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  • mebengalsfan#9264 mebengalsfan Member Posts: 3,169 Arc User

    ddo is ancient. If you do not think neverwinter holds up well in todays world.. you will not enjoy ddo that much. It also plays much more like other older style mmos (alot of powers.. but click /tab designs)

    I played it for a "bit" back when I played lotro, because I had some turbine points and just wanted to check it out. Turbine doesnt even own either game now (standing stones or something) and the server I played on in lotro, doesnt even exist any longer (bye old riddermark!) I will say this.. no game anywhere , I have ever played, had consistently nicer community then lotros back then..

    DDO frankly, wasn't as good as lotro was , I haven't played either game in years, no idea how any have aged, I quit Lotro at the time when they released the gap of rohan, because , well my raiding guild quit and my friends all quit (like 150+ people) over some unpopular decisions that were made for it, (namely making months of raiding gear obsolete and forcing everyone to do dailies for 2 months as its replacement ((yes.. solo dailies replaced all the t2 raiding gear... )) really bad move on their part.. most of the raiders I knew quit.. but it was ok, I wouldve staid if my friends did, but we were all sort of burnt out.. most of us had spent a better part of 4 years there. MOD 10 in neverwinter, made me think of gap of rohan, I lost dozens of people on my friends list due to mod 10 here and its insistence of overally grindy boring nonsense (still is overally grindy boring nonsense)

    I was a bit tired of raiding anyways.. tired of 3 hour sessions, and my life was moving past the point I could play for solid hours straight..

    While I enjoyed my time, I dont really look for that in a game any longer.


    DDO got Ravenloft before NWO got Ravenloft. Graphics are a bit dated yes, but DDO keep up on content just like NWO and the game plays to D&D rules unlike NWO.

    If Cryptic is trying to attract actual D&D players than they need to ensure classes play closer to D&D and not what they are delivering in mod 16.
  • cdnbisoncdnbison Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 806 Arc User
    @mebengalsfan#9264"What players are complaining about is that many of us upgraded our weapons last mod to the MC3 weapons hoping those would last 6 months, almost as long as the primal weapons. Well, that isn't the case as the MC weapons are only lasting us 1 mod.

    The other thing is that some players like myself also got the neck and waist MC3 do to change for our classes, but low and behold those are also being replaced. For some classes like the SW, DPS GF, GWF, HR, and TR this change is not as bad if the player got the Orcus set and never got another set. As the Orcus set has been BiS for quite a while for almost all classes.

    As someone who bought, with real world money, MC3 gear I feel cheated and am annoyed but I also understand those items would eventually be replaced. "


    Mod15 came out in November. Mod16 comes out in April. ~5-6 months. I also bought MC3 weapons - right before mod15 dropped. I didn't wait and get +1, as I knew they'd likely be getting replaced with mod16, and most people in my alliance would advise anyone asking that yes, while MC3 +1 are technically BiS, the cost vs. usage might make it too expensive for such a short time.

    The neck and waist (which I also have) are in a similar boat, though the level cap increase wasn't expected, so I can understand some buyers remorse on this one.

    Unfortunately, it's like buying a new phone right before the new model is introduced. It happens. It sucks if you dropped a few million AD only to find out that yeah, it was only BiS for X months, but it's going to happen, especially in games like this that are, for all intents and purposes, gear treadmills. It's "if", not "when" will you need to upgrade. You just hope you can get a decent lifespan out of what you're getting.

    As for the other stuff:
    1. There were some other builds that were viable, yes. It was also shockingly easy to make one that *wasn't*.
    2. I actually disagree a bit with this, in that it's far tougher to doom yourself with what appears to be good. I've been dabbling with mixes of the DC arbiter powers, and overall, it just works. The feats force powers into play, but that becomes chicken-egg - do you take a feat for the power, or a power for the feat? Regardless, I've found it quite difficult to not be able to solo, based on power selection.

    Are there fewer selections now? Sure. But there were a whole lot of really bad ones to begin with.
  • demonmongerdemonmonger Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,350 Arc User
    > @soulseeker#1880 said:
    > The issue with all this is you don't like it because your character is god like and nothing can kill it and you look like a <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. I You now will have to actually work (play the game) to achieve something. I truly don't see the fun in a game when you can run the end game dungeons and not even die or a tank not even lose health or need any healing... Where is the fun please tell me. This update is far overdue for this game. I am sorry so many people don't like it but its what you are getting but they are going to be following D&D rules now which I am ok with.
    >
    > Also I have seen someone work on their build for days now on the preview server and he has a build that's now posted and I have seen him run the new areas with no issues, as a matter of fact he killed that new Dragon on his on with very little issues... So cant anyone give it a chance then complain..... Because we are in a society where we complain about everything and everyone instead of looking and doing first.

