I think RNG if it is broken as suggested above should be corrected, still more is likely related to a slight lucky or unlucky streak which occurs even flipping coins, I once flipped a quarter and had flipped head 9 out of 10 times, still I suspect it average out close to the percentages identified by cryptic. I also do believe RNG has -yes- I can't believe I'm saying this 'value' and adds suspense and mystery to the whole upgrade process, making it seem more mysterious/magical and I wouldn't want to see it gone, despite often sometimes being sad even when it fails.
So I say to plasticbat I think your a good guy and agree in principle with what your saying, but without RNG we wouldn't feel really amazing when it succeeds, I believe if our chances were improved a little the process it help address your concern! I agree with defiantone99 that more should be done to lowering of costs of refinement or wards especially when some have 4, 5, and often many more character's they want to play. More end game content now requires higher and higher GS to play let alone participate in.
Some of the concerns could be addressed from more focused & better reward's offered by the God's from Celestial Chests, as well as increasing our upgrade chances for EPIC, Legendary and Mythic upgrades & enchants as suggested above. After all when Sharandar offer's 3 uncommon thauma (unbound) or 9 at all 3 gate's it's sad if prayer's reward a minor stone and rank 4 enchant; especially endgame when Rank 5's drop not often but they drop from a Enemy and their no God. Even still Rank 5's have hardly no RP value to upgrading Purple or greater artifacts just as equally as uncommon stones have on Artifacts or Gear.
A revised and new Celestial Enchantment Chest 1 of (lower & to right drop less frequent): Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Thauma Stone(s) (unbound) Preservation/Coalescent Ward : increased chances than today (account bound)
A revised and new Celestial Artifact Equipment 1 of: Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Resonance Stone(s) (account bound) Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Mark of Power/Stability/Union (unbound)
A revised and new Celestial Artifact 1 of: Peridot/Aqua/Saphire/Opal (account bound) Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Power/Stability/Union Stone (unbound)
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gabrieldourdenMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,212Arc User
I don't mind spending for marks and RP. It's the sheer amount of ad that goes into preservation wards for failed attempts that I hate with all my heart. You stay there and just look at ad vanish in the hope that maybe you'll finally get an upgrade that will basically change nothing... I would prefer to have higher prices/lower availability for RP and marks but get rid of RNG in upgrading. You get the needed stuff-> you upgrade. Period.
Le-Shan: HR level 80 (main)
Born of Black Wind: SW Level 80
I think RNG if it is broken as suggested above should be corrected, still more is likely related to a slight lucky or unlucky streak which occurs even flipping coins, I once flipped a quarter and had flipped heads 9 out of 10 times, still I suspect it averages out close to the percentages identified by cryptic. I also do believe RNG has -yes- I can't believe I'm saying this 'value' and adds suspense and mystery to the whole upgrade process, making it seem more mysterious/magical and I wouldn't want to see it gone, despite often sometimes being sad even when it fails.
So I say to plasticbat I think your a good guy and agree in principle with what your saying, but without RNG we wouldn't feel really amazing when it succeeds, I believe if our chances were improved a little it help address your concern! I agree with defiantone99 that more should be done to lowering of costs of refinement or wards especially when some have 4, 5, and often many more character's they want to play. More end game content now requires higher and higher GS to play let alone participate in. With respect to gabrieldourden I think you suggesting raising RP requirements would hurt far more than it help especially with new 160 items from Artifact Weapons/Offhand and yes even Artifact Cloaks & Belts in the not to distant future requiring even more refinement than exists today. I'd rather people focus on suggestions that include improving upgrade chances, or more drops of minor stones and even earning ward's a little more frequently!
Some of these could be addressed from more focused & better reward's offered by the God's from Celestial Chests in addition to increasing our upgrade chances. After all when Sharandar offer's 3 uncommon thauma (unbound) in one area or 9 at all 3 gate's, it's sad if prayer's from a Celestial Enchantment chest reward a minor stone and rank 4 enchant; especially endgame when Rank 5's drop not often but they drop from a Enemy and their no God. Even still Rank 5's have hardly no RP value to upgrading EPIC or greater artifacts just as equally as uncommon stones have on Artifacts or Gear at EPIC.
I'm also surprised we don't see far more minor stone(s) & perl(s) dropping from Enemy in the plural form or found in normal chests and it's nothing but sad when a HE in IWD award's a perl worth a 100 refinement. It bad enough 105 level 70 gear which drop's far more frequent only offer's 100 refinement in gear and could easily be increase by at least 50% or more given it doesn't stack (like enchants & stones do) to 150 for green or 300 if refined into similar item.
