Cosmics do tons of damage and each use different damage types, so if damage resistance became limited to only effect certain damage types, tanks would pretty much be required to have different sets of gear for each cosmic. Making enemies resistant to certain damage types would likely limit the amount of viable builds for end game content. Oh, you want to bring your build that only does decent damage with 1 or 2 damage types? Too bad. This boss just so happens to be resistant to both of them and now you can't do damage without adding an extra power that may not even fit the rest of your build.
All slightly extreme examples, tbh. I probably shouldn't have mentioned Kryptonite, because that's a nemesis power, in effect; something that completely neutralises the opponent.
A more realistic angle is an antagonistic power system (Fire/ice, Darkness/Celestial, Physical/Mental or Ego with a 15-25% variation in effectiveness and more buffs/debuffs for particular power sets (they should probably have at least two, one with synergies within the power set as we currently have, and one which provides more cross-framework utility). It would just add an element of Rock-Paper-Scissors to the game, which is very much in the Superhero canon.
Except Invulnerability's "kryptonite" is anything that deals really large hits, since 150ish flat damage reduction means nothing against a 10,000 damage hit, and Invulnerability's percent-based damage reduction is inferior to that of Defiance or even AoRP.
Defiance needs a similar treatment, too, really. It's a bit of an unvirtuous circle... players can stack DR so high that enemies need 10K attacks to dent some players, and it wipes out others. Everytime a new gear set comes out the DR gets higher, the attacks get stronger.... it's not really going anywhere good.
I would enjoy it if the game would, when your attacks are out of range, move you to within range instead of sitting there spamming messages telling you that you are out of range. We know it can be done because "run to target" exists.
This is true.... also the message saying you're out of stamina is something I almost never notice until the attack failed several times. Realistically... I would never use pop-up text to inform players of either.
I don't think it's too much to ask of the player to press the W key.
Also there's all those times where you're in range, start charging, and the enemy moves out of range(often because it's chasing another player) and now your attack fails because you can't move while charging.
Defiance already has the downside of pigeon-holing the player into focusing on CON while other defensive passives scale off any SS.
The game already has a huge focus on every fight, especially cosmic fights, being a DPS race and anyone who goes with a defensive passive inherently suffers from lower DPS outputs compared to builds that use offensive passives and at the same are good in both survivability and DPS. Other than the player being strictly of a tank role, so what if you're able to absord thousands of points of damage at a time? When it comes to cosmic fights, that alone won't win you the fight; the collaboration of the other important roles along with you being a tank will. When it comes to alerts and mostly everything else, the difficulty level is so trivial that so many other non-tank builds can double up as aggro-magnents and damage-soakers, with the exception of maybe rampages like F&I. Even then rampages are laughably easier to win compared to cosmics.
It doesn't make a whole lot of sense nerfing defensive passives and/or making them into active defenses considering that anyone going with a defensive-passive centered build trades away certain capabilities that other builds and roles excel in.
Defiance already has the downside of pigeon-holing the player into focusing on CON while other defensive passives scale off any SS.
All defensive passives require Con if you're going to tank anything big, because Con gives you hit points, and the difference between Defiance at 300 Con and 700 Con isn't all that impressive anyway.
All defensive passives require Con if you're going to tank anything big, because Con gives you hit points, and the difference between Defiance at 300 Con and 700 Con isn't all that impressive anyway.
Which is why I addressed Defiance at the start on general terms, especially with regards to anyone choosing to take Defiance for a hybrid-based build that is multi-role not solely to do with tanking. I'm fully aware that CON is an integral stat to focus on when dedicating the build to being a tank regardless of passive choice.
I'm also fully aware that Defiance isn't exactly an optimal choice to take when the build isn't focused on constantly maintaining aggro, but regardless the fact that it scales restrictively off CON and not any other SS like other defensive passives do is something to consider as to why suggesting to nerf it in some manner doesn't make sense.
All defensive passives require Con if you're going to tank anything big, because Con gives you hit points, and the difference between Defiance at 300 Con and 700 Con isn't all that impressive anyway.
Which is why I addressed Defiance at the start on general terms, especially with regards to anyone choosing to take Defiance for a hybrid-based build that is multi-role not solely to do with tanking. I'm fully aware that CON is an integral stat to focus on when dedicating the build to being a tank regardless of passive choice.
I'm also fully aware that Defiance isn't exactly an optimal choice to take when the build isn't focused on constantly maintaining aggro, but regardless the fact that it scales restrictively off CON and not any other SS like other defensive passives do is something to consider as to why suggesting to nerf it in some manner doesn't make sense.
For now.
That being said, if you plan to multi-role, you should probably also plan accordingly with gear that can help fill in those role bits.
many games have different defenses without that meaning needing a new set for everything.
