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Shared hp augments

tankready#0772 tankready
tankready#0772
 Member Posts: 82 Arc User
in PvE Discussion
Can us tanks please have shared hp from our deffence slot right now empowered runes stones dont work

If you cant fix it can you remove power share from augments and see how dps like not having power share thanks
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Comments

  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,405 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    HP of companion is not transferred to the character since the introduction of augment many years ago (before the existence of bonding runestone). HP was transferred in a short period of time and that was a bug. It is now fixed.
    There are other stat that are not transferred too except they are not 'common'.
    Non-augment companion has about 24K HP without any runestone. That was not transferred. The rest of its basic stat were.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • tankready#0772 tankready
    tankready#0772
         Member Posts: 82 Arc User
    correct but mod 15 was raidants hp share new mod we should be able to use empowered for hps share i ranked up 6 mine to 13s beacuse i wanted hp transfer to replace my raidants from mod 15 you know
  • greywyndgreywynd Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 7,152 Arc User
    Why? Aren't the tanks getting Def/Deflect/Awareness/Crit Avoid?
    I'm not looking for forgiveness, and I'm way past asking permission. Earth just lost her best defender, so we're here to fight. And if you want to stand in our way, we'll fight you too.
  • wintersmokewintersmoke Member Posts: 1,641 Arc User
    greywynd said:

    Why? Aren't the tanks getting Def/Deflect/Awareness/Crit Avoid?

    Yes, they do. However, they receive no benefit at all from Empowered runestones. So, as the OP pointed out, why not remove the Power from being transferred thru the Augment pets as well?
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,405 Arc User
    Well, the tooltip of empowered runestone already states HP does not apply.
    Like it or not, Cryptic considers this is WAI.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • ecrana#2080 ecrana
    ecrana#2080
         Member Posts: 1,654 Arc User
    As someone that runs every class, and reads the descriptions on runestones, I've never had an issue with the HP not sharing especially when it's been a nonshareable stats for years when used with bondings/comp setups.

    Empowereds still have value for tanks that need power so to say they have no value because they don't give HP is false.

    I'll gladly take the HP but when the argument is that the stones don't "work" that is a weak point to stand on. They give the stats they say they will.

  • tankready#0772 tankready
    tankready#0772
         Member Posts: 82 Arc User
    > @ecrana#2080 said:
    > As someone that runs every class, and reads the descriptions on runestones, I've never had an issue with the HP not sharing especially when it's been a nonshareable stats for years when used with bondings/comp setups.
    >
    > Empowereds still have value for tanks that need power so to say they have no value because they don't give HP is false.
    >
    > I'll gladly take the HP but when the argument is that the stones don't "work" that is a weak point to stand on. They give the stats they say they will.

    Im just fighting for equal rights its not fair dps get power share while tanks suffer hp from emopwered you are initialed to your own opinion im just talking about equal rights is all
  • demenoss#9306 demenoss
    demenoss#9306
         Member Posts: 205 Arc User
    As for removing power share from DPS, I play both DPS and Tank.. I say NO - Leave it.

    As for HP sharing for Tanks - TWO SWORDS UP! :)

    Good Journey.
    Guild: Noble Misfits
    Silky Pan'teeze: Drow Wizard --- Madres de Nasae: Half-elf Rouge
    Kepler: Human Paladin --- Demenoss: Dragonborn Barbarian
    Divine Pan'teeze: Drow Cleric --- Nikki Sharparrow: Human Ranger
  • autumnwitchautumnwitch Member Posts: 1,141 Arc User
    It does seem odd that DPS peeps get arguably their most important stat from runes yet Tanks can not get their arguably most important stat from runes.

    Especially considering post MOD-16 was supposed to be all about class balance.

