Enjoy?I am the one advocating a change of the system,and merely providing evidence to my arguments by posting screenshots.
It's fascinating that are you unable to comprehend the content of my post.How about you read it again and prove me wrong instead of derailing because you can not use your brain.
Or perhaps you can use your brain and know that what I am saying is true , and being unable to continue discussing on topic you start to derail and troll?
Enjoy?I am the one advocating a change of the system,and merely providing evidence to my arguments by posting screenshots.
It's fascinating that are you unable to comprehend the content of my post.How about you read it again and prove me wrong instead of derailing because you can not use your brain.
I understand that you are advocating to make it even worse than it is. It's bad enough the fascist state of existence that people already want to instate, let alone making it even worse. Unless I misunderstood your intentions, it appears to me that you are asking for even stricter restrictions on chat than what is already there, basically throwing the baby out with the bathwater, so to speak.
I have said multiple times through this thread and the bigger one what I want.Even in the post you quoted i wrote
You want a spam free zone?Start doing suggestions like we are here http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/sho...m-sucks/page56 .
Suggestions like implementation of other channels or adding a buffer or whatever you might contribute.
And make the stupid bans only for zone.A person should still be able to play the game and chat with guildies,friends!The punishment is too big.
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calaminthaMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I didn't vote in the poll. I don't like how it's worded.
I'm fine with the system as it stands. It seems self correcting. I would like to see Cryptic improve methods of detecting potential griefers, but that is about it.
STEP 1. FIND SOMEONE YOU HATE ON FORUMS STEP 2. LOGIN ON MULTIPLE SHARDS AND ADVERTISE PLAYERS @HANDLE SAYING HE NINJAED OR KILLED A KITTEN AND ASK PEOPLE TO REPORT HIM FOR SPAM.
STEP 3. HE GETS SILENCED
STEP 4. VOTE THAT THE SYSTEM IS STABLE AND UNEXPLOITABLE
anyone who doesn't have a problem with this is a complete moron like the thread starter.
Jesus if only we could mute people on the forums.....:rolleyes:
You make a poll, and put your bias opinion in the first post. Without making it clear how the system works.
Not to mention this "I should have the right to spam people in zone to sell something." Which isn't even the argument. Stop being so dense.
It's NOT about zone ban it's about banning their chat entirely, including guild, party, and whispers. You obviously aren't getting it.
If you're making a fair poll don't be so bias about it. Holy ****.
We're big boys and girls, my friend, so we can take a little humorous hyperbole for what it is - we know what the salient points are and vote accordingly.
A punishment isn't a punishment unless it hurts. The fact that spammers are squealing in outrage shows the system is working as intended. In the immortal words of Sheriff Arpaio ""You have been convicted. You're doing your time. Do your time and shut your mouth and do what you have to do."
They have a similar system on CO and STO and it has been used to grief people.
It has also been used, to a much greater degree, to effectively silence spammers.
Again, the benefits are worth the pitfalls.
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klamidia951Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 6Arc User
edited May 2013
What is the problem? If you are in protectors enclave .. there should not be an issue with some trade spam .. Sure it could be abused but there are ways to limit how often someone can post in zone chat .. or if X player exceeds X posts a second.
This is a small complaint and somewhat irrelevant in my opinion. Major cities is the MOST LOGICAL PLACE TO BARTER AND TRADE
The point is that is abusable. I also talk on the zone chat (never tried to sell anything yet) and haven't been muted. But I think someone said that if around 20 people report you, then you can be muted. The problem here is that there are people who has 20+ alt accounts they use to mute whoever they dont like. It's not just due to spamming or talking in zone only. Some even do it for fun.
Just to make sure I understand correctly, you're saying that there are people out there who will log-off and log-back-on twenty times over on different accounts just to 'have fun' getting someone banned for 24hours on chat? I am not being provocative here. I am actually curious. The chat box is always scrolling so fast I can't pick out names so I don't know how these 'fun-loving social degenerates' you are talking about are supposed to do it with all the chat-selling. As someone who has never, in months of playing the game, ever been chat-banned, I am curious as to how often this happens.
What is the problem? If you are in protectors enclave .. there should not be an issue with some trade spam .. Sure it could be abused but there are ways to limit how often someone can post in zone chat .. or if X player exceeds X posts a second.
