Yes, that's why this spec was the meta for the past few years, because it was "not performing too well". Come on really?
It's quite straightforward, it fits all character types, it works. Specializations are another example of layers of complexity being added to a game and not really adding too much to it other than lots of mediocre options and some over powered ones... easy to see why people would choose the simplest option.
I do think that they could be more generous in the bonuses of the specs that are being changed, though. Looking at some of my characters on PTS, then they're down by around 5% offense bonus and 15% defence. Quite significant. It's important that these changes don't crush the builds of non-specialised toons in order to restrict the excesses of others. Given that the specs are now based around what you slot in your gear, it seems fair to reward the choice to add defence/offence mods over anything else.
Suggestion
Kaiserin could you please change the sound effect of Slash? It doesn't sound like you are cutting something, it sounds like you are slicing vegetables.
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Kaiserin could you please change the sound effect of Slash? It doesn't sound like you are cutting something, it sounds like you are slicing vegetables.
That's how they made the sound effect..... melons and knives.
Re: Spec Changes. Would it make more sense for...
a) The Best Defense to grant up to 30% of overall Offense to Defense
and
b) Aggressive Stance to grant 30% of gear Defense to Offense?
It makes it more logical in terms of what the specs are called and what they're supposed to be doing, and provides less of an impact to Wardicator/Guardicator toons - you lose around 1/3rd of your offense bonus to get defences which are only moderately lower than they were under the old system.
I sure hope that Magic Runes will be added in single blade powers
we are SO CLOSE to mage Magic Swordman possible, and the more I look at it even Vampire swordman
1) Increase the base damage of each hit but reduce the total duration (currently it's at 5-6 seconds which is A LOT for any power and in most endgame fights you will have to interrupt the power early)
2) Add an earth glaive effect to accompany the uppercut (your punch so hard that it causes the earth to erupt). This can either be done around you (while keeping the uppercut as PBAoE), or centered on the target (changing the uppercut part to be centered on the target, as I'm sure it was intended to).
Watching the video again and trying to think how to improve the animation for nothing, yeah the Uppercut needs to have a flashy finisher to represent the fact that its an AoE IMPACT
Take the visuals from Tremor and Unleashed Rage (the hole effect) to cause ground destruction, the visual is too weak alone it's no different from the Uppercut
In fact, the the Punches need more impact as well, put more meat in these, make it feel more EPIC and fitting for Might
I feel like 100 hands and Uppercut had a baby and it's weak, Might had to take responsibility of it causing an mess in the Brick family :P
and to be fair, i was expecting this animation to be used
But if this is going to be released next week with the new lockbox, nothing will change
Post edited by avianos on
POWERFRAME REVAMPS, NEW POWERS and BUG FIXES > Recycled Content and Events and even costumes at this point Introvert guy who use CO to make his characters playable and get experimental with Viable FF Theme builds! Running out of Unique FF builds due to the lack of updates and synergies! Playing since 1 February 2011 128 + Characters (21 ATs, 107 FFs) ALTitis for Life!
On a side note, due to these changes, it happens Distinguished set loses its tanky gear purpose. You get overall better values with virtuous, both on offensive and defensive side. I don't know if it's intended or overlooked.
I'll try to provide some numbers.
So, here they come. You have to consider that Virtuous also has better crit chance and severity by around 10% each, and 30% better KB resists.
So I know this is mostly a SB update, but screw it! You are introducing the Might Ultimate now, and this I like, so I'mma make more suggestions regarding it.
As most people on this thread have already pointed out, myself included, the Might Ultimate doesn't feel very Might-y. Since we are probably time constrained and can't do much FX editing, here I propose some mechanic changes that can give it that Might-y feel that it currently lacks.
Suggestion
Catastrophic Pummeling
If Pummeling's mantain duration is staying as it currently is (5-6 seconds long) consider giving it a similar resistance to hold effects as Fury of the Dragon to prevent it from being interrupted too frequently
- It would make sense since you are going "ORA ORA ORA!" on your enemies ****, so a puny hold shouldn't be enough interrupt your unstoppable rage (crossposting from previous post to have all suggestions in one place)
Suggestion
Catastrophic Pummeling
Currently CP is on the average side of Ultimates damagewise, and it's duration does not help. I don't know how escalating damage formula used to work for attacks, but I know they are being phased out for reasons.
So instead, I suggest that each hit of the attack applies and refreshes a stackable 1 second buff called Unstoppable Rage on you that increases your damage by 3% per stack. With some readjustment to the base damage, this way the attack can start low and as you build up momentum or "Rage" it hits harder.
The 1 second duration is so that this buff only benefits this attack and cannot be used for other attacks
Suggestion
Catastrophic Pummeling
Same as above but instead it applies a buff on you (Demolishing Punches) that causes further attacks to ignore 2% of your enemies damage resistance. The idea being that as your punches demolish your enemy's defenses into thin paste you start hitting harder.
