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With Deeds being removed how are new players able to unlock chat or know what to do to unlock chat?

thevampinatorthevampinator Posts: 300Member Arc User
edited April 23 in General Discussion (PC)
Unles they changed it so you just have to do the first tutorial campaign. If they keep it like it is and do this. It would really hinder new players. I don't see why deeds were removed at all. And also unable to switch roles to others that are needed in the queue is something that is stupid. Not that I do change roles or use the switch tabs anyways. But yeah that seems a little extreme I do hope they can be switched within the queue itself. Also silver mobs shouldn't be removed in ig keep them there! Otherwise the patch notes seem alright. But yeah my concern is new players will be hindered by these changes unless they changed how things are unlocked like the chat and the ah and everything else.
Also restore the character portraits that is one thing I really don't like them being removed completely make them optional in the future I liked them. I feel something is missing without them there. Plus since you see the backside of your character most of the time its nice to see the face. I do hope this is rethought out and they will be restored one day. Thoughts people?

Comments

  • kreatyvekreatyve Posts: 9,937Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Community Moderator
    I'm pretty sure it's still the same to unlock chat.
    My opinions are my own. I do not work for PWE or Cryptic. - Forum Rules - Protector's Enclave Discord - I play on Xbox
    Any of my comments not posted in orange are based on my own personal opinion and not official.
    Any messages written in orange are official moderation messages. Signature images are now fixed!
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  • thevampinatorthevampinator Posts: 300Member Arc User
    edited April 23
    kreatyve said:

    I'm pretty sure it's still the same to unlock chat.

    This is a problem I think. Personally. Given what it takes to unlock chat, 5 questlines currently. With deeds it allows players to know what they have to complete by removing that that hurts players that are new and have no idea and cannot talk at all. Even in say chat they can't talk. So I think it would be a mistake to remove the deeds and not change it to make it easier like say for example complete the low level orbs campaign.
  • sandukutupusandukutupu Posts: 1,339Member Arc User
    @thevampinator between you and I, I believe that Cryptic wants us to use 3rd party chat (Discord) for everything. I don't understand how a company can be so opposed to being "user friendly". They claim it is to combat spam bots but let's get the facts straight. Spam bots are in chat and hitting report doesn't remove them. They get banned for 24 hours at best.

    All 3 of the games produced by Cryptic has the same basic chat engine. We can use microphones, but it sounds horrible or too soft. The chat is really plagued more so by trolls than spam bots. I am a very helpful player, when new players need answers, I don't tell them to hit ALT+F4. I go out of my way to stick around until they get the answer they need.

    Recently there was a level 41 in the game that was asking the location of the bank! How many new players get fed up and quit before they get needed answers? Those are potential zen buyers they are turning away. This happens because you need to be level 34 just to finish the Graveyard or Helm's Hold. You can't be level 15 anymore to talk or say or do anything.

    I know someone will say, Wendy they did this to stop spam. And I say, it doesn't work. Make a new rule in the EULA; Anyone caught spamming a gold advertisement gets the perma ban and account deleted "ZERO tolerance". Enforce the rule don't get lazy and automate it. Also a simple fix to the chat engine, grant new players the right to use a list of questions chat. (e.g. New Bob: Hello, I am new here, can someone show me the bank?) With simple responses back like; Yes, No, I don't know. It wouldn't have to be a long list either. Most new people ask the same questions.

    Finally to the trolls who get the 24 hour chat ban, fine. But the ones getting it a lot, make the ban last longer with powers of 2. The first chat ban is 24, 2 days, 4 days, 8, 16, 1 month... etc.. Trolls banned like that would either play the game or leave. How come we don't see simple rules being enforced? It makes me wonder if the EULA has any teeth at all?
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  • greywyndgreywynd Posts: 4,243Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    You can adjust your settings for voice chat. You can adjust the speaker volume. You can adjust the mic volume. I have zero problems using it to communicate with people that I am in party with.

    Until one of them complains that the mic is hot.
    Better to be a white knight than a knight with no honor.

    With your shield or on it.
  • mentinmindmakermentinmindmaker Posts: 896Member Arc User
    The way I understand it, the deeds are just the compilation of quests that are part of the campaign window. They are more like a guide to what content you ought to do at your level.