This is a small complaint and somewhat irrelevant in my opinion. Major cities is the MOST LOGICAL PLACE TO BARTER AND TRADE
You are right of course, cities are a logical place to barter and trade goods...but not on a PA system that reaches out over the entire city and prevents other people from having regular conversations.
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cr0pMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
We're big boys and girls, my friend, so we can take a little humorous hyperbole for what it is - we know what the salient points are and vote accordingly.
A punishment isn't a punishment unless it hurts. The fact that spammers are squealing in outrage shows the system is working as intended. In the immortal words of Sheriff Arpaio ""You have been convicted. You're doing your time. Do your time and shut your mouth and do what you have to do."
YAY! That was awesome! Vote one best post of the thread!
the community has spoken... we hate the spam... get over it.
funny also I will add, I notice there are a distinct 2 or 3 people that post arguments to anything and everything thats posted... especially when it comes to exploiting or justifying general ******-baggery...
Amusingly enuff, they also call others compulsive and obsessed even when wageing a near one man argument onto an entire community and post almost every 3rd post or so... hmm, oh hai thur said the pot to the kettle.
I loathe and detest the spam, but people are scumbags, and it won't stop, they will keep drowning everyone else and whining when muted.. Thus, it would make pragmatic sense if the game had a standard out-of-the-box trade channel, which would lower the temperature a little, and make the game more pleasant.
There is a pattern here, a lot of little design flaws in the game causing big trouble. Generally, they seem to be ones that fail to take into account that the player base is mostly a bunch of teenage sociopaths who will disregard or screw over other people at every opportunity. Robust MMO design is a game of pathology whackamole, often; protecting players from each other. The good news is that a lot of the problems have solutions that aren't technically too challenging, but they do require the developer not to be asleep at the wheel/busy elsewhere.
The OP is missing one important point . Most of us would like to see a working chat ban system. The current one can be exploited by trolls so it isnt working.
If a person can be chat banned even if they have been offline for a couple of weeks then it needs adjusted . As others have said separate Ignore from Spam and its a good system. People should not be chat muted for getting IGNORED.
I am all for a slightly adjusted one. That said in the space of over 3 years playing on this chat server I've only been chat banned 4 times.
If people are getting chat banned every second day they should adjust their thinking.
ambisinisterrMember, Neverwinter ModeratorPosts: 10,462Community Moderator
edited May 2013
When I first logged into Neverwinter and I saw "Zone Chat" I cringed. This is something which I knew most people would use as a standard way to communicate rather than to ask an occasional question or mature discussion. Sadly this became more true than I ever would have dreamed and it makes me wish Zone Chat was removed completely.
I played on NWN Servers in which some servers actually added additional programming in order to disable the "Shout" chat methods. So "Zone" chat as a whole just irks me. But I do like it for it's ability to find like-minded players and to ask silly n-o-o-b questions...
But that's not possible. Why?
Because the chat is spammed with a bunch of people selling items that should be in the auction house or in trade channels. I'm not keen on such players receiving a 24 hour mute but in my most humble opinion I don't have a ton of sympathy because this is something I find EXTREMELY disruptive and destructive.
I've never reported or ignored users for using Protector's Enclave's Zone Chat as a Trade Channel but I promise you it's a temptation I avoid only by grudgingly disabling zone chat.
There are trade channels and I believe an Official Trade Channel was purposely avoided because this is something players have typically run on their own. In the MMO's I have played there were specific locations which items were sold in spam fests, trade chat-rooms and "merchant guilds" in which items were traded amongst groups of players. This can add a lot of depth to the game and truly create a living in game economy.
The problem is the fact "Zone Chat" exists. It turns the entirety of Protector's Enclave into a spam fest which makes doing anything with zone chat turned on a nightmare. I would bet even if an Official Spam Bin (my spiteful name for Trade Channel) was created I would still expect the PE Chat to be flooded with trade offers.
Why?
There's a larger audience not in a trade channel.
So this wall of text boils down to one giant question mark.
I am telling you that as a player I hate the zone chat spam but I don't think there's much which could stop it. I feel player driven trade channels are the best way for MMO's to create in game economies and I hope that in time these channels will be used more and more. I don't like the idea of having an official trade channel. I don't think it would fix anything.
