Actually, I teamed with a group of ATs ( inferno/unleashed/mind) and we got through all 10 rounds successfully a few times. As long as each team member knew what they were doing, its achievable. ^^
Actually, I teamed with a group of ATs ( inferno/unleashed/mind) and we got through all 10 rounds successfully a few times. As long as each team member knew what they were doing, its achievable. ^^
And theres the rub. Most times people are just awful....they also smell of prunes :<
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
Then you'd know that this alert isn't only for a few select minmaxers.
I don't know what players want for content or what they wants games to be. As far as I can tell many of the complainers in this thread would be happy if all new content consisted of a button that upon clicking granted a reward. Of course then there would still be complaints that the button wasn't big enough for them to drag their mouse over.
Incorrect.
There are two schools of thought I'm seeing here, and I hate to say it but you're sounding like the worst of them (as much as I like you). No one has said 'it's too challenging!'. No one has complained about challenging content, ever.
No one ever said 'make it push-button win!'. Ever. Where you get this straw-man fallacy is beyond me. So far, the only people I've seen in favor of keeping this have immediately turned and insinuated that the majority of the gamers here 'aren't playing right'. This elitism and arrogance that attempts to discredit other players' legitimate concerns with the problem in the game borderlines on pathetic and disgusting, and is what I consider the worst of any gaming community. The snyde, smug, and pompous attitude that states "I can do it, therefore it is fine" is a blight. To that, I say "Lance Armstrong won the Tour-De-France. You should be able to do so, or maybe you just suck at bicycles and should go sit on the tricycle and do circles, loser."
There's a reason Demon's Souls isn't the greatest game ever. Masochistic try-harders love its punishment, while even competent and skilled gamers will simply try it and recognize it for being idiotic in its 'challenge'.
And there is a MASSIVE difference between 'challenge' and 'Frustratingly Imbalanced'.
However, this alert's time constraint (I'm only asking for 30 seconds, make it an even 2 minutes) takes it to a degree of stupidity, and you can't deny it. CO is a game of options. Yes, everyone needs to have a build that can play one or two roles and do so effectively with considerable degrees of optimization. No, not everyone should be able to complete this. But as it stands, it's not about skill- it's about cobbling together something very specific in a damned PUG.
Gate it to lvl35+, or add 30 seconds. All I'm saying. Stop listening to the try-harders that find some inflated self-worth and aggrandizing braggart rights by accomplishing something. Otherwise, effort has been wasted on something that is enjoyable only by a select elite few.
If this is too much to ask, and the community despises this- then we're completely broken and we deserve all the feces that is shoveled at us.
Then you'd know that this alert isn't only for a few select minmaxers.
I don't know what players want for content or what they wants games to be. As far as I can tell many of the complainers in this thread would be happy if all new content consisted of a button that upon clicking granted a reward. Of course then there would still be complaints that the button wasn't big enough for them to drag their mouse over.
You have been the voice of reason in this thread.
Thank you for posting hard numbers and examples instead of getting all emotional and over reacting to something new.
I know how to 'build right'. I know how to 'play right'. Most people do. But this is an alert with a challenge only a select few mini-maxers can succeed at, if they are on a team. That is not a challenge, it's a requirement.
1. Dont take this the wrong way, but CO doesn't exactly condition players to "build or play right" especially alerts. You generally don't have to do either of those things to win 99% of the fights. How can a boxer know if hes a great fighter if hes rarely challenged in training or in the ring?
2. That "select few mini-maxers" has already been proven false unless all of these examples and more are liars:
I have only been doing these alerts in my lv 20 Soldier AT. Both with a good single and cone AoE, I don't think I am holding back the groups, I pull my weight
No, archetypes are well capable. I pointed out in my fourth screenie that we had an at dps, who did really well.
Edit: The alert is unfriendly towards low level characters, but frankly so are most alerts.
3. kaizerin has at least posted hard facts to support his/her claims, would it be too much to ask for you and others that claim that this alert is too hard to at least post your build. That way maybe we can help you fix your problem or at least present a detailed view of the problem to the devs instead of blindly nerf herding.
Also your a Lifer and a regular on the forums, im just having a hard time imagining that you cant make a build that can handle this alert while staying in theme.
PVP is starving without rewards
1. Please give us Daily PVP missions that reward Questionite.
2. Please give us an exchange rate between Acclaim and Recognition so that PVP has access to all "On Alert" PVE rewards.
Anyway... Just a thing I've noticed on the fight with Firewing, the PBAoE burn lingers for a while even after you defeat him. I've found my hero dropping dead about half way through the cut scene (that unmistakable THUD sound during Tateklys speech ), so as a tip: watch out for that fire!
You have been the voice of reason in this thread.
Thank you for posting hard numbers and examples instead of getting all emotional and over reacting to something new.
