Hello, I'm a dps SW... And I agree to both healers' and others' complaints over here... But it is unavoidable to have all these problems you mention until you get your own party or wait a good while when people would learn the game better. And hopefully a better matchmaking.
On one hand, it is still rare to get a decent pug group, and I found myself many times with no healer at all, although clerics were in the group. I don't know if they had dps builds or just did not have a clue how to play, it was still frustrating. But I see some progress, people do learn how to play and I hope there will be more adequate teammates ;)
On the other hand, I understand healer's pain in trying to catch the group where everyone runs into opposite directions. Ehhh, I did run and still run around quite a lot, ignoring healer's position (feel free to hate me...), because I can't play in another way - question of survivability and skills I use, however I rely a lot on my selfheals, don't stay in red and am aware that a healer wouldn't probably be able to heal me. But I try to pay more attention to stay closer to healer where I know it'll be needed since I learned the idea of the healing mechanics here. From my experience, coming from another MMO, the healing mechanics seem to be quite different here, and not everyone would know that a healer can't spam automatic long range heals anywhere in the room.
P.S. I had a top tier healer in the past in another game, started to level a buff cleric here but still can't get used to the skills here.
Hello, I'm a dps SW... And I agree to both healers' and others' complaints over here... But it is unavoidable to have all these problems you mention until you get your own party or wait a good while when people would learn the game better. And hopefully a better matchmaking.
On one hand, it is still rare to get a decent pug group, and I found myself many times with no healer at all, although clerics were in the group. I don't know if they had dps builds or just did not have a clue how to play, it was still frustrating. But I see some progress, people do learn how to play and I hope there will be more adequate teammates
On the other hand, I understand healer's pain in trying to catch the group where everyone runs into opposite directions. Ehhh, I did run and still run around quite a lot, ignoring healer's position (feel free to hate me...), because I can't play in another way - question of survivability and skills I use, however I rely a lot on my selfheals, don't stay in red and am aware that a healer wouldn't probably be able to heal me. But I try to pay more attention to stay closer to healer where I know it'll be needed since I learned the idea of the healing mechanics here. From my experience, coming from another MMO, the healing mechanics seem to be quite different here, and not everyone would know that a healer can't spam automatic long range heals anywhere in the room.
P.S. I had a top tier healer in the past in another game, started to level a buff cleric here but still can't get used to the skills here.
Let's be patient
When you go into group and if you see no healer and other players are playing other classes, as a SW you are the healer. Whenever you play a class that has an off role you are considered for that role, players need to realize this.
Here is your non-damage classes based on game design
Healers: Devoted Cleric, Oathbound Paladins, and Scourge Warlocks Tanks: Guardian Fighters, Great Weapon Fighters and Oathbound Paladins
If you go into a dungeon and get the following classes who do you think is a healer and the tank?
Great Weapon Fighter, Scourge Warlock, Scourge Warlock, Trickster Rogue, and Control Wizard
Oathbound Paladin, Scourge Warlock, Devoted Cleric, Devoted Cleric, and Control Wizard
In the first group the game assumes one of the SW is a healer and that the GWF is the tank.
For the second group it assumes that the SW or one of the DC is the healer and the OP is the tank.
Now out of both groups all of the players could have built their characters as DPS and not as a non-DPS. This can impact groups and make content harder than it needs to be.
Now if the random Que system only allowed players to select a role it would improve how the que system. DPS type of players would have a much longer que time compared to those of us willing to play a support role and as a long time support player, I support this type of change.
0
silverkeltMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,235Arc User
Any dc build can heal.. There is only really maybe less then 2% of the entire DC population that is set up to be pure dps.. as in they can compete at top end.. I would take the explanation that they are DPS from them.
The rest of you are debuff not dps, you are there to support, it doesnt take that much to heal content in this game, 99% of the time aseal and divine glow is quite enough. Suck it up and throw healing word to the groups that need it.
Whats more important, throwing condemned down in a group that can barely stay alive, or some addition heals to them? If your in a premade group, sure your not expected to do more then random DGs really, but if your going to pug, suck it up and do it .
You should do whatever is necessary to get whatever group through whatever content.