    Boudica's Sisters - A Guild For Introverts
  • greywyndgreywynd Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 7,152 Arc User
    The tanks' more important stat is the healer that makes sure they stay on their feet.
    I'm not looking for forgiveness, and I'm way past asking permission. Earth just lost her best defender, so we're here to fight. And if you want to stand in our way, we'll fight you too.
  • rikitakirikitaki Member Posts: 926 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    I might be mistaken, but companion HP was never shared through bondings - and that was what made augment companions desirable for tanks. (as augment effect transferred even some HP - at the cost of inability to trigger bondings)

    The question is: what now - when every companion utilize bondings?
    I would vote for augment effect to transfer HP only (=no additional stats over bondings). That would make them more useful for tanks - while other classes might finally get motivated to use something else than augment.
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,405 Arc User
    rikitaki said:

    I might be mistaken, but companion HP was never shared through bondings - and that was what made augment companions desirable for tanks. (as augment effect transferred even some HP - at the cost of inability to trigger bondings)

    The question is: what now - when every companion utilize bondings?
    I would vote for augment effect to transfer HP only (=no additional stats over bondings). That would make them more useful for tanks - while other classes might finally get motivated to use something else than augment.

    If the period that has the bug is taken out,

    Companion HP was never shared through bonding.
    Augment basic HP was shared and is shared through augment.
    Augment equipment HP (from enchantment and regular gear in the past to companion gear and runestone now) was never shared. The golden rule in the past (before the "recent" companion gear change) was "do not put radiant to the defense slot for the gear used by companion".

    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • rikitakirikitaki Member Posts: 926 Arc User
    plasticbat said:


    If the period that has the bug is taken out,...

    In that case the period of the so called bug might be the time when choosing between augment and non-augment companions had the most profound base.

    Look, I do not want to argue what was when, I just wanted to point out that there is an easy way out of the "bullet pup for everyone" situation that we have now. Away from "augments are the only reasonable choice". And I am saying it as a person that used augments when the trend was a de-buff bonded companion...
  • wilbur626wilbur626 Member Posts: 1,019 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    I've been playing a tank since forever, and simply can't understand why ppl are whining about this "issue". Gear, enchants, insignia, boons and companions that grant +HP is more than enough for any content in the game.
    Elite Whaleboy
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,405 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    The max HP came from 6 top empowered runstone is about 30K.
    Augment itself provides 24+K HP from its base HP.
    Non-augment gives 0 HP.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • mordekai#1901 mordekai
    mordekai#1901
         Member Posts: 1,598 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    IF tanks could get more HP, and I agree that for someone playing a well built Tank main with all the bells and whistles, and a friendly Healer who knows their game, it's not necessarily needed, but there's another way of looking at this..

    Coming at it from a different angle, for all those second tier alts it might make them more efficient and open up more Tank players for group queues. Which might just shorten Random Queue waiting times for everyone.

    Anecdotally...
    I run a Pally, and for a while back when my Rogue was getting mugged down a back alley by the "Class Balance" of Mod 15 (I still don't know why that mess happened given everyone at Cryptic must have known what was coming in Mod 16... so just... WHY???????) that Pally became my de facto "Main" for a while.
    And by Jimminy that Pally could Tank!

    Since Mod 16, however, my Rogue has come back into play and I've not been able to devote as much in terms of time and resources to keeping that Paladin as... statistically optimised... as I'd like. Meaning that it's nowhere NEAR being stat ready for LOMM and even TOMM is a struggle.
    Playing that alt Pally as a Healer, however, is nowhere near as debilitating to the party, and she is a pretty darned effective Healer with a bit of DPS back-up.

    I'm just saying, that with a chunk of extra Hit Points I might not be as BiS as most people wanting to run end game queues demand, but it would make alting a Tank (particularly in PUG play) a sight easier.

    Not saying this topic is the answer to that specific issue, but... it's a thought.
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,405 Arc User
    mordekai#1901 said:


    Since Mod 16, however, my Rogue has come back into play and I've not been able to devote as much in terms of time and resources to keeping that Paladin as... statistically optimised... as I'd like. Meaning that it's nowhere NEAR being stat ready for LOMM and even TOMM is a struggle.

    Assuming your Paladin is not having the top stuff. It means your empowered runestone would not be top rank neither.
    With that in mind, how much HP difference are we talking about? +20K HP and losing some other defense stat?
    With 300K to 450K HP tank these days, does that extra 20K HP make or break thing?
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • ecrana#2080 ecrana
    ecrana#2080
         Member Posts: 1,654 Arc User
    This is all moot as noworries said in the systems AMA yesterday:

    "The tooltip on that runestone says that it doesn't give hitpoint to augment companions. That is as intended and there are no plans to change that."
  • wilbur626wilbur626 Member Posts: 1,019 Arc User
    > @dread4moor said:
    > Took views the OPs post as a request for a reasonable change, not a report of a bug nor "not WAI".
    >
    > If you compare the relative benefit gained from empowered runestones, Tanks get shortchanged.
    > That's a fact. With extra defense slots, Tanks get less benefit than DPS.
    > HP are tanks single most important stat.
    > Above Defense, Crit Avoidance, Incoming Healing and (LOL) Deflect.
    >
    > Nerf empowered for DPS? Nah.
    > Allow Tanks to benefit from empowered (in their MOST important stat: HP)...
    > Took says "Yes, please".

