Introducing a optional monthly sub. seems to be the best idea so far, to me. The details of what should be included in the sub. is of course important.
Well if it is it's fanboy nonsense that is shared by a great many developers as it was a big topic of discussion at last years GDC, we are living in the most self entitled, petty generation in history. They are more concerned what other people have than what they have and automatically view something as evil if it isn't free.
Perfect example I teach advanced network principles part time at our local community college, one student there who is barely Nineteen, received a patent for two pieces of software he created in High School and is now very well off, He is automatically hated at the school by a majority of the students because of it. I asked one student why he didn't like him. "He has more money than I do" was his answer, I was boggled by the admission of it.
And before you say that you don't care who has what maybe you don't, but a <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> ton of the crying on this forum stems from the fact that some people for whatever reason can't afford things they want, but instead of being okay with that they scream "I can so afford it, I just think it's stupid and the people who pay are fools!!"
I see a lot of crying, but I don't actually see anyone going away over the cash shop. That in itself speaks volumes.
Greed. Pure greed. The kid you mentioned should focus on things he likes, and money will come fast. But greed blind people and generate hate. "I want all that my neighbor have, his car, his wife, his kids". Human being are selfish creatures that will not stop until destroy everything.
Well if it is it's fanboy nonsense that is shared by a great many developers as it was a big topic of discussion at last years GDC, we are living in the most self entitled, petty generation in history. They are more concerned what other people have than what they have and automatically view something as evil if it isn't free.
Perfect example I teach advanced network principles part time at our local community college, one student there who is barely Nineteen, received a patent for two pieces of software he created in High School and is now very well off, He is automatically hated at the school by a majority of the students because of it. I asked one student why he didn't like him. "He has more money than I do" was his answer, I was boggled by the admission of it.
And before you say that you don't care who has what maybe you don't, but a <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> ton of the crying on this forum stems from the fact that some people for whatever reason can't afford things they want, but instead of being okay with that they scream "I can so afford it, I just think it's stupid and the people who pay are fools!!"
I see a lot of crying, but I don't actually see anyone going away over the cash shop. That in itself speaks volumes.
I don't hate rich people, I hate smug people.
I don't have anything against the people shelling out hundreds of dollars on this game, again, I hate smug people.
My distaste for the cash shop is because it feels too much of a nickle & dime shop to me. That's why I'm voicing my concerns. I love the game, but I hate the shop. I want to spend money on the game, but the businesses model doesn't allow me to (without it feeling morally wrong to me)
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mutharexMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I don't hate rich people, I hate smug people.
I don't have anything against the people shelling out hundreds of dollars on this game, again, I hate smug people.
My distaste for the cash shop is because it feels too much of a nickle & dime shop to me. That's why I'm voicing my concerns. I love the game, but I hate the shop. I want to spend money on the game, but the businesses model doesn't allow me to (without it feeling morally wrong to me)
I understand that. So if it feels wrong don't do it. I boycott a famous brand by not buying their products. It's very simple. Play without cash shop. A lot of people do it
I understand that. So if it feels wrong don't do it. I boycott a famous brand by not buying their products. It's very simple. Play without cash shop. A lot of people do it
I am boycotting the cash shop. I'm also voicing my concerns and giving constructive criticisms here on the forum, because deep down I actually want to support this game. If I didn't care at all, I'd be long gone by now.
I think their business model isn't morally wrong, they have the rights to price whatever they want, you can't called them immoral for that... Do you like being called immoral when somebody says your work's value is lower than you think it is? They can however price it too high too.
I don't hate rich people, I hate smug people.
I don't have anything against the people shelling out hundreds of dollars on this game, again, I hate smug people.
My distaste for the cash shop is because it feels too much of a nickle & dime shop to me. That's why I'm voicing my concerns. I love the game, but I hate the shop. I want to spend money on the game, but the businesses model doesn't allow me to (without it feeling morally wrong to me)
And that understandable Dezman, but I don't think Iv'e seen you hitting the forum insulting people who are spending money, those are the ones I speaking of, I respect people who voice their concerns give constructive non-insulting criticism and offer an alternative suggestion. It's the ones who spend sixteen hours a day insulting the devs an anyone who spends a dime on the game I have issues with.
