An insult to healers and tanks

paulamyo#4926
paulamyo#4926 Member Posts: 73 Arc User
This insurgences thing and "charging by killing monsters" while compiting with 10 or more dpss is an insult to healers and tanks.

So I have to wait for HOURS to enter an insurgency with my 27K IL paladin, then when it pops for like 4 minutes, manage to miracously get my percentage 4% up while being once and again stealed kills by lots of dps is a HAMSTER piece of HAMSTER.

I know this is a game that allways was oriented to the dpss, but even for you this is a new milestone of HAMSTER.

Thanks.
«1

Comments

  • hastati96
    hastati96 Member Posts: 481 Arc User
    edited May 2020
    I have exactly the same issue. waiting hours for the encounters to show up and I get 4% as a 27k paladin. I asked other people how much they got and dps classes were around 15-18% (compared to my 4%). This treatment is not fair. At least completing an isurgence could give 1-2%.
    Nero - Palacetamol - Essence of Aggression
  • zimxero#8085
    zimxero#8085 Member Posts: 876 Arc User
    How could it be modified to be more healer/tank friendly?
  • arazith07
    arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,442 Arc User
    I know in preview, tanks tended to get more than dps, as they would just run around and aggro everything. They may have overnerfed, or is a bug that showed up among all the others that randomly showed up with the transfer
  • hastati96
    hastati96 Member Posts: 481 Arc User
    edited May 2020

    How could it be modified to be more healer/tank friendly?

    Insurgencies are up for at least 15 minutes. If the server has maxed the meter Bel is summoned, otherwise insurgencies continue or a simple +X % (maybe 2?) for every completed HE. Only givining out % if you KILL enemies is a huge disadvantage for healer and tanks.

    Futhermore it would be possible to count kills also if you didn't finish the enemy but helped to kill it.
    Nero - Palacetamol - Essence of Aggression
  • paulamyo#4926
    paulamyo#4926 Member Posts: 73 Arc User

    How could it be modified to be more healer/tank friendly?

    Just give the rewards to everybody on encounter completion based on level of success or for attacking like in undermontain, not for KILLING each enemy.

  • paulamyo#4926
    paulamyo#4926 Member Posts: 73 Arc User

    Would it not be better to base the rewards upon their role?

    For the healers the percentage should go up based upon the amount of healing that they do and should also include the reviving of others and the removal of bad status effects.

    For the tanks have their % go up based upon the number kills that happened to enemies that they had aggro on and also give them bonus points for taking aggro off of a dps or healer.

    Basically they get credit for doing their job is that not a thing to be considered in a video game like this?

    That could be good but is probably difficult to code.

    And in insurgencies there is no much need of healing, if any.
  • mythdemeanour
    mythdemeanour Member Posts: 87 Arc User
    edited May 2020
    0% on my tank and I didn't even get credit for the event. Gonna go farm campaigns instead; this event is so fail!!

    Edit to add: On the second event I got 2% and on the third I got to 4% as soon after the event started. It would go no higher after that no matter how many I got the kill on. This must be another bug as my power is over 160k and I can kill things quite well with smite and bane. My rouge and arbiter cleric both got their full 20% in a matter of minutes.
    Post edited by mythdemeanour on
  • k3bab5
    k3bab5 Member Posts: 7 Arc User
    the mechanic is already in the game use the same mechanic used in undermountain for runic encounters for getting coalesced magic and ensure the encounters have a minimum timer for up time
  • finmakin
    finmakin Member Posts: 400 Arc User
    edited May 2020
    Just wait with big hits till DPS classes has almost killed the mobs..
    Do NOT mass pull, thats exactly what DPS classes are waiting for.
    Old fashioned kill stealing..

    hint, DPS always have a huge urge to get in,,, just wat like 10 seconds and then swap to a very low populated map.. better, a empty one, ;).. (old school Tiamat trick)
    Ogguk The Beholder… Justicar Paladin
    Puny Tank

    Guildleader of NWLC Alpha
  • melechest
    melechest Member Posts: 106 Arc User
    I think its based on damage dealt, not mobs killed.
    But yeah, i have the same problem. ive done 11 insurgencies and on 8 of them i got 0% increase. Seriously? And i have to wait another 2 hours just to maybe get another 1-2% if im lucky.

