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  • valon79#4291 valon79 Member Posts: 20 Arc User





    You don't have all boons yet, especially the last one from Maze Engine (Engine Inspiration - Your healing spells have a chance to heal allies around you for 20,000 hit points). That's the best boon for DevOP right next to Burning Guidance, and once you get it your healing will skyrocket. Same goes to DPS and Burning Guidance or upgrading enchants and gear for more HP for better Aura of Courage. Until then don't worry too much, Bond and Vow combo is amazing and should work fine, you could try Divine Touch instead Vow on trash, but at lower IL it might not be that effective. Also try running Smite instead Relentless Avenger, it gives heal over time and it's the strongest single target damage encounter.

    I'm 3.3k IL DevOP on PS4 (so no Vow changes yet), built for buff/debuff/DPS and I'd tell that boons make huge difference, and after some point while gearing up everything drastically changes. I'm still very attached to Vow while playing solo, but recently I was trying TW and DT instead like suggested by Beckylunatic and it worked fine. TW works great on big groups of enemies, but DT is much better when dealing with big hard hitting mobs such as giants in SKT. I've been trying running with DT instead of Vow for trash in CN for a while now and it's even better than Vow. Rotation on trash I use is BL, Bond and DT/Vow, on bosses Bane, BL, Vow (and will probably still stay that way after Vow change hits PS4 with Mod 10.5). My usual solo rotation was BL, RA and Vow, but at some point I completely dropped RA for Smite and now I use RA only for bosses to tank in CN to fill AP as fast as possible to use Heroism for Temp HP and CC immunity. At some point the knock back effect from RA started to annoy even me.


    Cool thanks, i will look more into it and boons are really new to me but im working at getting more. Yeah i noticed while dummy testing RA was a really awesome, but in real combat was less effective, still like the knock back for easier combat though( i still need the extra time as low dps). BL and DT are working a lot better for me(DT is still low dps but heals are awesome) than they were and smite is decent, having issue with TW idk why but isnt doing as much dps as i was hoping could be the lack of boons and higher level content. BL i wasnt charging at all and have found even a little charging is very helpful, as it increases dps and time for blinded. Currently running BL,smite, DT as i cant dps much so i am healing them to death lol, dailies shield and heroism, i havent been doing any party stuff, maybe after i get IL higher i will, thinking ur combo should work well when i do, thanks for the ideas and thoughts.
  • rubytruerubytrue Member Posts: 582 Arc User
    I'm a big fan of the AP gain changes made to Bane and Circle of Power. You can now use those and still get legit AP gain so you can fire off Dailies at a decent pace. Bane+Circle+Shield of Faith results in a sizable damage reduction still leaving you with Templar's Wrath for damage and temp HP.
  • valon79#4291 valon79 Member Posts: 20 Arc User
    rubytrue said:

    I'm a big fan of the AP gain changes made to Bane and Circle of Power. You can now use those and still get legit AP gain so you can fire off Dailies at a decent pace. Bane+Circle+Shield of Faith results in a sizable damage reduction still leaving you with Templar's Wrath for damage and temp HP.

    I can see how that would help a op protection, doesnt work at all for devotion. trying to find the right combo and im starting to like Cleansing Touch, Vow, and Bond. AP is a bit slow but not bad, no damage sucks, but I find charging Buring Light deadly(get caught in one shot areas). Divine Touch is nice but have had targeting issues to many times. at about 1950 IL and my healing good but not great, running with low IL and one shotted, high IL and i have a hard time getting them full up in even a two shot heal. Power is 5k, guessing thats one of the things i need to raise to have better heals? 3 fails but did manage to get through eLOL, think a lot of fails was dps issues but i can say partly do to my lack of healing(only tank wasnt getting one shot) running 200k HP and he was downing pots regularly so i count that as my fault.

    running through the threads, seeing 6k for recovery, armpen is good, i have low armpen partly to keep my agro low and lack of equip. what else should i consider raising(i know all needs it). thanks
  • trzebiat#2067 trzebiat Member Posts: 372 Arc User

    rubytrue said:

    I'm a big fan of the AP gain changes made to Bane and Circle of Power. You can now use those and still get legit AP gain so you can fire off Dailies at a decent pace. Bane+Circle+Shield of Faith results in a sizable damage reduction still leaving you with Templar's Wrath for damage and temp HP.