So far I think the devs are charging money at the right places!
If you want a cool mount, then pay up! If you want a chance at that sweet Nightmare horse mount, then pay up! Want a better companion? Well... either stick to your free one or pay up! Want bigger bags so you don't have to always find a vendor to empty'em? Pay up!
Even the $6 fee to respec seems fair! You should be careful when speccing your character! You should read what each talent ability does and chose it wisely, and if you think you did way too many mistakes, then stop being a cheapskate and pay the $6 fee! Like come on, this game is really well done and you aren't paying $15/month like other MMORPGs! $6 is *nothing*! If you can't afford that, then maybe you should find a better job than MacDonalds or eat a small lunch one day so you can keep the lunch money your dad gave you for a respec!
This game is not expensive to play! Support the developers and buy some stuff every now and then! Running a F2P game is not cheap! It's very expensive! They only do this because they are hoping some people will actually pay so that they can continue allowing F2P players to keep playing too!
The obvious counter-argument is that if all those inexpensive prices add up to more than you would pay in a standard 15 dollar subscription, then what's the point? F2P games need ways of making money, but if the community as a whole finds the manner in which this is done distasteful, then it might leads to the failure of this game. And no one wants that.
I understand that. So if it feels wrong don't do it. I boycott a famous brand by not buying their products. It's very simple. Play without cash shop. A lot of people do it
He is playing without the cash shop. He's also voicing his concerns about it on the forums.
I am boycotting the cash shop. I'm also voicing my concerns and giving constructive criticisms here on the forum, because deep down I actually want to support this game. If I didn't care at all, I'd be long gone by now.
Like someone already said, no beef with people saying they want the prices lowered. It's the mental OMGTISISPAY2WIN ****TY GAME FOKK PWE LOLLORZ STUPEED WHALES PAYING FUR STUFF people that we are fed up with
So, they give us a free game to play and there is still a bunch of complaints about the cash store? When was the last time a game came out without any cash out of pocket from its gamers? Much less a game of this quality? Anything you can buy with real money is obtainable in the game for free with a little thing called playing the game. It may take you longer to get it......but you can do it. All i see are a bunch of gimme gimme and why does it cost so much! There is NO subscription, there are people always on, it looks great, you don't have to search for parties to do the dungeons, I mean come on! So you don't wanna pay $35 for a Honey Badger, then go for the dog, cat or cleric that they give you in game. You don't have enough bag space? Well in the tabletop game you can't even carry that many things without an encumbrance penalty! The things in the Zen store are mostly vanity and cosmetic things. (I have spent money in the Zen Store and I swore I wouldn't, but I had to have a Honey Badger companion...but I didn't need it.) I am a registered DM with Wizards of the Coast. I really think that this game captures a little of that tabletop goodness mixed with MMO style. Much better than the previous D&D MMO. I for one will be playing this game for some time to come and I have recommended it to a few of my weekly adventurers. Now we have one pen and paper day and three online days. IT'S FREE PEOPLE! You gotta expect them to make some kinda money! I swear, you can't even give people anything. see ya on the Sword Coast!
I am boycotting the cash shop. I'm also voicing my concerns and giving constructive criticisms here on the forum, because deep down I actually want to support this game. If I didn't care at all, I'd be long gone by now.
Sorry pal i don't want to offend you but you sounds a little arrogant here... You can't classify your own opinions and say they're constructive, the others players could classify them constructive or not instead.
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bunglermooseMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 7Arc User
edited May 2013
You realize you just made his point for him, right? It is entirely possible for a person to play this game without spending a dime. However, the company wants you spend quite a few of your dimes -- so of course they're going to make certain conveniences available to purchase for real-money -- and you know what? That's perfectly OK. No one is forcing anyone to a) play the game or b) spend their money.
