As much as I want to cry about how stupid the CW nerf is, the cleric astral shield nerf is complete idiocy and we must address it and let the devs know that it won't fly. Speak up people. If anything they need a buff.
They could kill Astral Shield completely (along with Righteousness), replace it with a more active protection style heal and rebalance the game so most of the dmg is avoidable and it becomes an actual Action Rpg.
or:
->buff gf's tanking ability (shield and defense) to a reasonable level
->the power removed from astral shield should be put into the ability to properly heal allies; honestly wouldn't mind waiting a few seconds between each astral shield if the tank wasn't being killed in two hits without it along with the lack of a proper heal, which is why I mentioned buffing tank gf, even if it means lowering gf's damage
Now we have classes that depend on one another and properly help each another effectively!
DC, Way more fun now its not just stand in circle and DPS and actually need to use other ability's now
TR, Oh nooo I can't kill a boss in 17 sec anymore... its takes me 22 sec now....
CW, Lost DPS so now I focus more on control reducing the damage my team take's (see the point?)
GWF, Roarrrrrrrrr I can kill things now, I'm useful! (happy face)
GF, I can hold aggro from pack of mobs and Because I'm full tank spec and my feats have been fixed I have a 54% dam resist so now I can make Mobs focus on me so the cleric needs to Single target heal, and I rotate my dam resist buffs (10%) and my cleric decided to be smart and also rake foresight further reducing my damage taken by 11%, oh and Idecided not to take an ioun stone because I dont need damage to tank so I have acolyte of kelvemore for another 10% dam resist so thats 80% without AS.
Do you mean like if you run out of the red you still take damage but you use the dodge you'll sometimes avoid damage? by I still sometimes take damage even using the dodge :O
DC, Way more fun now its not just stand in circle and DPS and actually need to use other ability's now
TR, Oh nooo I can't kill a boss in 17 sec anymore... its takes me 22 sec now....
CW, Lost DPS so now I focus more on control reducing the damage my team take's (see the point?)
GWF, Roarrrrrrrrr I can kill things now, I'm useful! (happy face)
GF, I can hold aggro from pack of mobs and Because I'm full tank spec and my feats have been fixed I have a 54% dam resist so now I can make Mobs focus on me so the cleric needs to Single target heal, and I rotate my dam resist buffs (10%) and my cleric decided to be smart and also rake foresight further reducing my damage taken by 11%, oh and Idecided not to take an ioun stone because I dont need damage to tank so I have acolyte of kelvemore for another 10% dam resist so thats 80% without AS.
Working as Intended.
Pretty much perfectly said. I hate astral shield ruins PvE and especially PvP.
They could kill Astral Shield completely (along with Righteousness), replace it with a more active protection style heal and rebalance the game so most of the dmg is avoidable and it becomes an actual Action Rpg.
This feedback would have been helpful in alpha, not when it's about to go live. Guardian fighters & Great Weapon fighters especially have no mechanics to avoid most of the damage. The class design & toolkit doesn't allow it.
The DC nerf is stupid though, yes. They have nothing to make up for the stacking, I see few if any groups clearing any of the hard content.
0
bioshrikeMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,729Arc User
edited June 2013
They should do something like this:
1. Cleric A casts Astral Shield - it operates as normal.
2. Cleric B now casts Astral Shield while Cleric A's is still in effect - the extra duration from Cleric B's AS gets tacked onto the initial casting, and whichever was of a higher rank becomes the "active" one.
<::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::::)xxxo <::::::::::::)xxxxxxxx(:::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> oxxx(::::::::::::::> "Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
DC, Way more fun now its not just stand in circle and DPS and actually need to use other ability's now
TR, Oh nooo I can't kill a boss in 17 sec anymore... its takes me 22 sec now....
CW, Lost DPS so now I focus more on control reducing the damage my team take's (see the point?)
GWF, Roarrrrrrrrr I can kill things now, I'm useful! (happy face)
GF, I can hold aggro from pack of mobs and Because I'm full tank spec and my feats have been fixed I have a 54% dam resist so now I can make Mobs focus on me so the cleric needs to Single target heal, and I rotate my dam resist buffs (10%) and my cleric decided to be smart and also rake foresight further reducing my damage taken by 11%, oh and Idecided not to take an ioun stone because I dont need damage to tank so I have acolyte of kelvemore for another 10% dam resist so thats 80% without AS.
