If that's the case then why are the #2 in DPS with only CW doing more damage in Malabog's Castle?
Sounds like the GWF is doing just fine.
But see that's the problem.. U make it sound like being number 2 is ok... It isn't..
When the control class is doing more aoe dps than the class that is ment to be designed for aoe dps it's an issue.. Especially when the control class brings so much more to the party in utility... MC is designed for aoe dps.. And GWFs with high skill and gear should be topping charts.. That's there design.. That's all they bring.. And if they come 2nd here to a control class then yes it's a major issue and a major flaw in the class mechanics
"I went from 1/2 to 3/4 in DPS. Mainly due to the instigator spec relies heavily on AP."
sofro do mesmo mal...
yeah i do not play as ins gwf since expansion slam was killed any ap gain with aoe encounters is dead to so only thing left is now to roll destroyer and use 1 target encounters
I am a gwf with 13.6k gs. After this freaking patch, I played PVP twice, and there's a 10k gs tr can totally two shot me when I was in unstoppable. Is Cryptic really hearing the feedback about GWF players about the nerf of unstoppable?
Nerf Slam, fine; Nerf the debuff duration for WMS........ still FINE; Nerf the unstoppable? REALLY? WHAT ELSE DO WE HAVE? GWF ARE JUST LIKE PAPER NOW, I CAN'T TANK ANYTHING IN ANY T2 DUNGEON ANYMORE, ALWAYS GET KILLED BY THE ADDS SEA WITH MY UNSTOPPABLE ON.
CAN YOU HEAR OUR FEEDBACK? CRYPTIC? WHY YOU HATE GWF SO MUCH?
R.I.P. GWF >.>
u missed the biggest nerf to gwf AP gain was killed with expansion
I wish devs would explain us why is ok for cw to cast daily every 10 sec and for gwf was not ok every 20-30 sec?Why we need to be only class in game which can use daily every 1 min or more?
But see that's the problem.. U make it sound like being number 2 is ok... It isn't..
When the control class is doing more aoe dps than the class that is ment to be designed for aoe dps it's an issue.. Especially when the control class brings so much more to the party in utility... MC is designed for aoe dps.. And GWFs with high skill and gear should be topping charts.. That's there design.. That's all they bring.. And if they come 2nd here to a control class then yes it's a major issue and a major flaw in the class mechanics
RANGE DPS - Stands and turrets consistent DMG.
Melee DPS - has to run around t0 attack mobs, if mobs are not in a tight bunch they can't AoE them but stuck single target. This is why GWF DPS is low.
If the CW does their job and keeps the mobs in a tight bunch the GWF will be #1 in damage.
A good CW is able to keep up with the GWF if they know how to play their class. The only time a CW will out damage a GWF is if the CW is being a <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> and knocks the mobs all over the place forcing the GWF to single target from AoE.
Do you really not understand how DPS & Damage mechanic's work?
DPS (Damage Per Second)
This means if the melee class has to run to a target for 1 second, that's a 1 second damage lost.
Basic Example:
30 Second Fight
CW does 1000 Damage per hit
GWF does 1000 Damage per hit
Group of 5 Mobs:
CW Sing's and bunches mobs up:
GWF is running to sing to DPS
CW is gaining damage as GWF runs to group
CW is doing 1000 dmg per hit at 5 mobs for 5000 damage per second
GWF is now attacking 1000 dmg per hit at 5 mobs for 5000 damage per second
CW uses meteor and knocks mobs all over the place.
GWF now is stuck at single target vs. group and dps drops down to 1000 plus loses time running around. While CW turrets damage and maintains 1000 damage per hit.
This is why CW's do more damage than a GWF because BAD CW's knock the mobs away and turns a 20-30k DPS Player down to 5k DPS. Now you combine that with your TR, GF's damage you go from 60-90k TEAM DPS down to 20-30k TEAM DPS because the CW wants to be #1 in Damage and show how bad they are.
1) Upload ACT and analyse it: http://advancedcombattracker.com/
2) Check uptime on boss - fights like Draco on CN.
