impossible demogorgon

carbr

Wow!!! this DG demogorgon is unable to make my character with item level 41k not stand there, that's buggy. put this DG in the advanced lists because only those who have more advanced equipment will be able to do it without fail.

and put an item level cap for the epic DGs because there is a character with 5k item level doing castle nevel and it takes too long to do this race.

mentinmindmaker

Currently Demo is very hard because the community does not know the tactics.

Give it a few months until most people figure out what they must do.

Reports from preformed (guild) runs that have strong internal communication and coordination is that it is not too bad.

rockster

From the runs I've done it seems like it's mainly the third phase which is causing most issues, I've been in a few where the first two went fine, but the last one was repeatedly a total s-show. And I really feel it was unnecessary to force everyone to go back to the very start and do it all over again with all progress lost if it wipes. Sort of sadistic. Imagine LoMM if everyone wiped at the worm and found themselves back at the start again.

sgtpostal

while this new demo is a lil bit harder i feel the prob lies with the under geared understat-ed players out there and the fact imo that the portals have way to much health and all the adds hit like mack trucks which if not stat-ed right can severely hurt the chances of a completion (ive ran 15+ all ready an all but 3 were successful... as stated the fails were due to players with incorrect stats and no portal forcus on last phase from anyone lol)

greywynd

I'm possible Demogorgon?

nic1985

This strategy have worked so far in my Alliance group when there are mostly "low" dps.

P1: Split dps evenly among the four portals. One healer on each side and support the tanks when needed.

P2: Most of the time fight close to Demo and on the side of the Gold/Yellow portal where ever it spawn, so that if one person get his line they can turn the line toward Gold/Yellow portal fast.

P3: Top two dps, each take a portal side to close all portals right away. The rest of dps focus on Demo as tanks switches.

*It also help to use debuff/buff artifacts/mounts. If Demo use his large aoes attack and you can't avoid it, turn your back to him to avoid the stun and take minimal damage.

*We have also done a few RTQ with Demo, and it was mostly successful when we use the strategy above.

rockster

So it sounds like Halaster's Blast Scepter would be a viable option as it increases single target damage quite nicely. I would use that, but as a healer I've found that my Eye of Lath is more useful as so many drop down and need reviving and you can just point in the general direction of them from a distance until it lights up and pop it and get them back up again faster.

callumf

nic1985 said:

P3: Top two dps, each take a portal side to close all portals right away. The rest of dps focus on Demo as tanks switches.

This - basically if you dont close the portals in phase 3 you are dead. So you need 2 high dps for that, with a healer going between the two of them.

You also need 4 high dps on DEMO and 2 good tanks and a good healer.

I have run a few succesfully, but only when the DPS have all been 50k or above and know what they are doing.

Even an alliance run with lower levels fails even with understanding and communication.

callumf

Oh and oddly for me this is one time I wouldnt want the thing changed or the portals nerfed etc.

Its nice to have a doable trial that is a challenge thanks Devs

armadeonx

Given the amount of DPS required - I think they should remove the 48k TIL cap and let those over 48k use their full strength.

froger

armadeonx said:

Given the amount of DPS required - I think they should remove the 48k TIL cap and let those over 48k use their full strength.

^^^^ So much this. It kinda feels like getting shortchanged having high ilvl toon. Maybe we'll get a hardcore version where stats are uncapped.

mentinmindmaker

Running Demo only through RTQ, I have not yet won ONE Demo instance.

While people slowly are picking up the tactics, the standard PUG RTQ has too low dps to cope.

callumf

mentinmindmaker said:

Running Demo only through RTQ, I have not yet won ONE Demo instance.

While people slowly are picking up the tactics, the standard PUG RTQ has too low dps to cope.

Yes - quoted for truth, totally agree.

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admiralwarlord

reapermanaus#2689 said:

I just want to say if you are trying to kill the random trial qs well done, Demo is not a 40K Dungeon it is a 60K Dungeon. Yes with exactly the right group and all of their gear at max it can be done but the amount of people that abandon it is massive and fails must be around 90%, people dont play this to fail 90% of the time.