    The way I built my character I was far from a god... I was a highly mobile dart in dart out raptor style rogue. My mobility was 19,000 and I could keep pace with mounts. I could.not complete ravenloft as dps in fps role vs the giant armor monster that has a time limit before he just swirls you all to death. However I did throughly enjoy my build in pve and pvp.

    Mobility life steal and power... that was all.. that's where I dumped my money to be unique and have fun in anyway that I chose.... key word in all of this is that is it how I chose to play.
    Module 16 narrows choices down to basically 2 paths to play your character and no subclass specializations. It's going to be hella different and bland compared to mod 15.
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  • leonidrexleonidrex Member Posts: 401 Arc User

    > @soulseeker#1880 said:

    > The issue with all this is you don't like it because your character is god like and nothing can kill it and you look like a HAMSTER. I You now will have to actually work (play the game) to achieve something. I truly don't see the fun in a game when you can run the end game dungeons and not even die or a tank not even lose health or need any healing... Where is the fun please tell me. This update is far overdue for this game. I am sorry so many people don't like it but its what you are getting but they are going to be following D&D rules now which I am ok with.

    >

    > Also I have seen someone work on their build for days now on the preview server and he has a build that's now posted and I have seen him run the new areas with no issues, as a matter of fact he killed that new Dragon on his on with very little issues... So cant anyone give it a chance then complain..... Because we are in a society where we complain about everything and everyone instead of looking and doing first.



    The way I built my character I was far from a god... I was a highly mobile dart in dart out raptor style rogue. My mobility was 19,000 and I could keep pace with mounts. I could.not complete ravenloft as dps in fps role vs the giant armor monster that has a time limit before he just swirls you all to death. However I did throughly enjoy my build in pve and pvp.



    Mobility life steal and power... that was all.. that's where I dumped my money to be unique and have fun in anyway that I chose.... key word in all of this is that is it how I chose to play.

    Module 16 narrows choices down to basically 2 paths to play your character and no subclass specializations. It's going to be hella different and bland compared to mod 15.

    I never thought I would find a time where i would agree with you but HAMSTER me you are right.
    I always thought your build is funny but stupid but hey, its yours and have fun with it, now its gone. Along with all the builds i spend several months improving upon. God bless mod 16.
  • dread4moordread4moor Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,154 Arc User
    Good news for those happy with the game becoming simplified.
    If you have not seen this Mod17 thread already, you will be very happy with our future:
    https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter#/discussion/1246612/mod-17-proposal-nw-gauntlet

    jk, btw. I love this game and want it to improve.
    Tooks gotta make jokes tho.
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  • draugkirdraugkir Member Posts: 99 Arc User
    Theres no love for a mod that pretty much destroyed years of work and planning and learning.

    No love at all.

    The only reason behind most of the changes is $ and only $. Milking the cow while it lasts.
  • autumnwitchautumnwitch Member Posts: 1,133 Arc User
    edited March 2019
    draugkir said:

    Theres no love for a mod that pretty much destroyed years of work and planning and learning.

    No love at all.

    The only reason behind most of the changes is $ and only $. Milking the cow while it lasts.

    I wouldn't go that far but it is important to remember NW has to make money or it goes away. The game can't be just fun for the sake of fun. They have to be able to generate revenue. People need to get over demonizing Cryptic for trying to keep NW afloat financially. Cryptic is a business not a charity.

    What I see in MOD16 is good intentions. I do think, whoever is making the decisions on all the changes really wants to make the game better. Sadly, better is subjective and what they might think is better may only apply to one subset of current players or perhaps to everyone. Who knows at this point?

    As many have pointed out, it might have been better to break up so many changes over a longer period of time. That way current players could adjust at a more comfortable pace. It would also make it easier to focus all of the dev's attention to one aspect and hone it down really well and not having to deal with the huge deluge of bugs that will exist when MOD16 goes live as it is now.