3) Check how many mobs you hit/dmg for trash clear and check the dmg output for other classes you are running with. If theres a situation where CWs need to knock the mobs off cliff you arent gonna win the fight so dont even bother looking at it.
4) Just get an idea of what your effective dps is w/ the spec/enchant/stats youre using atm. Do math a bit, change things around to maximize your single target/aoe dps.
5) Your class got nerfed? Cool - time to rework and adapt.
6) Dont get discouraged if you ever get beat on meter, theres so many stuff that you can pad and make your meter look super good in NWO. If you do this in WoW you usually get called out ("let me check logs") and worst-case get kicked from raid. Aha well also you have to look into total stats/enchant difference between other players as well (rank 5s vs rank 9-10s, lesser vorp vs perfect vorp).
If there was a program like Simicraft/Skada/World of Logs in NW you wont see so many players in this game trash talking about how they top dmg imo because logs doesnt lie (heh you can even check their dmg percentile and world ranks)
Best way to make them quiet is to let them STREAM. Most wont cause they come up with excuses like "my computer cant handle it brah brah brah" They got nothing to prove anyways.
You were talking about PVE DPS -- this is a fact. I've not only offered to help, I actually put up my entire build -- skills, equipment, stats, and all to help the 95% of the GWFs on the forums that are having such a hard time with a great class.
I saw one Gwf that was doing really well in a MC pug, and it looked pretty nice, he was dishing good dps, and even surpassed the TR ;D
but as soon as a boss fight was going on, (his dps wasnt really showing, since he really had to run to fetch his targets) and well, his tank wasn't as good as his dps, and he soon had to struggle to keep alive.. ^.^ (sadly he ragequitt poor fellow)..
*ending upp as a waste of time for the other ones. *ps. might have been he got unstop bugg, but I don't think that was his issue.
*same team did the same run (swapped out the gwf 13k gs) with a 10k cw and the run went smooth.
sure I've had runs with GWF's who did good, but they are usually end build.. (not a single class has to be endbuild as much as the gwf for any decent action).
as extreme in their faith for the gwf some people are, I personally prefer my less geared (any other class) than doing any of the Tougher Dunegons on my GWF.. *Still love the gwf*
*I silently curse/(along with feelin sorry for them) everytime I get a Gwf on the team..
It Generally means more work for the others. Off course most things are possible if your really determined to make it happen
Why waste time on it when it can be so much simpler by other means ;D
This is not a matter of thinking a new build, it is a matter of pride.
All have noticed the growing scarcity of gwf. This is not new, what is no shortage of stories of people who changed the class by another easier to build.
* Do not blame them, nothing is more frustrating than seeing a party abandon you why they thought you would be dead weight.
It turns out that, contrary to the opinion of others, we were not a burden, we were the paingiver with double damage the second place, we, more than tanks, found the way to be "immortal", accumulating and donating hundreds of potions healing.
... greater gratification does not exist in this game than seeing someone who regretted their presence in a party, days later, I address the protective enclave for guidance for gwf he had just created.
* Note that none of this implies that the class itself was better than others, found that players did with their class work MUCH better than mine.
The frustrating thing is that this same class "useless" suddenly was butchered because the handful of whiners who chose the easy way out and still took a beating in pvp. And could not see this was taken from us in exchange for options more modest but accessible to players in general. No option was given
I've never once got beaten by a TR. You need to change your build.
Wish it would be that simple. U see in my case i used to run a sentinel based of recovery, invested in that build, and now it is useless cause i need to change it all in power. U and candy are new to the class, u saw what was obvious to see nothing of finesse, u just go stand still and whack the mole and now is the only build it works but there was alot of discussion regarding power vs other stats with GWF, math was done and power was a bad investment!!! Class previous to the patch did not need greater lighning to work or abusing WMS with stamina regeneration from battle fury or healing strike depending on what build u;re on. Is good that u2 enjoy the class but the some of us are not and we arent gonna spend another several million ad for a respec! Noone guaranties that they wont change their mind and fix the WMS animation...
