You, clearly, did not understand my question. Hopefully, I can clarify it below and you won't have to argue against any more Strawmen.
I did not ask which came first nor did I ask if NWO is the perfect iteration of DnD.
I asked how he could claim to love DnD yet call others 'DnD nerds', using nerds as an obvious pejorative. This type of hypocrisy tends to destroy any arguments he puts forth.
Everyone's just way too touchy, instead of focusing on the actual point everyone would rather just nit pick.
Here's the sentence:
"The DND nerds jumping to the defense of a terrible game are baffling" - the subject here is that it's baffling for DnD nerds to be defending this game. You don't come up with an argument for why they SHOULD but would rather waste time picking on his wording.
Stop being so sensitive if you're really a DnD nerd you shouldn't be upset by being called that. One of google's definitions of nerd is
An intelligent, single-minded expert in a particular technical discipline or profession. - that's not really a wholesale insult
Bottom line is this game outline will never satisfy the DnD itch. RP needs to become priority (real time DMs) Options next, an open build system were players dictate what builds are good and bad. Not filling out a predetermined skill tree. And rules, AC isn't even hit or miss in this "DnD" game. lol. Its all pretty silly imo.
I'm guessing that he would not regard himself as a D&D nerd just for loving D&D. Therefore "DND nerds" are defined by something other than the love of the game.
Thus he isn't denigrating others for enjoying the same things as he does.
He is denigrating them for enjoying different things than he does.
I see.
So, basically, he is a Dungeons and Dragons bigot.
Thanks for the clarity!
Everyone's just way too touchy, instead of focusing on the actual point everyone would rather just nit pick.
Here's the sentence:
"The DND nerds jumping to the defense of a terrible game are baffling" - the subject here is that it's baffling for DnD nerds to be defending this game. You don't come up with an argument for why they SHOULD but would rather waste time picking on his wording.
Stop being so sensitive if you're really a DnD nerd you shouldn't be upset by being called that. One of google's definitions of nerd is
An intelligent, single-minded expert in a particular technical discipline or profession. - that's not really a wholesale insult
How do you conclude that I am upset merely because I asked a person to clarify their statement?
The only thing irritating (note: not upsetting) is when people do not read statements, jump to conclusions and make up whole arguments from thin air to dissemble.
Also, he obviously used 'DnD nerds' as a pejorative. This is why I asked as he loves DnD yet he attempts to put others down for enjoying DnD.
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darkstorn42Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
To the OP:
I read your review, and while well written, its not a very good review. You just bashed on the game the entire time and only mentioned one thing that you liked, the combat. You later stated that the combat sucked, so you were argueing with yourself. In addition, a lot of the stuff you said the game was missing most MMOs do not have on launch, and its something that comes out later. Also, there is a raid style combat in the game, its just buggy right now.
To sum up your review for everyone else, which no where sums my opinion, "This game is bad and just trust my opinion without details or explanation."
I'd be very interested to hear how exactly I'm pushing a personal agenda, if it's this evident it should be pretty easy to come up with some real arguments instead of just being vague.
Firstly you start straight off by telling people that they shouldn't play this (free to try out, free to play) game, and that the companies involved have done a disservice to the gaming community. That is fine as an opinion, but not to claim that you can speak for the gaming community.
You throw insults at some of the people who decided differently about that game than you did.
You don't mention things like the foundry: whether not you agree with the concept, its a fairly large factor in the potential that the game has.
Likewise you avoid potential mitigating factors like zen not actually requiring you to pay real money to get, or zen mounts giving you the mount for all the characters you have, or will ever have.
Its not just that it comes across as a bit one-sided, its that you would have to know the game already to realise this: the people most "at risk" from the article (ones who haven't yet tried it, and may or may not enjoy it if they do) are the ones without the knowledge to spot the flaws in it.
This came across as particularly nasty given that there is no purchase of subscription cost: all someone would have to lose by playing the game to try it out is some time and bandwidth. Hence why telling people not to play it and decide for themselves seemed to imply that the personal agenda: making the game fail was more important than the review: telling people about the game and warning them about the issues in it.
It's not an official gaming site, it's not meant to be one so we agree on that. The mistakes you mention - can you be specific? the point of all this is discussion. I came here with an opinion; not to hear everyone agree with me. I was quite certain I'd get plenty of people disagreeing.
The first one that really annoyed me was the claim that you cannot use in-game currency for the auction house. You could make an argument that zen isn't an in-game currency, but all Astral Diamonds other than initial founder pack ones must be earned within the game. Even the ones that you can buy with zen were earned by another player who you are buying them from.
Another that I had issue with was regarding the post-60 content. However having checked on the date of the blog I've realised that it is technically true if Gauntlegrym was just being advertised but was not actually in-game yet.
Some items are BoP: You cannot just buy every single piece of loot in the game.
You do not require anything exclusive to zen-bought profession packs to make items on which you can turn a profit.
As always with different people, YMMV. But touting it as a review rather than an opinion piece or rage post does lead to certain expectations for even-handedness not expected in the other two.
I have been wanting to write a review of NeverWinter ever since I reached level 60. The problem has been there is so much I wanted to say about it that I've had a hard time getting it all out in a post. I've finally done that (linked below).
While my girlfriend edited it for me she made a comment about how NeverWinter sounds very much like 50 Shade of Grey. I asked her to elaborate. She said that 50 Shades of Grey was a new, racey, BDSM filled romance novel that has drawn in so many readers but left them hot, wet and wanting for more. 50 Shades of Grey tried to create a new genre of books that was racey and different than anything in the mainstream. But the problem with it is that although there was good "giggity giggity" scenes, the rest of it was absolute <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. There was no story line and it left readers in a state of, "should I keep reading to see if it gets better because I really want this to work out, or should I stop now because this seems to be going nowhere." I had the exact same experience in NeverWinter. The combat engine was fun, and it seemed like it had the potential to be an engaging PVP experience. Could this really be the next game to hook my attention for more than a millisecond since EverQuest? The promise was there but would it have the follow through. Click here to read on.
Greetings
I read the blog, and I would like to take a moment to discuss it with you.
For starters, it begins with a disservice, calling something a "Shiny <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>" is rather crude and vulgar, not really something anyone really wants to be met with from what begins as a long winded review, regardless if they like the game or not, that opens the door with a bitter beginning.
Secondly, saying the game is awful, is not helpful at all, and lets be real here, it's not awful, it's comparable to most MMO's out there in combat, graphics, and story line, class builds, and world development. while, I will say it is not a polished as some games like GW2, that in no way makes this game awful.
I would suggest that since a large part of your beginning outrage is focused at lore, and lack of immersible depth of the game, you should focus on that, as opposed to nit picking the mechanics, where are quiet sound, even if they could use some polish, and revision.
Your next point is how fast the leveling process goes, in that front, it is your own fault for hastening your end game, you could run dungeons at any level and enjoy them in Neverwinter, with it's dynamic leveling adjustment mechanic, meaning that you can get "cool looking" gear, without needing to hit end game for it. While I agree that pace by which you out level your gear is not what I was used it, it is very common in most contemporary MMO's like TERA and GW2. This is not a demerit in design or a bad game mechanic. It is quite common. Now if you had not played MMO's for any length of time since EQ, I can understand the system shock, but, if you were up to date with MMO's it would very run on the mill norm style of play.
