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real money stolen

bracer2bracer2 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 566 Bounty Hunter
edited August 2013 in General Discussion (PC)
So, im fine with all the changes coming up. As long as i can remove my high lvl enchantments for free from my equipment.

For the last couple months ive been working to get bis possible on my stalwarts armor. Many enchantments paid for with real money. Now, the same armor set is no longer viable to my build and need to be able to remove my enchantments. I didnt create the armor and i didnt change it either. Must be able to remove my enchants for free. Have sent in a ticket several days ago after the changes were announced. But there is zero action and no response. What should i do? as playing this game is irrelevant atm, my money is being stolen from me.

I paid for an item with real money. Now the item i own and paid for is not the same item... essentially i will need some type of refund for what ive paid for has been taken away without my consent.
Post edited by bracer2 on
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Comments

  • fantasycharacterfantasycharacter Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 675 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Sorry online experiences may change during course of play.

    Caveat emptor.
  • sturmwaffel2sturmwaffel2 Banned Users, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 219 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    If you have real money, might I suggest something promising besides a F2P system? Perhaps FFXIV or TESO? More honorable companies, less likely to **** you like that.
  • sirjestosirjesto Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 176 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    I feel you. I have had 1 character for 3 months...yup GF. Bought a helm soon after open beta started for 1.5 million AD. Spent hundreds on my character....have rank 8 enchants...transmuted the look and colored each piece. Just finally managed to upgrade to a perfect armor enchant.....now....3 months of time and money are essentially gone.
  • bracer2bracer2 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 566 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    Obviously i will need a refund and this ride is over. Is the best way to go to contact my bank? And go through those channels instead of even attempting to work with cryptic?
  • antovarasantovaras Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    You realise this is an MMO right?
    A world to defend
    A city to protect
    innocents to save
    "Why?" They ask "they hate you"
    We're heroes it's what we do.
    *patiently waiting on Paragon City*
  • aerisodaerisod Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    bracer2 wrote: »
    Obviously i will need a refund and this ride is over. Is the best way to go to contact my bank? And go through those channels instead of even attempting to work with cryptic?

    I'd just go straight to an attorney.
  • sturmwaffel2sturmwaffel2 Banned Users, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 219 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    aerisod wrote: »
    I'd just go straight to an attorney.

    Right when you run the launcher, click legal terms. Best of luck getting nothing. You're better off cutting your losses and warning all of your family and friends.
  • fantasycharacterfantasycharacter Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 675 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    aerisod wrote: »
    I'd just go straight to an attorney.

    Any attorney is just going to direct him to the caveat emptor in my post and say "that's the wisest advice you are going to get all your life".
  • kwequakwequa Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    "Sorry online experiences may change during course of play."
    It says they can change things anytime they want. Buyer beware..
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • bracer2bracer2 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 566 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    Right when you run the launcher, click legal terms. Best of luck getting nothing. You're better off cutting your losses and warning all of your family and friends.

    Well my bank says they should be able to get refunds on my most recent zen purchase which was $60 bucks. I guess that better then nothing.... blatant thievery.
  • dkcandydkcandy Member Posts: 1,555 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    If you think this is bad you should have all SEEN the QQ's on Diablo 3 when blizzard changed the mechanic to weapon speed. The game has a REAL money AH and players spent $1000's on gear to have all of that gear worthless by the change of a simple mechanic. Those players just bought the gear the night prior because the players on the PTR sold all of their gear ahead of time knowing the change that was coming.

    There was a very large # of charge backs, etc... and even more QQs.

    It's never a good idea for game that have real money transactions to "rework" items like this. Just NERF the damage on the set to 2-3% per stack or a flat 10% with no stacks. This put the set inline with other sets as far as power output and the sets bonus mechanic stays the same.
  • bracer2bracer2 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 566 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    dkcandy wrote: »
    If you think this is bad you should have all SEEN the QQ's on Diablo 3 when blizzard changed the mechanic to weapon speed. The game has a REAL money AH and players spent $1000's on gear to have all of that gear worthless by the change of a simple mechanic. Those players just bought the gear the night prior because the players on the PTR sold all of their gear ahead of time knowing the change that was coming.

