This is an awsome idea but think of all of the people they would have to hire to go through all of the Foundries ppl would submit with a reward system. I doubt it would be cost efficient for them.
True but someone is already looking them over to make sure they are not doing anything x-rated and reviewing them to make them featured. And what's wrong with keeping people employed?
True but someone is already looking them over to make sure they are not doing anything x-rated and reviewing them to make them featured. And what's wrong with keeping people employed?
I just meant that they probably would not sink that much money into a review team. This team would really have to do more than just review for rating, they would have to play them out and pick some out that would be the best if these were to drop t1 or t2 or better level gear as end game level content would need to do.
GG has amazingly bad design or it is not designed with a goal of "fun" in mind. It showed almost a complete lack of play testing and the rewards are not in any way balanced.
It's a ton of fun to me. And, as long as I end up with some Grym coins for GG gear, I'm good to go.
More, more, more.
It's a ton of fun to me. And, as long as I end up with some Grym coins for GG gear, I'm good to go.
More, more, more.
Traditional raids? *meh*
A little jealous.
I logged in for GG yesterday about halfway through p1 and finished 27th out of 48 after only killing the deciever. So many afkers if I can finish that way with 17 points :P. Then I spent ~20 minutes waiting for a pvp queue. I decided to queue for Dwarf King but the group tool gave me a couple people who probably can't even queue for t1 epics. I pressed on regardless only to have one of the dps, at the boss gate without even pulling once, say "sorry guys, gotta go".
75 minutes for 3 GG coins. I ****ing hate the GG design.
Use the <removed exploit lead-in> to interact with the auction vendor.
Depends on how many points you get for killing the Deceiver. I never kill the Deceiver, but I always end up in the top 10 doing other stuff. I've never spent 20 minutes in q when I q that early. I typically q for pvp at the 10 minute mark and have missed a couple of those. But, even when I miss those, I usually place in the top 15 of Phase 2, so it's all good (though we should get some coins for that).
So far, I only q for Fardelver's. But, I bet Dwarf King is still better than matching for most of the other Epic Dungeons. But, I don't waste my time with the Epic Dungeons anymore because Fardelver's is easy enough and I can buy better gear with Grym coins.
If I really wanted to do Dwarf King, I'd probably go in with guildies I already know.
The overall design is fine.
Raids wouldn't be any better. And would be more frustrating when you wait to 20 players and the some say, "sorry guys, gtg".
That's the primary problem with raids. Takes way more than 20 minutes to organize and people still drop after that.
Ive never really enjoyed raids. They are about as much fun as herding lemmings. And they rarely require much team work.
By this I mean, most raids generally only revolve around a few key people with the rest simply being fodder or DPS. You end up with the A-Team working the strat with everyone else just being extras. They become the burn pit, or add handlers, or they simply just add to the pile on the boss. Their role, the role of the bulk of the raiders mind you, is to simply pad the numbers. If they fail, all that mostly happens is the A-Team has a harder job. If the A-team fails its often a wipe, for everyone.
So you end up with a handful of key players who's success or failure controls the entire raid. And a mass of extras who's sole job normally gets distilled down to a single impossible to mess up task. And we call this teamwork. Unless you are part of the A-team, there is really no fun or team work here. And the odds of people ever being on the A-team are generally slim to none. "Why show someone else how to do it, we already have a player in the guild who can do it well". "Why move you up to the a-team? This other guy has better gear".
To me, 5 man groups remove all this BS. There is no need for fodder or extras. Every group is its own A-team.
And I think the endgame is refreshing getting lateral gear improvements instead of banging my head on the newest raid to get the newest gear that out dates everything that was previously put out. Thus making the older, original raids obsolete as well.
I really dont see the issue with not getting a new class in M1 if thats the case.
