so.... will any of you thaums can confirm for me if +aoe (feats/evocation) affects all damage from chilling cloud or just the third strike?
Ok I dont think you guys are going to like this. LOL
So I went on Mimic to test Wizard's Wrath, Focused Wizardry, and Evocation. Let me first say that this was mainly a TOOLTIP test. So I didnt actually use every Power to see if these feats and Evocation actually add damage or not. But from the ones I tested, and particularly Chilling Cloud, it seems that whatever the tooltip damage says, is actually the damage you do. With regards to Chilling Cloud itself, the tooltip damage that is correct is the one that shows AFTER you slot the power, not the tooltip that shows in the POWER Window.
So, I regret to inform you that the only Powers that Evocation/Wizard's Wrath/Focused Wizardry affect are: Chill Strike (on Tab), Ice Storm, and Steal Time. THAT'S IT! (I didnt test shield because it doesn't display its damage on the tooltip, but I am assuming that it is affected. Otherwise that would be really crappy)
If someone wants to do a more in-depth testing (pfft2 *cough*), then please go right ahead. I would love nothing more than for this to just be a Tooltip bug.
Chilling Cloud is DEFINITELY bugged, and they should be ashamed of themselves to actually include it in their Patch note as if it has changed. In the Power Window (the one you drag your powers from) it clearly shows that it benefits when I added the feats, and then again when I added Evocation. However when I slotted it, the damage reverted to its original state, loosing the 6%+9%+15%. So I actually tested it with One feat at a time, and then with Evocation, and on the dummies, the damage was exactly the same. The first 2 hits are withing the Tooltip range. The third hit hits the main target for almost double, but then the Secondary Targets get hit for the damage that's within the Tootip.
So I am reporting this as a bug, and I urge others to test it and see if they get the same effect. If so, please report it. Also report the fact that the CW class if being screwed with as always with these AoE feats that they can NEVER get right.
Ok I dont think you guys are going to like this. LOL
So I went on Mimic to test Wizard's Wrath, Focused Wizardry, and Evocation. Let me first say that this was mainly a TOOLTIP test. So I didnt actually use every Power to see if these feats and Evocation actually add damage or not. But from the ones I tested, and particularly Chilling Cloud, it seems that whatever the tooltip damage says, is actually the damage you do. With regards to Chilling Cloud itself, the tooltip damage that is correct is the one that shows AFTER you slot the power, not the tooltip that shows in the POWER Window.
So, I regret to inform you that the only Powers that Evocation/Wizard's Wrath/Focused Wizardry affect are: Chill Strike (on Tab), Ice Storm, and Steal Time. THAT'S IT! (I didnt test shield because it doesn't display its damage on the tooltip, but I am assuming that it is affected. Otherwise that would be really crappy)
If someone wants to do a more in-depth testing (pfft2 *cough*), then please go right ahead. I would love nothing more than for this to just be a Tooltip bug.
Chilling Cloud is DEFINITELY bugged, and they should be ashamed of themselves to actually include it in their Patch note as if it has changed. In the Power Window (the one you drag your powers from) it clearly shows that it benefits when I added the feats, and then again when I added Evocation. However when I slotted it, the damage reverted to its original state, loosing the 6%+9%+15%. So I actually tested it with One feat at a time, and then with Evocation, and on the dummies, the damage was exactly the same. The first 2 hits are withing the Tooltip range. The third hit hits the main target for almost double, but then the Secondary Targets get hit for the damage that's within the Tootip.
So I am reporting this as a bug, and I urge others to test it and see if they get the same effect. If so, please report it. Also report the fact that the CW class if being screwed with as always with these AoE feats that they can NEVER get right.
If someone wants to do a more in-depth testing (pfft2 *cough*), then please go right ahead. I would love nothing more than for this to just be a Tooltip bug.
Seems like just a tooltip thing, based on a fairly casual test on the Preview server just now.
My first parse, with zero feats and against a single target, showed Chilling Cloud's crit-neutral DPS at 866.39. The highest single hit weighed in at 2,127. The minimum damage was 384.
My second parse, with Focused Wizardry and Wizard's Wrath (and no other damage-increasing feats or features), showed Chilling Cloud's crit-neutral DPS at 940.5. The highest single hit recorded weighed in at 2,472. The minimum damage was 385.
940.5 / 866.39 = 1.085
2472 / 2172 = 1.162
The two feats are supposed to confer a net bonus of about 15.5%. I believe that the two feats do affect the third hit of Chilling Cloud (which is also the only AoE, and by far the highest-damage hit, in the cycle). I believe the two feats do nothing for the first two attacks, which would explain why the damage boost in my second parse is only 8.5% overall (and which also explains why the minimum damage didn't rise). FWIW, my Chilling Cloud tooltip stayed at 384-444 when I purchased the two feats.
Likewise, my tooltip damage didn't move when I subsequently purchased and slotted (rank 3) Evocation. My third parse, with both feats and Evocation, showed a crit-neutral DPS of 1,035.94. The highest single hit weighed in at 2,842. The minimum damage was 385.