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  • duchess#7443 duchess Member Posts: 11 Arc User
    I do agree with Autumwitch, nw is another gaming business and as in any other francise, it has to generate its funds, people to pay to make things happen, yes, there’s changes but it’s to go forward to make the game better, I’m anxious about the massive bugs it would bring but I’m also excited how it would unfold
  • leonidrexleonidrex Member Posts: 401 Arc User

    I do agree with Autumwitch, nw is another gaming business and as in any other francise, it has to generate its funds, people to pay to make things happen, yes, there’s changes but it’s to go forward to make the game better, I’m anxious about the massive bugs it would bring but I’m also excited how it would unfold

    they wont make more money when everyone quits the game, the right way to go about is fix whats broken and leave what works, not to dump everything and make generic mmorpg, there was plenty of those around, no more. wonder why.
  • duchess#7443 duchess Member Posts: 11 Arc User
    I’m hoping that the players would give mod 16 a chance, see how their classes would be, I know that the preview servers are having trouble with bugs but when it finally goes live on the 23rd, NW will have fixed it 😊
  • rjc9000rjc9000 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,405 Arc User

    I’m hoping that the players would give mod 16 a chance, see how their classes would be, I know that the preview servers are having trouble with bugs but when it finally goes live on the 23rd, NW will have fixed it 😊

    Hope over Experience

  • duchess#7443 duchess Member Posts: 11 Arc User
    rjc9000 said: hope over experience
    That will be an awesome “title” when mod 16 goes live 😁
  • mebengalsfan#9264 mebengalsfan Member Posts: 3,169 Arc User
    edited April 2019
    cdnbison said:

    @mebengalsfan#9264"What players are complaining about is that many of us upgraded our weapons last mod to the MC3 weapons hoping those would last 6 months, almost as long as the primal weapons. Well, that isn't the case as the MC weapons are only lasting us 1 mod.

    The other thing is that some players like myself also got the neck and waist MC3 do to change for our classes, but low and behold those are also being replaced. For some classes like the SW, DPS GF, GWF, HR, and TR this change is not as bad if the player got the Orcus set and never got another set. As the Orcus set has been BiS for quite a while for almost all classes.

    As someone who bought, with real world money, MC3 gear I feel cheated and am annoyed but I also understand those items would eventually be replaced. "


    Mod15 came out in November. Mod16 comes out in April. ~5-6 months. I also bought MC3 weapons - right before mod15 dropped. I didn't wait and get +1, as I knew they'd likely be getting replaced with mod16, and most people in my alliance would advise anyone asking that yes, while MC3 +1 are technically BiS, the cost vs. usage might make it too expensive for such a short time.

    The neck and waist (which I also have) are in a similar boat, though the level cap increase wasn't expected, so I can understand some buyers remorse on this one.

    Unfortunately, it's like buying a new phone right before the new model is introduced. It happens. It sucks if you dropped a few million AD only to find out that yeah, it was only BiS for X months, but it's going to happen, especially in games like this that are, for all intents and purposes, gear treadmills. It's "if", not "when" will you need to upgrade. You just hope you can get a decent lifespan out of what you're getting.

    As for the other stuff:
    1. There were some other builds that were viable, yes. It was also shockingly easy to make one that *wasn't*.
    2. I actually disagree a bit with this, in that it's far tougher to doom yourself with what appears to be good. I've been dabbling with mixes of the DC arbiter powers, and overall, it just works. The feats force powers into play, but that becomes chicken-egg - do you take a feat for the power, or a power for the feat? Regardless, I've found it quite difficult to not be able to solo, based on power selection.

    Are there fewer selections now? Sure. But there were a whole lot of really bad ones to begin with.

    Feats should not be designed around powers or powers to feats, etc.. each should be independent of each other. However, feats and powers should allow us to customize our character and make them feel unique.

    In D&D no two clerics, wizards, fighters, paladins, etc... are alike. Starting ability scores, spell selections, feats, etc.. all make each character created unique and fun.

    There was this very badly done movie on Amazon Prime but it was about D&D and a few player who played it. The DM was working on a campaign and his party was very focused on so called stats about what is BEST for each class. They needed 2 more bodies and one guy pulls in his GF to join their D&D group. She created a unique Fighter that is far from the typical fighter most of us would know. She had a unique build do to feats, her attribute points, etc..

    NWO mod 15 is a bit like PnP game, not perfectlyu close to it but it gave options. It allowed Rangers to have 3 unique play styles, wizards had multiple builds, OP had a variety of builds, GFs had a variety of builds, etc... even though not all builds were best they were there to test and try out.

