MOD 15 buff hr

thefiresidecat

based on the current incarnation in preview what will this probably look like?

archery or trapper? pathfinder stormwarden? will it be a different rotation than now or just lss as fast as possible?

wdj40

I imagine its too hard to tell as things are still only in proposal stage it seems... In the Preview server thread a Dev has commented about Aspect of the Serpent being just 2 stacks but you are able to build both stacks at the same time.

This would open up new rotations and better use of Deft Strike etc

Just need to them to reverse the change to Stillness of the Forest now to save the PvP Archer.

thefiresidecat

yeah when I wrote that, I really thought they were just ignoring the hr spec and what we had was what we were getting. glad to see it's still being tweaked.

wizardlvl80

From what I think, if we are to go support then this new Primal Instincts will be a must have. Propably Hawkeye will be used more often since it will be possible 18-19%% more encounter damage permabuff (if trapper). Boar hide might see some usage in low gear parties since it might grant 24% DR for your party which might be helpful to avoid one-shots for lowbies.

Oak skin still seems to be useless, Stag Hart is a meh imho.

wdj40

wizardlvl80#5963 said:

From what I think, if we are to go support then this new Primal Instincts will be a must have. Propably Hawkeye will be used more often since it will be possible 18-19%% more encounter damage permabuff (if trapper). Boar hide might see some usage in low gear parties since it might grant 24% DR for your party which might be helpful to avoid one-shots for lowbies.

Oak skin still seems to be useless, Stag Hart is a meh imho.

Funny you should mention Oak Skin... It can be buffed a fair bit in the current mod by various things. I have not used it for a while but have a healing build in my mind I will play around with later.

The Maze Engine Insparation Boon gives a healing tick of 20k when healing yourself and/or allies. This can be buffed itself and before I stopped playing around with it in the past it was ticks for 70-80k. I am thinking of combining that with the HoT Boon from Ravenloft and a couple of other things and see what happens.

wizardlvl80

Heya @wdj40

It's not like I think Oak Skin's numbers are bad. It's just overall idea of how healing is irrelevant in NWO. Current dungeons are being designed in a way, where you are either at full hp or dead. That's why I think Oak Skin is not something that can/should be picked over any damage dealing power.

thefiresidecat

I don't think our powers are going to be as much as what a templock can do. and as far as I can see combat hasn't been nerfed. I think we'd be far more welcome in a party as a high damage dealer than healing a little. to me it feels like the heals brought to the table are something better suited for a class that has to struggle a little more than we do with dps. we have dcs tlocks and ops... seems like if we really need the heals one or two of them can bring it to any dungeon already. and anymore than that would be wasted. I am far from the best hr and yet I can keep up with most of the other dps out there.

but I do like having a bit of healing in end game dungeons. it can make a difference.

wdj40

wizardlvl80#5963 said:

Heya @wdj40



It's not like I think Oak Skin's numbers are bad. It's just overall idea of how healing is irrelevant in NWO. Current dungeons are being designed in a way, where you are either at full hp or dead. That's why I think Oak Skin is not something that can/should be picked over any damage dealing power.

thefiresidecat said:

I don't think our powers are going to be as much as what a templock can do. and as far as I can see combat hasn't been nerfed. I think we'd be far more welcome in a party as a high damage dealer than healing a little. to me it feels like the heals brought to the table are something better suited for a class that has to struggle a little more than we do with dps. we have dcs tlocks and ops... seems like if we really need the heals one or two of them can bring it to any dungeon already. and anymore than that would be wasted. I am far from the best hr and yet I can keep up with most of the other dps out there.

but I do like having a bit of healing in end game dungeons. it can make a difference.

Ha ha yeah I get that healing is fairly pointless in end-game runs etc, there have been times in the past (when CN was the toughest dungeon) where I could carry the other 4 players as no other decent heals in the run. Finished it with over 10mil healing etc was pretty amusing

You whop out Helmite Paladin Ghost, with all your healing going on, he plants a mark on an enemy which spams out loads more healing ticks etc. Combine it with Fox's Cunning and you are incredibly hard to take down anywhere.

Also dont forget that Oak Skin also buffs DR by 12% (it was a little under when i worked it out ages ago) which just adds a little more suvivability.

Anyhoo I wasnt mentioning it for DPS reasons... just for a bit of fun.

wdj40

As far as I can tell Transfusion is bugged for us HR or we have absolutely no way of proccing it. It is the 4th Ravenloft Boon and gives a HoT when you heal an Ally for more than 10% HP.