I would say the biggest problem with your blog post, is that it hard to pinpoint what your real outrage is, where the real problem is, and it seems to all fall into the Zen shop, (abeit I do agree that the Coin (Gold/Silver/Etc, Then AD's and then Zen) all with their own system and means to work together is annoying, it hardly makes this game trash or awful.
It seems your largest gripe is the Cost in the store for Zen items, well, in that front, most Review sites agree with you, the Zen costs have met with unwelcome reviews from places like MMORPG, but again, That hardly makes the game Awful, nor does it make incomplete.
What you should do is go back, and really focus on what your main issue of contention is, and then work on that, without painting the game with such a large myopic brush, it really paints you in a bad light to be such broad based, and yet lacking any real focus for your outrage.
Anyway, I also looked at your GF's blog, she's cute.
So you didn't really write a review at all, you wrote an extended rant?
A world to defend
A city to protect
innocents to save
"Why?" They ask "they hate you"
We're heroes it's what we do.
*patiently waiting on Paragon City*
The point was, if you could use your brain for two seconds to use common sense, is that while I love forgotten realms and DND type stuff, the DND nerds was aimed at the clowns out there that are so obsessed with DND that they blindly obsess over this game despite the fact that from top to bottom it is absolute garbage.'
As someone who played this game and no longer does, that does not make me self contradicting.
The phrase "DND" bigot is either hilarious or the most <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> thing I've ever heard.... cant deicde which.
Secondly, saying the game is awful, is not helpful at all, and lets be real here, it's not awful, it's comparable to most MMO's out there in combat, graphics, and story line, class builds, and world development. while, I will say it is not a polished as some games like GW2, that in no way makes this game awful.
.
With all respect - because your post is one of the few here that arent insulting (including some of my own) if your idea of a polished quality game is GW2 then I weep for your MMO experiences. There are so many amazing games out there.
One issue raised that I have yet to see a Neverwinter supporter answer is... what can you do at 60 by yourself? What if I play at times or have a day off work where my guild or core group isnt around? What kind of character advancement is there to do solo? There is nothing to do at 60 that you can do alone to make your character better.
That is a MASSIVE flaw that no other game I have ever played endures. I obviously have no numbers to show but I bet if you took the amount of players that log in daily 5 days after Open Beta came out, and look at the number the day the game was declared "no longer in beta" and I'm betting the numbers are astounding how few people play now compared to then.
With all respect - because your post is one of the few here that arent insulting (including some of my own) if your idea of a polished quality game is GW2 then I weep for your MMO experiences. There are so many amazing games out there.
With all due respect, but such as?
One issue raised that I have yet to see a Neverwinter supporter answer is... what can you do at 60 by yourself? What if I play at times or have a day off work where my guild or core group isnt around? What kind of character advancement is there to do solo? There is nothing to do at 60 that you can do alone to make your character better.
I have no idea, I am not level 60 yet, I don't play to grind to the next level, I play to enjoy the game, as such, as of late, I have been looking into Foundry Quests, of which I have found to be very enjoyable. In that regard, and not sound like a broken record, but every game is really what you make of it.
That is a MASSIVE flaw that no other game I have ever played endures. I obviously have no numbers to show but I bet if you took the amount of players that log in daily 5 days after Open Beta came out, and look at the number the day the game was declared "no longer in beta" and I'm betting the numbers are astounding how few people play now compared to then.
I would respectfully disagree, most games that build on a trinity model, such as Neverwinter did, suffer this issue, that in the End Game you need to have a group. It is an inherent aspect of the "Distinct roles of each class" condition of any game built off that premise will suffer through. I would not call that a design flaw, as it was deliberate and thus intended, but I feel it is a flawed approach to contemporary MMOs.
I read the blog, and I would like to take a moment to discuss it with you.
For starters, it begins with a disservice, calling something a "Shiny <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>" is rather crude and vulgar, not really something anyone really wants to be met with from what begins as a long winded review, regardless if they like the game or not, that opens the door with a bitter beginning.
Secondly, saying the game is awful, is not helpful at all, and lets be real here, it's not awful, it's comparable to most MMO's out there in combat, graphics, and story line, class builds, and world development. while, I will say it is not a polished as some games like GW2, that in no way makes this game awful.
I would suggest that since a large part of your beginning outrage is focused at lore, and lack of immersible depth of the game, you should focus on that, as opposed to nit picking the mechanics, where are quiet sound, even if they could use some polish, and revision.
Your next point is how fast the leveling process goes, in that front, it is your own fault for hastening your end game, you could run dungeons at any level and enjoy them in Neverwinter, with it's dynamic leveling adjustment mechanic, meaning that you can get "cool looking" gear, without needing to hit end game for it. While I agree that pace by which you out level your gear is not what I was used it, it is very common in most contemporary MMO's like TERA and GW2. This is not a demerit in design or a bad game mechanic. It is quite common. Now if you had not played MMO's for any length of time since EQ, I can understand the system shock, but, if you were up to date with MMO's it would very run on the mill norm style of play.
I would say the biggest problem with your blog post, is that it hard to pinpoint what your real outrage is, where the real problem is, and it seems to all fall into the Zen shop, (abeit I do agree that the Coin (Gold/Silver/Etc, Then AD's and then Zen) all with their own system and means to work together is annoying, it hardly makes this game trash or awful.
It seems your largest gripe is the Cost in the store for Zen items, well, in that front, most Review sites agree with you, the Zen costs have met with unwelcome reviews from places like MMORPG, but again, That hardly makes the game Awful, nor does it make incomplete.
What you should do is go back, and really focus on what your main issue of contention is, and then work on that, without painting the game with such a large myopic brush, it really paints you in a bad light to be such broad based, and yet lacking any real focus for your outrage.
Anyway, I also looked at your GF's blog, she's cute.
You lost any credibility with me at the bolded-underlined portion.
While my girlfriend edited it for me she made a comment about how NeverWinter sounds very much like 50 Shade of Grey. I asked her to elaborate. She said that 50 Shades of Grey was a new, racey, BDSM filled romance novel that has drawn in so many readers but left them hot, wet and wanting for more.
There's not much to buy in this game in order to enjoy most of it.
If you want to be an absolute best in PVP then, yes, get ready to splash out. But it is your choice.
And if you can't pay 10 bucks for a bag then find a job.
An average game costs 50 bucks? Ten and fifty, honey.
The end game has tons of bugs, exploits, all gear is BoE, boss fights are repetitive. Without adds bosses are simple.
I think the game is untested and moved in the wrong direction.
While other games minimize trash and focus on boss fights this one adds tons useless bytes to make gameplay tedious.
Despite the many abilities I mostly keep the left button on and just add encounters off cd. It gets stale.
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loonbeMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 4Arc User
edited June 2013
You can't really call this a review. All you do is line up everything you hate about the game in a language as abrasive as you can.
No, it's a rant. A rant on how this game is not the time sink you want it to be. And that's fine, this game is clearly not suited for you. If you are however part of a couple of friends with only an hour a day to spend, this game has everything you need.
Also, you open your review saying you like the combat system but end your review saying it sucks.
