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Increase death penalty please [FEEDBACK]
dolrey
Member Posts: 741 Arc User
Hello 
After previous big patch a lot of technical issues were fixed. Overall now game by itself is very good and we appreciate this. But there still is one thing in players behavior which make dungeons much less interesting. Most part of players is used to think that they are like Rambo should rush forward ahead of their teammates to have as much damage indicator in menu as possible. Needless to say that a lot of players prefer to play content if not as role player but at least not rush like mad thru all dungeons. These speed runners just don't listen players who want to enjoy content. So then developers should make some actions to protect players who want to play normally and enjoy dungeons and stories (because by itself dungeons and stories are very good if not taking into account behaviour of speed runners).
And here are some ideas how to stop this:
1) Delete menu where we can see damage dealt or healing or damage taket etc. It is supposed to give more info to us to improve gameplay. But in practice players use it only to compare "whos sword is bigger" you know. So, no cherry on the cake no reason to rush forward.
2) Greatly increase price of 80 lvl medical kits (to about 6-8k astral diamonds) and delete immune to injuries from vip. Instead for vip add some free bound to character medical kits in daily rewards (about 2-4 per day). After this every Rambo will have to think twice before rushing forward because death penalty will be much higher.
So, these two relatively easy changes can improve behavior of some players and add some risk to epic dungeons finally preventing speed runners. Dungeons and content by itself are very good after latest fixes. @nitocris83 could you please send this feedback to developers team to they make the final touch in fixing PvE.
Thank you.
Ps: if somebody still would like to complete dungeons as fast as possible they still will be able to do so with their friends. How to say it well.. Just culture of dungeon playing will be much better what will improve user's perception of the game.
____
After previous big patch a lot of technical issues were fixed. Overall now game by itself is very good and we appreciate this. But there still is one thing in players behavior which make dungeons much less interesting. Most part of players is used to think that they are like Rambo should rush forward ahead of their teammates to have as much damage indicator in menu as possible. Needless to say that a lot of players prefer to play content if not as role player but at least not rush like mad thru all dungeons. These speed runners just don't listen players who want to enjoy content. So then developers should make some actions to protect players who want to play normally and enjoy dungeons and stories (because by itself dungeons and stories are very good if not taking into account behaviour of speed runners).
And here are some ideas how to stop this:
1) Delete menu where we can see damage dealt or healing or damage taket etc. It is supposed to give more info to us to improve gameplay. But in practice players use it only to compare "whos sword is bigger" you know. So, no cherry on the cake no reason to rush forward.
2) Greatly increase price of 80 lvl medical kits (to about 6-8k astral diamonds) and delete immune to injuries from vip. Instead for vip add some free bound to character medical kits in daily rewards (about 2-4 per day). After this every Rambo will have to think twice before rushing forward because death penalty will be much higher.
So, these two relatively easy changes can improve behavior of some players and add some risk to epic dungeons finally preventing speed runners. Dungeons and content by itself are very good after latest fixes. @nitocris83 could you please send this feedback to developers team to they make the final touch in fixing PvE.
Thank you.
Ps: if somebody still would like to complete dungeons as fast as possible they still will be able to do so with their friends. How to say it well.. Just culture of dungeon playing will be much better what will improve user's perception of the game.
____
We have game without death penalty. At all..
Isn't it strange for you?
Even when little child play with his cubics he can lose because he have to make a picture of the cubes or insert them into the hole of the desired shape. Neverwinter now is even easier than this because in NWO you can't lose even when your character die. I am not want to watch all the cutscenes or sit in dungeons for hours. I just want to play something more smarter and harder than at least child's cubics.
What about "1000 times". Do you know how many chess games had played grandmaster? And he don't want to speed run it. He don't want to listen how cool good strong the best he is from npcs. He don't want to get best skins or stats for his figures. He play chess because he have to think about every his step. Just because it is interesting.
Neverwinter has very high potential. Personally I want Neverwinter to become something like this. Good game with smart combat.
Isn't it strange for you?