    There was a very large # of charge backs, etc... and even more QQs.

    It's never a good idea for game that have real money transactions to "rework" items like this. Just NERF the damage on the set to 2-3% per stack or a flat 10% with no stacks. This put the set inline with other sets as far as power output and the sets bonus mechanic stays the same.

    If it were thousands of dollars an attorney might be viable. First time ive ever had my money stolen from a video game. Ouch.
  • tkobovtkobov Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 3 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Want to really feel screwed,buy a galeb.....

    I did, and the really sad thing is, my free level given man at arms outperforms a $30 real money pet......
  • fallout1111fallout1111 Member Posts: 71
    edited August 2013
    Having experienced the need of a real attorney before, I will warn you that you can expect to pay upwards of several thousand $$ just to retain their services (i.e. the cost of entry). Cut your losses.
  • bracer2bracer2 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 566 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    Just out of curiosity how much money is ok to steal from your customers? If my math is correct it will cost a little over $100 dollars in AD to remove my lvl 8+ enchantments from the armor set. How many other players are being ripped off i wonder?
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  • tinukedatinukeda Member Posts: 499 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Your having, apparently, not read or comprehended the Terms of Service does not equate this to a "theft" in the slightest.

    "Human Centi-i-Pad" episode of South Park anyone?

    QQ away though!
  • antovarasantovaras Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    bracer2 wrote: »
    Just out of curiosity how much money is ok to steal from your customers? If my math is correct it will cost a little over $100 dollars in AD to remove my lvl 8+ enchantments from the armor set. How many other players are being ripped off i wonder?
    At no point was anything stolen, you chose to spend money in an MMO with full cognisance of the Terms of Service...
    A world to defend
    A city to protect
    innocents to save
    "Why?" They ask "they hate you"
    We're heroes it's what we do.
    *patiently waiting on Paragon City*
  • bracer2bracer2 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 566 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    tinukeda wrote: »
    Your having, apparently, not read or comprehended the Terms of Service does not equate this to a "theft" in the slightest.

    "Human Centi-i-Pad" episode of South Park anyone?

    QQ away though!

    Regardless of how there terms of service protect them. When i buy something its mine exactly how it is regardless of the product. This is blatant thievery, nothing else. Masking it with predetermined terms and conditions only means there they are responsible for nothing. Even stealing. Simply put, stealing is taking something someone else owns without there consent. Isnt this the same thing?
  • bracer2bracer2 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 566 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    Just out of curiosity how much money is ok to steal from your customers? If my math is correct it will cost a little over $100 dollars in AD to remove my lvl 8+ enchantments from the armor set. How many other players are being ripped off i wonder?
  • rhoricrhoric Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Sorry to burst your bubble. But it is NOT theft. You actually don't own anything. The developer owns it.
  • bracer2bracer2 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 566 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    rhoric wrote: »
    Sorry to burst your bubble. But it is NOT theft. You actually don't own anything. The developer owns it.

    Seems like theft. Maybe not legally but laws have no moral compass. Its dishonest and outright stealing.
  • bluedarkybluedarky Member Posts: 1,232 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    bracer2 wrote: »
    Regardless of how there terms of service protect them. When i buy something its mine exactly how it is regardless of the product. This is blatant thievery, nothing else. Masking it with predetermined terms and conditions only means there they are responsible for nothing. Even stealing. Simply put, stealing is taking something someone else owns without there consent. Isnt this the same thing?

    Sorry but sales law disagrees with you. It's clearly laid out in the TOS that it's effectively a permanent rental (most video games are this btw) and that they can change the conditions of said rental at any time up to and including removing your access without reason at any time.
  • ironzerg79ironzerg79 Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,942 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    rhoric wrote: »
    Sorry to burst your bubble. But it is NOT theft. You actually don't own anything. The developer owns it.

    This. You have no legal ownership of anything here. You're paying for the service.

    Also, if you read the TOS you agreed to when you logged in, you would realize you waived your right to a lawyer and that any claims have to be resolved through arbitration.