Should update Celestial Enchantment Chest 1 of (lower & to right drop less frequent): Uncommon 1-2x/Rare/EPIC Thauma Stone(s) (unbound) Preservation/Coalescent Ward : increased chances than today (account bound) --improved chance to earn--
Should update Celestial Artifact Equipment Chest 1 of: Uncommon 1-2x/Rare/EPIC Resonance Stone(s) (account bound) Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Mark of Power/Stability/Union (unbound) or (account bound)
Should update Celestial Artifact Chest 1 of: Peridot 3-4x/Aqua 2x/Saphire/Opal (account bound) Uncommon 1-2x/Rare/EPIC Power/Stability/Union Stone (unbound)
Post edited by strathkin on
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feanor70118Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,170Arc User
It is amazing to me that people actually argue over whether the RNG in this game is working as advertised or whether it's too burdensome. Anyone with experience making anything with an upgrade chance under 10% knows how terrible the RNG is.
I don't care about mark of union/power/stability expense or SMOP expense. AD is easy to make. The problem is the cost in preservation wards and the face that it can be a half-hour torture session of boredom and frustration to make an R12 (or an R11, or a mythic artifact). The prize for putting over a million RP into an R11 should not be yet more tedium and irritation with the hostile RNG. It should be an upgrade that's over in a moment. The simple way to do this is to simply allow players to dump an amount of preservation wards equivalent to the average number needed according to the advertised upgrade chance for a guaranteed upgrade. So 33 wards go in, an R12 comes out, and no one needs to clik upgrade, slot wards, hit refine, wait, roll eyes, hit refine, repeat ad nauseam.
But of course people who want the game to be full of frustration and irritation rather than enjoyment will find some absurd excuse to argue against this idea, and of course the devs will never, ever consider giving players something they want that would make the game more enjoyable.
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plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,453Arc User
So I say to plasticbat I think your a good guy and agree in principle with what your saying, but without RNG we wouldn't feel really amazing when it succeeds, I believe if our chances were improved a little the process it help address your concern! I agree with defiantone99 that more should be done to lowering of costs of refinement or wards especially when some have 4, 5, and often many more character's they want to play. More end game content now requires higher and higher GS to play let alone participate in.
I think you are a good guy too (unless if you are female, then I apologize). I don't need that to feel amazing. I don't want to experience 'relief' after all sort of frustration. Based on my experience, it usually is '#^@%#@^%#!!' during the process and after it actually finished.
I don't mind they raise the RP cost to get rid of RNG. However, this is only my knee-jerk opinion without too much thinking about all the detail.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
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gabrieldourdenMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,212Arc User
edited February 2017
I hate Celestial Chests too. People should be rewarded for playing the game, not for running armies of invoking/leadership alts (that are easy to bot by the way). Put real rewards in the chests at the end of dungeons as it was before.
Le-Shan: HR level 80 (main)
Born of Black Wind: SW Level 80
I'm satisfied with the current setup. Takes time and effort and doesn't happen overnight. They just redid the required marks and make this cheaper to do a few months ago... Maybe a year ago.. I can't remember. When were SMOPS introduced?
After 3 years I just got my main to 4220 IL with all R12s. Now I'm working on my second. It's a grind but using the right utility slot enchantments and a good setup it's not hard to achieve. Get 10.5% in Quartermasters, keep your leadership going on a few toons and it should come together!! Again, it takes a long HAMSTER time to make it happen though.
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plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,453Arc User
I'm satisfied with the current setup. Takes time and effort and doesn't happen overnight. They just redid the required marks and make this cheaper to do a few months ago... Maybe a year ago.. I can't remember. When were SMOPS introduced?
After 3 years I just got my main to 4220 IL with all R12s. Now I'm working on my second. It's a grind but using the right utility slot enchantments and a good setup it's not hard to achieve. Get 10.5% in Quartermasters, keep your leadership going on a few toons and it should come together!! Again, it takes a long HAMSTER time to make it happen though.
I still hate the RNG. However, I shouldn't say that to you because I think you have worse RNG than I am.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
I hate Celestial Chests too. People should be rewarded for playing the game, not for running armies of invoking/leadership alts (that are easy to bot by the way). Put real rewards in the chests at the end of dungeons as it was before.