We're not talking about other games. We are talking about CO, and CO's budget, and CO's available dev resources, and what massive changes would need to take place IN CO to make such a suggestion happen.
I find it amusing folks talk of other games when they really have no relevance in what can be done HERE.
All defensive passives require Con if you're going to tank anything big, because Con gives you hit points, and the difference between Defiance at 300 Con and 700 Con isn't all that impressive anyway.
Which is why I addressed Defiance at the start on general terms, especially with regards to anyone choosing to take Defiance for a hybrid-based build that is multi-role not solely to do with tanking. I'm fully aware that CON is an integral stat to focus on when dedicating the build to being a tank regardless of passive choice.
I'm also fully aware that Defiance isn't exactly an optimal choice to take when the build isn't focused on constantly maintaining aggro, but regardless the fact that it scales restrictively off CON and not any other SS like other defensive passives do is something to consider as to why suggesting to nerf it in some manner doesn't make sense.
For now.
That being said, if you plan to multi-role, you should probably also plan accordingly with gear that can help fill in those role bits.
Agreed. But I'm not sure to the extreme that is being suggested. I don't think requiring dps to take powers that give other types of damage is all that reasonable, as I can't see the devs giving us more advantage points or power slots to make something like that really matter in terms of CO's gameplay.
Another thing to consider when discussing assymetrical resistances.... Games like Diablo 2 that used systems that gave varying levels of resist to various elements, usually have a small number of elements. I don't even know how many are in Champions. Just off the top of my head(not sure about all of them): fire, ice, crushing, piercing, slashing, dimensional, psi, darkness, unarmed, toxic, particle, electrical, sonic
D2 had 6 actual damage types; Fire, ice, electric, poison, physical and non-typed magic.
I take this quote from a review that I agree with.
"customisation is so linear; everyone is after the optimal dps:survivability ratio with 0 reliance on other players = autonomous gameplay... Players don't need each other anymore... which in my opinion is a bad thing."
I take this quote from a review that I agree with.
"customisation is so linear; everyone is after the optimal dps:survivability ratio with 0 reliance on other players = autonomous gameplay... Players don't need each other anymore... which in my opinion is a bad thing."
Roles are specific to the encounter, not the character -- it's a question of "this encounter needs X, Y, and Z. Which of those are you providing?".
Depends who you're asking, most of mine are Hybrids/DPS considering the options and circumstances I've experienced in this game, I've got some Support(Or Supportive), a few Tanks, Their builds reflecting certain traits of the guys I'm representing on here.
I take this quote from a review that I agree with.
"customisation is so linear; everyone is after the optimal dps:survivability ratio with 0 reliance on other players = autonomous gameplay... Players don't need each other anymore... which in my opinion is a bad thing."
Games like Diablo 2 that used systems that gave varying levels of resist to various elements, usually have a small number of elements.
IIRC there's about 12 damage types overall, four sub-divisions (Physical, Elemental, Energy, Paranormal) and a sub-sub-division of Physical/Non-Physical. There is gear in the game which works this (old drops like the Dark Shard Robe and Q gearlike the Cyber/Samurai/Armadillo sets, as well as the damage boost cores you get from the Q Zone), and I'm sure that could be extended without breaking the game. Other antagonistic effects could be coded in. It already happens with certain Offensive Passives (things like Ego Form give you 100% DR against Ego Damage... it's just that no-one seems to do any Ego Damage, back to that point about villain power variety again....)
Overall I just don't see that it should be possible to have a defensive passive which gives huge, across the board, resistance to everything. Everyone should have a chink in their armour; otherwise the only offensive strategy is brute force, which is why some content seems OP for many players and character types.
Current Invuln should still be available, though, possibly even buffed, just as a Feature Power - something that defines the character and in which you have to invest two or more Power Points + ADV points. Other Feature powers could be things like an in-combat Super Shrinker, Ant-Man style (massively reduced perception / threat wipe / increased Dodge chance, hugely decreased resistance to AoE) or Super Enlarger (increased damage but massively increased threat / reduced Dodge chance).
Other stuff to make combat more entertaining....
1) Nimble Block. The lower the rank of block, the faster you can move while blocking. It's a fair trade. I hate the way block almost nails you into the ground at any level. Mobility is becoming ever more important in the game and the current state of block just pushes people towards AD spam.
2) In-combat speed for fliers (or anyone else, but especially fliers). Can we please have an Advantage / Toggle power to allow us to maintain full flight speed in combat? The game's attitude to travel powers (locking them out at every conceivable opportunity) is such a bore. I'd happily spend a power point (or more) on being able to move out of the way rather than having to stack up defence, and to be able to do Superman style flying lunges....
3) Enemy attacks which increase in damage by applying stacking debuffs to you. These things allow players to work out patterns of damage without getting wiped out by too-strong initial one shot attacks. If you've not worked it out by the third cycle then you deserve to get nuked.