They will introduce the campaign system which will let us progress our exsisting characters already. I think it's a good move if they hold back on the new classes until they are completely ready. We do however not know how much content the campaign system will bring, we might sit there after a week or two done with it. If thats the case, I will most likely not bother with NW beyond that, but if it's a good system that lasts until or close to the next module I'll be alright with it.
If it's lacking I can just go back to GW2 which will start up right where I left it, with no worries about falling behind really.
This is extremely discouraging....... as someone who's already leveled every class to 60, been through all the story contentso many times, played with all the dungeons, gauntlegrym, etc...... there's going to be very little reason for me to continue playing if they're not releasing a new class....... way to drop the ball and let us down cryptic!
And just think, when they finally do bring out the new classes, you can run through the same tired content again.
Anyone with half a brain who actually watched interviews could have told you this months ago. Raids were going to be a public area where multiple groups needed to take down a boss but it won't be an instanced raid. Gauntletgrym is what you got. If you're wanting WoW's gear progression model look elsewhere because your certainly won't find it here. Not to mention it will likely be utter <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. All boss encounters evolve around adds and beefing up the boss HPs.
And one will really need to take the context of what Cryptic refer to raids as since numerous time they referred their dungeon delves as "raids."
In Startrek the skirishes kinda work that way, que up, more than 1 group defend station, invade station , kill the borg etc. You got a token (usable for equipement, and drops. I am sure it could be applied to the skirishes in Neverwinter. likely though, you would not call it a raid, though raid like.
But they have said that delves are really the highest content and they where not doing raids as such, though it was hinted that some other content might come that has more poeple. This I thought would be more than 1 group skirishes and maybe a 10 man delve. But we will see how or if that happens.
The lack of more classes is disappointing, though as I have said before, I would have perferred basic classes war,rog,cleric,wizard till 30 then added paragons paths ie guardian fighter/great weapon fighter at 30 adding the skills for those from 30 aswell as the paragon feat trees. I think they could still do that and make it easier to add "new" paths/classes as each path would pretty much equate to a class.
This is sort of how I hoped classes would work. You would choose the base and level paragon paths. I would have rather purchased more paragon path slots than character slots for the same class with a different focus. I agree as well, they could still go down a route like this and I hope they will.
I am surprised how many of you are so against raids? The days of 40 man raids is over I agree, But the 10 man module with hard modes was awesome! Kara and Ulduar in WoW was so much fun! No game is going to be perfect in every way, but I for sure would like to see Cryptic add a 10 man raid in some fashion. They should make the loot BoP so it can't be sold in AH which will give those players who enjoy spending the time necessary to complete the content a perc.
Don't OP the gear either, make it comparable to something a non raider can get so everyone can still compete in world events but give it a different look or ability that others don't get. Not everyone should be able to achieve the same things? why would we want to live in a world where everyone was a Harvard Grad or an Engineer?
We all have things we are good at and things we are not. Not everyone is a skilled raider or likes to spend countless hours questing the same dailies. Variety and community is what will give this game longevity. Let's hope we see some raiding content without destroying what we have now.
IMHO this game has a great start to it. I don't want to get off topic with opinions on Zen Market, Blue Gear, AH and LFG systems. But for this game to grow it's base it is going to have to implement a PVE Raiding system at some point. I hope sooner rather than later!
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eqballzzMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited July 2013
I love people saying they want end-game content but don't want raids. Ok. What is it? Until someone comes up with viable end-game content to replace raids they shouldn't be removing raids as the primary form of end-game content in MMOs (even if it's just 10-man content). I especially love the person saying they want the GW2 brand of "end-game" in some form. If the GW2 end-game was so great what are they doing here? GW2 was great leveling up. The end-game sucks ***. The PVP sucks and there is little to no character progression.
GW2 is filled with lots of semi-interesting "fluff" that would be great as filler between actual end-game content (read: raids) but doesn't work as the primary form of end-game IMO. Sorry but jumping puzzles and silly world events don't amount to good end-game content if you want any sort of progression and progression is the heart of an RPG style game (including MMOs). If you are not progressing your character in some way then I'm sorry but IT'S BORING and pointless. Oh and don't tell me grinding for a new hat that just looks different is progression.