    Ultimately, if you're upset about spending real money on stuff that gets changed (as is the nature of MMOs), you have two choices.

    a) cut your loses and quit (probably a wise move if you're this upset)
    b) just freaking deal with it...relax and actually have FUN playing the game

    Honestly, it's why games that are too dependent on cash shops ruin themselves. This guy, instead of obtaining stuff via in game methods, actually EARNING the gear and the enchants, just swiped his credit card and declared himself the winner. And now we all see where that gets you.

    It's all about having fun...he who spends the most money doesn't win.
    "Meanwhile in the moderator's lounge..."
    i7TZDZK.gif?1
  • kantazo1kantazo1 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    My best advice is to cut your loses and leave, find some other game and forget about this one. It will save you a lot of sour taste on your mouth.
    Seek and ye shall find. Yeshua
  • bracer2bracer2 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 566 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    ironzerg79 wrote: »
    This. You have no legal ownership of anything here. You're paying for the service.

    Also, if you read the TOS you agreed to when you logged in, you would realize you waived your right to a lawyer and that any claims have to be resolved through arbitration.

    Ultimately, if you're upset about spending real money on stuff that gets changed (as is the nature of MMOs), you have two choices.

    a) cut your loses and quit (probably a wise move if you're this upset)
    b) just freaking deal with it...relax and actually have FUN playing the game

    Honestly, it's why games that are too dependent on cash shops ruin themselves. This guy, instead of obtaining stuff via in game methods, actually EARNING the gear and the enchants, just swiped his credit card and declared himself the winner. And now we all see where that gets you.

    It's all about having fun...he who spends the most money doesn't win.

    lol. Well ive spent a total of $220 dollars since CB. I can get $60 of it back so i guess thats all that can be done.

    However, during that whole time ive only built one character, ive "earned" much more over that time period then ive purchased, just to be clear.
  • ironzerg79ironzerg79 Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,942 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    bracer2 wrote: »
    lol. Well ive spent a total of $220 dollars since CB. I can get $60 of it back so i guess thats all that can be done.

    However, during that whole time ive only built one character, ive "earned" much more over that time period then ive purchased, just to be clear.

    Well, time to go "earn" more stuff with the new content patch.

    I mean, at the end of the day, did you really think the first "top" tier armor set was going to be the end all and be all of gear ever? At some point you're naturally going to have to remove or replace those gems. The armor sets that the game launched with couldn't possibly ALWAYS be BIS, right?
    "Meanwhile in the moderator's lounge..."
    i7TZDZK.gif?1
  • ironzerg79ironzerg79 Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,942 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    bracer2 wrote: »
    For the last couple months ive been working to get bis possible on my stalwarts armor.

    Just occurred to me on my last post, so I thought I'd quote it here.

    Your entire argument is moot to begin with.

    BIS is a constantly moving target in any MMO. BIS is only BIS until the next content patch, and then the next one after that. What if someone wanted to sue Blizzard because their T2 armor they worked so hard for was made obsolete by content expansions? Where would that go?

    The point being is that you spent money on something you should have known was going to be obsolete at some point regardless...the "balance" patch doesn't change any of this.

    You'll never have BIS, so don't ever spend more than you're willing to lose to try to get there.

    Like...real money.
    "Meanwhile in the moderator's lounge..."
    i7TZDZK.gif?1
  • echokazulechokazul Member Posts: 149 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Oh, and just so it's out there, disputing the payment like that will probably get you banned from all PWE games. Though, from the sounds of it, you don't mind, just thought I'd warn anybody trying.
    Kyba Fell- Tiefling GF (Main)
    RainFeather- Dragonborn DC
    Rune Fell- Drow CW
  • tanglethorntanglethorn Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    Just bail. The more you feed this gluttony of a game, the worst it will get. I've played a lot of MMOs and this is the worst. Ive never seen so much nickeling and diming. The game has a cool combat mechanic, but everything just falls flat. The AD to do anything system is broken and the zen items are way too high. Respecs are too expensive, you get the picture. Walk away and support a different games. NeverWinter will continue to exist as long as players keep dishing out cash.
This discussion has been closed.