Well I agree part of the game succeeds because it doesn't happen over night. Still I agree at the very minimum a common theme focuses mostly on making ward's a little more obtainable, at the very least offer some real reward's more worthy of coming from a God, especially when any enemy will often drop's far better reward's today despite being small. Celestial Chest's have needed an OVERHAUL for some time and I'd argue is probably one area that has not be revised/revamped in a VERY LONG time IF ever. So I agree there should be far more real reward's in those chests!
I find it a little harder to believe the claim made above their 'easy' to bot although I'm sure a good programmer could likely find a way but honestly that's a real sad person who to take to that level to create invoke armies forcing more account bound items or us requiring more items to use 2 instead of 1 inventory slots spoiling it for everyone else.
Should update Celestial Enchantment Chest 1 of (lower & to right drop less frequent): Uncommon (1-2x)/Rare/EPIC Thauma Stone (unbound) perhaps (account bound) Preservation/Coalescent Ward : increased chances over today (account bound)
Should update Celestial Artifact Equipment Chest 1 of: Uncommon (1-2x)/Rare/EPIC Resonance Stone (account bound) Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Mark of Power/Stability/Union (unbound) perhaps (account bound)
Should update Celestial Artifact Chest 1 of: Peridot (3-4x)/Aqua (2x)/Saphire/Opal (account bound) Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Power/Stability/Union Stone (unbound) perhaps (account bound)
Still I stand by the argument that 105 gear really need's to be improved from the 100 refinement points, given it doesn't stack like stones improve it by 50-100% to 150/200 refinement given no one can horde it for RP weekends.
those invoking chests really do need updates, i havent seen coal ward from invoking for 2 years since they nerfed down to 666th abyss.
Hmmm! Although you said 2 years, I don't know how many chests you obtained. I do get c-ward. I do open many chests in one shot in a lone instance. My ratio is about 1 c-ward per 25 chests. In the last 2xRP, I opened 100 chests and got 4. The ratio is kind of consistent with my previous attempts.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
For that chest, you only need one slot in shared bank for all your characters. If you open it, yes, it will use more slots. Hence, to save the inventory space, don't open it until the stack is big enough.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
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beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
For that chest, you only need one slot in shared bank for all your characters. If you open it, yes, it will use more slots. Hence, to save the inventory space, don't open it until the stack is big enough.
Yup, exactly. And because I do the arti equipment chest, the stuff that drops that is not wards is 2 stacks of res stones (used up any 2xRP), 3 stacks of green marks (saved until 99 and then usually burned as artifact RP), 3 stacks of blue marks (rolled over but stashed the full stacks on a bank alt... dithering about using as artifact RP). Any purple marks get used ASAP; one of my characters almost always has a pending upgrade to consume anything. Account-bound pres wards don't usually last long either.
That was pretty OT. I'm also not fond of the boredom and frustration torture sessions for upgrades, and am "only" working on up to rank 10s (but the 5% and 10% upgrade successes from artifacts and equipment are no different).
There is nothing in game currently that really requires rank 12s. Making them more accessible would make even more content trivial.
While I can't say I like rng or the refinement process as a whole, to have a successful MMO there has to be things that are challenging to get. R12s are a stretch goal that is not required, but is a carrot on a stick goal to keep people playing and paying.
Let me guess, you want them to make it harder for others to get rank 12s now that you have them.
Defauting to the "You don't want people to have it because you already have it" argument is very tiresome and makes you seem like you can't support your decisions. I have no desire to make them harder to get. Yes, I have them for 1 full toon, and I personally think they are fine where they are. They are not bound, so they can be moved to alts. They retain their value very well, and you get a double RP period every couple months at least to get you there twice as fast.
You want the RNG reviewed? Absolutely. You want bind status and the amount of RP items reduced? 100% agree. Redo the entire RP system and make it less inventory intense? I'm with you. Remove the duplicate requirement? I'm fine with that.
More people having the best gear in the game is BAD for the game. More people with R12s is BAD. More people with Relic gear is BAD. The game is not hard, and the power level of the people playing it has far exceeded the content in the game...AGAIN. They seem to have no clue how to make the game harder, without making items that are even more powerful to go along with it as an incentive to do it. At this point, they could make the enitre new MOD have no improved gear, but have higher stat bosses, and we would probably be in the ballpark. So far MOD11 seems to have done that (I don't think Spellplague drops anything better than Relic).