    The actual quests are not going away, and you will do those anyways if you follow normal game progress.

    The access to chat depends on doing those quests and not on the deeds. There also is documented on the Internet somewhere which/how many quests you need to do to open chat.
  • freeblastfreeblast Posts: 3Member Arc User

    There also is documented on the Internet somewhere which/how many quests you need to do to open chat.

    Perhaps the explanation could be put in the Introduction of the Game you are trying to learn rather than in some random location that many "long-term" members have never seen themselves. Finding "Official Messages" about the game is slightly easier than finding the girl who sat next to you on the bus 30 years ago.....slightly. :-)

  • thevampinatorthevampinator Posts: 300Member Arc User
    edited April 23
    Well there is other ways of dealing with it. Reducing the spam is important but not were it hurts new legitimate new players who can't even ask any questions with no alternate means of unlocking the chat for example buying crown store items with money only. As for the bots, I think what needs to be done is going after the buyers who buy from these third party sites and publicly annouce the punishment for those players in the same chat that deals with the lockbox loot wins. Every 5 hours. If a person is caught buying from gold sellers. The message would say so and so was caught and found without a doubt buying from a gold seller he/she is permanently banned from Neverwinter. As well as adding rules on gold selling and buying. On its own tab page. On the character selection. The penetalies. Nothing less then permanent ban for buying from any gold seller. What this would do is basically cause the fear of being permanent banned for buying from them. If they publicly enforce these rules and name and shame the accounts involved in buying with permanent bans. This would hinder the botters as more people will not fall for it because of the fact they could be permanently banned from the game. Right now I think its a three day ban for buying from gold sellers. That is a mistake. It should be a permanent one. There is many ways they can fix the problem or hinder the botters without having to punish new players who might be driven away because of how they have things right now. By publicly going after the gold buyers and exposing them to the community I think it would send a message that they won't tolerate it. Personally I do hope cryptic takes this idea. As I do think it could help. Might not stop all of it but what it would do is show cryptic is serious about this and won't tolerate it.
  • thevampinatorthevampinator Posts: 300Member Arc User
    edited April 23

    @thevampinator between you and I, I believe that Cryptic wants us to use 3rd party chat (Discord) for everything. I don't understand how a company can be so opposed to being "user friendly". They claim it is to combat spam bots but let's get the facts straight. Spam bots are in chat and hitting report doesn't remove them. They get banned for 24 hours at best.

    All 3 of the games produced by Cryptic has the same basic chat engine. We can use microphones, but it sounds horrible or too soft. The chat is really plagued more so by trolls than spam bots. I am a very helpful player, when new players need answers, I don't tell them to hit ALT+F4. I go out of my way to stick around until they get the answer they need.

    Recently there was a level 41 in the game that was asking the location of the bank! How many new players get fed up and quit before they get needed answers? Those are potential zen buyers they are turning away. This happens because you need to be level 34 just to finish the Graveyard or Helm's Hold. You can't be level 15 anymore to talk or say or do anything.

    I know someone will say, Wendy they did this to stop spam. And I say, it doesn't work. Make a new rule in the EULA; Anyone caught spamming a gold advertisement gets the perma ban and account deleted "ZERO tolerance". Enforce the rule don't get lazy and automate it. Also a simple fix to the chat engine, grant new players the right to use a list of questions chat. (e.g. New Bob: Hello, I am new here, can someone show me the bank?) With simple responses back like; Yes, No, I don't know. It wouldn't have to be a long list either. Most new people ask the same questions.

    Finally to the trolls who get the 24 hour chat ban, fine. But the ones getting it a lot, make the ban last longer with powers of 2. The first chat ban is 24, 2 days, 4 days, 8, 16, 1 month... etc.. Trolls banned like that would either play the game or leave. How come we don't see simple rules being enforced? It makes me wonder if the EULA has any teeth at all?