Despite this I can't truly condone players getting muted for spamming zone chat with trade spam...
But at the same time this is player policing stating what they find disruptive and irritating. It might be best if those using Protector's Enclave Zone Chat as a Trade Chat simply took the hint and stopped doing something which seems to repeatedly end up in player issued mutes.
I don't know about the rest of you, but I live in a country where it's not alright to let innocent people suffer under a law, just because that law happens to also put some guilty parties in jail, too. There are people getting ignored/spam reported en masse, just for posting a single trade message in the general chat, and that's not ok. There are people being spam reported en masse by mistake, due to mis-clicks in the chat window, and that's not ok, either.
Not to mention this "law" is in the hands of a mob of random people. Again, not how my country works.
I'm just saying, maybe those of you who are arguing in favor of the status quo should stop and really think about what you are arguing for. In principle, this whole thing is wrong on multiple levels.
-Travail.
Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines.
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liquidc86Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
i love how this system works. sometimes i just stand there on city reporting everyone who posts more then 3 in a row.
I don't know about the rest of you, but I live in a country where it's not alright to let innocent people suffer under a law, just because that law happens to also put some guilty parties in jail, too. There are people getting ignored/spam reported en masse, just for posting a single trade message in the general chat, and that's not ok. There are people being spam reported en masse by mistake, due to mis-clicks in the chat window, and that's not ok, either.
Not to mention this "law" is in the hands of a mob of random people. Again, not how my country works.
I'm just saying, maybe those of you who are arguing in favor of the status quo should stop and really think about what you are arguing for. In principle, this whole thing is wrong on multiple levels.
-Travail.
In PWE's defense I've had a chat ban reversed . I didnt explode on the forums I put in a ticket , fired up my Skype so I could continue to chat with my guildies and kept calm and carried on.
Comments
It's fascinating that are you unable to comprehend the content of my post.How about you read it again and prove me wrong instead of derailing because you can not use your brain.
Or perhaps you can use your brain and know that what I am saying is true , and being unable to continue discussing on topic you start to derail and troll?
I understand that you are advocating to make it even worse than it is. It's bad enough the fascist state of existence that people already want to instate, let alone making it even worse. Unless I misunderstood your intentions, it appears to me that you are asking for even stricter restrictions on chat than what is already there, basically throwing the baby out with the bathwater, so to speak.
And make the stupid bans only for zone.A person should still be able to play the game and chat with guildies,friends!The punishment is too big.
I'm sure I can do better.
Should there be a wipe?
1. Yes. A fresh start is best for everyone.
2. No. I don't want to lose my exploited items/AD.
How did I do?
Link is dead, but I would agree that there should be chat channels for LFG and trade, and that punishment in this game is too extreme.
edit : its the link to "Chat Banned. Proof this system sucks." Thread here.
I'm fine with the system as it stands. It seems self correcting. I would like to see Cryptic improve methods of detecting potential griefers, but that is about it.
Jesus if only we could mute people on the forums.....:rolleyes:
LOL someone has serious issues. How mental and completely self absorbed can a person be? You totally have my vote!
It's amusing that the people who seem the most adamantly against this are the same people who irritate the most on the forums.
btw, I like the Mute-System too, but the style you made your fist post and the implication that all who click no are spammers makes me want to puke.
A punishment isn't a punishment unless it hurts. The fact that spammers are squealing in outrage shows the system is working as intended. In the immortal words of Sheriff Arpaio ""You have been convicted. You're doing your time. Do your time and shut your mouth and do what you have to do."
That simple.
If you've managed to HAMSTER off 20 strangers do you really have anything valuable to say?
Also, good luck using my forum name to track down my game name. They're totally different for a reason.
If someone hates you so much they log in twenty times on twenty accounts just to chat ban you...well what exactly did you do to them?
It has also been used, to a much greater degree, to effectively silence spammers.
Again, the benefits are worth the pitfalls.
This is a small complaint and somewhat irrelevant in my opinion. Major cities is the MOST LOGICAL PLACE TO BARTER AND TRADE
Just to make sure I understand correctly, you're saying that there are people out there who will log-off and log-back-on twenty times over on different accounts just to 'have fun' getting someone banned for 24hours on chat? I am not being provocative here. I am actually curious. The chat box is always scrolling so fast I can't pick out names so I don't know how these 'fun-loving social degenerates' you are talking about are supposed to do it with all the chat-selling. As someone who has never, in months of playing the game, ever been chat-banned, I am curious as to how often this happens.