I read your review, and while well written, its not a very good review. You just bashed on the game the entire time and only mentioned one thing that you liked, the combat. You later stated that the combat sucked, so you were argueing with yourself. In addition, a lot of the stuff you said the game was missing most MMOs do not have on launch, and its something that comes out later. Also, there is a raid style combat in the game, its just buggy right now.
To sum up your review for everyone else, which no where sums my opinion, "This game is bad and just trust my opinion without details or explanation."
I liked the combat ENGINE at first, it's quick and involving. Unfortunately it's also 60 levels of circle on the ground dodging. It has potential but their implementation of one combat tactic is lazy. Having one PvE/PvP encounter in your game does not raid content make. Most good mmo's launch with some end game content, WoW and Everquest both did
I read the blog, and I would like to take a moment to discuss it with you.
For starters, it begins with a disservice, calling something a "Shiny <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>" is rather crude and vulgar, not really something anyone really wants to be met with from what begins as a long winded review, regardless if they like the game or not, that opens the door with a bitter beginning.
Secondly, saying the game is awful, is not helpful at all, and lets be real here, it's not awful, it's comparable to most MMO's out there in combat, graphics, and story line, class builds, and world development. while, I will say it is not a polished as some games like GW2, that in no way makes this game awful.
You come to THESE forums and find the term "<font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>" overly offensive. You eluding to GW2 as polished pretty much shows your hand and removes your credibility. That game is ok but to use it as a measuring stick for other MMO's is a mistake.
I would suggest that since a large part of your beginning outrage is focused at lore, and lack of immersible depth of the game, you should focus on that, as opposed to nit picking the mechanics, where are quiet sound, even if they could use some polish, and revision.
There's no lore worth talking about, or depth. I didn't nit pick game mechanics the combat engine is quite good the implementation of it however isn't. As I said 60 levels of dodging red circles on the ground to do it again at 60. There's 0 variance in combat strategy
Your next point is how fast the leveling process goes, in that front, it is your own fault for hastening your end game, you could run dungeons at any level and enjoy them in Neverwinter, with it's dynamic leveling adjustment mechanic, meaning that you can get "cool looking" gear, without needing to hit end game for it. While I agree that pace by which you out level your gear is not what I was used it, it is very common in most contemporary MMO's like TERA and GW2. This is not a demerit in design or a bad game mechanic. It is quite common. Now if you had not played MMO's for any length of time since EQ, I can understand the system shock, but, if you were up to date with MMO's it would very run on the mill norm style of play.
I didn't rush through the leveling process, I played the game and after getting my first toon to 60 concluded there's very little point in the dungeons, as soon as you get out and start back to the quest line you out level the gear you got in less time than it took to get it
Cool looking leveling gear? I leveled a guardian fighter (tanks the kings of cool gear in most MMO's)....and ran every instance for all the blue gear I could find until level 60 it all pretty much looked the same and I in turn looked identical to every other dwarf GW. You out level the gear because the content is so easy that how could you not? I love running instances - it's the point of an MMO for me grouping/raid content but the ones in this game consist of adds, red circles on the ground, more adds and big slow easily avoided bosses. Did I leave anything out?
I would say the biggest problem with your blog post, is that it hard to pinpoint what your real outrage is, where the real problem is, and it seems to all fall into the Zen shop, (abeit I do agree that the Coin (Gold/Silver/Etc, Then AD's and then Zen) all with their own system and means to work together is annoying, it hardly makes this game trash or awful.
p
-No depth (no value in 1-60, tradeskill system is a facebook game, combat is the same from 1-60 etc)
-necessary items such as wards for enchants only enter the game when someone forks over actual money
-being able to buy everything with money adds an air of "what's the point" for me. End game loot being completely trivial to get does diminsh it's inhernet value.
-unfinished classes
-no raid content worth discussing, no 60 content worth discussing
-foundry is too restrictive - without some sort of progression or something to strive for what am I doing here? playing the game for the joy of the stories in foundry? I'm not going to rip on anyone if that's what they enjoy but THIS isn't enough to call a game a good or complete MMO
-there's no need for this many currency systems - it's designed to be confusing and nothing more (no I'm not confused by it, but one shouldn't need to track this many different currencies)
Keep in mind I had a group of friends at 60, a reasonably large one. We ran out of stuff to do so quickly most of the people quit out of boredom because there was just nothing else to do.
It seems your largest gripe is the Cost in the store for Zen items, well, in that front, most Review sites agree with you, the Zen costs have met with unwelcome reviews from places like MMORPG, but again, That hardly makes the game Awful, nor does it make incomplete.
Zen store does not make the game incomplete I've already touched on some of the points above but:
-classes are not finished, they're full of bugs and they still have talent trees to introduce (which requires a lot of balancing)
-raid content has not been tested, it was just launched with live and the result was obvious. I don't think I need to elaborate on why Gaunt isn't a great experience
-loot systems that boggle the mind - so many games out there with working loot systems that people do not gripe about constantly/are not so easily abused by ninja's and other clowns
-PvP there's no balance at all, no DR, the maps are all pretty much the same (tiny) there's 0 variance it's all capture the nodes and often times you end up very quickly in a 4v5 match; the matchmaking is awful as well. There appears to be NO effort made to try and line up competitive games
-no companion tomes - really it's THAT difficult to implement an item which allows my companion to level the same way I do? (minor gripe I don't really need my companion for anything but it's still unfinished feeling)
-the world is tiny and full of invisible walls, there's 0 point in exploring anything at 60
What you should do is go back, and really focus on what your main issue of contention is, and then work on that, without painting the game with such a large myopic brush, it really paints you in a bad light to be such broad based, and yet lacking any real focus for your outrage.
Anyway, I also looked at your GF's blog, she's cute.
Posting more frequently and with more focus has been something I've wanted to work on. Posting more positive stuff is also on my radar one only has so much time outside other real life commitments. I really do appreciate the feedback and discussion. Thanks
Firstly you start straight off by telling people that they shouldn't play this (free to try out, free to play) game, and that the companies involved have done a disservice to the gaming community. That is fine as an opinion, but not to claim that you can speak for the gaming community.
My statement is they did a disservice, I do not claim I speak for the gaming community anywhere in my post. My opinion is this game does nothing good for gaming and unfinished games releasing with a plethora of paid options is a bad trend. The paid options should be disabled until the game is ready for launch so people can..you know...test
You throw insults at some of the people who decided differently about that game than you did.
You don't mention things like the foundry: whether not you agree with the concept, its a fairly large factor in the potential that the game has.
Likewise you avoid potential mitigating factors like zen not actually requiring you to pay real money to get, or zen mounts giving you the mount for all the characters you have, or will ever have.
I believe the only insult in the post is the reference to "poor suckers" who bought founders packs. I should add to that I feel real bad for anyone who paid 200 bucks to play this game. To be clear - I'm not saying every founders pack owner is upset with their purchase. But I know there's a large number out there that wishes they could get their 200 bucks back.
Its not just that it comes across as a bit one-sided, its that you would have to know the game already to realise this: the people most "at risk" from the article (ones who haven't yet tried it, and may or may not enjoy it if they do) are the ones without the knowledge to spot the flaws in it.
This came across as particularly nasty given that there is no purchase of subscription cost: all someone would have to lose by playing the game to try it out is some time and bandwidth. Hence why telling people not to play it and decide for themselves seemed to imply that the personal agenda: making the game fail was more important than the review: telling people about the game and warning them about the issues in it.