    Not many people I think read the Eula. I think it should be in its own separate thing. Called Penalties for Gold Buyers and Sellers. So it stands out so people will read it and listing the permanent ban and possible account deletion. Like I mentioned above. Maybe a name and shame system for buyers. As much as I'd rather not have such a system where people are publically shamed and judged. I think it would be a great deterrent and as such they should do it if it will work. Maybe every five ours to maybe once a day announcement of the players caught doing it and given bans. They don't have to exactly list the names even but they should list the number of players caught and dealt with. As for well chat bans. We all know if we have been to zone chat Neverwinter does not do gorn jokes, there was for a time batrai jokes, but it seems the topic that might be close to stos gorn jokes seems to be the debates over whether or not the earth is flat or spherical. I doubt that would work if some of those people have more then 6 or seven accounts. Or make more to bypass such bans. I do agree with the gold buying there should be a harsher penalty maybe once in a while a one time forgiveness for it. But basically make it so they don't come back to the game with their real money bought ad. If they have to delete all the characters on that account and any stored ad. As punishment if they are not permanently banned. Maybe next year they could do an April fools Flat Toril puns and mock debates whether or not Toril is flat or Round. Would be really funny.
  • sandukutupusandukutupu Posts: 1,339Member Arc User
    I wasn't including "flat earthers" as trolls, but the ones who just spam the manifesto, copy paste nonsense religion and politics to get people irate. I you all know what I mean. There is a big difference in people who spread agenda and comedy.

    Please note: if you do have a cause, don't post rhetoric in any video game chat. No one will take you or your cause serious. I don't sound off about my personal crusades online, I go out and do stuff, because my actions is louder than words. <3
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  • kvetkvet Posts: 2,700Member, NW M9 Playtest Arc User
    aside: But flat earthers ARE trolls, alongside moon hoaxers and anti-health ... er... vaccination ppl... Too bad the EULA can't ban ignorance.
  • kreatyvekreatyve Posts: 9,937Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Community Moderator
    edited April 23
    bobo#5090 said:



    Not many people I think read the Eula.

    Who in gods name reads a EULA? Those things are so long, and filled with so much legalease that you need a degree to understand it, let alone read it. Wasn't there a "study" done where people were asked to sign a contract for a free phone or whatever, and then afterwards they were told the EULA had a clause in it that required them to give up their first born? It was meant to show that no one reads those things to the end, let alone understand half of what is in them.

    I've read it, but not until after I became a moderator and was curious. :( Pretty sure I've sold my soul to a game company or 2 without knowing it because you are right in that - nobody reads the EULA.
    My opinions are my own. I do not work for PWE or Cryptic. - Forum Rules - Protector's Enclave Discord - I play on Xbox
    Any of my comments not posted in orange are based on my own personal opinion and not official.
    Any messages written in orange are official moderation messages. Signature images are now fixed!
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  • thevampinatorthevampinator Posts: 300Member Arc User
    edited April 24
    kreatyve said:

    bobo#5090 said:



    Not many people I think read the Eula.

    Who in gods name reads a EULA? Those things are so long, and filled with so much legalease that you need a degree to understand it, let alone read it. Wasn't there a "study" done where people were asked to sign a contract for a free phone or whatever, and then afterwards they were told the EULA had a clause in it that required them to give up their first born? It was meant to show that no one reads those things to the end, let alone understand half of what is in them.

    I've read it, but not until after I became a moderator and was curious. :( Pretty sure I've sold my soul to a game company or 2 without knowing it because you are right in that - nobody reads the EULA.
    Yeah I might have read some for eso for example only after. Getting curious about something. Terms of Service. Eula and other things like that are just basically protects them legally and also gives out the rules. People will just click okay or scroll down fast and then okay in cases where you have to do that. Well it is wise I guess for people to read it at least once. The thing is it has bahahbahaa. Terms and conditions and rules and basically saying you don't own anything Cryptic does and they can terminate your account at any time for any reason. The stuff they have to have Legally. The typical stuff that all comes with it. Basically a simplified rules for the server. Please be less toxic in zone chat. Don't threaten people or harass peoples playing experiance. No buying ad from gold sellers period. No gold selling period.
    This is what it says in the terms of service.