You are partly mistaken. Demo is workable for characters with 45+ and some experience. In PE for example, most callers talk about 50+, as it's farm and time is a factor. But I'll agree with you that Demo is not something to be RTQ about, mainly because most of the characters that run randoms are alt's (mostly poorly equipped).

blargskull

armadeonx said:

Given the amount of DPS required - I think they should remove the 48k TIL cap and let those over 48k use their full strength.

I agree but I think they should drop the item level gates and let me try it with my 25K. I am wagering it isn't that tough in the damage aspect. Just because your character is 40K doesn't mean you can forget to dodge. It is still knock out the purple portals while the tank holds back Demogorgon correct? I am not belittling the players here, I'm just stating all dungeons have strategy about them, if they don't, then there is not much point to running them. If all it takes is 10 Mr. Beefs to walk in the door and your done, what keeps you coming back?

callumf

blargskull said:

armadeonx said:

Given the amount of DPS required - I think they should remove the 48k TIL cap and let those over 48k use their full strength.

I agree but I think they should drop the item level gates and let me try it with my 25K. I am wagering it isn't that tough in the damage aspect. Just because your character is 40K doesn't mean you can forget to dodge. It is still knock out the purple portals while the tank holds back Demogorgon correct? I am not belittling the players here, I'm just stating all dungeons have strategy about them, if they don't, then there is not much point to running them. If all it takes is 10 Mr. Beefs to walk in the door and your done, what keeps you coming back?

To be fair its pretty tough in the damage taken area, very. The attacks are hard to avoid, there is lots of them, and it gets very chaotic if the portals arent closed FAST. Also cant you Q privately at 25k with some mates and try it for yourself? Woudl be interested in your feedback.

rockster

The other day I did what I rarely do, and answered a request in lfg for RTQ group request instead of just pugging it solo. Even though one of the tanks decided to stay at the fire AFK the entire time, we still managed to do it successfully with relative ease, this was because people had the high DPS to do it and people were also organized and knew where to be, as in split-up in certain ways and take care of things. The reason it fails in RTQ is because 1. they often don't have the DPS needed to close the portals fast enough and/or most often 2. people just float to the final boss like hypnotized moths to a flame smashing buttons and ignore the portals altogether. The next time I got Demo again it was a normal pug RTQ thing and once again they just ignored the portals and after I died from all the unnecessary adds everywhere and was at the campfire and half the players had also died I typed "if no-one is going to kill the portal's there's no point". The issue is not if it can be done or not because it can with certain kinds of players, the issue is that it's in the RTQ and too many of the people who queue publicly for the RTQ are just not able to do it, due to being either too under-powered or too clueless, not only they don't know what to do, but also to the point they often don't even read chat and ignore whatever anyone says and are just in their own little world running around hitting things randomly. Even if there are a handful of players in there who know what they're doing, there's still too many others who don't or aren't up to it yet to make it work. That's the nature of a random public queue, you can't control who goes in and the content difficulty needs to cater for everyone for it to work. It's not like the other runs where everyone more or less does the same thing at the same time as a group and can follow what others do, this one is more complex and people have to split up and go different ways and do different things while not watching each other to make it work, it won't work without everyone knowing what they're doing before going in. It needs to be removed from RTQ.

callumf

rockster#6227 said:

The other day I did what I rarely do, and answered a request in lfg for RTQ group request instead of just pugging it solo. Even though one of the tanks decided to stay at the fire AFK the entire time, we still managed to do it successfully with relative ease, this was because people had the high DPS to do it and people were also organized and knew where to be, as in split-up in certain ways and take care of things. The reason it fails in RTQ is because 1. they often don't have the DPS needed to close the portals fast enough and/or most often 2. people just float to the final boss like hypnotized moths to a flame smashing buttons and ignore the portals altogether. The next time I got Demo again it was a normal pug RTQ thing and once again they just ignored the portals and after I died from all the unnecessary adds everywhere and was at the campfire and half the players had also died I typed "if no-one is going to kill the portal's there's no point". The issue is not if it can be done or not because it can with certain kinds of players, the issue is that it's in the RTQ and too many of the people who queue publicly for the RTQ are just not able to do it, due to being either too under-powered or too clueless, not only they don't know what to do, but also to the point they often don't even read chat and ignore whatever anyone says and are just in their own little world running around hitting things randomly. Even if there are a handful of players in there who know what they're doing, there's still too many others who don't or aren't up to it yet to make it work. That's the nature of a random public queue, you can't control who goes in and the content difficulty needs to cater for everyone for it to work. It's not like the other runs where everyone more or less does the same thing at the same time as a group and can follow what others do, this one is more complex and people have to split up and go different ways and do different things while not watching each other to make it work, it won't work without everyone knowing what they're doing before going in. It needs to be removed from RTQ.

I agree 90% - totally much harder than the other RTQs.

BUT I was in a group who finished phase 3 with 1 tank 1 healer and 5 dps from about 50% DEMO health, down to Zero. Now that is the exception, but picking up groups in PE the success rate [for me] is probably up to about 80% now and it can be fun.

I also concede it can be a right royal pain in the backside with some groups [but I said that about FBI and CoDG when they were new also]

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blargskull

callumf#9018 said:

blargskull said:

armadeonx said:

Given the amount of DPS required - I think they should remove the 48k TIL cap and let those over 48k use their full strength.

I agree but I think they should drop the item level gates and let me try it with my 25K. I am wagering it isn't that tough in the damage aspect. Just because your character is 40K doesn't mean you can forget to dodge. It is still knock out the purple portals while the tank holds back Demogorgon correct? I am not belittling the players here, I'm just stating all dungeons have strategy about them, if they don't, then there is not much point to running them. If all it takes is 10 Mr. Beefs to walk in the door and your done, what keeps you coming back?

To be fair its pretty tough in the damage taken area, very. The attacks are hard to avoid, there is lots of them, and it gets very chaotic if the portals arent closed FAST. Also cant you Q privately at 25k with some mates and try it for yourself? Woudl be interested in your feedback.

Sadly the last person I played with has left the building. The guild is in mothballs. I could claim ownership, in fact the owner stated he doesn't have any future plans for it. I am not guild leader material. I am just going to focus on my bard for now. I view this whole 40K gate as a hidden paywall. For anyone to declares the game is "Free to Play" at this point, it once was, I could go anywhere and do anything. Now you are allowed to pay up or grind for years. It seems like 2 steps forward and get knocked backed 3 every module. I am taking some time off to finish up Valhalla first.

rockster

blargskull said:

callumf#9018 said:

blargskull said:

armadeonx said:

Given the amount of DPS required - I think they should remove the 48k TIL cap and let those over 48k use their full strength.

I agree but I think they should drop the item level gates and let me try it with my 25K. I am wagering it isn't that tough in the damage aspect. Just because your character is 40K doesn't mean you can forget to dodge. It is still knock out the purple portals while the tank holds back Demogorgon correct? I am not belittling the players here, I'm just stating all dungeons have strategy about them, if they don't, then there is not much point to running them. If all it takes is 10 Mr. Beefs to walk in the door and your done, what keeps you coming back?

To be fair its pretty tough in the damage taken area, very. The attacks are hard to avoid, there is lots of them, and it gets very chaotic if the portals arent closed FAST. Also cant you Q privately at 25k with some mates and try it for yourself? Woudl be interested in your feedback.

Sadly the last person I played with has left the building. The guild is in mothballs. I could claim ownership, in fact the owner stated he doesn't have any future plans for it. I am not guild leader material. I am just going to focus on my bard for now. I view this whole 40K gate as a hidden paywall. For anyone to declares the game is "Free to Play" at this point, it once was, I could go anywhere and do anything. Now you are allowed to pay up or grind for years. It seems like 2 steps forward and get knocked backed 3 every module. I am taking some time off to finish up Valhalla first.