So Evocation represents a ~10% overall damage boost to Chilling Cloud, and a (2842 / 2472) - 1 = 14.96% boost to the third attack. Seems to be working as you'd expect, though I definitely agree that the opaque functionality of various feats and features in this game grows tiresome. Add that their functionality seems to change drastically and without any warning and you've a recipe for discouragement.
I haven't had much time to play in the last week or so, but I confess I'm a little less than enthusiastic about the game right now, given some of the outstanding bugs.
Sorry to post yet again, I just wanted to ask a question about how you would handle single target boss situations where hitting an add with the AOE from chilling cloud can cause problems?
Primarily I'm talking about in Karrundax where groups like to jump onto the mountainous scenery and attack the boss from a 'quasi' safe spot. As a ranged DPS in that situation I'm supposed to take the boss out, but, without damaging any of the surrounding adds.
Initially, I didn't realize that meant I couldn't use chilling cloud, or it would cause the adds to come after me. So I ended up just trying Ray of Enfeeblement on tab along with Chilling Strike and Icy Rays, while leaving Steal Time slotted in case anything came after me on my little perch.
I'm guessing you probably run Karrundax the normal way as god intended, but, it seems most groups prefer not to do that. So, I just wanted to know if you had a suggestion for an optimal single target setup where any form of AoE is a 'no no'. I ended up using the encounters I mentioned in the last paragraph along with Ray of Frost for my at will.
Anyways, if you don't have time to get back to me on this don't worry about it. Thanks for your hard work Copticone. It is much appreciated. The same goes for the rest of you as well!
Seems like just a tooltip thing, based on a fairly casual test on the Preview server just now.
My first parse, with zero feats and against a single target, showed Chilling Cloud's crit-neutral DPS at 866.39. The highest single hit weighed in at 2,127. The minimum damage was 384.
My second parse, with Focused Wizardry and Wizard's Wrath (and no other damage-increasing feats or features), showed Chilling Cloud's crit-neutral DPS at 940.5. The highest single hit recorded weighed in at 2,472. The minimum damage was 385.
940.5 / 866.39 = 1.085
2472 / 2172 = 1.162
The two feats are supposed to confer a net bonus of about 15.5%. I believe that the two feats do affect the third hit of Chilling Cloud (which is also the only AoE, and by far the highest-damage hit, in the cycle). I believe the two feats do nothing for the first two attacks, which would explain why the damage boost in my second parse is only 8.5% overall (and which also explains why the minimum damage didn't rise). FWIW, my Chilling Cloud tooltip stayed at 384-444 when I purchased the two feats.
Likewise, my tooltip damage didn't move when I subsequently purchased and slotted (rank 3) Evocation. My third parse, with both feats and Evocation, showed a crit-neutral DPS of 1,035.94. The highest single hit weighed in at 2,842. The minimum damage was 385.
So Evocation represents a ~10% overall damage boost to Chilling Cloud, and a (2842 / 2472) - 1 = 14.96% boost to the third attack. Seems to be working as you'd expect, though I definitely agree that the opaque functionality of various feats and features in this game grows tiresome. Add that their functionality seems to change drastically and without any warning and you've a recipe for discouragement.
I haven't had much time to play in the last week or so, but I confess I'm a little less than enthusiastic about the game right now, given some of the outstanding bugs.
I don't understand how you are getting these different outcomes. I didn't really pay attention to the third hit on the main target. I know it was higher than all other hits. But the first hit, and the second hit, and all secondary hits on secondary targets, did not change at all between 0 feats and all the AoE feats + Evocation. From what you are saying what might be happening is that only the 3rd single target hit is getting the bonus. Regardless it is definitely bugged.
Correction. I tested again, and also the secondary hits are getting a boost. So the first and second hits are getting nothing, and the 3rd hit + secondary get a boost but certainly not a 15%+6%+9%. Also I am sure you noticed the third hit on the main target is almost double the damage of the hits the secondary targets receive. A typical round is something like:
400 on main
400 on main
1300 on main
600 on secondaries.
Initially, I didn't realize that meant I couldn't use chilling cloud, or it would cause the adds to come after me. So I ended up just trying Ray of Enfeeblement on tab along with Chilling Strike and Icy Rays, while leaving Steal Time slotted in case anything came after me on my little perch.
There really isnt a boss where your secondary hits from Chilling Cloud or the AoE of CoI would cause you to get unwanted attention, unless the rest of the party is just standing there doing nothing. Even a DC's heals should draw more threat than that. In fact I do take advantage of adds near the boss to weave in Storm Pillar and get the 10% boost.
The Powers you mentioned are all good for Single Target. I still keep CoI on Tab, for that extra tick. I dont like the static cooldown of RoE on tab.
thanks for the results, i also added a link to your at-wil test threat pfft2, i hope you do not mind as the information is very useful for anyone looking for more indepth knowledge on it. I did assume +aoe only affected chilling cloud's 3rd strike, because it didnt change my tooltip, but i did not put much time into testing it. I am a little confused about the evocation results though.