1. Dont take this the wrong way, but CO doesn't exactly condition players to "build or play right" especially alerts. You generally don't have to do either of those things to win 99% of the fights. How can a boxer know if hes a great fighter if hes rarely challenged in training or in the ring?
2. That "select few mini-maxers" has already been proven false unless all of these examples and more are liars:
3. kaizerin has at least posted hard facts to support his/her claims, would it be too much to ask for you and others that claim that this alert is too hard to at least post your build. That way maybe we can help you fix your problem or at least present a detailed view of the problem to the devs instead of blindly nerf herding.
Also your a Lifer and a regular on the forums, im just having a hard time imagining that you cant make a build that can handle this alert while staying in theme.
No. I will not. You two can stand beside one another and defend your points- I actually like both of you.
The point I've made stands.
I'm sorry, I don't feel the need to post numbers and dissect what I already know is a perfectly good build that can solo the vast majority of this game's content and stay in theme. I know what I am doing is not broken, and I don't intend to change it to accomodate one alert, as it has performed well across the board- and not just in alerts (PvP not so much, but I'm sure you understand why).
I am in full favor of this being gated to levels 35+ or adding 30 seconds to the clock. Period.
Sigma, your quotes are incomplete. Most of the complaints have been from those who want to see the entire event; my Inferno only got to the round with Ironclad and Duratok, and then we barely managed to dent their health bars before losing. Didn't feel like a loss to me because Tickytacky (or whatever his name is, up there at the podium) told us we'd brought honor upon our homeworld just by getting that far (and since I never figured I'd clear the whole thing, I wasn't in it for the rewards anyway).
Now, if you're in it to "win" by clearing Firewing, or if you're looking for rewards beyond just having a fun challenge, then this thing is definitely going to leave a bad taste in your mouth. Same reason I've taken to skipping Blood Moon - this last time at least, unless the boss dropped their unique reward for you, what you got was an UNTIL box, same as the ones from part II of the Lemurian Invasion. And those drop an item - that is up to ten levels higher than you are, which is fine if you're 40, but not so great for everyone else, and there's little feeling of accomplishment when you know the whole thing is just going to start again in half an hour (even the little stone spire doesn't go away).
"Science teaches us to expect -- demand -- more than just eerie mysteries. What use is a puzzle that can't be solved? Patience is fine, but I'm not going to stop asking the universe to make sense!"
Yep. I love these people that, within 24 hours of a new alert coming out, seem to be experts on what the minimum team requirements are to complete it successfully. Like, if they can't beat it within a couple of tries it must be IMPOSSIBLE unless you have 5 min-max'd level 40 DPS builds.
How about experimenting with some different tactics? Maybe certain rounds are easier with vehicles? Or, just pre-grouping with a level 40 friend or two will increase your odds dramatically--perhaps you may want to join a SG?
I don't know if the timer on round 7 is optimum, but having completed the alert successfully on my first attempt with a PUG, I'm thinking many of these forumites doth protest too much.
LTS since 2009. Author of ACT parser module for CO. Founder of Rampagers. Resident curmudgeon.
"Without data, you're just another person with an opinion." -- W. Edwards Deming
There are two schools of thought I'm seeing here, and I hate to say it but you're sounding like the worst of them (as much as I like you). No one has said 'it's too challenging!'. No one has complained about challenging content, ever.
No one ever said 'make it push-button win!'. Ever. Where you get this straw-man fallacy is beyond me. So far, the only people I've seen in favor of keeping this have immediately turned and insinuated that the majority of the gamers here 'aren't playing right'. This elitism and arrogance that attempts to discredit other players' legitimate concerns with the problem in the game borderlines on pathetic and disgusting, and is what I consider the worst of any gaming community. The snyde, smug, and pompous attitude that states "I can do it, therefore it is fine" is a blight. To that, I say "Lance Armstrong won the Tour-De-France. You should be able to do so, or maybe you just suck at bicycles and should go sit on the tricycle and do circles, loser."
There's a reason Demon's Souls isn't the greatest game ever. Masochistic try-harders love its punishment, while even competent and skilled gamers will simply try it and recognize it for being idiotic in its 'challenge'.
And there is a MASSIVE difference between 'challenge' and 'Frustratingly Imbalanced'.
However, this alert's time constraint (I'm only asking for 30 seconds, make it an even 2 minutes) takes it to a degree of stupidity, and you can't deny it. CO is a game of options. Yes, everyone needs to have a build that can play one or two roles and do so effectively with considerable degrees of optimization. No, not everyone should be able to complete this. But as it stands, it's not about skill- it's about cobbling together something very specific in a damned PUG.
Gate it to lvl35+, or add 30 seconds. All I'm saying. Stop listening to the try-harders that find some inflated self-worth and aggrandizing braggart rights by accomplishing something. Otherwise, effort has been wasted on something that is enjoyable only by a select elite few.
If this is too much to ask, and the community despises this- then we're completely broken and we deserve all the feces that is shoveled at us.
