though nothing happened.
Think I'm joking, I predict that by 2014 not only will all the current issues "killing the game" be forgotten, but a new crop of issues will now be "killing the game" and most of those will be centred around the new class and paragon paths.
The only grief I personally have with BoP is that I simply will "never" (being a casual gamer) be able to afford any augmented pet, greater/perfect whatever enchants or full rank 7+ slotted gear. I just see no way to generate enough AD to acquire these kind of items. Other then that, I like the idea that you can't just hit 60, strut to the AH/mailbox and suddenly have the gear to facetank Draco and the likes while simultaneously reading a book and preparing a meal.
i did my new cw to 60 today walked up to ah and now have all most end game items and that's day 1 my right sides finished left side got helm and may be better weapon to pick up Later so can still be done just fewer people can do it.
and yes I know weapon and helms tend to cost more but i can afford them mainly trying to pick what weapon I want I kind of like gg main hand for renegade cw but then again i could buy a Mc main hand. its at 11k gs at min and done 0 dungeons so if any thing more stuff needs making bop.
I will tell you 1 thing I am pretty afraid doing a dungeon at min in case I screw up with not doing end game cc before.
The only grief I personally have with BoP is that I simply will "never" (being a casual gamer) be able to afford any augmented pet, greater/perfect whatever enchants or full rank 7+ slotted gear. I just see no way to generate enough AD to acquire these kind of items. Other then that, I like the idea that you can't just hit 60, strut to the AH/mailbox and suddenly have the gear to facetank Draco and the likes while simultaneously reading a book and preparing a meal.
Lol. Then you have no idea how the game work...
I make so many rough ads that i could buy any augment pet. Rank 7 slots can you make with good farming.
And higher gear especially perfect armor/weapon enhancements aren't for casual gamer as easy way. Now it's easier to get the set which you want.
Nice try at being funny, you know the real reason why these calls of things "killing the game" don't bother me, because they never pan out. Let's look at the major issues killing WoW over the years.
Back in Classic (pre-Burning Crusade), the fact that Alliance characters had access to Paladin and Horde had access to Shaman was going to kill the game.
In Burning Crusade the fact that the new Alliance race had Shamans and the new Horde race had Paladins and didn't have warriors was going to kill the game.
In Wrath of the Lich King Death Knights being restricted to characters of level 60+ was going to kill the game.
In Cataclysm the massive changes to the world was going to kill the game.
In Mists of Pandaria Pandas were going to kill the game (Whilst this may appear to be true there are three points to make in order to show that this isn't evidence of the playerbase being right, 1. Even a stopped clock is right twice a day, 2. 1 out of 5 isn't exactly a good track record and this is only the top 5 issues with each Expansion, 3. There are a lot more factors into WoW's lose of playerbase than just Pandas).
Lets take a look at that list, not only are the first two points contradictory, but each is just a group of people latching onto the thing they like least about the new Expansion and attempting to use hyperbole to force Blizzard to reverse the decisions they made.
As I attempted to point out, in three months, not only will Neverwinter still have a healthy playerbase, but all the issues people are complaining about now (including the BoP change) will be forgotten and a load of new issues (mainly about how the new class and paragon paths are "unbalanced" and "broken") will be what's killing the game.
Nice try at being funny, you know the real reason why these calls of things "killing the game" don't bother me, because they never pan out. Let's look at the major issues killing WoW over the years.
Back in Classic (pre-Burning Crusade), the fact that Alliance characters had access to Paladin and Horde had access to Shaman was going to kill the game.
In Burning Crusade the fact that the new Alliance race had Shamans and the new Horde race had Paladins and didn't have warriors was going to kill the game.
In Wrath of the Lich King Death Knights being restricted to characters of level 60+ was going to kill the game.
In Cataclysm the massive changes to the world was going to kill the game.
In Mists of Pandaria Pandas were going to kill the game (Whilst this may appear to be true there are three points to make in order to show that this isn't evidence of the playerbase being right, 1. Even a stopped clock is right twice a day, 2. 1 out of 5 isn't exactly a good track record and this is only the top 5 issues with each Expansion, 3. There are a lot more factors into WoW's lose of playerbase than just Pandas).