DC, Way more fun now its not just stand in circle and DPS and actually need to use other ability's now
TR, Oh nooo I can't kill a boss in 17 sec anymore... its takes me 22 sec now....
CW, Lost DPS so now I focus more on control reducing the damage my team take's (see the point?)
GWF, Roarrrrrrrrr I can kill things now, I'm useful! (happy face)
GF, I can hold aggro from pack of mobs and Because I'm full tank spec and my feats have been fixed I have a 54% dam resist so now I can make Mobs focus on me so the cleric needs to Single target heal, and I rotate my dam resist buffs (10%) and my cleric decided to be smart and also rake foresight further reducing my damage taken by 11%, oh and Idecided not to take an ioun stone because I dont need damage to tank so I have acolyte of kelvemore for another 10% dam resist so thats 80% without AS.
Working as Intended.
Said like the GF u r from all your posts who doesnt have a clue how other classes play.
DC, Way more fun now its not just stand in circle and DPS and actually need to use other ability's now
TR, Oh nooo I can't kill a boss in 17 sec anymore... its takes me 22 sec now....
CW, Lost DPS so now I focus more on control reducing the damage my team take's (see the point?)
GWF, Roarrrrrrrrr I can kill things now, I'm useful! (happy face)
GF, I can hold aggro from pack of mobs and Because I'm full tank spec and my feats have been fixed I have a 54% dam resist so now I can make Mobs focus on me so the cleric needs to Single target heal, and I rotate my dam resist buffs (10%) and my cleric decided to be smart and also rake foresight further reducing my damage taken by 11%, oh and Idecided not to take an ioun stone because I dont need damage to tank so I have acolyte of kelvemore for another 10% dam resist so thats 80% without AS.
Working as Intended.
You play as one class GF how the hell would you know how the other classes play. R u guessing its much more fun for them.
I like the fact that the Cleric can do damage. Hell in D&D they should never be considered as a primary healer. There are different kinds of Clerics. I saw someone complain that if they have a Cleric they shouldn't have to use pots.
Well in the words of DDO, My Mana is not your HP, and it should never be like that. Clerics should do their best to keep someone alive, but being in the back just to heal is boring as all hell.
I like the fact that the Cleric can do damage. Hell in D&D they should never be considered as a primary healer. There are different kinds of Clerics. I saw someone complain that if they have a Cleric they shouldn't have to use pots.
Well in the words of DDO, My Mana is not your HP, and it should never be like that. Clerics should do their best to keep someone alive, but being in the back just to heal is boring as all hell.
Opinion. If one chooses to go towards the line of keeping their allies alive effectively they should be able. You don't like it? Then you don't have to, but don't remove the option.
0
justiniand1Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 12Arc User
edited June 2013
The thing is if they had fixed aggro for GFs, removed stacking from AS and buffed damage from GWF the game would have been well balanced. 4-5 seconds of no AS is pretty much a lifetime in PvP and in PvE when you have an almost undodgeable hit squad of epic drow blademasters.
0
tang56Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I like the fact that the Cleric can do damage. Hell in D&D they should never be considered as a primary healer. There are different kinds of Clerics. I saw someone complain that if they have a Cleric they shouldn't have to use pots.
Well in the words of DDO, My Mana is not your HP, and it should never be like that. Clerics should do their best to keep someone alive, but being in the back just to heal is boring as all hell.
I'm hoping with further updates that additional prestige classes will allow the healing load to be slightly taken off the cleric.
E.g. A paladin path with lay on hands for the GF, warlord path with inspiring words for the GWF, bard for the rogues with some group buff abilities, shaman for the CW with protector spirit for moderate party wide healing and radiant servant for the cleric, although I'm not sure what ability to give them.
I like the fact that the Cleric can do damage. Hell in D&D they should never be considered as a primary healer. There are different kinds of Clerics. I saw someone complain that if they have a Cleric they shouldn't have to use pots.
Well in the words of DDO, My Mana is not your HP, and it should never be like that. Clerics should do their best to keep someone alive, but being in the back just to heal is boring as all hell.
yeah, but clerics in this game can't exactly damage can they
DC, Way more fun now its not just stand in circle and DPS and actually need to use other ability's now
TR, Oh nooo I can't kill a boss in 17 sec anymore... its takes me 22 sec now....