This pretty much covers it, shame that there's people actually defending Cryptic's decisions on something that is so clearly broken, it's people like that who make me want to stop posting here.
There's challenging, and then there's tailoring a mission for one specific super build, don't confuse the two.
Eh perhaps they should just add a one and a half minute timer to Gravitar, since that is apparently what challenging is these days, at least there's only the one boss in that alert!
This pretty much covers it, shame that there's people actually defending Cryptic's decisions on something that is so clearly broken, it's people like that who make me want to stop posting here.
There's challenging, and then there's tailoring a mission for one specific super build, don't confuse the two.
Eh perhaps they should just add a one and a half minute timer to Gravitar, since that is apparently what challenging is these days, at least there's only the one boss in that alert!
No, Gravitar is totally soloable and weak content. You are playing it wrong. Redo your whole character, stupid.
So far, the only people I've seen in favor of keeping this have immediately turned and insinuated that the majority of the gamers here 'aren't playing right'. This elitism and arrogance that attempts to discredit other players' legitimate concerns with the problem in the game borderlines on pathetic and disgusting, and is what I consider the worst of any gaming community.
So if you think that many people in CO dont know how to play they are eletist?
And theres the rub. Most times people are just awful....they also smell of prunes :<
Watch out Nepht, your L33T now....:eek:
Its not necessarily that players need to "LTP NUBZ!" it that the game never requires any thing from them, never teaches them any thing and thus they have no reason to think they are not realizing their full potential.
You talk of straw-man arguments but i could say the same about you framing this discussion as about an alert that's "only for minmaxers" or framing people that disagree with you as elitist.
Painting players that even you respect as elitist isn't going to win you any points.
PVP is starving without rewards
1. Please give us Daily PVP missions that reward Questionite.
2. Please give us an exchange rate between Acclaim and Recognition so that PVP has access to all "On Alert" PVE rewards.
Over all, the first seven rounds were fun and entertaining. It was nice to have something new to run for a change, even if the content was "light".
I've done this event twelve times (twice with all six of my 40s), each time with a random pick-up group. Not one single time did any of us get past the 8th round, three of the twelve times we failed due to the "run away" bug.
The greatest reward (which I received 8 times) was 11,000 Resources (the other three was 7,000 resources, one PUG never made it past the 5th round).
The timed rounds of this Alert are centered around coordinating and delivering high DPS. If you don't have the DPS NO STRATEGY exists to allow you to complete the 8th round (at the very least, I can't speak to the hypothetical "9th" or "10th" rounds).
The last few levels of this Alert are for high DPS characters solely and exclude all other builds.
Final opinion:
This is only a challenging event for high DPS characters. It is a frustrating event for everyone else. While the first few rounds were fun for me (the alien dogs were interesting and I enjoyed the "gladiatorial feel") the event is not worth the meager rewards or the frustration it caused.
Eight year, two month resident of Paragon City finding new challenges and combating new evils in Millenium City.
Over all, the first seven rounds were fun and entertaining. It was nice to have something new to run for a change, even if the content was "light".
I've done this event twelve times (twice with all six of my 40s), each time with a random pick-up group. Not one single time did any of us get past the 8th round, three of the twelve times we failed due to the "run away" bug.
The greatest reward (which I received 8 times) was 11,000 Resources (the other three was 7,000 resources, one PUG never made it past the 5th round).
The timed rounds of this Alert are centered around coordinating and delivering high DPS. If you don't have the DPS NO STRATEGY exists to allow you to complete the 8th round (at the very least, I can't speak to the hypothetical "9th" or "10th" rounds).
The last few levels of this Alert are for high DPS characters solely and exclude all other builds.
Final opinion:
This is only a challenging event for high DPS characters. It is a frustrating event for everyone else. While the first few rounds were fun for me (the alien dogs were interesting and I enjoyed the "gladiatorial feel") the event is not worth the meager rewards or the frustration it caused.
Sure, you'll want 2 or 3 DPS-oriented characters out of the 5 to complete the 8th round.
OH NO, there's one particular challenge of one alert that you can't sleep-walk through without some DPS roles on your team--Cryptic hates us!
If you don't have a DPS toon, and don't trust the odds of a PUG pairing you with any, make some friends? This is not entirely a solo game.
P.S. I just ran the alert twice during my lunch hour with PUGs. First time failed on round 8, second time total victory--with two out of five high-DPS toons (combat stats from the final fight below).
LTS since 2009. Author of ACT parser module for CO. Founder of Rampagers. Resident curmudgeon.
"Without data, you're just another person with an opinion." -- W. Edwards Deming
On the flip side, if your group has 3 or more high level (35+) DPS toons, the alert is an autowin.
I dunno.
I am glad to have a new special alert.
I am disappointed in not getting a new rampage.
I am happy that the alert is not too easy.
I am bored with alerts that are just tank-and-spank.
I am encouraged that they did something a little different in the alert.
