Epic Demogorgon, phase 3, is about killing Demogorgon

santralafax

I was in 2 matches this morning, the first ony ended in silver and I wasn't satisfied--so I queued up again.

The next group, in the first phase, barely missed gold. In phase 2 someone "healed" Goristro at least once, probably twice. We got him a about 1/2 down before it was over. In Phase 3 most of the players, all from the same guild, began whacking miscellaneous demons just like in Phase 1, while leaving Demogorgon alone. I would run up to Demogorgon, hit him a few times in unstoppable--he would immediately stomp ne. Rinse, repeat. I died maybe 6 times in Phase 3 alone. Despite that, I took Paingiver.

I've been in at least one other Demo fight with a yahoo healing Goristro recently.

Are there groups that are doing Demo as some kind of sport, ignoring the official rules?? I got one twisted ichor between the two matches. I'm maxed out on regular ichor, so I got none of that.

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namelesshero347

eDemo phase 3 can be a clusterf**k for all-DPS teams. It really helps if there is a good tank and/or healer around. Otherwise its kind of hard to ignore the adds and DPS demo at the same time. And if demo is on the other side of the map, half the all-DPS team won't make it there.

I find it much easier to getting gold on my GF/DC than on my TR/CW

urabask

santralafax said:

I was in 2 matches this morning, the first ony ended in silver and I wasn't satisfied--so I queued up again.

The next group, in the first phase, barely missed gold. In phase 2 someone "healed" Goristro at least once, probably twice. We got him a about 1/2 down before it was over. In Phase 3 most of the players, all from the same guild, began whacking miscellaneous demons just like in Phase 1, while leaving Demogorgon alone. I would run up to Demogorgon, hit him a few times in unstoppable--he would immediately stomp ne. Rinse, repeat. I died maybe 6 times in Phase 3 alone. Despite that, I took Paingiver.

I've been in at least one other Demo fight with a yahoo healing Goristro recently.

Are there groups that are doing Demo as some kind of sport, ignoring the official rules?? I got one twisted ichor between the two matches. I'm maxed out on regular ichor, so I got none of that.

I had the opposite experience where everyone went for Demo and ignored all the mobs and kept dying as a result : |

Starting to come to the conclusion that every party needs an OP because there's always the chance the other 5 you queue up with are really stupid.

oldbaldyone

Oddly enough, I've done eDemo twice, and the preset group of 2 parties did worse than the pug. Course, thats because the tank decided that since we didnt get gold in round 2, round 3 wasnt worth staying and promptly left.

This is the new thing I've seen with these rated raid/skirms...especially the skirms. People are leaving right away, because the group they got isn't deemed worthy of the time (they assume they wont finish it fast enough or get goldx3, so they leave.

Next up: Leaving Penalties for dungeons I bet

zibadawa

oldbaldyone said:

Oddly enough, I've done eDemo twice, and the preset group of 2 parties did worse than the pug. Course, thats because the tank decided that since we didnt get gold in round 2, round 3 wasnt worth staying and promptly left.

This is the new thing I've seen with these rated raid/skirms...especially the skirms. People are leaving right away, because the group they got isn't deemed worthy of the time (they assume they wont finish it fast enough or get goldx3, so they leave.

Next up: Leaving Penalties for dungeons I bet

People have been doing this in every queued content since forever, especially once they nerfed kicking. People will leave any dungeon or skirmish if the group doesn't look right--no tank = guaranteed fail in most cases, so why waste 45 minutes or so to find out for sure? People will ditch PvP matches and take the queue ban rather than wait out a match that doesn't meet their expectations, too. I've done it myself, as sometimes I'd rather finish up some solo content or just go watch TV instead of twiddling my thumbs in-game. Waiting it out is a waste of my time.

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gleichgewichtnw

Tanking edemo is a painfull mess, since you cant use your potions or skills. And if you run (with demo behind you) to the blue circle to cure you the ppl get angry.

normal demo have more of the blue circles on the map, so I can avoid the croud.

mentinmindmaker

The entrance sanity well is permanent.