    The changes in mod 16 was done for one simple reason, it is easier for the current team to balance classes out with the simplified feats compared to what was available in mod 15 and prior. This update takes away our freedom to design our characters like we would when we play D&D. Instead we get predefined stats, limitation on feats, and of course a reduction in powers.

    If I was Hasbro I would pull the D&D license from Cyrptic as NWO mod16 is not a D&D product. D&D is a complex role playing game and if Cryptic cannot produce such a product, maybe they should drop the license and let another company take it over that can deliver on a D&D mmo game.
  • cdnbisoncdnbison Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 806 Arc User
    See, I don't mind the feats being tied to particular powers - it's a very 5e thing to do (for those not aware, 5e feats tend to be fairly narrow in focus - you can now use Heavy Armor, for instance, or can ignore range penalties with your bow etc etc). I don't like the two-power feats (i.e. does X after you use ). That's forcing two of your three encounter power choices to use that feat. Something like the DCs Heavy Sun feat, though (eliminates knockback), is a *great* way to do it, IMO. It gives you a reason to take the feat / slot the power. The power goes from 'ok when solo' to 'if I take this feat, I can use it in a group, too'.

    And I'm with you all the way on ability score rolls. Possibly even grumpier, because as a DC, my primary stat adds even less than nothing. I'm better off dumping points into INT and CHA than into WIS.
  • adinosiiadinosii Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,294 Arc User
    cdnbison said:

    And I'm with you all the way on ability score rolls. Possibly even grumpier, because as a DC, my primary stat adds even less than nothing. I'm better off dumping points into INT and CHA than into WIS.

    WIS is actually semi-useful for Devout Clerics, as it now boosts outgoing healing, but for the arbiter, yes, it's just CON, INT and CHA. I have said it before and I'll say it again ... this feels just wrong to me, and is my single biggest issue with M16 ... because it wouldn't have required so much to do this properly. To me changes like this just say "we don't care about the players - we have this great idea and we will implement it - if you don't like it just leave".

    When it became clear this was not going to get changed, I took a 2-week break from the game and spent it trying out various other game. The problem was however, that none of those other games have the same set of features as what originally made NWO attractive to me. Anyhow, I'm still here and while most people in my guild may be somewhat unhappy with many of the M16 changes, they have been preparing for M16 and are sticking around as well.
    Hoping for improvements...
  • majorcharvenakmajorcharvenak Member Posts: 783 Arc User
    rjc9000 said:

    I’m hoping that the players would give mod 16 a chance, see how their classes would be, I know that the preview servers are having trouble with bugs but when it finally goes live on the 23rd, NW will have fixed it 😊

    Hope over Experience
    Experience over Hope. :p
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  • pitshadepitshade Member Posts: 5,665 Arc User
    Looking at the starting stat array for DC, INT replaced STR as a secondary stat, at least.

    Cleric: STR: 10, CON: 10, DEX: 10, INT: 15, WIS: 16, CHA: 13
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  • dread4moordread4moor Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,154 Arc User
    > @majorcharvenak said:
    > I’m hoping that the players would give mod 16 a chance, see how their classes would be, I know that the preview servers are having trouble with bugs but when it finally goes live on the 23rd, NW will have fixed it 😊
    >
    > Hope over Experience
    >
    > Experience over Hope. :p

    This.
    This whole thread is meaningless and adding nothing to improving Mod16.
    Sycophantic cheerleading is not feedback.

    I've spent ~2 hours per day for a ~4 weeks on preview.
    Giving constructive and specific feedback (some of it positive) on preview threads.

    That's the definition of "giving it a chance" and trying to improve it.
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  • mebengalsfan#9264 mebengalsfan Member Posts: 3,169 Arc User
    cdnbison said:

    See, I don't mind the feats being tied to particular powers - it's a very 5e thing to do (for those not aware, 5e feats tend to be fairly narrow in focus - you can now use Heavy Armor, for instance, or can ignore range penalties with your bow etc etc). I don't like the two-power feats (i.e. does X after you use ). That's forcing two of your three encounter power choices to use that feat. Something like the DCs Heavy Sun feat, though (eliminates knockback), is a *great* way to do it, IMO. It gives you a reason to take the feat / slot the power. The power goes from 'ok when solo' to 'if I take this feat, I can use it in a group, too'.

    And I'm with you all the way on ability score rolls. Possibly even grumpier, because as a DC, my primary stat adds even less than nothing. I'm better off dumping points into INT and CHA than into WIS.