Suggestion
Catastrophic Pummeling
New Adv: Each hit of Pummeling has a 10% chance to apply a stack of Furious on you. The final hits deals extra damage based on the number of Furious stacks on you
Suggestion
Catastrophic Pummeling
New Adv: Incapacitates the enemies and refreshes the duration of it for the duration of the mantain (like Ego Storm or Crippling Coils). If fully mantained, Stuns the enemies for a short duration of time
I do think that they could be more generous in the bonuses of the specs that are being changed, though. Looking at some of my characters on PTS, then they're down by around 5% offense bonus and 15% defence. Quite significant. It's important that these changes don't crush the builds of non-specialised toons in order to restrict the excesses of others. Given that the specs are now based around what you slot in your gear, it seems fair to reward the choice to add defence/offence mods over anything else.
My "specialized toon" lost 25% defense and I don't consider it crushed, so if your non-specialized toon only lost 15% it should be fine.
The more I think about it the less I like the player facing consequences for tanking of fixing the defense/offense loop. Now if it came with a rework to defensive passives, block replacers and CoPD (or just tank resistance in general) it would be a lot better. But without those I think it will make the game worse (not counting the server stuff).
I wouldn't be too worried. Prot/Warden and Prot/Guardian ( actual tanking specs ) are barely effected at all. Neither are variations paired with Sentinal. So there will still be plenty of viable tank builds. Given that Vindicator is a pure dps spec I'm not too put off with it being put in its rightful place as "not one of the best tank specs".
I do think that they could be more generous in the bonuses of the specs that are being changed, though. Looking at some of my characters on PTS, then they're down by around 5% offense bonus and 15% defence. Quite significant. It's important that these changes don't crush the builds of non-specialised toons in order to restrict the excesses of others. Given that the specs are now based around what you slot in your gear, it seems fair to reward the choice to add defence/offence mods over anything else.
My "specialized toon" lost 25% defense and I don't consider it crushed, so if your non-specialized toon only lost 15% it should be fine.
The more I think about it the less I like the player facing consequences for tanking of fixing the defense/offense loop. Now if it came with a rework to defensive passives, block replacers and CoPD (or just tank resistance in general) it would be a lot better. But without those I think it will make the game worse (not counting the server stuff).
I wouldn't be too worried. Prot/Warden and Prot/Guardian ( actual tanking specs ) are barely effected at all. Neither are variations paired with Sentinal. So there will still be plenty of viable tank builds. Given that Vindicator is a pure dps spec I'm not too put off with it being put in its rightful place as "not one of the best tank specs".
I'm reading a lot of "I"s and opinions here. Granted, the ones like us suggesting it be buffed a little is of the same vein, but for people that used Wardicator to get some survivability and damage on AOPM are losing a chunk of power, especially defensively when we have no other defensive boosts.
I'm worried, and I'm sure quite a lot of others are too.
Punching someone in the face a billion times is neat, but yeah its not very might-y as those powers typically involve big brutal single hits but also it is not quite elegant enough for unarmed martial arts...perfect for a brawler type character tho…
I'm reading a lot of "I"s and opinions here. Granted, the ones like us suggesting it be buffed a little is of the same vein, but for people that used Wardicator to get some survivability and damage on AOPM are losing a chunk of power, especially defensively when we have no other defensive boosts.
I'm worried, and I'm sure quite a lot of others are too.
Well you have to keep in mind that I'm the person with a bunch of videos showing me soloing warzone dailies on very squishy characters, so when people tell me "I need this defense" I just point them to the link in my signature and say "you actually don't". That's not an opinion, that's a fact with supporting evidence. If those squishballs can manage, then you should be fine considering you'll have much higher 'survivability' than they do.
You could also consider warden/guardian. It allows you to regain some of the defense/offense you've lost. Of course you'll have to give up some crit/severity for it, but that choice is up to you.
I'm reading a lot of "I"s and opinions here. Granted, the ones like us suggesting it be buffed a little is of the same vein, but for people that used Wardicator to get some survivability and damage on AOPM are losing a chunk of power, especially defensively when we have no other defensive boosts.
I'm worried, and I'm sure quite a lot of others are too.
Well you have to keep in mind that I'm the person with a bunch of videos showing me soloing warzone dailies on very squishy characters, so when people tell me "I need this defense" I just point them to the link in my signature and say "you actually don't". That's not an opinion, that's a fact with supporting evidence. If those squishballs can manage, then you should be fine considering you'll have much higher 'survivability' than they do.
You could also consider warden/guardian. It allows you to regain some of the defense/offense you've lost. Of course you'll have to give up some crit/severity for it, but that choice is up to you.
Wouldn't Guardian/Warden give the same as Protector/Warden or Protector/Guardian in terms of defense?
|| Main Tank || DPSer || Healer || CCer || Altoholic || @shadowolf505 in game ||
Wouldn't Guardian/Warden give the same as Protector/Warden or Protector/Guardian in terms of defense?
Yes, but you'll get more Offense thanks to having Best Defense twice. I mean shoot, if these people reeeeeally need that much more defense, they could always take Prot spec with Prot mastery on their dps :3c
I wouldn't be too worried. Prot/Warden and Prot/Guardian ( actual tanking specs ) are barely effected at all. Neither are variations paired with Sentinal. So there will still be plenty of viable tank builds. Given that Vindicator is a pure dps spec I'm not too put off with it being put in its rightful place as "not one of the best tank specs".