Running around with my Companion and Maze Inspiration ticks for 20k or 30k with Oak Skin but Transfusion never procs. Also tried the Legendary Lion Mount where you or an ally get hit and get 10% HP back... still did not see any Transfusion procs.

I cant think of anything else that could proc it so its a Boon that we cant even use

I will try this healing build in PvP in a mo and see if anything procs etc and what its like in a group setting. I am imagining I will survive for a bit but not be able to kill anything, I will probably get abused somewhat too.

Problem is testing anything in the current state of PvP is completely impossible, stunned>prone>dead does not allow much room for testing things.

rafaelda

yep agreed that the healing HR would not be usefull in endgame dungeons but would be fun/usefull when soling content as an extra loudout...

have to try that on preview later

wdj40

The other annoying thing is that the Magistrates Mount Insignia Bonus only half works for us too... We get the ticks of damage on Crits but as Oak Skin cannot crit we cannot get small healing ticks from the 2nd part of that bonus.

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wdj40

ibemin0x said:

@wdj40 I'd be happy with either that or a dmg increase per stack and leave it as it is

Sorry I am unsure what you mean... do you mean Stacks of Aspect of the Serpent?

If so yes I think they should not put a 3rd stack at the moment. I like that they have listened and we should be able to build both Melee and Ranged stacks much faster... I am imagining there is no Neutral stack count for it but will have to wait for it to come to xbox.

tassedethe13

If you gonna play buff, you will need fast rotation so trapper should be better than archery and combat.

If you buff, you don't need aspect of serpent, so why worry about stacks?

wdj40

tassedethe13 said:

If you gonna play buff, you will need fast rotation so trapper should be better than archery and combat.

If you buff, you don't need aspect of serpent, so why worry about stacks?

Because using a Buff Power of any type does not consume a stack of AotS, leaving the damaging powers to do more damage in the long run.

There is not a lot better for the Pathfinder path really... Aspect of the Pack is pretty much a must... everything else is either situational or plain useless. Leaving Serpent as a very good choice... 2 stacks is a huge damage buff and the 1 stack is not bad.

tassedethe13

Huge damage buff for you only. If you play as buffer, you have to buff others, that's why I said you don't have to worry about the stacks as you don't aim to dps.

wdj40

tassedethe13 said:

Huge damage buff for you only. If you play as buffer, you have to buff others, that's why I said you don't have to worry about the stacks as you don't aim to dps.

Just because you buff does not mean you cannot do DPS at the same time. You can do both if you want to, you are not restricted to using 6 Buff Encounters and not attacking at all or something.

tassedethe13

True, but the way buff works, it will always be better to go full buff than use a dps spell instead of a buffer one.

wdj40

tassedethe13 said:

True, but the way buff works, it will always be better to go full buff than use a dps spell instead of a buffer one.

Ok well if you are going to join in and say things like this. Please post your suggested rotation and what powers you would use etc.

Most buff powers have an opposite which is not a buff power. Like Oak Skin has Binding Shot... Stag Heart has Commanding Shot... Longstriders has Gushing Wound... Throw Caution has Split the Sky etc etc.

Aspect of the Serpent is one of the best Passives you can equip regardless of which Path or Paragon you go down... hell its even amazing without 5 points in making it better in the Trapper Tree.

I even use it somtimes on my PvP Archer who has 10 points into the Trapper Tree for Deft Strike to combine that with AotS.

jonkoca

I threw a buff build together today. Took all the trapper cooldown feats, then stamina / ap gains from the other trees, gave up on dps so didn't take any capstones. Took all the defensive/recovery/stamina boons. Took int and con for initial stats for recovery and HP. Pathfinder for the primal buff feature. Pack for the other.

Spam Lss, fox dodge, and disruptive for ranged. Spam hawkeye and foxshift, and careful attack. Pretty much straight backtoback rotations, LSS up all the time when in a party. Good dps buff and a dodge. Shepherds up every rotation too. Slashers mark an option too.

Didn't change my gear from my normal combat loadout, but if you want a more dedicated buffer, I guess defense, deflect and recovery focus.

thefiresidecat

so was careful attack fixed?

jonkoca

Nah, but it helps with cooldowns.

jazzfong

@jonkaca,
1. For buff HR is archery SW build better than PF trapper? Using the 40% ranged cd feat and Aim Shot 1 sec cd reduction, Disruptive Shot with Stormstep Action.
2. Is Armor of Quick Recovery a must?
3. Lightning or Vorpal?

