> @kalina311 said: > +1 @macjae comments saved me the trouble of typing a full reply : D > > @mikal#9243 > why are you using a sub optimal pvp /pvp hybrid builds as the base line for optimal Pvp Tr performance .. > perhaps you are missing the enchants and that is the grounds of your whole argument ..if you could use any enchant you want on your Tr in pvp no cost bared would you be using your current ones in pvp ?
I ran executioner for the better part of 2 years, since i run pve content far more i found that executioner (IN MY OPINION) is far too limited for my tastes. Its a single target focussed path and on occassions it was just a pain in the HAMSTER clearing mobs. Saboteur actually makes AOE abilities like POTB viable. At no point did i claim that this was an optimal build for any mode, it just makes playing a rogue more fun for me personally. I get faster cooldowns, quicker stealth regen, faster AP gain and better AOE effectiveness. For ME its just better.
-w- I’ll admit I don’t pvp that often, quite a decent bit more since the changes, but I’ll admit the class I’ve had the Hardest time killing was Pally’s, due HP... But as for tankiness TR wins, I’ve only ran into one or two really good tr’s that literally are so tanky they can stand still and you can whack away at them barely making a dent... Cx While others you drop in one-shot. Lol Hue Hue now I vanish~ ^.^
> why are you using a sub optimal pvp /pvp hybrid builds as the base line for optimal Pvp Tr performance ..
> perhaps you are missing the enchants and that is the grounds of your whole argument ..if you could use any enchant you want on your Tr in pvp no cost bared would you be using your current ones in pvp ?
I ran executioner for the better part of 2 years, since i run pve content far more i found that executioner (IN MY OPINION) is far too limited for my tastes. Its a single target focussed path and on occassions it was just a pain in the HAMSTER clearing mobs. Saboteur actually makes AOE abilities like POTB viable. At no point did i claim that this was an optimal build for any mode, it just makes playing a rogue more fun for me personally. I get faster cooldowns, quicker stealth regen, faster AP gain and better AOE effectiveness. For ME its just better.
I too love sab path
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demonmongerMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,350Arc User
I would be disagreeing with facts if you was actually presenting any. Rogues were altered to make stealth far less effective and drain twice as fast, instantly on encounter powers.
Feel free to show when they pulled that "change."
It's true tr stealth did get nerfed to consume stealth from at will damage and contact damage at a higher rate. Also itc got nerfed into the ground. Wicked reminder got nerfed. Impact shot got nerfed. Courage breaker got nerfed. ShockING exe got nerfed. Smoke bomb got nerfed.
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kalina311Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 2,082Arc User
You guys keep complaning about TR yet i don't see anyone complaining about other classes lmao. About saber, i didn't know he was better than all of you on pc. Gwf better than other classes. From the look of his stats.. it seems he played a lot in premades and since he can't tank vs a tr proves he's not that good at all. Im playing on xbox so i don't really care if he's the best gwf or not.
Sorry, Saber don't play in premade, that stat are from solo Q only, maybe that on Xbox GWF still have not understood how build up for PvP properly. ( just Maybe )
Why don't you go make a tr, get your deflect up to 50%, use ITC with 25k recovery and fight against some good cw's with lightning enchant or op's, dps dc's, even stealthed ITC will not save you from radiant damage.
Sure, i know a TR that killed the configuration that you has just wrote NAKED, mod 12b, with just primary and secondary weapon + 4 artifact. Kill both the DC and the CW, the OP has taked just 1 minute more. ( read well pls, NAKED, the other class was full 14, unparalled and full pvp player, not exactly what i will call pug )
So many things in game can be used against a tr such as Thunderhead enchant, curse rings, stealth reveal rings, sandy pants, shadowclad, lightning enchant yet you come here saying why tr have high deflect severity.
Sorry, on PC most of the item that you have selected are used by people that don't know how to play and require an help from a broken item. Usually used by Pug, but you will never see on PC a PM with curse ring, reveal ring and so on.
I can also say this - Why can a gf shield absorb 90k sod and kill any class in no time ? Their prone and stuns are long enough to get your hp to 10% or kill you < gf broken. Why can pally do that amount of damage and being tanky af. When i hit them, all i see is 0, 0, 0, 0 damage. < pally broken.
Just L2P here,i don't know BiS PVP TR that have difficult to kill GF or OP, usually they are gone with 1, max 2 rotation.