I would find it rather bizzare that the wizard wrath/focused wizardry had a different function than evocation.
thanks for the results, i also added a link to your at-wil test threat pfft2, i hope you do not mind as the information is very useful for anyone looking for more indepth knowledge on it. I did assume +aoe only affected chilling cloud's 3rd strike, because it didnt change my tooltip, but i did not put much time into testing it. I am a little confused about the evocation results though.
I would find it rather bizzare that the wizard wrath/focused wizardry had a different function than evocation.
I don't understand how you are getting these different outcomes. I didn't really pay attention to the third hit on the main target. I know it was higher than all other hits. But the first hit, and the second hit, and all secondary hits on secondary targets, did not change at all between 0 feats and all the AoE feats + Evocation. From what you are saying what might be happening is that only the 3rd single target hit is getting the bonus. Regardless it is definitely bugged.
Correction. I tested again, and also the secondary hits are getting a boost. So the first and second hits are getting nothing, and the 3rd hit + secondary get a boost but certainly not a 15%+6%+9%. Also I am sure you noticed the third hit on the main target is almost double the damage of the hits the secondary targets receive. A typical round is something like:
400 on main
400 on main
1300 on main
600 on secondaries.
Yeah, for simplicity's sake I only tested against a single target last night. Because the AoE splash damage is so much lower than the main-target damage on the third strike, it would have been hard to tell at a glance whether the feats were properly enhancing their damage. I'll see about doing something more in-depth tonight.
thanks for the results, i also added a link to your at-wil test threat pfft2, i hope you do not mind as the information is very useful for anyone looking for more indepth knowledge on it. I did assume +aoe only affected chilling cloud's 3rd strike, because it didnt change my tooltip, but i did not put much time into testing it. I am a little confused about the evocation results though.
I would find it rather bizzare that the wizard wrath/focused wizardry had a different function than evocation.
Please feel free, grimah. Maybe I'll finally get around to updating my thread.
The Evocation results are consistent with my expectations. Keep in mind that mine was a quick-and-dirty test. The last parse was the longest, so it's probably slightly more accurate than the previous parses; it takes awhile for Cryptic's baked in damage variance to stabilize, and even longer if you're just looking at a small subset of attacks.
- Today's tip is brought to you by >High Vizier< "Why buff your friends when you can turn your enemies into puff pastry?" "High Vizier, don't leave the Protector's Enclave without it."
Recipe:
1) Find a nice group of adds (preferably 2 groups)
2) Open with a Fully charged Storm Pillar in the middle (+10% damage)
3) 1 Round of Chilling Cloud (+25% damage)
4) A quick tabbed CoI + 1 well placed Sudden Storm both buffed by your previous ingredients. (remember to not aim your SS directly at your targets, but rather at their circles underneath them, which is a lot bigger. That way you get as many targets in the SS cone as possible)
If done properly, you should now be the proud owner of 10+ angry mobs rushing towards you...
5) Provide them with a nice slippery area by means of an Icy Terrain littered with lightning bolts.
6) Another round of Chilling Cloud to refresh that +25% buff
Anticipating a plethora of red circles and cleaves aimed directly at you, unleash HELL!!
7) Steal Time from the poor souls and watch your High Vizier armor leeching onto them marking them for death. As time stops, they realize the inevitable.
8) The skies darkens, and the calm before your next charged Storm Pillar is the only peaceful moment anyone remembers.
9) Your own party members grasp at anything they can get their hands on as you unleash Hurricane >Oppressive Force<, more than doubling the energy emanating from this demonic High Vizier set. (7x stacks)
10) A round of Chilling Cloud followed by a final and DEVASTATING Sudden Storm leaves nothing but carnage.
11) A final Conduit of Ice is nothing but a merciful ending to the still twitching charred bodies.
- Today's tip is brought to you by >High Vizier< "Why buff your friends when you can turn your enemies into puff pastry?" "High Vizier, don't leave the Protector's Enclave without it."
Recipe:
1) Find a nice group of adds (preferably 2 groups)
2) Open with a Fully charged Storm Pillar in the middle (+10% damage)
3) 1 Round of Chilling Cloud (+25% damage)
4) A quick tabbed CoI + 1 well placed Sudden Storm both buffed by your previous ingredients. (remember to not aim your SS directly at your targets, but rather at their circles underneath them, which is a lot bigger. That way you get as many targets in the SS cone as possible)
If done properly, you should now be the proud owner of 10+ angry mobs rushing towards you...
5) Provide them with a nice slippery area by means of an Icy Terrain littered with lightning bolts.
6) Another round of Chilling Cloud to refresh that +25% buff
Anticipating a plethora of red circles and cleaves aimed directly at you, unleash HELL!!
7) Steal Time from the poor souls and watch your High Vizier armor leeching onto them marking them for death. As time stops, they realize the inevitable.
8) The skies darkens, and the calm before your next charged Storm Pillar is the only peaceful moment anyone remembers.