It's one thing to wish that cash items were cheaper; I surely wish brand new automobiles were cheaper, but I don't spend a whole lot of time on a car lot complaining about it.
From what I've seen, people are saying they want to spend money but feel the prices are too high and that certain MMO staples (respecs) are locked away in the cash shop. They aren't "whining and crying or threatening to firebomb cryptic" they are simply voicing their concerns in the hope that PWE makes the prices more reasonable.
Then there's the other end of the spectrum, that not only blindly accepts any and all nickle and diming, but actively defends it and attacks those who voice concerns.
That's not to say there aren't people who don't want to pay for anything and just complain for the sake of complaining, but they seem to be in the minority here.
I have, so has my wife and my daughter, nothing we absolutely have to have to play the game that we can't get with AD, we choose to spend, we are not forced to spend to enjoy the game, if you feel like you are this isn't the type of game for you.
You realize you just made his point for him, right? It is entirely possible for a person to play this game without spending a dime. However, the company wants you spend quite a few of your dimes -- so of course they're going to make certain conveniences available to purchase for real-money -- and you know what? That's perfectly OK. No one is forcing anyone to a) play the game or b) spend their money.
It's one thing to wish that cash items were cheaper; I surely wish brand new automobiles were cheaper, but I don't spend a whole lot of time on a car lot complaining about it.
Oh god that will probably be the next cultural phenomena.....
Umm Bob, why are people in our parking lot yelling?
They're trolls sir, they are complaining because we don't offer more free products and won't greatly reduce the cost of what's available now.
I can agree on both sides. Of course the producers need money to keep the game going and continue to develop it, this is how our economy function. On the other hand, Free to play sometimes also leads to strange things that you have to buy for real cash (I mean, come on, bags could be a free item, or at least something you could buy for Gold or be able to produce through crafting). Although, as it is for now, I dont think that there is much in the shop that you really CANT do without either. As long as I get a healer for free, are able to buy healing pots for gold, im quite happy.
My own complaints right now is actually weapon-wise. Why cant I buy an axe ?
I have, so has my wife and my daughter, nothing we absolutely have to have to play the game that we can't get with AD, we choose to spend, we are not forced to spend to enjoy the game, if you feel like you are this isn't the type of game for you.
The PWE/devs aren't forcing anybody to spend money, is more like a case of coercion ... Yes coercion, because if you can't get 2 million AD to buy a nightmare or another equipment you gonna spend money. And this is slap in players face.
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lothdredMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 4Arc User
If they gave you a free game and then charged $1000 a bag, would you continue not to complain?
Your wunderlust lets you see value for money in things where there is none. The game is free, sure, but when the things you want from the game cost money, that means very little. A free game doesn't implicitly mean a carte blanche for charging whatever you like for things, not if you don't want upset customers.
They aren't giving the game away free out of the bottom of their hearts - they are giving it away to make money on microtransactions. It is not a free game.
Dude...you're a drama queen.
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mutharexMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I can agree on both sides. Of course the producers need money to keep the game going and continue to develop it, this is how our economy function. On the other hand, Free to play sometimes also leads to strange things that you have to buy for real cash (I mean, come on, bags could be a free item, or at least something you could buy for Gold or be able to produce through crafting). Although, as it is for now, I dont think that there is much in the shop that you really CANT do without either. As long as I get a healer for free, are able to buy healing pots for gold, im quite happy.
My own complaints right now is actually weapon-wise. Why cant I buy an axe ?
What class are you? i had an axe on my GF for a few levels and saw some sold for either ingots or AD, can't remember
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lothdredMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 4Arc User
Sorry pal i don't want to offend you but you sounds a little arrogant here... You can't classify your own opinions and say they're constructive, the others players could classify them constructive or not instead.
None taken, I'm writing this primarily for the devs & PWI.
You may classify my posts as qq if you want, I'm done with those arguments.
The PWE/devs aren't forcing anybody to spend money, is more like a case of coercion ... Yes coercion, because if you can't get 2 million AD to buy a nightmare or another equipment you gonna spend money. And this is slap in players face.