Everything should be pulled to it so people have a short run, and so those with ranged attacks can stay in it.

Mobs properly placed just outside entrance blue makes it SO much easier.

zibadawa

gleichgewichtnw said:

Tanking edemo is a painfull mess, since you cant use your potions or skills. And if you run (with demo behind you) to the blue circle to cure you the ppl get angry.

normal demo have more of the blue circles on the map, so I can avoid the croud.

A second tank you can trade aggro with helps. One comes in, takes aggro, other dude cycles back to the well.

r000kie said:

As someone said above, is hard to get to demo across the map, alive. Especially with a CW running like a duck because every time there is a mob around. I died maybe 10 times from damage coming from nowhere. Also, it seemed different after the last patch, damage done by mobs was increased?

CW's and HR's man. At least TR's can't hold aggro for beans (though demons seem a bit more persistent, but it's still not much), so we can dodge and run with rarely any kiting induced. But HR's and CW's...

qexotic

I only have two characters: a CW and an HR. Both have problems moving around at anything more than a slow hobble in Demo and eDemo. One way to slightly mitigate the constant dying is to have an Angel of Protection summoned as your companion. She stops quite a lot of the unseen hits that would otherwise take you out...but you will still be moving slowly and dying a lot.

gleichgewichtnw

zibadawa said:

A second tank you can trade aggro with helps. One comes in, takes aggro, other dude cycles back to the well.

That would be a possibility if you could finally make 10-player-groups and dont have randoms with you.

urabask

zibadawa said:

gleichgewichtnw said:

Tanking edemo is a painfull mess, since you cant use your potions or skills. And if you run (with demo behind you) to the blue circle to cure you the ppl get angry.

normal demo have more of the blue circles on the map, so I can avoid the croud.

A second tank you can trade aggro with helps. One comes in, takes aggro, other dude cycles back to the well.

r000kie said:

As someone said above, is hard to get to demo across the map, alive. Especially with a CW running like a duck because every time there is a mob around. I died maybe 10 times from damage coming from nowhere. Also, it seemed different after the last patch, damage done by mobs was increased?

CW's and HR's man. At least TR's can't hold aggro for beans (though demons seem a bit more persistent, but it's still not much), so we can dodge and run with rarely any kiting induced. But HR's and CW's...

This sounds like a GF problem lol.

mamalion1234

zibadawa said:

gleichgewichtnw said:

Tanking edemo is a painfull mess, since you cant use your potions or skills. And if you run (with demo behind you) to the blue circle to cure you the ppl get angry.

normal demo have more of the blue circles on the map, so I can avoid the croud.

A second tank you can trade aggro with helps. One comes in, takes aggro, other dude cycles back to the well.

r000kie said:

As someone said above, is hard to get to demo across the map, alive. Especially with a CW running like a duck because every time there is a mob around. I died maybe 10 times from damage coming from nowhere. Also, it seemed different after the last patch, damage done by mobs was increased?

CW's and HR's man. At least TR's can't hold aggro for beans (though demons seem a bit more persistent, but it's still not much), so we can dodge and run with rarely any kiting induced. But HR's and CW's...

hr and cw they can control shouldnt be an issue to stay alive.

zibadawa

mamalion1234 said:

hr and cw they can control shouldnt be an issue to stay alive.

Their ability to survive ranges from "irrelevant" to "exactly the problem" here. We're talking about how you can have mobs grouped up, applying AoE's to them to kill them all asap, and then one HR or CW gets scared and runs away and suddenly the entire pack is chasing them across the map and the dps to the mobs drops by multiple orders of magnitude as a result. What I'd much rather them do is simply die in this situation, as they're HAMSTER everyone over and slowing down the entire process. I only want them kiting stuff when they're actively moving mobs into a larger pack or into a better position--moving demo closer to the perma well would be good, dragging him off to the left side because you saw a well there means you should've just died for the team.

jobsalotofwork

Have you thought of using one of the invisibility rings on your CW to help you drop aggro?

urabask

zibadawa said:

mamalion1234 said:

hr and cw they can control shouldnt be an issue to stay alive.