I point out the flaws, the game takes no time to get to 60 and when you get there there's nothing to do but spend money. There is no depth anywhere at all in this game there's nothing that takes any real time to accomplish and character development is non existent. Perhaps better advice would be "play but avoid the cash shop" but it IS a blog and that piece was written while I was aggravated. Sure it could have come off differently but I've yet to hear a valid argument for "there's nothing to do at 60" once you spend a bit of time getting your T2..you're done.
The first one that really annoyed me was the claim that you cannot use in-game currency for the auction house. You could make an argument that zen isn't an in-game currency, but all Astral Diamonds other than initial founder pack ones must be earned within the game. Even the ones that you can buy with zen were earned by another player who you are buying them from.
Another that I had issue with was regarding the post-60 content. However having checked on the date of the blog I've realised that it is technically true if Gauntlegrym was just being advertised but was not actually in-game yet.
Some items are BoP: You cannot just buy every single piece of loot in the game.
You do not require anything exclusive to zen-bought profession packs to make items on which you can turn a profit.
As always with different people, YMMV. But touting it as a review rather than an opinion piece or rage post does lead to certain expectations for even-handedness not expected in the other two.
In game currency drops from mobs, why would it be so unbalancing to allow me to farm mobs and buy stuff? This reinvention of the currency wheel adds 0 value. I think their currency system is awful - don't just defend it by stating you can use this to buy that. Can you think of a valid reason to need THAT many different currencies for things? come on now
It just feels cheap, unfinished, buggy and full of stuff to spend your money on. My assertion is at 60 you run out of stuff worth doing very quickly and to progress your toon (say to be able to be competitive in pvp) you must spend money; or use Astral Diamonds to buy items that someone has spent money on. There's no way to earn it via playing the game alone.
There's not much to buy in this game in order to enjoy most of it.
If you want to be an absolute best in PVP then, yes, get ready to splash out. But it is your choice.
And if you can't pay 10 bucks for a bag then find a job.
An average game costs 50 bucks? Ten and fifty, honey.
So a mount and a bag amount to the cost of the average game. I didn't say I cannot afford it nowhere do I elude to it being too expensive for me to afford.
If I want to be competitive in pvp I need to "splash out" and that's my "choice" so I can "choose" to get rolled by players who have spent money on enchants/gear or I can "choose" to be mediocre via obtaining items through the game. But I have no other choice aside from leaving which I've already done
The end game has tons of bugs, exploits, all gear is BoE, boss fights are repetitive. Without adds bosses are simple.
I think the game is untested and moved in the wrong direction.
While other games minimize trash and focus on boss fights this one adds tons useless bytes to make gameplay tedious.
Despite the many abilities I mostly keep the left button on and just add encounters off cd. It gets stale.
You can't really call this a review. All you do is line up everything you hate about the game in a language as abrasive as you can.
No, it's a rant. A rant on how this game is not the time sink you want it to be. And that's fine, this game is clearly not suited for you. If you are however part of a couple of friends with only an hour a day to spend, this game has everything you need.
Also, you open your review saying you like the combat system but end your review saying it sucks.
I didn't want the game to be a time sink, I wanted it to be worth playing for more than a month. I didn't spend all my waking hours playing I played a bit here and there afterwork and had a couple longish weekend sessions. Nothing extreme at all
I described my experience with it and provided my reasoning. The combat engine has potential but their implementation is poor. You login you dodge the red stuff, you logout.
few things i felt i should point out after reading your post and your rant (its not a review its a personal rant)
coalescent wards can drop in the chest you get after logging in for 7 days and praying with the celestial coins, the mounts you buy with gold are all you REALLY need, but its easy to earn AD ingame and exchange for zen to buy said mounts if you so choose, as for bag space and bank space, never needed to buy bank space, and bought bags on my first character, but didnt feel the need to on my second so havnt bothered.
as for endgame content, theres more lvl 60 dungeons in this game than there are in most mmo's at launch, and frankly, raiding isnt fun, so i really dont mind not having that ingame.
with regards to everything being forsale, im Fing glad it is, on both of my fully geared out lvl 60'si have looted 3 pieces of armour / weapons total for them out of dozens and dozens of dungeon runs, i simply didnt have luck, what i did do, was sell the stuff i did win and bought the stuff i needed, frankly i find this one of the better aspects of this game, and crafting sucks in pretty much every game ive ever played, with mortal online being the exception, the way its handled here is fine.
so with that all said, dont put something forward as a review when you are in fact just ranting about things you dont like (a review would atleast explain how the incredibly simple to understand multiple currencies actually work to the point that you need never spend a penny ingame yourself).
You come to THESE forums and find the term "<font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>" overly offensive. You eluding to GW2 as polished pretty much shows your hand and removes your credibility. That game is ok but to use it as a measuring stick for other MMO's is a mistake.
I am going to have to ask you to not put words into my mouth, I never said I was offended, I said is vulgar, and crude, and in that regard makes you look bad, anyone even reading that opening line would dismiss what you wrote as a "review" and realize that it was nothing short of a emotionally fueled hate rant.
If you want to have a "review" taken seriously, you might want to make an effort to make it an actual review. After reading what you wrote, I did not see anything in what you said, that supported your "Feelings" on the issues.
Case in point:
Your First Problem: too easy to level.
To most gamers that is not a "problem" that is a boon to the game, where they do not need to run the same dungeon a hundred times to grind out their next level. In fact, western MMO's have been making a striding move to get away from that level of tedium in a game and make it so that players can "opt" to take any path they want. Simply put, you can if you like coffee that much, ground the game and level up, or you can take the time to explore the game, and do whatever you want and not worry about the leveling process. IE: The reality is, Modern MMO's are removing the focus on "grinding levels" and letting players focus on "playing the game".
If you walked into Neverwinter with the intent to Grind, then you were the one that set yourself up to fail from the onset. Most contemporary and western gamers have voiced that as they have grown older, jobs, life, family have taken a cut into what would be their game time, and thus there is a strong sense of appreciation for a game that we as players don't need to grind levels to get them, and could.. kick it old school and Go adventure with our friends or, since this is the internet, just kick back and try to have some fun with total strangers knowing the levels would come quickly enough on their own.
In fact, easy, grindless leveling is a sale point of most games, and Neverwinter, is no exception to that, players can just play, have fun, and not worry about leveling. Those that put too much into the number next to their level are the ones that make the game less enjoyable. The foundry and a good chunk (not sure if all of them can be or not) of the quests in Neverwinter can be done at any level, and thus, really, "End Game" is just a number and a state of mind, it has no real impact on the game overall. By around 20th, you have every ability unlocked, so, after that it's just a list of swap-outs.
Cool looking leveling gear? I leveled a guardian fighter (tanks the kings of cool gear in most MMO's)....and ran every instance for all the blue gear I could find until level 60 it all pretty much looked the same and I in turn looked identical to every other dwarf GW.
Not to be rude, but again this was your fault, by 16th I was using an ax on my Dwarf GF, and I will say, it gave me a very unique look in regards to the vast number of sword users I met. I will admit, that my main toon is only 18th now, and the choices of gear open to me is limited, but that is the case with any MMO, from EQ, (which had zero ability to change your look outside the cookie-cutter requirement of top gear, unless you wanted to downgrade your stats) to Neverwinter just released out this week end.