Lets take a look at that list, not only are the first two points contradictory, but each is just a group of people latching onto the thing they like least about the new Expansion and attempting to use hyperbole to force Blizzard to reverse the decisions they made.
As I attempted to point out, in three months, not only will Neverwinter still have a healthy playerbase, but all the issues people are complaining about now (including the BoP change) will be forgotten and a load of new issues (mainly about how the new class and paragon paths are "unbalanced" and "broken") will be what's killing the game.
Comments
Wow. Cant really even comprehend this lol.
First of all, new events happening causes declines in population in normally concentrated areas.
Second of all the game has been out for what 3 months? I would be interested to see the average population trends for MMO's around the 3 month mark to see if it is comparable with normal retention numbers.
You state i am ignorant then proceed with a highly ignorant post.
I even admitted the experience i have in game is anecdotal, but dont pretend that you have done hard research into it or that is something that is so cut and dried.
... or that his 30% fewer players claim is base on anything more than he thought it was a good number.
Llamas these days ... Lol
So....run dungeons, and actually EARN LOOT YOU CAN WEAR. THAT IS WHAT DUNGEONS ARE FOR.
What is wrong with people?
I may have to just sit in PE and spam "Running T1s for freshly dinged 60s in blues/greens: PM me", because everyone seems to have forgotten that's a thing you can do. I mean, once you've got inside (GS req etc) you can do epic cloak tower naked.
Why would you want to buy your gear with AD anyway? I mean the content is meant to be enjoyed and experienced, the loot is a by product of that experience.
And it wasn't down by 30%, it's down to 30%. again learn to read.
Feel free to ask any new player how they are "enjoying" their "experience." How about you stop posting until you get a clue?
So join a guild that runs groups to t2 dungeons or do without? You are not seriously suggesting to use the pug q system are you? Which is 80% fail runs.
So theres nothing "wrong with people". Are you saying you never ever got any t2 gear from ah? Dont be a hypocrite.
Maybe sitting in pe and making groups for new lvl 60s in green and blue would be a charitable thing to do, but you wont change anything.
You never bought t2 gear from the AH?! But now you have all your gear you are proBoP? There is irony here somewhere, i can smell it.
Your misinformation tour should be rebilled as a comedy act. Really.
Quit with the "I have run the numbers this whole time" nonsense because that is all it is, nonsense.
Of course i bought it. Hence i get to speak from experience. I said so in a previous post.
I regret buying it. It was broken that i could get it without having to do anything at all. Almost ruined the game for me.
Exploits and BoE combined made the AH flooded with super cheap gear of all kinds. They had to fix it somehow and stall the power curve so the game could survive.
Played till I dinged 60, got murdered in PvP till I had enough glory for the T1 PvP set (DC, so getting murdered in PvP was par for the course till I discovered the regen blue armour). Used the T1 PvP armour to run T1s to get a 2/2 set of better T1 armour without loltastic lifesteal (to be fair, I only had to run mad dragon successfully once, for which I am admittedly grateful). Currently running T2s to get a full T2 set. 50% of the way there, but secretly hoping to get 4/4 miracle healers. Rings and so on are almost entirely Drake seal stuff.
I don't really see the problem with this.
try to play the game and not to buy everything...
100% true. In fact, every change they do revolves around this. To the people saying "earn your own gear" good
luck to new players trying to farm T2 dungeons with the current player base.
Another prime example was the nerf to the 7 day celestial chests which can give Coalescent Wards. They reduced the chances on that horribly. Look at how much zen its takes to buy one, and than check price on AH.
The AH price is 1/3 the price of buying one with zen. Things like this they company responds to VERY QUICKLY.
Everything else gets ignored.
BoE was good to be able to use one of your character and hope to be able to dress them up with gear there is NO WAY anymore you can afford in the AH.
In particular with the Greed/Need option, if you got a TR in your group for example, you will never get the gear for your TR char.
Good luck finding a group where anyone if pushing Greed, aside from guild runs...
The secret of failure is conformity... people conform and they call it "adapt"..Weaklings adapt to injustices...Wise people fight for what is right...