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seisem2Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Wish it would be that simple. U see in my case i used to run a sentinel based of recovery, invested in that build, and now it is useless cause i need to change it all in power. U and candy are new to the class, u saw what was obvious to see nothing of finesse, u just go stand still and whack the mole and now is the only build it works but there was alot of discussion regarding power vs other stats with GWF, math was done and power was a bad investment!!! Class previous to the patch did not need greater lighning to work or abusing WMS with stamina regeneration from battle fury or healing strike depending on what build u;re on. Is good that u2 enjoy the class but the some of us are not and we arent gonna spend another several million ad for a respec! Noone guaranties that they wont change their mind and fix the WMS animation...
I made my character and was fully geared before the patch. Not only that, I did more damage with Slam as my daily. Still got nerfed, still got better. You have to adapt.
And they gave you a free respec token on the last patch for feywild, did you waste it?
I made my character and was fully geared before the patch. Not only that, I did more damage with Slam as my daily. Still got nerfed, still got better. You have to adapt.
And they gave you a free respec token on the last patch for feywild, did you waste it?
i blame ppl like u who exploit animations or dont even play gwf as candy and then they write on forums how GWF is great for all nerfs we get but if do not exploit animations no way u will be better on total damage then cw even with exploiting is hard to win good cw and insg was good aoe dps build but now is dead and sentinel was good pvp build but now is dead and next build which die will be destroyer build because ppl like u come on forums and brag how great they are but devs ignore fact U EXPLOIT TO BE GOOD
I've never once got beaten by a TR. You need to change your build.
LOL! In your 3 experiences Q'ing for PvP right? Cause even casuals meet P. Vorpal Gtene TR's from time to time...
Edit: Lol just realized you were talking about PvE, which is an even dumber argument as I will restate once again, trash mob DPS does not matter in the least.
Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
LOL! In your 3 experiences Q'ing for PvP right? Cause even casuals meet P. Vorpal Gtene TR's from time to time...
Edit: Lol just realized you were talking about PvE, which is an even dumber argument as I will restate once again, trash mob DPS does not matter in the least.
Says who? I'd rather clear to the boss in 15, and take him down in 7 than to clear to him in 25 and take him down in 5.
Says who? I'd rather clear to the boss in 15, and take him down in 7 than to clear to him in 25 and take him down in 5.
Except that unless we're talking 14k GWF and 8k CW/TR it would be clear to boss in 16, kill him in 4. A good CW with equal gear can slot one set of skills to out DPS GWF aoe (not even counting the fact that they push 50% of the mobs off for insta kill) and then a different set to way out DPS them in single target.
I have completed both Spider and FH in ~15 minutes many many times. Trash is herded to the correct spot and pushed off the entire run and then it's just full DPS boss while GF/GWF kites. GWF is still useable, but as a tank not a full DPS.
So that means DPS GWF is absolutely useless until boss, and then we rely on his incredible single target DPS (lol)
Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
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seisem2Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
LOL! In your 3 experiences Q'ing for PvP right? Cause even casuals meet P. Vorpal Gtene TR's from time to time...
Edit: Lol just realized you were talking about PvE, which is an even dumber argument as I will restate once again, trash mob DPS does not matter in the least.
You need to read the conversation we were having. He was talking about after his T2 run he fell to 3rd/4th place.
i blame ppl like u who exploit animations or dont even play gwf as candy and then they write on forums how GWF is great for all nerfs we get but if do not exploit animations no way u will be better on total damage then cw even with exploiting is hard to win good cw and insg was good aoe dps build but now is dead and sentinel was good pvp build but now is dead and next build which die will be destroyer build because ppl like u come on forums and brag how great they are but devs ignore fact U EXPLOIT TO BE GOOD
Exploit?? Are you kidding me? Tell me how I am cheating? I don't even know what Animation exploit you are even talking about. I play my class legitimately.
hes talking about the wms animation cancellation with sprint, as well as the sure strike end animation. I would say its an exploit, since you can swing wms faster with that method than using unstoppable.
I give you grief at times because of things you say. What was wrong with your post was telling me to respec. Sure I can move 6 points from Instigator over to Destroyer or even Sent but that waters down the build to a hybrid. I will get a dps boost but not a significant boost, roughly 1% -3%. That will not make up the dps loss from the AP generation nerf. That also will not make up for GWF using 1 daily while most classes are on their 2nd or even 3rd daily. CW alone can generate 0 - 100% AP in less than NINE seconds.