Their ability to survive ranges from "irrelevant" to "exactly the problem" here. We're talking about how you can have mobs grouped up, applying AoE's to them to kill them all asap, and then one HR or CW gets scared and runs away and suddenly the entire pack is chasing them across the map and the dps to the mobs drops by multiple orders of magnitude as a result. What I'd much rather them do is simply die in this situation, as they're HAMSTER everyone over and slowing down the entire process. I only want them kiting stuff when they're actively moving mobs into a larger pack or into a better position--moving demo closer to the perma well would be good, dragging him off to the left side because you saw a well there means you should've just died for the team.

: |

I would agree if people didn't drag all the mobs into the center when there aren't enough people to kill them. Can't count the number of times I've seen people drag 10+ mobs together then get all mad when people start dodging because everyone else is opening portals or respawning. If you're going to try to get all the mobs together the burden is on you to make sure it's even going to work.

Melee classes **** up the third phase 99.9% of the time too. There are always a few GWFs that rush out to demo and sit there whacking him instead of dragging him back to the permanent well.

santralafax

urabask said:

There are always a few GWFs that rush out to demo and sit there whacking him instead of dragging him back to the permanent well.

I'm probably one of those. Do you drag him to the well for quick access to it, or does the well cause him damage if he's actually IN it?

urabask

santralafax said:

urabask said:

There are always a few GWFs that rush out to demo and sit there whacking him instead of dragging him back to the permanent well.

I'm probably one of those. Do you drag him to the well for quick access to it, or does the well cause him damage if he's actually IN it?

For the quick access to it. Basically every time you have to get into a sanity well there's always one right next you and you can keep attacking him while you're in it.

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santralafax

r000kie said:

As per my GWF, I can sprint with ease, sadly demo almost never follows me so maybe that is the reason I personally hack happily at him doing my part.

Demo trails my GWF around a-lot.

rcethatsme

I am a 3.2k GWF working with a version of Laz's High Crit build.
I have been doing mostly Solo PVE since Mod 4 and I Do know how to fight my toon (Solo).
I just started to do Demo and I really do not know how to fight in a group real well, per-say
Can someone explain what my role would/should be in each Phase.
I really did not know about the Phase game until I read this post, so any and ALL help would be greatly appreated.
Thank You in advance for your comments

santralafax

Sure.

In the first phase you simply want to kill as many demons as you can, as quickly as you can. If you can develop tactics with others to increase the deaths, even better.

In the second match, you want to kill Goristro. If he targets you wht the red lines/track, try to center yourself between him and the gold/yellow target on the wall. When he hits that he takes extra damage. When not targeted, simply do your best to hack him to bits. The faster you get him down the better.

The third phase is primarily about killing Demo--as a GWF you just want to DPS him as much as possible while staying alive.

There will be a lot of talk about tactics and the best way that you should do these three things, but this is it in a nutshell.

santralafax

Today I was in a group vote-kicking people. First time I saw that--in a time-limited event. I received a request mid-way through phase 1 to vote-kick *somebody* and was kicked myself during Goristro (apparently for missing the Gold ward). After the first vote-kick we were down to 4 people. I don't know if a replacement arrived before I was disappeared.

It seems to me that by consigning your team to 4 or less, even if 1 is sub-optimal, you are further deteriorating your chances.

While they likely went on to earn Bronze, my next group took Gold. Thanks for not wasting any more of my time!

zibadawa

santralafax said:

Today I was in a group vote-kicking people. First time I saw that--in a time-limited event. I received a request mid-way through phase 1 to vote-kick *somebody* and was kicked myself during Goristro (apparently for missing the Gold ward). After the first vote-kick we were down to 4 people. I don't know if a replacement arrived before I was disappeared.

It seems to me that by consigning your team to 4 or less, even if 1 is sub-optimal, you are further deteriorating your chances.

While they likely went on to earn Bronze, my next group took Gold. Thanks for not wasting any more of my time!