I am unimpressed with the execution.
So.... after my 6th try I finally managed to defeat Firewing with a PUG!!!!!
The composition was pretty much 5 dps, all lvl 40 (maybe I was lucky with the lvls here). And... well we pretty much roflstomped everything including ironclad, I think we had like 20 secs left on the timer when we killed him.
I only got resources at the end though... boooooooo!!! hahahahha
___________________
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Click up there if you want to find more about the costumes behind my heroines.
Quasimojo1, thank you for providing some viable strategies and I am glad your luck in PUGs has been greater than mine.
I played twelve of the Malvan alerts. I enjoyed them enough to grind out twelve of them, and in general I hate repetition. (I can't run more than a few regular Alerts before I want to scratch my eyes out).
The fact is I enjoy meeting new players and making new friends. That's exactly WHY I like PUGs so much. I have a lot of friends on my friends list because of my PUG-affinity, and play with them frequently. I play for fun and creating character stories in my head. The truth is the upper rounds of this game are not designed for players like me, they are designed for well-built heroes where strategy is less important than DPS. (Though 2 of my six 40s are built for high DPS, neither have found luck in any of my runs).
I'm glad others have had a positive experience with the event. As it is, I'm done with the Malvan alert for now. Rewards are too meager for the frustration it's caused me in round 8 (and I can only presume, beyond).
Eight year, two month resident of Paragon City finding new challenges and combating new evils in Millenium City.
Kaizerin posted the DPS numbers necessary to succeed here. Those numbers are rather low, well within the reach of most AT's, many support builds, tanks, etc.
Has the alert been changed in such a fashion as to render those numbers inaccurate ?
Kaizerin posted the DPS numbers necessary to succeed here. Those numbers are rather low, well within the reach of most AT's, many support builds, tanks, etc.
Has the alert been changed in such a fashion as to render those numbers inaccurate ?
I think it boils down to the player skill as well... you know a dead player does 0 dps. So if they dont have common sense (blocking charged powers for instance, etc.) you can underperform even if in theory you have high dps.
___________________
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Click up there if you want to find more about the costumes behind my heroines.
After reading through this thread all I can say is:
"Damn you military housing shipment!"
Still don't have my gaming rig from England.
"There is only one way to support a PFF tank: Send Cyrone lots of money weekly... because he's the only one to successfully be a true PFF Tank." - chuckwolf
I just want a solid two minutes to fight Ironclad and Duratok. I don't think that's asking for too much as it certainly isn't enough extra time to ensure a victory for bad PuGs and the Formula 1 teams won't really need it anyway. The players that make up the middle ground between those two camps(aren't terrible and/or ridiculous min-maxers) could use the breathing room though.
Besides, now that I've used a few higher-level characters, anybody who isn't 40 is a "lowbie" for the purposes of this Alert. Happifun Security System X-4 wasn't putting out enough DPS to turn the tide, for Stark's sake!
"Science teaches us to expect -- demand -- more than just eerie mysteries. What use is a puzzle that can't be solved? Patience is fine, but I'm not going to stop asking the universe to make sense!"
I keep hearing the same thing: You need to put together a team.
You know, just like NemCon.
Bull****. The only reason you need to team for NemCon beforehand is that otherwise, the queue isn't likely to pop.
A full run of NemCon is a lot easier with a group of fairly average builds than this Forum Malvanum ****, mostly because tanks and supporters aren't rendered useless by an idiotic timer.
I just want a solid two minutes to fight Ironclad and Duratok. I don't think that's asking for too much as it certainly isn't enough extra time to ensure a victory for bad PuGs and the Formula 1 teams won't really need it anyway. The players that make up the middle ground between those two camps(aren't terrible and/or ridiculous min-maxers) could use the breathing room though.
Possibly the most intelligent thing said in this thread so far. Kudos.
Forming a good team isn't easy outside of peak hours. The time spent waiting for players to become available could be used to do something more interesting.
I don't want to do something I know it's will be 100% fail before starting.
^This
Times run: 30
Times to level 5 (pass): 30
Times to level 6: 5
Times to level 7: 3
Times past level 7: 0
Drops: ZERO
Times people left: 11
Last run had two level 12's. The DPS was so pitiful it took 7 minutes to complete level 5.
Edit: Finally got Duratok and Ironclad. We had four 40s and one 27. We didn't even get close to having either one below half health, but hey...I got there. Finally.
A full run of NemCon is a lot easier with a group of fairly average builds than this Forum Malvanum ****, mostly because tanks and supporters aren't rendered useless by an idiotic timer.
This is what did it for me as well. I was running with my healer, so as long as i was alive, the team was barely showing any damage, and she's built to put out steady damage as well, but it's not high damage, so while no one was anywhere neardying we still lost because DPS is king to Cryptic.
It would be nice if they made other classes a bit more relavant again like Crowd control CoughtelepathynowCough, but still it would be nice to get content that didn't pander to the highest DPS or those willing to pay2win.