Devo pallies healing still op in group. It looks like the healing depression doesn't affect devo pallies. We don't want that kind of healing in pvp. Dc healing is still OP. We don't want that much of healing in pvp.
Totally agree, there are DC and OP Healer that seems unaffected by the healing Depression, but should be balanced well, otherwise they will be left with nothing.
You guys keep complaning about TR yet i don't see anyone complaining about other classes lmao. About saber, i didn't know he was better than all of you on pc.
I think that you must search around in the forum, there are recent post for the GF too.
Lol i stopped trying to argue with these people. The argument here is "rogues need nerfing because SHUT UP". Some of the most well known TR players in the game posted a thread not long ago about rogue rebalancing, it was a very comprehensive and well written post about TR short comings and how to address them fairly. I would suggest that you all go and read it and then tell those players that they dont understand how to build a rogue lol good luck with that.
Lol i stopped trying to argue with these people. The argument here is "rogues need nerfing because SHUT UP".
Some of the most well known TR players in the game posted a thread not long ago about rogue rebalancing, it was a very comprehensive and well written post about TR short comings and how to address them fairly. I would suggest that you all go and read it and then tell those players that they dont understand how to build a rogue lol good luck with that.
How old are you? Because this is only meaningful question that comes to my mind after all posts.
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kalina311Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 2,082Arc User
I stopped reading this thread after I saw the comments about thunderhead enchants, Sandy pants, and curse bringer rings being a problem for TRs..... It's like no one understands how ITC works, and the fact that it's up pretty much up ALL THE TIME! I mean to quote Zoolander:
"Doesn't anyone else notice this??? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!!!!"
I stopped reading this thread after I saw the comments about thunderhead enchants, Sandy pants, and curse bringer rings being a problem for TRs..... It's like no one understands how ITC works, and the fact that it's up pretty much up ALL THE TIME! I mean to quote Zoolander:
"Doesn't anyone else notice this??? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!!!!"
I should stop reading your post since you clearly know that you can't have itc all the time unless you have crazy high recovery and even if you are stunned and you use itc you get stunned again by another item or another player. You should know since you play tr too But you don't care cuz you love playing broken gf and pally more
Your right I play a TR and have never experienced any of the problems you are talking about with cc, and I use a negation which should make it worse.
ITC removes all but prones on use, makes you immune to stuns, grants guaranteed deflect, and you don't need crazy high recovery with cooldown reduction feats in the sabo tree to keep it up continuously when comboed with bloodbath (30k is enough to give about a 1 second CD, which is easy enough with silveries and pots). I feel like you need to go and practice some more on how to use this power effectively, build correctly, and how to cycle dodges to avoid getting proned. In the mean time please stop posting nonsense.
I stopped reading this thread after I saw the comments about thunderhead enchants, Sandy pants, and curse bringer rings being a problem for TRs..... It's like no one understands how ITC works, and the fact that it's up pretty much up ALL THE TIME! I mean to quote Zoolander:
"Doesn't anyone else notice this??? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!!!!"
I should stop reading your post since you clearly know that you can't have itc all the time unless you have crazy high recovery and even if you are stunned and you use itc you get stunned again by another item or another player. You should know since you play tr too But you don't care cuz you love playing broken gf and pally more
Mmmmmm,ok....... regarding the "unless you have crazy high recovery"......please, someone pass the right build to this guy, at last he will have fun on xbox.
Your right I play a TR and have never experienced any of the problems you are talking about with cc, and I use a negation which should make it worse.
ITC removes all but prones on use, makes you immune to stuns, grants guaranteed deflect, and you don't need crazy high recovery with cooldown reduction feats in the sabo tree to keep it up continuously when comboed with bloodbath (30k is enough to give about a 1 second CD, which is easy enough with silveries and pots). I feel like you need to go and practice some more on how to use this power effectively, build correctly, and how to cycle dodges to avoid getting
proned. In the mean time please stop posting nonsense.