4) A more verbose combat mode. I like enemies like VIPER Brickbusters, where you have to be aware of what they're doing and what those effects might be. But in CO, you can get hit by a substantial debuff and have no idea of what has happened, other than the addition of a couple of teeny icons to a very long chain, which becomes unreadable in team events. I would like...
i) Colour coding of damage types in the Combat Log window ii) On-screen written over-head indications of major debuffs, incoming holds, DoT effects and my character's state (Stunned! Frightened! Held!) iii) A UI tweak so that I can see two rows of icons - my buffs, and the debuffs being applied to me (and if you can make them have glow outlines in the colours of their damage type, then all the better).
Endgame Meta = Be DPS, Support, CC Controller and Tank/Offtank and do your job RIGHT! There is NOTHING more than that
Conformity = Follow the strategy, be aware of the enviroment and don't have tunnel vision, study the battle mechanics, don't grief/troll. THAT'S IT
I would also like to remind you that outside the cosmics, people want to play the game alone in missions and solo friend instances without having to use teamwork 100% of the time. Because the CO community in cosmics which have YET to learn the basic strategies will make you despise the human nature and avoid
POWERFRAME REVAMPS, NEW POWERS and BUG FIXES > Recycled Content and Events and even costumes at this point Introvert guy who use CO to make his characters playable and get experimental with Viable FF Theme builds! Running out of Unique FF builds due to the lack of updates and synergies! Playing since 1 February 2011 128 + Characters (21 ATs, 107 FFs) ALTitis for Life!
Roles are specific to the encounter, not the character -- it's a question of "this encounter needs X, Y, and Z. Which of those are you providing?".
Depends who you're asking, most of mine are Hybrids/DPS considering the options and circumstances I've experienced in this game, I've got some Support(Or Supportive), a few Tanks, Their builds reflecting certain traits of the guys I'm representing on here.
So basically the answer is "None of them, and I'm bad at teamwork".
All slightly extreme examples, tbh. I probably shouldn't have mentioned Kryptonite, because that's a nemesis power, in effect; something that completely neutralises the opponent.
A more realistic angle is an antagonistic power system (Fire/ice, Darkness/Celestial, Physical/Mental or Ego with a 15-25% variation in effectiveness and more buffs/debuffs for particular power sets (they should probably have at least two, one with synergies within the power set as we currently have, and one which provides more cross-framework utility). It would just add an element of Rock-Paper-Scissors to the game, which is very much in the Superhero canon.
I can't really think of any MMORPG where damage types were implemented in a meaningful way, especially in games like this that encourage you to focus on just a few. What is a player supposed to do when the content they want to engage involves damage types they are ineffective against? Should they respec? Or should they just sit on the bench?
In its early days, WoW had enemies that were immune to various damage types, but they quickly realized that their model of "each class only gets a few damage types" is incompatible with making damage types a meaningful mechanic. What is the fire mage supposed to do against enemies immune to fire? So now, damage type is largely irrelevant, and that was the right move because it doesn't shut anyone out of anything.
Defiance needs a similar treatment, too, really. It's a bit of an unvirtuous circle... players can stack DR so high that enemies need 10K attacks to dent some players, and it wipes out others. Everytime a new gear set comes out the DR gets higher, the attacks get stronger.... it's not really going anywhere good.
Each defensive passive already has its own strengths and weaknesses. They're just (thankfully) not based on damage types:
1) Defiance: Requires con, which makes it less usable by the casual hybrid player who just wants some extra defense. Lots of spike damage at the start of the fight, before it fully ramps up, can hurt.
2) Invulnerability: As mentioned, this is great against lots of little hits, but it doesn't do much against big hits.
3) Regeneration: No damage reduction, except a bit at the start. Susceptible to 1-shots without sufficient HP.
4) Personal Force Field: LOL.
5) Aura of Radiant Protection: Technically not a defensive passive, but it's defense-oriented, so I figured I'd mention it anyway. Its weakness if the fact that you can't use it in the tank role, so it's either use it to tank as a hybrid or just use it to support your friends in the support role.
See? They're different enough that they don't need damage-type weaknesses to drag them down. Technically, the whole "strong defense vs some damage types, but not against others" already exists in certain offensive passives. Applying that to defensive passives would be a mistake though, given this game's current design direction.
(Hopefully) Useful CO Resources: HeroCreator (character planner), Cosmic Timers/Alert Checklist, Blood Moon Map, Anniversary Cat Map, and more (eventually, anyway).