Which doesn't answer my concerns at all. Like I said if this came with changes to other sources of resistance I'd be fairly ok with it. But as it is, this change will just make the powers that are already considered the best options for cosmics tanking ever better compared to the alternatives. In particular defiance. But other than defiance people will also be "pushed" (or tempted, or whatever) more into a certain set of powers like I already explained a few posts back.
Defiance is already the de facto best "slow hitting large attack" tanking passive, and Invulnerable is the best "fast small attacks" passive. That's what they'll always be, and the fact that people are choosing Defiance as the one best passive for tanking Cosmics/other big bosses appears to be by design. If they decide that they want Invulnerable to be up there with Defiance as a choice for tanking cosmics/bosses then they'll add some that attack frequently for smaller amounts.
Again, that is not addressing my concerns at all. The offense/defense loop helped other passive catch up a bit, and allowed them to be used for cosmic tanking. Now that gets significantly more difficult, so defiance is enforced more strongly as the "required cosmic tanking passive". Both because of it's the best against now more difficult opponents, and because it's affected less by this change than other passives.
My "specialized toon" lost 25% defense and I don't consider it crushed, so if your non-specialized toon only lost 15% it should be fine.
It feels like a nerf, though - won't be popular, and not good timing for anything else which makes the game unpopular.
So, here's my SUGGESTION:
Remove one Spec point from Rush of Battle in the Vindicator tree and give it to Aggressive Stance, allowing its Defence bonus to be up to 30% of Offence from Gear. This allows the Vindicator DPS tree to give a choice between building for Criticals to boost damage, or using Aggressive Stance to add an extra layer of defence. Rush of Battle still gives some helpful healing, it's all still less powerful than the Guardicator/Wardicator loop but helps to mitigate any nerfs which occur as a result of fixing the bug.
Defiance is already the de facto best "slow hitting large attack" tanking passive, and Invulnerable is the best "fast small attacks" passive. That's what they'll always be, and the fact that people are choosing Defiance as the one best passive for tanking Cosmics/other big bosses appears to be by design. If they decide that they want Invulnerable to be up there with Defiance as a choice for tanking cosmics/bosses then they'll add some that attack frequently for smaller amounts.
Keep in mind that not everyone chose Invul at the time because it requires an Energy Unlock while Defiance does not, although it does help out.
|| Main Tank || DPSer || Healer || CCer || Altoholic || @shadowolf505 in game ||
While I'm one of those particularly affected by the changes to the Vindicator spec tree, I think it's ok. It will certainly change the way tanks are built. It also makes room for Off-tanks to shine more. I just hope Might finally gets an actual Energy Unlock and some more brawling powers. And since Earth is under the Might category, here's hoping those powers get some love, too.
While I'm one of those particularly affected by the changes to the Vindicator spec tree, I think it's ok. It will certainly change the way tanks are built. It also makes room for Off-tanks to shine more. I just hope Might finally gets an actual Energy Unlock and some more brawling powers. And since Earth is under the Might category, here's hoping those powers get some love, too.
All are under Brick, not just Might. Brick has Heavy Weapons, Might and Earth.
|| Main Tank || DPSer || Healer || CCer || Altoholic || @shadowolf505 in game ||
Someone mentioned to me that it was Open Wound and not Deep Wound, and also that RE w/advantage would consume Swallowtail cuts unique bleed so I did another test:
Bug (maybe?)
This is the damage RE does when consuming 5 bleed stacks
Your Reaper's Embrace deals 6595 (6925) Slashing Damage to Regenerating Test Dummy A.
While this is the damage it does when consuming Deep Wound
Your Rupture deals 1736 (1909) Slashing Damage to Regenerating Test Dummy A.
I don't know if this was maybe overlooked, but shouldn't rupturing Deep Wound do more damage than rupturing 5 stacks of Bleed, kinda like how healing with Thrash from Deep Wound heals you for more HP than healing from 5 stacks of Bleed (disregard it currently being bugged)
Maybe you're just making excuses and talking trash. The spec is there to allow characters who invest in Offense to repurpose it into Defense. The fact that the Wardicator loop was left in place for years and made it too effective isn't the fault of the playerbase, neither is it a sign of poor thinking. It's now the norm, and like all the other fixes of long-standing features/bugs that needs to be taken into account when applying the "fix". Whatever was originally intended is no longer relevant. Shifting one spec point in the Vindicator tree is easy, doesn't disrupt anything else and minimises the impact of the fix. I think they call that a win-win situation.
Imo, it still seems odd for the 'pure dps' spec to boost defense and have a heal option (RoB), when Brawler and Avenger have none of the sort. Would almost rather push Vind further down the 'dps' line than it is. We can still use something like Ward + Guard if we want a 'hybrid/solo' option now (since the offense DR won't hit it as hard as it did before).
Anyways, Warden can still be pretty good for tanks, thanks to Elusive- so I wouldn't be too quick to ditch it. Sucks to lose the TBD/AS loop, but I understand getting rid of it.