OMG you can't be serious?
But...but I just had to spend the kids college fund on those strippers, "They coerced me!!" and they should be liable for tempting me!!!
or
I just had to buy that eightball, the dealer coerced me!!
:rolleyes:
All you are saying is the cash shop kicks so much *** you feel like you have to buy, that isn't PWE problem, that means they are very good marketers.
This game has power over people... achievement unlocked for Cryptic.
But...but I just had to spend the kids college fund on those strippers, "They coerced me!!" and they should be liable for tempting me!!!
or
I just had to buy that eightball, the dealer coerced me!!
:rolleyes:
All you are saying is the cash shop kicks so much *** you feel like you have to buy, that isn't PWE problem, that means they are very good marketers.
This game has power over people... achievement unlocked for Cryptic.
Yes, that's why i mentioned greed in one of my previous replies in this post. People are tempted to have the same items owned by the top players, and if they can't get them after grinding for a long time, they're tempted to buy them, not forced, but tempted (coercion). Btw this isn't my case once i can farm without any urge to get top items soon in my free time
So, they give us a free game to play and there is still a bunch of complaints about the cash store? When was the last time a game came out without any cash out of pocket from its gamers? Much less a game of this quality? Anything you can buy with real money is obtainable in the game for free with a little thing called playing the game. It may take you longer to get it......but you can do it. All i see are a bunch of gimme gimme and why does it cost so much! There is NO subscription, there are people always on, it looks great, you don't have to search for parties to do the dungeons, I mean come on! So you don't wanna pay $35 for a Honey Badger, then go for the dog, cat or cleric that they give you in game. You don't have enough bag space? Well in the tabletop game you can't even carry that many things without an encumbrance penalty! The things in the Zen store are mostly vanity and cosmetic things. (I have spent money in the Zen Store and I swore I wouldn't, but I had to have a Honey Badger companion...but I didn't need it.) I am a registered DM with Wizards of the Coast. I really think that this game captures a little of that tabletop goodness mixed with MMO style. Much better than the previous D&D MMO. I for one will be playing this game for some time to come and I have recommended it to a few of my weekly adventurers. Now we have one pen and paper day and three online days. IT'S FREE PEOPLE! You gotta expect them to make some kinda money! I swear, you can't even give people anything. see ya on the Sword Coast!
They complain because they think gaming companies do not need to make money. All the complaints about some players getting this or that because they paid just amaze me, there is no viable system pay system where players will spend enough on purely cosmetic items. If you cannot beat the game without store bought items then read some guides on how to play your class.
I have only bought 2 extra char slots so far and find this game great without buying anything else.
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mutharexMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
They complain because they think gaming companies do not need to make money. All the complaints about some players getting this or that because they paid just amaze me, there is no viable system pay system where players will spend enough on purely cosmetic items. If you cannot beat the game without those items then read some guides on how to play your class.
yeah, kids have no real life experience, they believe devs have daddies that maintain them while they are coding in the basement....
They project way too much
Comments
Greed. Pure greed. The kid you mentioned should focus on things he likes, and money will come fast. But greed blind people and generate hate. "I want all that my neighbor have, his car, his wife, his kids". Human being are selfish creatures that will not stop until destroy everything.
I don't hate rich people, I hate smug people.
I don't have anything against the people shelling out hundreds of dollars on this game, again, I hate smug people.
My distaste for the cash shop is because it feels too much of a nickle & dime shop to me. That's why I'm voicing my concerns. I love the game, but I hate the shop. I want to spend money on the game, but the businesses model doesn't allow me to (without it feeling morally wrong to me)
I understand that. So if it feels wrong don't do it. I boycott a famous brand by not buying their products. It's very simple. Play without cash shop. A lot of people do it
I am boycotting the cash shop. I'm also voicing my concerns and giving constructive criticisms here on the forum, because deep down I actually want to support this game. If I didn't care at all, I'd be long gone by now.
Their business model are not reasonable instead.