@pantagruel01@avianosI seem to be having communication issues to establishing some understanding recently, and being misconstrued, Yes I can bring along a certain role and yes I can contribute, I want to be a valued part of the team and feel like it to, considering the circumstances, I also like using a diverse range of builds that are symbolic representations of my Dragon Family and friends of such(Main reason why I still play CO), Which are different inherently based on their builds, Other then that, it's outside of Cosmics I find the lack of caring to be rather detrimental to the experience (And at my expense) because teamwork isn't encouraged when someone can just steamroll with a combination of certain builds/gear/devices, so playing Support or Tank is going to be trivialized to mainly the DPS Race thus making them less fun feeling part of a team and feeling more of a collaboration, am I being understood now!? the previous context apparently I'm misinformed of certain terminology or am I?
From my impression Meta is turning it into a Must win at any costs sorta mentality, number crunching to get best results and build design while Conformity is the majority using specific powers that are more effective then others cause it gets the job done faster so that's less diverse. (Awaiting Full Power Revision)
I take this quote from a review that I agree with.
"customisation is so linear; everyone is after the optimal dps:survivability ratio with 0 reliance on other players = autonomous gameplay... Players don't need each other anymore... which in my opinion is a bad thing."
@pantagruel01@avianosTheir seems to be some communication issues recently, and being misconstrued, I do have a variety of builds that represent my Dragon Family and friends (Main reason why I still play CO), they're different, they aren't Elite but are meaningful to me, yes I do have certain roles, yes I do like to contribute, despite circumstances, I like being apart of a team and valued as much but outside of Cosmics the experience is less so, it devolves into a DPS race were Tanks and Support are Trivialized, even certain players steamroll it with certain builds/gear/devices and rejecting any sort of teamwork, that isn't so fun, now unless I've been misinformed about certain terminology, I got the impression Meta is perfecting via numbers while Conformity is using (Or Abusing) certain effective powers to get the job done faster, thus making is less diverse, am I being understood now? (Pending All Powers being Reviewed)
I would also appreciate not getting Posts Deleted.
I take this quote from a review that I agree with.
"customisation is so linear; everyone is after the optimal dps:survivability ratio with 0 reliance on other players = autonomous gameplay... Players don't need each other anymore... which in my opinion is a bad thing."
There are games that have teamwork but no role requirements. The Dark Souls games come to mind. Role based is the easy way out. I suppose it's not fair to compare a company finessing their game creation style for over 20 years to one with no where near that experience in an engine that was an under the table project that has code known to be a hot mess.
Farming up gear is ****. Needing to farm up several sets for different encounters would blow. Having to full respec my toon because I want to do a different bit of content with my main? No thanks. Make a carbon copy build where the only change is the powers do a different type of damage? Nope. CO isn't set up like Borderlands where you can easily swap out elemental guns if an enemy is strong to a certain damage type. Hell, there isn't even a real build swap function like Rift has where you can have completely different power set ups for different builds.
Well let's face it.. CO is a DPS race. I'm not even pointing out blame because it's very easy for any MMO to fall into the trap. But on top of that we have an unwieldy Free-form system that must be a bear to balance. I don't know what the magic answer is. or even if there is one with current limitations. Cosmic Events, Mechanon, Comic Packs, & the Q-zone are good for teams. Also, some content like TA or Nemesis Confrontation. But no one in the game likes to team outside of Cosmics.
The AI needs works. The mission structure needs work. But right now combat is simply "he/she with the best dps build wins".
Having to full respec my toon because I want to do a different bit of content with my main? No thanks
But that's the current Meta, isn't it? Want to do Cosmic content... suddenly you have to go from Hybrid (Specific roles optional/adaptational) to KNOW THE ROLES AND BEST BUILD (and don't get outside of it).
Joking, thoughbut. That's not the idea at all.... just that you might need to be a bit more adaptive to the situation with lower quality gear rather than playing boring nonsense like Onslaught just to get the Excelsior! gear set.
Farming up gear is ****. Needing to farm up several sets for different encounters would blow. .
Well, er...no. Diablo and Torchlight get around this by making gear plentiful and the differences marginal.... it's the specific modifications which are more limited in availability. Even then, there's no need to be parsimonious. x1 of each specific damage type defence core could be ranked up to an equal rank "all defence" core of the type that we have at the moment. Otherwise all you need are several sets of blues/purple gear with a variety of mods stacked.... just what most of us had going prior to the Onslaught/GCR gear updates when gear was easier to come by.
Nope. CO isn't set up like Borderlands where you can easily swap out elemental guns if an enemy is strong to a certain damage type
With an FF, you've got five builds slots with an instant changeover of powers - even passives, ffs, focus, gear and devices. How difficult can this be?
There are games that have teamwork but no role requirements.
Sort of. They may lack mechanical roles, but there are usually functional roles.
