I am not sure where you get your confidence. That these prices are based in anything besides the option of "How can we get the most money in the shortest amount of time without having a subscription model". I have played many games that are now "free to play" and never have I seen such pricing for items that are necessary to game play.
I know that the AD market is overinflated because the influx of diamonds from the special packs that were sold, and those of us who play this game not having invested a couple hundred dollars have a steep mountain to climb to be able to afford things. The game is filled with players who insist that AD in the hundreds of thousands is easy to obtain and smugly state that anything in the game can be obtained thru ingame play... and they are the ones sitting on mountains of zen or AD. Pretty much reminds me of the 1% out there wagging their fingers at the masses for their poverty when they in fact perpetrated it.
Whistlingdixie has a very valid point. I won't sink a lot of real money into a game I am trying out and may not spend a lot of time playing. I have made that mistake in the past, buying premium editions of games for "special exclusive" items that, when the game began and you got past the first couple of weeks, ended up being really worthless. SWTOR ended up being so famous for that. Wasted money. Right now, though I thoroughly love this game's mechanics and skills and gameplay, I feel like I'm doing business with a snake oils man.
Just a small example as to why I am leery about spending money in NW: I spent money on Zen so I could respec one of my characters. Turns out, I had logged into the website when buying the zen on an account that was not the one that had the character on it that I wanted the respec. Didn't realize until it was too late that this was NOT a token that could be transferred but would be exclusive for the character on that account. I immediately placed a support ticket and I haven't received any response and it has been a week... not a single response, except for an auto-response when I first placed the ticket. My ignorance as to the item, not paying attention to the account. But really, how hard would it be for them to move that zen/respec to my appropriate account and sow some goodwill among their playerbase? Not really a company that I would trust that their products are worth spending my money on.
I can smugly state that I haven't bought any founder pack.
I can smugly state that with minimal efforts you can make around 20-30k a day on average by playing 2 hrs per day.
I can smugly state that I have spent 20 bucks on this game. And saving AD for an epic mount. Btw, you can get your epic Ioun Stone for free. But you have to work for it too.
The prices in Zstore are not low. Some items are overpriced in terms of the quality or functionality. Like useless companions, lottery asset packs and a one-time fuse guarantee for 16 bucks (!) If you compare, btw, in Dragon Saga, in order to enchant a weapon to level 20 - players spend around 100-150 bucks on average.
But you don't need to spend you hard-earned cash on everything in Zstore.
You know, 600k per month is around 1800 zen.
What I can say, just try top figure out the ways to make money.
Sometimes, I feel that most people who complain about prices in Zstore are those who want instant gratification and want that cool mount now than later but don't want to cough out 35 bucks for instant delivery. You can earn AD and split expenses. 15 bucks-worth AD and 20 bucks in cash.
I think my biggest issue is the dangling of the proverbial carrot in the form of purple chests that may (most likely may not) have a mount. They drop like candy at a halloween parade, but the only way to open them is through the acquisition of keys that can only be purchased. (Yes I know you can buy them for a rediculous amount of AD, but it's not worth it)
Instead, they tease you... taunting you with these mysterious chests.... And no way to open them... Muahahaha
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raddatackMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
So i started playing Neverwinter few months back. I must say it was pretty cool at first since it was something new. Then i started hearing the "pay to win" on zone chat. I figured theres some mounts etc that are purchased with zen, no big deal so i continued playing till level 30ish. That's when it became evident to me that i needed bag space. So i looked for bags. Definitely didnt have enough astral diamonds to purchase any bags from the AH so i looked at the prices of the items you purchase with zen. Obviously at first glance the prices didnt mean much to me [I'm a huge fan of HAMSTER] until i found out the conversion rate of dollars to zen. 10 bucks for a single bag? 50 bucks for a mount? 30 bucks for a companion? This is just coding folks. You arent working hard for replicate a mount so why charge 50 bucks for one? To be exact you arent working at all after the initial coding is done. The game it self does the transaction. That said prices in the zen shop are outrageous.
Take a look at the competitors such as wow, guild wars, and tera. You can spend 50 bucks and buy out half the game while in here you get 1 piece of code. Of course wow doesnt have a zen store however it does sell mounts and companions for money... that cost 9 bucks and are available on every single one of your characters.
I know you guys are out to make money however dont take my arm and a leg in the process.
That said i'll keep my money in my pocket.
Dude just because you can pay for extra bag space or a mount or companion doesn't make the game a pay2win. I have yet to see a mount increase someones damage output or seen a mount or bag kill people in pvp. Plus a lot of games have special currency to purchase stuff like that, there's nothing different.