9) Your own party members grasp at anything they can get their hands on as you unleash Hurricane >Oppressive Force<, more than doubling the energy emanating from this demonic High Vizier set. (7x stacks)
10) A round of Chilling Cloud followed by a final and DEVASTATING Sudden Storm leaves nothing but carnage.
11) A final Conduit of Ice is nothing but a merciful ending to the still twitching charred bodies.
This recipe only takes about 20seconds to cook.
This is excellent information. Been using the build and apparently I was not doing it right, lol. So thx for the info.
Copticone, try to use SotEA on test server instead of Icy Terrain. With SotEA sometimes your sequence will be over on 5 point.
+1 to this. SotEA does ridiculous damage (50k+ crits) after you've done your first round of debuffs/buffs. This is exactly the reason I laugh whenever a GWF says they can outdps a CW. I'm honestly afraid that it will be nerfed at some point.
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zippyhappychimpMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 7Arc User
Copticone, try to use SotEA on test server instead of Icy Terrain. With SotEA sometimes your sequence will be over on 5 point.
As much fun as I have with bowling and SotEA in general, it doesn't apply chill (without added feats), and it doesn't abuse Storm Spell quite the same way. Add in a longer cast to cast time (especially since the cooldown doesn't start till it explodes) and it falls behind.
In the right build, where you precast it to build Arcane stacks, take the feats to boost it, etc etc, it can be a contender. Even then you'll still have them randomly shoot off to nowhere or randomly missing the target or whatever bug-of-the-month is infesting it.
But there's no right answer. If you're having fun, you're having fun. And watching an elite with a vacuum ability knock himself down 3 times is HILARIOUS.
As much fun as I have with bowling and SotEA in general, it doesn't apply chill (without added feats), and it doesn't abuse Storm Spell quite the same way. Add in a longer cast to cast time (especially since the cooldown doesn't start till it explodes) and it falls behind.
In the right build, where you precast it to build Arcane stacks, take the feats to boost it, etc etc, it can be a contender. Even then you'll still have them randomly shoot off to nowhere or randomly missing the target or whatever bug-of-the-month is infesting it.
But there's no right answer. If you're having fun, you're having fun. And watching an elite with a vacuum ability knock himself down 3 times is HILARIOUS.
You apply the chill stacks with CoI on tab followed by a rotation of chilling cloud, SS and then use SotEA point blank like a boss .
Hello, thanks for the great guide. I just wanted to ask if this build would be ok for people who don't have really great gear? I can't really afford the High Vizier's set at the moment. Eventually I will get it. I have quite a few purples mainly from the new area and the rest of my gear is blue's. Will this build be lacking for me without really good gear? This is the current build I'm using: http://mmominds.com/2013/05/17/thaumaturge-endgame-dps-guide-ability-reviews-by-runicfi/
It's ok but I didn't realize that the person who made the guide wasn't lv. 60 yet and I don't feel this build really has a lot of good synergy between powers and feats the way yours does. I like the idea of having control powers and mainly doing a lot of aoe damage. I'm not in a guild yet and mainly solo, I do a few dungeons here and there, mostly I'm just working on the new zone and doing Foundry, Skirmishes and a little bit of pvp. I plan on doing more when I have the time. I don't get a lot of time to play so I'm mainly just a casual player right now. So with all that in mind would you still suggest your build or is there something that may benefit me more at this point in time? Any info will be greatly appreciated. Thank you.
Hello, thanks for the great guide. I just wanted to ask if this build would be ok for people who don't have really great gear? I can't really afford the High Vizier's set at the moment. Eventually I will get it. I have quite a few purples mainly from the new area and the rest of my gear is blue's. Will this build be lacking for me without really good gear? This is the current build I'm using: http://mmominds.com/2013/05/17/thaumaturge-endgame-dps-guide-ability-reviews-by-runicfi/
It's ok but I didn't realize that the person who made the guide wasn't lv. 60 yet and I don't feel this build really has a lot of good synergy between powers and feats the way yours does. I like the idea of having control powers and mainly doing a lot of aoe damage. I'm not in a guild yet and mainly solo, I do a few dungeons here and there, mostly I'm just working on the new zone and doing Foundry, Skirmishes and a little bit of pvp. I plan on doing more when I have the time. I don't get a lot of time to play so I'm mainly just a casual player right now. So with all that in mind would you still suggest your build or is there something that may benefit me more at this point in time? Any info will be greatly appreciated. Thank you.
IMO CW is the least gear dependent class in the game. High Vizier is just a nice bonus, which can be used regardless of spec. Your priority is to reach the softcap of our stats, ArP/Crit/Recovery, and that can easily be done with an augment companion and any combination of gear. Getting a full set of HV I think is easier now for people without much AD. Running the respective dungeons has a much better chance of getting your set pieces now that you get to choose which one you want. If you can manage to run some T2s during DDs (remember to preclear to get at least 2 runs during each DD), you should have a full set within the week.
IMO CW is the least gear dependent class in the game.