I miss when this game was about building a hero and having fun doing so, not what it is now.
Until Carrier Defense is the perfect example of well thought out content which balances the importance of all kinds of builds (except melee until the Mega D drops). I consider that perfect content aside the rewards for doing it. It even got comic panels.
Did this on a 40 Soldier, didn't feel like I was holding the team back. Aside from one group that fell apart before we even got to the dogs and the one I've been on that cleared the event, every team has failed to clear the Ironclad/Durtok round.
The one team that -did- get past them, barely squeaking by with a few seconds remaining? We pasted Firewing, no contest. That, to my mind, is a problem, the last two rounds felt like falling action after us narrowly managing to snatch victory from the two tanks.
Why is fighting, comparatively, a couple second-stringers so much harder than fighting the Arena Champion? Something seems out of whack here.
Alright...just played it myself for the first time.
1 min 30 seconds to bring down both Duratok and Ironclad is ridiculously too short. We already have teams having problems bringing down one boss villain within 2 mins for Smash, and Cryptic expects us to bring down two of them in a shorter period of time?
The only way to assure victory seems to be in the form of premade teams that are able to min-max for a build that is efficient at both DPS and absolute durability. Forget dedicated-support types and forget dedicated tanks.
The alert should be catering for level 35 and above restrictively considering this huge DPS wall. I don't know what Cryptic was thinking making it accessible to level 6's onwards and then screw up high level people by forcing them to scale down to level 30 and then cripple their DPS. Stupid stupid stupid decision.
Don't get me wrong, I think that the idea of an iron man fight is great and all, but it seems like this DPS wall design mechanic has to go. We need content that challenges the team in ways that everyone regardless of role, be it DPS or not, are able to contribute each in assuring victory, and not just have DPS as the sole important aspect to it more than anything else.
I've tried the alert twice now and done terribly at it each time. I acknowledge that I'm not a super ultimate CO player. I can't solo Telios Tower on elite with only my starting powers. I can't solo Rhinoplasty on elite with no gear. But even doing my best with full gear and scaled DOWN to level 30, I can't touch ANYTHING.
Second time around, my group, which was one down to start with, got to the third wave through sheer attrition, and then we hit the arena champions. Absolutely impossible. We couldn't even touch one of them with all four of us spiking a single target. This alert feels like it was built specificly to cater to the super elite players that have been ******** that the game is too easy, despite being an EXTREME minority. And the rest of us get to suffer for it.
Its a bit depressing seeing that the alert has divided the community. It boils down to having at least two minutes for Ironclad and Duratok tag team and making the level lvl 40 like the Lemurian Invasion to actually make the players feel like they're "best of best, competing in an arena of a galactic empire" rather than an average team fighting waves of mobs until the 8th round which is challenging as hell ONLY to face Firewing who's more of a pushover than anything.
If he was on scale with Gravitar in the sense that he deals good damage and is tough to be taken down and required a FULL cooperation of the entire team and give some guaranteed rewards at the end to make the whole thing satisfying for each player that took part in it, it would feel like the alert was not rushed and any bugs could be dealt with in a polite manner instead of people shouting at Cryptic about broken content, not listening to the community and the community itself fighting eachother.
Overall the alert was interesting and challenging, but wholly underhelming. From the aesthetic point of view and the way it was given- rushed with bugs that made it impossible to complete (10 full rounds not "5-rounds-counts-as-complete").
I sincerely hope the devs learn from this event to bring us better content in the future.With that said, brb- going to try and beat up Firewing again.
Overall the alert itself isn't bad (unskippable cutscenes not withstanding), though it can be difficult for non-premade groups or even premades lacking in dps.
On a side note, if the swapping of the music is jarring... good! It's supposed to be. It feels much the same way when playing except you're getting bored because the cutscenes aren't running at 6x speed.
I can't believe I didn't ask this yet! Will there be action figures made of the villains from other Custom Alerts?
That would be awesome.
A 10% chance on completion to get one AF of any named villain in the Alert, except Soviet Guard, who is already available via the Nemesis Vendor.
_________________________________________________ @flamingbunnyman in game. Formerly @Roderick in City of Heroes.
I like the concept, like the presentation (although the frequent cutscenes make grinding or just replays very tedious), but it could have been executed a lot better.
Just barely won the entire thing with my 2-Gun Mojo FF and two other very strong level 40 FF friends (thanks to a backup device), and a lower level character in the PUG. The full run is "balanced" only for a full team of level 40 FF DPS characters... who are arbitrarily brought down to level 30 for the alert.
I got 4G and a perk out of it. Eh.
Something much more satisfying and entertaining could have been created for a much wider section of players using the exact same concept and assets. Pretty disappointed.
Comments
And theres the rub. Most times people are just awful....they also smell of prunes :<
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
Incorrect.