    I can see how that would help a op protection, doesnt work at all for devotion. trying to find the right combo and im starting to like Cleansing Touch, Vow, and Bond. AP is a bit slow but not bad, no damage sucks, but I find charging Buring Light deadly(get caught in one shot areas). Divine Touch is nice but have had targeting issues to many times. at about 1950 IL and my healing good but not great, running with low IL and one shotted, high IL and i have a hard time getting them full up in even a two shot heal. Power is 5k, guessing thats one of the things i need to raise to have better heals? 3 fails but did manage to get through eLOL, think a lot of fails was dps issues but i can say partly do to my lack of healing(only tank wasnt getting one shot) running 200k HP and he was downing pots regularly so i count that as my fault.

    running through the threads, seeing 6k for recovery, armpen is good, i have low armpen partly to keep my agro low and lack of equip. what else should i consider raising(i know all needs it). thanks
    AP gain on Bane will be very helpful for Dev. Running the best possible combo on bosses which is Bane, Bond and Vow leaves me to rely on Divine Call for getting AP. There's always that easy way to spam dailies, which is using Relentless Avenger on bosses. Try RA, Bond and Vow on scorpions or Lostmauth in elol and spam Shield of Faith.

    At low IL Recovery is not that important because you have cooldown reduction from Justice capstone. I've run with low Recovery at the beginning for quite some time. You should increase Arpen to have at least 30-40% Resistance Ignored for soloing and easier dungeons. Just use Darks, gear with Arpen over Recovery (Alliance/Elven/Dusk Ward over Restoration) and put gear with Arpen on companion to get it through bondings.
  • emilemoemilemo Member Posts: 1,718 Arc User
    AP gain might be ok now but divine energy gain definitely isnt.
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  • valon79#4291 valon79 Member Posts: 20 Arc User
    edited December 2016


    AP gain on Bane will be very helpful for Dev. Running the best possible combo on bosses which is Bane, Bond and Vow leaves me to rely on Divine Call for getting AP. There's always that easy way to spam dailies, which is using Relentless Avenger on bosses. Try RA, Bond and Vow on scorpions or Lostmauth in elol and spam Shield of Faith.

    At low IL Recovery is not that important because you have cooldown reduction from Justice capstone. I've run with low Recovery at the beginning for quite some time. You should increase Arpen to have at least 30-40% Resistance Ignored for soloing and easier dungeons. Just use Darks, gear with Arpen over Recovery (Alliance/Elven/Dusk Ward over Restoration) and put gear with Arpen on companion to get it through bondings.

    thanks(good to know). Arpen is lower around 25%(getting more gear is challenging)i did make a switch to R7 Darks on companions seems to help,working on upgrading to R8.

    RA hmm never thought of that, was using Cleansing Touch to help with webs and supplement heals until i get the boons, but RA could be more useful on those Dungeons.

    Is it a matter of choice on Power vs def, i mean i would like to have 80% DR but not if it kills my heals? Am i just shooting for that to early? at around 35% DR and 15% heal bonus.
    Post edited by valon79#4291 on
  • trzebiat#2067 trzebiat Member Posts: 372 Arc User


    AP gain on Bane will be very helpful for Dev. Running the best possible combo on bosses which is Bane, Bond and Vow leaves me to rely on Divine Call for getting AP. There's always that easy way to spam dailies, which is using Relentless Avenger on bosses. Try RA, Bond and Vow on scorpions or Lostmauth in elol and spam Shield of Faith.

    At low IL Recovery is not that important because you have cooldown reduction from Justice capstone. I've run with low Recovery at the beginning for quite some time. You should increase Arpen to have at least 30-40% Resistance Ignored for soloing and easier dungeons. Just use Darks, gear with Arpen over Recovery (Alliance/Elven/Dusk Ward over Restoration) and put gear with Arpen on companion to get it through bondings.

    thanks(good to know). Arpen is lower around 25%(getting more gear is challenging)i did make a switch to R7 Darks on companions seems to help,working on upgrading to R8.

    RA hmm never thought of that, was using CC to help with webs and supplement heals until i get the boons, but RA could be more useful on those Dungeons.

    Is it a matter of choice on Power vs def, i mean i would like to have 80% DR but not if it kills my heals? Am i just shooting for that to early? at around 35% DR and 15% heal bonus.
    To help with Arpen and damage you can get a mount with +2000 Arpen. I bought White Tiger as my first epic mount for that and it was huge help, I don't even regret getting it before mount with Wanderer's Fortune. It also has one of the best insignia bonuses (Protector's Camaraderie).

