"And here's the one very important point about why recognition rewards are bound to characters and are not an account-wide currency:
MMORPGs are built around rewards-vs-grinding and time-sink mechanics. It's in the MMO's publisher's and developer's best interests that as many players as possible stay around playing the game for as long as possible. The more time a player spends online in the game, the more opportunities there are for players to keep on paying for gold sub in the game or to purchase stuff at the Z store. This is nothing new when it comes to MMORPGs that at the end of the day are business products. You could scoff at this and dismiss it as money-grabbing corporate tactics, or you may not have any intention to pay for anything at all, but it is what it is.
It makes perfect sense why they don't let GCRs be freely transferred across toons on the same account when considering that. GCR as a reward is meant to be earned on an individual toon basis just like XP, questionite and other mission rewards are."
No, it doesn't. In Path of Exile nothing is character bound. In fact, none of the weapons and armor are bound in any way, not even if you wear them. There are only a few pieces of special currency that are account bound. One of the most popular leagues is the one with more generous rewards. People played longer and created more alts because it was so much easier to gear up additional characters. Perfect example of a game that makes it easy to gain currency and items for alts while still keeping people playing and growing.
The whole character bound thing encouraging people to stick around is crap.
Heirloom gear is a thing because people don't want to grind out things from scratch every time they make a new toon. CO is not the only game with Heirloom gear. Level up / bonus XP cash shop items are also a thing because, again, people don't want to do the earlier game for the umpteenth time. Respecs are a thing in many games so that players don't have to start over to try out different build ideas. You have plenty of games making it easier to roll alts or skip the process entirely.
GCR is the only thing you listed that is per toon. XP can be bought in the cash shop. Questionite can be traded. Mission Rewards are replaced by heirloom gear. Those are all thing that are the opposite of grind while still encouraging alts.
"It doesn't defuse my point in the slightest about how questionite is supposed to be earned on an individual toon basis and how it isn't a account-wide shared currency, in the same manner recognition points are."
100% incorrect. Questionite can be bought with Zen and is meant to be traded. The entire Q-To-Zen system is built around ability to trade. The earning per toon with a refinement cap is meant to prevent people from gaining questionite too quickly because it can be used to purchase cash shop items. Questionite IS an account wide currency that is controlled so that people will actually spend real money in the cash shop.
"Also I'm not really seeing the rationale of not being able to transfer recognition points between toons being a factor in making people want to play alts less."
My main character is specifically built to quickly gain currency. Another toon I roll up is not going to fit that criteria. It's faster to use my main that is already geared up with a specific build to get gear for my alts than it is to use my alts to get their own gear. Starting a currency grind on a new toon does not inspire me to bother creating it in the first place. It's also not just GCR, it's all of the other things that have also become character bound.
What makes more sense: Using my already geared toon to purchase a GCR costume piece for an alt, or using that brand new alt to gain that costume bit eventually at level 40? Yes, the costume pieces are account wide. That's the point. Having that account wide item I can use on an alt is why I can enjoy the toon's theme now instead of in 40 levels and a GCR grind later. Being able to share currency account wide is what makes alting more enjoyable.
It doesn't defuse my point in the slightest about how questionite is supposed to be earned on an individual toon basis and how it isn't a account-wide shared currency, in the same manner recognition points are. Sure, you can take advantage of the questionite exchange to transfer questionite between toons.
There's no "taking advantage" of anything by transferring Q to other toons using the exchange, it's simply working as intended........ otherwise I'm sure it would have been changed to not allow your other toons to take your Q balance from the exchange.
Unless of course you have actual knowledge that the devs didn't mean to implement it in that way?
It doesn't defuse my point in the slightest about how questionite is supposed to be earned on an individual toon basis and how it isn't a account-wide shared currency, in the same manner recognition points are. Sure, you can take advantage of the questionite exchange to transfer questionite between toons.
There's no "taking advantage" of anything by transferring Q to other toons using the exchange, it's simply working as intended........ otherwise I'm sure it would have been changed to not allow your other toons to take your Q balance from the exchange.
Unless of course you have actual knowledge that the devs didn't mean to implement it in that way?
It doesn't work in the quite the same way as placing globals and account-wide items in a hideout bank and transferring these things freely in any amount across any number of toons in the same account.
But okay, I'll relent and accept that since it can be done, "questionite" shouldn't be in my initial statement.
My main character is specifically built to quickly gain currency. Another toon I roll up is not going to fit that criteria. It's faster to use my main that is already geared up with a specific build to get gear for my alts than it is to use my alts to get their own gear. Starting a currency grind on a new toon does not inspire me to bother creating it in the first place. It's also not just GCR, it's all of the other things that have also become character bound.