There are two schools of thought I'm seeing here, and I hate to say it but you're sounding like the worst of them (as much as I like you). No one has said 'it's too challenging!'. No one has complained about challenging content, ever.
No one ever said 'make it push-button win!'. Ever. Where you get this straw-man fallacy is beyond me. So far, the only people I've seen in favor of keeping this have immediately turned and insinuated that the majority of the gamers here 'aren't playing right'. This elitism and arrogance that attempts to discredit other players' legitimate concerns with the problem in the game borderlines on pathetic and disgusting, and is what I consider the worst of any gaming community. The snyde, smug, and pompous attitude that states "I can do it, therefore it is fine" is a blight. To that, I say "Lance Armstrong won the Tour-De-France. You should be able to do so, or maybe you just suck at bicycles and should go sit on the tricycle and do circles, loser."
There's a reason Demon's Souls isn't the greatest game ever. Masochistic try-harders love its punishment, while even competent and skilled gamers will simply try it and recognize it for being idiotic in its 'challenge'.
And there is a MASSIVE difference between 'challenge' and 'Frustratingly Imbalanced'.
However, this alert's time constraint (I'm only asking for 30 seconds, make it an even 2 minutes) takes it to a degree of stupidity, and you can't deny it. CO is a game of options. Yes, everyone needs to have a build that can play one or two roles and do so effectively with considerable degrees of optimization. No, not everyone should be able to complete this. But as it stands, it's not about skill- it's about cobbling together something very specific in a damned PUG.
Gate it to lvl35+, or add 30 seconds. All I'm saying. Stop listening to the try-harders that find some inflated self-worth and aggrandizing braggart rights by accomplishing something. Otherwise, effort has been wasted on something that is enjoyable only by a select elite few.
If this is too much to ask, and the community despises this- then we're completely broken and we deserve all the feces that is shoveled at us.
Nope that be Dark Souls
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
Poteito... Potaito... :cool:
=^ _ ^= Kitty Lives!
Batman vs. Snake Eyes is a challenge.
But that was like Redshirt vs. The Mandalorian invasion.
You have been the voice of reason in this thread.
Thank you for posting hard numbers and examples instead of getting all emotional and over reacting to something new. 1. Dont take this the wrong way, but CO doesn't exactly condition players to "build or play right" especially alerts. You generally don't have to do either of those things to win 99% of the fights. How can a boxer know if hes a great fighter if hes rarely challenged in training or in the ring?
2. That "select few mini-maxers" has already been proven false unless all of these examples and more are liars:
3. kaizerin has at least posted hard facts to support his/her claims, would it be too much to ask for you and others that claim that this alert is too hard to at least post your build. That way maybe we can help you fix your problem or at least present a detailed view of the problem to the devs instead of blindly nerf herding.
Also your a Lifer and a regular on the forums, im just having a hard time imagining that you cant make a build that can handle this alert while staying in theme.
PVP is starving without rewards
1. Please give us Daily PVP missions that reward Questionite.
2. Please give us an exchange rate between Acclaim and Recognition so that PVP has access to all "On Alert" PVE rewards.
The point I've made stands.
I'm sorry, I don't feel the need to post numbers and dissect what I already know is a perfectly good build that can solo the vast majority of this game's content and stay in theme. I know what I am doing is not broken, and I don't intend to change it to accomodate one alert, as it has performed well across the board- and not just in alerts (PvP not so much, but I'm sure you understand why).
I am in full favor of this being gated to levels 35+ or adding 30 seconds to the clock. Period.
Now, if you're in it to "win" by clearing Firewing, or if you're looking for rewards beyond just having a fun challenge, then this thing is definitely going to leave a bad taste in your mouth. Same reason I've taken to skipping Blood Moon - this last time at least, unless the boss dropped their unique reward for you, what you got was an UNTIL box, same as the ones from part II of the Lemurian Invasion. And those drop an item - that is up to ten levels higher than you are, which is fine if you're 40, but not so great for everyone else, and there's little feeling of accomplishment when you know the whole thing is just going to start again in half an hour (even the little stone spire doesn't go away).
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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How about experimenting with some different tactics? Maybe certain rounds are easier with vehicles? Or, just pre-grouping with a level 40 friend or two will increase your odds dramatically--perhaps you may want to join a SG?
I don't know if the timer on round 7 is optimum, but having completed the alert successfully on my first attempt with a PUG, I'm thinking many of these forumites doth protest too much.
"Without data, you're just another person with an opinion." -- W. Edwards Deming
This pretty much covers it, shame that there's people actually defending Cryptic's decisions on something that is so clearly broken, it's people like that who make me want to stop posting here.
There's challenging, and then there's tailoring a mission for one specific super build, don't confuse the two.
Eh perhaps they should just add a one and a half minute timer to Gravitar, since that is apparently what challenging is these days, at least there's only the one boss in that alert!
Its not necessarily that players need to "LTP NUBZ!" it that the game never requires any thing from them, never teaches them any thing and thus they have no reason to think they are not realizing their full potential.