So after playing my class as Instigator without exploits or animation cancelling since beta, now needs to respec to destroyer to make up AP generation loss with 25% CD reduction destroyer feat to certain encounters. That would still not come close to the DPS nerf via AP generation we as a class suffered.
Rather than take up arms in defense of the GWF as a whole class, you go out of your way to tell everyone they are wrong and your spec is the bee's knees. I could swap out roar and switch to punishing charge for AP gain but that comes at a significant dps loss. Not to mention the fact that Punishing Charge procs 0 damage on crits via deep gash. It is rather gimmicky in the fact that I have to wait on a Sing to charge thru a crowd twice for minimal damage just so I can generate AP. Punishing Charge is more of a PVP skill than an actual PVE skill. My next option is to take my normal vorpal and push it into a greater. That is just masking the underlying issue of GWF damage output. No...until developers put away their TR toys and actually start running GWFs in all three trees we will be the least played and least understood class in the game.
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seisem2Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I give you grief at times because of things you say. What was wrong with your post was telling me to respec. Sure I can move 6 points from Instigator over to Destroyer or even Sent but that waters down the build to a hybrid. I will get a dps boost but not a significant boost, roughly 1% -3%. That will not make up the dps loss from the AP generation nerf. That also will not make up for GWF using 1 daily while most classes are on their 2nd or even 3rd daily. CW alone can generate 0 - 100% AP in less than NINE seconds.
So after playing my class as Instigator without exploits or animation cancelling since beta, now needs to respec to destroyer to make up AP generation loss with 25% CD reduction destroyer feat to certain encounters. That would still not come close to the DPS nerf via AP generation we as a class suffered.
Rather than take up arms in defense of the GWF as a whole class, you go out of your way to tell everyone they are wrong and your spec is the bee's knees. I could swap out roar and switch to punishing charge for AP gain but that comes at a significant dps loss. Not to mention the fact that Punishing Charge procs 0 damage on crits via deep gash. It is rather gimmicky in the fact that I have to wait on a Sing to charge thru a crowd twice for minimal damage just so I can generate AP. Punishing Charge is more of a PVP skill than an actual PVE skill. My next option is to take my normal vorpal and push it into a greater. That is just masking the underlying issue of GWF damage output. No...until developers put away their TR toys and actually start running GWFs in all three trees we will be the least played and least understood class in the game.
I've taken my free time to help you guys out and post my build. I didn't have to help any of you guys. I saw the posts slamming GWF and talking about how bad it is (remember your post about how you are 3rd or 4th on dps in runs) and tried to help people with their problems. I don't understand what you mean by the TR toys... maybe for PVP (which I have said numerous times I don't care about) for PVE they cannot touch a well played GWF.
I'm really tired of hearing about this animation cancelling, I didn't know it existed and haven't been using it.
You know why I haven't taken up arms about the GWF? Because it is not broke. Everybody I play with on my server always tells me they haven't seen a GWF pour out this kind of damage. I tell them it's easy, if I can do it anybody can do it and give them guidance on how to do it. People just don't want to change whatever build they started out with. Luckily for me, I figured it out the first time, with a few minor changes on the way.
Comments
But see that's the problem.. U make it sound like being number 2 is ok... It isn't..
When the control class is doing more aoe dps than the class that is ment to be designed for aoe dps it's an issue.. Especially when the control class brings so much more to the party in utility... MC is designed for aoe dps.. And GWFs with high skill and gear should be topping charts.. That's there design.. That's all they bring.. And if they come 2nd here to a control class then yes it's a major issue and a major flaw in the class mechanics
sofro do mesmo mal...
yeah i do not play as ins gwf since expansion slam was killed any ap gain with aoe encounters is dead to so only thing left is now to roll destroyer and use 1 target encounters
u missed the biggest nerf to gwf AP gain was killed with expansion
I wish devs would explain us why is ok for cw to cast daily every 10 sec and for gwf was not ok every 20-30 sec?Why we need to be only class in game which can use daily every 1 min or more?