CW, Lost DPS so now I focus more on control reducing the damage my team take's (see the point?)
GWF, Roarrrrrrrrr I can kill things now, I'm useful! (happy face)
GF, I can hold aggro from pack of mobs and Because I'm full tank spec and my feats have been fixed I have a 54% dam resist so now I can make Mobs focus on me so the cleric needs to Single target heal, and I rotate my dam resist buffs (10%) and my cleric decided to be smart and also rake foresight further reducing my damage taken by 11%, oh and Idecided not to take an ioun stone because I dont need damage to tank so I have acolyte of kelvemore for another 10% dam resist so thats 80% without AS.
Working as Intended.
Well said. Very similar to my T2 testing in practice mode. So far so good.
No, it's 2xDC 2xCW and 1xTR
or you actually though GWF and GF could be of any use without permanent Astral Shield? LOL how naive :rolleyes:
This, because of the DC nerf, GWF and GF are even more useless LMAO! If they buffed them instead, there would only need to be 1 DC and a GF/GWF would take place, think devs, think. I TOTALLY AGREE WITH THE OP, BUFF THEM DONT NERF THEM @DEVS.
0
theairockstarMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
Coming from the perspective of a relatively skilled cleric in this game it is going to be relatively harder for us to do anything then it is already. Currently I have a 100% up-time on astral shield which is apparently not going to be possible after you nerf the effect time and it is extremely hard for ANY cleric to mitigate the damage from the hordes of additional mobs that you throw at people during boss fights, and that is with two clerics throwing down astral shields. We can't heal, we can't damage. A well equipped low level is going to heal more via regeneration then what we can do with healing word or any of our other crummy heals. My character is a pretty good spec for critical and damage mitigation, I keep foresight on for some damage mitigation I use sacred flame for even more. Astral shield for emergency heals and sun burst to try to keep the hordes of minions you throw at us off of me. From my perspective I don't see many people clearing end game content when everybody playing one switches over to one of the better classes. Me for one? I switched over to a trickster rogue.
DC, Way more fun now its not just stand in circle and DPS and actually need to use other ability's now
TR, Oh nooo I can't kill a boss in 17 sec anymore... its takes me 22 sec now....
CW, Lost DPS so now I focus more on control reducing the damage my team take's (see the point?)
GWF, Roarrrrrrrrr I can kill things now, I'm useful! (happy face)
GF, I can hold aggro from pack of mobs and Because I'm full tank spec and my feats have been fixed I have a 54% dam resist so now I can make Mobs focus on me so the cleric needs to Single target heal, and I rotate my dam resist buffs (10%) and my cleric decided to be smart and also rake foresight further reducing my damage taken by 11%, oh and Idecided not to take an ioun stone because I dont need damage to tank so I have acolyte of kelvemore for another 10% dam resist so thats 80% without AS.
Working as Intended.
This! Perhaps some people will have to reconsider the class choice they made. Having a 1 click=win button in a game sucks. Glad they took steps to fix it.
Row, row, row your boat, Gently down the stream.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
I like the fact that the Cleric can do damage. Hell in D&D they should never be considered as a primary healer. There are different kinds of Clerics. I saw someone complain that if they have a Cleric they shouldn't have to use pots.
in Neverwinter it is. actually, cleric paragon path skills from D&D, Divine Oracle can't see it as a healer. in here you can say the paragon Divine Oracle is combine of D&D Divine Oracle and Warpriest. the nerfing in AS make it more Divine Oracle then Warpriest. as for primary healer depend who took the paragon of healing, it could be Paladin or Cleric
0
mewbreyMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 517Bounty Hunter
in Neverwinter it is. actually, cleric paragon path skills from D&D, Divine Oracle can't see it as a healer. in here you can say the paragon Divine Oracle is combine of D&D Divine Oracle and Warpriest. the nerfing in AS make it more Divine Oracle then Warpriest. as for primary healer depend who took the paragon of healing, it could be Paladin or Cleric
That Wiki page misses a lot of the 4ED cleric paragon paths... ofcourse in 4ED more than just cleircs can take these paths, but in general they could be considered cleric paths.