And that understandable Dezman, but I don't think Iv'e seen you hitting the forum insulting people who are spending money, those are the ones I speaking of, I respect people who voice their concerns give constructive non-insulting criticism and offer an alternative suggestion. It's the ones who spend sixteen hours a day insulting the devs an anyone who spends a dime on the game I have issues with.
The obvious counter-argument is that if all those inexpensive prices add up to more than you would pay in a standard 15 dollar subscription, then what's the point? F2P games need ways of making money, but if the community as a whole finds the manner in which this is done distasteful, then it might leads to the failure of this game. And no one wants that.
Well, except maybe DDO players.
He is playing without the cash shop. He's also voicing his concerns about it on the forums.
Nothing wrong with doing either of these things.
Nope nothing wrong, it is the manner in which you do it that makes the difference.
I haven't seen the purple equipment at cash shop yet, but i can be wrong ...
Like someone already said, no beef with people saying they want the prices lowered. It's the mental OMGTISISPAY2WIN ****TY GAME FOKK PWE LOLLORZ STUPEED WHALES PAYING FUR STUFF people that we are fed up with
Get to 60 and you'll see.
Sorry pal i don't want to offend you but you sounds a little arrogant here... You can't classify your own opinions and say they're constructive, the others players could classify them constructive or not instead.
It's one thing to wish that cash items were cheaper; I surely wish brand new automobiles were cheaper, but I don't spend a whole lot of time on a car lot complaining about it.
Trickster Rogue
~Mindflayer~
Then there's the other end of the spectrum, that not only blindly accepts any and all nickle and diming, but actively defends it and attacks those who voice concerns.
That's not to say there aren't people who don't want to pay for anything and just complain for the sake of complaining, but they seem to be in the minority here.
CS issue? Check this thread first! | Reporting exploits: Done Right
I have, so has my wife and my daughter, nothing we absolutely have to have to play the game that we can't get with AD, we choose to spend, we are not forced to spend to enjoy the game, if you feel like you are this isn't the type of game for you.
Oh god that will probably be the next cultural phenomena.....
Umm Bob, why are people in our parking lot yelling?
They're trolls sir, they are complaining because we don't offer more free products and won't greatly reduce the cost of what's available now.
My own complaints right now is actually weapon-wise. Why cant I buy an axe ?
The PWE/devs aren't forcing anybody to spend money, is more like a case of coercion ... Yes coercion, because if you can't get 2 million AD to buy a nightmare or another equipment you gonna spend money. And this is slap in players face.
Dude...you're a drama queen.
What class are you? i had an axe on my GF for a few levels and saw some sold for either ingots or AD, can't remember
You got to level 60 FOR FREE. The "entitlement generation" is pathetic.
He believes that devs survives absorbing light and minerals like plants do... Nothing in this world is entirely for free
None taken, I'm writing this primarily for the devs & PWI.
You may classify my posts as qq if you want, I'm done with those arguments.
OMG you can't be serious?
But...but I just had to spend the kids college fund on those strippers, "They coerced me!!" and they should be liable for tempting me!!!
or
I just had to buy that eightball, the dealer coerced me!!
:rolleyes:
All you are saying is the cash shop kicks so much *** you feel like you have to buy, that isn't PWE problem, that means they are very good marketers.
This game has power over people... achievement unlocked for Cryptic.
Yes, that's why i mentioned greed in one of my previous replies in this post. People are tempted to have the same items owned by the top players, and if they can't get them after grinding for a long time, they're tempted to buy them, not forced, but tempted (coercion). Btw this isn't my case once i can farm without any urge to get top items soon in my free time
They complain because they think gaming companies do not need to make money. All the complaints about some players getting this or that because they paid just amaze me, there is no viable system pay system where players will spend enough on purely cosmetic items. If you cannot beat the game without store bought items then read some guides on how to play your class.
I have only bought 2 extra char slots so far and find this game great without buying anything else.
yeah, kids have no real life experience, they believe devs have daddies that maintain them while they are coding in the basement....
They project way too much