    You're biggest threat are stuns, roots like from webs that doesn't turn off Bond of Virtue are not a problem. You meant Cleansing Touch? I find it useless in PvE, but it's a must in PvP. On bosses using RA to be able to spam Shield of Faith really helps at lower item level, especially if the group is struggling with surviving. After you feel confident without constant SoF it's better to use Bane on bosses.

    Go for power. You'll get defense from gear and later can build more DR through bondings and Negation, it's not worth to use azures for defense over radiants for HP. I tried taking boons with defense over power at some point, but it didn't make much difference. You're still too low IL to think about getting to 80% DR. I'm 3.4k IL and I'm sitting at 185k HP (Dusk set bonus and 5x VIP) and around 55% DR from gear and bondings (Def from one R9 bonding and two R9 azures), 75% when Sudden Defense procs on companion, plus 15% from R8 Negation, optionally 15% from Heroism, 5% from mount and 5% from Valorous Strike.
  • armadeonxarmadeonx Member Posts: 4,952 Arc User
    I bought the white tiger too, it's v. handy having a spare 2k armor pen.
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  • valon79#4291 valon79 Member Posts: 20 Arc User


    AP gain on Bane will be very helpful for Dev. Running the best possible combo on bosses which is Bane, Bond and Vow leaves me to rely on Divine Call for getting AP. There's always that easy way to spam dailies, which is using Relentless Avenger on bosses. Try RA, Bond and Vow on scorpions or Lostmauth in elol and spam Shield of Faith.

    At low IL Recovery is not that important because you have cooldown reduction from Justice capstone. I've run with low Recovery at the beginning for quite some time. You should increase Arpen to have at least 30-40% Resistance Ignored for soloing and easier dungeons. Just use Darks, gear with Arpen over Recovery (Alliance/Elven/Dusk Ward over Restoration) and put gear with Arpen on companion to get it through bondings.

    thanks(good to know). Arpen is lower around 25%(getting more gear is challenging)i did make a switch to R7 Darks on companions seems to help,working on upgrading to R8.

    RA hmm never thought of that, was using CC to help with webs and supplement heals until i get the boons, but RA could be more useful on those Dungeons.

    Is it a matter of choice on Power vs def, i mean i would like to have 80% DR but not if it kills my heals? Am i just shooting for that to early? at around 35% DR and 15% heal bonus.
    To help with Arpen and damage you can get a mount with +2000 Arpen. I bought White Tiger as my first epic mount for that and it was huge help, I don't even regret getting it before mount with Wanderer's Fortune. It also has one of the best insignia bonuses (Protector's Camaraderie).

    You're biggest threat are stuns, roots like from webs that doesn't turn off Bond of Virtue are not a problem. You meant Cleansing Touch? I find it useless in PvE, but it's a must in PvP. On bosses using RA to be able to spam Shield of Faith really helps at lower item level, especially if the group is struggling with surviving. After you feel confident without constant SoF it's better to use Bane on bosses.

    Go for power. You'll get defense from gear and later can build more DR through bondings and Negation, it's not worth to use azures for defense over radiants for HP. I tried taking boons with defense over power at some point, but it didn't make much difference. You're still too low IL to think about getting to 80% DR. I'm 3.4k IL and I'm sitting at 185k HP (Dusk set bonus and 5x VIP) and around 55% DR from gear and bondings (Def from one R9 bonding and two R9 azures), 75% when Sudden Defense procs on companion, plus 15% from R8 Negation, optionally 15% from Heroism, 5% from mount and 5% from Valorous Strike.
    lol yes CT. thx for the info, that does help idk if i will get the tiger soon but it is definitely something i will think about. i tried bane a couple times and do like it, works great on the way to boss. i was trying to upgrade R7 wow what a waste of time AH! thanks

    Im struggling with using burning light( i see its a big reason to have aura of courage) but as i dont yet have burning guidance is it worth using over TW? i mean the extra heals is nice but the charge time with the lag is almost a sure way to die most times
  • kitkathdkitkathd Member Posts: 286 Arc User
    emilemo said:

    What is the BO shield value? I didn't know there was a limit, it's not in the description: http://neverwinter.gamepedia.com/Binding_Oath

    The BO shield is equal to your health ( 160 000 health = 160 000 blue BO shield). The problem is not what the value of the BO shield is, the problem is that the damage you take upon BO expiration is not mitigated by your DR. Which is either:

    a) an oversight hence unintentional on the devs part
    b) flat out stupid decision on the dev's part which made our best tanking encounter into the worst