Aren't we taking this a little too far? We aren't raising our arms against some great evil, it's just unbridled capitalism.
glassdoor.com - Cryptic Studios Review
Of course this poster is taking things too far, It's an opinion, an opinion they feel is right vs other players opinions on the Bop/Boe subject. Fact is Cryptic did a horrible job when developing the loot system in this game, there was no reason to allow the majority of the gear to be Boe with a small amount Bop. It diminishes the value of gear as well as players accomplishments in the game,spending time farming the gear.
I have yet to play a game (Besides Diablo III) where you can rush to the Ah once you reach max level and spend in game currency to buy the best gear without ever having to set foot in a dungeon like I was able to do in Neverwinter. Now Cryptic realizes the mistake they made and they are trying to correct that mistake. Problem now, way too many players got use to the way the old loot system was and now (instead of adapting) they would rather rush the forums in an all for nothing ploy to try and get Cryptic to somehow see the error of their ways and revert the Bop changes. Which of course they are not going to do.
I like the recent changes to the loot system, as well as Cryptics work trying to correct the dungeon exploits to make the game as a whole a lot better. The players who enjoy the game will tough it out why Cryptic makes the Necessary changes to make this game last instead of falling to the wayside like so many other games.
Life is a dream for the wise, a game for the fool, a comedy for the rich, a tragedy for the poor.
~Sholom Aleichem
Think I'm joking, I predict that by 2014 not only will all the current issues "killing the game" be forgotten, but a new crop of issues will now be "killing the game" and most of those will be centred around the new class and paragon paths.
In 2014 it is quite likely, as has happened with many other PWE titles, that the ACTIVE population of this game will have dwindled to a few thousand well heeled players who spend 500$ Us plus per year to pick up 12k plus gear from the game vendors , make lvl7 enh from lockbox drops, and can be maintained on a much smaller server with a smaller staff. Its not the ONLY PWE business model, but it seems to be the prevelant one. Look at Champions Online to see the future.
There is a clear pattern here.. big launch .. cull out the freebies.... cull out the casuals by grinding them to death.. leaving a much more streamlined, profitable product for the true parent company here. Meanwhile the core Cryptic staff, who are EMPLOYEES, will move on to their next assigned project. Often the group left behind to service a well launched game is much less experienced, more prone to mistakes, and will take a few months to get up to speed on quality, but soon you wont even notice. You shouldn't burn Cryptic for things beyond their control.
Don't believe? Watch it play out. I will still be here in 2014. Someone has to be here to get stuff for the upper crust, and it pays well enough to keep me in gear for my self.. CYAS...
Only/big thing I think would be a good change on this issue. I like BOP because it keeps people from needing every item in the game to sell as they did back when it was all BoE.
You and the other 5 people should keep us posted.
and yes I know weapon and helms tend to cost more but i can afford them mainly trying to pick what weapon I want I kind of like gg main hand for renegade cw but then again i could buy a Mc main hand. its at 11k gs at min and done 0 dungeons so if any thing more stuff needs making bop.
I will tell you 1 thing I am pretty afraid doing a dungeon at min in case I screw up with not doing end game cc before.
Lol. Then you have no idea how the game work...
I make so many rough ads that i could buy any augment pet. Rank 7 slots can you make with good farming.
And higher gear especially perfect armor/weapon enhancements aren't for casual gamer as easy way. Now it's easier to get the set which you want.
Nice try at being funny, you know the real reason why these calls of things "killing the game" don't bother me, because they never pan out. Let's look at the major issues killing WoW over the years.
Lets take a look at that list, not only are the first two points contradictory, but each is just a group of people latching onto the thing they like least about the new Expansion and attempting to use hyperbole to force Blizzard to reverse the decisions they made.
As I attempted to point out, in three months, not only will Neverwinter still have a healthy playerbase, but all the issues people are complaining about now (including the BoP change) will be forgotten and a load of new issues (mainly about how the new class and paragon paths are "unbalanced" and "broken") will be what's killing the game.
So is this a consensus between all 5 of you?
Now you're just trying to be insulting and not even addressing what I've written.
Good day to you sir.