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Friendly fire... yes or no?
Archived Post
Member Posts: 5,050,278 Bounty Hunter
As I just read there is currently no friendly fire in NW. But it looks like it might still be possible to change this. So... let's help them to decide to introduce friendly fire. 
Really I loved my devastating fireballs killing friend and foe alike. I mean I told that dumb Fighter to wait.
But I can also see the problems in an online game. To coordinate a team getting not hit by an AoE attack is much harder than in a PnP environment. On the other hand shouldn't there be a danger so you don't just use your powers without thinking? Shouldn't there be some kind of drawback? Even if a friendly AoE would do only 50% dmg it would be fine for me but if there were no friendly fire at all I think I would miss something. Maybe it would also be a solution to use friendly fire only with certain powers and not all of them.
Anyway... what do you think? Should there be friendly fire? And if yes how should it be implemented?
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Really I loved my devastating fireballs killing friend and foe alike. I mean I told that dumb Fighter to wait.
But I can also see the problems in an online game. To coordinate a team getting not hit by an AoE attack is much harder than in a PnP environment. On the other hand shouldn't there be a danger so you don't just use your powers without thinking? Shouldn't there be some kind of drawback? Even if a friendly AoE would do only 50% dmg it would be fine for me but if there were no friendly fire at all I think I would miss something. Maybe it would also be a solution to use friendly fire only with certain powers and not all of them.Anyway... what do you think? Should there be friendly fire? And if yes how should it be implemented?
Source
OPG: Magic in the older games had an area of effect and anyone within that area of effect usually got hurt as much as the enemy. Will friendly fire be possible with Area of Effect Spells and Objects?
Jack: Currently, no, but it’s interesting because that idea just came up internally!
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It should not be implimented. In a non pvp oriented game, there will be some who will just want to grief. Imagine going a good distance into a quest and then your mage just fireballs everyone (maybe even including himself) to death, or the warrior using a spinning axe attack while standing next to your cleric. This would happen 40000 times a day.
That would be better.
Griefers are definitely a reason not to implement. But by inclusion it could possibly make the game more strategic ... or just make it an unmanageable mess.
It could possibly also alienate certain builds from PUGs (not everyone has 4 mates to team up with). Some other negatives;
Real Time combat makes combat much more fluid, meaning you would be more likely to accidently nuke your companions.
Implementing code to allow you to target ranged effects on nothing would be a nightmare and near impossible to implement, especially if Neverwinter includes for flying creatures. Think of the issues with Teleport in City of Heroes. You either teleported the full distance or teleported to something that blocked your progress. You couldn't pick a spot in between.
For all the added depth it could/may bring to combat, I would opt for a no as I feel the negatives outweigh the positives.
I'm all for tactics, but Friendly Fire just proves to be too much of a hassle. Try doing any sort of PvP in Fallen Earth and you'll see what I mean!
But I agree with most, not as constant.
I believe I'm a good player, but I rarely use higher difficulties in STO, because I have old and cranky computer and I know it may get me frustrated if mouse don't do exactly what I want during the tough battle.
So I vote for switch!
even then id personally rather not see it.
that's a good idea.
Tabletop RPGs usually have some sort of friendly fire mechanic or another, whether they are strongly rooted in tactical positioning like D&D or more based on narrative craziness like Exalted. This works because there is a reasonable expectation of the players working together to avoid <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> each other over. When someone starts being a jackass with their splash effects, there are usually social repercussions, be it relentless noogies, ostracism, or expulsion from the group.
In MMOs, by contrast, the much more fluid assosciation between players would let a griefer interfere with a lot of people before being shut down, if ever. In an MMO, friendly fire is basically open PvP.
I dont see a real problem with having some encounter, or especially daily powers that you have to target a bit more carefully.
These are not 'spammable' like at will powers, so you would have a reasonable chance to target the area powers.
As to griefing. I got the impression combat content is restricted to instanced areas because of the CO-OP nature of the game. If these adventuring areas are anything like in GW you can only bring a small team to such areas, so opportunities for griefing can only come from your own party of five (or whatever ends up being the limit). Easily solved by team leader booting the offending person.
Obviously this should be permanently off in any public area.
On a side note: I'd like to see ability for content creators to create social hub instances that allow larger groups to mingle by flagging them "non-adventuring areas". Obviously the game supports this already for official hub areas.
The best idea;)
A greater reward for a more dangerous instance shall be great
griefing is only a problem in pure MMOGs - if parties go on limited quests where they are exclusive to the area, FF should be an option for area difficulty.
Have a flag on an area was how it worked in NWN1 and if you didn't like it you didn't have to play those mods.
FF and PvP in general would be turned off in community areas and make hunting areas have an option for FF and even PvP.
I would love to have the option to build my areas.
This^ is probably one of the best idea's on this matter I've seen so far.
Personally, I don't like FF because it tends to be problematic in real time games. It's something that's more applicable to the turn based combat used in PnP games, since you have time to think on strategy and RP shouting a warning to other characters before you shoot a Fireball and such. In real time things move too fast for you to type out your warning and take your time moving your cursor to just the right spot to target your spell/power correctly.
Still, some content creators might want to have the option for certain maps, or when making Persistent worlds with a particular flavor. So perhaps the option should be up to the content creator or DM, which I believe is the way it was done in NWN1.
To me part of playing a Mage is playing the tactics. Is having to be the guy in the back being more strategic. When you take it away, all you have is a big cluster in the middle with people slapping down explosions as fast as they can.
Also remember, FF for us, means FF for the monsters too. I enjoy closing in on enemies to keep them from using their area attacks, or atleast making them pay for it when they do.
The only problem I ever found with FF in NWN1/2was trying to keep NPCs from doing dumb things.
I understand how this could easily cause problems with some players, but it would add another level of complexity and thought to the game. I can think of quite a few games i've played that would be a LOT more complicated with the realism of friendly fire, and to me, it would be an exciting option for the players to use.
If its not then I would hope those powers are not available. Occupational hazard of being in an area burst effect from a wizard with an all targets attack. And sometimes in 4e you actually do it to help your allies.
Unfortunately, sometimes the considerations of the medium (imprecise positioning, cat-herding AI, and griefers) sometimes have to take precedence.
I agree that friendly fire is a big part of the 4e but that been said it's way easier to avoid friendly fire when it's on a tabletop grid and turn based in which you have time to think of a way to avoid nuking your allies. But in a real time action video game, which the dev stated it would be, friendly fire will happen way more often and can get quite frustrating for players grouping with someone who doesn't do it intentionally but do it a bit too often.
I can't say if I want friendly fire to be or not, it really depends of the gameplay they are aiming for, which we have unfortunately no information yet =(
Of course friendly fire should be added.
This^
...is why I don't entirely like FF mechanic. In a PnP session where combat is turn based and players can take their sweet time deciding which powers to use and how, with no chance of them clicking on the wrong spot on the screen and such, it is FAR easier to use area effect powers that can have FF effects effectively without hitting your allies than it is in a real time combat game.
But this^ is also something to consider, which is why I'd support a FF mechanic that can be set by the DM or the person creating the maps, etc. That way you can set FF mechanics when applicable, if that's what you want for your game.
this^
since fortunately the quests/areas will be limited it can be an option for difficulty. Its not like players are going to run past us to grab the loot - I think MMOG's have solved that problem a while ago.
In a co-op game it requires a lot more thought on the part of the players. We're not talking about the chaos of Magicka where chain lightning your teammates is part of the fun, nor the PvP that's so essential to the fun of Paranoia.