    I have a crazy idea; don't use gear with defensive slots if you don't need the stats you can get from defensive runestones 😂
    Elite Whaleboy
  • wintersmokewintersmoke Member Posts: 1,641 Arc User
    plasticbat said:

    The max HP came from 6 top empowered runstone is about 30K.
    Augment itself provides 24+K HP from its base HP.
    Non-augment gives 0 HP.

    Now, replace HP with Power & see if you still think that situation is working as intended...
  • plasticbatplasticbat Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 12,405 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    wintersmoke said:

    plasticbat said:

    The max HP came from 6 top empowered runstone is about 30K.
    Augment itself provides 24+K HP from its base HP.
    Non-augment gives 0 HP.

    Now, replace HP with Power & see if you still think that situation is working as intended...
    HP is and was special and has been treated special. Power is just another stat.
    If I have 300K Power, the 30K power does not really matter to me.
    What I think does not matter and also moot. What Cryptic thinks and decided do.
    *** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
  • tankready#0772 tankready
    tankready#0772
         Member Posts: 82 Arc User
    i'm just saying for 1 month remove power share stats and see forums blow up yes there is like 2 or 3 tanks left in this game i am one those tanks i think empowered runes stone should replace our mod 15 radiant's my build relys on this fix until then i can not slot anything in my defence slots beacuse im caped. id like to hear what chris as to say if he reads this fourm he is a fellow tank as well :D
  • tankready#0772 tankready
    tankready#0772
         Member Posts: 82 Arc User
    in mod 15 i used fishbowl for hp share that it sates in the augment enchanted tab i used brozwood rings 3x double deffence slots i was running 6 raidants 14s and now im stuck with nothing since empowered runes stones dont work even thos then enchanted power from fishbowl states shared hp so idk how someone will from dev team can fix this
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  • ecrana#2080 ecrana
    ecrana#2080
         Member Posts: 1,654 Arc User
    tankready#0772 said:

    id like to hear what chris as to say if he reads this fourm he is a fellow tank as well :D

    I have a feeling Chris would parrot the line given in the AMA...
    "The tooltip on that runestone says that it doesn't give hitpoint to augment companions. That is as intended and there are no plans to change that."

    Why are we comparing things to M15? This isn't M15. The systems changed. I run tank. I adjusted. It's really that simple.

    You can sit there talking about well let's take away power from DPS and see the uproar.

    How about let's take away the ability to hit 100% crit chance? Oh yeah they did that and DPS adjusted. And they had all those pesky enchants that gave crit now going to waste.

    And why not stop thinking "i'm capped and can't put anything in my defense slots" and instead start seeing the pattern and saying "in another mod or two i may need to add more defensive stats to my comp gear since they keep upping caps"?
  • dread4moordread4moor Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,154 Arc User
    mordekai#1901 said:



    Coming at it from a different angle, for all those second tier alts it might make them more efficient and open up more Tank players for group queues. Which might just shorten Random Queue waiting times for everyone.

    This. Right here.
    Took's OP has ~660k HP. Not the highest, but Took isn't desperate for more.
    No, this will benefit new tanks and alts tanks the most.

    By allowing empowered to work in defense slots you give a HP boost to low geared tanks.
    They will Q for more content.
    That will reduce Q times for everyone.

    Why would any player be against that?
    More tanks and sturdier tanks.
    A win for everyone.
    JrUzbQw.jpg?1
    I am Took.
    "Full plate and packing steel" in NW since 2013.
  • rickcase276rickcase276 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,404 Arc User
    Only issue I can see with it is the fact that if you give the hp back from runestones, which I am not opposed to, would it basically make healers not needed again? Because not only tanks would get the HP but so would DPS, and more HP for toons most times equals less use for healers.
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