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Catastrophic Pummeling doesn't have a cd atm. I dunno if that's intended, but it is hilarious.
Bug: Catastrophic Pummeling is classed under Close Area Attacks instead of Ultimates. This also means that taking it doesn't lockout picking other ults.
Bug: Deflect's Elusive Swordsman adv doesn't seem to be working at all (no procs on melee attacks, nor any melee dmg penalty when slotted).
Bug: Slash's tooltip mentions that it hits twice for each portion, when that's not actually the case (Slash's last hit also has typos in its tooltip).
Bug: Slash's tooltip states that its bleed chance is doubled w/ Focus, but in testing w/ FotS, this doesn't seem to be the case (final hit doesn't always apply bleed, as it should w/ Focus). I'm unsure which way is intended for this power.
I assume CPummeling's root being a fixed duration and not increasing w/ rank is intended to match the anim.
(also, CPummeling's anim makes characters with tails look like they suddenly grew a dozen of them out of their butt.)
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Oh, and Steadfast is still bugged to not proc w/ some MA powers when they crit:
Hahhah. That Might Ultimate sure looks silly....Isn't that more like the MA Ultimate we allready have?
Maybe make it look more like windmill blades:
Or atleast change it to one fisted one.
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Imo, it still seems odd for the 'pure dps' spec to boost defense and have a heal option (RoB), when Brawler and Avenger have none of the sort.
Brawler and avenger have far stronger dps specs. Guardian has a better dps boost than vindicator for most ranged builds, and warden better for some/many melee builds. And vindicator was obviously not designed as a pure dps spec.
Someone mentioned to me that it was Open Wound and not Deep Wound, and also that RE w/advantage would consume Swallowtail cuts unique bleed so I did another test:
I don't think using swallowtail cut during parses is a good idea, since on the targets were the type of dps that you're testing with parses matters are not affected by it. Not that it hugely matters here since you got the same dps as without it. But without a rupture you could add swallowtail to pretty much any parse to add 1k dps to it.
Again if you are going to fix overperforming SPECs, then you better fix and buff UNDERPERFORMING SPECs and broken-useless Masteries
Also as much as I adore using Avenger and Brawler, those specs are not useful for builds which don't utilize BLAST and COMBO powers
You people compare the ultimate to JoJo's Bizarre adventure but no one of you mentioned Fist of the Northstar, AKA the grandfather and inspiration of Jojo
Shame on you, if you are going to play with the Rapid-Fire Fisticuffs at least mention who did it first
and here is the problem again, the ultimate doesnt have the required Visual IMPACT
Compare it to the Devasting Strike, every hit has a strong visual effect
Punches need a stronger visual and you need to deal enviromental damage on the ground to show it's Might-themed power (earth shattered effects and a crater would help)
Post edited by avianos on
POWERFRAME REVAMPS, NEW POWERS and BUG FIXES > Recycled Content and Events and even costumes at this point Introvert guy who use CO to make his characters playable and get experimental with Viable FF Theme builds! Running out of Unique FF builds due to the lack of updates and synergies! Playing since 1 February 2011 128 + Characters (21 ATs, 107 FFs) ALTitis for Life!
I'm late to the party I suppose, but here's my thoughts on anyway:
Aggressive Stance (Guardi/Wardicator)
First of all, RIP. I fully admit the loop effect had to go, but the decrease in overall usefulness is a disappointment. This particular specialization provides an extremely minimal benefit and really should be buffed. On my test character, Aggressive Stance 2/2 is giving me...3% extra damage resistance which is pretty trash compared to (if my numbers are right) the 21% it provides for that same character on live. Any other specialization that provides Fortified Gear (there are 4 total) is going to convey a better defensive bonus. Fortified Gear is providing +8% damage resistance to my modestly-geared character. It will likely provide a lot more to someone with the cosmic-level stuff.
Aggressive Stance really needs a buff to its defense. It doesn't need to be nearly what it was on live, just somewhere around what Fortified Gear provides. The bonus from power-based offense is pretty irrelevant since I can't really think of any powers this applies to except for maybe an active offense here or there. It's too niche to be meaningful.
Slash
Compared to its sister ability, this power doesn't really stand out. In fact, it pretty much feels inferior both in terms of its effect radius and its advantages.
I'd suggest bringing its effect radius up to match Reaper's Caress. Or, to make it truly different, its damage could be upped (if it needs to become Tier 1, that's fine), remove its ability to apply bleed, and give it Open Wound upon finishing the combo. That way, it becomes a harder-hitting, but slower-to-apply-its-bleeds combo for an alternative playstyle.
Finally, since Reaper's Caress has a Clinging Flames advantage, why not give Slash an advantage to apply Chilled, Chi Flame, Negative Ions (needs an interacts-with-Negative Ions effect too though!), Deadly Poison, or other cross-framework effect?
Laughing Zephyr
Compared to the lunge-aways in Munitions, the cooldown is really long. While it's nice that it has the Stim Pack advantage, I'd probably look elsewhere so it could have more uptime. I feel like it should do more than it does to warrant that cooldown, but I'm not sure what.