Admit it, what you guys want is a DC that have maximum buff/debuff potential, high healing numbers, high survival ability (so you dont need to worry abt him) and still dealing high damage to speed up the run. Is this possible? Yes, but u know how hard it is to be achieved? So, either you have to be 3.5k+ or you have no rights and not worth the supports from those who are capable of, but at that time you no longer need heals, FBI excluded however.
I see so many DPS running around complaining about a lack of heals in dungeons yet these same DPS stay right in the hard hits area and expect a healer to heal through one shots. NOT HAPPENING! Learn to avoid a one shot. I mean it is clear as day, it is a bright red area that you need to move away from. Very simple mechanic.
When with a good group I use DG, Chains, and BoP. I am mainly debuffing the HAMSTER out of things with BoB and BoP and DG both Divinity and regular. Most players probably don't realize I'm healing, buffing and debuffing them so they can do more damage. See above about players not pay attention to strong strike attacks.
Now I also have AA and use that when I see how stupid DPS are behaving. Usually a SW or a GWF not paying attention and running right into the one shots.
As a DC that plays mostly as a leader, notice I did not state healer here, I can do my job just fine. My problem is DPS not doing there and that is avoiding the one shot areas. LEARN TO MOVE!
0
greywyndMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 7,140Arc User
eh, my DC is full spec to heal.
I'm not looking for forgiveness, and I'm way past asking permission. Earth just lost her best defender, so we're here to fight. And if you want to stand in our way, we'll fight you too.
null I played another MMO that would allow different builds. One for dps and one for support, PvE and PvP, bosses and mobs etc via an armory system. Something like that would be nice.
greywyndMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 7,140Arc User
Think of it in terms of the source material and not as a video game. Hero doesn't generally run around with multiple suits in his traveling wardrobe in the event of the possibility of a dungeon delve or running into a competing dungeon party.
I'm not looking for forgiveness, and I'm way past asking permission. Earth just lost her best defender, so we're here to fight. And if you want to stand in our way, we'll fight you too.
No clue what this thread is about. Only want to ad the following. My temptation lock outheald lot's of OP's and DC's , only watching the chard, but he is by sure not the better healer same as his buffs were far worse till mod 9 and his healing is too inconsistent. Stating the OP is the best healer may also be not correct, since every OP i saw was not able to prevent onehits that good at Orcus. DC has a lot of tools to debuff boss and buff tank. If you pic a pure Faithfull setup with some of those T4/5 feats , like chaplains strength, you will dish out lots of heals. I think FBI will lead to a revival of Faithfull DC full heal, if there are enough 3,1 DC who gonna carry that burdon of mod 10. Pure pain to grind through that mod with a healerspec...time for dualspec imo.
0
silverkeltMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 4,235Arc User
templock over 40% lifesteal can heal any content ive seen, I havent been to fbi and now that its gated via the stupid gated mechanism will never go in all likely hood.
stupid HAMSTER ever-frost resistance.
0
mamalion1234Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,415Arc User
edited August 2016
if divine glow heal for 150k and i say much ( than needed) on one cast then because a paladin can do 1m he heal better? TEAMates have 1m hp do they take 1m damage ? PLAYING as oath of devotion can be lethal. SO much healing 1m can lead to take aggro and die in 1 hit .
IF I NEED to heal as righteous i use healer lore instead terifying insight. THAT extra 20% is enough to give the necessary amount of heals when they need.
null Perhaps not but the hero does have access to more than the handful of skills we have on the hotbar.
I don't swap out my skills very often since I'm a strictly dps class and have a build that works for me. But I can see how other classes would want the option. Especially the option to switch between healing and damage.
Templock misses powerfull damagebuffs and DR-buffs like BtS, HG, AS, AA, DG, BoB and agent of devine (faithfull capstone), he heals most things until players get onehittet. All you got is PoP (unhandy no aoe), you don´t reach the tank and the boss most time Dreadtheft is unhandy to debuff, you miss lots of rotation/damage Wraith of shadow, not much used by most player in PVE. Darkrevelry powerbuff, pretty poor compared to AC/DC powerbuff All in all not to compare to a DC imo and you loose damage by positioning for pop and and using low level spells to debuff, if needed. I agree about about actual content that can be done by templock, but as said the haels are somehow inconsistent and you may fail the moment you get cc´ed or LS doesn´t pop if needed. Not sure about SB or HB being the better healer, but SB will be the better damagedealer i think. Maybe someone proves me wrong, I will try FBI myself as templock.... in case I can get through that grinding festival.