However, in Neverwinter, you can at-will, change the appearance of any gear item you have, right from your inventory, so if you have a preferred look or style, in my case, I believed Dwarfs should use axes, with just some AD's (which I get for free just for playing the game) I would just kept re-skinning my new weapons with the ax skin I liked, to keep the look I enjoyed, I found it to be a very fun and decent feature that you can keep it up throughout the entire leveling process.
-foundry is too restrictive - without some sort of progression or something to strive for what am I doing here? playing the game for the joy of the stories in foundry? I'm not going to rip on anyone if that's what they enjoy but THIS isn't enough to call a game a good or complete MMO
I find this rather amusing coming from someone that claims to be an old EQ player, where there was absolutely no objective to the game beyond grinding Gear and Levels.
In the end, I see you have some issues with this game, well, it's a free a game, and with the growing trend of F2P MMO's the developers are allowed to make a game they want to make, and then open the doors to let others come in and enjoy it, if it is not their thing, they are free to move on to something they may enjoy more. With the F2P model, the designers and developers do not need to grasp at every sub, and worry about every warm body that occupies their server, there is no need to cater to the discontent, disillusioned, or just querulous individuals in the gaming world.
Like many things, a game is just, a game, regardless of the flack I got for it, I personally found GW2 to be a very enjoyable contemporary title, I am sure power gamers that maxed out by the end of the first week had a different view then myself, and that is fine, the world is made of many different kinds of players, each with what they enjoy and do not enjoy, I waited a few months before buying the game, and then took my sweet time exploring and enjoying the game as I wanted to.
Just like in Neverwinter, I have no rush to 60th, the truth is, after playing MMO's for over a score of years, the hard truth is, there is nothing at the end game but more of the same, this is literally a Meme of the MMO world and design. There were a few games that do give a bit more to do at Cap, games like DAoC and GW2 with their Realms vs Realms combat, but that is not really new content per say, that is players entertaining themselves by killing each other day in and day out in old content.
In the end, if you want to rant at a game, you can, I believe the freedom of speak entitles you to do so, but at the end of the day, it's free to play, they are under no obligation to cater to you or your needs. Their goal is to make a game that some people want to play, for the ones that enjoy it, they put options in to support their hobby via a cash shop so that everyone feels like they got something, and those that don't, they can move on without either party feeling any remorse.
Neverwinter was not for you, let it go and find something that is.
cipher9nemoMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
In your article you wrote...
Side note, since spider mounts are bound to your account, it's a big, red flag telling everyone how much of a moron you were to spend $200 on a free to play game.
How utterly judgmental and narrow-viewed that statement is. When I scanned your review and saw this at the end I didn't bother reading the rest.
If you walked into Neverwinter with the intent to Grind, then you were the one that set yourself up to fail from the onset. Most contemporary and western gamers have voiced that as they have grown older, jobs, life, family have taken a cut into what would be their game time, and thus there is a strong sense of appreciation for a game that we as players don't need to grind levels to get them, and could.. kick it old school and Go adventure with our friends or, since this is the internet, just kick back and try to have some fun with total strangers knowing the levels would come quickly enough on their own.
The issue with this is the old school grind games used to please all types of players. They didnt just have the grinders, they had the RPers, the casuals, and the PVPers etc - all on board. Nowdays games focus on the casuals, and the people who actually want a longer journey and a grindy endgame can no longer find it reliably.
Why?
Youve stated half the case: Players have voiced that as they have grown older, jobs, life, family have taken a cut into what would be their game time, and thus there is a strong sense of appreciation for a game that we as players don't need to grind levels to get them.
The other half of this however, is that many of those same people have also voiced that they feel entitled to the same loot and other rewards the grinders have, while not wanting to grind for it. This is the major difference between say EQ1 or UO versus todays games. Casual players were satisfied knowing they werent the best geared in older MMOs. Now days this is not the case - the casual players demand to have the same rewards as the grinders, which eliminates the ability for MMO companies to cater to grinders in the first place.
End result: The entirety of the genre, minus a few exceptions, is built around casual gamers who hop from game to game nowdays. The grinders of old are now speed gamers who basically get to the end of the game in a few weeks (sometimes a few days) and then have nothing left to do until new content comes out. Thus they hop from game to game. They come back when new content hits and leave again when they have handedly beaten it and achieved all desired loot from it.
The issue with this is the old school grind games used to please all types of players. They didnt just have the grinders, they had the RPers, the casuals, and the PVPers etc - all on board. Nowdays games focus on the casuals, and the people who actually want a longer journey and a grindy endgame can no longer find it reliably.
Why?
Youve stated half the case: Players have voiced that as they have grown older, jobs, life, family have taken a cut into what would be their game time, and thus there is a strong sense of appreciation for a game that we as players don't need to grind levels to get them.
The other half of this however, is that many of those same people have also voiced that they feel entitled to the same loot and other rewards the grinders have, while not wanting to grind for it. This is the major difference between say EQ1 or UO versus todays games. Casual players were satisfied knowing they werent the best geared in older MMOs. Now days this is not the case - the casual players demand to have the same rewards as the grinders, which eliminates the ability for MMO companies to cater to grinders in the first place.
End result: The entirety of the genre, minus a few exceptions, is built around casual gamers who hop from game to game nowdays. The grinders of old are now speed gamers who basically get to the end of the game in a few weeks (sometimes a few days) and then have nothing left to do until new content comes out. Thus they hop from game to game. They come back when new content hits and leave again when they have handedly beaten it and achieved all desired loot from it.
I believe that another main point of contention that you are missing my friend, is that the volume of players has changed as well. When EQ came out, it was in every sense of the word a "fringe" game, one could even akin it to what would be today an "indy" game, for it's perceived audience.
Things changed, and gamers became a real market share, and with that too, gone are the days when playing DnD made you an outcast, and we embrace the movement of the future where games are mainstream, where they are played by people with families, jobs, and professional identities. With that comes the realization, that games need to address these people, sorry, but in the past players were never content that they had second rate gear, they would respond with the fact they had a life as a means of validation for it, and in many ways, they were correct, but in the modern times, in the past 2 decades of games and MMO's, it has become apparent that the majority of the gamers have 'lives" to compete with their game. Hence the ongoing move of most MMO's to remove grind, while still trying to add fun factors.
In the case of Neverwinter, it comes in the forum of running a dungeon for the sake of just having fun running a dungeon without needing to grind some special named loot, or needing to do it a dozen times over for that last level. It is the fact that players have Girl Friends, they have wives, children, jobs, and many things in life, and what is becoming very clear in the recent trends of MMO's is that companies are learning if they make someone chose between their MMO and that person being there for their family, is not something they can continue to do. Wecome to the new age of MMO's, where is many ways, it mimic's the table top adventure, where we were allowed to gather together, to just have fun and play a game, and not sit around and grind.
Comments
Everyone's just way too touchy, instead of focusing on the actual point everyone would rather just nit pick.
Here's the sentence:
"The DND nerds jumping to the defense of a terrible game are baffling" - the subject here is that it's baffling for DnD nerds to be defending this game. You don't come up with an argument for why they SHOULD but would rather waste time picking on his wording.