Tornado Slash
This power is (almost) very cool. Almost. I don't really get why the advantages are intentionally dropping the baseline effect. The stun itself also seems only marginally useful, given the cooldown.
The Stun effect says it's 16 seconds when it's really just the standard Stun duration.
I'd suggest getting rid of the stun effect and replacing it with a knock-to, as well as making the power instant. It'd be a lot more useful and would allow people more choices for mass knock-to besides just Particle Wave.
Overall, looks neat even if count-to-5-and-blow-the-stacks isn't my thing. (Hence why Slash/Dragon's Bite would be a nice alternative way to play the set)
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I hate to get in a tit-for-tat war with you Spinny, but imo, calling Vindicator "pure DPS" spec doesn't seem quite accurate. ONLY because of the Agressive Stance spec in it. That does seem more for tanking because it is increasing Defense...off of Offense, yes. But, it is increasing Defense. So, my nitpick is calling it a "pure" when maybe you should be calling it "Primarily" or "Overwhelmingly" dps.
Sorry, just a nitpick in wording. Otherwise, no dispute with your main points.
Further, to agree with this not being a tank ruining change, I have plenty of Invuln tanks that never used the loop and do just fine in all content. They've main tanked everything, except Eidolon. Sure, upon occasion I get splatted at Dino, but I've had my Defiance tanks with the loop get one-shot crit splatted too. This is through Block.
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-=-=-=-=-=-(CO in-game handle: @WarCan )-=-=-=-=-=- "Okay, you're DEAD, what do you do NEXT?"
Slash
Compared to its sister ability, this power doesn't really stand out. In fact, it pretty much feels inferior both in terms of its effect radius and its advantages.
I'd suggest bringing its effect radius up to match Reaper's Caress. Or, to make it truly different, its damage could be upped (if it needs to become Tier 1, that's fine), remove its ability to apply bleed, and give it Open Wound upon finishing the combo. That way, it becomes a harder-hitting, but slower-to-apply-its-bleeds combo for an alternative playstyle.
Finally, since Reaper's Caress has a Clinging Flames advantage, why not give Slash an advantage to apply Chilled, Chi Flame, Negative Ions (needs an interacts-with-Negative Ions effect too though!), Deadly Poison, or other cross-framework effect?
I like this idea, They can both provide more synergies for elementalists
ICE powerframe could use some love until it gets a proper revamp, since currently only FIRE expands its synergies among other powerframes
Also yeah, SLASH SUCKS and it has a really obnoxious sound effect as mentioned before
Post edited by avianos on
POWERFRAME REVAMPS, NEW POWERS and BUG FIXES > Recycled Content and Events and even costumes at this point Introvert guy who use CO to make his characters playable and get experimental with Viable FF Theme builds! Running out of Unique FF builds due to the lack of updates and synergies! Playing since 1 February 2011 128 + Characters (21 ATs, 107 FFs) ALTitis for Life!
Changed this spec to grant offense bonuses based on the amount of defense on your gear. Previously it took into account all sources of your defense.
Aggressive Stance
Changed this spec grant defense bonuses based on the amount of offense directly on your gear and granted by mod effects. Additionally, this spec will also grant a bonus based on the amount of offense you have from individual powers (not other specializations). Previously it took into account all sources of your offense.
Some detail on this change: When these advantages were combined it created an infinite loop where they would continuously benefit each other. The UI would eventually stop updating the bonuses, but the loop kept on. This was an unnecessary resourse hog and also made these specialization much better than intended.
The change made here will no longer allow these effects to loop off one another. Instead, each individual source will gain the bonus.
Question regarding this:
Does these reworked specs take cosmic gear "Set effects" into calculation (The offense for 3 justice pieces and defense for 3 distinguished) ?
Because even if these set stats are not base stats of individual gear pieces, they are ON the gear when all pieces are reunited, and i would find it a bit disappointing if it was suddenly considered as one of these "outside sources" of off/def that are suddenly ignored in calculation.
Which brings up the question, with a change of this magnitude, do characters with Wardicator/Guardicator get a free respec? The changes aren't at the "we turned your baseline ST DPS attack into a utility power" level (hi there Telekinesis), but this is a substantial change for a lot of characters.
And I'm impressed that we made it to page three before the Sky Is Falling debate really got going.
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Formerly @Seschat pre PWEmerger. @Seschat on the Titan boards.
As to the "free respec", Kaiserin has been generous in the past when she deems something changed important enough that wouldn't otherwise fall into the standard reason of giving one.
Not saying she will or won't, but I'm feeling that she understands what this means to characters. It may require more than just the 50g outlay to change specs/stats for players.
Regardless ... I'm hopeful for the freebie.
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-=-=-=-=-=-(CO in-game handle: @WarCan )-=-=-=-=-=- "Okay, you're DEAD, what do you do NEXT?"
Brawler and avenger have far stronger dps specs. Guardian has a better dps boost than vindicator for most ranged builds, and warden better for some/many melee builds. And vindicator was obviously not designed as a pure dps spec.
