Make boons account-wide

pantha7

signet of patronage is useless since you need to have 100% campaign completion on main...i don't understand its use...also it's very time consuming doing daily quests, specially farming and grinding old campaigns from mod 3.
WHY alts need to pass the torment of grinding 'OLD STUFF' to get boons while you could just make the boons account-wide and share them with our main..so so so so so simple as that ...it coudn't be more simplier than that cryptic devs...srsly ..who had the smartest ever idea of signet of patronage to help supposedly players...? i think i have made that question before..can't remember,any cryptic devs wanna answer about it ?

mebengalsfan

They make money off players who want to forgo running the campaign on alts or on their main. If they removed that it would be an income loss for PWE/Cryptic.

I completed all campaigns on 3 characters up to Chult. It is not hard once you learn each campaign quick way to complete it.

greywynd

Signet of Patronage accelerates the grind. Originally, IWD took 35 days to complete; 10 rep/day. With the addition of the demon hunter and HEs that was reduced to 18 days; an additional 10 rep from the hunter. Now, using a Patronage token IWD can be fully completed in 9 days.

greywynd

As for the rest, yes, you actually have to have completed each campaign completely first, and gather additional currencies from the campaign on one character before you can fashion a Patronage token.

Can I ask you, seriously, why do you play a game in which you want to avoid playing?

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oldtimer

Campaign completions should have been made account wide a long time ago. Boons are extremely important and why we are still forced to mindlessly grind or PAY for buffs from obsolete content we grinded for months to be made available to us again on every single new character we ever make is beyond me. It doesn't help that the sheer number of campaigns we have now is ridiculous and we get a new one every mod.

Patronage tokens and campaign buyouts the way they are now are not acceptable. I am NEVER buying a campaign completion as long as it applies to just one character and even with patronage tokens i could barely stoumach running the old campaigns for the third time in a year without stabbing myself in the face.

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greywynd

tiberiusrex#6660 said:

there is more to this game than grinding old campaigns for the 90th time. that's a disingenuous question imo. I'm still playing this game and I too have zero desire to grind out old campaigns for my alts. it's not fun. there are things you can be doing that are a lot more gratifying.

The game is based on character. Not account. You don't want to run old content don't start a new character and expect all the bells and whistles your other characters earned.

marnival

If they want to get new players that can run end content or at least be a part of the last 2 campains it is probably a good idea to include the first 8-10 caimpains for new characters.

If you enter a game and find out that it will take you 3-6 month time to even get close to the new content some will pay their way there some will grind their way there but the absolute majority will tire and find another game.

This is not probably this is a well knowed fact and the longer a game has been on market the harder it is to attract new players for just this reason. The balance how much of old game content new players will pay for vs just leave is ofc a case by case basis.

But giving new players or old players that tired of their characters access to the benifits of earlier compains in form of boons etc will make more stay that is also a knowed fact.

In some of my earlier game you could buy a transfer from your account to another with characters making it very easy for you to invite friends to play the game by giving them an allready playable character, something I think would make this game more attractive to inviting friends of existing players.

Sure some would use it to sell well geared/equipped characters but for cryptic that is a lesser matter if it would attract more players in the end....

greywynd

marnival said:

If they want to get new players that can run end content or at least be a part of the last 2 campains it is probably a good idea to include the first 8-10 caimpains for new characters.

If you enter a game and find out that it will take you 3-6 month time to even get close to the new content some will pay their way there some will grind their way there but the absolute majority will tire and find another game.

This is not probably this is a well knowed fact and the longer a game has been on market the harder it is to attract new players for just this reason. The balance how much of old game content new players will pay for vs just leave is ofc a case by case basis.

But giving new players or old players that tired of their characters access to the benifits of earlier compains in form of boons etc will make more stay that is also a knowed fact.

In some of my earlier game you could buy a transfer from your account to another with characters making it very easy for you to invite friends to play the game by giving them an allready playable character, something I think would make this game more attractive to inviting friends of existing players.

Sure some would use it to sell well geared/equipped characters but for cryptic that is a lesser matter if it would attract more players in the end....