I can second that. I've two CWs (my 1st is a Woodelf with a bad initial attribute setup, therefore I did a 2nd one as a Tiefling with better intial attribute setup), and just today I used my 1st CW, who only has the Archmage set and 4.150 recovery, nearly no Armor Penetration, the old June build from copticone and I did a run with my usual mates, where the damage output was not as good as with my 2nd CW (HV, 2.300 ArP, etc.) but I was still a bit better as the GF (whom I normally outdamage by 10-15%).
tl;dr: Yes, this build also works for not-so-good equiped characters.
+1 for shard. The extra control is terrific. Using this build with HV, I've had 1 wizard even come close to me in MC (pretty good test, lots of AoE packs and no punting). I said "When you've got 2 endgame geared CWs in an active competition for the most DPS, everyone wins!" To which the DC replied "Except for me, I'm smashing buttons like a monkey on meth keeping you 2 alive". I may have to redo my defense slots from darks to azures or radiants... I almost always have all of the aggro. Contemplating swapping out my soul forged for a thunderhead as well. I rarely see it proc, I go from >25% to dead faaar to often.
+1 for shard. The extra control is terrific. Using this build with HV, I've had 1 wizard even come close to me in MC (pretty good test, lots of AoE packs and no punting). I said "When you've got 2 endgame geared CWs in an active competition for the most DPS, everyone wins!" To which the DC replied "Except for me, I'm smashing buttons like a monkey on meth keeping you 2 alive". I may have to redo my defense slots from darks to azures or radiants... I almost always have all of the aggro. Contemplating swapping out my soul forged for a thunderhead as well. I rarely see it proc, I go from >25% to dead faaar to often.
You may also want to consider LifeSteal. I'm running with 1500LS, and with our big bursts it's very noticeable.
What items do you need to get that kind of lifesteal?
I've been finding my regeneration pretty convenient for returning to at least 3/4 of my health while running around Sharandar, but that doesn't feel nearly as life-sustaining in the midst of pitched dungeon fights *shakes fist at Totemists*. There's only so much Major Healing potions can do.
What items do you need to get that kind of lifesteal?
I've been finding my regeneration pretty convenient for returning to at least 3/4 of my health while running around Sharandar, but that doesn't feel nearly as life-sustaining in the midst of pitched dungeon fights *shakes fist at Totemists*. There's only so much Major Healing potions can do.
Dark Enchantments in Defensive Slots
Necromancer rings have Defensive Slots
Demon Web Wrap 150LS
Spirit Cave Orb 270LS
Lord Talisman of the Dark 88LS
I have a cat, so I get another ring with Defensive slot + another Demon Wrap.
If I can ever start running and completing dungeons with more reliability (read: find a nice Beholder shard guild - haven't had much luck at dungeon completion with PUGs), I'll probably be able to build this up. Until then, though, the AD savings I got from the KotF pack were about used up getting what I have presently.
* * *
One thing I recently figured out concerning this build and how well it synergized with the High Vizier set was how the capstone feat for the Thaumaturge tree used the word "Mitigation" to say "it decreases the defense of the monsters affected by it". For the longest time, I wasn't impressed with it because I thought it made their attacks cause 15% less damage (and didn't see much of that), rather than make them 15% more vulnerable to damage.
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darthpotaterMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,259Arc User
edited September 2013
I am using this build with 1100 lifesteal, and the lifesteal was really nice, saved me lots of times and saved a lot of potions too. BUT now I dont use shield, and shield was the "lifesaver" because of the high aoe damage to all the targets, usually filling 7k-9k.
Also, the cave orb stats and damage are very low compared with CN set and MC set, I feel like changing the lifesteal with more HP and regeneration (with those defensive slots) is better now, and the new barkshield enchant seems a good replacement for shield and soulforged.
I am still not 100% sure of this but is how I feel since the new patch.
I am using this build with 1100 lifesteal, and the lifesteal was really nice, saved me lots of times and saved a lot of potions too. BUT now I dont use shield, and shield was the "lifesaver" because of the high aoe damage to all the targets, usually filling 7k-9k.
Also, the cave orb stats and damage are very low compared with CN set and MC set, I feel like changing the lifesteal with more HP and regeneration (with those defensive slots) is better now, and the new barkshield enchant seems a good replacement for shield and soulforged.
I am still not 100% sure of this but is how I feel since the new patch.
Sudden Storm, Shard of Endless, Steal Time, Oppressive Force, Maelstorm are all very nice big bursts that would generate very nice heals with Lifesteal. Everything else will top you off nicely as well. Fighting bosses that continuously throw something at you, like Vilandra in MC, while you're topping yourself back to 100% with a couple of encounters or an Ice Knife is great.
The spirit cave is just a nice chunk of Lifesteal. But I am working on rank8 Darks which will allow me to switch out of it. I really personally hate the stats on the Ancient and the Fey set. But I will probably switch to the Fey orb eventually since it is a bigger upgrade on the base damage than CN's. I got my hand on 3 CN orbs before and sold them. Having that 10.5% LifeSteal got me out of situations and often allowed me to solo finish bosses when the rest of the group wiped (soloed last 30% of Draco a couple of times). To me that was more beneficial than having the highest base damage Orb.