Stop being so sensitive if you're really a DnD nerd you shouldn't be upset by being called that. One of google's definitions of nerd is
An intelligent, single-minded expert in a particular technical discipline or profession. - that's not really a wholesale insult
I see.
So, basically, he is a Dungeons and Dragons bigot.
Thanks for the clarity!
How do you conclude that I am upset merely because I asked a person to clarify their statement?
The only thing irritating (note: not upsetting) is when people do not read statements, jump to conclusions and make up whole arguments from thin air to dissemble.
Also, he obviously used 'DnD nerds' as a pejorative. This is why I asked as he loves DnD yet he attempts to put others down for enjoying DnD.
I read your review, and while well written, its not a very good review. You just bashed on the game the entire time and only mentioned one thing that you liked, the combat. You later stated that the combat sucked, so you were argueing with yourself. In addition, a lot of the stuff you said the game was missing most MMOs do not have on launch, and its something that comes out later. Also, there is a raid style combat in the game, its just buggy right now.
To sum up your review for everyone else, which no where sums my opinion, "This game is bad and just trust my opinion without details or explanation."
You throw insults at some of the people who decided differently about that game than you did.
You don't mention things like the foundry: whether not you agree with the concept, its a fairly large factor in the potential that the game has.
Likewise you avoid potential mitigating factors like zen not actually requiring you to pay real money to get, or zen mounts giving you the mount for all the characters you have, or will ever have.
Its not just that it comes across as a bit one-sided, its that you would have to know the game already to realise this: the people most "at risk" from the article (ones who haven't yet tried it, and may or may not enjoy it if they do) are the ones without the knowledge to spot the flaws in it.
This came across as particularly nasty given that there is no purchase of subscription cost: all someone would have to lose by playing the game to try it out is some time and bandwidth. Hence why telling people not to play it and decide for themselves seemed to imply that the personal agenda: making the game fail was more important than the review: telling people about the game and warning them about the issues in it.
The first one that really annoyed me was the claim that you cannot use in-game currency for the auction house. You could make an argument that zen isn't an in-game currency, but all Astral Diamonds other than initial founder pack ones must be earned within the game. Even the ones that you can buy with zen were earned by another player who you are buying them from.
Another that I had issue with was regarding the post-60 content. However having checked on the date of the blog I've realised that it is technically true if Gauntlegrym was just being advertised but was not actually in-game yet.
Some items are BoP: You cannot just buy every single piece of loot in the game.
You do not require anything exclusive to zen-bought profession packs to make items on which you can turn a profit.
As always with different people, YMMV. But touting it as a review rather than an opinion piece or rage post does lead to certain expectations for even-handedness not expected in the other two.
Greetings
I read the blog, and I would like to take a moment to discuss it with you.
For starters, it begins with a disservice, calling something a "Shiny <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>" is rather crude and vulgar, not really something anyone really wants to be met with from what begins as a long winded review, regardless if they like the game or not, that opens the door with a bitter beginning.
Secondly, saying the game is awful, is not helpful at all, and lets be real here, it's not awful, it's comparable to most MMO's out there in combat, graphics, and story line, class builds, and world development. while, I will say it is not a polished as some games like GW2, that in no way makes this game awful.
I would suggest that since a large part of your beginning outrage is focused at lore, and lack of immersible depth of the game, you should focus on that, as opposed to nit picking the mechanics, where are quiet sound, even if they could use some polish, and revision.
Your next point is how fast the leveling process goes, in that front, it is your own fault for hastening your end game, you could run dungeons at any level and enjoy them in Neverwinter, with it's dynamic leveling adjustment mechanic, meaning that you can get "cool looking" gear, without needing to hit end game for it. While I agree that pace by which you out level your gear is not what I was used it, it is very common in most contemporary MMO's like TERA and GW2. This is not a demerit in design or a bad game mechanic. It is quite common. Now if you had not played MMO's for any length of time since EQ, I can understand the system shock, but, if you were up to date with MMO's it would very run on the mill norm style of play.
I would say the biggest problem with your blog post, is that it hard to pinpoint what your real outrage is, where the real problem is, and it seems to all fall into the Zen shop, (abeit I do agree that the Coin (Gold/Silver/Etc, Then AD's and then Zen) all with their own system and means to work together is annoying, it hardly makes this game trash or awful.
It seems your largest gripe is the Cost in the store for Zen items, well, in that front, most Review sites agree with you, the Zen costs have met with unwelcome reviews from places like MMORPG, but again, That hardly makes the game Awful, nor does it make incomplete.
What you should do is go back, and really focus on what your main issue of contention is, and then work on that, without painting the game with such a large myopic brush, it really paints you in a bad light to be such broad based, and yet lacking any real focus for your outrage.
Anyway, I also looked at your GF's blog, she's cute.
D&D Home Page - What Class Are You?
A city to protect
innocents to save
"Why?" They ask "they hate you"
We're heroes it's what we do.
*patiently waiting on Paragon City*
As someone who played this game and no longer does, that does not make me self contradicting.
The phrase "DND" bigot is either hilarious or the most <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> thing I've ever heard.... cant deicde which.
With all respect - because your post is one of the few here that arent insulting (including some of my own) if your idea of a polished quality game is GW2 then I weep for your MMO experiences. There are so many amazing games out there.
One issue raised that I have yet to see a Neverwinter supporter answer is... what can you do at 60 by yourself? What if I play at times or have a day off work where my guild or core group isnt around? What kind of character advancement is there to do solo? There is nothing to do at 60 that you can do alone to make your character better.
That is a MASSIVE flaw that no other game I have ever played endures. I obviously have no numbers to show but I bet if you took the amount of players that log in daily 5 days after Open Beta came out, and look at the number the day the game was declared "no longer in beta" and I'm betting the numbers are astounding how few people play now compared to then.
With all due respect, but such as?
I have no idea, I am not level 60 yet, I don't play to grind to the next level, I play to enjoy the game, as such, as of late, I have been looking into Foundry Quests, of which I have found to be very enjoyable. In that regard, and not sound like a broken record, but every game is really what you make of it.
I would respectfully disagree, most games that build on a trinity model, such as Neverwinter did, suffer this issue, that in the End Game you need to have a group. It is an inherent aspect of the "Distinct roles of each class" condition of any game built off that premise will suffer through. I would not call that a design flaw, as it was deliberate and thus intended, but I feel it is a flawed approach to contemporary MMOs.
D&D Home Page - What Class Are You?
You lost any credibility with me at the bolded-underlined portion.
You didn't take her hint.
If you want to be an absolute best in PVP then, yes, get ready to splash out. But it is your choice.
And if you can't pay 10 bucks for a bag then find a job.
An average game costs 50 bucks? Ten and fifty, honey.
The end game has tons of bugs, exploits, all gear is BoE, boss fights are repetitive. Without adds bosses are simple.
I think the game is untested and moved in the wrong direction.
While other games minimize trash and focus on boss fights this one adds tons useless bytes to make gameplay tedious.
Despite the many abilities I mostly keep the left button on and just add encounters off cd. It gets stale.
No, it's a rant. A rant on how this game is not the time sink you want it to be. And that's fine, this game is clearly not suited for you. If you are however part of a couple of friends with only an hour a day to spend, this game has everything you need.