    I rarely picked feats that impacted just one encounter. Yet you are ok with the devs forcing this on us. I want feats to be independent of powers so I have more customization than limitation they are giving us as it is.

    Whenever you tie one thing to another you limit yourself and that is what this update has done moreso than many realize.

    Not many feats where tied to powers or personals; some were but you didn't have to take them to still be effective as a damage dealer. As a buffer, yeah specific feats were needed but that was how you ended up as a buffer vs being a healer, tank, or DPS.

    Not sure what kool aid you been drinking, but for me this update is anything but good. It is has more bugs than what is on live, it greatly impacts combat core mechanics, greatly impact character design core mechanics, greatly changes core mechanics around companions, greatly changes core mechanics around stats and allocation of stats as well as gear, etc... This is a new game and not even NWO, it is not even close to what was on beta when the game first launched. This update should have been delivered as NWO 2 and the old server should have been shut down. I would have been perfectly happy if the devs did this and I would have simply moved onto without jumping into NWO2.
  • mrlight73#3252 mrlight73 Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    Hi. Im a fresh player who just got to end game, now 11.2 k ilvl. This game is one of the few MMOs I adore. The combat, the lore, the char and environment models are fanstastic! It it didnt feel like a grind from lvl 1 to 70 because I had fun. What I love the most about NW is the degree of liberty it gives you to customize your char: the powers and the feats are diverse and fun to tweak. Each lvl you felt rewarded and thus look forward towards the next. I love all the changes in MOD 16 except this one: the severe dumbing down of the powers and feats tree. I do welcome change and commend the devs for the new content. However, I find it more prudent to take it one major change at a time and consider always that not all change is good. In the good chance that one of the community managers read this post of mine, PLEASE: retain the powers and feats, you make tweak it for balances and such but pls dont cull it to a point where mostly everything are binary options. The combat is great as it is. The counter stats features are welcome, but I sure do hope you retain the fast-paced combat rotations of mod 15. Im just beginning to love this game and Id hate to see it die in such short notice. :(
  • mebengalsfan#9264 mebengalsfan Member Posts: 3,169 Arc User

    Hi. Im a fresh player who just got to end game, now 11.2 k ilvl. This game is one of the few MMOs I adore. The combat, the lore, the char and environment models are fanstastic! It it didnt feel like a grind from lvl 1 to 70 because I had fun. What I love the most about NW is the degree of liberty it gives you to customize your char: the powers and the feats are diverse and fun to tweak. Each lvl you felt rewarded and thus look forward towards the next. I love all the changes in MOD 16 except this one: the severe dumbing down of the powers and feats tree. I do welcome change and commend the devs for the new content. However, I find it more prudent to take it one major change at a time and consider always that not all change is good. In the good chance that one of the community managers read this post of mine, PLEASE: retain the powers and feats, you make tweak it for balances and such but pls dont cull it to a point where mostly everything are binary options. The combat is great as it is. The counter stats features are welcome, but I sure do hope you retain the fast-paced combat rotations of mod 15. Im just beginning to love this game and Id hate to see it die in such short notice. :(

    What you loved is going to change greatly. Think of how long it took you to go from level 1 to 70, there is going to be roughly a 25% increase in that time if not more. On average it will take players 2x longer to complete the same task they do now come mod 16. This will discourage end game players from helping other players out.

    I played other MMOs and I always went back and helped others out as I still felt powerful in lower content even if my gear/stats were clamped because the devs realized that they needed to provide us a slight bump over other the players who are in that zone so they can see that later on they would also become powerful.

    This update removes that and makes it so we are all equally gimp regardless of the zone and that will be the death of end game players doing walk through for lower gear players.

    I personally would hate to be the person in charge at Cryptic that made the decision to go with mod 16 if it ends up tanking and results in a big loss of revenue.
  • silverkeltsilverkelt Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,235 Arc User
    If you think about it.. if they just launched nwo2 istead.. would of fixed alot of issues other then gameplay.. like the economy, for started.

    Plus , if they are really looking for new players or recapture.. wouldve been a good time to do all of this.

    Since they are going to lose a % of people anyways.. I have no idea why they didnt really.



  • mebengalsfan#9264 mebengalsfan Member Posts: 3,169 Arc User

    If you think about it.. if they just launched nwo2 istead.. would of fixed alot of issues other then gameplay.. like the economy, for started.