You're saying i am lying ? i can make a video now. I have 22k recovery without in combat. 25k in combat. I am 3 sec away from having permanent itc. With cooldowns from saboteur i am 2 seconds away. Im not wasting points in saboteur cuz i have to Sacrifice dps for 1 second less cooldown. I can make a video how hard i can be hit by a gf's biggest burst encounter power while having stealthed itc with 85% deflect severity. If i remember correctly, last time a gf took 50% of my hp (190k hp) while i had stealthed itc. Think about it... without stealthed itc i would be dead with 1 burst attack which proves tank classes such as gf and pally are more broken. Now im going off-topic, tank classes should not be strikers. Their damage output shouldn't be higher than cw, hr, sw and tr !
I stopped reading this thread after I saw the comments about thunderhead enchants, Sandy pants, and curse bringer rings being a problem for TRs..... It's like no one understands how ITC works, and the fact that it's up pretty much up ALL THE TIME! I mean to quote Zoolander:
"Doesn't anyone else notice this??? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!!!!"
I should stop reading your post since you clearly know that you can't have itc all the time unless you have crazy high recovery and even if you are stunned and you use itc you get stunned again by another item or another player. You should know since you play tr too But you don't care cuz you love playing broken gf and pally more
Mmmmmm,ok....... regarding the "unless you have crazy high recovery"......please, someone pass the right build to this guy, at last he will have fun on xbox.
Well, why don't you make a video. Show use you can have permanent itc with 25k recovery without using saboteur feats. Im sure you can't, why ? because 1) you don't have a tr or 2) you don't have 25k recovery (lol)
Well, why don't you make a video. Show use you can have permanent itc with 25k recovery without using saboteur feats. Im sure you can't, why ? because 1) you don't have a tr or 2) you don't have 25k recovery (lol)
Permanent itc? You wanna become even more tanky of what you already are? Seems that you are missing the point, the defensive mechanic of TR is not just ITC, but a good rotation of skill.
Kirin, for example, he can do 1 vs 1 almost without be visible and non targettable at all, if he need,or make some error, itc ( well, usually if the enemy survive, he usually take your life after 1 bloodbath+sod ).
Your class has, and i'm not the only one that say it, the best defensive mechanic of all the game, and you , with a broken SoD, an incredible defence system, crying because can't fight agains a GF properly? Put it in this way, your comparing the "best broken class" vs the "just broken class".
The problem is that you are using the most broken one and still losing to GF. What should do all the other player with the other class? Nerf this and that because i can kill them? He killed me, impossible, he must be nerfed!
You wanna be more tanky so that you can survive the GF damage ( still the best spike damage in pvp in my opinion) or Nerf the GF damage so and bla bla bla.
Ok, i'm a poor CW, i wanna sod nerf, gf shield nerf, itc nerf , double damage on all my power and my shield on tab must add an extra 50% layer of deflect too, plus crit on assailant again hahahha, c'mon, you can't be serius.
I've understood that you must be in some way good on xbox, the only real suggestion that i can give is : PRATICE. Call your GF friend, go in iwd, or in a private dominion, and pratice, call good PVP GF, and pratice, after 100 times, you will be better, really.
Comments
> +1 @macjae comments saved me the trouble of typing a full reply : D
>
> @mikal#9243
> why are you using a sub optimal pvp /pvp hybrid builds as the base line for optimal Pvp Tr performance ..
> perhaps you are missing the enchants and that is the grounds of your whole argument ..if you could use any enchant you want on your Tr in pvp no cost bared would you be using your current ones in pvp ?
I ran executioner for the better part of 2 years, since i run pve content far more i found that executioner (IN MY OPINION) is far too limited for my tastes. Its a single target focussed path and on occassions it was just a pain in the HAMSTER clearing mobs. Saboteur actually makes AOE abilities like POTB viable. At no point did i claim that this was an optimal build for any mode, it just makes playing a rogue more fun for me personally. I get faster cooldowns, quicker stealth regen, faster AP gain and better AOE effectiveness. For ME its just better.
It's true tr stealth did get nerfed to consume stealth from at will damage and contact damage at a higher rate. Also itc got nerfed into the ground. Wicked reminder got nerfed. Impact shot got nerfed. Courage breaker got nerfed. ShockING exe got nerfed. Smoke bomb got nerfed.
