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A minor suggestion when the TR rework comes in
shiva
Member Posts: 27 Arc User
My suggestion would be to extend the duration of some of our damage buffs, like cunning ambusher and invisible infliltrator. Its a little hard to utilize the damage buff in a short amount of time(5-6 seconds) considering some of our key powers have a moderate amount of animation time, like duelist flurry, lashing blade etc. If you can add atleast 3 more seconds on the duration, i believe it can realy help TRs in pve. What are your thoughts?
Post edited by shiva#4006 on
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> The million dollar question is....
>
> ...."when will this rework happen?"
>
>
it's been about a year? since they initially said tr would be next, followed by a trs are "insatiable" comment in the livestream to again we are next but instead sw gets a fairly hefty rework after only a few weeks of the owl bear nerf.
yea I'm not betting anytime soon cause if they wanted to they clearly could have done something. if they can do such a rework on sw in a few weeks when we've been waiting quite a bit longer.
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> > @morenthar said:
> > The million dollar question is....
> >
> > ...."when will this rework happen?"
> >
> >
>
> it's been about a year? since they initially said tr would be next, followed by a trs are "insatiable" comment in the livestream to again we are next but instead sw gets a fairly hefty rework after only a few weeks of the owl bear nerf.
>
> yea I'm not betting anytime soon cause if they wanted to they clearly could have done something. if they can do such a rework on sw in a few weeks when we've been waiting quite a bit longer.
SW is in a far worse state in than TR is. TR has great single target dps (better than SW) and it is crazy powerful in pvp because of SoD + CB + unmatchable survability.
The tweaks for SW aren't a "hefty rework" as they benefit the support tree (temptation) the most and warlock will still be the worst damage dealer. By the way you posted I assume you don't play a SW at all/enough to know what the stat of the class is.
I understand the complaint of having to try harder than other classes (like CW/GWF with lightning) to be competitive in dps but as you too have to deal with the pve stigma we SWs do (pve mindset of people who don't play either class is SW/TR= garbage, don't inv for endgame) then you shouldn't complain that, SW, the worst class in the game, is getting a few tweaks especially because they could potentially make people expect us to pretty much be forced to run as templocks in order to get an inv and I know I am not the only one who very much favours fury and argue that that's the spec that should be looked at first and foremost.
I remember, not too long ago, when SWs were one shotting bosses. TRs were looking for a rework then. I know both classes have problems right now, but, to be honest, TRs have been ignored far far longer. We haven't had anything but nerfs in pve since Mod 5.
Think about that for a minute. Mod 5. I'm not hating on SWs, but it is a false equivalency to state that SWs have some bigger need than TRs. You all have had a lot more attention over the years than we have had, and have, during that time, been on top.
Can we please, please get some word, @nitocris83
She Looked Lvl 18
Here is my Blog
I understand how it feels like to see one's class go unnoticed from devs and ir certainly isn't good, however, there are a few things I'd like to comment on:
- What SW is getting is not a rework but rather a few band aid fixes, if you have spent a decent amount of time playing a SW alt or running with a good SW friend/guildie/etc you'll know what the class problems are (at least a few of them) and will realize the mod 13 changes don't address some of them, like slow casting speed, powers take and need far too long to deal full damage (that is inferior to that of other damage dealers) and 2 of the capstones either need way too much time to deal full damage (fury capstone) as proc from powers that aren't that powerful to being with or it simply is far too underpowered (damnation)
SW will continue to be the worst damage dealer. From what I know, you're one of the best TRs on PC or at the very least much much better than average, you may have already noticed that TR > SW
Natsu stated the best TR he knows > the best SW he knows.
I have never seen (current state of the game and a few mods back) a SW in any platform hitting as hard as you top TRs can.
- Try to see it this way, you got told you were next for a year now but templocks have been waiting since mod 6 for a complete rework, they got told they were going to get one "soon" and there they are, waiting for mod 13 changes that, even though look promising, don't address some of the worst limitations the spec has, like lack of meaningful damage mitigation and inability to heal out of combat (unless the SW has quite a few spare pinatas)
- TR got its ability to stack immense amounts of power addressed, at least to some extent and it got given a new SoD as a band aid, it is very powerful in both pve and pvp. SW got owlbear, one of its maim sources of damage (with which was still inferior to other damage dealers), nerfed and the mod 13 SW thread you saw is our SoD band aid although unlike yours, it isn't that good that with a good player people will be "oh wow that guy hits incredibly hard!!" which is why SW will continue to be the inferior dps class, specific issues need to ve addressed.
- I think what matters more is what we have now and that's probably the reason devs took a look on SW,it simply is the worst class in the game, they overnerfed it and it will take a lot of time until they can undo some of the damage thry caused to the class.
If you think SW isn't in bigger need for help than TR then you can ask the best ones you can find to compare what those 2 classes are capable of, you can also transfer stuff to your SW alt (if you have one), run it some and it should be easy to spot some of the issues the class has. Try any spec and build you can come up with, still, good SW < good TR
Think about it, what would be the bigger issue, "what class is getting more attention?" or "what class needs more attention?" SW is inferior to TR in both pve and pvp and you can check that out in case you disagree, it makes sense to me that devs gave SW some time in which the dev came up with a few tweaks. Perfomance should be one of the factors why a class gets tweaks before others and as it has been seen, SW < TR so why not bringing that class in line with the rest then another class gets addressed? That would be TR.