    Plus , if they are really looking for new players or recapture.. wouldve been a good time to do all of this.

    Since they are going to lose a % of people anyways.. I have no idea why they didnt really.



    Because they need the newer servers they have for Magic the Gathering and not NWO. Also, if the devs do NWO2 they would have to get Sony and MS licenses for those games vs. simply updating the core game.

    I wonder if players on PSN and MS can request that these companies deny Cryptic the right to upgrade our version with mod 16 since it not actually a game update but a new game given its a complete change to the game core mechanics.

  • kiraskytowerkiraskytower Member Posts: 455 Arc User


    I wonder if players on PSN and MS can request that these companies deny Cryptic the right to upgrade our version with mod 16 since it not actually a game update but a new game given its a complete change to the game core mechanics.

    Mod 16 is clearly an update, not a new game ... so Sony and Microsoft aren't even going to entertain this.

    But every module we get this "Oh no, you are changing my favorite class. Can't we just keep this Mod forever?" The answer is always the same .... The player base wants new content and Cryptic needs new things to sell for zen. Each module represents a huge amount of time and manpower (and of course money) invested by Cryptic in the game - and they hope to get that back in zen sales during that module. On PC we have already reached the point where everyone is either finished the AI campaign or just tired of running it .... it's time for new content.
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  • autumnwitchautumnwitch Member Posts: 1,133 Arc User

    If you think about it.. if they just launched nwo2 istead.. would of fixed alot of issues other then gameplay.. like the economy, for started.

    Plus , if they are really looking for new players or recapture.. wouldve been a good time to do all of this.

    Since they are going to lose a % of people anyways.. I have no idea why they didnt really.



    Because they need the newer servers they have for Magic the Gathering and not NWO. Also, if the devs do NWO2 they would have to get Sony and MS licenses for those games vs. simply updating the core game.

    I wonder if players on PSN and MS can request that these companies deny Cryptic the right to upgrade our version with mod 16 since it not actually a game update but a new game given its a complete change to the game core mechanics.

    I am a bit astonished that WotC is ok with the changes. Some of them really stab a knife in a few of the core D&D elements. It's their reputation as well not just Cryptic's.

    As far as PSN I am really curious if they will hold up implantation on PS4 due to the certification process. That's a huge update to go through and sort out.
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  • darkheart#6758 darkheart Member Posts: 274 Arc User
    > @kiraskytower said:
    > I wonder if players on PSN and MS can request that these companies deny Cryptic the right to upgrade our version with mod 16 since it not actually a game update but a new game given its a complete change to the game core mechanics.
    >
    >
    >
    > Mod 16 is clearly an update, not a new game ... so Sony and Microsoft aren't even going to entertain this.
    >
    > But every module we get this "Oh no, you are changing my favorite class. Can't we just keep this Mod forever?" The answer is always the same .... The player base wants new content and Cryptic needs new things to sell for zen. Each module represents a huge amount of time and manpower (and of course money) invested by Cryptic in the game - and they hope to get that back in zen sales during that module. On PC we have already reached the point where everyone is either finished the AI campaign or just tired of running it .... it's time for new content.

    Time for new content and complete revamp of the combat system and game mechanics are 2 entirely different things. They could of just released the new campaign mod without the massive changes.
  • dread4moordread4moor Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,154 Arc User
    > @kiraskytower said:
    > I wonder if players on PSN and MS can request that these companies deny Cryptic the right to upgrade our version with mod 16 since it not actually a game update but a new game given its a complete change to the game core mechanics.
    >
    >
    >
    > Mod 16 is clearly an update, not a new game ... so Sony and Microsoft aren't even going to entertain this.
    >
    > But every module we get this "Oh no, you are changing my favorite class. Can't we just keep this Mod forever?" The answer is always the same .... The player base wants new content and Cryptic needs new things to sell for zen. Each module represents a huge amount of time and manpower (and of course money) invested by Cryptic in the game - and they hope to get that back in zen sales during that module. On PC we have already reached the point where everyone is either finished the AI campaign or just tired of running it .... it's time for new content.

    This a new game.
    How combat works, the basic mechanics.
    The classes are completely different.
    The playstyles. The pace.
    The micro and macro objectives of play.
    Everything.

    Has nothing to do with "new content".
    No one is complaining about the Module itself. It's pretty good.
    It's "Neverwinter 2: Die Harder" we don't like.
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    I am Took.
    "Full plate and packing steel" in NW since 2013.
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