0
thefabricantMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 5,248Arc User
Templock misses powerfull damagebuffs and DR-buffs like BtS, HG, AS, AA, DG, BoB and agent of devine (faithfull capstone), he heals most things until players get onehittet. All you got is PoP (unhandy no aoe), you don´t reach the tank and the boss most time Dreadtheft is unhandy to debuff, you miss lots of rotation/damage Wraith of shadow, not much used by most player in PVE. Darkrevelry powerbuff, pretty poor compared to AC/DC powerbuff All in all not to compare to a DC imo and you loose damage by positioning for pop and and using low level spells to debuff, if needed. I agree about about actual content that can be done by templock, but as said the haels are somehow inconsistent and you may fail the moment you get cc´ed or LS doesn´t pop if needed. Not sure about SB or HB being the better healer, but SB will be the better damagedealer i think. Maybe someone proves me wrong, I will try FBI myself as templock.... in case I can get through that grinding festival.
Templock misses powerfull damagebuffs and DR-buffs like BtS, HG, AS, AA, DG, BoB and agent of devine (faithfull capstone), he heals most things until players get onehittet. All you got is PoP (unhandy no aoe), you don´t reach the tank and the boss most time Dreadtheft is unhandy to debuff, you miss lots of rotation/damage Wraith of shadow, not much used by most player in PVE. Darkrevelry powerbuff, pretty poor compared to AC/DC powerbuff All in all not to compare to a DC imo and you loose damage by positioning for pop and and using low level spells to debuff, if needed. I agree about about actual content that can be done by templock, but as said the haels are somehow inconsistent and you may fail the moment you get cc´ed or LS doesn´t pop if needed. Not sure about SB or HB being the better healer, but SB will be the better damagedealer i think. Maybe someone proves me wrong, I will try FBI myself as templock.... in case I can get through that grinding festival.
The debuff on Wraith's Shadow does not work.
Are you sure about it? I did not check it, but I felt a profit in PVP getting less burst from opponent like GF...maybe it´s a pschologic effect, feeling less vulnerable using that debuff ... I would have bet that is worked in mod 8. If not, the most powerfull debuff a warlock can deal is garbage and the rework too lol
At least we can be a controller class atm. using Arms of hadar proning some minor bosses and elitemobs... sure they will fix AoH and break it completely to uselessness in short time but won´t care about the soulbinder sparkmechanic, wich will stay broken and useless for ages. For the ones that don´t know about, it´s a core mechanic like mark for GF, Divinity for DC and determination for GWF.
Comments
On one hand, it is still rare to get a decent pug group, and I found myself many times with no healer at all, although clerics were in the group. I don't know if they had dps builds or just did not have a clue how to play, it was still frustrating. But I see some progress, people do learn how to play and I hope there will be more adequate teammates ;)
On the other hand, I understand healer's pain in trying to catch the group where everyone runs into opposite directions. Ehhh, I did run and still run around quite a lot, ignoring healer's position (feel free to hate me...), because I can't play in another way - question of survivability and skills I use, however I rely a lot on my selfheals, don't stay in red and am aware that a healer wouldn't probably be able to heal me. But I try to pay more attention to stay closer to healer where I know it'll be needed since I learned the idea of the healing mechanics here. From my experience, coming from another MMO, the healing mechanics seem to be quite different here, and not everyone would know that a healer can't spam automatic long range heals anywhere in the room.
P.S. I had a top tier healer in the past in another game, started to level a buff cleric here but still can't get used to the skills here.
Let's be patient :)
Here is your non-damage classes based on game design
Healers: Devoted Cleric, Oathbound Paladins, and Scourge Warlocks
Tanks: Guardian Fighters, Great Weapon Fighters and Oathbound Paladins
If you go into a dungeon and get the following classes who do you think is a healer and the tank?
Great Weapon Fighter, Scourge Warlock, Scourge Warlock, Trickster Rogue, and Control Wizard
Oathbound Paladin, Scourge Warlock, Devoted Cleric, Devoted Cleric, and Control Wizard
In the first group the game assumes one of the SW is a healer and that the GWF is the tank.
For the second group it assumes that the SW or one of the DC is the healer and the OP is the tank.
Now out of both groups all of the players could have built their characters as DPS and not as a non-DPS. This can impact groups and make content harder than it needs to be.