Hehe, when people try to use that argument it always makes me laugh because it is demonstrably false. Even EVE has requirements of specialized roles. Yea you can get by being a generalist for a bit, but you best plan to specialize and build accordingly there. Hell, the one game I know people tried to praise, GW2, has shirked that and included taunts and specialized heals so you can't even point to that game anymore. Why? Because roles always existed even there.
There are games that have teamwork but no role requirements.
Sort of. They may lack mechanical roles, but there are usually functional roles.
Hehe, when people try to use that argument it always makes me laugh because it is demonstrably false. Even EVE has requirements of specialized roles. Yea you can get by being a generalist for a bit, but you best plan to specialize and build accordingly there. Hell, the one game I know people tried to praise, GW2, has shirked that and included taunts and specialized heals so you can't even point to that game anymore. Why? Because roles always existed even there.
The basic essence of team content is
A, B, and C need to be done. We could all run around each doing a piece of all of them, but that winds up with a bunch of task-switching overhead so it doesn't work very well. Thus, we split up duties -- some people do A, some people do B, some people do C. Occasionally there's a need for floaters who swap between teams as needed, or those tasks don't all start or stop at the same time so you have people sitting around doing nothing, but mostly that doesn't happen.
Once jobs have been split up like this, the next obvious step is to get better at your specific job. In an MMO, that means building, gearing, and learning the fights. Thus, even without any specific classes, if optimization is possible, you get specialists.
I personally much prefer if everyone is a hybrid than pidgeon holing to specific repetitive tasks. it's much more fun to DPS, tank and heal in a fight that continously do one of the 3 only. Of course opinions are different with everyone.
With an FF, you've got five builds slots with an instant changeover of powers - even passives, ffs, focus, gear and devices. How difficult can this be?
As for ideas to make combat a bit more engaging, here are a few that already have some part in present mechanics. block: making charged attacks hurt more so we actively have to block or stun the enemy. enemy block: make it so that when they block either we do really little damage or after a few attacks we have sme kind of debuf/stun/knockback, so we have to break their block. lunges or knockbacks for example. holds. very few enemies use them, and besides losing a few seconds nothing really happens. I mean I've been playing for years (not all years though) and I still have no idea if pressing F actually does something or I can leave it pressed all the tme while held.. make it so either holds leave you vulnerable for future charged attacks, or certain holds drain health etc. area attacks marked on the ground: I'm not sure if we have these yet, but it helps to keep battles more agile instead of being all the time in the same spot.
Of course everyone has their own opinions, but I think these changes would make battles more entertaining than just standing in the same spot pressing skill 2.
The last MMO I played that tried to make it so that everyone does everything turned into a big DPS race where everyone just zerg rushed bosses and people who wanted to build for something other than just DPS got left out of a lot of stuff.
teamwork is working on a team, in such a way that solves the issue. simple as that. if if the hulk and superman are both insufficiently strong to defeat an enemy, and they realize their combined strenght does the trick, it IS teamwork.
With an FF, you've got five builds slots with an instant changeover of powers - even passives, ffs, focus, gear and devices. How difficult can this be?
They only work with the powers you currently have. It's an unrealistic expectation with this game when you consider that not every power works with every form, energy unlock, or passive. Add to that the current push to require 2-3 powers for optimal damage output and...yeah, that's not realistic. Given this game's current design, the easier (and wiser) move is to just leave damage types exactly how they are. Absolutely nothing good would come from making passive X weak against damage type Y, or making a foe immune to damage type Z.
This kind of thing can only work when you can easily adapt. As in, without having to respec, regear, and all that nonsense.
(Hopefully) Useful CO Resources: HeroCreator (character planner), Cosmic Timers/Alert Checklist, Blood Moon Map, Anniversary Cat Map, and more (eventually, anyway).
they should go the TSW way and just let FFs unlock ALL powers and just equip in the hot bar those that they want to. (still they can limit the amount of defenses/builders/etc you have at the same time.
they should go the TSW way and just let FFs unlock ALL powers and just equip in the hot bar those that they want to. (still they can limit the amount of defenses/builders/etc you have at the same time.
You realize how much they would have to redesign the system. Furthermore, TSW hasn't added new powers in a very long time, where as Champions is adding powers constantly. Further more, they would have to take Champions back to a time of 7 powers tray, and since I doubt many would be for that (I would be), that's kind of a losing argument. Finally, TSW is completely and totally balanced around the Trinity system, which you have already preached multiple times you think is a bad system. So you can't have your cake and eat it to. And allowing people to get all powers in all trees is just not good forethought because all character identity is lost. Finally, TSW is slower combat than CO, like monumentally slower. It's only a bit more action packed than WoW combat.
Now I am all for silvers getting limited freeform and having to buy new power sets. And not the el cheapo AT, I mean you are talking at least $15 to $25 dollars for a power set. A lot of work, animation and effects go into those power sets, and if you want more well they have to be paid for.
they could always make it so after a certain number of stuns/knockbacks, you become inmune to them for a while.