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silverrainneMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 17Arc User
<i posted this in another similar thread but it seems more appropriate in this thread>
lets do some math to deck out a character
4,000 - bags (initial bag is 30 slots anyway so you don't need 5)
3,000 - 3,500 for a decent companion
3,000 - for the mount (and let's not try to fool ourselves here it does give a huge advantage in PvP)
300 - if its your first time playing that class (because lets face it hardly anybody gets their powers/feats/stats the way they want them on their first try)
Wow that adds up to $108+ usd...for 1 character (minus the mount)
i already went and bought 6 extra character slots and you want me to pay $70 per extra character to deck them out i might try at $30 until then, no thanks i think i'll just buy a new xbox game and every dlc that comes out for it too.
thanks for making this game free though it had a lot of potential (aside from the fact you locked classes out of any kind of D&D customization cant believe you have the balls to call this a D&D game but thats for a different thread)
First off, you get 2 bags from questing, so you only need 2 more, $20.
The $60 pack will get you a purple striker pet and a max speed mount for *every* character on your account.
So, by your logic, $23 per character, minus the character slots if 2 isn't enough (then add $2.50 each)
If you were to play a sub game, that's less than 2 months sub in most games (I'm assuming the $60 pack=the same cost as buying the game/expansions before you even get to start paying a sub!).
Too much? I don't think so!
Sometimes, I feel that most people who complain about prices in Zstore are those who want instant gratification and want that cool mount now than later but don't want to cough out 35 bucks for instant delivery. You can earn AD and split expenses. 15 bucks-worth AD and 20 bucks in cash.
Correct, which is why lowering their prices will help them sell more. Monetizing bags and mounts is one thing, but to have them cost so much is where the line gets drawn. P2W mechanics are SUPPOSED TO BE aimed at those who want instant gratification. When those who want that instant gratification will not fork out what they are asking for them, thats where the issue lies.
First off, you get 2 bags from questing, so you only need 2 more, $20.
The $60 pack will get you a purple striker pet and a max speed mount for *every* character on your account.
So, by your logic, $23 per character, minus the character slots if 2 isn't enough (then add $2.50 each)
If you were to play a sub game, that's less than 2 months sub in most games (I'm assuming the $60 pack=the same cost as buying the game/expansions before you even get to start paying a sub!).
Too much? I don't think so!
In a sub game id be getting alot more than that for paying the sub fee though, including a monthly point stipend in any sub game worth its salt. So yes, its too much if I have to pay 2 months worth of sub relatively in another game just to get a mount and a couple bags in this one.
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brendan03usMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited July 2013
The issue comes down to longevity of play and so on.
If you see yourself playing for 4-6 weeks, then, yes, plonking down the equivalent of 3x+ of a monthly sub is going to be hard to justify.
For me, in a Cryptic game (like this or STO), I tend to fill up the gas tank and then spend over time, because I tend to play games for a longer period. I also take breaks, and then when I come back a few months later, the fund is still there, which makes it easier to jump in and plug any holes I may have from having been away for a few or several months. I expect it will be the same for NW for me as it was for STO. I like Foundry and creation, and I also like taking breaks, so for me it's an investment for the longer term, and it's actually less than it was for sub games (like, say, EVE or WoW) which have managed to get more money from me than the Cryptic/PWE model does.
The one model I would advise to stay away from is the EU model -- that really is a terribly expensive game to play for what it is.
Very good points Chai23, I also strongly think that the current pricing of items that really only add "less annoyance" is preventing allot of people from buying them. 25$ for an infinitely replicated digital super horsethings is just simply over the top, it feels far more like a scam than it does "instant gratification". These items that people are buying have almost NO cost to the company beyond their minimal initial development cost. This is why I find it so outrageous...
As you were saying, when you subscribe to another game, you are granted FULL ACCESS to all of the content for that particular playing time. This is most certainly true however it goes farther than that. Pay to play games often do not allow any form of RMT, This mean that ideally every player that plays is on an even playing field beyond their available play time. This inevitably makes the economy FAR more involved. Values of items are defined by the rate and ease in which they can be obtained within the GAME WORLD. They are not defined by the value of exchange rates and endorsed RMT which is the Free to Play plague.
Pay to play games are also held to much, much higher standards of customer service as the people having issues are PAYING CUSTOMERS. They are not just purchasing a digital item which cannot be refunded, they paying for a service which it's success is more based around quality of product and quality of service. Free to play on the other hand are all about sucking as much money out of players as fast as possible before they move to another free to play title. The simple fact that PWE uses the same currency across their lineup of free to play games just about proves my accusation...
In the end, people need to talk with their wallet. Stop buying into free to play BS...
WoW has a zen store now but continues to use the methods of delayed gaming techiniques to keep players subbed for longer and if they do make the game F2P in the future they'll make it Freemium which is to say they'll limited gameplay enormously unless you pay a sub no matter how much you've spent in their microtransaction store.