"At no point did i claim that this was an optimal build for any mode, it just makes playing a rogue more fun for me personally"
and... we are done here folks lol yes you definitely are entitled to your "fun"
Cheers
Sure, i know a TR that killed the configuration that you has just wrote NAKED, mod 12b, with just primary and secondary weapon + 4 artifact. Kill both the DC and the CW, the OP has taked just 1 minute more. ( read well pls, NAKED, the other class was full 14, unparalled and full pvp player, not exactly what i will call pug ) Sorry, on PC most of the item that you have selected are used by people that don't know how to play and require an help from a broken item. Usually used by Pug, but you will never see on PC a PM with curse ring, reveal ring and so on. Just L2P here,i don't know BiS PVP TR that have difficult to kill GF or OP, usually they are gone with 1, max 2 rotation. Totally agree, there are DC and OP Healer that seems unaffected by the healing Depression, but should be balanced well, otherwise they will be left with nothing. I think that you must search around in the forum, there are recent post for the GF too.
Some of the most well known TR players in the game posted a thread not long ago about rogue rebalancing, it was a very comprehensive and well written post about TR short comings and how to address them fairly. I would suggest that you all go and read it and then tell those players that they dont understand how to build a rogue lol good luck with that.
"Doesn't anyone else notice this??? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!!!!"
¨˜ˆ”°¹~•-.„¸ρℓαуιиg иєνєяωιитєя ѕιи¢є 2015¸„.-•~¹°”ˆ˜¨
Your right I play a TR and have never experienced any of the problems you are talking about with cc, and I use a negation which should make it worse.
ITC removes all but prones on use, makes you immune to stuns, grants guaranteed deflect, and you don't need crazy high recovery with cooldown reduction feats in the sabo tree to keep it up continuously when comboed with bloodbath (30k is enough to give about a 1 second CD, which is easy enough with silveries and pots). I feel like you need to go and practice some more on how to use this power effectively, build correctly, and how to cycle dodges to avoid getting
proned. In the mean time please stop posting nonsense.
I have 22k recovery without in combat. 25k in combat. I am 3 sec away from having permanent itc. With cooldowns from saboteur i am 2 seconds away.
Im not wasting points in saboteur cuz i have to Sacrifice dps for 1 second less cooldown.
I can make a video how hard i can be hit by a gf's biggest burst encounter power while having stealthed itc with 85% deflect severity. If i remember correctly, last time a gf took 50% of my hp (190k hp) while i had stealthed itc. Think about it... without stealthed itc i would be dead with 1 burst attack which proves tank classes such as gf and pally are more broken. Now im going off-topic, tank classes should not be strikers. Their damage output shouldn't be higher than cw, hr, sw and tr !
¨˜ˆ”°¹~•-.„¸ρℓαуιиg иєνєяωιитєя ѕιи¢є 2015¸„.-•~¹°”ˆ˜¨
Well, why don't you make a video. Show use you can have permanent itc with 25k recovery without using saboteur feats.
Im sure you can't, why ? because 1) you don't have a tr or 2) you don't have 25k recovery (lol)
¨˜ˆ”°¹~•-.„¸ρℓαуιиg иєνєяωιитєя ѕιи¢є 2015¸„.-•~¹°”ˆ˜¨
But Tr should be tankier than tank classes,makes sence...
Mr Fantasy at least you have a fitting name as you clearly live in one jeeez and I thought demonmonger was living in denial lol....
Kirin, for example, he can do 1 vs 1 almost without be visible and non targettable at all, if he need,or make some error, itc ( well, usually if the enemy survive, he usually take your life after 1 bloodbath+sod ).
Your class has, and i'm not the only one that say it, the best defensive mechanic of all the game, and you , with a broken SoD, an incredible defence system, crying because can't fight agains a GF properly? Put it in this way, your comparing the "best broken class" vs the "just broken class".
The problem is that you are using the most broken one and still losing to GF.
What should do all the other player with the other class?
Nerf this and that because i can kill them? He killed me, impossible, he must be nerfed!
You wanna be more tanky so that you can survive the GF damage ( still the best spike damage in pvp in my opinion) or Nerf the GF damage so and bla bla bla.
Ok, i'm a poor CW, i wanna sod nerf, gf shield nerf, itc nerf , double damage on all my power and my shield on tab must add an extra 50% layer of deflect too, plus crit on assailant again hahahha, c'mon, you can't be serius.
I've understood that you must be in some way good on xbox, the only real suggestion that i can give is : PRATICE. Call your GF friend, go in iwd, or in a private dominion, and pratice, call good PVP GF, and pratice, after 100 times, you will be better, really.