No, more people being BIS is BETTER for the game. More runs, less fails and a happier playerbase. The gear gap is out of control.
You don't need BiS to run any content in this game unless you are talking about PVP.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
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gabrieldourdenMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,212Arc User
Failure rate should be balanced with rewards. At the beginning of this game failure rate was high but rewards were high too. I didn't mind spending a whole afternoon in the old SP to get a chance at an helm plus the unbound drops from bosses. Today we are at the opposite side. Rewards are horrible for most content and too much RNG related. 15kk-ad Cambions dropping in VT, that I can solo with ease with my 3,5k HR, and far worse rewards in FBI. The message we get from devs is "mindlessly farming easy content is the way to go". You cannot add more difficult stuff if it doesn't give better rewards and that's why we got a sideways mod right now. No real increase in difficulty and equal rewards. Boons look bad too (except some for specific builds) because they know power creep is too high compared to content. It's good because at least we get a way and time to gear up some alts but for our mains it's probably almost useless (that's my guild impression after day one). My hope is that they are trying to level the power across the board in order to then ramp up the difficulty with the next mod but I guess I'm hoping too much...
Le-Shan: HR level 80 (main)
Born of Black Wind: SW Level 80
If they fix the RNG, that alone will lower the cost. After burning 150+ pres wards for an R12 on multiple occasions, I have to say the 3% upgrade chance is BS.
I am currently at 130+ on one Azure R10 struggling to reach R11, but nope...
I think I'll leave it hanging in the bank, and keep it to remind me of how annoying/pathetic the whole preservation ward scam really is...
I don't mind spending for marks and RP. It's the sheer amount of ad that goes into preservation wards for failed attempts that I hate with all my heart. You stay there and just look at ad vanish in the hope that maybe you'll finally get an upgrade that will basically change nothing... I would prefer to have higher prices/lower availability for RP and marks but get rid of RNG in upgrading. You get the needed stuff-> you upgrade. Period.
^ This...
Also, I am very, very far from in the mood to spend money on Neverwinter after using thousands of wards just to upgrade enchants that I've already grinded RP and marks for.
At the very least there should be some form of accumulating factor that increases your chances with failed attempts.
Yes, lots of people like to point of that it's just "RNG", but in NW, "RNG" is horribly streaky.
Happy customers tend to spend more money, burning pres. wards like there's no tomorrow does not make me happy...
Stack your boxes. I open 100 at a time and usually pull 4-7 coal wards...
I invoke my account once a day for the coin. Every 11 days each toon gets a box x 53 toons. So every 22 days I can pull about 4 coal wards...
EDIT: I open 100 at a time and ALWAYS pull 4+ coal wards...
This makes me cringe (2 month in new player with 3 toons and 3.2k main).
I don't think any MMO game in the entire history has this kind of model for "grinding". You're telling me, spending an hour or two of your day just to log and re-log, press one key, 53 times, is good gaming, something has seriously failed or gone on a spiral.
No seriously, step away from the idea that you NEED to do that for coal wards, then tell me if that's anything a sane individual or game model should do. Matter of fact, step away from the ideology that you need to continue for the sake of personal investment and get a fresh perspective.
Same thing goes for 36k rAD per toon grind. Time-gated drops (QM's/Dragon's Hoard enchants). Everything in this game takes time, an extraneous amount of time at that, to reach an artificial item level number that will dictate your entire gaming experience in NWO.
Don't get me wrong, I just like to fault things. But this is a great action orientated game with an awesome premise in DnD. Why destroy that and be the direct symptom of a dying population (albeit slowly)? The new mod brings nothing new, just more BHE grinding to do. No new gear except pet stuff. There should be TONS more choice and flavor in all directions.
Edit. Forgot to mention my most important point. As a new player, this game is as unfriendly and convoluted as they come, like you can't even chat till you complete three zones? wtf?
Then once you realize what end-game is and involves, it becomes abusive and selective.
Make Preservation Wards increase your success to 25%.
Eliminate the need for a second enchantment to go from 9 10.
I believe that should do it. It's still not cheap, but it eliminates the absurdity of the process.
While I certainly thought they should increase the chance of all upgrade's so for example when trying to get an artifact to purple it improve the existing chance by 1/3 (33%) that would result existing upgrade chance (xx%) x 1.33 = but at least if they didn't want to do that I'd be very happy it they extended that instead to a Preservation Ward or Coal Ward so it reduced the chance of it being required.