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jonkoca

jazzfong said:

@jonkaca,
1. For buff HR is archery SW build better than PF trapper? Using the 40% ranged cd feat and Aim Shot 1 sec cd reduction, Disruptive Shot with Stormstep Action.
2. Is Armor of Quick Recovery a must?
3. Lightning or Vorpal?

Only pathfinder has the new primal instincts or whatever it's called class feature. That improves your hawkeye buff. Trapper feats just mean no cooldowns at all. Rotation is Foxdodge, LSS, disruptive, switch, hawkeye, foxshift (doesnt need target, but cools down ranged) apply careful attack, switch, repeat. Use thirst artifact for debuff on enemy. Any old armor will do, but recovery, defense, deflect etc. would be nice.

Weapon enchant wise, don't think it matters, something that buffs party like plague or holy perhaps.

Basically, stay alive and spam buffs, forget the paingiver, unless the party main dps is HAMSTER, then just switch to normal SW combat loadout and take over.

wdj40

I doubt I will even play Mod 15... With the way things stand they have destroyed my 2 main loadouts. Archer in PvP and PF Trapper in PvE.

I tried a loadout the other day which would be something like what to expect in Mod 15. So in PvP I took off Stillness of the Forest etc and it was terrible.

I just tried PvP a few mins ago with my current loadout and spent the entire game stunned so I ended up just rage quitting... Went straight to dashboard and I probably wont even load NW up for a while now if at all.

Trapper in PvE is good but a but underpowered so what have they done? Lower the damage output!
Archer in PvP is squishy and 240k Heath vanishes in less than 2 seconds against pretty much every class... the only thing it had going for it was it could kill players when they are not grouped up... so what have they done? Kept the squishyness as it is and lower the damage output by a huge amount!

I just dont have the heart to play this heap of rubbish anymore... its gone from the best MMO combat experience to one I cant even tolerate anymore.

auntjimima

@jonkoca

Sounds like a cool idea FOR NOT A LOT OF INVESTMENT AWAY FROM THE MAIN DPS LOADOUT BUILDS. I especially think it's interesting that you opt out of taking any capstone feat in favor of dipping into other trees for more Buffy stuffy.

You should or someone should make a quick mmominds or more official detailed build post somewhere else of this "alt buffer loadout". I'm curious about more than just what the is in this thread: character sheet points, all feats, all boons, etc...

Good talk here. Looking forward to potentially buying a 4th loadout for this.

Ps. Pvp is dead.
I am also sad for this... Especially with the state of the hr pvp right now. But I still think this game cool, just less cool ATM.

auntjimima

@jonkoca

Interesting build concept.. I find the idea of not taking any capstone feats intriguing. I am curious for more info.

Especially since I believe this build is designed to be an alt to DPS loadouts. A good DPS loadout requires more precise build therfore should demand the most resources to making it effective. A good buffer build is not as dependant on such min/maxing as a DPS build...

I am not $$, nor do I scheme, but I would most likely thrift another loadout from the zen store for a buffer build like this.

Good work. Cheers!

jonkoca

Hadn't thought about it but yeah, cheap build. Utility comes from feats and powers, all free at lvl70. Boons just improve survivability. Gear free from hunts. Dps not an issue so no need even to refine weapon / neck-waist sets. Lol. Lesser soul, cheap wep. enchant, use dps loadout for enough IL to get in and you're good to go.

Ultimate irony, did CR for the first time with this build yesterday, after a mod of not getting invited on my dps build.

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wdj40

ibemin0x said:

@wdj40 it is sad but hey we have to be the resistance bro. trapper is too good to be forgotten. now, what they did to it this mod is just awful. no consideration at all for the hrs that dont want to be pseudo-gwfs. it baffles me that the devs dont even have the decency to address the issues. sad really =(

Yeah the complete lack of care or feedback has left me just annoyed and frustrated. I love this game and have easily passed other games I have put time into by a significant margin. I dont mind all the game changes they make as will adapt etc... but the class changes are terrible and just keep getting worse and worse. So much so that I cant bring myself to play much anymore.

I ran a quick PUG in PvE last night.... after 3 runs of Throne the 4th popped, loaded up oh hey Throne again I just quit out and logged off. I have dropped my PvP loadouts already as there is no point in that anymore. Stunned to death is not fun in the slightest lol.

The PUG's I ran last night I was using Combat, its just so boring compared to Trapper. It dishes out the damage but I never wanted to be a Melee character in the 1st place.

All this and more has left me deciding to hang up my NW boots and move on to the next MMO that is coming out. My VIP runs out in 7 days so that will be it for me. I wont un-install though as I will keep an eye on things and if improved in the future there is no reason not to come back into it