What makes more sense: Using my already geared toon to purchase a GCR costume piece for an alt, or using that brand new alt to gain that costume bit eventually at level 40? Yes, the costume pieces are account wide. That's the point. Having that account wide item I can use on an alt is why I can enjoy the toon's theme now instead of in 40 levels and a GCR grind later. Being able to share currency account wide is what makes alting more enjoyable.
So basically, it boils down to "I don't want to be bothered doing the same boring grinding for another toon that I did for my first one."
Actually I can relate in some way. Any new toons I make these days I buy XP boosts to get them to level 35 or even 40. I'm pretty tired of the grind too. Heck, at times I just spend globals at the AH to get quick legion gear. I can alleviate the grind to some extent, but to the extent that I want to bypass endgame-specific content and earn endgame-specific rewards without doing said endgame with this new toon? Nah, that's reaching.
I'm pretty sure that the whole concept of wanting to create a new toon to enjoy playing a different kind of build, a toon with a different concept and look is the main criteria to wanting to create a new toon in the first place. People seem to do it all the time even with the knowledge that they'll have to grind for SCR/GCR like they did with earlier toons. Saying that not having access to account-wide SCR/GCR being one criteria in making a new toon just comes off as arbitary and a personal limitation.
And just to clarify, I'm not a die-hard supporter of recognition being individual toon rewards. If Cryptic one day decides to go ahead and make SCR/GCR account-wide rewards because it's a more effective way to sell the product, by all means I'm all for it. I'm just taking everything at face-level for what it is.
The essence of team content is "requires teamwork". Content that requires teamwork by definition cannot be done solo.
Right, but nothing stops a player from teaming up with a friend for even the most basic leveling quests. The only reason you'd likely have less people wanting to team up for "easier" content is because some of them never wanted to team up in the first place--they only did so because the game pretty much required them to begrudgingly work with other people to get the stuff done.
Having to team up to bring down massive bosses feels pretty good. On the other hand, requiring a team just to slog through daily quests does not.
(Hopefully) Useful CO Resources: HeroCreator (character planner), Cosmic Timers/Alert Checklist, Blood Moon Map, Anniversary Cat Map, and more (eventually, anyway).
I'm pretty sure that the whole concept of wanting to create a new toon to enjoy playing a different kind of build, a toon with a different concept and look is the main criteria to wanting to create a new toon in the first place. People seem to do it all the time even with the knowledge that they'll have to grind for SCR/GCR like they did with earlier toons. Saying that not having access to account-wide SCR/GCR being one criteria in making a new toon just comes off as arbitary and a personal limitation.
I can alleviate the grind to some extent, but to the extent that I want to bypass endgame-specific content and earn endgame-specific rewards without doing said endgame with this new toon? Nah, that's reaching.
Being able to bank GCR to share account wide still requires doing the content. It just gives more freedom into how they choose to do the content. Or did I miss the announcement that GCR can be purchased in the cash shop?
I'm pretty sure that the whole concept of wanting to create a new toon to enjoy playing a different kind of build, a toon with a different concept and look is the main criteria to wanting to create a new toon in the first place. People seem to do it all the time even with the knowledge that they'll have to grind for SCR/GCR like they did with earlier toons. Saying that not having access to account-wide SCR/GCR being one criteria in making a new toon just comes off as arbitary and a personal limitation.
We already know that people have left or are making fewer alts due to things going the character bound route. They said as much on the forums and we don't seem them around often if at all anymore. Just because people put up with things doesn't mean they like it. It's not an "arbitrary and personal limitation", it's people cutting some of the stupid BS out of their lives.
And just to clarify, I'm not a die-hard supporter of recognition being individual toon rewards. If Cryptic one day decides to go ahead and make SCR/GCR account-wide rewards because it's a more effective way to sell the product, by all means I'm all for it. I'm just taking everything at face-level for what it is.
This is where I am. I will say though with the way the setup is I've stopped playing any other toon than my main. I don't bring my healer or anything else to GCR content cause I no longer find the grind fun. So I don't do it. Even the toon I meant to be an eventual dog ccer I got distinguished gear on an pretty much dropped playing.
The system as setup does not encourage me to run through any more of the Justice Gear path. Cause it isn't fun. Part of it is also the token requirement, with two of the rampages being a pain in the **** to get going. Hell, Sky Command's queue was broken last night. And it's hard enough to get a team (private or otherwise) going for that one.
I no longer find the Justice Gear path fun, so I no longer grind.
I was on the side of bankable currency but I've changed my mind. Right now there is a cap on how much gcr you can earn per day. One has to assume that this cap is not arbitrary and was put into place for a reason. Right now this restriction is on a per character basis, which means that if I have extra playtime I can cap out more than one character. I rarely have enough time to even cap 1 toon but it is possible to reach that cap in a 24hr period on 6 characters (more so during Giant Monster weeks). All those Alts earning gcr could potentially create an imbalance that the current cap is set up to prevent. Also, bankable gcr and scr would create a way for people to only run the content they feel has the quickest and easiest gain on as many Alts as possible and ignore the rest of the content. So, if they were to make gcr bankable wouldn't that leave us open to further restrictions which in turn would make acquisition less alt friendly, defeating the entire purpose of those who requested it?