...Today we are at the opposite side. Rewards are horrible for most content and too much RNG related... etc...
I will say despite RNG adds suspense or mystery to the upgrade process... and I think it be horrible if you just put in the regents and immediately given an upgrade. Upgrades should not be a guaranteed thing; however, their chances for being successful should be increased because at Orange or Mythic or even higher rank enchantments is very poor today. I would like to see the UPGRADE chances increased by 33% and still that could perhaps be buffed further if using a preservation or coal ward even. An EPIC Artifact today that has a 25% chance existing (25%) x1.33% = 33.25% revised final revised result. A Legendary Artifact would increase to 13.3% or Mythic from 5% to 6.65%.
This still makes preservation & coal ward's valuable and it be nice if each preservation ward was used it possibly extended this upgrade chance a little further depending on the quality of the ward used and that would go a long way to restore faith in RNG or Random Number God / Goddess.
If they fix the RNG, that alone will lower the cost. After burning 150+ pres wards for an R12 on multiple occasions, I have to say the 3% upgrade chance is BS.
I am currently at 130+ on one Azure R10 struggling to reach R11, but nope...
I think I'll leave it hanging in the bank, and keep it to remind me of how annoying/pathetic the whole preservation ward scam really is...
(as if I could ever forget)
Also realize that Preservations Ward's are great for lower Rank enchantments up to perhaps maybe Rank 7, 8 maybe 9 if your lucky or even Artifact's getting them up to EPIC but once you're going beyond that territory you really should be considering Coal Ward's. Still again I think upgrade chances are far too low for the vast majority of players it causes too many frustrations and should be increased if not by what I suggest by something and extend that buff further if a preservation or coal ward is slotted during upgrade. Upgrades need to be made a little less frustrating yes...
those invoking chests really do need updates, i havent seen coal ward from invoking for 2 years since they nerfed down to 666th abyss.
Hmmm! Although you said 2 years, I don't know how many chests you obtained. I do get c-ward. I do open many chests in one shot in a lone instance. My ratio is about 1 c-ward per 25 chests. In the last 2xRP, I opened 100 chests and got 4. The ratio is kind of consistent with my previous attempts.
I have suggested they also update the reward's for Celestial Chests with better more FOCUSED reward's worthy of a God. Far too often today many enemy in campaign area's often drop far better reward at end game than a minor thau stone or Rank 4 enchantment. I'm not suggesting a HUGE improvement on Coal Ward's dropping but the chance should be in the range of 5-10% and for preservation ward's closer to 20-25% along with some other changes...
Should update Celestial Enchantment Chest 1 of (lower & to right drop less frequent): Uncommon (1-2x)/Rare/EPIC Thauma Stone (unbound) perhaps (account bound) Preservation/Coalescent Ward : increased chances over today (account bound)
Should update Celestial Artifact Equipment Chest 1 of: Uncommon (1-2x)/Rare/EPIC Resonance Stone (account bound) Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Mark of Power/Stability/Union (unbound) perhaps (account bound)
Should update Celestial Artifact Chest 1 of: Peridot (3-4x)/Aqua (2x)/Saphire/Opal (account bound) Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Power/Stability/Union Stone (unbound) perhaps (account bound)
I also THINK 105 uncommon gear really need's to improved the 100 refinement points given today, given it doesn't stack like stones can be so at least improve it by 50-100% to 150/200 refinement as it can't be horded for RP weekends.
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plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,453Arc User
those invoking chests really do need updates, i havent seen coal ward from invoking for 2 years since they nerfed down to 666th abyss.
Hmmm! Although you said 2 years, I don't know how many chests you obtained. I do get c-ward. I do open many chests in one shot in a lone instance. My ratio is about 1 c-ward per 25 chests. In the last 2xRP, I opened 100 chests and got 4. The ratio is kind of consistent with my previous attempts.
I have suggested they also update the reward's for Celestial Chests with better more FOCUSED reward's worthy of a God. Far too often today many enemy in campaign area's often drop far better reward at end game than a minor thau stone or Rank 4 enchantment. I'm not suggesting a HUGE improvement on Coal Ward's dropping but the chance could be extended by 2-3% or 5-10% for preservation ward's along with some other changes...
1 in 25 is about 4%. Even if my estimate is not the norm, it should already be around 2-3% for c-ward drop. Hence, you should ask for higher ratio.