Replacements can arrive before the first stage starts. There's something like a 2 minute hiatus before you can do vote kicking, but once that passes you can start booting whoever, and before the "prepare for battle" timer hits 0 new people can queue into the instance to replace them. I've had this done before in a normal demo run when one player apparently went afk after accepting the queue. He was just standing there at the initial load-in point and wasn't responding to requests to get on the slab. So he ended up vote-kicked from our party, and a few seconds later a DC loaded in (hooray).

However, no replacements can arrive after the first stage begins (meaning the cutscene plays). So at that point votekicking is rarely wise, as it only helps if the person is dropping the performance of the entire team--constantly kiting mobs around the arena when you need to kill them or keep them in a stable area, regularly charging goristro into black portals (misses are fine; it's pretty much guaranteed to happen a few times since he tends to start charging concurrently with the death lasers multiple times, and most people cannot survive those), things like that. Being suboptimal isn't a worthwhile kick. If his net contribution is positive (or zero, really), then you only serve to lose by kicking him. In fact, since the vote kick distracts everyone from their jobs, and thereby actively hinders progress, even a slightly negative contribution should be tolerated as the vote kick itself is worse than they are!

szejhuludpuchacz

Party composition is a key. Dont go without good tank in your party, dont depend on another party. Perfect is op/gf, healer +3 good DPS (included some controler). I would say its not safe to enter edemo under 3k. Drowcraft armor help alot my GWF, losing some stats but its better tan derping dead in 4 pieces of DF armor.

urabask

szejhuludpuchacz said:

Party composition is a key. Dont go without good tank in your party, dont depend on another party. Perfect is op/gf, healer +3 good DPS (included some controler). I would say its not safe to enter edemo under 3k. Drowcraft armor help alot my GWF, losing some stats but its better tan derping dead in 4 pieces of DF armor.

Taking a GF relies on everyone not doing stupid things. I'd rather take an OP and not waste time on a run because someone keeps standing in red circles and getting the GF killed.

szejhuludpuchacz

urabask said:

Taking a GF relies on everyone not doing stupid things. I'd rather take an OP and not waste time on a run because someone keeps standing in red circles and getting the GF killed.

I have done edemo with GF only, just need geared players. Its up to him slot KV, sometimes aggroing mobs is just enough. ITF help melt mobs on mid. DC help GF survive, and you can synchro que with guildies, friends, zerg channel members. One team with GF another with OP.

kemi1984

mentinmindmaker said:

The entrance sanity well is permanent.

Everything should be pulled to it so people have a short run, and so those with ranged attacks can stay in it.

Mobs properly placed just outside entrance blue makes it SO much easier.

Please just give this guy a medal, anybody ??
Yes just yes! pull the big guy to the entrance sanity well and it will be much easier....even when you die, you do not need to run to the other part of the map

kemi1984

Thinking about it what's your opinion of GF role in the 1st phase.

Do you prefer to grab Demo and toy with him so the rest can dps the adds or pull him to the well and STILL take the adds?

Of course the 2nd option is much harder lol. Especially with KV on and folks taking a nice hot bath in red circles but still...

What's your opinion fellow players?

szejhuludpuchacz

kemi1984 said:

Thinking about it what's your opinion of GF role in the 1st phase.

Do you prefer to grab Demo and toy with him so the rest can dps the adds or pull him to the well and STILL take the adds?

Of course the 2nd option is much harder lol. Especially with KV on and folks taking a nice hot bath in red circles but still...

What's your opinion fellow players?

Havent tried on my GF yet, since he is under req+conq. On OP im taking all on me to mid, since auras helps in some limited range. As GF i would keep him near the entrance kiting demogorgon and helping team with ITF at least. Most GWF are SM these days and mark mobs with DS (and IV has 3xcharges of aoe mark atwill) so no need to go there with enforced and being hitted from the back.

In Goristro phase Im just waiting for aggro. If his attack aim someone else I will run circle to get rid of stacks. Sometimes there are cirlces in line with yellow rune. It helps to run it instead of entrance if Gori aggro on you during pink one-shot attack.