Yea, partly why I put 'pure dps' in quotes. I guess there's some impetus to label Vind as 'pure dps' since other specs have been given various labels ('pure melee', 'range + support', 'pure support', etc), and there isn't a generalized (not melee or ranged typed) dps spec otherwise. In reality, melee vs range isn't really a role difference (so Brawler and Avenger are both the 'pure dps' specs) and Vind was more of a hybrid dps + tank spec. Vind still will be hybrid, but now is worse at it.
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I'd also back adding more Elemental cross-set synergy like Reaper's Caress got w/ Fire- if time permits. Elemental weapons are cool.
Comments
It's quite straightforward, it fits all character types, it works. Specializations are another example of layers of complexity being added to a game and not really adding too much to it other than lots of mediocre options and some over powered ones... easy to see why people would choose the simplest option.
I do think that they could be more generous in the bonuses of the specs that are being changed, though. Looking at some of my characters on PTS, then they're down by around 5% offense bonus and 15% defence. Quite significant. It's important that these changes don't crush the builds of non-specialised toons in order to restrict the excesses of others. Given that the specs are now based around what you slot in your gear, it seems fair to reward the choice to add defence/offence mods over anything else.
also, the tooltip on it, where it explains the no mercy advantage, it has a </font> thing sticking out
edit: someone already posted the rupture thing it seems, sorry.
Kaiserin could you please change the sound effect of Slash? It doesn't sound like you are cutting something, it sounds like you are slicing vegetables.
That's how they made the sound effect..... melons and knives.
Re: Spec Changes. Would it make more sense for...
a) The Best Defense to grant up to 30% of overall Offense to Defense
and
b) Aggressive Stance to grant 30% of gear Defense to Offense?
It makes it more logical in terms of what the specs are called and what they're supposed to be doing, and provides less of an impact to Wardicator/Guardicator toons - you lose around 1/3rd of your offense bonus to get defences which are only moderately lower than they were under the old system.
The reworked skills do to (or they want to do) many things at time more than be a specialized powerset in doing damage.
Is like we put Might with debuffs and heals when the powerset is focused to High Strength and Raw/Brute Damage.
we are SO CLOSE to mage Magic Swordman possible, and the more I look at it even Vampire swordman Watching the video again and trying to think how to improve the animation for nothing, yeah the Uppercut needs to have a flashy finisher to represent the fact that its an AoE IMPACT
Take the visuals from Tremor and Unleashed Rage (the hole effect) to cause ground destruction, the visual is too weak alone it's no different from the Uppercut
In fact, the the Punches need more impact as well, put more meat in these, make it feel more EPIC and fitting for Might
I feel like 100 hands and Uppercut had a baby and it's weak, Might had to take responsibility of it causing an mess in the Brick family :P
and to be fair, i was expecting this animation to be used
But if this is going to be released next week with the new lockbox, nothing will change
YeeeeeEEEESSSSSS~
@Chimerafreek
Have you tested with Str/Warden/Protector and Str/Warden/Vindicator? I'm curious at those numbers is all.
This is just twisting the knife. Terrible.
How so? Q trading supplements that whereas you could open a mountain of Lockboxes/never get an Ult
42 40s, LTSer.
No Mercy Advantage: No longer has a chance to apply bleeds. Causes Reaper's Embrace to rupture all of your Wound effects instead of Bleed effects.
- This advantage still ruptures bleeds aswell as wounds, resulting in ridiculous 50k+ hits
Suggestion:
Add restoration adv to Tornado Slash.
I wouldn't say people don't do the Q trading but for most who don't, they just farm for G and buy stuff off of AH.
So I know this is mostly a SB update, but screw it! You are introducing the Might Ultimate now, and this I like, so I'mma make more suggestions regarding it.
As most people on this thread have already pointed out, myself included, the Might Ultimate doesn't feel very Might-y. Since we are probably time constrained and can't do much FX editing, here I propose some mechanic changes that can give it that Might-y feel that it currently lacks.
My "specialized toon" lost 25% defense and I don't consider it crushed, so if your non-specialized toon only lost 15% it should be fine.
I wouldn't be too worried. Prot/Warden and Prot/Guardian ( actual tanking specs ) are barely effected at all. Neither are variations paired with Sentinal. So there will still be plenty of viable tank builds. Given that Vindicator is a pure dps spec I'm not too put off with it being put in its rightful place as "not one of the best tank specs".
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
I'm reading a lot of "I"s and opinions here. Granted, the ones like us suggesting it be buffed a little is of the same vein, but for people that used Wardicator to get some survivability and damage on AOPM are losing a chunk of power, especially defensively when we have no other defensive boosts.
I'm worried, and I'm sure quite a lot of others are too.
Brawler AT anyone?
also:
"Omae Wa Mou Shindeiru"
Well you have to keep in mind that I'm the person with a bunch of videos showing me soloing warzone dailies on very squishy characters, so when people tell me "I need this defense" I just point them to the link in my signature and say "you actually don't". That's not an opinion, that's a fact with supporting evidence. If those squishballs can manage, then you should be fine considering you'll have much higher 'survivability' than they do.
You could also consider warden/guardian. It allows you to regain some of the defense/offense you've lost. Of course you'll have to give up some crit/severity for it, but that choice is up to you.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Wouldn't Guardian/Warden give the same as Protector/Warden or Protector/Guardian in terms of defense?