I also THINK 105 uncommon gear really need's to improved the 100 refinement points given today, given it doesn't stack like stones can be so at least improve it by 50-100% to 150/200 refinement as it can't be horded for RP weekends.
Also, there is no point to hord gear even if its value is 500. It is not stackable. How many can be kept for 2xRP? 10? 20? Even if you can keep 20, you are talking about 10000 RP (20000 RP for 2xRP). It is just a drop in the bucket. To use the gear to be RP, you basically should just use it on the spot and don't keep that "overnight".
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
Stack your boxes. I open 100 at a time and usually pull 4-7 coal wards...
I invoke my account once a day for the coin. Every 11 days each toon gets a box x 53 toons. So every 22 days I can pull about 4 coal wards...
EDIT: I open 100 at a time and ALWAYS pull 4+ coal wards...
This makes me cringe (2 month in new player with 3 toons and 3.2k main).
I don't think any MMO game in the entire history has this kind of model for "grinding". You're telling me, spending an hour or two of your day just to log and re-log, press one key, 53 times, is good gaming, something has seriously failed or gone on a spiral.
No one said that's good gaming but it is what's CURRENTLY required if you want bound coal wards. Otherwise you can grind AD for days to get 500,000 to buy ONE...
I use to do 6 invokes on all toons when there was AD from invoking. Now it's one round a day just for the coin. Provided I do nothing but invoke on the toons it takes about 45 minutes. If I start resetting professions and running cloak tower from some AD that time drastically increases...
At the moment I'm seriously considering deleting most of my toons and restarting some more GFs for speed runs of cloak tower but that is a lot of work and as soon as I make that change they'll rethink how little dungeons give AD lol For now, I'll keep doing what I'm doing because it works.
Comments
So I say to plasticbat I think your a good guy and agree in principle with what your saying, but without RNG we wouldn't feel really amazing when it succeeds, I believe if our chances were improved a little the process it help address your concern! I agree with defiantone99 that more should be done to lowering of costs of refinement or wards especially when some have 4, 5, and often many more character's they want to play. More end game content now requires higher and higher GS to play let alone participate in.
Some of the concerns could be addressed from more focused & better reward's offered by the God's from Celestial Chests, as well as increasing our upgrade chances for EPIC, Legendary and Mythic upgrades & enchants as suggested above. After all when Sharandar offer's 3 uncommon thauma (unbound) or 9 at all 3 gate's it's sad if prayer's reward a minor stone and rank 4 enchant; especially endgame when Rank 5's drop not often but they drop from a Enemy and their no God. Even still Rank 5's have hardly no RP value to upgrading Purple or greater artifacts just as equally as uncommon stones have on Artifacts or Gear.
A revised and new Celestial Enchantment Chest 1 of (lower & to right drop less frequent):
Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Thauma Stone(s) (unbound)
Preservation/Coalescent Ward : increased chances than today (account bound)
A revised and new Celestial Artifact Equipment 1 of:
Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Resonance Stone(s) (account bound)
Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Mark of Power/Stability/Union (unbound)
A revised and new Celestial Artifact 1 of:
Peridot/Aqua/Saphire/Opal (account bound)
Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Power/Stability/Union Stone (unbound)
Born of Black Wind: SW Level 80
So I say to plasticbat I think your a good guy and agree in principle with what your saying, but without RNG we wouldn't feel really amazing when it succeeds, I believe if our chances were improved a little it help address your concern! I agree with defiantone99 that more should be done to lowering of costs of refinement or wards especially when some have 4, 5, and often many more character's they want to play. More end game content now requires higher and higher GS to play let alone participate in. With respect to gabrieldourden I think you suggesting raising RP requirements would hurt far more than it help especially with new 160 items from Artifact Weapons/Offhand and yes even Artifact Cloaks & Belts in the not to distant future requiring even more refinement than exists today.
Some of these could be addressed from more focused & better reward's offered by the God's from Celestial Chests in addition to increasing our upgrade chances. After all when Sharandar offer's 3 uncommon thauma (unbound) in one area or 9 at all 3 gate's, it's sad if prayer's from a Celestial Enchantment chest reward a minor stone and rank 4 enchant; especially endgame when Rank 5's drop not often but they drop from a Enemy and their no God. Even still Rank 5's have hardly no RP value to upgrading EPIC or greater artifacts just as equally as uncommon stones have on Artifacts or Gear at EPIC.