Campaign completion tokens.

Patronage tokens.

Buying a Level 70.

The options are there, but all of them require SOME effort be made by the character in question

marnival

greywynd said:

marnival said:

If they want to get new players that can run end content or at least be a part of the last 2 campains it is probably a good idea to include the first 8-10 caimpains for new characters.

If you enter a game and find out that it will take you 3-6 month time to even get close to the new content some will pay their way there some will grind their way there but the absolute majority will tire and find another game.

This is not probably this is a well knowed fact and the longer a game has been on market the harder it is to attract new players for just this reason. The balance how much of old game content new players will pay for vs just leave is ofc a case by case basis.

But giving new players or old players that tired of their characters access to the benifits of earlier compains in form of boons etc will make more stay that is also a knowed fact.

In some of my earlier game you could buy a transfer from your account to another with characters making it very easy for you to invite friends to play the game by giving them an allready playable character, something I think would make this game more attractive to inviting friends of existing players.

Sure some would use it to sell well geared/equipped characters but for cryptic that is a lesser matter if it would attract more players in the end....

Campaign completion tokens.

Patronage tokens.

Buying a Level 70.

The options are there, but all of them require SOME effort be made by the character in question

As stated before very few players will enter a game paying 200+€ for a starting fee, once they get hooked perhaps but if you get 10 to play but loose 1000 because of it the probability is that the 1000 will pay more in the long run.

We do not have the numbers for that statistic to be sure but earlier proven games has and this game is most likely not an exception to the case.

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gromovnipljesak

greywynd said:

marnival said:

If they want to get new players that can run end content or at least be a part of the last 2 campains it is probably a good idea to include the first 8-10 caimpains for new characters.

If you enter a game and find out that it will take you 3-6 month time to even get close to the new content some will pay their way there some will grind their way there but the absolute majority will tire and find another game.

This is not probably this is a well knowed fact and the longer a game has been on market the harder it is to attract new players for just this reason. The balance how much of old game content new players will pay for vs just leave is ofc a case by case basis.

But giving new players or old players that tired of their characters access to the benifits of earlier compains in form of boons etc will make more stay that is also a knowed fact.

In some of my earlier game you could buy a transfer from your account to another with characters making it very easy for you to invite friends to play the game by giving them an allready playable character, something I think would make this game more attractive to inviting friends of existing players.

Sure some would use it to sell well geared/equipped characters but for cryptic that is a lesser matter if it would attract more players in the end....

Campaign completion tokens.

Patronage tokens.

Buying a Level 70.

The options are there, but all of them require SOME effort be made by the character in question

"The intent is to provide players with a sense of pride and accomplishment for unlocking different heroes."

I'd definitely have a sense of pride and accomplishment when I neglect my 3rd born child to death because I was too busy grinding out SOMI boons.

mebengalsfan

The grind here is not that bad.

In DCUO the main thing you go after is feats; feats give you skill point and skill points give you stats. In that game when I left groups wanted players with over 200 SP and players complained it was hard to get some older feats that would help them get 200+. Getting feats in that game is way more of a grind than this game.

I took 6 months off and when I came back in under two months I completed 2 characters STK/SOMI without any issues in about 2 months and CoA as well. I also completed Chult on 3 characters during that same time. STK takes about 30 minutes, CoA about 10-20 minutes and Chult 1 day out of the week roughly 1-2 hours and I was done. I did not do the campaign during the weekends as I focused on dungeons, mostly t9.

The grind is not that bad. I know a few players new took their new character through all of the campaigns in roughly 2-3 months.

If you want to complete all campaigns up to STK, save up 8500 zen and buy the campaign completion token with a 15% off coupon or wait until the services are on sale.

I bought 2 of those during the 50% off sale in November for my HR and SW.