Yes, but you'll get more Offense thanks to having Best Defense twice. I mean shoot, if these people reeeeeally need that much more defense, they could always take Prot spec with Prot mastery on their dps :3c
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Which doesn't answer my concerns at all. Like I said if this came with changes to other sources of resistance I'd be fairly ok with it. But as it is, this change will just make the powers that are already considered the best options for cosmics tanking ever better compared to the alternatives. In particular defiance. But other than defiance people will also be "pushed" (or tempted, or whatever) more into a certain set of powers like I already explained a few posts back.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
It feels like a nerf, though - won't be popular, and not good timing for anything else which makes the game unpopular.
So, here's my SUGGESTION:
Remove one Spec point from Rush of Battle in the Vindicator tree and give it to Aggressive Stance, allowing its Defence bonus to be up to 30% of Offence from Gear. This allows the Vindicator DPS tree to give a choice between building for Criticals to boost damage, or using Aggressive Stance to add an extra layer of defence. Rush of Battle still gives some helpful healing, it's all still less powerful than the Guardicator/Wardicator loop but helps to mitigate any nerfs which occur as a result of fixing the bug.
Is that fair, spinny?
Vindicator is the "Pure DPS" spec, so no. Wanna be tanky? Pick a tank spec.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Dull binaries (and trinities) are the hallmark of small minds, spinny. Try and think bigger.
Keep in mind that not everyone chose Invul at the time because it requires an Energy Unlock while Defiance does not, although it does help out.
Maybe you should think beyond wardicator?
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
Epic Stronghold
Block timing explained
All are under Brick, not just Might. Brick has Heavy Weapons, Might and Earth.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
This is the damage RE does when consuming 5 bleed stacks
While this is the damage it does when consuming Deep Wound
I don't know if this was maybe overlooked, but shouldn't rupturing Deep Wound do more damage than rupturing 5 stacks of Bleed, kinda like how healing with Thrash from Deep Wound heals you for more HP than healing from 5 stacks of Bleed (disregard it currently being bugged)
Maybe you're just making excuses and talking trash. The spec is there to allow characters who invest in Offense to repurpose it into Defense. The fact that the Wardicator loop was left in place for years and made it too effective isn't the fault of the playerbase, neither is it a sign of poor thinking. It's now the norm, and like all the other fixes of long-standing features/bugs that needs to be taken into account when applying the "fix". Whatever was originally intended is no longer relevant. Shifting one spec point in the Vindicator tree is easy, doesn't disrupt anything else and minimises the impact of the fix. I think they call that a win-win situation.
Anyways, Warden can still be pretty good for tanks, thanks to Elusive- so I wouldn't be too quick to ditch it. Sucks to lose the TBD/AS loop, but I understand getting rid of it.
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Catastrophic Pummeling doesn't have a cd atm. I dunno if that's intended, but it is hilarious.
Bug: Catastrophic Pummeling is classed under Close Area Attacks instead of Ultimates. This also means that taking it doesn't lockout picking other ults.
Bug: Deflect's Elusive Swordsman adv doesn't seem to be working at all (no procs on melee attacks, nor any melee dmg penalty when slotted).
Bug: Slash's tooltip mentions that it hits twice for each portion, when that's not actually the case (Slash's last hit also has typos in its tooltip).
Bug: Slash's tooltip states that its bleed chance is doubled w/ Focus, but in testing w/ FotS, this doesn't seem to be the case (final hit doesn't always apply bleed, as it should w/ Focus). I'm unsure which way is intended for this power.
I assume CPummeling's root being a fixed duration and not increasing w/ rank is intended to match the anim.
(also, CPummeling's anim makes characters with tails look like they suddenly grew a dozen of them out of their butt.)
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Oh, and Steadfast is still bugged to not proc w/ some MA powers when they crit:
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/championsonline/#/discussion/1210616/some-ma-attacks-still-arent-procing-steadfast
I know its an older one, but it'd be nice if that were fixed while we're still working on MA.
Also, Bug: Tornado Slash doesn't proc Steadfast on crits either.
..
Yet.. Bug: Catastrophic Pummeling procs Steadfast on crits.
So, a Might/Brick ult works w/ Steadfast XD I think I need a drink..
(bugs aside, I like the SB changes thus far.)
- Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!
Maybe make it look more like windmill blades:
Or atleast change it to one fisted one.
And playing by myself since Aug 2009
Godtier: Lifetime Subscriber
Brawler and avenger have far stronger dps specs. Guardian has a better dps boost than vindicator for most ranged builds, and warden better for some/many melee builds. And vindicator was obviously not designed as a pure dps spec.
I don't think using swallowtail cut during parses is a good idea, since on the targets were the type of dps that you're testing with parses matters are not affected by it. Not that it hugely matters here since you got the same dps as without it. But without a rupture you could add swallowtail to pretty much any parse to add 1k dps to it.