I'm also surprised we don't see far more minor stone(s) & perl(s) dropping from Enemy in the plural form or found in normal chests and it's nothing but sad when a HE in IWD award's a perl worth a 100 refinement. It bad enough 105 level 70 gear which drop's far more frequent only offer's 100 refinement in gear and could easily be increase by at least 50% or more given it doesn't stack (like enchants & stones do) to 150 for green or 300 if refined into similar item.
Should update Celestial Enchantment Chest 1 of (lower & to right drop less frequent):
Uncommon 1-2x/Rare/EPIC Thauma Stone(s) (unbound)
Preservation/Coalescent Ward : increased chances than today (account bound) --improved chance to earn--
Should update Celestial Artifact Equipment Chest 1 of:
Uncommon 1-2x/Rare/EPIC Resonance Stone(s) (account bound)
Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Mark of Power/Stability/Union (unbound) or (account bound)
Should update Celestial Artifact Chest 1 of:
Peridot 3-4x/Aqua 2x/Saphire/Opal (account bound)
Uncommon 1-2x/Rare/EPIC Power/Stability/Union Stone (unbound)
I don't care about mark of union/power/stability expense or SMOP expense. AD is easy to make. The problem is the cost in preservation wards and the face that it can be a half-hour torture session of boredom and frustration to make an R12 (or an R11, or a mythic artifact). The prize for putting over a million RP into an R11 should not be yet more tedium and irritation with the hostile RNG. It should be an upgrade that's over in a moment. The simple way to do this is to simply allow players to dump an amount of preservation wards equivalent to the average number needed according to the advertised upgrade chance for a guaranteed upgrade. So 33 wards go in, an R12 comes out, and no one needs to clik upgrade, slot wards, hit refine, wait, roll eyes, hit refine, repeat ad nauseam.
But of course people who want the game to be full of frustration and irritation rather than enjoyment will find some absurd excuse to argue against this idea, and of course the devs will never, ever consider giving players something they want that would make the game more enjoyable.
I don't mind they raise the RP cost to get rid of RNG. However, this is only my knee-jerk opinion without too much thinking about all the detail.
Born of Black Wind: SW Level 80
After 3 years I just got my main to 4220 IL with all R12s. Now I'm working on my second. It's a grind but using the right utility slot enchantments and a good setup it's not hard to achieve. Get 10.5% in Quartermasters, keep your leadership going on a few toons and it should come together!! Again, it takes a long HAMSTER time to make it happen though.
I find it a little harder to believe the claim made above their 'easy' to bot although I'm sure a good programmer could likely find a way but honestly that's a real sad person who to take to that level to create invoke armies forcing more account bound items or us requiring more items to use 2 instead of 1 inventory slots spoiling it for everyone else.
Should update Celestial Enchantment Chest 1 of (lower & to right drop less frequent):
Uncommon (1-2x)/Rare/EPIC Thauma Stone (unbound) perhaps (account bound)
Preservation/Coalescent Ward : increased chances over today (account bound)
Should update Celestial Artifact Equipment Chest 1 of:
Uncommon (1-2x)/Rare/EPIC Resonance Stone (account bound)
Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Mark of Power/Stability/Union (unbound) perhaps (account bound)
Should update Celestial Artifact Chest 1 of:
Peridot (3-4x)/Aqua (2x)/Saphire/Opal (account bound)
Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Power/Stability/Union Stone (unbound) perhaps (account bound)
Still I stand by the argument that 105 gear really need's to be improved from the 100 refinement points, given it doesn't stack like stones improve it by 50-100% to 150/200 refinement given no one can horde it for RP weekends.
I invoke my account once a day for the coin. Every 11 days each toon gets a box x 53 toons. So every 22 days I can pull about 4 coal wards...
EDIT: I open 100 at a time and ALWAYS pull 4+ coal wards...
That was pretty OT. I'm also not fond of the boredom and frustration torture sessions for upgrades, and am "only" working on up to rank 10s (but the 5% and 10% upgrade successes from artifacts and equipment are no different).
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
You want the RNG reviewed? Absolutely. You want bind status and the amount of RP items reduced? 100% agree. Redo the entire RP system and make it less inventory intense? I'm with you. Remove the duplicate requirement? I'm fine with that.