    Either way they have our feedback. Its all been explained many times by many people. If they want and plan to do something about it they are keeping it to themselves.
    The damage has already been mitigated when it struck your BO shield. Its further mitigated by 50% upon expiration of the shield. Its not an oversight you just are not looking at it right. BO and Absolution are effectively secondary mitigation abilities after your DR.
  • michaelrn1982michaelrn1982 Member Posts: 89 Arc User
    I find using TW and BO together is rather amazing and provides a good shield to your temp hp. BO can also be used for a nice massive DPS boost as a Prot. I usually pair with Absolution or Blinding Light depending if I am tanking more or just killing stuff. I usually start off with BO, then TW and follow up with BL to keep the damage going and leave me to lay in a few rounds of Purifying Fire before Echo kicks off or next round of BO/TW are up.
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    Check out the Shadowknight Build for OP Protection here

    [Combat (Self)] Orcus gives 0 (446273) Physical Damage to you with Wand Bash.
    [Combat (Self)] Orcus gives 0 (514415) Physical Damage to you with Bash.
    [Combat (Self)] Orcus gives 0 (521299) Physical Damage to you with Bash.
    [Combat (Self)] Orcus gives 0 (555505) Physical Damage to you with Wand Sweep.
    [Combat (Self)] Orcus deals 64883 (648828) Physical Damage to you with Wand Bash.

  • trzebiat#2067 trzebiat Member Posts: 372 Arc User
    I respec'd to Prot today during our first try of FBI because our tank felt asleep and I now understand why Binding Oath is getting nerfed. First time trying Protection Oath just before Dragon Turtle and I survived with no problem up to the point when he reached 11 stacks and I ran out of divine call to reset cooldowns for BO or TW. No changes to build except one feet and boon and it literally feels like cheating.
  • mamalion1234mamalion1234 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,415 Arc User
    Because they dont ask for devotion that means nothing. Personal i never refused to join a party without cleric because i know a devotion can offer too to the team. CALL me for next run fbi ( i have done 2-3 with 2 paladin composition devo-protection).
    SHIELD of faith and the crazy heals are the strong of point of devotion.

  • oggycz#5356 oggycz Member Posts: 182 Arc User
    edited January 2017
    I had few FBI runs with my dev OP + OP tank without DC and we have no big problem (when people avoid aoe). And past few days I did many smooth esva runs with 1 tank (GF mostly) + me (for offtank heal) + 2DC (buff) and DPSs.
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  • druim#6852 druim Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    Can you share your build with us?
  • mercedesmanmercedesman Member Posts: 200 Arc User
    I have solo tanked esva many times and had many wonderful FBI runs where I am the only tank (note that I run with a very strong guild and runs are made with all BIS/near BIS toons).. The key is knowing the groups capabilities and changing Aura's to accommodate the needs.. I do not swap out wisdom for anything but will change between courage and truth depending on the make up. I am able to stay in constant Shield of Faith and can stay in constant bubble if need for the first 30 seconds after I pop my devoted sigil. the main keys to staying alive is popping TW as soon as it comes available and stack the temp HP.. I used to have a very low crit chance but realized that by upping my crit I can increase my temp HP much quicker.. not rocket science I know.. also I have stacked HP everywhere and in mSVA runs I can hit 267K in hp.. this certainly helps.
  • armadeonxarmadeonx Member Posts: 4,952 Arc User
    @mercedesman What's your DR?
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  • thrill#1417 thrill Member Posts: 163 Arc User
    I am trying to decide what stats to adjust for 10.5 coming to PS4. I am around 3100 IL. After all I have read on here I get the impression going to high crit/dps is the best choice with the changes to BO. My armpen is capped (with bonding), I have started trading recovery for more crit (currently about 7k recovery [65% recharge increase] and 6k crit [39% crit chance]). I am thinking Circle of Power/TW/Bane/Shield of Faith will be my best option for boss fights.

    What is the consensus on the minimum level of recovery needed to run that setup. I really want to get my crit much higher but I don't want to get killed because I can't use TW fast enough.

    Additionally, unbonded I have about 5k recovery, 4.5k armpen, and 6k crit on myself. So all of my crit is unbonded whereas a good amount of my recovery and armpen comes from bonding. I am pretty sure that is fine for recovery, but for the sake of casting TW before bonding kicks in which is better to have on your person? Crit or Armpen? Should I keep them balanced or favor one over the other?
  • armadeonxarmadeonx Member Posts: 4,952 Arc User
    edited January 2017
    The way I look at it is if your companion drops out of the fight for more than 20 secs (e.g. Orcus 1-shots him 3 times in a row before he can attack/proc - it's happened to me a couple of times with my fire archon) then which stat would you rather be low on: armor pen or crit?. To me the answer is crit as you always want high enough RI to boost your temp HP.