There are options and the grind is not that bad. If you want to talk about a grind, go talk to anyone who played EQ back in the day, that was a grind. This is a joke and not that bad.

givearandomname

who has time for campaigns i mean seriously i spend 6 hours a day just farming diamonds everything is so expensive it will be years before i even have enough to be caught up gear wise to everyone else who has the time to waste on doing another 6 hours of campaign quests every single day for another month or two lol

givearandomname

the biggest thing they need to do is stop up scaling the old content and calling it new content old camp should have never been leveld up to 70 but with them uping the level to old content they can be lazy with making new stuff.

oldbaldyone

I think New players should have to go through the campaigns. Streamline them if you want, but I think that content and experience is valuable. Removing the time gates would probably be enough for most people (have the quests reset every 15 mins or something).

For alts...account wide is a stretch. They have always held the idea that they would rather have 50 people buy something at $100, than 500 people buy something at 10. Not sure why, but it is what it is. I think a further reduction in currency costs, more so for each toon till you basically just have to get 1 currency for each turn in or something would be fine. Little effort, but not a ton.

2 cents.

mebengalsfan

givearandomname said:

who has time for campaigns i mean seriously i spend 6 hours a day just farming diamonds everything is so expensive it will be years before i even have enough to be caught up gear wise to everyone else who has the time to waste on doing another 6 hours of campaign quests every single day for another month or two lol

Here is how you do it if you are new to NW...

Play your character from level 1-70. As you do this run your daily skirmish and dungeon. Save the AD. Use the seals to buy R6 echantments

Once you complete the EE campaign you should be 70. You have saved all of the AD. Buy a Con Artist for 2 gold, buy R8 bondings and rank up your conartist up to Blue. If you have AD left, go into the AH and buy +2 Chult rings. If you still have AD left buy Teak Weapons, pioneer boots and armor/weapon enchantment if you can afford it.

Start your campaign task and if you are high enough play the T1 and T2 dungeons. If you are VIP use all of your daily keys on that one character. Over time your IL will raise, you will unlock T3 content and you will gain refinement to upgrade your gear.

By the time you are done playing all of the campaigns your artifacts should be legendary, your weapons, neck and waist will be near legendary or legendary. Your IL will go from a meager 6K if that to over 12K and your bonding will go from R8 all the way to R12+.

The reason the campaign is there is to help gear up the toon artifacts, artifact gear, runestones, enchantments, etc... not having those to play, you simply miss out on ranking up your character. As someone who has two alts that purchased the campaign token they missed out on all that refinement and instead of being 14K+, they are only 13K and that is with them being in a GH 20.

marnival

mebengalsfan#9264 said:

The grind here is not that bad.

In DCUO the main thing you go after is feats; feats give you skill point and skill points give you stats. In that game when I left groups wanted players with over 200 SP and players complained it was hard to get some older feats that would help them get 200+. Getting feats in that game is way more of a grind than this game.

I took 6 months off and when I came back in under two months I completed 2 characters STK/SOMI without any issues in about 2 months and CoA as well. I also completed Chult on 3 characters during that same time. STK takes about 30 minutes, CoA about 10-20 minutes and Chult 1 day out of the week roughly 1-2 hours and I was done. I did not do the campaign during the weekends as I focused on dungeons, mostly t9.

The grind is not that bad. I know a few players new took their new character through all of the campaigns in roughly 2-3 months.

If you want to complete all campaigns up to STK, save up 8500 zen and buy the campaign completion token with a 15% off coupon or wait until the services are on sale.

I bought 2 of those during the 50% off sale in November for my HR and SW.

There are options and the grind is not that bad. If you want to talk about a grind, go talk to anyone who played EQ back in the day, that was a grind. This is a joke and not that bad.

I come from EQ1 back in the day and no game in todays world would make it as it was then. If you as I come from that background we are not a good example for what we consider dueble when it comes to grinding (hell epic weapons took 6 mounth easy not to mention shawl quest that was insane). The downtime between fights was 90 % and when you died you lost exp that could take days to recover yea that was hardcore grinding for sure.

What you say is true but the other side of the coin is how many more player would you get by making things easer for them to reach the end game without to much grinding compared to those willing to grind/pay.

Looking on succesful games and given that the wide playerbase do not have time to play every day and most of them only a couple of hours when they do 5-6 month time or 200€+ is most likely not the best way to go.....

gromovnipljesak

The problem isn't whether it's hard or it takes time or whatever.