Sudden Storm, Shard of Endless, Steal Time, Oppressive Force, Maelstorm are all very nice big bursts that would generate very nice heals with Lifesteal. Everything else will top you off nicely as well. Fighting bosses that continuously throw something at you, like Vilandra in MC, while you're topping yourself back to 100% with a couple of encounters or an Ice Knife is great.
The spirit cave is just a nice chunk of Lifesteal. But I am working on rank8 Darks which will allow me to switch out of it. I really personally hate the stats on the Ancient and the Fey set. But I will probably switch to the Fey orb eventually since it is a bigger upgrade on the base damage than CN's. I got my hand on 3 CN orbs before and sold them. Having that 10.5% LifeSteal got me out of situations and often allowed me to solo finish bosses when the rest of the group wiped (soloed last 30% of Draco a couple of times). To me that was more beneficial than having the highest base damage Orb.
Yes I read all your posts, and I am aware of the changes to your build, to make more damage, I still dont like Sudden Storm, tryed it lots of times, and allways remove it. I usually play as the only CW, and without GF, and I get ALL the agro ALL the time. Even with a good GF, I get lot of attention, and damage spells like SS dont help me.
Actually I slot EF for AP (yes, dont kill me please), CoI, Icy Terrain and Steal Time. Have to try Shard (I dont have it), maybe I need to redo all the build, but with this setup I can control all the ads and spam daily spells all the time while debuff enemies. Maybe my playstile is more defensive
Comments
and also the featured satirical comedic adventure "A Call for Heroes".
Ok I dont think you guys are going to like this. LOL
So I went on Mimic to test Wizard's Wrath, Focused Wizardry, and Evocation. Let me first say that this was mainly a TOOLTIP test. So I didnt actually use every Power to see if these feats and Evocation actually add damage or not. But from the ones I tested, and particularly Chilling Cloud, it seems that whatever the tooltip damage says, is actually the damage you do. With regards to Chilling Cloud itself, the tooltip damage that is correct is the one that shows AFTER you slot the power, not the tooltip that shows in the POWER Window.
So, I regret to inform you that the only Powers that Evocation/Wizard's Wrath/Focused Wizardry affect are: Chill Strike (on Tab), Ice Storm, and Steal Time. THAT'S IT! (I didnt test shield because it doesn't display its damage on the tooltip, but I am assuming that it is affected. Otherwise that would be really crappy)
If someone wants to do a more in-depth testing (pfft2 *cough*), then please go right ahead. I would love nothing more than for this to just be a Tooltip bug.
Chilling Cloud is DEFINITELY bugged, and they should be ashamed of themselves to actually include it in their Patch note as if it has changed. In the Power Window (the one you drag your powers from) it clearly shows that it benefits when I added the feats, and then again when I added Evocation. However when I slotted it, the damage reverted to its original state, loosing the 6%+9%+15%. So I actually tested it with One feat at a time, and then with Evocation, and on the dummies, the damage was exactly the same. The first 2 hits are withing the Tooltip range. The third hit hits the main target for almost double, but then the Secondary Targets get hit for the damage that's within the Tootip.
So I am reporting this as a bug, and I urge others to test it and see if they get the same effect. If so, please report it. Also report the fact that the CW class if being screwed with as always with these AoE feats that they can NEVER get right.
Bug report sent.
Seems like just a tooltip thing, based on a fairly casual test on the Preview server just now.
My first parse, with zero feats and against a single target, showed Chilling Cloud's crit-neutral DPS at 866.39. The highest single hit weighed in at 2,127. The minimum damage was 384.
My second parse, with Focused Wizardry and Wizard's Wrath (and no other damage-increasing feats or features), showed Chilling Cloud's crit-neutral DPS at 940.5. The highest single hit recorded weighed in at 2,472. The minimum damage was 385.
940.5 / 866.39 = 1.085
2472 / 2172 = 1.162
The two feats are supposed to confer a net bonus of about 15.5%. I believe that the two feats do affect the third hit of Chilling Cloud (which is also the only AoE, and by far the highest-damage hit, in the cycle). I believe the two feats do nothing for the first two attacks, which would explain why the damage boost in my second parse is only 8.5% overall (and which also explains why the minimum damage didn't rise). FWIW, my Chilling Cloud tooltip stayed at 384-444 when I purchased the two feats.
Likewise, my tooltip damage didn't move when I subsequently purchased and slotted (rank 3) Evocation. My third parse, with both feats and Evocation, showed a crit-neutral DPS of 1,035.94. The highest single hit weighed in at 2,842. The minimum damage was 385.
So Evocation represents a ~10% overall damage boost to Chilling Cloud, and a (2842 / 2472) - 1 = 14.96% boost to the third attack. Seems to be working as you'd expect, though I definitely agree that the opaque functionality of various feats and features in this game grows tiresome. Add that their functionality seems to change drastically and without any warning and you've a recipe for discouragement.