    Another point there is if you don't already have r12 bondings you're going to be refining them upwards and increase the stats. You want armor pen to be static but have ever improving crit.
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  • mercedesmanmercedesman Member Posts: 200 Arc User
    @armadeonx please feel free to hit me up in game @oldashell so I can give you that stat. I have read your question 3 times now and have remembered to get the info 0 times.. lol
  • Anyone know if sanctuary does anything at all against damage if you're already at 95% damage resistance?
  • thrill#1417 thrill Member Posts: 163 Arc User

    Anyone know if sanctuary does anything at all against damage if you're already at 95% damage resistance?


    My understanding is it does not. The only real value it has is to counter CC effects.
  • telprydaintelprydain Member Posts: 545 Arc User
    Sooooooo, anyone tried adding some ballwick feats into the mix.
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  • armadeonxarmadeonx Member Posts: 4,952 Arc User

    Sooooooo, anyone tried adding some ballwick feats into the mix.

    The trouble with that is you need the 3 boxes from the Light path to do powersharing and if you take any out the the top you'll lose the Justice capstone which is one of the few useful feats...
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  • Anyone know if sanctuary does anything at all against damage if you're already at 95% damage resistance?


    My understanding is it does not. The only real value it has is to counter CC effects.
    Well, that makes it pretty useless for end game then, they should have looked at that.
  • armadeonxarmadeonx Member Posts: 4,952 Arc User
    They heard all about it on the Paladin changes Preview thread. We gave them more than enough feedback.

    There's a *slim* possibility that they'll do something about it when they eventually do our *official* class rebalance instead of the series of flying nerfs they've been hitting us with.
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  • sundance777sundance777 Member Posts: 1,097 Arc User
    I ran cn before the mod with the new go to encounters, Templars, Bane and Circle of Power. The run went fine although it was a little dicey with the rotation but we won. I put those on the back burner and worked on some power and HP for the upcoming Mod 10.5 and went in to CN a couple more times this week.

    I have around 156K HP, and 70% DR standing still and enough armor pen and power to tack on 250-275K HP with each templars. my buffed DR does up to an over 95%, but if companion dies I feel like I am OK standing in the Circle of Power and my daily is Shield of Faith so it would seem I have plenty of layers.

    The first run went great,or good enough for the first day with new rotation we had a melee, couple of ranged and a DC (not sure what type - I assumed buff/debuff and power share). I was dropped once, and I blamed it on the rotation but we finished just fine.

    Then as a test I ran again with 4 melee dps. Which I could do before with binding oath no problem, all day long. This did not go well at all. Orcus was not happy and took me out over and over again, and forced us to start swapping out characters. A GF friend who tanks Orcus all the time jumped in and I thought, great, we are all set but no...we struggled a fair amount still. My take away is that more balance is needed in the party - fine, it was a good test run. But here is what I noticed from my testing.

    AP Gain seemed fine, but Divine Call definitely did not seem to be recharging the way I am used to. I did not respec or change anything really, other than changed out smite for bane, I was already using CoP for solo stuff the last several weeks.

    I was actually able to get some aggro, and actually was pulling aggro away from the GF during the Orcus fight. I have noticed that two tanks often confuses the bosses but this was pretty full on I had the aggro and the GF did not for minutes at a time.

    Orcus one hit me, or so it seemed, through KV, CoP, ( and I think Shield of Faith) while buffed in combat to way over 80% DR and hit me for 490K physical damage which is just over my HP and max temp HP: http://xboxdvr.com/gamer/Suns Tip/screenshot/5566613

    Something is not working in my opinion or Orcus now hits for more than 800K. Can anyone see from the screenshot anything we might report or test further?

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  • armadeonxarmadeonx Member Posts: 4,952 Arc User
    I've run a few CN since the update too and each time there was a DC present which turned out to be a good thing as even standing in CoP and thus at 95% DR (factoring in Orcus's 15% RI so 80% DR) he was still hitting me for huge chunks.

    Bane and SoF kept the damage to a manageable level but I definitely had to watch my rotations. Previously I'd pop SoF only when he raised his arms but now had to change that to popping it every time it charged. If it dropped I'd lose all my temp health and a big chunk of normal.

    @sundance777 what's your DR without bonding procs and CoP?
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  • vcekvcek Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 127 Arc User


    I certainly love the changes since the update, now i don't even have to use binding oath to tank. (protection, max heal feats)
    Very effective in svardborg/FBI
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