Also, you open your review saying you like the combat system but end your review saying it sucks.
I liked the combat ENGINE at first, it's quick and involving. Unfortunately it's also 60 levels of circle on the ground dodging. It has potential but their implementation of one combat tactic is lazy. Having one PvE/PvP encounter in your game does not raid content make. Most good mmo's launch with some end game content, WoW and Everquest both did
You come to THESE forums and find the term "<font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>" overly offensive. You eluding to GW2 as polished pretty much shows your hand and removes your credibility. That game is ok but to use it as a measuring stick for other MMO's is a mistake.
There's no lore worth talking about, or depth. I didn't nit pick game mechanics the combat engine is quite good the implementation of it however isn't. As I said 60 levels of dodging red circles on the ground to do it again at 60. There's 0 variance in combat strategy
I didn't rush through the leveling process, I played the game and after getting my first toon to 60 concluded there's very little point in the dungeons, as soon as you get out and start back to the quest line you out level the gear you got in less time than it took to get it
Cool looking leveling gear? I leveled a guardian fighter (tanks the kings of cool gear in most MMO's)....and ran every instance for all the blue gear I could find until level 60 it all pretty much looked the same and I in turn looked identical to every other dwarf GW. You out level the gear because the content is so easy that how could you not? I love running instances - it's the point of an MMO for me grouping/raid content but the ones in this game consist of adds, red circles on the ground, more adds and big slow easily avoided bosses. Did I leave anything out?
-No depth (no value in 1-60, tradeskill system is a facebook game, combat is the same from 1-60 etc)
-necessary items such as wards for enchants only enter the game when someone forks over actual money
-being able to buy everything with money adds an air of "what's the point" for me. End game loot being completely trivial to get does diminsh it's inhernet value.
-unfinished classes
-no raid content worth discussing, no 60 content worth discussing
-foundry is too restrictive - without some sort of progression or something to strive for what am I doing here? playing the game for the joy of the stories in foundry? I'm not going to rip on anyone if that's what they enjoy but THIS isn't enough to call a game a good or complete MMO
-there's no need for this many currency systems - it's designed to be confusing and nothing more (no I'm not confused by it, but one shouldn't need to track this many different currencies)
Keep in mind I had a group of friends at 60, a reasonably large one. We ran out of stuff to do so quickly most of the people quit out of boredom because there was just nothing else to do.
Zen store does not make the game incomplete I've already touched on some of the points above but:
-classes are not finished, they're full of bugs and they still have talent trees to introduce (which requires a lot of balancing)
-raid content has not been tested, it was just launched with live and the result was obvious. I don't think I need to elaborate on why Gaunt isn't a great experience
-loot systems that boggle the mind - so many games out there with working loot systems that people do not gripe about constantly/are not so easily abused by ninja's and other clowns
-PvP there's no balance at all, no DR, the maps are all pretty much the same (tiny) there's 0 variance it's all capture the nodes and often times you end up very quickly in a 4v5 match; the matchmaking is awful as well. There appears to be NO effort made to try and line up competitive games
-no companion tomes - really it's THAT difficult to implement an item which allows my companion to level the same way I do? (minor gripe I don't really need my companion for anything but it's still unfinished feeling)
-the world is tiny and full of invisible walls, there's 0 point in exploring anything at 60
Posting more frequently and with more focus has been something I've wanted to work on. Posting more positive stuff is also on my radar one only has so much time outside other real life commitments. I really do appreciate the feedback and discussion. Thanks
My statement is they did a disservice, I do not claim I speak for the gaming community anywhere in my post. My opinion is this game does nothing good for gaming and unfinished games releasing with a plethora of paid options is a bad trend. The paid options should be disabled until the game is ready for launch so people can..you know...test I believe the only insult in the post is the reference to "poor suckers" who bought founders packs. I should add to that I feel real bad for anyone who paid 200 bucks to play this game. To be clear - I'm not saying every founders pack owner is upset with their purchase. But I know there's a large number out there that wishes they could get their 200 bucks back.
I point out the flaws, the game takes no time to get to 60 and when you get there there's nothing to do but spend money. There is no depth anywhere at all in this game there's nothing that takes any real time to accomplish and character development is non existent. Perhaps better advice would be "play but avoid the cash shop" but it IS a blog and that piece was written while I was aggravated. Sure it could have come off differently but I've yet to hear a valid argument for "there's nothing to do at 60" once you spend a bit of time getting your T2..you're done.
In game currency drops from mobs, why would it be so unbalancing to allow me to farm mobs and buy stuff? This reinvention of the currency wheel adds 0 value. I think their currency system is awful - don't just defend it by stating you can use this to buy that. Can you think of a valid reason to need THAT many different currencies for things? come on now
It just feels cheap, unfinished, buggy and full of stuff to spend your money on. My assertion is at 60 you run out of stuff worth doing very quickly and to progress your toon (say to be able to be competitive in pvp) you must spend money; or use Astral Diamonds to buy items that someone has spent money on. There's no way to earn it via playing the game alone.
If I want to be competitive in pvp I need to "splash out" and that's my "choice" so I can "choose" to get rolled by players who have spent money on enchants/gear or I can "choose" to be mediocre via obtaining items through the game. But I have no other choice aside from leaving which I've already done
I cannot disagree with any of that
I didn't want the game to be a time sink, I wanted it to be worth playing for more than a month. I didn't spend all my waking hours playing I played a bit here and there afterwork and had a couple longish weekend sessions. Nothing extreme at all
I described my experience with it and provided my reasoning. The combat engine has potential but their implementation is poor. You login you dodge the red stuff, you logout.
coalescent wards can drop in the chest you get after logging in for 7 days and praying with the celestial coins, the mounts you buy with gold are all you REALLY need, but its easy to earn AD ingame and exchange for zen to buy said mounts if you so choose, as for bag space and bank space, never needed to buy bank space, and bought bags on my first character, but didnt feel the need to on my second so havnt bothered.
as for endgame content, theres more lvl 60 dungeons in this game than there are in most mmo's at launch, and frankly, raiding isnt fun, so i really dont mind not having that ingame.
with regards to everything being forsale, im Fing glad it is, on both of my fully geared out lvl 60'si have looted 3 pieces of armour / weapons total for them out of dozens and dozens of dungeon runs, i simply didnt have luck, what i did do, was sell the stuff i did win and bought the stuff i needed, frankly i find this one of the better aspects of this game, and crafting sucks in pretty much every game ive ever played, with mortal online being the exception, the way its handled here is fine.
so with that all said, dont put something forward as a review when you are in fact just ranting about things you dont like (a review would atleast explain how the incredibly simple to understand multiple currencies actually work to the point that you need never spend a penny ingame yourself).
laters
Monk
I am going to have to ask you to not put words into my mouth, I never said I was offended, I said is vulgar, and crude, and in that regard makes you look bad, anyone even reading that opening line would dismiss what you wrote as a "review" and realize that it was nothing short of a emotionally fueled hate rant.
If you want to have a "review" taken seriously, you might want to make an effort to make it an actual review. After reading what you wrote, I did not see anything in what you said, that supported your "Feelings" on the issues.
Case in point:
Your First Problem: too easy to level.