Also as much as I adore using Avenger and Brawler, those specs are not useful for builds which don't utilize BLAST and COMBO powers
You people compare the ultimate to JoJo's Bizarre adventure but no one of you mentioned Fist of the Northstar, AKA the grandfather and inspiration of Jojo
Shame on you, if you are going to play with the Rapid-Fire Fisticuffs at least mention who did it first
and here is the problem again, the ultimate doesnt have the required Visual IMPACT
Compare it to the Devasting Strike, every hit has a strong visual effect
Punches need a stronger visual and you need to deal enviromental damage on the ground to show it's Might-themed power (earth shattered effects and a crater would help)
The blast/combo spec not, but the spec tree in general hugely so.
Aggressive Stance (Guardi/Wardicator)
First of all, RIP. I fully admit the loop effect had to go, but the decrease in overall usefulness is a disappointment. This particular specialization provides an extremely minimal benefit and really should be buffed. On my test character, Aggressive Stance 2/2 is giving me...3% extra damage resistance which is pretty trash compared to (if my numbers are right) the 21% it provides for that same character on live. Any other specialization that provides Fortified Gear (there are 4 total) is going to convey a better defensive bonus. Fortified Gear is providing +8% damage resistance to my modestly-geared character. It will likely provide a lot more to someone with the cosmic-level stuff.
Aggressive Stance really needs a buff to its defense. It doesn't need to be nearly what it was on live, just somewhere around what Fortified Gear provides. The bonus from power-based offense is pretty irrelevant since I can't really think of any powers this applies to except for maybe an active offense here or there. It's too niche to be meaningful.
Slash
Compared to its sister ability, this power doesn't really stand out. In fact, it pretty much feels inferior both in terms of its effect radius and its advantages.
I'd suggest bringing its effect radius up to match Reaper's Caress. Or, to make it truly different, its damage could be upped (if it needs to become Tier 1, that's fine), remove its ability to apply bleed, and give it Open Wound upon finishing the combo. That way, it becomes a harder-hitting, but slower-to-apply-its-bleeds combo for an alternative playstyle.
Finally, since Reaper's Caress has a Clinging Flames advantage, why not give Slash an advantage to apply Chilled, Chi Flame, Negative Ions (needs an interacts-with-Negative Ions effect too though!), Deadly Poison, or other cross-framework effect?
Laughing Zephyr
Compared to the lunge-aways in Munitions, the cooldown is really long. While it's nice that it has the Stim Pack advantage, I'd probably look elsewhere so it could have more uptime. I feel like it should do more than it does to warrant that cooldown, but I'm not sure what.
Tornado Slash
This power is (almost) very cool. Almost. I don't really get why the advantages are intentionally dropping the baseline effect. The stun itself also seems only marginally useful, given the cooldown.
The Stun effect says it's 16 seconds when it's really just the standard Stun duration.
I'd suggest getting rid of the stun effect and replacing it with a knock-to, as well as making the power instant. It'd be a lot more useful and would allow people more choices for mass knock-to besides just Particle Wave.
Overall, looks neat even if count-to-5-and-blow-the-stacks isn't my thing. (Hence why Slash/Dragon's Bite would be a nice alternative way to play the set)
Sorry, just a nitpick in wording. Otherwise, no dispute with your main points.
Further, to agree with this not being a tank ruining change, I have plenty of Invuln tanks that never used the loop and do just fine in all content. They've main tanked everything, except Eidolon. Sure, upon occasion I get splatted at Dino, but I've had my Defiance tanks with the loop get one-shot crit splatted too. This is through Block.
-=-=-=-=-=-(CO in-game handle: @WarCan )-=-=-=-=-=-
"Okay, you're DEAD, what do you do NEXT?"
ICE powerframe could use some love until it gets a proper revamp, since currently only FIRE expands its synergies among other powerframes
Also yeah, SLASH SUCKS and it has a really obnoxious sound effect as mentioned before
42 40s, LTSer.
Question regarding this:
Does these reworked specs take cosmic gear "Set effects" into calculation (The offense for 3 justice pieces and defense for 3 distinguished) ?
Because even if these set stats are not base stats of individual gear pieces, they are ON the gear when all pieces are reunited, and i would find it a bit disappointing if it was suddenly considered as one of these "outside sources" of off/def that are suddenly ignored in calculation.
Which brings up the question, with a change of this magnitude, do characters with Wardicator/Guardicator get a free respec? The changes aren't at the "we turned your baseline ST DPS attack into a utility power" level (hi there Telekinesis), but this is a substantial change for a lot of characters.
And I'm impressed that we made it to page three before the Sky Is Falling debate really got going.
Formerly @Seschat pre PWEmerger. @Seschat on the Titan boards.
Supporter of the Titan Project.
Not saying she will or won't, but I'm feeling that she understands what this means to characters. It may require more than just the 50g outlay to change specs/stats for players.
Regardless ... I'm hopeful for the freebie.
-=-=-=-=-=-(CO in-game handle: @WarCan )-=-=-=-=-=-
"Okay, you're DEAD, what do you do NEXT?"
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I'd also back adding more Elemental cross-set synergy like Reaper's Caress got w/ Fire- if time permits. Elemental weapons are cool.
- Be safe and have fun, champs - for science!