You talk of straw-man arguments but i could say the same about you framing this discussion as about an alert that's "only for minmaxers" or framing people that disagree with you as elitist.
Painting players that even you respect as elitist isn't going to win you any points.
PVP is starving without rewards
1. Please give us Daily PVP missions that reward Questionite.
2. Please give us an exchange rate between Acclaim and Recognition so that PVP has access to all "On Alert" PVE rewards.
Oh silly me, thanks for clearing that up for me Cyber.
<_<
Even joking about it hurts, go figure.
So people who don't have a specific build are just playing it wrong, LOGIC!
Over all, the first seven rounds were fun and entertaining. It was nice to have something new to run for a change, even if the content was "light".
I've done this event twelve times (twice with all six of my 40s), each time with a random pick-up group. Not one single time did any of us get past the 8th round, three of the twelve times we failed due to the "run away" bug.
The greatest reward (which I received 8 times) was 11,000 Resources (the other three was 7,000 resources, one PUG never made it past the 5th round).
The timed rounds of this Alert are centered around coordinating and delivering high DPS. If you don't have the DPS NO STRATEGY exists to allow you to complete the 8th round (at the very least, I can't speak to the hypothetical "9th" or "10th" rounds).
The last few levels of this Alert are for high DPS characters solely and exclude all other builds.
Final opinion:
This is only a challenging event for high DPS characters. It is a frustrating event for everyone else. While the first few rounds were fun for me (the alien dogs were interesting and I enjoyed the "gladiatorial feel") the event is not worth the meager rewards or the frustration it caused.
Eight year, two month resident of Paragon City finding new challenges and combating new evils in Millenium City.
Well stated!
OH NO, there's one particular challenge of one alert that you can't sleep-walk through without some DPS roles on your team--Cryptic hates us!
If you don't have a DPS toon, and don't trust the odds of a PUG pairing you with any, make some friends? This is not entirely a solo game.
P.S. I just ran the alert twice during my lunch hour with PUGs. First time failed on round 8, second time total victory--with two out of five high-DPS toons (combat stats from the final fight below).
"Without data, you're just another person with an opinion." -- W. Edwards Deming
I dunno.
I am glad to have a new special alert.
I am disappointed in not getting a new rampage.
I am happy that the alert is not too easy.
I am bored with alerts that are just tank-and-spank.
I am encouraged that they did something a little different in the alert.
I am unimpressed with the execution.
Whoever you are, be that person one hundred percent. Don't compromise on your identity.
I always have been ......
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
They all thought I was out of the game....But I'm holding all the lockboxes now..
I'll......FOAM FINGER YOUR BACK!
I have heard there is no failure past round 5.
The composition was pretty much 5 dps, all lvl 40 (maybe I was lucky with the lvls here). And... well we pretty much roflstomped everything including ironclad, I think we had like 20 secs left on the timer when we killed him.
I only got resources at the end though... boooooooo!!! hahahahha
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Click up there if you want to find more about the costumes behind my heroines.
I played twelve of the Malvan alerts. I enjoyed them enough to grind out twelve of them, and in general I hate repetition. (I can't run more than a few regular Alerts before I want to scratch my eyes out).
The fact is I enjoy meeting new players and making new friends. That's exactly WHY I like PUGs so much. I have a lot of friends on my friends list because of my PUG-affinity, and play with them frequently. I play for fun and creating character stories in my head. The truth is the upper rounds of this game are not designed for players like me, they are designed for well-built heroes where strategy is less important than DPS. (Though 2 of my six 40s are built for high DPS, neither have found luck in any of my runs).
I'm glad others have had a positive experience with the event. As it is, I'm done with the Malvan alert for now. Rewards are too meager for the frustration it's caused me in round 8 (and I can only presume, beyond).
Eight year, two month resident of Paragon City finding new challenges and combating new evils in Millenium City.
There is no failure of the Alert if you pass round 5. You most certainly can fail later rounds; doing so merely does not fail the Alert.
@flamingbunnyman in game. Formerly @Roderick in City of Heroes.
Has the alert been changed in such a fashion as to render those numbers inaccurate ?
'Caine, miss you bud. Fly high.
I think it boils down to the player skill as well... you know a dead player does 0 dps. So if they dont have common sense (blocking charged powers for instance, etc.) you can underperform even if in theory you have high dps.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Click up there if you want to find more about the costumes behind my heroines.
"Damn you military housing shipment!"
Still don't have my gaming rig from England.
"There is only one way to support a PFF tank: Send Cyrone lots of money weekly... because he's the only one to successfully be a true PFF Tank." - chuckwolf
You know, just like NemCon.
I don't want to do something I know it's will be 100% fail before starting.
Besides, now that I've used a few higher-level characters, anybody who isn't 40 is a "lowbie" for the purposes of this Alert. Happifun Security System X-4 wasn't putting out enough DPS to turn the tide, for Stark's sake!