To most gamers that is not a "problem" that is a boon to the game, where they do not need to run the same dungeon a hundred times to grind out their next level. In fact, western MMO's have been making a striding move to get away from that level of tedium in a game and make it so that players can "opt" to take any path they want. Simply put, you can if you like coffee that much, ground the game and level up, or you can take the time to explore the game, and do whatever you want and not worry about the leveling process. IE: The reality is, Modern MMO's are removing the focus on "grinding levels" and letting players focus on "playing the game".
If you walked into Neverwinter with the intent to Grind, then you were the one that set yourself up to fail from the onset. Most contemporary and western gamers have voiced that as they have grown older, jobs, life, family have taken a cut into what would be their game time, and thus there is a strong sense of appreciation for a game that we as players don't need to grind levels to get them, and could.. kick it old school and Go adventure with our friends or, since this is the internet, just kick back and try to have some fun with total strangers knowing the levels would come quickly enough on their own.
In fact, easy, grindless leveling is a sale point of most games, and Neverwinter, is no exception to that, players can just play, have fun, and not worry about leveling. Those that put too much into the number next to their level are the ones that make the game less enjoyable. The foundry and a good chunk (not sure if all of them can be or not) of the quests in Neverwinter can be done at any level, and thus, really, "End Game" is just a number and a state of mind, it has no real impact on the game overall. By around 20th, you have every ability unlocked, so, after that it's just a list of swap-outs.
Not to be rude, but again this was your fault, by 16th I was using an ax on my Dwarf GF, and I will say, it gave me a very unique look in regards to the vast number of sword users I met. I will admit, that my main toon is only 18th now, and the choices of gear open to me is limited, but that is the case with any MMO, from EQ, (which had zero ability to change your look outside the cookie-cutter requirement of top gear, unless you wanted to downgrade your stats) to Neverwinter just released out this week end.
However, in Neverwinter, you can at-will, change the appearance of any gear item you have, right from your inventory, so if you have a preferred look or style, in my case, I believed Dwarfs should use axes, with just some AD's (which I get for free just for playing the game) I would just kept re-skinning my new weapons with the ax skin I liked, to keep the look I enjoyed, I found it to be a very fun and decent feature that you can keep it up throughout the entire leveling process.
I find this rather amusing coming from someone that claims to be an old EQ player, where there was absolutely no objective to the game beyond grinding Gear and Levels.
In the end, I see you have some issues with this game, well, it's a free a game, and with the growing trend of F2P MMO's the developers are allowed to make a game they want to make, and then open the doors to let others come in and enjoy it, if it is not their thing, they are free to move on to something they may enjoy more. With the F2P model, the designers and developers do not need to grasp at every sub, and worry about every warm body that occupies their server, there is no need to cater to the discontent, disillusioned, or just querulous individuals in the gaming world.
Like many things, a game is just, a game, regardless of the flack I got for it, I personally found GW2 to be a very enjoyable contemporary title, I am sure power gamers that maxed out by the end of the first week had a different view then myself, and that is fine, the world is made of many different kinds of players, each with what they enjoy and do not enjoy, I waited a few months before buying the game, and then took my sweet time exploring and enjoying the game as I wanted to.
Just like in Neverwinter, I have no rush to 60th, the truth is, after playing MMO's for over a score of years, the hard truth is, there is nothing at the end game but more of the same, this is literally a Meme of the MMO world and design. There were a few games that do give a bit more to do at Cap, games like DAoC and GW2 with their Realms vs Realms combat, but that is not really new content per say, that is players entertaining themselves by killing each other day in and day out in old content.
In the end, if you want to rant at a game, you can, I believe the freedom of speak entitles you to do so, but at the end of the day, it's free to play, they are under no obligation to cater to you or your needs. Their goal is to make a game that some people want to play, for the ones that enjoy it, they put options in to support their hobby via a cash shop so that everyone feels like they got something, and those that don't, they can move on without either party feeling any remorse.
Neverwinter was not for you, let it go and find something that is.
D&D Home Page - What Class Are You?
How utterly judgmental and narrow-viewed that statement is. When I scanned your review and saw this at the end I didn't bother reading the rest.
Hammerfist Clan. Jump into the Night: NW-DMXWRYTAD
The issue with this is the old school grind games used to please all types of players. They didnt just have the grinders, they had the RPers, the casuals, and the PVPers etc - all on board. Nowdays games focus on the casuals, and the people who actually want a longer journey and a grindy endgame can no longer find it reliably.
Why?
Youve stated half the case: Players have voiced that as they have grown older, jobs, life, family have taken a cut into what would be their game time, and thus there is a strong sense of appreciation for a game that we as players don't need to grind levels to get them.
The other half of this however, is that many of those same people have also voiced that they feel entitled to the same loot and other rewards the grinders have, while not wanting to grind for it. This is the major difference between say EQ1 or UO versus todays games. Casual players were satisfied knowing they werent the best geared in older MMOs. Now days this is not the case - the casual players demand to have the same rewards as the grinders, which eliminates the ability for MMO companies to cater to grinders in the first place.
End result: The entirety of the genre, minus a few exceptions, is built around casual gamers who hop from game to game nowdays. The grinders of old are now speed gamers who basically get to the end of the game in a few weeks (sometimes a few days) and then have nothing left to do until new content comes out. Thus they hop from game to game. They come back when new content hits and leave again when they have handedly beaten it and achieved all desired loot from it.
That's like saying: my D&D character is level 20, what is there to do now?
The Foundry contains thousands of quests, many of them are excellent. Many more are added each day. You'll never run out of content.
Unless your idea of playing an MMO is to somehow 'beat it'; in which case there's no MMO that will satisfy you for long.
I'm personally having a blast playing foundry quests. I can't keep up with all the ones I want to try. But to each his own.
The Cursed Emerald:
Ditto. Playing and making them. That's the real draw of Neverwinter for me.
Hammerfist Clan. Jump into the Night: NW-DMXWRYTAD
I believe that another main point of contention that you are missing my friend, is that the volume of players has changed as well. When EQ came out, it was in every sense of the word a "fringe" game, one could even akin it to what would be today an "indy" game, for it's perceived audience.
Things changed, and gamers became a real market share, and with that too, gone are the days when playing DnD made you an outcast, and we embrace the movement of the future where games are mainstream, where they are played by people with families, jobs, and professional identities. With that comes the realization, that games need to address these people, sorry, but in the past players were never content that they had second rate gear, they would respond with the fact they had a life as a means of validation for it, and in many ways, they were correct, but in the modern times, in the past 2 decades of games and MMO's, it has become apparent that the majority of the gamers have 'lives" to compete with their game. Hence the ongoing move of most MMO's to remove grind, while still trying to add fun factors.
In the case of Neverwinter, it comes in the forum of running a dungeon for the sake of just having fun running a dungeon without needing to grind some special named loot, or needing to do it a dozen times over for that last level. It is the fact that players have Girl Friends, they have wives, children, jobs, and many things in life, and what is becoming very clear in the recent trends of MMO's is that companies are learning if they make someone chose between their MMO and that person being there for their family, is not something they can continue to do. Wecome to the new age of MMO's, where is many ways, it mimic's the table top adventure, where we were allowed to gather together, to just have fun and play a game, and not sit around and grind.
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