RANGE DPS - Stands and turrets consistent DMG.
Melee DPS - has to run around t0 attack mobs, if mobs are not in a tight bunch they can't AoE them but stuck single target. This is why GWF DPS is low.
If the CW does their job and keeps the mobs in a tight bunch the GWF will be #1 in damage.
A good CW is able to keep up with the GWF if they know how to play their class. The only time a CW will out damage a GWF is if the CW is being a <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> and knocks the mobs all over the place forcing the GWF to single target from AoE.
Do you really not understand how DPS & Damage mechanic's work?
DPS (Damage Per Second)
This means if the melee class has to run to a target for 1 second, that's a 1 second damage lost.
Basic Example:
30 Second Fight
CW does 1000 Damage per hit
GWF does 1000 Damage per hit
Group of 5 Mobs:
CW Sing's and bunches mobs up:
GWF is running to sing to DPS
CW is gaining damage as GWF runs to group
CW is doing 1000 dmg per hit at 5 mobs for 5000 damage per second
GWF is now attacking 1000 dmg per hit at 5 mobs for 5000 damage per second
CW uses meteor and knocks mobs all over the place.
GWF now is stuck at single target vs. group and dps drops down to 1000 plus loses time running around. While CW turrets damage and maintains 1000 damage per hit.
This is why CW's do more damage than a GWF because BAD CW's knock the mobs away and turns a 20-30k DPS Player down to 5k DPS. Now you combine that with your TR, GF's damage you go from 60-90k TEAM DPS down to 20-30k TEAM DPS because the CW wants to be #1 in Damage and show how bad they are.
After the AP reduction I am still suffering in DPS due to them using 2+ dailies to our 1.
Instigator does not have encounter reduction to offset the lost AP gain such as the Destroyer.
I literally went from 1st to 3rd after the the loss.
Single target TRs and AOE CWs I run with would never beat me. After the patch the role reversed.
I can not keep up with the TRs or CWs that min/maxed.
It was only after that fateful patch that we learned just how reliant GWF was to AP.
I get it. Developers love the TR. I just wish they would shelf them for a couple months and give GWF the love they deserve.
I've never once got beaten by a TR. You need to change your build.
Catalina Erantzo - GWF 13.9K GS
<Future> Guild on Dragon - Legit Non Exploit Guild (We are always recruiting great players)
Future Guild Recruitment Thread: http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?475381-lt-Future-gt-Legit-Non-Exploit-Guild-Recruiting
+10000000000000
So much fail in one post.
1) Upload ACT and analyse it: http://advancedcombattracker.com/
2) Check uptime on boss - fights like Draco on CN.
3) Check how many mobs you hit/dmg for trash clear and check the dmg output for other classes you are running with. If theres a situation where CWs need to knock the mobs off cliff you arent gonna win the fight so dont even bother looking at it.
4) Just get an idea of what your effective dps is w/ the spec/enchant/stats youre using atm. Do math a bit, change things around to maximize your single target/aoe dps.
5) Your class got nerfed? Cool - time to rework and adapt.
6) Dont get discouraged if you ever get beat on meter, theres so many stuff that you can pad and make your meter look super good in NWO. If you do this in WoW you usually get called out ("let me check logs") and worst-case get kicked from raid. Aha well also you have to look into total stats/enchant difference between other players as well (rank 5s vs rank 9-10s, lesser vorp vs perfect vorp).
If there was a program like Simicraft/Skada/World of Logs in NW you wont see so many players in this game trash talking about how they top dmg imo because logs doesnt lie (heh you can even check their dmg percentile and world ranks)
Best way to make them quiet is to let them STREAM. Most wont cause they come up with excuses like "my computer cant handle it brah brah brah" They got nothing to prove anyways.
On a side note! Make sure you read this: http://wow.joystiq.com/2012/07/23/officers-quarters-meter-padding-mayhem/#continued
PvP GWF - BizzyBedBug
PvE GF (salvaged)
PvE TR (salvaged)
GWF PvP/CW PvE @ http://www.twitch.tv/bizzyplusplus/
You were talking about PVE DPS -- this is a fact. I've not only offered to help, I actually put up my entire build -- skills, equipment, stats, and all to help the 95% of the GWFs on the forums that are having such a hard time with a great class.