    Cryptic hasnt shown any love for healers and tanks. Now they just push us even more down. Like already being abused by dps in dungeons is not enough.
  • finmakin
    finmakin Member Posts: 400 Arc User
    edited May 2020
    Cryptic should change this to amount of mobs youre fighting, or create seperate instances for Tank and Healers because tanks and healers have respect for eachother, someting I cannot say from the DPS zerg legion..

    Till then I personally close the portal as soon I see it popping, which means a forced Bel phase
    Ogguk The Beholder… Justicar Paladin
    Puny Tank

    Guildleader of NWLC Alpha
  • vattara
    vattara Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 277 Arc User
    "For the healers the percentage should go up based upon the amount of healing that they do and should also include the reviving of others and the removal of bad status effects.

    For the tanks have their % go up based upon the number kills that happened to enemies that they had aggro on and also give them bonus points for taking aggro off of a dps or healer.

    Basically they get credit for doing their job is that not a thing to be considered in a video game like this?"

    This was the same model that was implemented in MOD 6 when IWD dropped. It was frustrating and ridiculous then and don't want to revisit it now, imo. I needed 4 runs to get 20% on my Cleric (arbiter) and that was deliberate moving to a low population instance and trying to work with the solo and sole dps mechanic. It wasn't enjoyable and isn't enjoyable what a game should be?
  • finmakin
    finmakin Member Posts: 400 Arc User
    vattara said:

    "For the healers the percentage should go up based upon the amount of healing that they do and should also include the reviving of others and the removal of bad status effects.

    For the tanks have their % go up based upon the number kills that happened to enemies that they had aggro on and also give them bonus points for taking aggro off of a dps or healer.

    Basically they get credit for doing their job is that not a thing to be considered in a video game like this?"

    This was the same model that was implemented in MOD 6 when IWD dropped. It was frustrating and ridiculous then and don't want to revisit it now, imo. I needed 4 runs to get 20% on my Cleric (arbiter) and that was deliberate moving to a low population instance and trying to work with the solo and sole dps mechanic. It wasn't enjoyable and isn't enjoyable what a game should be?

    Be glad you made 20%, im sitting here on a whopping 7% (from the 100% I need to get that quest done)...
    The 7% i have now is standing since Thursday...

    Thank you Cryptic and the DPS zerg legion

    Ogguk The Beholder… Justicar Paladin
    Puny Tank

    Guildleader of NWLC Alpha
  • vattara
    vattara Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 277 Arc User
    I hear you @finamakin. I would never consider playing a devout cleric healing high Ilevel players who don't need ANY healing to receive a %charge.
  • autumnwitch
    autumnwitch Member Posts: 1,018 Arc User
    edited May 2020
    On one hand they keep going on and on about how they want to increase the number of healers and tanks roles but then turn around and do stuff like this.

    The issue is the people making these decisions have a DPS state of mind/perception and they just don't stop and think how this will affect all players. This team just never thinks about what's beyond or the next step. There is a disconnect of decision making that comes across as haphazard.

    Every time they do anything to change the game they need to have a process/flow that examines how new events/things touch all players. If we do "X" what does this mean for new players, long time players, DPS, Tanks, Healers, solo and group dynamics. There has been very few examples since MOD 16 with new events that have taken this mindset.

    I understand that all events/changes can't be catered to all players groups, nor probably should they. The problem now is certain groups (DPS and Long time players) have a very lopsided advantage. Even events that require healers specifically, for example, also benefit DPS players just as much, if not more. There simply isn't anything that caters to healers/tanks that balance things out.

    Boudica's Sisters - A Guild For Introverts
  • greywynd
    greywynd Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 6,458 Arc User
    finmakin said:



    Be glad you made 20%, im sitting here on a whopping 7% (from the 100% I need to get that quest done)...
    The 7% i have now is standing since Thursday...