    Without limiting the foregoing, in addition to the User Content rules set forth in Section 16, you agree not to take any of the following actions:

    a. harm minors in any way;

    b. impersonate any person or entity, including any PWE officials, forum leaders, guides, hosts, employees or agents, or falsely state or otherwise misrepresent your affiliation with a person or entity;

    c. forge headers or otherwise manipulate identifiers in order to disguise the origin of any message transmitted through the Website;

    d. upload, post, e-mail, transmit or otherwise make available any unsolicited or unauthorized advertising, promotional materials, “junk mail”, “spam”, “chain letters”, “pyramid schemes”, or any other form of solicitation;

    e. interfere with or disrupt the Service or servers or networks connected to the Service, or disobey any requirements, procedures, policies or regulations of networks connected to the Service;

    f. “stalk,” threaten or otherwise harass or cause discomfort to another;

    g. collect, store, post or otherwise disseminate any personal data about other users;

    h. impede or disrupt the Service or the normal flow of game play or dialogue in the Game or in Interactive Areas (defined below) in the Service or use vulgar language, abusiveness, use of excessive shouting (ALL CAPS), “spamming” or any other disruptive or detrimental methods in an attempt to disturb other users or our employees;

    i. engage in, encourage, or promote any illegal activity, or any activity that violates these Terms or the Rules of Conduct;

    j. engage in any actions that defraud or attempt to defraud, scam or cheat others out of any items that have been earned through authorized game play;

    k. cheat or utilize unauthorized exploits in connection with the Games or the Service;

    l. using or exploiting any bugs, errors, or design flaws to obtain unauthorized access to the Service or to gain an unfair advantage over other players;

    m. trade, sell, auction or otherwise transfer any virtual items or goods of any nature outside the game;

    n. take any action that disrupts the Service or that negatively affects or may prohibit other users from enjoying the Website, the Games or any other aspect of the Service.
    15.3We may take any actions and impose any penalties we deem necessary to discourage and punish any violation of these terms or any other illegal or inappropriate conduct, all without prior notice or warning. The determination as to whether a violation has occurred and who is responsible for such act is solely within our discretion, and is based on what we deem best for the community and the Service. By using the Service, you agree you will be bound by our determination as to whether a violation has occurred and any penalty we choose to implement.


    If they simplified them placing the rules in a simple small format or paragraph, Calling it Server Rules. People would more then likely read it.

    Server Rules
    One: no harming or sexting anyone whos a minor.
    Two: No impersonating. Stalking, promoting real life illegal activity.
    Three: No harassing abusing, or threatening other players. Collecting other players personal information. That includes real life home of address. Passwords.
    Four: try to keep zone chats clean no abusing other players or bypassing chat profanity filter in any of the zone chats.
    Five No exploiting any bug that hurts gameplay experience or hurts profits and economy in any shape or form, including outside game software that gives an unfair advantage. No multiboxing.
    Six No Ad Gold Buying or Selling outside the game in game items in any shape or form.
    Seven no defrauding players or the companies that run cyptic.

    Simplified rules and a place where people can read them long with the terms of service on another tab with the extended more detailed version of the rules. Could be better then just having something people will never read or just skip over.
  • siggymas#6537 siggymas Posts: 2Member New User
    hello new player here, i couldn't start a topic so i was wondering if i can find any help here. regarding unlocking chat.

    i use the knox veteran recruitment item, to make a fresh 2nd slot level 70 character but my chat are not unlocking.
    btw my first character haven't also unlock the chat. i thought if i buy the instant level 70 item i would have unlock everything.

    do i need to use my 1st slot character? because i cannot complete the quest chain for plague tower since i am unable to access the TROUBLED TIMES quest.
  • dionchidionchi Posts: 826Member Arc User
    edited December 1

    -snip-
    Recently there was a level 41 in the game that was asking the location of the bank! How many new players get fed up and quit before they get needed answers? Those are potential zen buyers they are turning away. This happens because you need to be level 34 just to finish the Graveyard or Helm's Hold. You can't be level 15 anymore to talk or say or do anything.

    Easy fix as far as I'm concerned...

    Sergeant Knox gives a quest to see Auctioneer to learn about the Auction house, the Mount Merchant to get a mount the Grand Emporium to get a companion and Anton Omeris to learn about starting a guild. Someone could easily program a line to "Visit the Bank" for a similar "How To" questline.

    Sgt. Knox: "TALK TO BANKER ABOUT YOUR PERSONAL STORAGE SPACE"

    That so many simple things like acquainting new players with their own personal and account shared bank space and instead seems to prioritize so many "cosmetic" fixes in the game, really gets me to question the priorities some of the people responsible for attracting new players and retaining 'new-ish' players.

