Bad Boy Dungeon Running

godsblade

Bad Boy Dungeon Running,

So your making a AD run in say ToS (Temple of Spider- Non Epic). You blow past all the MoBs to the boss, smackem down in 5 seconds flat an move to the next, your standing at the gate to End Boss in 8 min flat --- waiting for the other slow low level sots to catch up. You watch the health bars an see one die, the other at half life....you grumble to yourself low levels...


Really what did you expect? If you were really that powerful you would have killed all the MOBs on your way thru so they could keep up with you...so do it. Its really bad manners IMHO to leave lower level players to deal with the massive agro you just created blowing thru all the mobs. Most cant handle the damage they take trying to keep up. Looks bad for your guild also...Who wants to join a guild of self centered high levels?

Most of all: Its just good play, if your gonna blow thru, kill everything and don't leave it for the little guys or the less geared. Makes you look good, makes your guild look good, and the little guys appreciate not being left in the dust with 20 Mobs hounding them to the Boss Gate.

Just sayin, if your that strong KILLEM ALL


PS I believe you should play any way you want, but good play is good play.



Rolen

santralafax

+1 I see this behavior in T1 and T2 dungeons as well--characters that blow past the drider on the way to the second boss in ETOS, leaving the rest to clean up for example. Meanwhile they are circling Boss #2. What is the purpose in that??

No, it doesn't make them look good. Nor their guild. It just makes them look like they are playing their own game on our time.

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asterotg

If you try to do it in the shortest time possible, you dont stop at every single mob and kill it. You attack them, grab aggro and pull them all.

Some of the mobs reset, after a while. 8 of 10 players just run along and are happy to be done with it in 5-8 minutes. The other two went for a smoke at the beginning of the dungeon, want to explore it, kill every mob available or anything else. They get the aggro of the reseted mobs, after they reseted and are most likely not able to handle them. Maybe 50% of them are leveling players, the other half are praying alts qued up for TOS, to grab some RAD.

Believe me, if it would be possible, I would que it solo, if possible, I invite some friends. If a legit player is inconvinienced by my playstyle, I am sorry, but it is a fact, that at last 9 out of 10 players run SOT to grab some RAD and not for the gaming expirience.

If you dont like your group, it is allways possible to reque. TOS que pops up in 30 seconds.

blinxon

Are we talking about non epic ToS? Srly?

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blinxon

magenubbie said:

More dungeon behavior in general. the difficulty is irrelevant in my opinion.

Sry...maybe i missed it. I read the op and thought we are talking about non epic dungeons. If this is a thread about general behaviour i think like you:
Dont PuG. Build your grp with your guilde or with your friendlist.

kreatyve

I PuGed eToS last night. I haven't done it in a while, since I got new gear. We didn't have too many issues, though I outdamaged everyone. I didn't run ahead and leave people behind. I think the only reason anyone died in it at all was cause the tank decided to go diving after some loot.

santralafax

kreatyve said:

I PuGed eToS last night. I haven't done it in a while, since I got new gear. We didn't have too many issues, though I outdamaged everyone. I didn't run ahead and leave people behind. I think the only reason anyone died in it at all was cause the tank decided to go diving after some loot.

I was just pointing out that there is behavior like this across the board. It's particularly bad in non-epic dungeons--by level 70's who think their AD run is the only agenda of the day.

santralafax

asterotg said:

Believe me, if it would be possible, I would que it solo, if possible, I invite some friends. If a legit player is inconvinienced by my playstyle, I am sorry, but it is a fact, that at last 9 out of 10 players run SOT to grab some RAD and not for the gaming expirience.

If you dont like your group, it is allways possible to reque. TOS que pops up in 30 seconds.

-1

schietindebux

do level 50 toons run half speed than level 70?
in case you go etos to watch the landscape and explore dark corners you should build a team of 3 ppl go PE ask for teammates.
Otherwise just keep up to that 3k dude that pulls everyone, and clears the dungeon in 8 minutes, thats what this game sadly is all about, grinding, dailies and dungeons....boring as f..
I never go TOS and do not have any interest in it and I can´t understand this thread, sry

looomis

schietindebux said:

do level 50 toons run half speed than level 70?
in case you go etos to watch the landscape and explore dark corners you should build a team of 3 ppl go PE ask for teammates.
Otherwise just keep up to that 3k dude that pulls everyone, and clears the dungeon in 8 minutes, thats what this game sadly is all about, grinding, dailies and dungeons....boring as f..
I never go TOS and do not have any interest in it and I can´t understand this thread, sry

This is exactly my opinion. The dungeon is there since the beginning and if you are new - get a special group.

sockmunkey

The next time someone criticizes me for wanting more REWARDING solo content. I'm going to point them to this topic.