Now if the random Que system only allowed players to select a role it would improve how the que system. DPS type of players would have a much longer que time compared to those of us willing to play a support role and as a long time support player, I support this type of change.
The rest of you are debuff not dps, you are there to support, it doesnt take that much to heal content in this game, 99% of the time aseal and divine glow is quite enough. Suck it up and throw healing word to the groups that need it.
Whats more important, throwing condemned down in a group that can barely stay alive, or some addition heals to them? If your in a premade group, sure your not expected to do more then random DGs really, but if your going to pug, suck it up and do it .
You should do whatever is necessary to get whatever group through whatever content.
I see so many DPS running around complaining about a lack of heals in dungeons yet these same DPS stay right in the hard hits area and expect a healer to heal through one shots. NOT HAPPENING! Learn to avoid a one shot. I mean it is clear as day, it is a bright red area that you need to move away from. Very simple mechanic.
When with a good group I use DG, Chains, and BoP. I am mainly debuffing the HAMSTER out of things with BoB and BoP and DG both Divinity and regular. Most players probably don't realize I'm healing, buffing and debuffing them so they can do more damage. See above about players not pay attention to strong strike attacks.
Now I also have AA and use that when I see how stupid DPS are behaving. Usually a SW or a GWF not paying attention and running right into the one shots.
As a DC that plays mostly as a leader, notice I did not state healer here, I can do my job just fine. My problem is DPS not doing there and that is avoiding the one shot areas. LEARN TO MOVE!
I played another MMO that would allow different builds. One for dps and one for support, PvE and PvP, bosses and mobs etc via an armory system. Something like that would be nice.
Narcediira A'Dareon -- Control Wizard
Alliana Miatumal -- Scourge Warlock
Member of House Stargayren
Only want to ad the following.
My temptation lock outheald lot's of OP's and DC's , only watching the chard, but he is by sure not the better healer same as his buffs were far worse till mod 9 and his healing is too inconsistent.
Stating the OP is the best healer may also be not correct, since every OP i saw was not able to prevent onehits that good at Orcus.
DC has a lot of tools to debuff boss and buff tank.
If you pic a pure Faithfull setup with some of those T4/5 feats , like chaplains strength, you will dish out lots of heals.
I think FBI will lead to a revival of Faithfull DC full heal, if there are enough 3,1 DC who gonna carry that burdon of mod 10. Pure pain to grind through that mod with a healerspec...time for dualspec imo.
stupid HAMSTER ever-frost resistance.
IF I NEED to heal as righteous i use healer lore instead terifying insight. THAT extra 20% is enough to give the necessary amount of heals when they need.
Perhaps not but the hero does have access to more than the handful of skills we have on the hotbar.
I don't swap out my skills very often since I'm a strictly dps class and have a build that works for me. But I can see how other classes would want the option. Especially the option to switch between healing and damage.
Narcediira A'Dareon -- Control Wizard
Alliana Miatumal -- Scourge Warlock
Member of House Stargayren
All you got is PoP (unhandy no aoe), you don´t reach the tank and the boss most time
Dreadtheft is unhandy to debuff, you miss lots of rotation/damage
Wraith of shadow, not much used by most player in PVE.
Darkrevelry powerbuff, pretty poor compared to AC/DC powerbuff
All in all not to compare to a DC imo and you loose damage by positioning for pop and and using low level spells to debuff, if needed. I agree about about actual content that can be done by templock, but as said the haels are somehow inconsistent and you may fail the moment you get cc´ed or LS doesn´t pop if needed.
Not sure about SB or HB being the better healer, but SB will be the better damagedealer i think.
Maybe someone proves me wrong, I will try FBI myself as templock.... in case I can get through that grinding festival.
I did not check it, but I felt a profit in PVP getting less burst from opponent like GF...maybe it´s a pschologic effect, feeling less vulnerable using that debuff ... I would have bet that is worked in mod 8.
If not, the most powerfull debuff a warlock can deal is garbage and the rework too
At least we can be a controller class atm. using Arms of hadar proning some minor bosses and elitemobs... sure they will fix AoH and break it completely to uselessness in short time but won´t care about the soulbinder sparkmechanic, wich will stay broken and useless for ages. For the ones that don´t know about, it´s a core mechanic like mark for GF, Divinity for DC and determination for GWF.