I find I can't cap out on more than one character simply because there isn't enough available content in a day. Getting a duplicate run of three of the cosmics is NOT a common occurrence. In addition, Eido runs have basically dried up.
And I'm NEVER guaranteed to catch up with up with all three runs everyday, due to work and you know that thing called sleep.
And I'd rather not chance a TA with a pickup group. I don't have enough patience to deal with such idiocy after the one or two times (the second time had an experienced person on the team but no one listened to him, so I just cut out early--too old for that shite) I did try to do TA with a pickup group. I'll let you know guess how the first time went.
I was on the side of bankable currency but I've changed my mind. Right now there is a cap on how much gcr you can earn per day. One has to assume that this cap is not arbitrary and was put into place for a reason. Right now this restriction is on a per character basis, which means that if I have extra playtime I can cap out more than one character. I rarely have enough time to even cap 1 toon but it is possible to reach that cap in a 24hr period on 6 characters (more so during Giant Monster weeks). All those Alts earning gcr could potentially create an imbalance that the current cap is set up to prevent. Also, bankable gcr and scr would create a way for people to only run the content they feel has the quickest and easiest gain on as many Alts as possible and ignore the rest of the content. So, if they were to make gcr bankable wouldn't that leave us open to further restrictions which in turn would make acquisition less alt friendly, defeating the entire purpose of those who requested it?
BTW, 'i shot some enough to get GCR/SCR/Q so I 'k' AFK from now on' or 'dn't have enough power/gear/mods but i wanna GCR so i stay even making open mission more difficult or even fail' are very annoying (well... I tried to do cosmics with become devices with this reason by my self). GCR/SCR able to make them put in hideout account bank has a possibility to solve this matter.
And I'd rather not chance a TA with a pickup group. I don't have enough patience to deal with such idiocy after the one or two times (the second time had an experienced person on the team but no one listened to him, so I just cut out early--too old for that shite) I did try to do TA with a pickup group. I'll let you know guess how the first time went.
Well that's a shame. I have a bad pickup group for TA now and then, but usually it's fine. Sucks that you had a bad run or two and gave up.
I would've thought you of all people would be all for the Justice gear path encouraging players to engage in a variety of content.
Please elaborate.
You're always showing your love for grindy content. You should be happy that the devs are nudging you into a wide variety of content instead of just doing the same cosmics over and over. Get out there and do some Rampages too. Loads of fun, right? ^^
(Hopefully) Useful CO Resources: HeroCreator (character planner), Cosmic Timers/Alert Checklist, Blood Moon Map, Anniversary Cat Map, and more (eventually, anyway).
You're always showing your love for grindy content. You should be happy that the devs are nudging you into a wide variety of content instead of just doing the same cosmics over and over. Get out there and do some Rampages too. Loads of fun, right? ^^
So are you saying that someone can only support variety if they personally like every option? Please, elaborate.
You're always showing your love for grindy content. You should be happy that the devs are nudging you into a wide variety of content instead of just doing the same cosmics over and over. Get out there and do some Rampages too. Loads of fun, right? ^^
So are you saying that someone can only support variety if they personally like every option? Please, elaborate.
Yeah my problem is the Justice Gear path DOESN'T support variety. At all.
There simply isn't that much varied content that gives GCR. Maybe in the future, but currently not now.
Yeah my problem is the Justice Gear path DOESN'T support variety. At all.
Eh, Justice Gear path technically sees you in a greater variety of content than the Distinguished gear path. I personally just don't like rng rewards, and with how long rampages have been in the game I got bored of them long ago - especially when better content came along.
Yeah my problem is the Justice Gear path DOESN'T support variety. At all.
Eh, Justice Gear path technically sees you in a greater variety of content than the Distinguished gear path. I personally just don't like rng rewards, and with how long rampages have been in the game I got bored of them long ago - especially when better content came along.
Yeah I can see how the rng part of it can be a turn off. It already has turned me off pursuing Justice Gear on any other toon.
I don't see a down side to this, as would make it more alt friendly, and would not change a thing for anyone really but those who have multiple characters. Even helping those who have maxed out a character and have no reason to play it can now do so and would encourage more game play not less. You would see an up take of player logging on to do content more not less. Sounds like a win win to me.
I mean, there have been several arguments made in this thread to counterpoint all of those claims... so yeah, there's that.
Comments
Hyperbole. Reading comprehension failure. Facepalm initialized.