I haven't had much time to play in the last week or so, but I confess I'm a little less than enthusiastic about the game right now, given some of the outstanding bugs.
Primarily I'm talking about in Karrundax where groups like to jump onto the mountainous scenery and attack the boss from a 'quasi' safe spot. As a ranged DPS in that situation I'm supposed to take the boss out, but, without damaging any of the surrounding adds.
Initially, I didn't realize that meant I couldn't use chilling cloud, or it would cause the adds to come after me. So I ended up just trying Ray of Enfeeblement on tab along with Chilling Strike and Icy Rays, while leaving Steal Time slotted in case anything came after me on my little perch.
I'm guessing you probably run Karrundax the normal way as god intended, but, it seems most groups prefer not to do that. So, I just wanted to know if you had a suggestion for an optimal single target setup where any form of AoE is a 'no no'. I ended up using the encounters I mentioned in the last paragraph along with Ray of Frost for my at will.
Anyways, if you don't have time to get back to me on this don't worry about it. Thanks for your hard work Copticone. It is much appreciated. The same goes for the rest of you as well!
I don't understand how you are getting these different outcomes. I didn't really pay attention to the third hit on the main target. I know it was higher than all other hits. But the first hit, and the second hit, and all secondary hits on secondary targets, did not change at all between 0 feats and all the AoE feats + Evocation. From what you are saying what might be happening is that only the 3rd single target hit is getting the bonus. Regardless it is definitely bugged.
Correction. I tested again, and also the secondary hits are getting a boost. So the first and second hits are getting nothing, and the 3rd hit + secondary get a boost but certainly not a 15%+6%+9%. Also I am sure you noticed the third hit on the main target is almost double the damage of the hits the secondary targets receive. A typical round is something like:
400 on main
400 on main
1300 on main
600 on secondaries.
There really isnt a boss where your secondary hits from Chilling Cloud or the AoE of CoI would cause you to get unwanted attention, unless the rest of the party is just standing there doing nothing. Even a DC's heals should draw more threat than that. In fact I do take advantage of adds near the boss to weave in Storm Pillar and get the 10% boost.
The Powers you mentioned are all good for Single Target. I still keep CoI on Tab, for that extra tick. I dont like the static cooldown of RoE on tab.
I would find it rather bizzare that the wizard wrath/focused wizardry had a different function than evocation.
and also the featured satirical comedic adventure "A Call for Heroes".
Would you say that it's a bit... Cryptic? :>
Yeah, for simplicity's sake I only tested against a single target last night. Because the AoE splash damage is so much lower than the main-target damage on the third strike, it would have been hard to tell at a glance whether the feats were properly enhancing their damage. I'll see about doing something more in-depth tonight.
Please feel free, grimah. Maybe I'll finally get around to updating my thread.
The Evocation results are consistent with my expectations. Keep in mind that mine was a quick-and-dirty test. The last parse was the longest, so it's probably slightly more accurate than the previous parses; it takes awhile for Cryptic's baked in damage variance to stabilize, and even longer if you're just looking at a small subset of attacks.
- Today's tip is brought to you by >High Vizier< "Why buff your friends when you can turn your enemies into puff pastry?" "High Vizier, don't leave the Protector's Enclave without it."
Recipe:
1) Find a nice group of adds (preferably 2 groups)
2) Open with a Fully charged Storm Pillar in the middle (+10% damage)
3) 1 Round of Chilling Cloud (+25% damage)
4) A quick tabbed CoI + 1 well placed Sudden Storm both buffed by your previous ingredients. (remember to not aim your SS directly at your targets, but rather at their circles underneath them, which is a lot bigger. That way you get as many targets in the SS cone as possible)
If done properly, you should now be the proud owner of 10+ angry mobs rushing towards you...
5) Provide them with a nice slippery area by means of an Icy Terrain littered with lightning bolts.
6) Another round of Chilling Cloud to refresh that +25% buff
Anticipating a plethora of red circles and cleaves aimed directly at you, unleash HELL!!
7) Steal Time from the poor souls and watch your High Vizier armor leeching onto them marking them for death. As time stops, they realize the inevitable.
8) The skies darkens, and the calm before your next charged Storm Pillar is the only peaceful moment anyone remembers.
9) Your own party members grasp at anything they can get their hands on as you unleash Hurricane >Oppressive Force<, more than doubling the energy emanating from this demonic High Vizier set. (7x stacks)
10) A round of Chilling Cloud followed by a final and DEVASTATING Sudden Storm leaves nothing but carnage.
11) A final Conduit of Ice is nothing but a merciful ending to the still twitching charred bodies.
This recipe only takes about 20seconds to cook.
This is excellent information. Been using the build and apparently I was not doing it right, lol. So thx for the info.