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asterotg

This is one of the few games, where ppl flame you for being 'overgeared' and running PuG. The same ppl will flame you for beeing an 'elitist', if you run Tiamat or EDemo premade with sync ques.

I dont try to force my playstyle on anyone, who are these ppl setting rules and judging others.

If you think, that you will do a random que, the other 2 or 4 ppl will ask you how you would enjoy your expirience the most, think again. This is a MMORPG with many ppl and playstyles. As long as the other players dont cheat, bot or steal your time, just deal with it.

sockmunkey

asterotg said:

T
I dont try to force my playstyle on anyone, who are these ppl setting rules and judging others.

That seems like splitting hairs. Force might be the wrong word, but you queue up for grouped content with the full intention of playing it like a solo player. So while you might not force them, you are also not opposed to dragging them, kicking and screaming if necessary, along for the ride.

If you don't want to judged by others for how you behave, don't random queue. You don't get to just say "deal with it", in the most selfish way possible. And then try to defend it or rationalize it by saying that you are not forcing people to "deal" with your behavior.

asterotg

sockmunkey said:

asterotg said:

T
I dont try to force my playstyle on anyone, who are these ppl setting rules and judging others.

That seems like splitting hairs. Force might be the wrong word, but you queue up for grouped content with the full intention of playing it like a solo player. So while you might not force them, you are also not opposed to dragging them, kicking and screaming if necessary, along for the ride.

If you don't want to judged by others for how you behave, don't random queue. You don't get to just say "deal with it", in the most selfish way possible. And then try to defend it or rationalize it by saying that you are not forcing people to "deal" with your behavior.

Do you run TOS at all or are you in for the judgment? Ask ppl running it, look at their gear. How many are leveling players in for the 'group content'? 1-5%. So most ppl are running it for RAD and not for the group expirience.

How do you know how I play. If I would run it as a solo player, I would do a door to door pull, no matter what, kill bosses, leave trash, dodge chasm, rinse and repeat. I did solo runs and as a matter of fact, they are faster then 9 out of 10 PuG runs (1 is the run with 2 other 'overgeared egoists' in my group). I dont do this. I dps all trash, clear 80-90% of them, clear after bossfights, drop the bridge and so on. This is a 3 ppl dungeon. If 2 ppl cant kill 10-20% of the mobs, most likely they are undergeared and badly played praying alts, in it for the RAD.

I said it before and I say it again, if, by chance, in one of 100 runs a leveling players is bothered by my play style, sorry. If you are running it undergeared for the RAD, like most of the players are, and you are killed by 2 mobs, bc I did not clear all the trash, I dont feel guilty at all.

sockmunkey

And this is EXACTLY why I have suggested that the game needs REWARDING solo content. You are already playing a solo game. At least if there was legit ways to earn AD alone. You wouldn't need to use the queue, and the random people you get stuck with, as a your own personal enterprise.

flowcyto

Allowing solo entry into these places for the RAD would be nice- if the devs don't want solo play to be too rewarding then they can always considerably lower the reward per run if done solo (rewarding high-end group dungeons w/ better loot would also be nice as a counter-balance, but that's a bit of a diff topic).

I don't mind teamplay, ofc, but being forced to random queue is pretty bleh. Just because I don't want to run w/ randos doesn't mean I'm 'anti-social', and even guilded players often take breaks from group-oriented play or have downtime where they're flying solo for various things or various reasons. Rather, it seems that forced teaming in lowbie instances to get end-game relevant rewards (RAD) contributes more to that type of anti-team attitude than any other type of gameplay.

asterotg

IMO there are 3 problems here. One is the lack of rewarding solo content. Second is the lack of rewarding end game content. Last but not least are min IL for the dungeons, so ppl at min IL are depending on seasoned 'overgeared' players, to carry them.

A few days ago I did a PuG VT run on my CW. I did 80% of all the dmg, I did the pulls and I had 90% of the aggro. When I did not pull, the others waited for me to do so, bc they were to weak, to do so. I know, that this is not due to my skill, but due to the fact, that existing content is not build for BIS chars with leg/ epic companions and all boons, including R 7 stronghold boons.