No, it doesn't. In Path of Exile nothing is character bound. In fact, none of the weapons and armor are bound in any way, not even if you wear them. There are only a few pieces of special currency that are account bound. One of the most popular leagues is the one with more generous rewards. People played longer and created more alts because it was so much easier to gear up additional characters. Perfect example of a game that makes it easy to gain currency and items for alts while still keeping people playing and growing.
The whole character bound thing encouraging people to stick around is crap.
Heirloom gear is a thing because people don't want to grind out things from scratch every time they make a new toon. CO is not the only game with Heirloom gear. Level up / bonus XP cash shop items are also a thing because, again, people don't want to do the earlier game for the umpteenth time. Respecs are a thing in many games so that players don't have to start over to try out different build ideas. You have plenty of games making it easier to roll alts or skip the process entirely.
GCR is the only thing you listed that is per toon. XP can be bought in the cash shop. Questionite can be traded. Mission Rewards are replaced by heirloom gear. Those are all thing that are the opposite of grind while still encouraging alts.
100% incorrect. Questionite can be bought with Zen and is meant to be traded. The entire Q-To-Zen system is built around ability to trade. The earning per toon with a refinement cap is meant to prevent people from gaining questionite too quickly because it can be used to purchase cash shop items. Questionite IS an account wide currency that is controlled so that people will actually spend real money in the cash shop.
My main character is specifically built to quickly gain currency. Another toon I roll up is not going to fit that criteria. It's faster to use my main that is already geared up with a specific build to get gear for my alts than it is to use my alts to get their own gear. Starting a currency grind on a new toon does not inspire me to bother creating it in the first place. It's also not just GCR, it's all of the other things that have also become character bound.
What makes more sense: Using my already geared toon to purchase a GCR costume piece for an alt, or using that brand new alt to gain that costume bit eventually at level 40? Yes, the costume pieces are account wide. That's the point. Having that account wide item I can use on an alt is why I can enjoy the toon's theme now instead of in 40 levels and a GCR grind later. Being able to share currency account wide is what makes alting more enjoyable.
[at]riviania Member since Aug 2009
Unless of course you have actual knowledge that the devs didn't mean to implement it in that way?
Click here to check out my costumes/milleniumguardian (MG) in-game/We need more tights, stances and moods
But okay, I'll relent and accept that since it can be done, "questionite" shouldn't be in my initial statement. So basically, it boils down to "I don't want to be bothered doing the same boring grinding for another toon that I did for my first one."
Actually I can relate in some way. Any new toons I make these days I buy XP boosts to get them to level 35 or even 40. I'm pretty tired of the grind too. Heck, at times I just spend globals at the AH to get quick legion gear. I can alleviate the grind to some extent, but to the extent that I want to bypass endgame-specific content and earn endgame-specific rewards without doing said endgame with this new toon? Nah, that's reaching.
I'm pretty sure that the whole concept of wanting to create a new toon to enjoy playing a different kind of build, a toon with a different concept and look is the main criteria to wanting to create a new toon in the first place. People seem to do it all the time even with the knowledge that they'll have to grind for SCR/GCR like they did with earlier toons. Saying that not having access to account-wide SCR/GCR being one criteria in making a new toon just comes off as arbitary and a personal limitation.
And just to clarify, I'm not a die-hard supporter of recognition being individual toon rewards. If Cryptic one day decides to go ahead and make SCR/GCR account-wide rewards because it's a more effective way to sell the product, by all means I'm all for it. I'm just taking everything at face-level for what it is.
Having to team up to bring down massive bosses feels pretty good. On the other hand, requiring a team just to slog through daily quests does not.
Whoever you are, be that person one hundred percent. Don't compromise on your identity.
Being able to bank GCR to share account wide still requires doing the content. It just gives more freedom into how they choose to do the content. Or did I miss the announcement that GCR can be purchased in the cash shop?
We already know that people have left or are making fewer alts due to things going the character bound route. They said as much on the forums and we don't seem them around often if at all anymore. Just because people put up with things doesn't mean they like it. It's not an "arbitrary and personal limitation", it's people cutting some of the stupid BS out of their lives.
[at]riviania Member since Aug 2009
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
The system as setup does not encourage me to run through any more of the Justice Gear path. Cause it isn't fun. Part of it is also the token requirement, with two of the rampages being a pain in the **** to get going. Hell, Sky Command's queue was broken last night. And it's hard enough to get a team (private or otherwise) going for that one.
I no longer find the Justice Gear path fun, so I no longer grind.
And I'm NEVER guaranteed to catch up with up with all three runs everyday, due to work and you know that thing called sleep.
And I'd rather not chance a TA with a pickup group. I don't have enough patience to deal with such idiocy after the one or two times (the second time had an experienced person on the team but no one listened to him, so I just cut out early--too old for that shite) I did try to do TA with a pickup group. I'll let you know guess how the first time went.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
There simply isn't that much varied content that gives GCR. Maybe in the future, but currently not now.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.
My super cool CC build and how to use it.