You already do but its not nearly enough.
Argument Dog said:
Ah yes, the tried and true formula of Gradii; continuously prove he hasn't a clue.
Oh come off it already everyone knows you're just a blustering tub of hot air who cant give a compelling counterargument for most things to save your life.
And there we have it again. Yes, because you continuously post links to articles you've clearly never read, or videos you've never watched while parading against the things they actually enforce. When you start posting things that aren't demonstrably false, then I might stop pointing out how much you don't know.
Just like now, you make a claim you clearly can't back up. But hey, do keep going on it Gradii. The old saying goes a broken clock is right at least twice a day. Your day might be coming soon.
I think you're all being a little melodramatic, tbh. It's perfectly possible to run dual form, dual passive builds which can switch between more defensive/more attacking modes, and swapping gear sets is easy. Why else would the game allow you to have these build options open to you?
The thing is.... I don't think that most players actually want this sort of thing. I think demystifying the game and playing according to tram line "optimal" rules probably is what people want; if there's one thing that confuses the CO game population it's new.
I think you're all being a little melodramatic, tbh. It's perfectly possible to run dual form, dual passive builds which can switch between more defensive/more attacking modes, and swapping gear sets is easy. Why else would the game allow you to have these build options open to you?
The thing is.... I don't think that most players actually want this sort of thing. I think demystifying the game and playing according to tram line "optimal" rules probably is what people want; if there's one thing that confuses the CO game population it's new.
No one really suggests being unable to dual build. Well not anyone with any sense actually. The ones suggesting it are the ones saying that the game uses a hard trinity system that you have to conform to despite that most of my builds don't conform to the norm.
Comments
A more realistic angle is an antagonistic power system (Fire/ice, Darkness/Celestial, Physical/Mental or Ego with a 15-25% variation in effectiveness and more buffs/debuffs for particular power sets (they should probably have at least two, one with synergies within the power set as we currently have, and one which provides more cross-framework utility). It would just add an element of Rock-Paper-Scissors to the game, which is very much in the Superhero canon.
Except Invulnerability's "kryptonite" is anything that deals really large hits, since 150ish flat damage reduction means nothing against a 10,000 damage hit, and Invulnerability's percent-based damage reduction is inferior to that of Defiance or even AoRP.
Defiance needs a similar treatment, too, really. It's a bit of an unvirtuous circle... players can stack DR so high that enemies need 10K attacks to dent some players, and it wipes out others. Everytime a new gear set comes out the DR gets higher, the attacks get stronger.... it's not really going anywhere good.
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My characters
The game already has a huge focus on every fight, especially cosmic fights, being a DPS race and anyone who goes with a defensive passive inherently suffers from lower DPS outputs compared to builds that use offensive passives and at the same are good in both survivability and DPS. Other than the player being strictly of a tank role, so what if you're able to absord thousands of points of damage at a time? When it comes to cosmic fights, that alone won't win you the fight; the collaboration of the other important roles along with you being a tank will. When it comes to alerts and mostly everything else, the difficulty level is so trivial that so many other non-tank builds can double up as aggro-magnents and damage-soakers, with the exception of maybe rampages like F&I. Even then rampages are laughably easier to win compared to cosmics.
It doesn't make a whole lot of sense nerfing defensive passives and/or making them into active defenses considering that anyone going with a defensive-passive centered build trades away certain capabilities that other builds and roles excel in.
Epic Stronghold
Block timing explained
I'm also fully aware that Defiance isn't exactly an optimal choice to take when the build isn't focused on constantly maintaining aggro, but regardless the fact that it scales restrictively off CON and not any other SS like other defensive passives do is something to consider as to why suggesting to nerf it in some manner doesn't make sense.
That being said, if you plan to multi-role, you should probably also plan accordingly with gear that can help fill in those role bits.
Silverspar on PRIMUS
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I find it amusing folks talk of other games when they really have no relevance in what can be done HERE.
But I've been wrong before.
D2 had 6 actual damage types; Fire, ice, electric, poison, physical and non-typed magic.
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My characters
I take this quote from a review that I agree with.
"customisation is so linear; everyone is after the optimal dps:survivability ratio with 0 reliance on other players = autonomous gameplay... Players don't need each other anymore... which in my opinion is a bad thing."
Epic Stronghold
Block timing explained
Also has it occurred that some of us use Specific roles to begin with so we choose to play diverse builds regardless?
I take this quote from a review that I agree with.
"customisation is so linear; everyone is after the optimal dps:survivability ratio with 0 reliance on other players = autonomous gameplay... Players don't need each other anymore... which in my opinion is a bad thing."
Epic Stronghold
Block timing explained
I take this quote from a review that I agree with.