- David Brin, "Those Eyes"
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Bull****. The only reason you need to team for NemCon beforehand is that otherwise, the queue isn't likely to pop.
A full run of NemCon is a lot easier with a group of fairly average builds than this Forum Malvanum ****, mostly because tanks and supporters aren't rendered useless by an idiotic timer.
Possibly the most intelligent thing said in this thread so far. Kudos.
^This
Times run: 30
Times to level 5 (pass): 30
Times to level 6: 5
Times to level 7: 3
Times past level 7: 0
Drops: ZERO
Times people left: 11
Last run had two level 12's. The DPS was so pitiful it took 7 minutes to complete level 5.
Edit: Finally got Duratok and Ironclad. We had four 40s and one 27. We didn't even get close to having either one below half health, but hey...I got there. Finally.
Is that a new parser?
This is what did it for me as well. I was running with my healer, so as long as i was alive, the team was barely showing any damage, and she's built to put out steady damage as well, but it's not high damage, so while no one was anywhere neardying we still lost because DPS is king to Cryptic.
It would be nice if they made other classes a bit more relavant again like Crowd control CoughtelepathynowCough, but still it would be nice to get content that didn't pander to the highest DPS or those willing to pay2win.
I miss when this game was about building a hero and having fun doing so, not what it is now.
It's not new to me. :-)
"Without data, you're just another person with an opinion." -- W. Edwards Deming
The one team that -did- get past them, barely squeaking by with a few seconds remaining? We pasted Firewing, no contest. That, to my mind, is a problem, the last two rounds felt like falling action after us narrowly managing to snatch victory from the two tanks.
Why is fighting, comparatively, a couple second-stringers so much harder than fighting the Arena Champion? Something seems out of whack here.
1 min 30 seconds to bring down both Duratok and Ironclad is ridiculously too short. We already have teams having problems bringing down one boss villain within 2 mins for Smash, and Cryptic expects us to bring down two of them in a shorter period of time?
The only way to assure victory seems to be in the form of premade teams that are able to min-max for a build that is efficient at both DPS and absolute durability. Forget dedicated-support types and forget dedicated tanks.
The alert should be catering for level 35 and above restrictively considering this huge DPS wall. I don't know what Cryptic was thinking making it accessible to level 6's onwards and then screw up high level people by forcing them to scale down to level 30 and then cripple their DPS. Stupid stupid stupid decision.
Don't get me wrong, I think that the idea of an iron man fight is great and all, but it seems like this DPS wall design mechanic has to go. We need content that challenges the team in ways that everyone regardless of role, be it DPS or not, are able to contribute each in assuring victory, and not just have DPS as the sole important aspect to it more than anything else.
Second time around, my group, which was one down to start with, got to the third wave through sheer attrition, and then we hit the arena champions. Absolutely impossible. We couldn't even touch one of them with all four of us spiking a single target. This alert feels like it was built specificly to cater to the super elite players that have been ******** that the game is too easy, despite being an EXTREME minority. And the rest of us get to suffer for it.
It's different from the one I usually see posted on the forums. Do you have a link to it? It seems to present things in a cleaner format.
If he was on scale with Gravitar in the sense that he deals good damage and is tough to be taken down and required a FULL cooperation of the entire team and give some guaranteed rewards at the end to make the whole thing satisfying for each player that took part in it, it would feel like the alert was not rushed and any bugs could be dealt with in a polite manner instead of people shouting at Cryptic about broken content, not listening to the community and the community itself fighting eachother.
Overall the alert was interesting and challenging, but wholly underhelming. From the aesthetic point of view and the way it was given- rushed with bugs that made it impossible to complete (10 full rounds not "5-rounds-counts-as-complete").
I sincerely hope the devs learn from this event to bring us better content in the future.With that said, brb- going to try and beat up Firewing again.
A premade run through the new Forum Malvanum alert in Champions Online.
Overall the alert itself isn't bad (unskippable cutscenes not withstanding), though it can be difficult for non-premade groups or even premades lacking in dps.
On a side note, if the swapping of the music is jarring... good! It's supposed to be. It feels much the same way when playing except you're getting bored because the cutscenes aren't running at 6x speed.
That would be awesome.
A 10% chance on completion to get one AF of any named villain in the Alert, except Soviet Guard, who is already available via the Nemesis Vendor.
@flamingbunnyman in game. Formerly @Roderick in City of Heroes.
Just barely won the entire thing with my 2-Gun Mojo FF and two other very strong level 40 FF friends (thanks to a backup device), and a lower level character in the PUG. The full run is "balanced" only for a full team of level 40 FF DPS characters... who are arbitrarily brought down to level 30 for the alert.
I got 4G and a perk out of it. Eh.
Something much more satisfying and entertaining could have been created for a much wider section of players using the exact same concept and assets. Pretty disappointed.