You are right of course, cities are a logical place to barter and trade goods...but not on a PA system that reaches out over the entire city and prevents other people from having regular conversations.
Cast a vote in a real poll, this one's clearly biased.
YAY! That was awesome! Vote one best post of the thread!
funny also I will add, I notice there are a distinct 2 or 3 people that post arguments to anything and everything thats posted... especially when it comes to exploiting or justifying general ******-baggery...
Amusingly enuff, they also call others compulsive and obsessed even when wageing a near one man argument onto an entire community and post almost every 3rd post or so... hmm, oh hai thur said the pot to the kettle.
There is a pattern here, a lot of little design flaws in the game causing big trouble. Generally, they seem to be ones that fail to take into account that the player base is mostly a bunch of teenage sociopaths who will disregard or screw over other people at every opportunity. Robust MMO design is a game of pathology whackamole, often; protecting players from each other. The good news is that a lot of the problems have solutions that aren't technically too challenging, but they do require the developer not to be asleep at the wheel/busy elsewhere.
If a person can be chat banned even if they have been offline for a couple of weeks then it needs adjusted . As others have said separate Ignore from Spam and its a good system. People should not be chat muted for getting IGNORED.
I am all for a slightly adjusted one. That said in the space of over 3 years playing on this chat server I've only been chat banned 4 times.
If people are getting chat banned every second day they should adjust their thinking.
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
I played on NWN Servers in which some servers actually added additional programming in order to disable the "Shout" chat methods. So "Zone" chat as a whole just irks me. But I do like it for it's ability to find like-minded players and to ask silly n-o-o-b questions...
But that's not possible. Why?
Because the chat is spammed with a bunch of people selling items that should be in the auction house or in trade channels. I'm not keen on such players receiving a 24 hour mute but in my most humble opinion I don't have a ton of sympathy because this is something I find EXTREMELY disruptive and destructive.
I've never reported or ignored users for using Protector's Enclave's Zone Chat as a Trade Channel but I promise you it's a temptation I avoid only by grudgingly disabling zone chat.
There are trade channels and I believe an Official Trade Channel was purposely avoided because this is something players have typically run on their own. In the MMO's I have played there were specific locations which items were sold in spam fests, trade chat-rooms and "merchant guilds" in which items were traded amongst groups of players. This can add a lot of depth to the game and truly create a living in game economy.
The problem is the fact "Zone Chat" exists. It turns the entirety of Protector's Enclave into a spam fest which makes doing anything with zone chat turned on a nightmare. I would bet even if an Official Spam Bin (my spiteful name for Trade Channel) was created I would still expect the PE Chat to be flooded with trade offers.
Why?
There's a larger audience not in a trade channel.
So this wall of text boils down to one giant question mark.
I am telling you that as a player I hate the zone chat spam but I don't think there's much which could stop it. I feel player driven trade channels are the best way for MMO's to create in game economies and I hope that in time these channels will be used more and more. I don't like the idea of having an official trade channel. I don't think it would fix anything.
Despite this I can't truly condone players getting muted for spamming zone chat with trade spam...
But at the same time this is player policing stating what they find disruptive and irritating. It might be best if those using Protector's Enclave Zone Chat as a Trade Chat simply took the hint and stopped doing something which seems to repeatedly end up in player issued mutes.
Not to mention this "law" is in the hands of a mob of random people. Again, not how my country works.
I'm just saying, maybe those of you who are arguing in favor of the status quo should stop and really think about what you are arguing for. In principle, this whole thing is wrong on multiple levels.
-Travail.
In PWE's defense I've had a chat ban reversed . I didnt explode on the forums I put in a ticket , fired up my Skype so I could continue to chat with my guildies and kept calm and carried on.
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
LFG spam is just as bad.
LF EPIC KARR NEED 2 DC
LF EPIC KARR NEED 2 DC
LF EPIC KARR NEED 2 DC
LF EPIC KARR NEED 2 DC
Zone chat is always going to be spammy because there's only one place with a bank, mailbox, auction house and crafting vendors.