The problem is, it's really, really HAMSTER boring.

greywynd

Then do something that isn't.

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gromovnipljesak

greywynd said:

Then do something that isn't.

That's not how you keep an audience. You do know the good ol' "Customer is king", right?
And besides, doing other content can take you only so far. That will get boring too, as we've already done our fair share of grind in those dungeons before.

dairyzeus

Boons give item level, and item level is a rough indication of time spent on a character.

Giving all alts potentially all free boons would lead to even more cases of fresh inexperienced lvl 70s in endgame content unable to appropriately play their role.

However, I do wish signets of patronage were completely free. That way you don't have to keep grinding on your main for the currencies, you considerably cut down the time for each set of boons on alts, while still forcing alts to spend some time in each zone if they want the boons.

namelesshero347

Yup. The game already have many 11/12K-ish toons who hit the numbers with equipment and guild boons, but are not good at their role. Give them free boons and it will be hard to tell which BiS player is actually good.

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namelesshero347

tiberiusrex#6660 said:

they don't get good doing campaigns and the boons aren't good enough to even begin to make them look bis. but it might help them make it thru some of the things they que for a little easier. and give them a little more surviviability which will make it easier on every one else

On the Temple forum, there is a "new DC question" post. The OP is a 14K DC asking that question. Pretty sure he brought all equipment, including boons. Imagine the game full of toons like that.

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oldtimer

dairyzeus said:

Boons give item level, and item level is a rough indication of time spent on a character.

Giving all alts potentially all free boons would lead to even more cases of fresh inexperienced lvl 70s in endgame content unable to appropriately play their role.

However, I do wish signets of patronage were completely free. That way you don't have to keep grinding on your main for the currencies, you considerably cut down the time for each set of boons on alts, while still forcing alts to spend some time in each zone if they want the boons.

If i want to learn a new class i'm not going to do it by grinding 54 different boons 4 hours a day for 4+ months doing quests that are so easy even bots can do them. Only things i learned from doing dailies on a low geared char is that gorillas in Omu are overpowered and smash my face in and that i never want to do these boring, easy and mostly horribly outdated campaigns ever again.

Doing campaigns more than once is dumb, a waste of time and should not exist this far into the game's life. Also right now you can buy 46 of the boons if you drop 13k Zen for campaign completions and that will only reward you 1380 IL which is less than what a companion with rank 7 enchants and IG +3 gear gives you and a companion like that can be bought and geared up for less than 50k AD in some cases.

All new accounts should have to go through all the campaigns this is a no brainer but once they are completed fully at 100% including all boons/hunts they should be unlocked account wide just like dungeons/trials are now. Remove the patronage tokens and remove Zen store campaign completions to prevent people with more money than brains buying out almost all the boons and using them. Not that 1380 IL will make that much of a difference for someone that has and is willing to spend a ton of cash to get BIS gear and enchants right off the bat.

There are plenty of things that make this game horribly alt and new player unfriendly that should be changed. 10 campaigns,3 of them two parters, with one new one that takes 2-3 months of grinding being introduced with every new module is one of them. Forcing players to spend 4 months grinding or drop 130$ PER CHARACTER and still spend 4 months grinding just to get boons is just stupidity and greed.

gromovnipljesak

dairyzeus said:

Boons give item level, and item level is a rough indication of time spent on a character.

Giving all alts potentially all free boons would lead to even more cases of fresh inexperienced lvl 70s in endgame content unable to appropriately play their role.

However, I do wish signets of patronage were completely free. That way you don't have to keep grinding on your main for the currencies, you considerably cut down the time for each set of boons on alts, while still forcing alts to spend some time in each zone if they want the boons.

To be fair, someone who has completed those campaigns probably knows what they're supposed to do on their fresh alts by the time it actually matters. I honestly doubt that someone will attempt to make a healer GWF. And lately people seem to realize IL ain't everything, so it matters even less (especially considering the fact that i have 3k+ hours on my main, and don't have all boons 'cause SOMI is gluteus maximus cancer).