Don't you guys get it? Cryptic developing raids require WORK. If far easier for them to make money sprinkling the community with magical ponies and butterfly companions, then creating actual content. Keep sending them you cash so they can make more skins.
NW-DT4OV7EXH
Every time they idiot-proof something...they make better idiots.
GG and Fury of the Feywild work great for endgame content.
Easy answer.
No "progression" may be boring and pointless to you - upgrading gear is boring and pointless to me.
Give me more fluff and story over crunch and stats any day.
I'd much rather acquire different powers and new adventures than increased power.
RPGs are about playing a role; not rolling for gear. Same should be true for MMOs.
0
eqballzzMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
GG and Fury of the Feywild work great for endgame content.
Easy answer.
No "progression" may be boring and pointless to you - upgrading gear is boring and pointless to me.
Give me more fluff and story over crunch and stats any day.
I'd much rather acquire different powers and new adventures than increased power.
RPGs are about playing a role; not rolling for gear. Same should be true for MMOs.
So you want additional powers for what? To do foundry missions or the same dungeons over and over? At some point you are doing the same content over and over regardless if it's raids or quests or dungeons. Sorry but you are not getting "new" adventures all the time. That is unrealistic. Raids are not only about gear but working as a team to defeat encounters. It's no different than dungeons..just harder and allows for slightly higher participation which makes it a good guild activity. Based on your logic there shouldn't be any dungeons, either since that is just "upgrading gear".
I agree that RPGs are about playing a role but if there isn't content to play that role in what is the point?
The only raids they're likely going to have is from the FBI / Secret Service, backed by the Federal Reserve for getting into the 'cyber-cash" game and competing with them at making money out of thin air...
You think the Money Masters want to allow anyone else to digitally create money like they do? The only reason it's allowed is the gaming industry is peanuts. What's a few billion when the Fed and Banksters have rigged a 300 Trillion dollar market? (Think LIBOR rate scandal, housing scandal, QR-anything, etc).
Comments
It does not "have to be raids". But it is preferable if the "endgame" in an MMORPG is something, as opposed to what it is in Neverwinter, which is
nothing.
True but someone is already looking them over to make sure they are not doing anything x-rated and reviewing them to make them featured. And what's wrong with keeping people employed?
I just meant that they probably would not sink that much money into a review team. This team would really have to do more than just review for rating, they would have to play them out and pick some out that would be the best if these were to drop t1 or t2 or better level gear as end game level content would need to do.
More, more, more.
Traditional raids? *meh*
A little jealous.
I logged in for GG yesterday about halfway through p1 and finished 27th out of 48 after only killing the deciever. So many afkers if I can finish that way with 17 points :P. Then I spent ~20 minutes waiting for a pvp queue. I decided to queue for Dwarf King but the group tool gave me a couple people who probably can't even queue for t1 epics. I pressed on regardless only to have one of the dps, at the boss gate without even pulling once, say "sorry guys, gotta go".
75 minutes for 3 GG coins. I ****ing hate the GG design.
So far, I only q for Fardelver's. But, I bet Dwarf King is still better than matching for most of the other Epic Dungeons. But, I don't waste my time with the Epic Dungeons anymore because Fardelver's is easy enough and I can buy better gear with Grym coins.
If I really wanted to do Dwarf King, I'd probably go in with guildies I already know.
The overall design is fine.
Raids wouldn't be any better. And would be more frustrating when you wait to 20 players and the some say, "sorry guys, gtg".
That's the primary problem with raids. Takes way more than 20 minutes to organize and people still drop after that.