    As for the chat issue, new players maybe should be blocked from "SAY" and "ZONE" (possibly "TELL" unless initiated from face to face) chat for a period of time, but can use other chat methods primarily "PARTY", "GUILD", "ALLIANCE", "QUEUE GROUP", and such freely regardless of character level or deeds completion. ¢¢
    DD~
  • tribbulatertribbulater Posts: 135Member Arc User
    It's ridiculous to restrict the access of new players to at least a global help chat. All new players should be in the global help channel by default and older players could opt in or out of that channel at will.

    As for spam control, there are three separate issues of chat 'player abuse': Trolls, Harassment and Gold/RMT spam.

    The primary reason for limiting chat access on a F2P game is so that people can't just make a quick disposable account and instantly be able to broadcast garbage to everyone's screen.

    Trolls are adequately handled by "ignore player" commands. Harassment and Gold/RMT spam should have a "Report player" menu with a sub-menu for Harassment / Gold Seller.

    Harassment reports would send a copy of the reported chat line to a GM, and five harassment reports would mute the account until a GM could review it. A text box describing that process would go to the reporter. If a GM determines that reporters are using the system frivolously, they would warn the player and then institute an increasing series of bans against the account.

    Gold/RMT spam reports would shut an account down after only 2 player reports and send copies of the chat line to a GM. However the text box that pops up would warn the reporting player of severe consequences should they make false reports.

    This would mute abusive accounts quickly, allow for GM review, and the players would quickly learn not to abuse the reporting system or face bans.
  • pitshadepitshade Posts: 4,329Member Arc User
    > @siggymas#6537 said.
    >
    > do i need to use my 1st slot character? because i cannot complete the quest chain for plague tower since i am unable to access the TROUBLED TIMES quest.

    Why can't you complete Troubled Times?

    The intro quest for Plague Tower chain is called, "Trouble in the Ranks," IIRC. Have you found and completed that quest?
    "We have always been at war with Dread Vault" ~ Little Brother
  • dionchidionchi Posts: 826Member Arc User
    edited December 2

    It's ridiculous to restrict the access of new players to at least a global help chat. All new players should be in the global help channel by default and older players could opt in or out of that channel at will.

    As for spam control, there are three separate issues of chat 'player abuse': Trolls, Harassment and Gold/RMT spam.

    The primary reason for limiting chat access on a F2P game is so that people can't just make a quick disposable account and instantly be able to broadcast garbage to everyone's screen.

    Trolls are adequately handled by "ignore player" commands. Harassment and Gold/RMT spam should have a "Report player" menu with a sub-menu for Harassment / Gold Seller.

    Harassment reports would send a copy of the reported chat line to a GM, and five harassment reports would mute the account until a GM could review it. A text box describing that process would go to the reporter. If a GM determines that reporters are using the system frivolously, they would warn the player and then institute an increasing series of bans against the account.

    Gold/RMT spam reports would shut an account down after only 2 player reports and send copies of the chat line to a GM. However the text box that pops up would warn the reporting player of severe consequences should they make false reports.

    This would mute abusive accounts quickly, allow for GM review, and the players would quickly learn not to abuse the reporting system or face bans.

    "Global help channel" used to be Zone chat and Say Chat. The only problem was these were the channels most often spammed by the Gold and AD pirates. A 3rd party vendor spammer would sign on, create a character and immediately begin spamming. Often before even completing the tutorial before there was a block initiated. The spammer would have their account blocked or ignored and the spammer would simply create a new account and the cycle repeated - constantly.

    Game moderators and managers probably have enough to do without having to constantly chase down spammer and harassment reports.

    There are ignore and report spammer/harassment and offensive behavior options. The problem is unless an offender is caught red handed or there are sufficient reports to warrant an investigation, it's merely one player complaining about another player which may or may not be a valid and factual complaint.

    Just about everything a new player needs to learn, including locations within the Protector's Enclave - with the exception of the bank - is given to players during the quests they get from Sgt. Knox or by paying attention to the tutorial voiceovers during those low level quest. If a player chooses to skip over tutorial quests or ignore those tutorial voiceovers it's not the game's fault.