If there were something like CN for BIS players to farm with rewarding drops, they would do that and not run VT, ELoL, ToS etc. for RAD on 6 alts.

santralafax

...
Looomis, there's a lot more to say, but it wouldn't remain civil.

hustin1

sockmunkey said:

The next time someone criticizes me for wanting more REWARDING solo content. I'm going to point them to this topic.

Hear, hear. It's especially frustrating when the best you can offer in a Foundry is eye candy and humor.

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blinxon

The OP is talking about non epic version, isnt he? So my advice:
Check your FL ( i dont think you dont have a friend ingame ^^) and build your own group.

asterotg

santralafax said:

...
Looomis, there's a lot more to say, but it wouldn't remain civil.

You seem to prefer giving your opinion, how everyone else has to behave, while your suggestions, how to fix this, sums up to zero. Very constructive.

santralafax

asterotg said:

santralafax said:

...
Looomis, there's a lot more to say, but it wouldn't remain civil.

You seem to prefer giving your opinion, how everyone else has to behave, while your suggestions, how to fix this, sums up to zero. Very constructive.

ambrosianectar said:

OP, Here's a different solution to the problem:



Express your expectations at the start of the dungeon.



In a PUG, it is unreasonable for you to expect everyone to run think exactly what you are thinking.



Want to run "Boss to Boss"?

I would agree with Ambrosianectar here. If you have your own ideas about dungeon running, let people know.

As for the statement you quoted, I have been in MC with Looomis before. Saying anything more there breaks TOS.

bodini72

the comments here are typical of the selfish society we live in today...

let me queue for GROUP content but i'm better than everyone else so if they don't do what I want then @#$% them...

trying to blame others for being too slow or undergeared is akin to victim blaming. telling them to make their own group is beyond selfish and condesending. Demanding others in GROUP content conform to YOUR demands(which to be clear does not follow group content standards) is the worst type of mentality in an MMO.I say shame on you

You're soooo OP, go do epics and let lower level/geared players run approporiate content.Want to burn through lower level content without ANY concern for the others in there with you then form a group in PE with that specifically in mind. As you say there are plenty of players that will appreciate the run through.

The point is that there are also plenty of people that DO NOT appreciate your selfish behavior in an community based game.

asterotg

bodini72 said:

the comments here are typical of the selfish society we live in today...

let me queue for GROUP content but i'm better than everyone else so if they don't do what I want then @#$% them...

trying to blame others for being too slow or undergeared is akin to victim blaming. telling them to make their own group is beyond selfish and condesending. Demanding others in GROUP content conform to YOUR demands(which to be clear does not follow group content standards) is the worst type of mentality in an MMO.I say shame on you

You're soooo OP, go do epics and let lower level/geared players run approporiate content.Want to burn through lower level content without ANY concern for the others in there with you then form a group in PE with that specifically in mind. As you say there are plenty of players that will appreciate the run through.

The point is that there are also plenty of people that DO NOT appreciate your selfish behavior in an community based game.

Did you read the comments? Most ppl running it are lvl 70 alts, farming AD. They depend on stronger geared ppl to finish the dungeon. How is it victim blaming, if someone ques for a 3 ppl dungeon and he gets killed by one or two mobs, bc he did not gear the char at all.

Not the ppl able to run this dungeons solo are complaining, but the ones, who die, if not every last mob is killed by someone else.

ATM the most rewarding dungeon for farming RAD is (exept high geared premade runs) TOS. That is not the fault of the players, but of the developers.

As I wrote before, most players I know kill most of the mobs, drop bridges etc, to help the other players out, but there is a balance between doing a fast run and regarding the other players needs and clearing the dungeon up to the last mob, so everyone else can frolik arond at their own leisure.

greywynd

asterotg said:

Did you read the comments? Most ppl running it are lvl 70 alts, farming AD.

Do you have actual, documented proof of this? Or just the extremely small sample data of posters in this thread?

bodini72

Your close minded view changes nothing. Your comments speak volumes and contradict your last statement. It is highly inappropriate to join/run GROUP content while you are at higher levels and DEMAND others follow your anti group view. No matter the arguement you TRY to pose to justify it, it is still shameful at best.

If you are going to run lower level content to satisfy YOUR wants the least you can/should do is check to see if everyone is cool with speed runs. It is the responsibility of those that have to offer assistance to those that don't have. That is a basic principal of group play.

If you wouldn't like it being done to you or if it is something you wouldn't do to someone you know then it is bad manners to do it to others. The arguement that it is the designers fault while true doesn't make rude/inapproporiate behavior acceptable.

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