"customisation is so linear; everyone is after the optimal dps:survivability ratio with 0 reliance on other players = autonomous gameplay... Players don't need each other anymore... which in my opinion is a bad thing."
IIRC there's about 12 damage types overall, four sub-divisions (Physical, Elemental, Energy, Paranormal) and a sub-sub-division of Physical/Non-Physical. There is gear in the game which works this (old drops like the Dark Shard Robe and Q gearlike the Cyber/Samurai/Armadillo sets, as well as the damage boost cores you get from the Q Zone), and I'm sure that could be extended without breaking the game. Other antagonistic effects could be coded in. It already happens with certain Offensive Passives (things like Ego Form give you 100% DR against Ego Damage... it's just that no-one seems to do any Ego Damage, back to that point about villain power variety again....)
Overall I just don't see that it should be possible to have a defensive passive which gives huge, across the board, resistance to everything. Everyone should have a chink in their armour; otherwise the only offensive strategy is brute force, which is why some content seems OP for many players and character types.
Current Invuln should still be available, though, possibly even buffed, just as a Feature Power - something that defines the character and in which you have to invest two or more Power Points + ADV points. Other Feature powers could be things like an in-combat Super Shrinker, Ant-Man style (massively reduced perception / threat wipe / increased Dodge chance, hugely decreased resistance to AoE) or Super Enlarger (increased damage but massively increased threat / reduced Dodge chance).
Other stuff to make combat more entertaining....
1) Nimble Block. The lower the rank of block, the faster you can move while blocking. It's a fair trade. I hate the way block almost nails you into the ground at any level. Mobility is becoming ever more important in the game and the current state of block just pushes people towards AD spam.
2) In-combat speed for fliers (or anyone else, but especially fliers). Can we please have an Advantage / Toggle power to allow us to maintain full flight speed in combat? The game's attitude to travel powers (locking them out at every conceivable opportunity) is such a bore. I'd happily spend a power point (or more) on being able to move out of the way rather than having to stack up defence, and to be able to do Superman style flying lunges....
3) Enemy attacks which increase in damage by applying stacking debuffs to you. These things allow players to work out patterns of damage without getting wiped out by too-strong initial one shot attacks. If you've not worked it out by the third cycle then you deserve to get nuked.
4) A more verbose combat mode. I like enemies like VIPER Brickbusters, where you have to be aware of what they're doing and what those effects might be. But in CO, you can get hit by a substantial debuff and have no idea of what has happened, other than the addition of a couple of teeny icons to a very long chain, which becomes unreadable in team events. I would like...
i) Colour coding of damage types in the Combat Log window
ii) On-screen written over-head indications of major debuffs, incoming holds, DoT effects and my character's state (Stunned! Frightened! Held!)
iii) A UI tweak so that I can see two rows of icons - my buffs, and the debuffs being applied to me (and if you can make them have glow outlines in the colours of their damage type, then all the better).
I have more, but that'll do for now...
Endgame Meta = Be DPS, Support, CC Controller and Tank/Offtank and do your job RIGHT! There is NOTHING more than that
Conformity = Follow the strategy, be aware of the enviroment and don't have tunnel vision, study the battle mechanics, don't grief/troll. THAT'S IT
I would also like to remind you that outside the cosmics, people want to play the game alone in missions and solo friend instances without having to use teamwork 100% of the time. Because the CO community in cosmics which have YET to learn the basic strategies will make you despise the human nature and avoid
Epic Stronghold
Block timing explained
In its early days, WoW had enemies that were immune to various damage types, but they quickly realized that their model of "each class only gets a few damage types" is incompatible with making damage types a meaningful mechanic. What is the fire mage supposed to do against enemies immune to fire? So now, damage type is largely irrelevant, and that was the right move because it doesn't shut anyone out of anything.
Each defensive passive already has its own strengths and weaknesses. They're just (thankfully) not based on damage types:
1) Defiance: Requires con, which makes it less usable by the casual hybrid player who just wants some extra defense. Lots of spike damage at the start of the fight, before it fully ramps up, can hurt.
2) Invulnerability: As mentioned, this is great against lots of little hits, but it doesn't do much against big hits.
3) Regeneration: No damage reduction, except a bit at the start. Susceptible to 1-shots without sufficient HP.
4) Personal Force Field: LOL.
5) Aura of Radiant Protection: Technically not a defensive passive, but it's defense-oriented, so I figured I'd mention it anyway. Its weakness if the fact that you can't use it in the tank role, so it's either use it to tank as a hybrid or just use it to support your friends in the support role.
See? They're different enough that they don't need damage-type weaknesses to drag them down. Technically, the whole "strong defense vs some damage types, but not against others" already exists in certain offensive passives. Applying that to defensive passives would be a mistake though, given this game's current design direction.