Claim it. Use it for a proxy bank. Take leadership, then hand leadership over to an alt or two. It's an asset, you may as well use it. And if you want a friendly guild to join on PC mine is nice, send me an ingame mail @rockster#6227

armadeonx

Finding myself running out of unrefined AD (and having spare time) I queued for trials yesterday and got Demo on the first pop.

I inspected everyone and we averaged at around 46k-ish with a couple of DPS at 50k. I was surprised that everyone got in the circle without too much hesitation.

I was less surprised to see the two tanks not relying on each other and despite me (running heals DC) staying on whoever was tanking demo, they didn't swap as they should and I had to pick them up a few times.

Phase 2 was simple enough but it all fell apart on phase 3. No coordination, not enough DPS - we lasted a fair while but eventually started dropping until everyone was out and ppl gave up.

rockster

mmhmm

blargskull

@callumf#9018 Got with some people today and gave what you suggested a try. No can do, Item Level 25K not allowed in no matter what your party looks like, private queue is no different. Must have the golden ticket or piles of zen to enter.

callumf

blargskull said:

@callumf#9018 Got with some people today and gave what you suggested a try. No can do, Item Level 25K not allowed in no matter what your party looks like, private queue is no different. Must have the golden ticket or piles of zen to enter.

Shame would have been interesting to see.

I think a group with Voice Chat and good players could probably finish Demo with an average item level of 40k maybe.

chaderickrax

I think that, when the only way to get to 50k DPS is to spend cash or play for literal years, it's not fair to call people "under-statted." A Random Trial Queue is something you (used to) play to get the full experience of Neverwinter. It's coming of age, and getting to finish the storylines to some of the games biggest campaigns.

These days, it's a place for grizzled veterans who don't remember what it was like to be starting out.

There are trials for veterans. Those trials should been in the RTQ.

nibs

Been playing since last year march, spent no real money in zen store, all my mounts/comps came from jumas or dungeons or give aways, grinded for everything, been handed nothing as Im a quiet player and have no groups at all online, have not been carried through any dungeon ever, more a solo player, still haven't done TOMM.. yet Im level 49kish and can push it to over 50k now if i was lazy but i want to do it right with skill. So to say the only way to get to level 50k is to spend money really just shows how bad a player you are and how lazy and impatient you are.

aslan3775

nibs#8955 said:

Been playing since last year march, spent no real money in zen store, all my mounts/comps came from jumas or dungeons or give aways, grinded for everything, been handed nothing as Im a quiet player and have no groups at all online, have not been carried through any dungeon ever, more a solo player, still haven't done TOMM.. yet Im level 49kish and can push it to over 50k now if i was lazy but i want to do it right with skill. So to say the only way to get to level 50k is to spend money really just shows how bad a player you are and how lazy and impatient you are.

I agree with what you said, except for the last sentence. What you have accomplished is great. IMHO, you would be more accurate to state "So to say the only way to get to level 50K is to spend money isn't true--it might be the easier method to obtain 50K, but not the only way."

blargskull

@nibs#8955 and @aslan3775 if you read my earlier postings I stated this is grind away for years or pay cash. I am not going to slave away my free time for just one game. In addition to Neverwinter and Champions on PC, I play Black Desert, New World, Guild Wars, Minecraft, and recently started to play through Dead Space again. I also currently play on PS4 - Apex Legends, Assassin's Creed: Valhalla, Disgaea, Caravan Stories, Monster Hunter World, Dead by Daylight, GTA 5, and other titles. Neverwinter gets to fight over my time and money with all those other games. If you didn't pay zen to max out your item level, then you spent your time. I have to work, eat, sleep, and then comes entertainment. The only people I know with that kind of time is the retired couple in my building, some home schooled kids, and unemployed adults living with their parents.

I am not saying you reside in the 3rd category either, but if you do, I tip my pointy hat to you.