Even when little child play with his cubics he can lose because he have to make a picture of the cubes or insert them into the hole of the desired shape. Neverwinter now is even easier than this because in NWO you can't lose even when your character die. I am not want to watch all the cutscenes or sit in dungeons for hours. I just want to play something more smarter and harder than at least child's cubics.
What about "1000 times". Do you know how many chess games had played grandmaster? And he don't want to speed run it. He don't want to listen how cool good strong the best he is from npcs. He don't want to get best skins or stats for his figures. He play chess because he have to think about every his step. Just because it is interesting.
Neverwinter has very high potential. Personally I want Neverwinter to become something like this. Good game with smart combat.
Post edited by dolrey on
9
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
1) Individual skill. Skill are something subjective and is difficult to project into ones progression as different individual has different level of skill and they don't always tend to be in tip top condition.
2) Luck. Although its influence is not big but it does have some effect on the number in the chart. For example FBI druffi's red arrow keeps popping on your head or some random stun keep stunning u.
3) Bad behaviour from other player. Except if u are doing premade and your teammates are not a complete HAMSTER, you will find things like not raising u when your on the ground or some CW repel your mob away from your IBS or daunting light etc.
4) Final blow. Even the mob has 1hp left, your 300k final blow are still gonna add in the chart.
In my opinion, these chart are misleading and encourage bad behaviour. If u want to gauge your true progression, ACT might be more suitable, well except your are platform user, then the chart are your only way.
And your intro @dolrey really made me laugh,
https://forum.arcgames.com/neverwinter/discussion/1249301/quartermasters-enchant-not-upgrading-loot-table-quality
considering that the latest patches broke QM and probably other enchantments, you should really read through
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter#/categories/bug-reports-pc
before you come up with suggestions like these.
Not to mention that companions are still one burning hot fudged up mess since they released Undermountain, and we haven't heard anything official beside the usual "we're looking into it." line.
And unless there's another huge patch with bug fixes ready to go with the release of Undermountain on consoles, the console forums will be on fire next week...
Besides, looking at the last patch, it allready feels like they're working on the next module and we might only get small patches with minor fixes until that one gets released.
I can understand your frustration but
when you did the same dungeon 1000 times, watching all the cutscenes, exploring all corners, there is nothing wrong un do It fast. It can be fun also to improve yourself.
If you dont like It, form your patient group and go private. Keep in pace the other players
Caturday Survivor
Elemental Evil Survivor
Undermontain Survivor
Mod20 Combat rework Survivor
Mod22 Refinement rework Survivor
And hope your opponent doesn't mind that you're taking a few hours to ponder every. single. move...
> Instead of calling devs to make changes because you dont like how people plays, and suggesting other players to play in private queue with friends to not disturb you, why not you take your Friends to private queue and stay un a dungeon for hours?
>
>
>
> I can understand your frustration but
>
> when you did the same dungeon 1000 times, watching all the cutscenes, exploring all corners, there is nothing wrong un do It fast. It can be fun also to improve yourself.
>
>
>
> If you dont like It, form your patient group and go private. Keep in pace the other players
>
> We have game without death penalty. At all..
> Isn't it strange for you?
>
> Even when little child play with his cubics he can lose because he have to make a picture of the cubes or insert them into the hole of the desired shape. Neverwinter now is even easier than this because in NWO you can't lose even when your character die. I am not want to watch all the cutscenes or sit in dungeons for hours. I just want to play something more smarter and harder than at least child's cubics.
>
> What about "1000 times". Do you know how many chess games had played grandmaster? And he don't want to speed run it. He don't want to listen how cool good strong the best he is from npcs. He don't want to get best skins or stats for his figures. He play chess because he have to think about every his step. Just because it is interesting.
>
> Neverwinter has very high potential. Personally I want Neverwinter to become something like this. Good game with smart combat.
The solution is to make things harder like old CN days when if dps went solo to ads died in 0.1 secs. Not what you are proposing.
The Game is easy. Yes. What you are suggesting doesnt fix anything just make things worse.
Caturday Survivor
Elemental Evil Survivor
Undermontain Survivor
Mod20 Combat rework Survivor
Mod22 Refinement rework Survivor
However, I don't feel that death should have more severe penalties, but instead maybe staying alive should have more rewards?