    Thank you Cryptic and the DPS zerg legion

    And it is capped at 20%/day.
    I'm not looking for forgiveness, and I'm way past asking permission. Earth just lost her best defender, so we're here to fight. And if you want to stand in our way, we'll fight you too.
  • karvare
    karvare Member Posts: 247 Arc User
    It seems that with time things are going a little better. My first time I got 3% on my 27k paladin tank, then second time people worked mobs while allowing me to work my own. I ended that one with 17%, and on the third I got my last 3%. After that I just spammed my heal on those that were fighting and avoided attacking altogether. Also helps if the DPS let the insurgences continue without closing the portal. That allows more mobs to spawn.
  • plasticbat
    plasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 10,457 Arc User
    I play 6 characters. When one gets 20%, I stop attacking and leave so that I can send the next toon going in. There is no point to stay after getting 20% of the day. The next toon can get the HE reward.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • finmakin
    finmakin Member Posts: 400 Arc User
    edited May 2020
    karvare said:

    It seems that with time things are going a little better. My first time I got 3% on my 27k paladin tank, then second time people worked mobs while allowing me to work my own. I ended that one with 17%, and on the third I got my last 3%. After that I just spammed my heal on those that were fighting and avoided attacking altogether. Also helps if the DPS let the insurgences continue without closing the portal. That allows more mobs to spawn.

    That was my plan too, if only DPS let the tanks and healers do their fights on their own..
    We already got screwed enough by this..
    Cryptic team should stop with their common DPS mindset.

    Ogguk The Beholder… Justicar Paladin
    Puny Tank

    Guildleader of NWLC Alpha
  • finmakin
    finmakin Member Posts: 400 Arc User
    If only one of the Devs could react on this topic to clear things up with this mess
    Ogguk The Beholder… Justicar Paladin
    Puny Tank

    Guildleader of NWLC Alpha
  • paulamyo#4926
    paulamyo#4926 Member Posts: 73 Arc User
    finmakin said:



    That was my plan too, if only DPS let the tanks and healers do their fights on their own..
    We already got screwed enough by this..
    Cryptic team should stop with their common DPS mindset.

    You can´t count on the DPSs to stop stealing kills. Most of them porbably aren´t aware that they are making it impossible for you to progress, they are just minding their own business.

    Unless you manage to get into a low populated instance at a low connection hour or you mount a raid with your guild to let the supports some space, you will be overwhelmed by DPSs. It doesn´t really matter if 2 of the 10 or more DPSs are aware of your strugle and let you alone if the other 8 or more just zerg through the mobs.

    Its a design failure and must be sorted out by devs.
  • regenerde
    regenerde Member Posts: 2,993 Arc User
    edited May 2020

    How could it be modified to be more healer/tank friendly?

    Well, it could be really simple, as long as a player tanks/heals/fights with others inside this thingy to the end, he'll get 20% when it's done. I mean, why even pitch player against player with something like this, when the main goal of the game is working together to kill the big bad?

    I managed to get 3% with one run, and it was just pure chaos inside... next time i'll just follow the general example of "playstyle" and attack anything that comes into reach of my sword and shield.

    Anyway, i'm just wondering why they think they have to turn everything into some kind of pissing contest.
    Post edited by regenerde on
    I do believe in killing the messenger...
    Want to know why?
    Because it sends a message!
  • lantern22
    lantern22 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,110 Arc User
    yeah, it been put together pretty badly

    I'll just wait until the bash everything DPS have moved on, or they patch it so its worth spending time on, or patch in the rod
  • polaris1986
    polaris1986 Member Posts: 320 Arc User
    Come on, you all have a DPS paragons.
    Also you can choose heroic where no one else farming. and mobs will be easy. Also you don't need a party - then your progress will going much faster.
    "sometimes the world doesn't need another hero, sometimes what it needs is a monster"

  • paulamyo#4926
    paulamyo#4926 Member Posts: 73 Arc User

    Come on, you all have a DPS paragons.
    Also you can choose heroic where no one else farming. and mobs will be easy. Also you don't need a party - then your progress will going much faster.

    wow.

    Not everybody have dps paragon developed enough for compiting with 10 other people in DPS. Many people have healers only for the healer paragon because they have another better DPS.

    And paladins don´t have a dps paragon.

    Many many people is saying that they are strugling with this. They are saying here in the forum, there are at least 3 posts about this. They are taling about it in zone chat in protector and in vallenhas. In my alliance many people is very upset with this.

    Just because YOU can do it does not mean is fair for everybody. I´m not saying all chars have to gain % at the same speen, but many people are saying they are gaining 0% or 1% each 2 hours, and thats not fair.