- SW has been nerfed pretty hard as well, mod 10.5 TC fix (damage loss was up to 40% for the best SWs as calculated by fabricant and confirmed by fernu when he tested on preview) with no compensation is a prime example, the one thing that gave SW a change to compete or give other classes a run for their money got taken away and nothing was given to make up for that, "we will monitor how SW does" they said and you most likely know the rest, people started either moving to another classes or quitting the game and that still is happening, even after mod 13 changes were announced as SW will still be the weakest class in the game.
- Note that I'm not hating on TRs, just telling you what my point of view is as someone who runs a SW and have been through a similar issue you have, hopefully devs will get to give you guys the space and time needed to come with tweaks and fixes to what you guys have noticed the class needs to be looked at.
Check older threads and you will see us SWs have been in the same situation you are know, you'll see I posted about the state of SW in quite a few, no dev answer whatsoever in the majority of them until they started doing it and eventually came with the mod 13 thread, you may see a few devs quoting me regarding the state of the class. Don't give up guys, keep trying and you will eventually be given some attention as well.
@nitocris83
An official TR thread where a dev can be told and shown what the class needs and the issues it currently has would certainly help, they have been waiting for a rework for a long time now but it just keeps getting delayed over and over again.
Note that there's quite a huge stigma towards both SW and TR in pve because they don't have it as easy as other classes do to perform very well.
Let me help you understand, as you have helped me to understand better the SW.
Our powerstacking was nerfed completely. That is fine, I understand it wasn’t WAI.
But, you seem to think they gave us something in return. There you are incorrect.
The SoD buff was short lived on preview and done away with before it ever went live because of how it interacted when stacking power. They nerfed the power stacking and SoD, as well.
They decided to go with a different buff to SoD based on unmitigated damage, which makes TRs ridiculous in PVP and does absolutely nothing for PVE as, like everyone else, we have to carry enough armor pen to get past all damage resistance.
Also, a half dozen of the best TRs on PC came up with two threads exactly like you suggest last April when we were led to believe our rework was eminent. It had hundreds of responses. We had to beg a dev to even acknowledge they saw it.
I’m sorry you were nerfed a few mods ago. We have received NOTHING but nerfs since mod 5. We have been in this state for literally years. What mod were SWs introduced? How long ago was it you all were one shotting bosses? Your comment of “I know how you all feel” shows me that you really don’t.
I can appreciate you feel like SWs need some attention. Well, you are getting it. That, however, doesn’t take away the fact that TRs have been needing a rework for 3 years now, been continually misled about it, promised we were the next class to get worked on, and then get 2nd fiddled again. Now, while you all are getting attention, we can’t even get a response to many many requests to get some word- ANY word- on what the status on our rework is or even IF it is happening.
SWs need some help. That doesn’t excuse the Devs from a complete lack of communication to the TR community- that they have repeatedly misled- on the subject.
The fact that they are giving you all attention isn’t your fault and I don’t begrudge you all. I begrudge the Devs for once again telling the TRs one thing and then doing something else.
She Looked Lvl 18
Here is my Blog
Some funfacts, Natsu is an guildmate from me and he was (something like an month ago) interested about the state from SW comparing to Tr.
So we did an Fbi "Testrun" with an Tr from our Alliance (he asked me first, but i am not in the mood anymore to do "dps races", or better said i play worser if i am start to try hard, than i am normally do).
So both of them had similar gear, with the needed focus on Arpen, crit, power and recovery, the Tr is from an Gh20 guild, we were on R19, also not an big different.
So we start the run, the Ac wasn't using exaltation, and guess what happened, they where more or less on the same spot after the run.
We checked Paingiver, we checked Act, it wasn't a big different, Natsu was during Trash mob a little bit ahead, Draka (the Tr) was a little bit "better" against Bosses.
Act showed that Natsu dealt more overall dps, and Draka had higher burst dps and SoD Proccs.
So you say Sw needs some attention, you are right, but the same counts also imho still for the Tr.
And both classes need it Asap.
Personally for me it would be fine, if the devs made for us Trs also only some minor changes, like cancelling the chance to build bleeding stacks from duellist flurry (spoken from an Mi Exe pov).
One way or another severe nerfs have hit classes overall, SW has got a few of them not only a few mods ago but before that as well although fellow SWs who have been playing the class much longer and who understand the game better overall are more qualified to comment on that, I think @etelgrin and @schietindebux have been rocking SWs way before I even knew Neverwinter existed.
Hopefully devs will get to listen to you guys to get the class to a better state, it is certainly bad that no actions have been taken to tweak TR based on the feedback and testing of you top players.
@talon1970
How does Draka compared to @sirjimbofrancis and galatic underwear?
Anyway, it is true both SW and TR need tweaks and you guys have suggested good ones, I hope you'll get listened to.