Catalina Erantzo - GWF 13.9K GS
<Future> Guild on Dragon - Legit Non Exploit Guild (We are always recruiting great players)
Future Guild Recruitment Thread: http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?475381-lt-Future-gt-Legit-Non-Exploit-Guild-Recruiting
but as soon as a boss fight was going on, (his dps wasnt really showing, since he really had to run to fetch his targets) and well, his tank wasn't as good as his dps, and he soon had to struggle to keep alive.. ^.^ (sadly he ragequitt poor fellow)..
*ending upp as a waste of time for the other ones. *ps. might have been he got unstop bugg, but I don't think that was his issue.
*same team did the same run (swapped out the gwf 13k gs) with a 10k cw and the run went smooth.
sure I've had runs with GWF's who did good, but they are usually end build.. (not a single class has to be endbuild as much as the gwf for any decent action).
as extreme in their faith for the gwf some people are, I personally prefer my less geared (any other class) than doing any of the Tougher Dunegons on my GWF.. *Still love the gwf*
*I silently curse/(along with feelin sorry for them) everytime I get a Gwf on the team..
It Generally means more work for the others. Off course most things are possible if your really determined to make it happen
Why waste time on it when it can be so much simpler by other means ;D
All have noticed the growing scarcity of gwf. This is not new, what is no shortage of stories of people who changed the class by another easier to build.
* Do not blame them, nothing is more frustrating than seeing a party abandon you why they thought you would be dead weight.
It turns out that, contrary to the opinion of others, we were not a burden, we were the paingiver with double damage the second place, we, more than tanks, found the way to be "immortal", accumulating and donating hundreds of potions healing.
... greater gratification does not exist in this game than seeing someone who regretted their presence in a party, days later, I address the protective enclave for guidance for gwf he had just created.
* Note that none of this implies that the class itself was better than others, found that players did with their class work MUCH better than mine.
The frustrating thing is that this same class "useless" suddenly was butchered because the handful of whiners who chose the easy way out and still took a beating in pvp. And could not see this was taken from us in exchange for options more modest but accessible to players in general. No option was given
Where is the victory of the best?
Wish it would be that simple. U see in my case i used to run a sentinel based of recovery, invested in that build, and now it is useless cause i need to change it all in power. U and candy are new to the class, u saw what was obvious to see nothing of finesse, u just go stand still and whack the mole and now is the only build it works but there was alot of discussion regarding power vs other stats with GWF, math was done and power was a bad investment!!! Class previous to the patch did not need greater lighning to work or abusing WMS with stamina regeneration from battle fury or healing strike depending on what build u;re on. Is good that u2 enjoy the class but the some of us are not and we arent gonna spend another several million ad for a respec! Noone guaranties that they wont change their mind and fix the WMS animation...
I made my character and was fully geared before the patch. Not only that, I did more damage with Slam as my daily. Still got nerfed, still got better. You have to adapt.
And they gave you a free respec token on the last patch for feywild, did you waste it?
Catalina Erantzo - GWF 13.9K GS
<Future> Guild on Dragon - Legit Non Exploit Guild (We are always recruiting great players)
Future Guild Recruitment Thread: http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?475381-lt-Future-gt-Legit-Non-Exploit-Guild-Recruiting
i blame ppl like u who exploit animations or dont even play gwf as candy and then they write on forums how GWF is great for all nerfs we get but if do not exploit animations no way u will be better on total damage then cw even with exploiting is hard to win good cw and insg was good aoe dps build but now is dead and sentinel was good pvp build but now is dead and next build which die will be destroyer build because ppl like u come on forums and brag how great they are but devs ignore fact U EXPLOIT TO BE GOOD
Cause u dont know how to use prone skills. A sentinel GWF dies in less then 6 sec if prone is used correctly.
LOL! In your 3 experiences Q'ing for PvP right? Cause even casuals meet P. Vorpal Gtene TR's from time to time...