+1 to this. SotEA does ridiculous damage (50k+ crits) after you've done your first round of debuffs/buffs. This is exactly the reason I laugh whenever a GWF says they can outdps a CW. I'm honestly afraid that it will be nerfed at some point.
As much fun as I have with bowling and SotEA in general, it doesn't apply chill (without added feats), and it doesn't abuse Storm Spell quite the same way. Add in a longer cast to cast time (especially since the cooldown doesn't start till it explodes) and it falls behind.
In the right build, where you precast it to build Arcane stacks, take the feats to boost it, etc etc, it can be a contender. Even then you'll still have them randomly shoot off to nowhere or randomly missing the target or whatever bug-of-the-month is infesting it.
But there's no right answer. If you're having fun, you're having fun. And watching an elite with a vacuum ability knock himself down 3 times is HILARIOUS.
You apply the chill stacks with CoI on tab followed by a rotation of chilling cloud, SS and then use SotEA point blank like a boss
It's ok but I didn't realize that the person who made the guide wasn't lv. 60 yet and I don't feel this build really has a lot of good synergy between powers and feats the way yours does. I like the idea of having control powers and mainly doing a lot of aoe damage. I'm not in a guild yet and mainly solo, I do a few dungeons here and there, mostly I'm just working on the new zone and doing Foundry, Skirmishes and a little bit of pvp. I plan on doing more when I have the time. I don't get a lot of time to play so I'm mainly just a casual player right now. So with all that in mind would you still suggest your build or is there something that may benefit me more at this point in time? Any info will be greatly appreciated. Thank you.
IMO CW is the least gear dependent class in the game. High Vizier is just a nice bonus, which can be used regardless of spec. Your priority is to reach the softcap of our stats, ArP/Crit/Recovery, and that can easily be done with an augment companion and any combination of gear. Getting a full set of HV I think is easier now for people without much AD. Running the respective dungeons has a much better chance of getting your set pieces now that you get to choose which one you want. If you can manage to run some T2s during DDs (remember to preclear to get at least 2 runs during each DD), you should have a full set within the week.
tl;dr: Yes, this build also works for not-so-good equiped characters.
You may also want to consider LifeSteal. I'm running with 1500LS, and with our big bursts it's very noticeable.
I've been finding my regeneration pretty convenient for returning to at least 3/4 of my health while running around Sharandar, but that doesn't feel nearly as life-sustaining in the midst of pitched dungeon fights *shakes fist at Totemists*. There's only so much Major Healing potions can do.
Dark Enchantments in Defensive Slots
Necromancer rings have Defensive Slots
Demon Web Wrap 150LS
Spirit Cave Orb 270LS
Lord Talisman of the Dark 88LS
I have a cat, so I get another ring with Defensive slot + another Demon Wrap.
If I can ever start running and completing dungeons with more reliability (read: find a nice Beholder shard guild - haven't had much luck at dungeon completion with PUGs), I'll probably be able to build this up. Until then, though, the AD savings I got from the KotF pack were about used up getting what I have presently.
* * *
One thing I recently figured out concerning this build and how well it synergized with the High Vizier set was how the capstone feat for the Thaumaturge tree used the word "Mitigation" to say "it decreases the defense of the monsters affected by it". For the longest time, I wasn't impressed with it because I thought it made their attacks cause 15% less damage (and didn't see much of that), rather than make them 15% more vulnerable to damage.
Also, the cave orb stats and damage are very low compared with CN set and MC set, I feel like changing the lifesteal with more HP and regeneration (with those defensive slots) is better now, and the new barkshield enchant seems a good replacement for shield and soulforged.
I am still not 100% sure of this but is how I feel since the new patch.
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Sudden Storm, Shard of Endless, Steal Time, Oppressive Force, Maelstorm are all very nice big bursts that would generate very nice heals with Lifesteal. Everything else will top you off nicely as well. Fighting bosses that continuously throw something at you, like Vilandra in MC, while you're topping yourself back to 100% with a couple of encounters or an Ice Knife is great.
The spirit cave is just a nice chunk of Lifesteal. But I am working on rank8 Darks which will allow me to switch out of it. I really personally hate the stats on the Ancient and the Fey set. But I will probably switch to the Fey orb eventually since it is a bigger upgrade on the base damage than CN's. I got my hand on 3 CN orbs before and sold them. Having that 10.5% LifeSteal got me out of situations and often allowed me to solo finish bosses when the rest of the group wiped (soloed last 30% of Draco a couple of times). To me that was more beneficial than having the highest base damage Orb.
Yes I read all your posts, and I am aware of the changes to your build, to make more damage, I still dont like Sudden Storm, tryed it lots of times, and allways remove it. I usually play as the only CW, and without GF, and I get ALL the agro ALL the time. Even with a good GF, I get lot of attention, and damage spells like SS dont help me.
Actually I slot EF for AP (yes, dont kill me please), CoI, Icy Terrain and Steal Time. Have to try Shard (I dont have it), maybe I need to redo all the build, but with this setup I can control all the ads and spam daily spells all the time while debuff enemies. Maybe my playstile is more defensive
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