By this I mean, most raids generally only revolve around a few key people with the rest simply being fodder or DPS. You end up with the A-Team working the strat with everyone else just being extras. They become the burn pit, or add handlers, or they simply just add to the pile on the boss. Their role, the role of the bulk of the raiders mind you, is to simply pad the numbers. If they fail, all that mostly happens is the A-Team has a harder job. If the A-team fails its often a wipe, for everyone.
So you end up with a handful of key players who's success or failure controls the entire raid. And a mass of extras who's sole job normally gets distilled down to a single impossible to mess up task. And we call this teamwork. Unless you are part of the A-team, there is really no fun or team work here. And the odds of people ever being on the A-team are generally slim to none. "Why show someone else how to do it, we already have a player in the guild who can do it well". "Why move you up to the a-team? This other guy has better gear".
To me, 5 man groups remove all this BS. There is no need for fodder or extras. Every group is its own A-team.
They will introduce the campaign system which will let us progress our exsisting characters already. I think it's a good move if they hold back on the new classes until they are completely ready. We do however not know how much content the campaign system will bring, we might sit there after a week or two done with it. If thats the case, I will most likely not bother with NW beyond that, but if it's a good system that lasts until or close to the next module I'll be alright with it.
If it's lacking I can just go back to GW2 which will start up right where I left it, with no worries about falling behind really.
What 40% complete thats what 10-20% away from launch quality for this company. There hasnt been anything 100% complete thats been launched yet.
Which is a shame, this game has so much potential..
Sarcasm? I hope so.
And just think, when they finally do bring out the new classes, you can run through the same tired content again.
And one will really need to take the context of what Cryptic refer to raids as since numerous time they referred their dungeon delves as "raids."
Raids..... pfft.
Don't OP the gear either, make it comparable to something a non raider can get so everyone can still compete in world events but give it a different look or ability that others don't get. Not everyone should be able to achieve the same things? why would we want to live in a world where everyone was a Harvard Grad or an Engineer?
We all have things we are good at and things we are not. Not everyone is a skilled raider or likes to spend countless hours questing the same dailies. Variety and community is what will give this game longevity. Let's hope we see some raiding content without destroying what we have now.
IMHO this game has a great start to it. I don't want to get off topic with opinions on Zen Market, Blue Gear, AH and LFG systems. But for this game to grow it's base it is going to have to implement a PVE Raiding system at some point. I hope sooner rather than later!
GW2 is filled with lots of semi-interesting "fluff" that would be great as filler between actual end-game content (read: raids) but doesn't work as the primary form of end-game IMO. Sorry but jumping puzzles and silly world events don't amount to good end-game content if you want any sort of progression and progression is the heart of an RPG style game (including MMOs). If you are not progressing your character in some way then I'm sorry but IT'S BORING and pointless. Oh and don't tell me grinding for a new hat that just looks different is progression.
Every time they idiot-proof something...they make better idiots.
Easy answer.
No "progression" may be boring and pointless to you - upgrading gear is boring and pointless to me.
Give me more fluff and story over crunch and stats any day.
I'd much rather acquire different powers and new adventures than increased power.
RPGs are about playing a role; not rolling for gear. Same should be true for MMOs.
So you want additional powers for what? To do foundry missions or the same dungeons over and over? At some point you are doing the same content over and over regardless if it's raids or quests or dungeons. Sorry but you are not getting "new" adventures all the time. That is unrealistic. Raids are not only about gear but working as a team to defeat encounters. It's no different than dungeons..just harder and allows for slightly higher participation which makes it a good guild activity. Based on your logic there shouldn't be any dungeons, either since that is just "upgrading gear".
I agree that RPGs are about playing a role but if there isn't content to play that role in what is the point?
You think the Money Masters want to allow anyone else to digitally create money like they do? The only reason it's allowed is the gaming industry is peanuts. What's a few billion when the Fed and Banksters have rigged a 300 Trillion dollar market? (Think LIBOR rate scandal, housing scandal, QR-anything, etc).
/off soapbox