    However I agree there should be some in game mechanism for new and new-ish players to ask questions. As has been suggested, open GUILD, ALLIANCE and PARTY chat regardless of character level or deed completion. If a player isn't a guild or alliance member, they can still use "Invite to party" to ask a question. Should the person invited not be interested they are free to decline the invite, but if the person is willing to join the party and answer questions, I'm also willing to bet the more experienced player would even be more willing to mentor the new player by going on a couple of quests with them.

    But maybe that's just what I would probably be willing to do and that would be behavior indicative of anyone else.

    How to best or most effectively implement chat capabilities while also discouraging spammers - I'm afraid that's above my pay grade.
    DD~
  • siggymas#6537 siggymas Posts: 2Member New User
    > @pitshade said:
    > > @"siggymas#6537" said.
    > >
    > > do i need to use my 1st slot character? because i cannot complete the quest chain for plague tower since i am unable to access the TROUBLED TIMES quest.
    >
    > Why can't you complete Troubled Times?
    >
    > The intro quest for Plague Tower chain is called, "Trouble in the Ranks," IIRC. Have you found and completed that quest?

    hello and thank you for taking your time to read my trouble :( :(

    i have investigate my problem.... on my journal, apparently on my level 70 character, i have completed the quest chain for plague tower... is it normal that i did not get the achievement? and does that mean i have already securely completed the plague tower quest chain even though i did not get the achievement?

    since im using the Knox Veteran Recruitment Item to creaTE A FRESh level 70 toon. on my first level 11 character i never finish the quest chain for the plague tower.
  • dionchidionchi Posts: 826Member Arc User

    hello and thank you for taking your time to read my trouble :(:(

    i have investigate my problem.... on my journal, apparently on my level 70 character, i have completed the quest chain for plague tower... is it normal that i did not get the achievement? and does that mean i have already securely completed the plague tower quest chain even though i did not get the achievement?

    since im using the Knox Veteran Recruitment Item to creaTE A FRESh level 70 toon. on my first level 11 character i never finish the quest chain for the plague tower.

    As I remember it, when the player completes the Plague Tower successfully they get a Cloak of the Plaguetower as your achievement reward. So if you don't have this Cloak in your inventory, or you don't remember getting one, chances are the Plague Tower Quest wasn't successfully completed.

    An easy way to check is to open your Journal ("J" key). Go to the first tab the Quest Journal - for simplicity sake I went to the display options tab and set the SORT to Level (Ascending) and SHOW BY REGION to None - be sure to have
    SHOW COMPLETED and SHOW LOW LEVEL checked. This will display all of the quests the player's received the symbol (diamond) on the left is shaded for quests completed and still bright for uncompleted quests.

    My advice would be to go down the list from top to bottom (lowest to highest) and quickly complete unfinished low level quests with your level 70 character, perhaps this will help.

    Also in the Chat Window, click on the Chat Settings icon (wheel at top left) and make sure the channels you are wanting to see chat messages in, are clicked.

    I hope you get it working, chat is sometimes useful and even entertaining (when it's not disturbing) at times

    DD~
  • pitshadepitshade Posts: 4,329Member Arc User




    i have investigate my problem.... on my journal, apparently on my level 70 character, i have completed the quest chain for plague tower... is it normal that i did not get the achievement? and does that mean i have already securely completed the plague tower quest chain even though i did not get the achievement?



    since im using the Knox Veteran Recruitment Item to creaTE A FRESh level 70 toon. on my first level 11 character i never finish the quest chain for the plague tower.

    I can't say for sure, but it doesn't seem like it would matter which character you complete the quests on as long as it's the same character for all quests.

    This is the list of Spellplague on an alt that hasn't done it at all.

    https://imgur.com/fY8eJaM

    You have all of these on the list marked with a check and complete or what are you missing?
    "We have always been at war with Dread Vault" ~ Little Brother
  • wintersmokewintersmoke Posts: 1,430Member Arc User
    freeblast said:

    There also is documented on the Internet somewhere which/how many quests you need to do to open chat.

    Perhaps the explanation could be put in the Introduction of the Game you are trying to learn rather than in some random location that many "long-term" members have never seen themselves. Finding "Official Messages" about the game is slightly easier than finding the girl who sat next to you on the bus 30 years ago.....slightly. :-)

    when you try to chat (or post to the auction house, or send a mail message) before these are unlocked, a pop up message appears onscreen telling you what the unlock requirements are.
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