The colored ones are the ones I am hoping for, but I'm sure everyone has their own wish. ^^
The violet ones are what I think the melee cleric if they ever bring it out will be, and rather than calling it a cleric they will call it a warpriest, as we already have cleric as a base name it could save a little confusion.
I don't think we'll get a good idea how all this shakes out until it has actually been live for a bit, and the less informed lowest common denominator players butt heads with it all. There's going to be a bit of a shakeout period, where GFs will actually need to spec and enchant for survivability, and TRs are going to have to grow some situational awareness, rather than just standing in red, whaling blindly on bosses and screaming "OMG HAEL U NUB".
Well-drilled players with solid synergy will find ways to make almost anything work, as usual. The unwashed masses, who are the cash cow that funds all of this, however, will need to be able to cope. Sadly, that often boils down to a staring competition, where the developer blinks first, and dumbs things down to avoid an exodus, rather than people enjoying the process of upping their game.
MMOs aren't just for the deep nerds any more. They need to pander to the LoL players and the CODBLOPSers if they want to make the buckets of cash that publishers require. How this will turn out in reality is something that I wouldn't dare try to predict.
1. Cleric A casts Astral Shield - it operates as normal.
2. Cleric B now casts Astral Shield while Cleric A's is still in effect - the extra duration from Cleric B's AS gets tacked onto the initial casting, and whichever was of a higher rank becomes the "active" one.
...I hope this is a joke because that's a horrible idea.
-Campaign: Spells and Coin
--Part 1: Spells and Coin (NW-DHM3XQVQK)
--Part 2: A Blind Eye (NW-DI3QTHZGJ)
--Part 3: Dodo's Dinner (NW-DHPA8O253)
DC, Way more fun now its not just stand in circle and DPS and actually need to use other ability's now
TR, Oh nooo I can't kill a boss in 17 sec anymore... its takes me 22 sec now....
CW, Lost DPS so now I focus more on control reducing the damage my team take's (see the point?)
GWF, Roarrrrrrrrr I can kill things now, I'm useful! (happy face)
GF, I can hold aggro from pack of mobs and Because I'm full tank spec and my feats have been fixed I have a 54% dam resist so now I can make Mobs focus on me so the cleric needs to Single target heal, and I rotate my dam resist buffs (10%) and my cleric decided to be smart and also rake foresight further reducing my damage taken by 11%, oh and Idecided not to take an ioun stone because I dont need damage to tank so I have acolyte of kelvemore for another 10% dam resist so thats 80% without AS.
Working as Intended.
GWFs could already kill things. That's not the issue. You are not supposed to be Primary damage dealers anyway, rather add tanks. Maybe try playing your intended role next patch and you will get invites. CWs are losing none of their AoE damage btw so keep dreaming on that.
Comments
They could kill Astral Shield completely (along with Righteousness), replace it with a more active protection style heal and rebalance the game so most of the dmg is avoidable and it becomes an actual Action Rpg.
->buff gf's tanking ability (shield and defense) to a reasonable level
->the power removed from astral shield should be put into the ability to properly heal allies; honestly wouldn't mind waiting a few seconds between each astral shield if the tank wasn't being killed in two hits without it along with the lack of a proper heal, which is why I mentioned buffing tank gf, even if it means lowering gf's damage
Now we have classes that depend on one another and properly help each another effectively!
DC, Way more fun now its not just stand in circle and DPS and actually need to use other ability's now
TR, Oh nooo I can't kill a boss in 17 sec anymore... its takes me 22 sec now....
CW, Lost DPS so now I focus more on control reducing the damage my team take's (see the point?)
GWF, Roarrrrrrrrr I can kill things now, I'm useful! (happy face)
GF, I can hold aggro from pack of mobs and Because I'm full tank spec and my feats have been fixed I have a 54% dam resist so now I can make Mobs focus on me so the cleric needs to Single target heal, and I rotate my dam resist buffs (10%) and my cleric decided to be smart and also rake foresight further reducing my damage taken by 11%, oh and Idecided not to take an ioun stone because I dont need damage to tank so I have acolyte of kelvemore for another 10% dam resist so thats 80% without AS.
Working as Intended.