Edit: Lol just realized you were talking about PvE, which is an even dumber argument as I will restate once again, trash mob DPS does not matter in the least.
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
Says who? I'd rather clear to the boss in 15, and take him down in 7 than to clear to him in 25 and take him down in 5.
Except that unless we're talking 14k GWF and 8k CW/TR it would be clear to boss in 16, kill him in 4. A good CW with equal gear can slot one set of skills to out DPS GWF aoe (not even counting the fact that they push 50% of the mobs off for insta kill) and then a different set to way out DPS them in single target.
I have completed both Spider and FH in ~15 minutes many many times. Trash is herded to the correct spot and pushed off the entire run and then it's just full DPS boss while GF/GWF kites. GWF is still useable, but as a tank not a full DPS.
So that means DPS GWF is absolutely useless until boss, and then we rely on his incredible single target DPS (lol)
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
You need to read the conversation we were having. He was talking about after his T2 run he fell to 3rd/4th place.
Catalina Erantzo - GWF 13.9K GS
<Future> Guild on Dragon - Legit Non Exploit Guild (We are always recruiting great players)
Future Guild Recruitment Thread: http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?475381-lt-Future-gt-Legit-Non-Exploit-Guild-Recruiting
Exploit?? Are you kidding me? Tell me how I am cheating? I don't even know what Animation exploit you are even talking about. I play my class legitimately.
Catalina Erantzo - GWF 13.9K GS
<Future> Guild on Dragon - Legit Non Exploit Guild (We are always recruiting great players)
Future Guild Recruitment Thread: http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?475381-lt-Future-gt-Legit-Non-Exploit-Guild-Recruiting
and also the featured satirical comedic adventure "A Call for Heroes".
I give you grief at times because of things you say. What was wrong with your post was telling me to respec. Sure I can move 6 points from Instigator over to Destroyer or even Sent but that waters down the build to a hybrid. I will get a dps boost but not a significant boost, roughly 1% -3%. That will not make up the dps loss from the AP generation nerf. That also will not make up for GWF using 1 daily while most classes are on their 2nd or even 3rd daily. CW alone can generate 0 - 100% AP in less than NINE seconds.
So after playing my class as Instigator without exploits or animation cancelling since beta, now needs to respec to destroyer to make up AP generation loss with 25% CD reduction destroyer feat to certain encounters. That would still not come close to the DPS nerf via AP generation we as a class suffered.
Rather than take up arms in defense of the GWF as a whole class, you go out of your way to tell everyone they are wrong and your spec is the bee's knees. I could swap out roar and switch to punishing charge for AP gain but that comes at a significant dps loss. Not to mention the fact that Punishing Charge procs 0 damage on crits via deep gash. It is rather gimmicky in the fact that I have to wait on a Sing to charge thru a crowd twice for minimal damage just so I can generate AP. Punishing Charge is more of a PVP skill than an actual PVE skill. My next option is to take my normal vorpal and push it into a greater. That is just masking the underlying issue of GWF damage output. No...until developers put away their TR toys and actually start running GWFs in all three trees we will be the least played and least understood class in the game.
I've taken my free time to help you guys out and post my build. I didn't have to help any of you guys. I saw the posts slamming GWF and talking about how bad it is (remember your post about how you are 3rd or 4th on dps in runs) and tried to help people with their problems. I don't understand what you mean by the TR toys... maybe for PVP (which I have said numerous times I don't care about) for PVE they cannot touch a well played GWF.
I'm really tired of hearing about this animation cancelling, I didn't know it existed and haven't been using it.
You know why I haven't taken up arms about the GWF? Because it is not broke. Everybody I play with on my server always tells me they haven't seen a GWF pour out this kind of damage. I tell them it's easy, if I can do it anybody can do it and give them guidance on how to do it. People just don't want to change whatever build they started out with. Luckily for me, I figured it out the first time, with a few minor changes on the way.
Catalina Erantzo - GWF 13.9K GS
<Future> Guild on Dragon - Legit Non Exploit Guild (We are always recruiting great players)
Future Guild Recruitment Thread: http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?475381-lt-Future-gt-Legit-Non-Exploit-Guild-Recruiting