Also, I doubt very much they'll have a veterans program anywhere near like what we've seen in games like STO and Rift offering those who've subbed before little things like all of their bag slots and bags of previous toons as well as all of their talents and previous coin when they do finally break down and make it a Freemium model.
When you look at it from that vantage point, you see this model isn't quite so bad altho NW definitely does need a veteran program that rewards players for the length of time they've played, much like STO has.
Comments
I can smugly state that I haven't bought any founder pack.
I can smugly state that with minimal efforts you can make around 20-30k a day on average by playing 2 hrs per day.
I can smugly state that I have spent 20 bucks on this game. And saving AD for an epic mount. Btw, you can get your epic Ioun Stone for free. But you have to work for it too.
The prices in Zstore are not low. Some items are overpriced in terms of the quality or functionality. Like useless companions, lottery asset packs and a one-time fuse guarantee for 16 bucks (!) If you compare, btw, in Dragon Saga, in order to enchant a weapon to level 20 - players spend around 100-150 bucks on average.
But you don't need to spend you hard-earned cash on everything in Zstore.
You know, 600k per month is around 1800 zen.
What I can say, just try top figure out the ways to make money.
Sometimes, I feel that most people who complain about prices in Zstore are those who want instant gratification and want that cool mount now than later but don't want to cough out 35 bucks for instant delivery. You can earn AD and split expenses. 15 bucks-worth AD and 20 bucks in cash.
Instead, they tease you... taunting you with these mysterious chests.... And no way to open them... Muahahaha
Dude just because you can pay for extra bag space or a mount or companion doesn't make the game a pay2win. I have yet to see a mount increase someones damage output or seen a mount or bag kill people in pvp. Plus a lot of games have special currency to purchase stuff like that, there's nothing different.
First off, you get 2 bags from questing, so you only need 2 more, $20.
The $60 pack will get you a purple striker pet and a max speed mount for *every* character on your account.
So, by your logic, $23 per character, minus the character slots if 2 isn't enough (then add $2.50 each)
If you were to play a sub game, that's less than 2 months sub in most games (I'm assuming the $60 pack=the same cost as buying the game/expansions before you even get to start paying a sub!).
Too much? I don't think so!
Correct, which is why lowering their prices will help them sell more. Monetizing bags and mounts is one thing, but to have them cost so much is where the line gets drawn. P2W mechanics are SUPPOSED TO BE aimed at those who want instant gratification. When those who want that instant gratification will not fork out what they are asking for them, thats where the issue lies.
In a sub game id be getting alot more than that for paying the sub fee though, including a monthly point stipend in any sub game worth its salt. So yes, its too much if I have to pay 2 months worth of sub relatively in another game just to get a mount and a couple bags in this one.
If you see yourself playing for 4-6 weeks, then, yes, plonking down the equivalent of 3x+ of a monthly sub is going to be hard to justify.
For me, in a Cryptic game (like this or STO), I tend to fill up the gas tank and then spend over time, because I tend to play games for a longer period. I also take breaks, and then when I come back a few months later, the fund is still there, which makes it easier to jump in and plug any holes I may have from having been away for a few or several months. I expect it will be the same for NW for me as it was for STO. I like Foundry and creation, and I also like taking breaks, so for me it's an investment for the longer term, and it's actually less than it was for sub games (like, say, EVE or WoW) which have managed to get more money from me than the Cryptic/PWE model does.
The one model I would advise to stay away from is the EU model -- that really is a terribly expensive game to play for what it is.
As you were saying, when you subscribe to another game, you are granted FULL ACCESS to all of the content for that particular playing time. This is most certainly true however it goes farther than that. Pay to play games often do not allow any form of RMT, This mean that ideally every player that plays is on an even playing field beyond their available play time. This inevitably makes the economy FAR more involved. Values of items are defined by the rate and ease in which they can be obtained within the GAME WORLD. They are not defined by the value of exchange rates and endorsed RMT which is the Free to Play plague.
Pay to play games are also held to much, much higher standards of customer service as the people having issues are PAYING CUSTOMERS. They are not just purchasing a digital item which cannot be refunded, they paying for a service which it's success is more based around quality of product and quality of service. Free to play on the other hand are all about sucking as much money out of players as fast as possible before they move to another free to play title. The simple fact that PWE uses the same currency across their lineup of free to play games just about proves my accusation...
In the end, people need to talk with their wallet. Stop buying into free to play BS...
Also, I doubt very much they'll have a veterans program anywhere near like what we've seen in games like STO and Rift offering those who've subbed before little things like all of their bag slots and bags of previous toons as well as all of their talents and previous coin when they do finally break down and make it a Freemium model.
When you look at it from that vantage point, you see this model isn't quite so bad altho NW definitely does need a veteran program that rewards players for the length of time they've played, much like STO has.