From my impression Meta is turning it into a Must win at any costs sorta mentality, number crunching to get best results and build design while Conformity is the majority using specific powers that are more effective then others cause it gets the job done faster so that's less diverse. (Awaiting Full Power Revision)
I take this quote from a review that I agree with.
"customisation is so linear; everyone is after the optimal dps:survivability ratio with 0 reliance on other players = autonomous gameplay... Players don't need each other anymore... which in my opinion is a bad thing."
(Pending All Powers being Reviewed)
I would also appreciate not getting Posts Deleted.
I take this quote from a review that I agree with.
"customisation is so linear; everyone is after the optimal dps:survivability ratio with 0 reliance on other players = autonomous gameplay... Players don't need each other anymore... which in my opinion is a bad thing."
Farming up gear is ****. Needing to farm up several sets for different encounters would blow. Having to full respec my toon because I want to do a different bit of content with my main? No thanks. Make a carbon copy build where the only change is the powers do a different type of damage? Nope. CO isn't set up like Borderlands where you can easily swap out elemental guns if an enemy is strong to a certain damage type. Hell, there isn't even a real build swap function like Rift has where you can have completely different power set ups for different builds.
[at]riviania Member since Aug 2009
The AI needs works. The mission structure needs work. But right now combat is simply "he/she with the best dps build wins".
But that's the current Meta, isn't it? Want to do Cosmic content... suddenly you have to go from Hybrid (Specific roles optional/adaptational) to KNOW THE ROLES AND BEST BUILD (and don't get outside of it).
Joking, thoughbut. That's not the idea at all.... just that you might need to be a bit more adaptive to the situation with lower quality gear rather than playing boring nonsense like Onslaught just to get the Excelsior! gear set.
Farming up gear is ****. Needing to farm up several sets for different encounters would blow. .
Well, er...no. Diablo and Torchlight get around this by making gear plentiful and the differences marginal.... it's the specific modifications which are more limited in availability. Even then, there's no need to be parsimonious. x1 of each specific damage type defence core could be ranked up to an equal rank "all defence" core of the type that we have at the moment. Otherwise all you need are several sets of blues/purple gear with a variety of mods stacked.... just what most of us had going prior to the Onslaught/GCR gear updates when gear was easier to come by.
Nope. CO isn't set up like Borderlands where you can easily swap out elemental guns if an enemy is strong to a certain damage type
With an FF, you've got five builds slots with an instant changeover of powers - even passives, ffs, focus, gear and devices. How difficult can this be?
Epic Stronghold
Block timing explained
Silverspar on PRIMUS
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A, B, and C need to be done. We could all run around each doing a piece of all of them, but that winds up with a bunch of task-switching overhead so it doesn't work very well. Thus, we split up duties -- some people do A, some people do B, some people do C. Occasionally there's a need for floaters who swap between teams as needed, or those tasks don't all start or stop at the same time so you have people sitting around doing nothing, but mostly that doesn't happen.
Once jobs have been split up like this, the next obvious step is to get better at your specific job. In an MMO, that means building, gearing, and learning the fights. Thus, even without any specific classes, if optimization is possible, you get specialists.
Epic Stronghold
Block timing explained
Epic Stronghold
Block timing explained
block: making charged attacks hurt more so we actively have to block or stun the enemy.
enemy block: make it so that when they block either we do really little damage or after a few attacks we have sme kind of debuf/stun/knockback, so we have to break their block. lunges or knockbacks for example.
holds. very few enemies use them, and besides losing a few seconds nothing really happens. I mean I've been playing for years (not all years though) and I still have no idea if pressing F actually does something or I can leave it pressed all the tme while held.. make it so either holds leave you vulnerable for future charged attacks, or certain holds drain health etc.
area attacks marked on the ground: I'm not sure if we have these yet, but it helps to keep battles more agile instead of being all the time in the same spot.
Of course everyone has their own opinions, but I think these changes would make battles more entertaining than just standing in the same spot pressing skill 2.
Epic Stronghold
Block timing explained
Silverspar on PRIMUS
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This kind of thing can only work when you can easily adapt. As in, without having to respec, regear, and all that nonsense.
Now I am all for silvers getting limited freeform and having to buy new power sets. And not the el cheapo AT, I mean you are talking at least $15 to $25 dollars for a power set. A lot of work, animation and effects go into those power sets, and if you want more well they have to be paid for.
Silverspar on PRIMUS
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Just like now, you make a claim you clearly can't back up. But hey, do keep going on it Gradii. The old saying goes a broken clock is right at least twice a day. Your day might be coming soon.
Silverspar on PRIMUS
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The thing is.... I don't think that most players actually want this sort of thing. I think demystifying the game and playing according to tram line "optimal" rules probably is what people want; if there's one thing that confuses the CO game population it's new.
Silverspar on PRIMUS
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