No, it's 2xDC 2xCW and 1xTR
or you actually though GWF and GF could be of any use without permanent Astral Shield? LOL how naive :rolleyes:
I want this class in NW.
Pretty much perfectly said. I hate astral shield ruins PvE and especially PvP.
This feedback would have been helpful in alpha, not when it's about to go live. Guardian fighters & Great Weapon fighters especially have no mechanics to avoid most of the damage. The class design & toolkit doesn't allow it.
The DC nerf is stupid though, yes. They have nothing to make up for the stacking, I see few if any groups clearing any of the hard content.
1. Cleric A casts Astral Shield - it operates as normal.
2. Cleric B now casts Astral Shield while Cleric A's is still in effect - the extra duration from Cleric B's AS gets tacked onto the initial casting, and whichever was of a higher rank becomes the "active" one.
"Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark
Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
lol way more fun now? lmao.
If AS is ruining your pvp at 60, its because you are bad.
Said like the GF u r from all your posts who doesnt have a clue how other classes play.
Plays class thats buffed is happy much...
You play as one class GF how the hell would you know how the other classes play. R u guessing its much more fun for them.
Why should i get a nerf to make you feel better
Well in the words of DDO, My Mana is not your HP, and it should never be like that. Clerics should do their best to keep someone alive, but being in the back just to heal is boring as all hell.
I'm hoping with further updates that additional prestige classes will allow the healing load to be slightly taken off the cleric.
E.g. A paladin path with lay on hands for the GF, warlord path with inspiring words for the GWF, bard for the rogues with some group buff abilities, shaman for the CW with protector spirit for moderate party wide healing and radiant servant for the cleric, although I'm not sure what ability to give them.
Just throwing out ideas really.
yeah, but clerics in this game can't exactly damage can they
Depends on the build. I've seen some Clerics (not me) perform some pretty good damage.
I play every class. all 60 all geared.
I have cleared all content on all classes also, even Never on my GWF and GF, I find the changes way more fun, so the perspective is from every class.
Well said. Very similar to my T2 testing in practice mode. So far so good.
This! Perhaps some people will have to reconsider the class choice they made. Having a 1 click=win button in a game sucks. Glad they took steps to fix it.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
in Neverwinter it is. actually, cleric paragon path skills from D&D, Divine Oracle can't see it as a healer. in here you can say the paragon Divine Oracle is combine of D&D Divine Oracle and Warpriest. the nerfing in AS make it more Divine Oracle then Warpriest. as for primary healer depend who took the paragon of healing, it could be Paladin or Cleric
That Wiki page misses a lot of the 4ED cleric paragon paths... ofcourse in 4ED more than just cleircs can take these paths, but in general they could be considered cleric paths.
Angelic Avenger
Anointed Champion
Astral Savant
Battle Chaplain
Compassionate Healer
Divine Oracle
Holy Emissary
Radiant Servant
Messenger of Peace
Miracle Worker
Seldarine Dedicate
Stone Keeper
Truthseeker
Warpriest
The colored ones are the ones I am hoping for, but I'm sure everyone has their own wish. ^^
The violet ones are what I think the melee cleric if they ever bring it out will be, and rather than calling it a cleric they will call it a warpriest, as we already have cleric as a base name it could save a little confusion.
Well-drilled players with solid synergy will find ways to make almost anything work, as usual. The unwashed masses, who are the cash cow that funds all of this, however, will need to be able to cope. Sadly, that often boils down to a staring competition, where the developer blinks first, and dumbs things down to avoid an exodus, rather than people enjoying the process of upping their game.
MMOs aren't just for the deep nerds any more. They need to pander to the LoL players and the CODBLOPSers if they want to make the buckets of cash that publishers require. How this will turn out in reality is something that I wouldn't dare try to predict.
...I hope this is a joke because that's a horrible idea.
--Part 1: Spells and Coin (NW-DHM3XQVQK)
--Part 2: A Blind Eye (NW-DI3QTHZGJ)
--Part 3: Dodo's Dinner (NW-DHPA8O253)
-One Shots
--The Wizard of Eldeur (NW-DRKQNE4S7)
GWFs could already kill things. That's not the issue. You are not supposed to be Primary damage dealers anyway, rather add tanks. Maybe try playing your intended role next patch and you will get invites. CWs are losing none of their AoE damage btw so keep dreaming on that.