More people having the best gear in the game is BAD for the game. More people with R12s is BAD. More people with Relic gear is BAD. The game is not hard, and the power level of the people playing it has far exceeded the content in the game...AGAIN. They seem to have no clue how to make the game harder, without making items that are even more powerful to go along with it as an incentive to do it. At this point, they could make the enitre new MOD have no improved gear, but have higher stat bosses, and we would probably be in the ballpark. So far MOD11 seems to have done that (I don't think Spellplague drops anything better than Relic).
Born of Black Wind: SW Level 80
Today we are at the opposite side. Rewards are horrible for most content and too much RNG related. 15kk-ad Cambions dropping in VT, that I can solo with ease with my 3,5k HR, and far worse rewards in FBI. The message we get from devs is "mindlessly farming easy content is the way to go".
You cannot add more difficult stuff if it doesn't give better rewards and that's why we got a sideways mod right now. No real increase in difficulty and equal rewards. Boons look bad too (except some for specific builds) because they know power creep is too high compared to content.
It's good because at least we get a way and time to gear up some alts but for our mains it's probably almost useless (that's my guild impression after day one).
My hope is that they are trying to level the power across the board in order to then ramp up the difficulty with the next mod but I guess I'm hoping too much...
Born of Black Wind: SW Level 80
I think I'll leave it hanging in the bank, and keep it to remind me of how annoying/pathetic the whole preservation ward scam really is...
(as if I could ever forget)
Also, I am very, very far from in the mood to spend money on Neverwinter after using thousands of wards just to upgrade enchants that I've already grinded RP and marks for.
At the very least there should be some form of accumulating factor that increases your chances with failed attempts.
Yes, lots of people like to point of that it's just "RNG", but in NW, "RNG" is horribly streaky.
Happy customers tend to spend more money, burning pres. wards like there's no tomorrow does not make me happy...
I don't think any MMO game in the entire history has this kind of model for "grinding". You're telling me, spending an hour or two of your day just to log and re-log, press one key, 53 times, is good gaming, something has seriously failed or gone on a spiral.
No seriously, step away from the idea that you NEED to do that for coal wards, then tell me if that's anything a sane individual or game model should do. Matter of fact, step away from the ideology that you need to continue for the sake of personal investment and get a fresh perspective.
Same thing goes for 36k rAD per toon grind. Time-gated drops (QM's/Dragon's Hoard enchants). Everything in this game takes time, an extraneous amount of time at that, to reach an artificial item level number that will dictate your entire gaming experience in NWO.
Don't get me wrong, I just like to fault things. But this is a great action orientated game with an awesome premise in DnD. Why destroy that and be the direct symptom of a dying population (albeit slowly)? The new mod brings nothing new, just more BHE grinding to do. No new gear except pet stuff. There should be TONS more choice and flavor in all directions.
Edit. Forgot to mention my most important point. As a new player, this game is as unfriendly and convoluted as they come, like you can't even chat till you complete three zones? wtf?
Then once you realize what end-game is and involves, it becomes abusive and selective.
This still makes preservation & coal ward's valuable and it be nice if each preservation ward was used it possibly extended this upgrade chance a little further depending on the quality of the ward used and that would go a long way to restore faith in RNG or Random Number God / Goddess.
Should update Celestial Enchantment Chest 1 of (lower & to right drop less frequent):
Uncommon (1-2x)/Rare/EPIC Thauma Stone (unbound) perhaps (account bound)
Preservation/Coalescent Ward : increased chances over today (account bound)
Should update Celestial Artifact Equipment Chest 1 of:
Uncommon (1-2x)/Rare/EPIC Resonance Stone (account bound)
Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Mark of Power/Stability/Union (unbound) perhaps (account bound)
Should update Celestial Artifact Chest 1 of:
Peridot (3-4x)/Aqua (2x)/Saphire/Opal (account bound)
Uncommon/Rare/EPIC Power/Stability/Union Stone (unbound) perhaps (account bound)
I also THINK 105 uncommon gear really need's to improved the 100 refinement points given today, given it doesn't stack like stones can be so at least improve it by 50-100% to 150/200 refinement as it can't be horded for RP weekends.
I use to do 6 invokes on all toons when there was AD from invoking. Now it's one round a day just for the coin. Provided I do nothing but invoke on the toons it takes about 45 minutes. If I start resetting professions and running cloak tower from some AD that time drastically increases...
At the moment I'm seriously considering deleting most of my toons and restarting some more GFs for speed runs of cloak tower but that is a lot of work and as soon as I make that change they'll rethink how little dungeons give AD lol For now, I'll keep doing what I'm doing because it works.