Maybe a bonus for no deaths, but keep it individual, as to not encourage kicking of players slightly prone to death?
Comparing this game to chess is not valid. In chess, you may be up against a formidable opponent and have to take time to plan your moves. This game is mostly about smashing mobs.
I don't care about people running ahead. Just they better not HAMSTER die. I won't rez them no matter how furious they ping. The walk of shame from the last campfire is enough of a death penalty for me.
So, for your daily AD you just want to complete it as fast as you can (even if that means dying many times, who cares, fast AD is all that matters).
For comparison: DDO has hundreds of dungeons. It's fun to play new dungeons when nobody knows what to do, it feels like actual dungeons crawling. It's especially fun to play Rogue, because traps are deadly there and nobody knows possible trap locations yet. So, when exploring a new dungeon on harder difficulty you definitely want to have trapper, CC and healer in your party.
NWO is a completely different game, because there are no traps and no CC (sadly).
NWO is more f2p friendly and because of that it has a lot more players.
Since NWO has so many players, game designers don't really care about many things (U16 is a proof of that).
As for stopping zergers (the ones who run ahead of party) DDO has a beautiful mechanics called Dungeon Alert, red alert is the worst, because you almost can't move and mobs always crit etc. (the whole party is affected, you need to start killing mobs or wait some time in order to reduce alert lvl). Btw, in DDO you can't just respawn. Once you die, you die (there an item that lets you self-resurrect once, but it takes months to farm that item, otherwise only party members can rez you, or you have to pay DDO points for that, similar to Zen points). There are some companions (hirelings in DDO) that can rez you too, but only if he is alive and if he is not interrupted (but most likely he is dead too, especially during red alert).
I recommended this multiple times to the people at Cryptic and they never listen. Back when we had a Foundry (a huge library of player made dungeons) they could have shuffled them like a deck of cards. Then draw 3 off the top for the players doing RQ, they vote on which one of the three they want to do. With thousands of stories there would be little chance that any player in your PUG would know the dungeon layout. After completion, the dungeon is returned to the bottom of the deck. There were rules the Foundry had to be 15 minutes to qualify, but the ones placed into the RQ could have been hand picked by the developers to ensure no possible exploits existed.
But that idea and possibility burned down in the great Foundry fire of April 11th.
@dolrey This is why I asked you if you were trolling us;
Now about this hypothetical "death penalty", I don't see how you can increase it for dungeons alone. With the game's limitations, this means the new players dying in PvE on any map will be suffering the same penalty. If you jump into the fray injured, after 8 injuries you can still fight but you are not fighting your best. Cryptic has never been one to issue a serious "death penalty" in any of their games. I play Champions, I lose stars. If you read the fine print about it; stars are boosts and no stars means you are at 100%. The star packs are nothing but a boost, die as much or as little as you like. Star Trek (I have not played for a long time) uses 3 injuries; minor, major, and critical. None of these do much and the critical was something like a 10% debuff I seem to recall.
In contrast to the Cryptic model, another game I play issues 15% each time I die up to 4 times stopping at 60% total penalty. This can be removed in a town or using buffs from inventory. Cryptic will never issue this kind of difficulty, it is not in the nature of their games. I am sorry, but you might as well tell the majority of the players, you want them play better or else. I understand people don't want to be one shot or team wiped in a dungeon from scaling. The dungeons are not what they use to be prior to mod 6, that was about 4 years ago. Dungeons are not a thing and Foundry is gone, there is still some things I find entertaining in the game, but I am playing less often now.
The title of this thread stuck me as, "Oh someone is trying to provoke the wrath of the A typical Cryptic gamer.". You can place all the good or bad advice you like into the forums, because the developers don't care to take any advice at all. Some will listen, but they don't heed good advice. All threads like this do, is start players screaming at each other, and a moderator has to shut them down. For now I recommend you invest in a game called Dark Souls, I don't play it, but I hear it is very challenging.
The day Devs removes immune to injuries from Vip, I'll stop buying it.
And the rest:
I'm guessing you just have. . . . "a little sword", you know.